Suspension Spacers - Tech Talk with Mic from Ironman 4x4

If you have followed our Ironvan Toyota Hilux Bush Truck Build series, you would have heard that we briefly discuss suspension spacers in the suspension episode.
(View the episode here: • Vehicle Build: "Ironva... )
Typically, the spacer lift kits consist of a thick spacer that is shaped more or less like the upper strut top mounting. The spacer is mounted on top of the upper strut mount between the upper strut mount and the chassis. This effectively increases the length of the strut assembly. The thickness of the spacer is now added to the overall length of the standard strut due to the fact that it is now the spacer that sits against the chassis and not the strut top mount pushing the complete coil-over strut downwards. This results in a lift in ride height at the wheel of approximately twice the thickness of the strut top spacer.
It is important to note that under full compression, with the lower control arm hard up against the bump stop rubber, the coil spring should still have gaps between the coils. This will certainly be the case with the standard strut and a well-engineered, up-rated coil-over strut assembly. Under full compression with a spacer fitted, the spacer robs the coil spring of compressible travel distance. On a number of vehicles that we have dealt with, the coil spring compresses completely before the bump stop comes into play. This will result in a solid metal stop which is noisy, uncomfortable and with enough force will certainly damage the strut and or chassis bracket.
With the standard shock length being the effective droop limit, any increase in the length of the strut assembly by fitting a spacer will drop this limit further down. This may result in the upper ball joint experiencing a rotation beyond its angle limit resulting in ball joint failure and a collapse of the suspension on that corner. Another issue is that the side shaft will be forced to operate at a more acute angle beyond its design specification. With the wheels being able to drop further down than what they were designed to handle, the inner C.V. joint may be able to disengage and failure is highly likely.
www.ironman4x4.co.za/contacts/
#Ironman4x4Africa #4x4suspension #4x4fitment

[@BryanPaulCannon]

This is easily the best explanation I’ve ever seen on what happens to your suspension when you install lift spacers. Very good demonstration sir 👍🏻

[@nickwest2158]

Yes maybe they can be dangerous, but I've been driving with spacers for 8 years now no problems (on and offroad) and I still feel it's 1 of the best and in-expensive mods I've done

[@chrismatthews973]

Thank you very much Mr Mick.... You're a great teacher, thanks for educating us all. Had my attention for the whole video.... very well spoken 👏 👌 👍 🙌

[@XplorAfrica]

Mic, I never actually knew what is going on here. I feel like a pro now. Lol. Thanks for a thorough and professional explanation. It is clear that you know what you are talking about.

[@wellsjulien9255]

Very good, very well explained and illustrated, thank you

[@harmeet094]

Man those things can easily be resolved. For stopping spring to from compressing too much, we just need to increase height of bump stop. And the last case you showed where spring comes down way too much, it will only happen when car is in air, it will never happen under load.

[@ishice3749]

Someone comented the same about increasing the bump stop supposedly he did that right after he installed the lift kit and it lasted 12 years kzbin.info/www/bejne/al7YoJeHZ6yAh8ksi=Gd19nBdS5boVpSDO

[@africancustomfabricators9399]

You the first person to see in UAE about offloading section with good explanation

[@boymeetsbush8232]

Thanks for this talk. I enjoy your videos and learn a lot.

[@willemstoltz1595]

Thanks for the video, had a spacer on my 4x2 Hilux just took it out yesterday because there is definitely an effect on your steering and breaking of the vehicle, much beter response on the road with original set-up. The spacer is good for looks but after watching this video it technically make sense to go without it.

[@mikemorgan4670]

Very well explained. It all makes sense now.

[@SaintPablo7]

Great video awesome information!!

[@georgegarcia4240]

Great explanation video, just what I was looking for so I can visually understand more about suspension, thanks

[@RandallTRoy]

Mic, great explanation I really appreciate the details. 👍

[@raysekulic1266]

Great video, was here looking for how to install spacers but I'll rethink it.

[@EWOverland]

Thanks for sharing. Very important info

[@UTPP]

What an excellent explanation, thank you. I have a question, I want to lift our 4WD purely for looks only. We never go off road and don't do any four wheel driving. Will it still damage cv's and other components knowing it will not do any off road driving?

[@29628622]

Amazing explanation 🫶

[@stephanc7192]

Great video Thanks

[@kishorevigneshkumar]

0. Did I get this right? The top limit of the wheel travel is the rubber bump stop. The bottom limit is the full open length of the strut. The difference between these is the "wheel travel". 1. When you say that only the static equilibrium point shifts when the ride height is "lifted", what type of lift do you mean? How was this "lift" achieved.? 2. If a top hat spacer is fitted above the strut, to achieve the aforesaid "lift", then the static equilibrium point would still shift down. But would the strut's extended length also cause the down travel to increase beyond the previous droop limit. Would this mean that the wheel travel in this case is not conserved and has increased? (by an amount equal to spacer thickness) ? Thanks for the video and effort in explaining it practically.

[@africancustomfabricators9399]

I like the explanation

[@lmalesci]

I have a question for you in the 4x4 sector and I would like to know if you can tell me if it is true that the ironman nitro gas shock absorbers go well with the original series set-up and can they be adapted with the +5? I have a Suzuki jimny 4x4 with m13a 1.3 l petrol engine with standard shock absorbers and calibrations, yesterday afternoon I picked up the new ironman nitro gas shock absorbers and the 4x4 spare parts dealer in Florence told me that these ironman nitro gas shock absorbers are ok for off-road 4x4 with suspension standard or in a second you could put the springs higher and it becomes a +5 high setting is it true? Greetings from Florence Italy!

[@fishonico]

How is that different to fitting a longer strut and raised height coil ? Wouldn’t the bump stop, cv angle and ball joint still have the same issues ? The coil bind issue wouldn’t happen but the others still remain or am I missing something here ??

[@townley1017]

Awesome

[@pinikpikantv3555]

I am planning to put spacer to allow less than 4% increase in size of my tyre as I want a A/T on my nissan x trail t32. Are there recommended spacers to buy. I will be off roading once in a year probably and not hard core. I just want clearance from ground. I know some friends did plastic spacers but did not have any issues . They dont do 4x4 wheeling in regular basis though. What set up is advisable then to give more clearance on my car for beach and desert ride. Will not be doing desert or the like safari.

[@attaboysimulations3240]

So Mick...just to understand you right.... it will only be an issue when your vehicle is suspended in the air?? Because how I understand it, you took the suspension the the lower most point but that will only happen when you go hippie ca jeeey in the air.... What about front load, what about caber... Just asking or are you just trying to sell your product? Needless to say, I've got billstein suspension with a 50inch lift kit and never in my life have I encountered problems as shown on this video..

[@tommyhartvig5495]

Thanks for a great video now I know why its not a good idea I just wish there was upgraded aftermarket suspension for my car 😪

[@jasonkolker9444]

i feel that

[@siminicmatei2153]

Same

[@A.A.HadiWhite]

Does the pressure must be directly pressing on the spring coil or not necessary? for example: if I cut the bottom eye of the sturt off and add a 1" rod welded between the strut and the lower eye, in other words add 1" to the total hieght of the strut will that give me 2" or 1"?

[@johnyang6969]

Hello. My question is can I have a spacer lift kit with the Ironman 4x4 lift kit together? I have a Subaru crosstrek and wondering if it can be done

[@forester_overland_nz]

Cool video showing why strut top spacers are not the recommended way to lift trucks. Though this is not a problem for McPherson struts where the bump stops are at the top of the shock 👍🏼 e.g. Subarus

[@chandrachurniyogi8394]

have a question . . . 4WD SUVs & light pickup trucks equipped with a 2.0 in. or 3.0 in. suspension lift actually has different level of lift between the forward & aft suspension setup . . . if the front axle has a true 3.0 in. lift the rear axle has something like a 2.6 in. or 2.5 in. lift . . . so my question is why's the lift less at the rear? might as well have a true 3.0 in. of full spec suspension lift both at the front & rear . . . if not why??? please advise . . .

[@ciap1]

Wouldn't a longer shock/spring assembly also have the same issues as a spacer? For example, the upper control arm at full extension and the CV angles?

[@stephenmulholland4868]

Yes it can..then to fix that problem you need to upgrade upper control arm

[@PrajwalCanonShutter]

And what about the CV angle ?

[@jaswinderahluwalia]

GUYS...HE said at the end that its ok to instal strut spacer for FWD cars. any idea what is the safe mm size of spacer to instal ?

[@jairus2937]

I had my 2” lift on my Pajero gen 4 but it seems still not enough height for me,I’m planning to ad 20mm coil rear spacer and 10-12mm front strut. Just a bit additional of height,do you think it’s too risky and not good for the cv joint?

[@Ironman4x4Africa]

These vehicles have independent suspension both front and rear. 40mm is maximum you should be lifting these. Certainly drive shafts will become an issue over time. Shocks topping out on suspension rebound = $$$$$$.

[@ReefZA]

Increase your tire size, that should give you more ride height

[@user-tz7yy3nw7y]

What about a spacer between the lower control arm and the shock

[@xxmaddog_madaraxx]

If I purchased a 3 inch spacer AND 3 inch bump stop - would that solve the problem or no?

[@jamesblack9019]

Question, I understand the issue of the coil compression/bump stop. In regards to the extended doop, CV angles etc, how is the spacer any different to fitting an aftermarket strut and coil to give you the same lift? (Note I'm not someone who recommends spacers due to the first issue)

[@micvanzyl]

Hi James. The total length of the strut is measured from the top of the strut top mount (that bolts to the chassis bracket) and the bottom eye of the shock. The strut top mount is mounted to the upper part of the shock shaft. This total strut length determines how far the wheel will droop when it is lifted off the ground when off-roading. The droop is thus controlled by the total length of the strut assembly. Fitting a spacer effectively lengthens the strut by adding the thickness of the spacer to the top allowing the wheel to droop further (about 2x the spacer thickness) which causes inner CV joint binding/eventual failure as well as upper ball joint over-extension. Fitting longer coils to a correct length shock (without spacer) doesn’t lengthen the strut assembly and doesn’t cause the aforementioned issues. A standard coil spring at normal ride height will carry the front of the vehicle more or less half way along the shock absorber’s length of travel half way between fully extended and fully compressed. Fitting an aftermarket lift coil merely lifts the ride height closer to the fully extended point. You thus have less droop and the wheel will hang sooner than with the standard coil. The strut length stays the same. No issues on full droop.

[@mugurmartinescu5728]

@@micvanzyl That is simply not true. If the aftermarket strut length is the same as stock, there will be absolutely no lift, unless the aftermarket would not sag at all, which would result in an impossible ride comfort. The majority of the aftermarket suspension on off-road vehicles also raise the vehicle. The CV is angled as much as in the case of a spacer at the same final lift. The droop is limited on some pickups (like the Ranger) by the upper control arm touching the strut housing. The benefit of an aftermarket suspension is, in the context of this video explanation, to eliminate the risk of the coil bind. There are solutions for that too, one could fit extended bump stops.

[@micvanzyl]

@@mugurmartinescu5728 Sorry Mate. Some of your replies are simply not true. Please bear in mind that I have had a career in steering, suspension and suspension geometry for the last 30 years. While I see new things very often which is great, I've seen a hell of a lot during this time. 1. YOUR COMMENT: "That is simply not true. If the aftermarket strut length is the same as stock, there will be absolutely no lift, unless the aftermarket would not sag at all, which would result in an impossible ride comfort." MY COMMENT: The lift comes from a spring with higher spring rate and/or a taller spring, not the length of the strut. 2. YOUR COMMENT: "The majority of the aftermarket suspension on off-road vehicles also raise the vehicle. The CV is angled as much as in the case of a spacer at the same final lift." MY COMMENT: This may be true at ride height when the vehicle is standing on its 4 wheels on the ground. With a spacer fitted however, the total length of the strut is now longer allowing the wheels to droop further taking the CV angle past critical maximum angle. We see this very often. My youngest brother owns a very large CV and drive shaft business. He sees CV joint failure constantly with 4wd vehicles fitted with spacers. I cannot argue with him on that. 3. YOUR COMMENT: "The droop is limited on some pickups (like the Ranger) by the upper control arm touching the strut housing." MY COMMENT: This is incorrect. The droop limit on the front of just about all Strut equipped 4wd pickups and wagons currently (including the Ranger) is determined by the length of the strut. That is why it is critical not to extend the length of the strut (which is what fitting a spacer to the top of the strut does). If your upper control arms are currently touching your struts, you have too much droop. 4. YOUR COMMENT: "The benefit of an aftermarket suspension is, in the context of this video explanation, to eliminate the risk of the coil bind. There are solutions for that too, one could fit extended bump stops." MY COMMENT: The benefit of fitting an aftermarket suspension, provided it is a properly engineered product, is to induce a lift where required that ensures that all of the front suspension geometry limits as designed by the original vehicle manufacturer engineers remain in place. This will ensure that you do not have component failures while traveling down the road in your 4wd with your family on board and other road users around you. Fitting a spacer on top of the strut and then compensating for this by fitting an extended bump stop may well eliminate the potential coil bind. It will however certainly not eliminate the over extension of the droop. There are many vehicles with spacers and other cheap and easy suspension lifts (extended shackles) out there. We get them into our workshop every day. Most will not experience any issue. However, we have had far too many vehicles arrive at our workshop with serious suspension failure or imminent failure due to spacers and other unsafe modification issues. We refer to suspension components as "LIFE & LIMB" parts. If they fail, you could lose LIFE & LIMB. I cannot fathom why one would risk your life, those of your loved ones and other road users by saving a couple of bucks on a properly engineered suspension lift by going for these quick fixes.

[@mugurmartinescu5728]

@@micvanzyl thank you for this thoughtful explanation. It makes sense and I appreciate it and apologize for making some assumptions. The explanation of the overextending CV makes sense now.

[@Ironman4x4Africa]

@@mugurmartinescu5728 You're most welcome Mate. Safety first.

[@ruanbeukes4007]

Mic, 2 questions: 1 if I fit the spacers with a shock extension and bump stop spacers too will that have the same negative effects mentioned? 2 if i do a spring replacement of +25mm instead of the spacers will there be any similar issues? Keep in mind I drive a 2018 Suzuki Vitara LY and just want a lift to fit some larger tyres for more clearance.

[@micvanzyl]

Hi Ruan. I cannot comment on the Suzuki as we do not have suspension for and have not worked on this vehicle. Any spacer between the top of the suspension strut and the vehicle chassis mounting point is going to allow the wheels to drop down further past the original suspension travel droop limit originally intended by the vehicle manufacturer. This may well compromise the upper ball joint and the drive shaft angles. Fitting 25mm lift coils will not cause this as long as you keep the original shocks or use shocks that have the same length as the originals.

[@gerryroetsYosi]

Then what's the difference between a complete suspension lift 2" and the front drive sharft angle it will also change

[@theviolator2.030]

His hairline need a 4 inch lift.

[@flw1776]

Despite not recommending spacers …Doesn’t Ironman 4x4 sell Polyurethane Coil Spacer30mm Suited For Toyota fj80?

[@kyrankraupner4887]

Mic, for arguments sake: if you put a 20mm strut spacer in and adjusted the bump-stop 20mm up- effectively stopping over compression of the shock- do you forsee an issue?

[@yipgeewai7208]

Hi sir. If I install the spacers, the warranty will void?

[@Ironman4x4Africa]

Hi Yip. If the Ironman 4x4 shock absorbers fails prematurely and it is found to be physical damage to the shock due to the fitment of strut spacers fitted on top of the front struts, then indeed the we will not be able to honour the product warranty.

[@yipgeewai7208]

@@Ironman4x4Africa thanks sir

[@tomyuk]

Hello there! What about just a 40mm / 1.575 inch "cheap lift kit", just for daily usage, almost never anything seriously offroad, gravel/light muddy road at best. 2010 RX350. I don't really think I'd run into any of the problems mentioned in this video. Can anyone chime in or share their experiences with similar usage? Also. OEM is 235/55r19. I'm at 255/65r17. For 27.5% more side wall; much greater bump absorption, and on super quiet tires, with internal sound dampening. Just thought a 40mm 'cheapo lift kit' would fit the bill for slightly more ground clearance, as am in a 3rd world country, and wanted to hear some of other people's testimonies.

[@Pato-ml7nt]

Actually the spacer sits on top of the strut not in between the spacer seat n top locking hat. So it does not rob any space as you explain.

[@technocurry]

Well ive got a corolla and already murder it what could go wrong

[@cmadventures6077]

So with a longer spring, the suspen8wont go further down? 😅 And a larger spring won't compress as much either. Lol next

[@DingasPro]

I prefer a complete strut replacement, spacers are not only unfomfortable but dangerous and makes the stock struts ride really badly.

[@chrischambless]

You've pointed out a few problems, but problems often have solutions. So correct me if I"m wrong, but doesn't any kind of lift put the same kind of stress on your CVs? And can't that be remedied with a diff drop kit? Seems like a diff drop plus an aftermarket upper control arm with different geometry would fix 2 of the three issues. As for the issue of the spring becoming the bump stop, you could select a different spring with either less windings or a smaller diameter made from a stiffer alloy to compensate. Seems like if all one does is add a body lift spacer without making the additional mods, that could lead to big problems as stated. But in combination with a larger suspension upgrade and some careful decision making, a bit of body lift might be totally fine if you do it right. And I can think of a few reasons why you would want to have both.

[@micvanzyl]

Hi Chris. Just to be clear, a body lift spacer is not the same as a strut spacer. Body lift spacers extend the mountings of the body to the chassis. A strut spacer sits atop the front or rear suspension strut between the upper strut cap and the suspension mounting point. Both induce an increase in ride height when you measure the distance between the vehicle body and the wheels. A properly engineered suspension lift from a reputable brand offer a marginal lift on the intended vehicle. This is normally between 25 to 50mm depending. The ride height under full compression and full droop with this type of suspension lift does not allow the travel between full compression and full droop to exceed the upper and lower limits as determined by the original vehicle engineer. This engineer has also designed the CV's to operate correctly throughout the scope of this factory determined suspension travel. The same applies to the ball joints on the upper control arms. Exceeding these travel limits is where problems arise. As for fitting different springs, this is not as straight forward as it sounds. There is not enough space in this comments bracket to delve into that . Spring rate, spring stress and materials used are a chapter all to them selves in the big book on suspension. Fitting a diff drop, aftermarket control arms, bump stop extensions, etc may eliminate some of the issues but invariably cause new issues. We once fitted a 4 inch lift to a vehicle for Nissan South Africa as a show vehicle. It had a diff drop kit, bump stop extensions, upper control arms and a host of other components that had to be fitted. It took an immense amount of modification to get the suspension to work and it turned out ok. A major head ache was the front prop shaft. Dropping the front diff induced new angles on the front prop shaft causing new issues requiring fixing. Just not worth the effort or the risk at the end of the day.

[@chrischambless]

@@micvanzyl thanks for taking the time to set me straight. Now on a unibody vehicle, like a Honda Element, there is no difference. You put a spacer on top of the strut/coil assembly and that lifts the body. Everyone refers to that as a body lift which is why I was confused what you were talking about. I just bought the Ironman FCP front coilovers for my Lexus GX 460. I went for the 2.5” lift heavy load option because I have a 150 lbs steel bumper coming. I have not installed them yet. Waiting on the bumper. So are you telling me I dont need to worry at all about a diff drop for the sake of my CVs?

[@riderknight5805]

I'll still fit spacers I like it more now it's risky 😬 🤪

[@yipgeewai7208]

Yes.. Is very dangerous

[@bne4k111]

So off-roading = lift kit Daily driving = strut spacers Lift kit = $$$$ Strut spacers = $