History of Credit Exploits and Inflation in SWTOR

[@Just_Jamxs]

i remember how i would grind for hours and hours after school to buy all my abilities. seeing a lightsaber for 50K felt impossible to reach, huh the good old days

[@NarasimhaDiyasena]

Most I had was 1.25 million credits after grinding for years. Then took a break and hoped back in 2019 and sold a cartel item for 180 million and was making 30 million credits per week lmao. Haven’t played since so idk how it is now

[@olafgurke4699]

Yeah, same. I remember I was on Rishi with a BH when the expansion dropped, and I was so poor I couldn't afford the new abilities. In fact, buying the new abilities made me so poor, I couldn't even afford to leave the planet. xD

[@exumaan2512]

@@NarasimhaDiyasena Similar but even worse. The most expensive items on Darth Malgus are not even listed on GTN anymore because they're worth more than the sale cap (1 billion)... It's just insane and Bioware doesn't give too many fucks.

[@lslunny95]

Im new and when I saw how many credits and I was mind blown

[@vlads3283]

@@olafgurke4699 didn't quests give credits back then?

[@doctordakotascorpio7047]

the first time i reached or went over 1 million credits i felt like a millionaire that could anything...good times lol

[@8imouse]

Exactly! I wanted Sateele Shan holostatue and it cost around 4 mil on GTN, and when I finally got the money and purchased it I was euphoric, lol.

[@mandalore41]

I bought a revans mask for 4.5 million years ago, now the price is just ridiculous and you are better off just using cc coins

[@kenbennett4556]

Now if you have 1 million credits you may as well be broke and homeless.

[@mathieulefebvre7812]

Played st launch 100k felt like a millionair

[@HighMarshallHaka]

The most expensive think I bout was the entire tula hord set at release for like 10mil

[@Lazarenko93]

I remember I once had two unstabe dual sabers so I sold one on the GTN. A guy messaged me if I wanted to sell it for a lower price as he didnt had the money to match my price. Sold it to him for his ask price. He was so happy with it. Felt good doing that. Made me feel content. Credits werent an issue and made that guys day.

[@freddym99]

900 million. take it or leave it.

[@screamingiraffe]

@@freddym99 I always the 'needy' guy trying to buy things out of my price range, and people like you really made my day when I got it, hated grinding but loved the stories. Thanks for that.

[@MS-zd9nl]

I remember clearly the day when I bought the darth revan chestpiece for 400k, i never bound it to a character so i can still sell it, which i will eventually do

[@ferryrahman1]

I remember I bought the HAVOC SQUAD armor for less than 1 million. I was preferred status. Then i got subbed, sold it for 220 million. Great success!

[@deadshot5007]

I remember when the Malgus armor cost around 30 million and now you can only find it for over 100 million.

[@hollowkid97]

I think those are two different malgus armors. The new one is darker and full black.

[@deadshot5007]

@@hollowkid97 Nah I mean the one that dropped in early 2016

[@storms9023]

Malgus Reborn is even more ridiculous.

[@JuicyJenitals]

Almost exactly 1 year ago i was buying hypercrates off the gtn for 400 mil, now 400 mil will only get you 5 cartel packs 💀

[@Cyggdrasil]

I remember when the Red Black Dye used to cost 35,000 average, now days i see them around 185,000

[@Swtorista]

That's a good example since they are easy to produce. Not just cartel stuff has gone up.

[@LevadeNZ]

On my server, I'm somewhat known for crafting a lot of the popular craftable dyes and putting them up at a slight profit, 100+ of them every night to try and keep the market somewhat stable. Every couple of weeks I get someone messaging to ask why I'm doing it, but every time, I notice that material prices often begin to drop. A friend "sponsored" me to go to their server and do the same thing every time prices get ridiculous there.

[@CopeAndSeeth]

@@LevadeNZ never heard of you

[@hrginho]

@@LevadeNZ I do the same with craftable armors on the GTN. I see a lot of pieces going for 400-600k credits. I sell mine for 100k (which I think is a reasonable price), and still earn a nice amount. But the prices don't go down at all, my armor sets get sold, and the other not so much. I'm wondering if it's really me being the problem, offering my armor pieces for a low price?

[@LevadeNZ]

@@hrginho Sometimes it takes quite a while unfortunately. I might flood the market with grade 4 dyes, and it takes a couple weeks for material prices to drop, but I have the stocks to keep up the pace until they do.

[@OnkelGertsch]

I felt the burn of this today. Today I saw a Sith Warrior video. I liked the armor the player was wearing, it wasn't too fancy. But I kind of liked the colors on the plates and how the whole thing works together. So I logged in and searched. Of course, the armor is no longer available in the Cartel market, so I searched in the players market. And I found it. A golden armor pack, no platinum, no copy of a Lore Charakter or something like that, without colors for a billion. A BILLION! Get the fu.... outta here.

[@johnathanera5863]

The resilient warden set? Lol. I'm in the same boat

[@OnkelGertsch]

@@johnathanera5863 Jup^^

[@hrginho]

I'm lucky enough to have bought it four years ago from the cartel market, just before I quit playing. I'm back now, for over a month.

[@chadmann2724]

I just want more legacy cargo space 😭

[@Facetiously.Esoteric]

I remember 5 of us in our guild throwing together to buy a guild ship when it came out. So much farming.

[@Swtorista]

Yes! It was a huge deal when we decided to move servers and had to buy it again lol

[@alberthord9527]

@@Swtorista My guild is just a few of my friends and me. I was our most active player at the time, so I farmed mats on Yavin, sold them on the GTN, and bought our guild ships (Emp & Rep) out of my own pocket. I did not have the dedication to try and fully expand the ships that way though.

[@Garpii]

I remember farming for a guild ship solo. What a fun that was. And I also tried to farm for ships' expansions, but I could only kill battlemasters on Hoth and Tatooine, I think, so it was a very long endeavor.

[@luketimewalker]

Apart from one guildie giving me 1 million, I had to farm it all by myself. Back then it was 50 million credits! For months all I would do was farm Rishi crates and craft stuff !!

[@Facetiously.Esoteric]

@@luketimewalker 5 of us tossed in 10 mill each. Had to farm forever.

[@SydBarrett986]

I started the game in 2013 I think, as an f2p player. I was able to buy a 600k credits escrow transfer thingy for 4k (!) and then buy the twi'lek and sith pureblood legacy unlock with it. I also bought companion customization, hide head slot, cargo hold, more quickbars, bigger inventory, even a character slot playing free and using these escrow transfers.

[@luketimewalker]

WOW

[@MokiSenpai]

The most hush hush exploit was done by the aid of support. Back in the day, when the best mainhands dropped from the hardest nim bosses, You could buy offhand weapons with tokens, remove the hilts, barrels from them, destroy them and ask tech support to restore them. But the funny thing is... the hilt, barrel that they restored was not offhand bound, it was just an unbound item, so you could use it in your mainhand... gaining a massive DPS boost.

[@Swtorista]

Haha! This isn't an economy exploit but I love the story!

[@HiddenPalm]

Making one million in an hour or even five million an hour is no where near enough to buy simple things like a dye going for one billion credits or even a 500 million armor set. Most players only have a few hours at most before having to go to sleep to get ready for work or school. The inflation is killing the game for sure. This is pushing people to make the black market even worse because people are now going to gold farmers a lot more than ever before. Thanks for making this video. Something has to be done. This is worse than Venezuela's economy, but at least they have the US imposed sanctions as an excuse. EA doesn't have an excuse. FYI, The black and black dye on the Satele Shan is going for 1 billion.

[@HittokiriBattousai17]

It's because they have no new players and the core players have ENOURMOUS wealth, and control the economy themselves. The rich stay rich, the poor will never get rich, and it will be like that until the game ends.

[@hoebertrabeck1621]

you say shit is expensive on gtn.... wait i have a little idea... sell stuff on the gtn

[@hoebertrabeck1621]

" The inflation is killing the game for sure. This is pushing people to make the black market even worse because people are now going to gold farmers a lot more than ever before. Thanks for making this video. Something has to be done. This is worse than Venezuela's economy, but at least they have the US imposed sanctions as an excuse. EA doesn't have an excuse." inflation is indeed a catchup mechanic. it helps new players and especially returning players. and its unavoidable. i started playing on starforge again like 3 weeks ago. had 45 million. now after selling some fp decos and stuff i got from galactic seasons. i am at 2 billion credits. have all my 3 gear sets augmented (blue because if i dont run gods nim i dont need more) sorry but if you are too lazy to go to onderon and farm some crafting mats (which sell for horrendous prices) its not the games fault. you would need gigantic credit sinks to get more credits off the gtn whales than farmes can create. those credit sinks would be a nightmare for new players. its mmo economics not real world economics. Those are 2 quite similar but in certain points highly different things. what is the games fault is the credit cap in the gtn. it has to go. if people trade more shit without paying taxes the main credit sink does not work anymore, that leads to the hyperinflation we see now. it might look scary, but if you know how to play the gtn a bit its super easy to get money.

[@HiddenPalm]

@@hoebertrabeck1621 The comment you replied to is about a year old. Today, 2 billion can get you two dyes. The main credit sink in the game has always been gear repair. Credit sinks are everywhere actually. It has never fixed the economy of this game. It never eased it, it never slowed it down. Credit sinks don't work in real life either. In my opinion, the only solution is to accept the economy as is and have everything in the game reward more credits. Raise the minimum wage. Better yet, make the economy reward so well it's a living wage, enough to buy pretty things to make your toon look good to keep you playing, while also having enough for necessities like augment kits, augments, stims, adrenals etc to be able to play endgame content. Barely getting by is fine too. But a Star Wars toon can not live on bread alone.

[@hoebertrabeck1621]

@@HiddenPalm "Better yet, make the economy reward so well it's a living wage, enough to buy pretty things to make your toon look good to keep you playing, while also having enough for necessities like augment kits, augments, stims, adrenals etc to be able to play endgame content. " do you have an economocs degree from the "unicorn university of dreams"? if you raise the minimum wage you raise the price. when everybody has more money the prices go up. it will be the same ratio from income to expenses. a few people control the gtns. if you put on crafting mats relatively cheap, they will be bought in masses and resold with a profit. its a uncontrolled hypercapitalistic system, where if you have the money you can control the market as you wish. no minimum wage can change this.

[@PogoMeraki]

I actually started talking about this in a swtor session once in the republic fleet. Some of the folks were acting like I was crazy talking about how awfully inflated the current prices are.

[@teddylark2357]

yes they are the ones making money so they have to shut that shit down..

[@luketimewalker]

interesting

[@Sundance_one]

This is so interesting, I just came back to the game after about 4-5 years and was surprised by the prices

[@Val.Kyrie.]

Ditto

[@1AmGroot]

27:23 This actually happened to me a couple days ago. I really wanted to buy the Resilient Warden armor set. I checked the GTN, saw it was going for about 800m credits, said "screw it" and bought it for cartel coins which I had left over from when I was subscribed.

[@tuxedotservo]

I remember the companion gifts exploit. I also remember someone (on Reddit, I believe) bragging about it, and writing what basically amounted to a manifesto that summed up as "cheaters always win" after managing to avoid the ban-hammer.

[@silassheppard5574]

Really enjoyed this „swtor history“ episode:) Would love to see more of those videos! :D

[@Kryptic1046]

I've also played off and on since launch, and remember the earlier days of the game. I came back to the game in 2017 after a couple years off, played for awhile, and I remember stuff like gold armor packs being ~15 million credits (which I used to regularly buy off the GTN), and most expensive cosmetic items were around 20 million or less. I took a few years off, came back earlier this year and was floored at how much everything cost. I was sitting on a lot of stuff I had bought on the CM back in the day, and I quickly realized I was now sitting on billions of credits in CM items. The inflation is absolutely insane.

[@Eltaurus]

Hey, do you remember even earlier days? I am wondering, how far the current twotino population was before you caught them into mean motion resonance?

[@Kryptic1046]

@@Eltaurus - "Hey, do you remember even earlier days?" Um, excuse me, but I don't prefer to discuss my distant past. I also don't waste time and energy talking about the orbits of puny planetoids with perfect strangers. You keep your mind on those forests and tornadoes and all that other sh** you got over there in your lil Goldilocks zone. Don't worry about what happens out here fella.

[@Eltaurus]

@@Kryptic1046 you really are an ice giant

[@luketimewalker]

@@Eltaurus @Neptune that was unexpected ^^'

[@connorgalloway2673]

I just now reached a billion credits, which these days is just enough for one platinum item, then you’re broke again.

[@norad1]

Thanks for the video! I have actually wondered about the inflation, and this was super informative. I've been off for the past 7 months and I recall hypercrates being around 500mil, didn't realize it had gotten so bad lol. I know for myself I had to learn how to deal with inflation and make tons of credits to be able to get the things I wanted, but I found there were certainly limits to what lengths I was willing to deal with. One solution though that is already implemented in the game is the GTN tax. If the goal is to simply take money out of the game, they could just crank that up from whatever percentage it already is.

[@Swtorista]

I feel like that's a solution we may see more of in the future. But if it's too high people will just trade via chat instead

[@JuicyJenitals]

Im part of the reason inflation got so bad. I bought 1 billion credits off ebay a year ago for $50 so i can mass buy furniture for my stronghold and this was around the steam launch and new players would sell items on the gtn for the default buyout price so i was able to stack up hundreds of thousands of crafting mats and then i quit playing until a week ago when i sold all my mats for super cheap.in short i imported a billion credits and swallowed up too many crafting mats driving everything up in price. I just went on and sold a stack of 3300 dragon pearls for 1 credit lol. The main problem however is the credit sellers on ebay changed the price from 1 bil @ $50 to just $7 for a billion

[@elderliddle2733]

I remember something I did to help the economy slightly. I had a rare lightsaber from a cartel pack that I didn’t want. It was a double saber (I think it was like the defiant or onslaught saber idk) it was on the GTN for like 500 mill. I sold mine on the GTN for like 50 mill. The prices came crashing down trying to compete with my price. From what I saw, they have gone back up to about 100 mill. But it’s still cool that I broke the economy for a hot second.

[@Adamopoly]

The person selling it for 500 million most likely bought it for ur 50 million just to resell it for his/her price.

[@FalandraAoC]

@@Adamopoly yeah if anything, this probably made it worse because now this person selling it for 500 million has more of them and can force prices to stay high for longer 😂

[@BoxmanCaleb]

@@FalandraAoC exactly what I would do lol

[@fremejoker]

I call BS. One item cannot cause a price crash. For that multiple items need to be offered at the 50 mill mark to cause other sellers to decrease their prices because they cannot buy those themselves.

[@commander_fu6457]

The inflation could have been fixed by server rollbacks right after the exploits were reported to the dev team. I have no idea why that didn't happen especially on the 2017 exploit. o.O

[@DS01]

The white crystals were a nice status symbol at launch. My static and I rocked them proudly on The Crucible Pitts. Great times.

[@tayltv01]

Oh, my goodness... I remember just grinding the Black Hole dailies and the ones on Belsavis to make credits.

[@gabereichenbach5662]

I’m surprised you didn’t mention the referral program. I think while exploits have certainly influenced the economy I’d argue the referral program had a far greater effect on gtn prices. While the referral program was far from perfect it pumped probably tens of thousands of cc’s into the game on a monthly basis maybe more. With this now gone from the game we have a supply issue when it comes to cartel market items being bought with cc and sold on the gtn for credits.

[@vodkavecz]

Yeah I remember when I checked in for new content there were always people on general chat offering to give ~2M credits if you use their referral link. Didn't understand what's in it for them, until someone told me they get CC for that.

[@DarkJediMaster18]

It did have a big effect on what's going on now with the GTN. I watched countless videos of SWTOR KZbinrs that had 10s of thousands of cartel coins and they would buy many rare items from the cartel market, then sell them on the GTN for high and higher prices. It didn't cost them anything because they were getting thousands of free CCs every month. She probably didn't mention it because she had thousands of CCs herself. Go back and watch older vids of hers and you can see. But I guess if I was getting free CCs every month I would have been going crazy buying cartel market items as well. lol Also another problem is all the new players from Steam that want all the kool stuff and are willing to pay whatever to get it because they are late to the game.

[@kalisthenes6650]

Cartel coins are a separate economy item and not related to credits. The video is about the rampant inflation with credits. Selling cartel items for huge amounts just moves the already created credits around it doesn’t create any more credits in the economy which is what inflation is.

[@JohnSmith-li6mn]

@@kalisthenes6650 so you're telling me the fact that people don't have to do or pay for jack and get all of the best looking stuff and sell it for however isn't a problem. that either you're unable to get or not willing do what are you gonna do. Pay For It. Legit watch the video what she talks about is how hypercrates and such. genuinely have you even played the game?

[@kalisthenes6650]

@John Smith lol, you totally missed the point of the video. It’s not about you and your beef with people getting pile of free CC’s. It’s about the credit economy inflation rate. CC’s don’t play a part in that. What you are seeing is that as a result of the credit inflation rate CC items can be sold for huge amounts of credits on the GTN. Those are credits that already exist in the economy and they just move between players. The sale of the items does not generate any new credits. To answer your question yes I play. I hadn’t played for a couple of years but when I came back I found I had a pile of CC’s because my security key had been attached the whole time. So I went and sold several hypercrates on the GTN to play catch-up on my companions, crafting and strongholds. I guess by your rationale then I am part of the problem. (You would be wrong, but I am sure, based on your response to me I am simply wasting my time trying to explain this to you).

[@HKfortyseven]

I made my first million back in the day because someone posted a cathar honor sword on the gtn for like fifteen hundred credits and I bought it and then resold for just over a million. I felt like such a boss lol. I now have around $150 million total across all my 9 characters and that's peanuts compared most it seems.

[@JonYen69]

I’ve got 45B. I know a few guys in the 150+B

[@arceptor]

@@JonYen69 i got a trillion

[@JonYen69]

@@arceptor nooooo!! I want a trillion

[@luketimewalker]

@@arceptor :o

[@DatAsuna]

A half hour video for a beefy topic. lol I remember the days when seeing something for 200k felt like a big deal.

[@Aviriia]

Remember the time when everyone thought that a BB dye of 3mil was crazy? XD

[@Swtorista]

I feel like I left a lot of stuff out too!

[@002shinigami]

I remember when I logged in one day and a friend had received the credit cap because of a mistake made by the Devs. What's crazier is, because he was such an honest guy, he told BW and they just let him keep the creds. It had affected so much and it was the real start of hyper inflation. Now it looks like things have gotten worse since I last logged in. I remember things being between 1-100 million depending on its value as an item (typically deco's and really nice looking armor) and now it is looking like items at 1 billion is not all that crazy. Friggin' sheeeeeeeeeesh.

[@luketimewalker]

lol WUT

[@freddym99]

like they are selling the trash armor from the starter planets for 10k but your favorite robe or blaster rifle is so damn expensive that its not even shown anymore...

[@Cpl1nsane]

When ROTHC released I used the game time that came with that pre-purchase to grind heroics etc for credits so that I could buy account wide unlocks for when my subscription would inevitably fall back to preferred status. I cant have payed more than a 1 to 2 million for some of the higher end ones like section-x access and artifact authorisation, and most likely less than 500 thousand for the lower end ones like inventory & cargo hold slots. Looking at the huge cost now, I count myself lucky that I was able to do this and have access to things that would otherwise be disabled while not subscribed. I dread to think about the credit sink it is to decorate strongholds now compared to before the inflation, all those nice cartel market decorations locked off because of the extortionate prices.

[@Aceswolf]

Guild mates and I was talking about Credit sinks how to fix the economy. Ships... Now here me out. Imagine having 20 different ships and you're able to upgrade and customize the look of & have a small group of 2-8 on board. Not able to be sold on GTN and make the Credit SINK HUGH to get the credits out. Just saying those with tons of money would dump tons into it.

[@frederickmiller5492]

i love this idea - I also think we should be able to add decos to our existing ships. Adding ships for purchase is a great idea.

[@phaedrus12134]

This is something that was brought up in the video, credit sinks like this make it so the only people that get experience this are the people who exploited or who got lucky getting rich. Meaning probably about 90%-99% of players won't have any opportunity to do this. Where they need credit sinks: Collection unlocks should be able to be bought with credits. More galactic seasons more often. Etc... But no credit sink will put a dent into the mega wealthy's wallets. Imo the economy in the game is the best I have ever seen it right now. You 100% can make good credits playing the game and actually work towards and achieve farming for items you want without spending real money. The prices are just intimidating. My idea would be to do a credit gouge; reduce the amounts of credits in the game. If you had 2bil, you now have 200mil - or something along those lines. If done right credits and items will still hold their value, but the intimidating prices of things will significantly drop.

[@Aceswolf]

@@phaedrus12134 you know how many players would leave the game if the gouged the credits from people and give them nothing in return... honestly. I agree open some of the Cartel Gear, mounts, season pass things. I personally believe ships would be a great way to get the credits out of the economy. They can see how much the top credit holders have. Adjust the price of the ships so that it's a huge credit sink. They can't be sold on GTN. Once bought EA swtor can take those credits out of the economy and delete them. Then another credit sink would be buying all the stuff that you can decorate your ship with. Credits again and can't be sold on the gun or any other way. EA swtor takes those credits out of the economy and deletes them. I also agree that you can grind the game and get everything you wnat and need. However just taking something from people like credits. Your hitting people that spent a lot of money on the game too. The money that has gone to the companies staff to make new stuff, the money that kept the servers running for years now. I've only been playing for 3 months if they did that I would take my 200$ a month I have spent in tho 3 months to a different game. Yeah 2400$ a year sounds like a drop in the bucket. What happens when others who spend more than that leave the game. Do you think that would help or hurt the game? I try and do my part. When I pop hyper crates I sell the good stuff usually undercut the lowest price by 10-20% so that those that have been saving and are super close to getting it can get it. In all honesty it's EA swtor game. They will do what they need to do to keep the lights on and people working.

[@phaedrus12134]

@@Aceswolf reducing the number of credits in the game, increases the value of a single credit. By gouging credits nothing would need to be given in return, as the credits would be worth more. Aka you'd still be just as wealthy, the numbers just wouldn't be so ridiculous...

[@Clawy111]

I made 100k and I started 2 days ago. ON Korriban. Selling the loot i got, apprentice sabers when I got the light sabers, one from the Inqusitior or one of the Heroic Missions.

[@bannyn]

I remember saving up all my credits just to buy my abilities. Then when I bought my first cartell backs and started selling my duplicate stuff on the GTN and actually reached a million I was stunned. Of course in those days the high prices were still like 40 or 50 thousand with the super rare being 100000 or more

[@daniellogan-scott5968]

I actually shared this video to Facebook even though my readers are not players. It has become common for economists to study the economies of MMOs to see how people behave in economic systems. This analysis is an excellent example of this. There is a saying among libertarians. "When you print money it's counterfeiting and illegal, but when the government prints money it's quantitive easing." Basically, flooding the economy with money causes inflation whether this is done by individuals or government. What inflation does is devalue the money in your pocket. So the million credits in your bank would buy less today than it did last week so you effectively lost money. This is true in SWTOR and in real life.

[@JACKxTHExRIPPER]

I remember when augment kits first came out, I had prepared and built a ton of bracers ahead of time to deconstruct. I had several characters making aug kits and they were selling for a good amount. I ended up making 26 million in 1 day. I felt like a god. I was easily the richest of all my friends.

[@Swtorista]

Smart!!!

[@eujr4SC]

I remember grinding for a few weeks just to get the few million or so credits for the Korrealis Commander way back in the day when they announced it was going to be leaving the game. Things were so expensive and there weren't a lot of ways to earn credits as easily after the game launched. Keep up the content! I may be interested in playing again. Haven't played since the KotFE storyline.

[@lancellewellyn8715]

Maybe there could be a Smuggler's Run type event. Like how you spend credits to send companions off to get crafting mats, you could pay a Cartel smuggler to get rare, non-tradeable items for you. The more dangerous the mission, the more you pay, and there'd be a chance they get caught and don't come back at all.

[@Eno-master]

oh i LOVE this idea. losing a level 50 comp permanently!

[@luketimewalker]

very good

[@goldenfiberwheat238]

Nope. Let’s just charge for quick travel instead!

[@sarkath77]

Maybe banned accounts could have all of their items confiscated (after a set amount of time that for the player to contest the ban) and placed into a developer owned bank where they would then be listed for sale on the market. The price of the items would be set as the average or most common price for each particular item, meaning rare items don't get taken out of circulation. Any credits made by the dev bank would be removed from circulation to bring down the over all credits in the economy. I haven't thought this out entirely, so I'm open to feed back on this idea, but I think it would be overall pretty good for the economy, even if not a lot of players get banned. And of course, hacked items or glitched items would be removed and deleted before being put on sale ideally.

[@NicoleMay316]

The referral program added it's fair share to the issue. Plenty of people used it legitimately or gave away stuff, but there were players who spent all their time paying a small sum of credits to new subscribers and then getting the monthly cartel coin bonus until they cancelled their sub. I heard some players made upwards of $200-$1000 in cartel coins per month like this.

[@Swtorista]

Technically this HELPED inflation as it introduced more items (supply) into the economy. I was worried when they took it away as less people would be able to throw cartel packs onto the gtn making them scarcer. Luckily we saw more cartel coins come back via galactic Seasons.

[@triquivijate]

TYSM for explaining this issue. - I have been around almost since launch and have seen the inflation ramp up ever quicker each year. - Even my stack of legit credits isn't a lot nowadays. Inflation really hurts new players. Old veterans know all the tricks to keep up with it, or are no longer concerned with making credits day-to-day. Mostly it's the fault of EA / Bioware. They took their eye off the ball, and never kept the lid on pricing and the value of items. As Swotorista said, the damage is done.

[@Swtorista]

Yes veterans can "keep up" at least! I can't imagine starting into collecting as a newer player these days.

[@bridersurris904]

@@Swtorista I'm a newer player, and also can't afford more than a one-off sub to get preferred, and yeah.... it looks like hell ahead.

[@ancientsithlord3314]

Struggling to repair gear and struggling to buy all my abilities man those were the days

[@llamaMonstA]

Some of the larger guilds have a conquest crafting exploit. I've seen their conquest score rise millions in minutes. I imagine if they're getting credits for conquest on top of it, that it's another credit exploit as well.

[@AlipashaSadri]

I recently logged back to the game and went to GTN and WOW! Prices in the *millions*!!!!?! I used to think I was very wealthy for having a few million in the bank... Hyperinflation! Nice video :) Thanks for the history :)

[@mflax4331]

Every MMO fights with this problem: more or less. How much is done depends on the developers and those paying their wages. STO and other MMOs usually find alternative ways to pay for stuff and to create credit sinks. The new season introduced both: new coins to use at vendors and taking credits out of the market. Other events offer similar event currencies. Check your inventory and you will probably find a lot of different currencies in there. I didn't use any exploit (at least not knowingly - you know it starts as a bug so nobody knows). Which is one more reasons those responsible for the game are slow in erasing funds from this (falling victim of a bug is not the same as intentionally using an exploit). On the other hand WE will never know what stuff is kept track off for just finding those bad guys. I played all 8 classes through the first 3 chapters and now (after selling of crafting materials like crazy) I have bought anything I like and have more than 300mio in my account bank. I'm not into fancy gear, I mostly buy functional stuff (and most of the rest I'll receive as presents from the game). Summing it up: I'm not affected by this (except the inflation gives me more money when selling off materials).

[@HealerMommy1]

even private servers for SWG l.ike legends has this issue. before it grew big the server had a player that found a credit dupe and put trillions in and wiped entire servers market. credits stayed and items poofed. it ruined the server yet none of the players who joined after it know and to this day the ecom there is so bad... it's why I'm glad I'm playing on a smaller server for SWG Named prophecy...they fixed the exploits so no one could usem.

[@mflax4331]

@@HealerMommy1 When Diablo3 got out they had an auction house. That was abused a lot and thus they almost completely abandoned it and turned up the drops. Thus players got their stuff more from loot than from shopping. In Neverwinter Online they had an early exploit involving cats (if I remember right). Those not involved and in the game at that time received a special cat coat as a memorial of that fiasco. So yes, attempts at fraudulant behaviour are rampant in all online games I know. As I Don't care about anything I cannot get by my own means, I don't pay much attention. Additionally I message the game guardians with any attempt to sell me coins (many games feature a spam / similar button to make that easy). BTW gold sellers may get their gold from hacking - thus getting in contact may be a very bad idea.

[@KuroiHametsu]

@Swtorista The only good way to stop the inflation is to limit the amount an item can be sold for capping under 50,000,000 because nothing should cost more than a guild ship. Set tiered maximums for every items rarity. Then you also add a 25% tax to every gtn purchase costing more credits to buy. Also add a 25% cost to list based on your price. So you sell an item for 50,000,000 you spend 12,500,000 just to put it up on the market. people will be able to buy entire supplies but prices for players will go back to more reasonable rates.

[@luketimewalker]

agree

[@TommyTucker74]

As someone who's been around since launch, this was a trip down memory lane. Fwiw, I still have hundreds of those gifts. I never did the exploit, but I have max influence companions on my crafters which is it's own reward. 😁

[@arc2144]

The inflation is why I stopped bothering with the GTN

[@phaedrus12134]

It works both ways. The economy of the game is actually really healthy right now. With conquest, things sell extremely well - especially things like crafting materials that contribute to conquest. Are things expensive right now? Yes, but you can also sell things and actually make good profit. I make 50mil+ a day just sending my companions on missions while I play. So even though things are expensive right now, they are very obtainable without having to spend any real money - more so now then ever.

[@rockyshields9122]

Keep thinking it can't keep going up but prices are just increasing

[@CobaltTux]

100mil Lana customizations, I fixed everything lol

[@Stardustheart]

I played swtor from 2012, to about uh knights of the eternal throne. And yeah, compared to what things costing from what I remember in the early game, even to early KOTET, its gone straight wild from when I returned only recently this month to poke around. I have to admit I saved up a LARGE amount of credits in my time playing, I was at one point on 6 raid teams at once most being NiM or Hard mode, often ending raid going straight into another. I'd often get a lot of raid mats, decorations ectect and just sell em along with sale runs some of my groups would do. But even now, im kind of blown away with how much everything costs. I feel like almost all I've saved up has amounted to not that much in comparison now. :X

[@Empyre47AT]

I remember buying hypercrates for 4-6M credits on the GTN around 2014. 1B is plain ludicrous.

[@flixet5425]

This video brings back some memories. Thanks!

[@phaedrus12134]

Thank you for this video. Nobody believes me when I explain how bad credit exploits have ruined the economy of the game over the years - everyone wants to blame it on credit sellers, when this is a very small percentage of the problem. This has gotten so bad because people printed a crap ton of credits, add this with the referral system (another thing people like to blame) being taken out - so a lot of items aren't for sale in the quantities they used to be. An economy is all about supply/demand/amount of currency. All of which is out of wack right now. At least making credits IN GAME is easier than it has ever been right now. Again, thanks for the video. This needed explained from someone trusted. Edit* it's actually crazy how good the economy is right now in terms of how easy it is the make credits in the game - without spending anything on the cm. If the exploit problems of the past weren't still haunting the game, it wouldn't be so intimidating to most people but with how well the conquest system was redone, crafting materials are very profitable.

[@DatAsuna]

I think it's less credit seller and exploits than it is the balance of the ingame credit sinks themselves. If you remember shortly before 6.0 we'd kind of hit a stabilised point where prices weren't too crazy because the only thing you could possibly need a million credits for outside of the GTN was a select handful of legacy perks. After 6.0 bioware not only introduced arbitrary credit walls for crafting but decided 1 million credits was the new baseline for armours and cosmetics even from vendors, along with the infinite sinks that are tunings. Inflation spiked massively right after 6.0 and it was all because bioware decided to raise the standard so that a million credits was no longer just nice to have but the bare minimum for you to do almost anything at level cap.

[@phaedrus12134]

@@DatAsuna it's like 90% exploits. I've seen people with 100s of billions loaded into their wallet. These mega wealthy players that made their credits from exploits have more wealth than any credit sink could swallow. And because they have hoarded items, they will not stop accumulating wealth - these items will always be worth a lot. With this wealth they essentially can control the market at any given time - when they do this they flood credits into people's wallets and then those people begin to overpay on things. There is a reason people can sell a lightsaber for 2bil+, because people are paying that much for them. Inflation like we are seeing is a direct consequence of people printing money and circulating it into a market they control...

[@tremor3258]

Really feels like 2017 one in particular probably should've been a rollback, that sounds so bad.

[@baldesion]

I recently just saw someone talking about inflation and telling people to undercut everyone on the market when looking up ways to earn credits and what sells on the market. So this video is amazing timing.

[@skellybelly6972]

I remember when you could buy operation passes for 200k on gtn. I could run ops every week for free. I still got like 10 of them in the Unclaimed items tab since the last server merge when my legacy cargos got overfilled by the merge. I think they still work too.

[@holeeshi9959]

one way to fix it: they could just add reskinned cartel market armors/weapons packs to a vendor for credits, or cool armor that can only be bought for credits, but have those packs always be bound so they cant resell it. the excess cash will be gone in no time because at the end of the day people just want to look pretty

[@Takeru_Dono]

There’s something incredibly funny and amazing that the concept of an actual economy and inflation existing in a video game

[@saykni]

Ending the referral system means that less people are buying hyper crates, which would often drop the most sought after items, creating a steady supply and making the prices drop. Now that bioware removed this so that people buy more cartel coins, prices have risen because the value of things are more in line with real life money.

[@MrBetterThanYou77]

yes.

[@Swtorista]

Technically, more people should be able to buy Hypercrates via the cartel coins from Galactic Seasons, if I've done my math guessing right.

[@saykni]

@@Swtorista while it does offer an opportunity for players who didnt partake in the referral program to earn cartel coins, I personally think that it doesnt nearly amount to the amount of cartel coins people were earning through referrals. For one thing, I didnt participate in galactic seasons at all because it required me to play the pvp at times which is annoying. Its also a set amount of cartel coins per season, unless theres some kind of way to earn them that i am unaware of. I know there were alot of people whos entire existence were getting people to click their links, these people would mostly buy hypercrates and resell any of the items.

[@Aguila1138]

"Republic credits are no good out here. I need something more real"

[@rockyshields9122]

Yeah been playing since launch and I only play a few hours a week and make 25 million . The GTN prices have gone insane in last year

[@Elite1Force]

very interesting video. I actually recorded all my market transaction for hypercrates and single packs between the end of 2015 and begining of 2017. There i somewhat can see the spikes mentioned by you in this video and also how the hypercrate price evolved over time. Luckily, even though i stopped trading a long time ago, i had most of my money invested in packs... You pretty much covered everything in the video, but if you are interested i could send you this spreadsheet.

[@pascalwijtsma]

zimbabwe laughes as this game now : who has the highest inflation now boi!

[@RolyTheHolyPaladin]

9:44 - So... inflation happens within a video game, the exact same way it happens in real life? (increasing the currency supply far faster than goods and services increase) - INTERESTING!

[@Swtorista]

Definitely some similar traits!

[@cullenmason618]

Finally became a billionaire a couple of months ago. Was shocked to see that apparently I am still considered middling in the broken swtor economy hahaha

[@rebellyanmagic6409]

Only in SWTOR can you be an in-game literal billionaire and still be one of 'the poors.'

[@SeLeXeL]

I have a screenshot somewhere, taken soon after launch, of me checking my in-game mail showing the notifications of items sold on the GTN. I'd sold a bunch of augments, accumulated via slicing gathering missions, for around 10-20 creds each :P

[@graved1gger]

Master's datacron costs 800 mils on darth malgus right now O_O.

[@rebellyanmagic6409]

I still have a couple in my Legacy vault. Once I noticed the price climbing, I bought what I could and kept them for when I wanted to create alts.

[@GabeBarcelona]

I first played back in 2018 then came back 2022 after getting the star wars itch again thanks to the shows+ new games. I only played solo story so did not know how the economy worked. Thanks for the video series!

[@emilianthered2160]

Star Wars: The Venezuelan Republic

[@CaetanoAmadeu]

Lmao yea

[@Nick-4K]

Back in 2013. I found out that Rubat Crystals were one of the most sought after items. So I sent all my followers to get them and used to make bank off them. Made about a million in the first year of playing. I remember thinking that 1 million credits was crazy. Now I can make that in a few hours. Crazy.

[@Jaeden_Phoenix]

I remember back when 500k was rich, good times

[@HummingbirdSound]

One single ultimate pack is worth between 109 million and 125 million credits on my server at the moment (February 2022). So a hypercrate is worth around 3 billion credits...

[@Swtorista]

Yep they keep going up!

[@petergohan]

We can see now the real reason we have amplifiers in the game.

[@Swtorista]

Yep amplifiers definitely seem to be a credit sink! A great example too - you really don't *need* them.

[@snens7179]

Having to roll amps again on all the new gear will take a chunk of credits out of the game but in the end thats another one time thing before we wait years for the next tier of gear.

[@ValtronHK]

I won a Revan Reborn set from a Swtorista raffle once (thanks, btw). Oh boy am I glad I did not have to purchase it for GTN prices!

[@Swtorista]

I am also glad I don't have to buy prizes from the GTN LOL

[@fernandoquant]

Has the removal of the referral program helped to reduce the amount of CC in subs' pockets leading to more inflation, or the opposite? I haven't played recently, but I remember the program being a nice way to get some sweet CC, which allowed me to buy new stuff.

[@phaedrus12134]

Them removing it def contributed to inflated prices. High demand of items with no supply, except from those that hoarded the items, means high prices.

[@CopeAndSeeth]

It's def made it worse, people can't get easy CC anymore, and the demand for the items has grown unbelievably

[@graved1gger]

Was there on pre-launch beta test. I recall buying inventory slots / cargo hold slots and being like "wow that's expensive". Played for a few months after release and then.. life happened. Now I'm back after almost 10 years, looking at gtn and like "wtf is going on there".

[@iEpitome]

Fortunately I’ve been playing SWTOR for yeaaarrrsss so I’ve been able to accrue 5+ billion credits. However I have to be so careful on how I wanna approach buying stuff 😂 Having to buy a revan set for 1 billion a set is insane

[@Eltaurus]

5B isn't that much, actually. During galactic seasons I created a fresh new character on a server I haven't played before, and was able to get 1B in under a month.

[@JonYen69]

@@Eltaurus yeah I’m sitting in 45B

[@iEpitome]

@@Eltaurus Key statement “+” I have definitely gotten more then 5 billion. These inflations on certain GTM items is insane and sometimes drains me so I have to build that back up.

[@Eltaurus]

@@iEpitome with all those tons of circulating credits I already bought every item from the collections that there is on GTN. So I can't really relate to that.

[@karadara9215]

I was so brought when I purchased a contraband slot machine for 20m credits. So proud . . . now it costs 950m credits minimum. On the bright side, when I returned, I had some cartel market stuff ready to sell.

[@kiev-estate]

Made 200+ mil per day crafting crit augments

[@manofmercy1500]

Funny that you posted this vid regarding credit inflation. Just checked the GTN & for some silly reason several folks have posted lots of lvl.10 & under gear pieces for prices usually around 3.5 million credits! Some of these same pieces you can even just buy from a vendor for only 500 credits (the common tier gear, not anything above)!

[@darkice60000]

they could do what black desert does and give every item a fixed price range on the gtn. I think runescape does it too.

[@endergamer3x]

There was also another "buy a stack for 0 and sell for 10 mio" exploit. This one was regarding the fireworks, one new type, that was added to the anniversary vendor once in either 2019 or 2020.

[@luketimewalker]

oooh

[@ItchyNavel]

I really hope there is a highschool teacher out there somewhere that watches this and uses it to teach their students about real-world inflation. You can't just make money out of nothing and not effect the economy, you might make more per mission(day at work), but it doesn't matter if the hypercrate(used car) now costs 50% more.

[@Swtorista]

Yep it's a great comparison. This is why we aren't allowed to print money at home lol

[@electricluxray2216]

Aw, this stuff is so nostalgic lol. I used to play SWTOR all the time a few years back and I vividly remember checking out the GTN a bunch and wondering how people were even buying some of the most expensive items.

[@HiddenPalm]

Credit sinks are interesting. But it can't be a sole solution. Price regulations on the GTN along with credit sinks would be more effective in my opinion. For example instead of a 1 billion price regulation on all items on the gtn, make all dyes limited to 500k, with cartel dyes having a higher credit limit like 2million. Similar price regulations for other item categories like decorations and mounts, etc. The price regulations would be correlated to the intended ways players can earn credits in the game. This all gets readjusted twice a year. This may mean, that all items will be sold at their highest regulated prices possible, and extremely rich market savvy players would be dominating the GTN for some months. But after a while, this will even out as those filthy rich players run out of items to sell along with some credit sinks - and the market being flooded, a sign of a healthy server. And since prices on the GTN for every item significantly decreased, people will be buying everything they can. Which in my opinion will be returned right back to the market, making practically every player a participant of the market, making it thrive. Once the market gets flooded again because of more participants, dyes can go back down to 20k making the game more enjoyable to new players, keeping the community growing. This massive push towards participation in the market is capitalism, and the price regulations to make things significantly more affordable to all is communism. Best of both worlds to solve SWTOR's economic crises. You're welcome.

[@mineman1736]

Remember when I wanted to buy the exposed reavers chest plate, it was going for around 200k and the only way I knew how to get credits was doing all of the heroics so I spent a whole week grinding heroics on hoth.

[@neytiri490]

I started playing Swtor like 5 years ago too and as a preferred player the credit cap was at 350k i think and with this amount you could buy quite a lot of stuff. Nowadays i think the cap is rised to 1million?...it's been a year since i played the last time :) However 1million even a year ago was like nothing worth. In my eyes the exploits are the one thing, idiots who abuse bugs will be allways in every game, but with the expansions bioware also rised the rewards for missions (especially heroics) extremly. I don't know if it is on purpose from the side of bioware because with this they want to push more players into an abo (because the cap for a preferred is in no proportion anymore) but i think it would be way better if they would just cut all credits in stock of all players, all rewards from missions and all prices for items on the GTN by lets say 1/100 or even 1/1000. Then the prices would become realistic again. Like in real you don't pay 2000$ for bread, you buy 2$ and items from vendors, upgrades or housings would become something you really have to work for once again.

[@Swtorista]

It's definitely an option for them to reduce the rewards. There's need to be some kind of fix for the existing billions of credits in the economy tho

[@HadoukenSpammer]

The "the wealthy" legacy title is awarded for the first time when you get 10 million credits. That says a lot about the current state of things.

[@cadetwright6496]

Whenever I sell my items I try to sell it lower than the gtn just to make some players day :)

[@danielcallaway5650]

That's basic economics. I do it all the time and stuff sells fast. Just undercut the cheapest price by about 1%.

[@steve-yw8vc]

That's called undercutting.

[@Rabanthebrain]

God I remember feeling decked out having collected tulak hords armor, white black lightsaber crystal, dies and a couple of mounts for something under 10 Millie's. I looked at some of those same items that and we're at Zimbabwe levels of inflation

[@mamswer]

I used to play Neopets too. Thank you for reminding me of the great memories.

[@Zetheseus]

Saw berserker going for like 1 mil on GTN. tried selling it at like 800k, no takers. sold it for like 250k, sold quickly. I also remember a few years ago (3 or 4 at most), the most expensive thing on the GTN was a Crate-o-Matic for 500 mil. Now things are 100 times that.

[@RatedRY]

As a big fan of the original KOTOR series when the remake trailer came out I got super hyped and started playing TOR for the first time... I'm absolutely loving the story content, but the prices of things on the GTN and whatnot are just crazy. I've been spending most of my time as a new player just making credits via gathering because I feel broke af lol, but thankfully now as a grade 11 slicer I am actually making a fair amount of credits. I hear that black friday can be a good time for CM sales too so I'm hoping they'll be some good sales then.

[@mrnobody3773]

Just do some solo flashpoints like 'A traitor among the Chiss' and loot some decorations. Hanging plants can be sold for over 15 millions. I've sold a bunch of those decorations last months and I earned a few hundred millions $. Forget making this kind of money within the game. Even the slicing run in Breaktown (witch use to get me ALOT of millions) can even make it any more with 25+ hours of farming.

[@captainjumper626]

Green trooper at the dance party: ME! Galaxy map before 3D design: I remember. Having to pay for abilities: I HATED IT WITH A PASSION!!!

[@Swtorista]

Was it a great credit sink? Yes. Was it healthy for the game? Uhhhhh no haha!!

[@Skrubb_Lord]

I remember before they did away with planetary commendation that were rewarded from heroics, you could go to the first vendor in supplies buy a belt for 2 comms pull a mod out and put it back in to bind it and sell it back to the vendor for 5k+ credits. It's pennies compared to the others exploits mentioned but it was still "free" credits via trading of comms.

[@allmachtigerbuchsenschuh8987]

When Makeb released, we sold the new Augmentation Kits for 140K Credits... Later on "Black and Black" Dye Modules were EXTREMELY expensive when they did cost 1 to 5 million credits...

[@warbearin]

This video made me think I have to start investing my swtor credits before they lose their value xD Ive ammased like 60mill over the years ive played but sheesh why inflation gotta be so bad

[@migipot9112]

I remember Tempest Warden being a low cost armor before Jedi Under Siege, whatta time

[@kitslagle6296]

I like what Bethesda did with "The Elder Scrolls online". Instead of a auction house they had guild stores littering the land. In order for someone to sell their items they would have to be competitive with other guild stores. With competition for selling items and no way to corner the market prices did not get out of hand. Each guild store was competitive with all the others. At first I and others hated the idea but over time everyone saw the sense in it. It really works. It is not perfect by no means but over all it works better than having a centralized market house. Even if you had a shit ton of credits you would still have to be competitive with other market stores.

[@meat141andfriends6]

I remember the first time I got 1 million I bought that VIP pass to go up to the top level of the space station. I found one vendor up there and a bunch of NPC's....... That was it. I legit just grinded days and weeks to have the ability to jump off the railing of the VIP lounge. Cheers SWTOR

[@Fade_ToBlack]

OMG LITERALLY SAME, I WAS SO PISSED LOOOOOOOL. And the thing is, for whatever reason I was expecting there to be like loads of people up there you know? Like a lil exclusive club that only “elite” players at the time could get into…NOPE. No one and nothing there except shit vendors

[@tremor3258]

Man I remember counting credits to hope for new skills.

[@Blackdawn80]

At launch I had recruited a person to guild who was into "finding exploits", once I heard him openly talk about it he was removed immediately. He was systematically testing the sync between the server and client and moving credits. Needles to say, this person was removed at once. The Dev's have always had the ability to remove credits but they could have rolled back all the transactions for that 2017 GTN bust.

[@noktin]

I took a break around the time Satele Shan's armor and Senya's lightsaber pike were the most expensive items on the GTN at about 30M credits. I just returned about a month ago and Senya's lightsaber pike is now in the hundred millions. Insanity!

[@Swtorista]

If you can even find it for sale at all!!!

[@mtflx4645]

I remember about 3 years into the launch of the game, The only Rancor mount available at the time was up there at MAYBE around 50MILL, just because 50Mill was nothing easy to come across. I played from around 2014-2017 and just recently came back to the game mid 2021, and the same armor sets I bought and completed for maybe a couple hundred thousand, were up there for like 200Mil a set 😂.