Tapered Ball Nose Bits - Part 34 - Vectric For Absolute Beginners

[@robinparkes988]

I’m brand new to CNCing and have just found your channel. Brilliant explanation throughout. Thanks for taking the time to make and post this video. 🇬🇧

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Thank you, Robin! I appreciate it!

[@luckettg]

I have been using these bits for years, and yet I found several ideas and good advice. This is not just a good video for beginners. Thank you.

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Thank you very much! Glad to hear you found it useful!

[@bobfalk2896]

Excellent video. Your videos have really helped me in my quest to become competent with my CNC router. Thank you for helping all of us out! Cheers, bob

[@markoilic1378]

I've spent a lot of time studying, yet I haven't met a professor who is better than you Mark in explaining things. You make everything very easy at the end of the day, cheers Mark!

[@DaveGatton]

My Sunday morning coffee tastes better while watching a Mark Lindsay CNC video. Coincidence? I think not. :-)

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Thank you, Dave! Have another cup on me!

[@mnoland3376]

Thank you so much for the information. I am a beginner CNC operator and your instruction Style so far is a great fit for my learning ability.

[@stevegronsky8904]

I didn't make it "live" this morning, but I did watch. As usual, nicely done Mark. Thanks for all your time and work to put these videos out here for us.

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Thank you, Steve. I will be going LIVE for the Q&A Session this afternoon at 3 Eastern, Noon Pacific. Hope to see you there!

[@rschulz01]

This is extremely helpful!

[@rhodge4511]

Mark, nice presentation. I am getting into a lot of 2.5D plaques and Christmas is just around the corner so this information is right on time.

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Thank you, Robert! I hope it helps!

[@104Tomcat]

Great video! I learned a lot. Have a spiral ball nose bit but have never used it, it's a 2 year old "new" bit. Going to cut a couple of previously "regular" balls nose cut plaques and compare them. Thanks for doing these videos Mark, they are appreciated.

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Thank you very much, David!

[@MakersGottaEat]

Excellent. Just what I was searching for. Thanks for sharing.

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Thank you very much for checking it out!

[@HeathKnuckles_Tasty_Timber]

Excellent information Mark! Thank you for sharing!

[@neoblu63]

Great video and thanks for your insight on when one might want to use a tappered vs regular ballnose. Helped a great deal. Also appreciate showing how tappered ballnose tools are added to the tool database. As they say, a picture (or in this case a video) is worth a thousand words.... especially when you get to the tool diameter vs the tip diameter/radius. New in version 10, now when giving names to new tools I add, I find myself inserting the naming variables (right click when editing the name) which pull the actual values from the tool data entered below. That way the name remains in sync with the actual tool data. Again thanks for all your work and sharing.

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Thanks for that tip! I usually name my bits differently than I demonstrated in the video. I didn't name that bit the same way I usually name my bits to make it easier for me to go back and delete after the video was posted. I don't like having a bunch of tools in the database that I don't actually own.

[@davidkaye821]

Fantastic Series, I'm making my way through EVERY one of them, they are a GOLDMINE of useful info on CNC machining in general and Vectric in particular! Best part is that you actually SHOW every step needed to do what you want to do, A LOT of other channels assume too much and leave out the details. Thank you Sir! BTW, @19:34, are you a Led Zeppelin fan? Several bookmarks for Trampled Underfoot! lol More props to ya Mate, ROCK ON!

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Thank you very much! My friend Eloy and I do a little thing called the Trampled Underfoot Podcast on Tuesday nights here on KZbin. We're both Zeppelin fans, but that's not what the podcast is about. There's a link to that channel in the description of just about all of my videos. Join us!

[@placitas52]

Great information, thank you. Needed to know about mfg database on tool geometry. Well worth half hour. Thanks again.

[@themikeporter]

Thanks Mark! Was just asking some of these questions the other day.

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Thank you, Mike! I hope it helps!

[@petercoote3069]

very good explanation helps a lot big thanks for this vedio peter

[@eloyvasconcelosdesouza1206]

Excelente abordagem, tive problemas com fresas angulares,agora entendo o motivo daqueles erros.

[@JasperTielen]

This is exactly what I think is missing in vectric software. You should really have the shank and cutter dimensions in the tool database and maybe even the tool holder dimensions like fusion 360 has. It can calculate collision and you will know if it fits. I've seen a post about this where vectric says "you should know if the selected tool is capable of doing the job" though I think it's safer to let the software help you by warning you that it might not be the right tool for the job. Maybe someone with a more direct line to vectric can ask them once more.

[@chrispelletier3661]

Hello Mark, I want to use MDF for some 3d carving. I can not find any info on speeds and feed on MDF using tapered ball nose bits. Can you help me out? Thank you very much for all your videos Chris

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

The best advice I can give you is to treat MDF as you would a hardwood like maple or cherry to start, then fine tune your speeds and feeds from there. There are just too many variables to be able to give you any concrete numbers.

[@charlesmohney5309]

Love your videos, to the point, I downloaded Amana Vectric tool data base. bit 46284K has a tip radius.of .06285 should thar be .03 radius?

[@mr.p9882]

Are you familiar with idcwoodcraft tools? Are they as good as Amana? Have you tried them? I'm thinking of ordering some but I really need to know if they will hold up as well as Whiteside and Amana...

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

To be honest, I've never tried them, so I don't have an opinion. Sorry!

[@Aarononautos]

Man I wish I'd known Whiteside had their tool dbase for Vectric. I've been manually inputting these things like an idiot. Now I'm going to go download and overwrite what I put in by hand because I'm certain some of it is wrong. Especially with the tapered 1/16 and 1/8 that I have and probably for the engravers I just put in the other day.

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Before you change anything, import the TOOL file and look at it to see if there are any dramatic differences. Remember that the TOOL files supplied by the manufacturer are guidelines, and the feeds, speeds, and pass depths may not be appropriate for your machine. Take all of that into consideration before you use that TOOL file.

[@markb4656]

Another use for the tapered ball nose cutter is for doing male inlays. If I am using a 1/16 diameter taper ball nose cutter, I cut the female pocket with a 1/16 diameter regular cutter about .005 less than the thickness of the male inlay. I make a mirror image of the male inlay and run the material for the male inlay through the planner on a planner sled. If I am using a 1/16 diameter ball nose cutter, I set my cutting depth about .010 deeper than the thickness of the male inlay material. Because of the mirror image the top surface of the inlay, will end up at the bottom of the female pocket. The taper on the cutter gives you a lead in on the male inlay and because the tip of the ball cutter is smaller in diameter that the cutter you used for the female pocket, you will get an interference fit at the top of the inlay. At the glue up I put wax paper over the male inlay and clamp a board that covers the entire inlay.Works like a charm. You might have to change the depth of the ball mill depending on the hardness of the materials you are using. The harder the materials, the less interference you want to have.

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Oh wow! I'll have to give that a try. When I finally get around to doing an inlay, that is. Hopefully pretty soon. Thanks for the tip!

[@Mr_Chuckles]

Handy trick -> Raster cut *with* the grain to better hide the cutlines.

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

That works in some applications, but not so much in others. It also depends on the material. Some brittle woods like Wenge don't like running with the grain. I get my best results running at somewhere between a 40° and 45° angle to the grain.

[@Mr_Chuckles]

@@MarkLindsayCNC Thanks Mark!

[@williealvarado2008]

Thank you SO MUCH as this was super helpful. I sent you an email with questions on a Tapered Ball Nose CNC Bit requesting assistance. Thanks again and look forward to hearing from you. Cheers!

[@p8ntblr1]

I recently purchased a Amana 46282-K 1/16" tapered ball nose bit. 1/4" shank. I downloaded the amana tech sheet for the tool data base and notice the pass depth is set at 1.022. Is extremely high pass depth normal?

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

No, it isn't. I don't know where they got that Pass Depth, but that's a good catch on your part. I have the Pass Depth for my 1/16" Tapered Ball nose set to .1 - and even that may be a bit too aggressive. I almost always use my smaller TBN bits in conjunction with a Roughing toolpath (with a machining allowance of .025) so they never get close to taking off .1 per pass.

[@b-radg916]

I may have missed it, but is there a reason to use a standard ball nose over a tapered one? If there is, I can't think of one.

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Mainly when you want a radiused edge and straight sides in a pocket - similar to using a bowl bit, but a smaller diameter. They're also used in making coves. The larger surface area means you can use a slightly larger stepover.

[@softwaretraining-naval]

So nice video. Thanks for sharing!

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Thank you very much! I hope it helps!

[@davidlister2438]

As usual, some great information! I'm a new (6 months) hobbist using Vcarve Desktop on a Piranha XL. I think your comments about adjusting feed/plunge rates on the fly in the shop would not apply in my case. The Piranha XL does give me the option of cutting back the speed from 100% to anything less. Would I be right to go with a higher feed/plunge rate on the individual bits, then start out with a lower speed on the CNC - say 25% or so? Thanks, Mark - you videos have been a great help!

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Thank you, David. You could give that a try (in some scrap material, of course,) and see if that will work for you. From the way you're describing it, it sounds reasonable to me. I would be hesitant to start out fast, then try to slow down. In starting slow, you can increase to the point that you start to get chatter - well before you risk damaging the bit, machine, or material. If you start out fast, you may already be beyond that point - and once it's damaged, it's too late to slow it down, and there's no way to reverse most of that damage.

[@larryrosenau4292]

Good morning Mark, I notice you recorded this video in October 2019. Has Amana changed it so you can download individual tools? your videos are very helpful Keep. them coming! Larry

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Thank you Larry. No, they haven't changed their tool database system, and don't plan to.

[@larryrosenau4292]

@@MarkLindsayCNC Ok. Thanks for your help. I ordeed those two bits and with your video I was able to get them in my database. Larry

[@tonyb6617]

Mark ... great video. I have a question. Wouldn't using a 3D roughing pass have a cycle time benefit over not using one. Would it make sense if you have a larger depth to always use a 3D roughing pass?

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Yes, you should use a 3D Roughing pass if you're carving anything with a deeper cut. My point in saying that in a lot of cases a roughing toolpath isn't required was to show how the bit worked vs a straight ball nose bit. I use roughing toolpaths almost all the time. There are cases where the finishing toolpath isn't removing much material (equal to the bit's cutting diameter or less,) and that makes the roughing pass unnecessary. It's just good practice to do a roughing pass to make things easier on the finishing bit.

[@b-radg916]

@@MarkLindsayCNC: You said you almost always use the Raster strategy for your 3D Finishing toolpath. What do you think about the 3D Raster strategy for your Roughing toolpath? On a couple tests I did it was faster, and seems like it leaves less for the finishing bit to remove too. Thanks!

[@travismurray9160]

Question for you bout using tapered ballnose bits. How much do you usually take out per pass in hardwood using the 1/4" to 1/16"? 1/4" to 1/8""? Thanks.

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

I have my tapered ballnose bits set to take off .1 inches per pass. Since I do a 3D roughing toolpath with a machining allowance of anywhere from .02 - .03 machining allowance first, most of the material is cleared away, so it never actually cuts out that much material.

[@steinaralpenmob]

Thanks again for a great video Mark, I always learn lots of news from your videos. But I have one "problem" I use metric, do you know of an easy way to convert from inches to millimeters when I need to create a new tool in my database

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

Thank you! I released a video this morning that might help in setting up a new bit in the database. Just remember to work in the Metric tools category and set the Units to Metric. Here's that video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/amPZZ355abqDd8k If all of the dimensions are in Imperial, and you need them to be metric, type the Imperial measurement into the applicable box, followed by *m then hit the = key on your keyboard. I did a video on this 2 years back. I use a file in the demonstration, but it's the same formula. kzbin.info/www/bejne/gXaXnKt-rapsa8k

[@feolender2938]

google

[@Dave-ni4vg]

I don’t understand when you look at the specs it says 150 160 ipm for the tapered bit but I don’t think anyone runs it at those speed when 3 d carving?

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

There are a lot of variables. It depends on whether you run a roughing pass or not, the type of material, and your machine. Some folks with very rigid machines do run them that fast.

[@hmatyas1]

How can you skip the 3D roughing tool path. I can see how you could use the tapered ball nose bit for both the roughing and finishing cut. But I do not understand how you could skip it. Thank you. Harvey

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

That's the purpose of the tapered ballnose bit - to allow you to skip the roughing pass if you wish. The tapered cutter will clear away the material along the face of the material being cut before the tip gets there. It basically does a roughing and finishing pass all at once. You still have the option of running a roughing toolpath if you'd like. Some people prefer to do it that way. With a tapered ballnose, a roughing pass is usually not required, unless the model is placed in the material so deep it's beyond the cutting length of the bit. In that case, yes, you'll need to do a roughing pass.

[@hmatyas1]

So basically in Vcarve, would you do the roughing and finishing simulation with the same cutter and then just skip the roughing tool path and go straight to the finishing tool path? I'm basically afraid that if I skip the roughing tool path that I will break the bit. By going striaght to the finishing cut, 1) You avoid a total change, 2) avoid rezeroing the bit, 3) save the time needed for the roughing cut. Have you done a video showing how this is done? Thank you for your help. I'm still learning how to use the CNC and the Vcarve software. Harvey

[@ayoubbenali5780]

What is rpm?

[@Patricksworkshop]

first

[@MarkLindsayCNC]

We all gotta have a goal in life. Thanks for checking it out, Patrick!