Terra-Master D5 Thunderbolt 3 DAS Part 2, SSD Test, RAID Bug & more observations! Re-Upload.

[@merodeadorNocturno]

I love how insightful these videos are. I thank you so much for your professional reviews!!

[@ArtIsRight]

You are so welcome!

[@garybrenner2801]

I recently found your KZbin channel & I'm glad I did!! I've only watched two videos so far, (this one & part 1 of this one). I've been looking at getting a DAS RAID system for quite a while now & need all the help I can get. I'm not very computer savvy at all & these help a lot! Thanks for the great videos!

[@ArtIsRight]

You're welcome

[@luismiguelclemente3232]

Thank for such an amazing video. Very well explained and clear. Congratulations. You helped me a lot to understand DAS system

[@ArtIsRight]

Glad it was helpful!

[@luismiguelclemente3232]

@@ArtIsRight I wonder if you can help me on this: is Backblaze personal backup account (which I use!) will be able to backup the DAS i.e. raid 5 system? Or this is not compatible with Backblaze storage backup?

[@ArtIsRight]

They don't do NAS but DAS I would think they do since it is treated as a HDD link to the system RAID or not that should not matter. But, I would check with them via email, support call, etc and see what they say. Let me know as well what you find out.

[@luismiguelclemente3232]

@@ArtIsRight according to Backblaze support there should be no problem. I’ll give it a try

[@ArtIsRight]

That is what I gathered :)

[@jaimeduncan6167]

Please Like the videos, people, they are super useful, and that could trigger the Algorithm to present it to more people.

[@ArtIsRight]

Thank you!

[@coachafella]

I have the D5 on a Windows system, configured with 5 HDDs in RAID 5. Getting around 800MB/s sequential read/write. Works very well, and so far it's been perfectly reliable. The only negative is the drive noise, which may bother some, especially if it's close. I'm using a 3m Thunderbolt cable and have it under a desk in my computer room which makes it very tolerable. For ease of setup, capacity and speed I would highly recommend it.

[@ArtIsRight]

Nice!

[@fuzzycuffs]

Wow thank you for this. I'm sitting here shopping for a replacement for my Drobo and was all about to go to a mini raid enclosure for 2.5" ssds for less storage but faster and now I'm finding that it isn't faster at all.

[@ArtIsRight]

SSD in smaller links up quantity works really well. Point of diminishing return hits quickly once to get to 3 or more drives linked up together. There are other bottleneck that comes up. Cheers!

[@jaimeduncan6167]

Great video. The performance with SSDs is bad, probably the raid controller is pretty cheap and clearly is pretty slow. On the other hand if one compares the price of this box to a Lacie or Promise Pegasus32 the slow performance can be justified. At this price, one should consider a software-only solution like OWC. You are one of the bests reviewers for the photo world, I don't know why the channel doesn't have far more subscribers. Sometimes I wonder if the algorithm simply discriminates against not-so-young male individuals. In any case, keep up the good work and I hope it will be reflected as more of us share the videos. Maybe Promise will send you a Promise Pegasus 32 and a Pro for testing?

[@ArtIsRight]

Thank you, personally I think that I have a lot working against me, but I endure. I think KZbin is looking for flashy, I am not that. What I do is much more in-depth. Either way, I appreciate the comment :)

[@jwickstead]

You are one of the best, most prepared, straightforward reviewer with real life information on KZbin. I totally appreciate these videos and how you have put them together. I learnt a lot about das from you so per your self on the back. You’re very good at this and it’s the kind of review I want to see. Thanks

[@roamingyak]

Awesome mate, so happy to find such a concise and detailed review!!! Great presenting 🙂 Are there any alternatives to this device? I need TB3/4 and the ability to use 4-5 sata ssd's (for cost, low noise, noise). This device is quite expensive for any empty enclosure.

[@ArtIsRight]

Most of them are going to be around this price range. So alternative wise, there some but not much. I would look at OWC macsales.com and see what they have. You can always search on amazon too.

[@Whaever_1981]

Amazing video. Thank you. Is there any alternative that competes with this at a lower price point you recommend?

[@ArtIsRight]

For a DAS with TB it would be difficult to find, I would look at second hand market perhaps

[@Whaever_1981]

I want to create a 5 drive 10TB NAS in RAID 5. Would you think this is safe? If not, then probably a RAID 6 enclosure such as the Synology DS1522+ would be the best option, right? As always, thank you for the great content! :D

[@ArtIsRight]

RAID 5 works and there's redundancy, you should be ok.

[@NathanAtkinson]

First - Thank you, thank you, thank you for taking such an expert perspective and being able to communicate it so well to the... "non experts" such as myself. After watching your reviews, I felt confident in making this purchase... However, for the life of me, I can not seem to find how to configure things to go from the seemingly default of a Software RAID to a Hardware RAID. Is this something that I need to purchase additional hardware for? Is it software (form the less-than user friendly) TM website? Is it something else altogether that you discussed, and I simply missed (at great embarrassment to myself) about how to set up HWR vs SWR. Thank you again for your incredible generosity of time.

[@ArtIsRight]

Hardware RAID is build in, you need to download the utility software from Terra Master to do this. It is a web interface still. If you have any more Q, dm me, I don't usually see reply to comments.

[@FabricioContreras]

Good videos about this DAS. I already bought it. I'm about installing in Raid 5. Few questions, what is the meaning of sector size? I have the 512B, 1k, 2k and 4k and can I make a RAID 1 with 4 disk and use the fifth as an independiente drive? Regards!

[@ArtIsRight]

Sector size is the allocation blocks size for the RAID. some type of files work faster with various sector size. In most day to day use you won't notice this much. If you want to know more about it, I would google it and see what you can find. As far as raid 1 with 1 disk independent you should be able to do that in the RAID controller App

[@FabricioContreras]

Thanks!.. BTW, I never fund the HFS+ option formating the drive :-/ (I got Seagate Exos HD 20tb each) @@ArtIsRight

[@ArtIsRight]

it is in disk utility under file system

[@barryo3315]

Just a quick point. Terra master sells the Thunderbolt DAS as a creator solution, but it looks as if their USB solution hits the same speeds for a lot less $. I use my DAS as a large raid array backup for my NAS, and then copy that to personal Backblaze. Backblaze has stated they support DAS drives in the personal plan. My security system and media system runs on a windows PC (Blue Iris). This runs file sync from the NAS to the DAS and backs it up to backblaze so the DAS is never shared, and acts as my local backup

[@ArtIsRight]

👍🏼

[@coachafella]

Have you seen real benchmarks of the USB version? I have the D5 Thunderbolt 3 with 5 HDDs in RAID 5 and am getting around 800 MB/s sequential read/write speeds. The tests I've seen of the USB version get about half that or lower.

[@ZonaDeluxeOficial]

This is an Amazing video! A lot of information just in one video, straight to the point and results ready on paper! I get to know what I needed. And now the only thing that I need to investigate it’s what is the difference between “Software and Hardware” RAID 😂 But my common sense makes me think that Hardware RAID it’s if you install the OS straight in the RAID, and Software RAID it’s if you have an external NAS connected to a computer 🤔 But of course not sure so I will investigate that 😆😅

[@ArtIsRight]

In the case of DAS Hardware RAID (HWR) - the raid array and parity computation is done on a dedicated chip inside the DAS. Software RAID (SWR) - the raid array and parity computation is done on the computer OS. When reading and writing HWR generally has the advantage because all of the calculation and parity is handled by a dedicated chip SWR read and write relies entirely on the computer OS and in turn the computer CPU for calculation parity, file allocation and etc. SWR is slower and in some ways slow the OS down as well with larger sets of data. Because it is relying on the computer CPU and OS doing its thing and in addition handle the RAID data.

[@ZoroDavid]

Hello, Thank you for your video ! How do you know if the device is in hardware or software raid ? Thank you in advance for your answer.

[@ArtIsRight]

The setup process would be one of the way to tell. Or when you plug it into a computer. If it is setup for Mac, if it is using Mac Software RAID then any Mac OS will see and be able to read it. If it is setup for Win, then the same would happen, plug it into Win and the OS should see it. However, if you plug it in and it does not work or show up in either OS, it could be hardware raid which requirer drivers and kernel extension installed on the system. If you don't know, it is a trial and error process.

[@ZoroDavid]

@@ArtIsRight Thank you very much for your quick answer 😀 Okay, so, software (managed by the computer) or hardware (managed directly by the D5) RAID is something that needs to be setup during the RAID configuration (and drivers installation) the first time we plug it into the computer (Windows in my case).

[@ArtIsRight]

Yes that has to be part of the initial setup.

[@coachafella]

It's hardware RAID, there's a RAID controller in the unit. Also, it requires a driver and RAID SW app to be installed on the PC. The app is used to configure the onboard RAID controller. I have this unit and it works very well. Very easy to set up.

[@franzpleurmann2585]

Can I still access the data on the individual drives when configured as JBOD on different system? For example if I remove one drive from the enclosure and connect it directly via SATA to a different system.

[@ArtIsRight]

No, JBOD volume itself still spans across all drives. With JBOD you just get the span of the space but not necessary the benefit. The best thing that you can do in this situation is set each drives up as individual drives.

[@franzpleurmann2585]

@@ArtIsRight Isn't the whole point of a JBOD that I can access the drives individually? I do own several LSI based PCIe RAID Controllers which provide a IT (initiator target) mode. It presents each drive individually to the host. If I would set up each drive individually wouldnt I still be unable to access the drive from another system because it is still part of logical unite of the hardware RAID?

[@ArtIsRight]

This largely depends on the JBOD setup. In this particular one, my understanding is that it pools the drive together.

[@stevegauldphotography]

Sorry (Stupid Question time) - It puzzels me (Bit of a dinosaur TBH ) It is my understanding (or have I got it wrong?) If you set up as Raid 5 (5 x HHD's) 5 x 6GB HHD's = 30 GB? BUT something like 3 x 6 Gb + 2 x 4Gb = 20Gb ?? Is this correct what does the Raid do with the 'other' 10Gb :-( :-(

[@ArtIsRight]

The general rule that you can use for RAID 5 with the same capacity drives are as follows: (Total number of drives - 1) x capacity = total usable capacity with parity The sample that you gave above is for either RAID 0 or JBOD With mixed size disks (Total number of drives - 1) x capacity of the smaller drive = total usable capacity with parity In the latter case whatever un allocated capacity is just that, unallocated. RAID 5 is not sophisticated and cannot be "effectively" with mixed capacity drives. So the smallest drive would be used to determined the parity for all of the other drives regardless of the larger drive capacity. Hope this helps.

[@tombouie]

Well-Done

[@ArtIsRight]

Thank you!

[@ThomasGeist]

One of the big downsides of HDDs can be the spin-up time which (at least on a Mac) can lock up any other drive access while it’s happening. With the current very large 12 - 14 TB HDDs this can seem even more sluggish.

[@ArtIsRight]

Could be, have 20 TB drives in NAS, have not noticed it being an issue. I have not tested the DAS with large drives. Give and takes of various systems / drives.

[@coachafella]

I have 5 14TB drives in my Terramaster D5 configured in RAID 5, and have them configured to not spin down idle, so access is very good. I'm getting about 800 MB/s sequential read/write speeds.

[@chinmayn73]

Is it better to wait for thunderbolt 5? 1000 mbps is rather low….ideally it should go to 250mbps x 5drives

[@ArtIsRight]

TB 5 won't solve the issue per se. The calculation is not really that simple, there are more variables and factory that goes into this. My thought, if you need it, get it now. TB5 is here but still a long ways away.

[@sayednab]

do you recommend buying the 2 bay terramaster as a begginner ? using it only for home use.

[@ArtIsRight]

That works, do you just need a DAS? There are other options if you are choosing to go that route. Getting 2 identical larger drives and cloning them would work as well

[@sayednab]

@@ArtIsRight No, I want a NAS, cos whenever I am out the home, I need to access my files. which I can't with DAS. But thunderbolt gives me the option to recover files faster. I have eyeing this device as well. QNAP TS-251D-4G 2-Bay NAS.

[@ArtIsRight]

Personally I like Synology Product More. All NAS are vulnerable when you connect it online but a few years ago QNAP got ransom ware hack and the company response to that was terrible. And I also prefer DSM more than QOS.

[@sayednab]

@@ArtIsRight Oh I thought NAS were safe to use since the end user have the server based at home, and no one else knows the server destination.

[@ArtIsRight]

If your NAS can connect to the internet then not necessarily. You just have to make sure that you are behind a good firewall. Also those quick connection thing for Synology & QNAP alike, if not used carefully is one of the easiest way to get hack / ransomware

[@chinmayn73]

What if I install a nvme m2 into a 2.5” enclosure would it go to 600 mbps speed? That means it would go to 600 per nvme x 5? It that possible?

[@ArtIsRight]

You'll still be limited by the 40 Gb/s TB interface, which has a lot of overhead, the best would be 2000 MB/s but then you for got the fact that adapting the NVMe you would be using the sata interface which is slower, so it is going to cost much more for no gained really 6G is about the max for SATA ports

[@chinmayn73]

@@ArtIsRight will be getting the d5 unit today with 3 iron wolf pro 7200 drives will expand accordingly post checking speed

[@ArtIsRight]

👍🏼

[@chinmayn73]

@@ArtIsRight terrmaster D5 has a lot of issues with every update on macOS I spoke to a couple of sellers who are extremely frustrated at the driver issues they are facing with it.

[@coachafella]

@@chinmayn73 I have 5 Seagate 7200 drives in a RAID 5 config with my D5 and am getting around 800 MB/s read/write sequential.

[@franzpleurmann2585]

Do I also need the raid driver when I just want to use the disks in JBOD?

[@ArtIsRight]

Yes the driver and kernel Extension primary allow for connection to happen between the drive and computer

[@franzpleurmann2585]

@@ArtIsRight I think this is a mayor flaw of the enclosure because it introduces a dependency which cant always be fulfullied.

[@ArtIsRight]

Most hardware RAID and TB drive multiplier does this.

[@PianoManPaul]

FANTASTIC, detailed, informative work on this video and thank you so much for posting! I was hoping - can you, or anyone, please offer me some insight into helping me make a critically important choice? I'm on the fence about things - I'll be making a huge investment in a 8-bay thunderbolt DAS shortly. (The rest of this comment gets long, and I apologize) ... I'll be loading the new DAS with either 18- or 20TB drives (which I'll also be researching), but I do believe I've indeed narrowed my DAS options down to 4: For TM, either the D8, or the D8-332 (it's hard to find the actual differences in these 2 units - almost like one is trying to pretend the other doesn't exist) ... now I was also looking in the similar price range at 2 OWC brand units: The ThunderBay 8, and ThunderBay Flex 8 (I'm REALLY leaning towards the Flex 8). My critical two concerns are, in this order: 1. Speed!!, because I do moderate video editing, but mainly run a multi-DAW media studio with many terabytes of Kontakt, and other audio sample libraries that need to load quickly) 2. Expandability. I'm running behind on a major project that currently uses a "spaghetti-mess" config of chock-full USB 3.1 Gen2 10gbps able hubs, pocket nvme drives, and cabling. Yes, quite often my mouse lags on the screen when those WD nvme portable Gen2 drives are chewing up that USB bandwidth! And yes - It's UGLY, but as of right now, it's the fastest option I have. On my new DAS I'd like to start a RAID-5 with say, 3x 18 or 20 TB HDD's, and be ABLE TO BUILD on to it from there (probably canceling out a HW RAID option and be forced upon a PC CPU-gouging software option -- unless, someone can confirm that one of these TM models has expandability built into their HARDWARE RAID setups?!?!) I have my questions, and I just want to do it all correct, the first time, Actually, its too late for that based on the QNAP NAS (TS-673A) I invested in last summer, thinking I could connect its dual USB 3.1 Gen2 ports to my PC (wrooong) .... at least it's serving a purpose, storing a 22+ TB PLEX core server on there, and a lot of photos, games, and installers, that I don't need to travel really fast through my network. One last thing, I should have maybe mentioned initially - the core PC in question, is a laptop with a single Thunderbolt 4 port. It's a powerful machine (MSI GE76 Raider 11-UH). I have a couple of cheaper 10 ft Thunderbolt 4 cables from Amazon, but I'll want to get a longer one - that's CERTIFIED - because really, it's the only Thunderbolt 4 port in my entire system right now. So there you have it. Any experienced guidance or help REALLY appreciated, and of course, I hit sub when I first saw this very informative video... Thanks so much again!!

[@ArtIsRight]

1. Speed!!, because I do moderate video editing, but mainly run a multi-DAW media studio with many terabytes of Kontakt, and other audio sample libraries that need to load quickly) -Even with TB, they are still spinning drive, there will be some lag. But if the drives are spinning this should be minimal. 2. Expandability. I'm running behind on a major project that currently uses a "spaghetti-mess" config of chock-full USB 3.1 Gen2 10gbps able hubs, pocket nvme drives, and cabling. Yes, quite often my mouse lags on the screen when those WD nvme portable Gen2 drives are chewing up that USB bandwidth! And yes - It's UGLY, but as of right now, it's the fastest option I have. On my new DAS I'd like to start a RAID-5 with say, 3x 18 or 20 TB HDD's, and be ABLE TO BUILD on to it from there (probably canceling out a HW RAID option and be forced upon a PC CPU-gouging software option -- unless, someone can confirm that one of these TM models has expandability built into their HARDWARE RAID setups?!?!) -With DAS, because the management system is so Rudimentary, it is best to start out with the number of drives that fills out the array. Don't try to expand later because you can't really do this without breaking down the entire array and rebuilding it up again. -As far as drives goes for the best bang for the buck, I recommend Seagate EXOS. Hope this helps, I do wonder why didn't you consider going to 10 GbE? Is it because you need higher read write speed? If you response please start a new comment. This way I am guarantee to see it.