TF2: How Did We Get Here?

TF2 has been slipping into a coma, year after year. Each update brings more bloat with less variety. The only content TF2 has seen added over the past 6 years are hats, maps, taunts, effects, and skins. With #FixTF2 concluded, and the bot crisis seemingly at an end, it is paramount to point out that the bots were far from the only fundamental issue TF2 has faced since 2018.
Valve has pushed out formulaic updates for so long that people only think to ask for content that fits into these narrow categories. This has created a feedback loop where Valve is only adding the same things to the game. People see hats get added, and suggest hats they like. They see a new bout of maps, and the community rushes to make maps in hopes that they make it into the game.
TF2 now has over 70 war paints, 100 taunts, 140 maps, 295 unusual effects, and over 1900 cosmetics. Meanwhile, we have not seen a single munitions crate drop in the game since 2016. There are still only 3 weapon unusual effects. Its time to say that enough is enough, and ask for more variety in the content that makes it into TF2.
Music and footage used: pastebin.com/c...

[@xXChaD]

From a workshopper point of view it's pretty unfair how valve just suddenly decided to stop adding certain kinds of submissions without warning or even a "we won't be adding these anymore". Valve just lets people waste their time. Like, is there a good reason why we can't get the occasional weapon reskin? They are doing this to warpaints now.

[@MochaFur1]

probably because it takes more effort to add in, especially when they have a whole button ingame to test cosmetics and stuff

[@TwistedFireX]

@@MochaFur1A whole week to implement… those poor poor devs!

[@LordVader1094]

@@MochaFur1 >more effort to add in Not likely.

[@MrSlaughterrific]

apparently 1 guy decides on a whim what he likes and they work with the same people over and over because it's less paper work

[@Sub5_77]

tbh u ppl are bloating workshop with the slop so u deserve it.

Team fortress 5 has gone down hill since they removed the big slappy from the workshop

[@MEWOVER9000]

Truly Team Fortress 5's biggest L 😔

[@ThatGuyNamedRick]

They nerfed the Madcap AND removed Big Slappy? 0 out of 10 game.

[@chaoschaoful]

I noticed that, too.

[@symus29165]

Bro is a time traveller

[@LameRyan]

Yall remember exiting the game and finding out that some game coming out had exclusive items being added to tf2?

[@Humancatpost]

It sucked so bad being a teenager with no money seeing a new promo item drop every few weeks, the FOMO was real

[@damsen978]

@@Humancatpost Don't be a fool, you didn't miss anything. Promo items never belonged to a game with such an unique art-style like TF2.

[@Humancatpost]

@@damsen978 Of course I agree with you as an adult, but it didn’t feel that way as a kid.

[@damsen978]

@@Humancatpost If you started in the early (2007,2008) to mid (2010,2011) years of TF2, you wouldn't be saying that even as a kid. I think people need to know how the game looked like in these stages of its life span which is when the game had the most polish and looked the best.

[@netwiz9868]

The economy used to be one of my favorite ways of interacting with the community. Used to be trade servers everywhere with tonnes of opporitunity to go from rags to riches. At this point it's just impossible with trade bots having near-full control of the economy. Can't say it's Valve's fault completely but, it really sucks. There's just too many hats, taunts, etc that bots hyper-inflate the price of that just sit in inventories of inflated value. There needs to be a crash at some point, some change

[@woshee_real]

I've come to accept that the game is no longer recieving majors which is fine, this game had 10 years (11 years if we count blue moon) of major updates before they called it quits, what I am not happy about is war paints. They rarely get added, if they are, it's just base replacements with maybe a small change here and there, community members have been making absolutely beautiful war paints with UV bases, original bases using coding, and they don't get added.

[@woshee_real]

Also aint scared of the storage space at all, more recent AAA titles are like 100+ gigs, tf2 barely takes up storage in the grand scheme of things (and if it is, then that's your fault not having at least 500 GB-1 TB storage in 2024)

[@ticklemedaddy]

​@@woshee_real There is no rational way for me to explain how violently repulsed I am by your excuses for TF2's filesize continuously inflating a lot of people, a lot a lot of people, buy one pc and stick for it as long as it remains functional, and TF2 is a game from 2007, how is it in any way OK in your eyes for it to grow like a balloon?

[@damsen978]

Skins never belonged to the game in the first place, they all look awful because the default textures have more detail in them and you never get tired of seeing them, its also makes the game feel cleaner and easier to the eyes to read what they are using.

[@woshee_real]

@@damsen978 Well sadly to you they exist, and I personally enjoy em, just sucks that VALVe picks the worst things sometimes because they randomize picks (better than favoritism.)

[@anser2723]

after seeing that intro and watching the vid i guess you could say that we're on a road to nowhere (ill see myself out)

[@danin900]

I'd take one rebalance update over 20 updates that add hats and maps. It's long, long overdue.

[@eatumupeatumup1211]

This is something that has been in the back of my mind for a while. While I think the balance is fine for the most part, valve def needs to slow the number of hats and maps down in favor of more quality. Also MORE STRANGES :)

[@mossydirt4541]

TF2 is somehow both abandonware and bloatware.

[@九头金蛇]

me when i misuse words i dont understand

[@wikkidize]

@@九头金蛇 leave him alone, hes just 10 years old

[@TemporaleTossico]

Your point is correct, but both of those words have nothing to do with the topic at hand

[@LordVader1094]

People in these replies can't take a joke lmao

[@Azazel386]

​@@LordVader1094Misusing words isn't a joke. It's just a grammar mistake, nothing funny about that lol

[@or6060]

this is the only content that valve allows the community to generate, so this is all we will ever get.

[@Maethendias]

bloat is also literally the reason why item servers and inventories get slower and slower every update they literally cant handle this many id's btw the fact that we have THIS many taunts and unusal effects especially is insane, since literally no one is using 90% of any of those almost 2000 cosmetics for... a game that only allows 3 at a time, while ALSO having region locks, so essentially its even LESS is also just stupid

[@TwistedFireX]

I hate 99% of taunt effects and prefer the normal taunts because it puts you at a huge disadvantage.

[@pinhead7422]

@@TwistedFireX why would taunt effects put you at a disadvantage?

[@TwistedFireX]

@@pinhead7422 They can clip through walls if you're close enough to one.

[@pinhead7422]

@@TwistedFireX then just don't taunt, just choosing to do a normal taunt puts you at a disadvantage anyway.

[@TwistedFireX]

@@pinhead7422 The High Five taunt let’s you see around corners without exposing yourself which is a pretty good advantage

[@atomictem5725]

I remember the Love And War update, the huge balance patches the Christmas updates. Festive Weapons, Strangifiers.

[@Gravity_studioss]

I am an F2p with like 4-5 cosmetics. I sure do love having 800 items that I cannot even use take up my storage space

[@mr.banana2370]

sell crates in community market. it frees up space and gives you money

[@HunterStiles651]

@@mr.banana2370 The Steam Community Market is a terrible way to get rid of useless items in bulk. The UI is garbage, you need to put in the time to figure out what an appropriate price would be so people will actually want to buy it, and none of these crates are worth jack anyway. You're better off just going right click > delete.

[@2-AZ1-BE]

A nother reason why I play tf2 classic, as a new guy, I feal like I didn't miss out on anithing.

[@MadContendery]

"a nother"

[@Iciclefairy]

TF2’s art style died when they added the potassium bonnet back in Gun mettle.

[@九头金蛇]

muh art style

[@reallyahuman]

​@@九头金蛇oh god forbid, the fans care about the game's readability and its artstyle's integrity?

[@littlehorn0063]

Better to wear Flavorful Baggies in hell, than Frenchman's Beret in heaven, I guess...

[@九头金蛇]

@@reallyahuman 1 mod fixes it all

[@reallyahuman]

@@九头金蛇 shouldnt take a community mod to fix community slop

[@humanharddrive1]

I agree, all the new hats look like trash, like technically they look different from early hats, as if they were modeled with a different philosophy and texturing style, not to mention the actual hats being silly crap like deer ears or cookies or shit that doesn't fit in the game, and vehicle taunts or other taunts that create items out of thin air are just cringe. not to mention the fact that they make the game unnecessarily big, I remember when the game was 15 gigabytes, now it is almost 30. I disagree that weapons need unusual effects, or war paints for that matter.

[@Scrum_Master_Revolution]

I really dont understand this mentality, they havent done a real update in over 7 years and there are still people who seriously believe "oh yeah one of these days theyre finally going to release a real content update if we just shame them back to their desks". I dont know how any more obvious it could be without them writing a blog post about it, they are done making tf2 updates, they are finished working on the game, there is no team left, there is one guy who picks the maps and cosmetics for the holiday updates and they have some contractors working on bug fixes. The writing has been on the wall for 7 years, its done, its over. You say its been slowly slipping into a coma ITS BEEN IN ONE for nearly a decade. Frog in boiling water analogy except its been boiling for 7 years and just now the frog is thinking "its getting a bit too hot in hear, maybe Im not quite sure yet "

[@alface935]

There is no reason why Team Fortress 2 a game from 2007 should be 21 Gigabytes in file size For reference Call Of Duty 4 Modern Warfare 1 which is also a game from 2007 is only 10 Gigabytes in file size

[@GreaserOfAllGreasers]

You'ld be right if we didn't had all the cosmetics, unusuals, war paints,etc...

[@alface935]

@@GreaserOfAllGreasers True... :(

[@GreaserOfAllGreasers]

@@alface935 what's even worse is the size getting bigger and bigger in the next years, and most of the gygabites consisting of "virtual slop"

[@alface935]

@@GreaserOfAllGreasers Yeah Virtual Slop that You can even get without putting real life money into the game or openning loot boxes which is just gambling

[@BoP0e]

TF2 was 7 gigabytes when it came out. It shows how much unused and unnecessary bloat it has.

[@kingkrool94]

6:08 The reason why weapon unusuals are so limited is that they interfere with the readability of whether or not you're firing your weapon, for us ugly as most unusual effects are, they're usually contained to the just head and aren't that bad. as a player who joined in 2022, I'm fully aware of what I missed. the cool updates, the cool hats, and events. it sucks that all of the cool stuff is either lost to time or absurdly expensive. I wish I could have the Poker Night items, I wish I could have the salvaged crates and get cool stranges, I wish I could have the weapon skins from the old collections. it is how it is... as for updates, Valve doesn't have to do anything more. We've been conditioned to just receive a cosmetic case and a bubble of maps for so long that most people don't ask for anything more. they make loads of money just from the case alone. unless a lot of Valve employees suddenly care for TF2, I doubt we'll get anything more.

[@woshee_real]

Yeah the community dug itself into the hole by invasion, jungle inferno not doing well, the more recent updates reaching peaks higher than when major updates came out.

[@robert9016]

As a player who joined in 2014, I don’t have any of those things.

[@DmitriD147]

That was the greatest intro i have ever seen, the rest was good too, well researched and point was clear, well done dude

[@MEWOVER9000]

Glad you liked it!

[@swan-cloud]

my biggest problem is just how big the game is now, my computer doesn't have a lot of space and it's a shame that most of that 30 gb download is maps i'll never play and cosmetics i'll never use.

[@woshee_real]

That's your fault sorry to say. You should start upgrading storage, being in 128 GB- 256 GB in 2024 is getting yourself hit in the foot.

[@ticklemedaddy]

​@@woshee_real Noone hates low-end players more than TF2 players to, it's like someone looking into the mirror and getting violently angry

[@collinsmith7143]

​@@woshee_real or valve could get rid of the bloat ware.

[@TwistedFireX]

@@woshee_realWhat’s with you weirdos trying to blame everything on the user rather than the multi-billion dollar company? Valve is the source of all our problems with the game yet you refuse to accept that. Why is that?

[@woshee_real]

@@TwistedFireX because it is? You telling me that 27 GB is too much space in 2024 lol

[@FilmmakingSock]

There's just way too much stuff in this game. I don't want a bunch of slop added to the game three times a year, I want balance changes, god damn it.

[@cristianstefan9472]

Great video , but 2 cities came out in 2013 , and also , no mention of Arena Mode? I think it has been more neglected than MvM , a mode that it s both fun and replayable in it s own way

[@i1KiCK1BUTT]

If you're great at the game, it's fun.

[@Delfite]

Nobody talks about Arena mode because nobody plays Arena mode. Nobody plays Arena mode because you quite literally CAN'T play Arena mode because you're too busy being dead and doing nothing for upwards of 40 seconds if not LONGER because neither person wants to kill each other nor cap the point. Arena mode fundamentally does not work in a class-based shooter like TF2. This has been a proven fact since the game's release. A fact that even Valve has acknowledged by removing it from all official map pools outside of the Screamfortress maps, which actually let dead players do something to help their team win.

[@bitterman213]

I like arena and would like to play it more again but I agree it needs more rework, I think unreal tournament freeze tag would be a perfect mutator for Arena (dead players are frozen in place unable to move/attack and can be revived by their teammates)

[@TheTdw2000]

The gas passer, infinite refunds, and airblasting giants would never have been allowed by 2012 Valve making MvM initially. Every change to MvM since 2013 has been for the worse.

[@humanharddrive1]

arena mode is trash, it shouldn't exist.

[@DISCONSOLATION]

REVERT AMBASSADOR

[@Aprocrisin]

no

[@uraccountcrashed8845]

Horrible idea. Reverting the Spycicle, however...

[@v-14415]

I'm afraid they won't do that Sadly, the only thing that you can do, in order to become the Spyper, is to use the Diamondback

[@DISCONSOLATION]

@@v-14415 but... ...the diamondback.. is gay..😓

[@v-14415]

@@DISCONSOLATION Don't use it as a Revolver, use it as a Sniper Rifle

[@Armolitskiy]

the bloat is real. minecraft was affected by this too

[@Skyfoogle]

more content is generally healthy for minecraft though. having more building materials in a building game is fun. in tf2 its literally just making the game harder to run so people can look silly.

[@Armolitskiy]

@@Skyfoogle nuh uh more blocks is less creativity and its a bloat

[@PraiseTheBoi]

aint no way you say minecraft have bloat xDD, literally lack of contect is the word you are looking for not bloat

[@Armolitskiy]

@@PraiseTheBoi kid, you just don't know how to play the game

[@GORTRON_THE_DESTROYER]

nice profile pic

[@bitterman213]

There’s plenty of people like me who would love to jump into a new MVM campaign without any regard to loot pool, as we aren’t concerned at all with a drop we’re never gonna grind for anyway

[@TheTdw2000]

Fortunately we have potato and pineapple to provide community mvm tours. You even get badges.

[@switchgeer6519]

there's alot of things in tf2 that we don't really need any more of. unusuals, maps, cosmetics. instead it'd be nice if they started recycling older things. liike on a seasonal rotation they'd bring back a random cosmetic series and a random unusual effect series. maybe they could bring back crates too so we can unbox more strange weapons. on top of that, y'know how new maps get their own featured section? maybe that could stay year round, but the maps in the featured section is a random selection of regular maps, temporarily getting people a decent chance to fill a watergate or snowplow server whenever they want. they could even introduce weekly contracts or something that'd be fun... though thats all speculation that to be fair i find rather unlikely.

[@Lonqudor]

My stance on the workshop has always been that people who don't vote, don't have the right to complain about what gets added. If we don't tell Valve what we do and don't want, they'll add literally everything. (Or literally just the stuff we don't want, funny enough)

[@reddeath4942]

I ran into this guy last week in a 2fort server. He was a chill dude and I was pleasantly surprised to see his KZbin channel. Keep up the good work man!

[@shloobington]

i hope this video gets more eyes on it and we actually get SOMETHING, more strange weapons at the least, i dont agree with most of the comments but i have hope

[@gibustheinfamous]

I wish there was a "turn off cosmetics" option.

[@aviko9560]

I am pretty sure there are addons that do this

[@FelipeJaquez]

The Mannconomy update and it's consequences have been a disaster for the TF2 community.

[@sevendeadlysquids404]

I think you have missed the forest for the trees. The forest would be neglect. There are so many neglected things in TF2 but I don’t think the ones you picked out are truly the ones that are causing the biggest problems. Adding new Australiums, spells, strange weapons and unusual weapon effects are all just cosmetic things. They would probably help Valve make some easy money but not the state of the game. Maybe it would be healthy for TF2’s art direction to do these instead of some of the hats that get added but that’s about it. Balance changes may spice things up but I don’t think the solution is make weapons that aren’t as good better. The Buffalo Steak is not the best weapon, but it’s fun and unique. The Southern Hospitality is fine from a balance standpoint it just doesn’t stand out. The focus should be more on things that aren’t fun to play with or against, like the Pomson or Natasha, instead of just making middling weapons super good. I think the reason most people say the game is in a fine state now is that Valve has butchered weapons terribly in the past, nerfing things that didn’t need nerfs, buffing things that were fine, etc. I think the worst way the game suffers from bloat are maps and game modes, which you touched on briefly. This is the true problem. Players are spread thin on all these different things and Valve barely supports any of them after they are added in, nor do they give any thought to what they add. Mann Up, PASS time, rd_asteroid, arena, that janky zombie mode, vs SH, just to name a few. MvM is the last game mode I’d use as an example of neglected, they support those community made missions for charity events all the time and it has a thriving community. The problem is there are so many ways to play the game now and not enough players to be actively playing them all, particularly during Halloween. Good luck finding a match somewhere like cp_Yukon during Halloween lol. The bot problem got as bad as it did because you’d have like 14 people up for a match of something like viaduct and you couldn’t quite fill out the server fully and then bots would flood in.

[@brokenmartin4861]

rd_asteroid is still in beta and never got releaced, arena got scrapt, vsh and zombies are community game modes, mannpower got updated back in 2020

[@sevendeadlysquids404]

​@@brokenmartin4861 The problem is they add all of these modes instead of looking at ones already in the game, and arena was a terrible example of that as that was way, way back from the early days. But the others hold true. Pass time servers and Mannpower are pretty much dead modes. People were memeing on Valve for updating Mannpower in 2020 because it was already dead at that point. Instead of working on the core game, they wasted time trying to bloat the game with these other poorly thought out game modes. Just like maps, it takes a community and spreads it thin. Now, as for VSH and Zombies, I don't criticize Valve for wasting time working on those but it was Valve's decision to implement those. Now, VSH does feel within the spirit of TF2, and the community version of it was extremely popular as well, so no real point against them there. But Zombies was an absolute mess.

[@Duck776]

They need to add more strange variants for other weapons, such as the Eureka Effect. And, then they can add more weapons.

[@TheIceBurglar]

Great video, I agree 200% While I'm glad for what we DO get, it HAS become formulaic and I'm left feeling like "so this is what we are going to get until they completely let the game die..". I do understand their approach, as it seems like maps, taunts, hats, and effects are going to have pretty wide appeal across the playerbase. TF2 is made up of so many different game-modes, playstyles ( friendlies, contract-cheezers, hard-tryers, traders, F2P/P2P etc ), and match systems ( Casual, Community, MvM, Competitive ) that a lot of people long-ago stopped getting things added that they find special. *More Stranges/Strangifiers - Lots of good weapons that never got them, and as you mentioned there are some like the gunslinger, kritzkrieg, and PDA that are getting out of control. *New weapon unusual effects. - Even just some lazy ones like orange, purple, or team colored variants of the 'isotope' effect would add variety and be an exciting opportunity for people to color-match their weapon effect with their hat or killstreaker. *New Killstreaker effects - And what about other improvements to the existing effects, like allowing the particle intensity to grow beyond the 10-kill mark? *Promotional Items - The last one I can find was from 2016. Why not add some cool cross-over swag for people who install the TF2 DLC on the upcoming Funkopop game, or for players of other recent Valve projects like Deadlock, CS2, HL Alyx? Or for people who pre-order upcoming games on Steam? I would try games I'm not otherwise interested in just to get some cool unique stuff in TF2. To not even do crossover promo-items for their own games it seems like they really don't give a crap about TF2 anymore. *New spells - We haven't had any in 10 years, so they have become really expensive and most players never got the chance to try them and seemingly never will. I think they should add spells in the future Halloween events and some mechanism for them to be retained beyond the event so that having a cool spelled-item doesn't stay impossible for most players. *New unusual miscs - Haven't had one since ~2016. I know these were never really intentional, but they're very cool and coveted. The price's on them have skyrocketed and most people will never get the chance to own one. I don't see the harm in allowing a small quantity to be unboxed every year. Miscs are increasingly just hoarded by collectors/speculators. Even if future ones were intentionally kept rare, it would be nice for those who were willing to put a bit of money into the game if we had some new ones with the newer effects, and maybe a few more people would get the chance to actually use them instead of just sitting on them and watching the price go up. Also for the class-specific miscs, Demoman never got one, that sucks for Demo players who want to SWAG their character out since their only options are the exceptionally expensive all-class miscs. *New achievements and contracts. *Fix useless weapons - It's probably okay if there's some meme-tier weapons in the game like the scout's fish, but there's plenty of weapons that are really cool and have potential, but just never got their stats adjusted properly to be practical. Pomson, manmelter, gas-passer, etc. *Add more cosmetic slots and taunt slots - Badges, belts, backpacks, birds, boots, and beards sit collecting dust because most of us used our three available slots for a hat, shirt, and pants. We gained a large performance gain with their 64bit update, and I believe an increase in the game's object limit would allow us the headroom to have a few more cosmetics drawn in-game. Some people that play on old/low-tier hardware are afraid their computer will explode if there was 10 or 20 more cosmetic items equipped across the entire match, but they can just use mods to prevent the rendering of cosmetics if this turns out to be true. They keep adding taunts and some of us have a lot of money in them, seems like we're due for another row of taunts in the menu or an alternative system like a wheel-selector.

[@gibustheinfamous]

Great video. Very well edited. With the segments, though, you could definitely include some chapters. What was Grouch thinking?

[@ruzgar1372]

Minor point but I kinda miss when nearly all of the smismass maps didn't get added to the game permanently, or hell when the only maps you got was halloween maps (2017-2021). There's way too many snow reskins and snow maps in the game.

[@ZeFlyingFurry]

finally someone with the balls to say it

[@cihloun]

The Once in a Lifetime intro is awsome

[@ilyakoni6887]

for strange weapons its sad that we cant get anymore stock stranges, but you still can get strange warpaints cheaper than stock stranges bcs they constantly get added, tho valve stopped adding even them in recent updates

[@woshee_real]

There's also cosmetics since you put kill tracking parts on those.

[@brokenmartin4861]

there are bot killers

[@Zbigmat]

Boosting the algorythm, you deserve it bby.

[@_Crowuh]

If I can offer some criticism, when you mention things like "The old Loch n Load" and "The old Soda Popper" being not fun to play against, you should either say why or put some visual on-screen explaining why. Like you said, a lot of players joined post-2017, so they're not going to know what you're talking about.

[@cloverpickingirish3122]

You should make a video about the "Goblineer"

[@HelluvaOpp]

This in all honesty, is a really well-made video. Nicely done mate.

[@bestestbread]

I went into this video expecting some stupid rant about some random cosmetic but I’m glad to say I was pleasantly surprised!

[@cantstandurbs876]

People actually care about stranges? 💀bruh it's literally the same weapon with an orange name color, and I thought people paying for unusuals and australiums just to flex were pathetic, I can't imagine how sad someone's life must be to pay from 50 to 400 usd for a glorified orange name tag lmfao.

[@JonJohJameson]

1:05 "completely overlooked" I'd say that ZestyJesus has been bringing this up but he's the Boogeyman of the TF2 community.

[@akumaking1]

Gaben is too busy being in a food coma to actually do anything.

[@roman108]

What about weapons huh? ACTUAL NEW weapons not reskins and warpaints… that used to be frequent every year from 2008 to 2014… Why did people just give up on this

[@MEWOVER9000]

Not Against it. Just think that we should start by buffing the unusable weps first

[@davidmacdonald1855]

Totally agree and have held these same thoughts for awhile. Also agree no one is talking about this. Enjoyed this video subscribed:) I really noticed the bloat last Screamfortress when there were 40 something maps to try to get through. I think there are over 140 maps in the game. They cant just keep adding maps 3 times a year. It has spread us too thin. I would like to see some kind of map cap say 50 total or something. Every month they could rotate 25 or so maps out and bring 25 maps into the rotation.

[@herzeleid0281]

the worst thing about warpaints is that most original gunmettle\toughbreak skins are not utilized and used by people and they actually look very good and fitting in artstyle

[@farcy3insanitymeme]

As much as I can see you put a lot of effort into this video, I don't think this is going to change anything

[@moronribbons5774]

I got into the game in 2018 and the point about not knowing what I missed resonates with me a bit. I play Deep Rock Galactic more these days and I was around to see season 5 when it got released some time ago, and the odd feeling of getting to discover and expiriment with new things and changed old things really had me wondering, "is this what TF2 updates used to be like?" to myself. Also, I'm really glad to see someone I can agree with in saying the game's weapon and class balance isn't perfect and could use changes. I don't know how many will agree but I think wanting the vaccinator or the scorch shot or the wrangler reworked or heavily tweaked in some ways is a pretty agreeable standpoint to have by now... I think a good first/only priority should any changes start happening is to get rid of the dumb cancer playstyle enabling weapons - like, the wrangler would be a lot cooler if it gave you both increased sentry redeploy speed and sentry damage resistance rather than sentry armor, so you could use it for jumping and repositioning for a sudden wrangle attack more.

[@arch231angel3]

team fortress 2 inflation is real, look it up

[@sugarsmile7852]

Arena mode,man i need watchtower back to the game

[@lxbreadboixl3140]

10:42 If you ignite the gas cloud, it could "explode" to spread around fire, making it actually useful in small areas

[@dumbvillage9253]

Btw some of the latest tf2 maps are actually just overwatch maps lul. They're good fun, but yeah... some new content you may like is actually just ripped straight out of overwatch(like Phoenix, having discovered this based on B-roll in a video i saw). I don't think the sheer level of neglect that is this should be acceptable. Yes - it's a good map, had fun. But it is quite literally just a lazy copy and paste of something that worked.

[@woshee_real]

A lot of content in this game is now less amateur, since most of the community members who work on this game are either in college with a major related to gaming, or work for a major game company. In 2020-2021 tho, the selection was just VALVe on after covid brain damage, they couldn't pick good content to save their lives those 2 years the pandemic was a thing.

[@ryanphillips4123]

Careful, Zeztyjesus got slammed for talking about this

[@dustykh]

The solution to bloat is... add more stuff? More unusual weapons? More MvM?

[@pncx9872]

i've been playing since 2011, joined shortly after the game went f2p. all i do is play the same 5 decade year old payload maps. i refuse to touch the new maps, and i do not care for cosmetics

[@greg2551]

It's sad to see valve neglect TF2 the way they have the past 7 years. I mean hell, they don't even need to do that much to make an actually good and refreshing TF2 update considering the MASSIVE amounts of content on the Workshop. Just some regulation and testing, that's all.

[@velikigospar]

the problem is that people keep spending money on these bloated updates, giving valve the impression that they are doing enough. The only scenario Valve will have my money is when they start implementing meaningful content like you mentioned in the video, and when most of the playerbase (including the whales) starts thinking like this, we might get results

[@stewmba]

Easily one of my least favourite things about playing engineer is how a handful of his weapons cost stupid amounts of money to get strange or just don’t have strange versions

[@SigmaMale1440p]

The only way to truly fix the cosmetic/map bloat is to revert them. This will never happen, because everyone on both sides of the transaction is losing money. There's too much shit in the game and it doesn't need any extra fluff added onto it. Back in the day, a hat or a strange weapon meant something, because there weren't (literally) thousands of them. Now, they mean nothing. It's not cool, nor is it special anymore.

[@FrancisL4D]

Meet your match led us here....

[@kooz8279]

That's one beautiful intro. Excellent job

[@toasty_mann]

7:08 family guy death pose

[@VladdyDaddy45]

blud actin like valve gives half a rat's left asscheek about tf2💀

[@theredstormer8078]

this hasn't been ignored by the community. Up until the bots were a big issue, people were still complaining about it quite a bit. Saying it has been ignored is just false.

[@YellowDice]

Yess the missing aussies bother me, no shotgun or pistol? I don't care about war paints or weapon effects tbh.

[@Mate_Antal_Zoltan]

Honestly? Just make it like mobile games. Have people download only the maps they want to play on. That way we can rest easy knowing that Embargo isn't actually taking up any space on our computers.

[@user-bkey]

surprised you think no one has addressed the content being stale for 6 years thats been a very main complaint that we've only been getting holiday updates, i think only recently thats changed because the bots were a more important issue. also because we've been complaining for 7 years (jungle inferno was 2017), it's time to accept that we're not getting any new weapons or balance changes

[@CoolSs]

When come to stranges. I think stat clock for higher tier should drop too. strange warpaints prices are crazy. About weapons rebalancing, i too want it but without the care of the original tf2 team. I don't want them or have faith it will been done right. Last thing i want in tf2 is modern rebalancing (comp or MYM style)

[@damsen978]

TF2 is literally bloatware, having come from 2011 when the game looked and was much cleaner (compared to now) makes me really sad at how much content its bloated with.

[@Chowder908]

We just got our bot crisis fixed lets give it some time before we start demanding updates again. I don't want a situation where we demand an update and bots return full force and we finalyl get an update with another bot infestation. Remember the halloween update it was unplayable last year because bots...

[@MEWOVER9000]

Updating the game is unlikely to lead to a new wave of bots. Regardless, my point is that we can have both. Valve was already updating the game with community content for years. Giving a little bit more variety, and maintaining other crucial aspects of the game, shouldn't be any more difficult than dumping 10 maps on us. We just need to ask Valve to put their resources into giving us a little more variety.

[@Chowder908]

@@MEWOVER9000 I mean the development team is basically a janitor and a plant now I wanna see if the bot measures are good in the long run before we start throwing out updates again.

[@woshee_real]

There's only 1 dev on this game, with some contractors. You can count the dev team with your hand which isn't a good sign when you want major updates to a 15 year old game.

[@reallyahuman]

the halloween update was infested cuz valve didnt both to do the bare mininum. "they" are doing it right now, and we are demanding that valve can keep it up so we wont fall into another 7 year cycle

[@b.r.207]

Out of curiosity, when did you start playing TF2?

[@MEWOVER9000]

2011

[@b.r.207]

@@MEWOVER9000 Neat. Also, good video. Hope to see more.

[@valetc6479]

I don't agree or disagree with your change on gas passer, I mostly ignored it because most community balance suggestions are words that bring no actual significance other than discourse, because valve won't bring their dev. asses back to developing this game. it would be much more valuable if we were to see actual changes happen so then we have a reason to banter instead of calling X weapon overpowered, broken, unfun, unbalanced, poorly designed and whatever uncreative argument people make just for the sake "of it."

[@Aprocrisin]

3:30 hit the nail on the there not just because you were right about how samey and boring tf2 updates are but you were also right about how boring and shitty pop music is

[@galaxyaxolotl]

I love gambling cases, love this game, I love mvm! Love the vid man, keep it up.

[@galaxyaxolotl]

If you want we could collab. (I make terrible videos with low effort editing)

[@shottytheshotgun]

People either came in late and don’t know what they missed, or they are the people invested in having many ugly cosmetics.

[@galaxyaxolotl]

@@shottytheshotgun I just enjoy opening them

[@timothytosser288]

Some of these cosmetics do look cool

[@Maethendias]

please algo, pick this up

[@johanildpg5414]

this is the best video on this specific topic I've seen, someone at valve should watch this

[@funnyminion111extra6]

Master at intros.

[@cozzieozzie]

Sadly Valve seems to have no plans to give us new stranges, new weapon effects (which we don't need lets be real here) or a new massive update (which is fine since the game doesn't really need it). I personally think TF2 is fine at the moment and is still fun to play, cosmetic stuff isn't a big deal though it does bloat the game a little.

[@CoolSs]

I am in favor of removing over 90% of content post 2017. Maps hats taunts AND unusuals. Like there's so much slop. It's unreal. Let's only keep the best of best of them (lol that like 10 items and half) the word "evolve the artstyle" is cope for the lack of integrity and restrain to uphold the soul of tf2. If you want to make your things, go do it. Just don't use tf2 and just go make your own. Also more people should not accept mediocrity or trash.

[@Sub5_77]

Please no more all class smissmass ornament slops and top hats. I'm tired boss...

[@No_Life_Alex]

that cover of once in a lifetime has to be the most awful thing I've ever heard.

[@greed0599]

I genuinely do not care if there's wacky art style breaking cosmetics... as long as silhouettes are identifiable, I'm good. I do want actual, new, real weapons though. I would take no new cosmetics or maps ever again if they just added 1 or 2 new weapons once a quarter.

[@slugbones]

Same as it ever was

[@griefyn]

Could you make a list of the songs that were used in the video? Good video by the way

[@MEWOVER9000]

The list is in the description :)

[@griefyn]

@@MEWOVER9000 🖤

[@baguettetheweirdguy2529]

Awesome video, while i knew TF2 and seen it during its glory days with KZbin videos i started playing around late 2022 and while i absolutely love this game it's a shame that the game has become more stagnant especially when they are already so many good changes sitting in the workshop, heck if MvM had maps added from the community MvM event officially i'd be awesome, i never got to experience balance changes as well (other than "fixes" for Gas Passer and Neon Annihilation) which is a shame as i love to speculation and give ideas even though all of dumb are dumb insane and especially unbalanced like if i had to buff the gas passer i'll look at how how jarate and thr buff banner and mad milk and the concheror are similar in their effects why not make enemies covered in Gas deal less damage similar to the damage resistance of the battalion backup... Welp i'm talking out of my ass again but yeah i think the one thing i wish i got to experience were the blog-post written as if the mercs wrote them and the update pages, they were awesome and i dpubt we'll be getting any new one, sorry for the long comment, great video!

[@FrancisL4D]

We don't need more content, 99% of the stuff get is subpar. Fixing all the bugs and exploits and maybe some of the weapons is enough. We don't need more unusual effects period! Weapon effects were halted for a reason and the 3rd effect was discontiniod because of visual noise. We don't need any maps, Most maps that we have gotten dosen't even look or feel like tf2 and also plays like shit. I do agree that mvm needed more content but its too late now and i'm fine with it tbh. More aussie's should've been a thing. Short Circuit, Vaccinator, Phlog, Scorch shot & Fos should be nerfed. Gru, Eviction Notice Baby face, Base jumper, Amby, Shortstop, Crit-a-cola & caber Should be reverted. Halloween spells are again gone for a reason, They add more visual noise that conflicts with the base game, Purple smoke & green flames. More strange weapons is perfectly fine, Every weapon should have one.

[@vin8754]

talking heads = instant like

[@bwtrickster]

you rendered this wrong

[@MEWOVER9000]

Its the swirling border, messes with KZbins compression. Lesson learned for next time

[@4AEMRR]

or y'know, let the game die already. most milked game since 2008

[@vermin5367]

At least 75% of the maps in tf2 need to be cut from the game, theres no reason tf2 should be taking up as much space on my pc as it is.

[@tomas6621]

Exakly

[@ticklemedaddy]

Saxton Hale and Zombie Fortress are practically dead, and as far as I know there are no map stamps for them, meaning nothing would be really lost if those two gamemodes were removed (aside Matthew Simmons' voice acting)

[@mauricioalvarezpino1818]

I was going to argue that maps should stay and cosmetics (specially the ones that shrare extreme similarities with other cosmetics) should start getting cut, then I remembered there's like 5 million halloween maps.

[@animewolfOtakuwolf]

Honestly I'm glad Valve is not touching the item and weapon balancement anymore, after what happened with MYM and Jungle Inferno (and Gun Mettle before then) I dread to think about having more weapons and items nerfed into the floor because of people taking the game too seriously or being too stupid and/or lazy to develop enough skills to understand and counter them. Also, "Is not fun to fight against" is subjective and a terrible reason for rebalance/rework items and weapons (and one that destroyed the item balancement to begin with), because by that logic Valve should just turn the game into a discount Quake or CS.

[@pathulhu200]

balancing didn't start being good until gun mettle when they actually started listening to people who know what they're talking about, even if they only listened a tiny bit "is not fun to fight is too subjective" is a non argument, people focused on a specific niche interest like a video game can come to a general consensus on what does and doesn't make for interesting gameplay and interactions, the whole point of a video game is to be enjoyed and there's going to be flaws and design clashes wherever you look. i hate this slippery slope of "well if you nerf all the annoying weapons tf2 will literally just be diet quake" as if that wasn't was tf2 has been for its entire life

[@CoolSs]

11:38 fact. We deserve better. It's crazy how the only thing we ask for. Is to restore tf2 fun/soul. I want Quickplay back. #BringBackQuickPlay

[@vooshoos]

I agree with what you have said in the video, however, Valve is likely to ignore most movements from the community unless it's coming from money-makers. They ignored Uncle Dane's remove crits movement, yet they caved on day 1 for mappers asking for non-gimmick maps. As of I think they should rotate themes more often, it's just a shame they dropped community updates because of scumbags. I think instead of Scream Fortress every year, if they did a "fall update, or instead of smissmass, a generic snowy update it would be way better. These small accumulative things would be way better for the game then the automated content drops. But there's less care and voice for these things. Oh well.

[@MEWOVER9000]

Actually, they didn't ignore the remove random crits movement. They polled the community about it, and found that a small majority preferred random crits in the game. (51/49 pro random crits)

[@vooshoos]

@@MEWOVER9000 That's fair, I didn't know that. I remember the random crits surveys during casual around the time and around JI. Was it that poll? If not, where did you find the results?

[@nocturne6320]

Dude really opened with a first point being "we need more microtransaction bs, because we like to see numbers go up" 💀