The 2013 FAA Rule That’s Being Blamed for Today’s Pilot Shortage

As the omicron variant surge disrupts air travel in the short-term, an emerging pilot shortage means travelers could quickly face even more limited flight options and higher ticket prices in the long-run. But as airlines attempt to lure new pilots into the cockpit, some executives say a 2013 FAA regulation called the 1,500-hour rule has turned off many prospective pilots.
I took a closer look at the rule to understand why it’s being blamed for a shortage, and why it’s so challenging for the government to address.
If you want to read more about the nationwide need for pilots, check out my colleague Alison Sider’s story here: www.wsj.com/articles/pilots-a...
#1500HourRule #FAA #ShelbyHolliday

[@ShelbyHollidayWSJ]

What do you think it will take to incentivize the next generation of pilots?

[@TheN747]

The only thing stopping me is the price tag. I’m not willing to take on all of that debt without any assistance or assurances only to have to wait years before getting a remotely decent pay check at the regionals.

[@Andrew54123]

airlines will have to start paying for training

[@danielschein6845]

More money. A new first officer at a regional makes about as much as the woman who made my Starbucks coffee this morning. Pilots used to put up with this because it was a stepping stone to having a real career at the majors. That's not the case any more so no one wants to go to civilian flight school. Military pilots see the situation and stay in the military.

[@real_wiam]

Cost to reward ratio needs to better. People respond to incentives, more requirements means less people show up. Neither good nor bad but important to know

[@PeterLai1130]

Top Gun 2 😂

[@guanmaunit]

I paid for all my pilot training out of pocket, I got my private, instrument, commercial SEL and MEL, CFI and CFII. What most people don’t mention is you’ll always have to time build to the 1500 hours total time. Most training is complete within 250-300 hours. The 1500 hours isn’t all training hours. You could rent a Cessna for 1000 hours and fly circles in the sky and it doesn’t do anything to train you for the airlines but in the eyes of the FAA that’s a-ok to count towards your ATP rating. Which is the license you need to join the regionals. The way most people build hours is to become a Certified flight instructor. If you think regional pay is bad have I got news for you being a CFI is worse. Students cancelling last minute and weather cancellations quickly errode your paycheck. I had to hang it up after 700 hours because I couldn’t pay the bills as an instructor. If they lowered the minimums I would get back into the industry immediately. A good reference for a breakdown of the hours necessary for your ATP rating is eCFR title 14 chapter 1 sub chapter D Part 61.159

[@ShelbyHollidayWSJ]

Thanks for watching and for leaving a comment about your experience. It has been very insightful to hear from those of you who've experienced the issue first-hand.

[@lookingforwookiecopilot]

I've got just under 800 hours I'm not using (as there's not much need for helicopter pilots below 2,000 hours these days) that I could sell you. 😆

[@kyle2034]

And at $150/hr renting a cessna for 1200 hours would cost... $180,000. I'm thinking of buying an airplane to build my hours. Not sure how else to do it while working a separate day job. I can't afford to quit to go become a CFI only making $20k a year.

[@maxd.2364]

I feel your pain cause I did the same as you, and paid for the whole training myself and got my commercial pilot's license thinking that I was gonna be able to get a Job, but there are no jobs for low hour pilots to be able start a career as a pilot and gain experience. The reality is that insurance companies create the rules for air carriers and unless you have thousands of hours of experience you wont be able to get a job and enter this industry.

[@UnbeatenPath1]

@@kyle2034 teach part time. I was at a 9-5 at the time and worked nights and weekends to get it done. Sure it took longer and I worked 7 days a week, but I didn't want to take the payout to go full time

[@TheN747]

I love that they never mention that the first officer in the crash that sparked all of this had been forced to come to work sick, and had been awake/working for over 15 hours. Sure some lack of experience/professionalism was a part of this but before this regional airlines could basically do whatever they wanted to crew members with the threat of loosing their jobs if they didn’t comply. 1500 hours does nothing. Efficient training, resource management, and studying human factors saves lives. Make it 750 hours. Especially if it was 250 before.

[@AnthonyGale]

I agree....seems like 750 would be more appropriate. Especially since we don't see such high requirements across the globe. It's not as if those other nations have crashes frequently, and if they have them, are they caused by pilot error?

[@bittnerbs]

With a bachelor’s degree in aviation, it’s 1,000 hours. As someone that already has a bachelor’s degree and is finishing a second bachelor’s degree in aviation, the training is pretty much the same as it is at any 141 school. I’m not sure why the core curriculum makes a bit of difference. It’s having regulation for the sake of having regulation.

[@gordo1163]

@@bittnerbs the thing is that all flight training from start to end must be 141. so if you decide you want to start as part 61, then you've already you're eligibility for the 1,000 hours.

[@lukehancock801]

WSJ should also distinguish the difference between a Commercial Pilot License and an Airline Transport License (ATP). You can get a commercial with 250hrs while an ATP requires the 1500hrs. Commercial just means you can get paid to fly. Wish me luck, I have 260hrs

[@pablog5738]

And, if I am not mistaken, hours flying as commercial pilot counts for the 1500 ATP hours, is that correct?

[@findingmo7049]

I’m assuming commercial pilot license = cargo planes? While ATP license = passenger planes?

[@jacksonchoran8871]

@@pablog5738 correct!

[@TylerZ4358]

@@findingmo7049 not necessarily. FedEx and UPS pilots are required to have ATP certificates.

[@EvanLuftfahrt-ij8ib]

Good luck, mate!

[@Andrew54123]

I started flight school in 2016, finished my ratings in 2019 which cost around $90k. Worked as a CFI until I lost my job because of covid, spent months unemployed. I should mention that I’m 30 years old, and even while working as a CFI doing 13 hour days and still only making $19k a year, I have to live with my mother to make ends meet. Just now, in almost 2022 I’m about to finally get to a regional airline in a few weeks. My first year pay will still only be about $40k

[@bittnerbs]

That’s about to be bumped up, buddy. Regionals won’t be paying that terribly for much longer. I’m already seeing sign-on bonuses and other incentives.

[@ShelbyHollidayWSJ]

Thanks for the comment, although I'm sorry to hear about your experience. Best of luck to you as you move up the chain.

[@theoutlook55]

Best of luck to you man. Keep faith.

[@ShainAndrews]

@@bittnerbs Do not fall for sign on bonuses. It's a one time payment with strings attached... and you give 23% to the man because... well clearly the man wants his cut for preparing you (sarcasm).

[@hawkmurrell8264]

My first regional airline gig, in 1998, paid $9600/year. The Director of Operations literally handed out Pizza Hut applications with the comment “You’ll need these” on the first day of training, threatened to fire everyone, and left. Two weeks later training ended when the FAA suspended our operations for maintenance violations.

[@danielschein6845]

The 1500 hour rule may be overkill (For comparison, the Air Force deploys new fighter pilots into combat with 300 hours.) but it's not what is causing the problem. The problem is low pay at the regionals. No one is going to spend 5 years of their life (after college) and spend $100K to train for a job that starts at $20K per year. Those who do have the experience necessary find that they can make far more money flying for foreign airlines. The solution to the pilot shortage comes right out of an Econ 101 textbook. The airlines simply have to pay more.

[@FlightX101]

Its getting better salary size i believe. But yea anything below 50k after all of that training is basically a crime lol. Dont forget you're only paid for actual flight hours too

[@kyle2034]

And that's exactly what they're going to do. But the money doesn't come out of thin air... the cost will be passed on to the ticket buyers. The best solution would be a combination of the 2. Reducing training costs while increasing ticket prices to pay pilots more... particularly at the regionals. Even reducing from 1500 hours to 1000 hours would make a huge difference. Right now if you have a 4 yr degree in aviation you only need 1000 hrs. Change that to a 4 yr degree regardless of major.

[@mikeadams1647]

The Air Force is a highly selective program. It cost over a million dollars to train a pilot. Most of the planes are equipped with ejection seats. Losses are part of military flying and factored in. No comparison

[@monrow11]

Exactly right. But the Air Force does not care if their pilot is a nervous ball of trash when they are flying. If they break a rule. No problem. Air Force pilots aren’t flying living breathing 200 people behind them day in and out. People think as soon as you get your wings in the Air Force you turn into Tom Cruise in top gun. Your not. Your still inexperienced. Retiring Air Force pilots have the hours and experience to fly an airliner. New Air-force pilots would still be a liability. Even if they are f-14 pilots. Experience is not everything. But it’s a huge piece.

[@didja691]

I disagree with the idea of placing all or even a majority of the blame on the salary at the regionals. If you cant get new pilots into the pipeline because it is going to cost north of $80k, it doesnt matter how much the regionals are paying if the new pilot cant afford to get the hours. The 1500 hour rule is the prime culprit by a large sum. Without that number of hours required, you can have a FO in a regional jet within a few months instead of two to three years due to time building that provides zero training benefit when someone pokes holes in the sky with a cessna 172 for 1200 hours..... Sure, regionals need to raise pay, and that is happening..... but the primary fix is to reduce the 1500 hour rule or change it to 400 hours (just as arbitrary a number as the 1500 hour rule is) to become a FO and then 1500 hours to become a captain. That actually makes sense...... and that is why our government will never even consider it.....

[@chanchanthavong8474]

1,500 hours earned in a single engine Cessna as a student pilot or instructor?Congress and FAA needs to examine the quality of training, not the quantity.

[@kyle2034]

Yep I'd much rather fly in a jet with a pilot with 500 hours of multi engine turbine time than a 1500 hour cessna pilot.

[@Mike-nu9uc]

I flew with pilots who had thousands of hours but zero actual knowledge. Also, look at Qatar Airways, Emirates, Singapore, etc. they ALL hire low hour pilots (nationals only) and so far they’re doing pretty good in terms of safety. More hours doesn’t mean more experience. It’s all about the training.

[@joeskurkis]

What they should do is drop qualifications for the Regionals to 750hrs and keep the mainlines at 1500hrs. This allows for a nice even flow and actual training because hours alone doesnt equal training or ability.

[@davidt8087]

Agreed

[@planewire2153]

As a commercial pilot myself and a flight instructor, the problem is the enormous upfront cost for training, combined with low starting pay, then amplified by an unstable future. For reference, training from zero to flight instructor instrument is about 90k, and takes about a year and a half, and a flight instructor salary is about 40k, you can expect to work for two years, then you can become a first officer at a regional airline and make 40k a year for two years, then finally a captain can make 70k a year. Also you need a college degree to even be considered for a major airline job, where a first office can expect to make 140k a year, and a captain about 220k. So it can take a decade before you make a descent salary.

[@Hedgeflexlfz]

Flight instructors make less than 40k LOL

[@JH-in5oq]

More like 30K. Regional airline first officers used to make less than 40K but the shortage has changed that

[@generalrendar7290]

I'm a pilot who was just hired at the regionals.The rule is STUPID. Imagine lawmakers telling people that you have to drive in a go-kart for 1,000 hours before you can begin to drive a car. If it's improved safety, it's only made it harder for slackers to coast through, however they still get in. An extra 1200 hours of time in a 160 hp which goes 120 mph piston aircraft and land at an untowered airfield DOES NOT prepare you to fly .74 Mach, deal with at least 10 different aircraft systems and then fly a STAR to get ready to land, then fly a parallel approach nearly blind, then navigate through O'Hare International. It is no where near the same.

[@magicmagnificent8862]

!!!!!! BINGO!

[@tthreepo4291]

The 1500 hour rule was passed just as I was getting ready to get my first loan and Begin ground school. I had to walk away. As an adult with a family already being forced to be a CFI for years on top of making less than a McDonalds Manager at a regional made it impossible. Even without the loan I'd have to repay I wouldn't make enough money to support my family even with my wife working full time.

[@condor8442]

What you said there makes no sense as you dont carry 200 passengers at Mach 0.78 in a car . Yes Flying a jet requires alot of safety and competency considerations

[@generalrendar7290]

@Condor 84 I'm saying a single engine, single pilot prop plane is analogous as a go kart is to a car or Semi-truck. Someone who has 1000 hours in a go-kart is not significantly safer than a teenager who has only practiced driving a car for 6 months. Thus, a pilot at 250 hours in a prop plane is *not* significantly less safe than a pilot who has 1500 hours in a prop plane when it comes to flying jets. It makes it a barrier for the common man to enter the field. So either only the rich, the former military pilot, or the scholarshiped/diversity quotas applicants get into the career easily.

[@condor8442]

@@generalrendar7290 I’m very surprised with this comment

[@byronhenry6518]

I’m actually quite happy with the 1500 hour rule. I’m a regional FO and I’m glad my pay is what it is now than what would have been 10 years ago. Back then you’d make more money managing a McDonald’s. The training has always been expensive. And the 2 years I worked as a flight instructor to get those hours were extremely valuable to my skill set before I started flying jets. The more you fly, the better you are at flying, the safer you are. And your pay should reflect that. There’s no argument there. It’s better for pilots in the long run, and it’s safer for the public.

[@jdoe4983]

Yes, these people in the comments are so short sighted. Never side with the CEOs, they yearn for the days they could pay regional FOs mcdonalds wages. They would rather make dirt money and fly a dirty regional with horrible qol than just spend 2 years flying the bug smasher.

[@davidt8087]

I'm happy for high pay. You already have 1500 hours (idk if you had to get 1500 or 250). But how much skill will I get sitting right seat in thr pattern daily with brand new students where one moment of not paying attention and the student crashes? We have now put pilots at risks for the arrogant r3tard3d family members of one single accident which had nothing to do with flight hours. Once again Americans being American. Trying to lobby for change to "honor our dead loved ones", when it's all about being in denial of their family members dying, denying that something bad happened to them, because they're American, oh no, bad things only happen to people in Iraq, or to minorities, so if it happened to them, it's just a fluke. Something that we must correct even if it takes us 50 years of wasting politicians time or all our money. And they somehow won because m0ron politicians used them to gain easy votes. Those r3tard3d families did all that because they were in denial, and didnt want to accept the death of their family and mourn. They thought if they could make a change of the regulations, somehow their family members "wouldn't die in vain", or that they're "protecting others". Theyre too stupid to realize if their dead family members somehow came back alive. They'd fkn be disgusted at how after they died. Instead of accepting it and mourning and missing them, they went on their own personal and selfish arrogant mission and campaign to make change, because they simply couldn't fkn accept that bad things can and do happen to Americans, even of a certain majority. Fkn imbecile children.

[@connorhale599]

The problem is 1500 is an arbitrary number, there is a massive difference between a 250 hour and 1000 hour pilot. But to be completely honest, the simulator training that new hires recieve on simulators of the actual aircraft their flying is much better than flight hours in a 172.

[@davidt8087]

Agreed. 1500 hours pilots today last flew at least 2 years ago. They've been doing nothing but sitting on the right watching students fly, occasionally stepping in for a second. That's considered an experienced pilot? Give me a fkn break. This whole charade happened because of arrogant Americans who couldn't accept their family members died in an accident which had everything to do with low pay, long hours, and fatigue, and just arbitrarily pushed this 1500 hours which has done nothing for safety anyway, but it has helped the family members of that accident convienetly forget their family members died. They're so pathetic, they went into denial and thought they can "make things right" by campaigning to make nonsensical changes in an industry they don't understand and have no business trying to change. If pilots tried to change their industry they'd tell us we have to mind our own business. But becsuse these are majority Americans, they're diseases psychotic minds have to interfere with everyone and everything. If their dead loved ones came back, they'd be fkn disgusted that they spend years and all their money to change regulations to avoid accepting and mourning their deaths, instead of accepting reality, accepting that bad things can happen to everyone and not just Iraqis or minorities in America. And paying their respects to their dead family and morning and missing them. No, the self righteous arrogant "usa usa" idiots family members of the 2009 colgan air crash, had to act out, as if the accident can't happen to them, they're white Americans. So if it happened. It must have been a mistake. An oversight no one caught on to except only them. So they and only they are going to waste all their time and money to change it because when they win, they can be happy knowing they made things "rifht" for everyone, and conveniently, all the time they waste trying to change regulations means less time accepting reality and having to mourn. Seriously if you were someone who died in this crash and came back to life somehow and saw your family members being arrogant like this, not morning you but campaigning to change things in other people's industry as a unconscious way to forget you and not accept what happened to you, youd fkn spit in their fkn ugly r3tard3d faces

[@tsekeithable]

Please remove the 1,500 hrs rule. Otherwise those entry pilot like me would not be able to join airliner. Those airliners in US can offer more level D simulator training hours before line training to make us confident to fly. EU and Asia only requires 250hrs to steep in the cockpit with high safety record. The key point is, the training quality that the airline can offer, very simple.

[@sarahann530]

Eu and Asian airlines hire train their own pilots .

[@davidt8087]

@@sarahann530and thays why they have the highest instances of crashes due to the most minor issue in the cockpit ad well, issues that would never cause a crash with American pilots..even an issue affecting an instrument on one side of the cockpit but not the other in eu or Asian airlines has led to a dozen or more crashes at least. Airlines who hire people with zero experience and put them in a 737 250 hours later, are doing the basics and bare minimum to just teach them how to operate the plane like it's any machine, like a forklift or a crane. That's not how it is in the US. Pilots have passion and understand aviation and aerodynamics. Which is why, we don't ever have crashes like air France 447 in America. Only a stupid system of airline training frlm zero to first officer could cause a crash like that. The first officer was stalling, but because in other countries they only teach you to be a pilot like it's just any other job, and only teach you how to fly when everything is normal, the idi0t first officer thought if he can pull up the stick, he will go up and won't stall, and couldn't fkn understand why pulling up on his stick would only make the stall worse. I mean this is basic stuff in the US, pilots flying a single engine cessna 172 with like 5 hours flight time learn to master stall recovery, but airline pilots in Europe fkn can't because they don't understand aerodynamics. Aviation, how their instruments and systems work, they are basically just managers of the cockpit, NOT PILOTS

[@sgtclark0126]

If the major airlines were to kick start their own financial aid programs for aspiring pilots, I'm sure that could help. There could even be smaller airlines that do it too.

[@16sondra]

Some do but only if you have the correct skin color.

[@jeffholliday6972]

Very interesting story, especially about the effects on flights to smaller, regional airports. Which are already expensive. The comments here are also very thoughtful and insightful. Nice to hear from people who are actually in the industry and also, some background on the crash that led to the 1500 rule.

[@vielumiereg9794]

Some other airlines around the world got the idea right, like Emirates for example. Provide all the training for free, in return, student signs contract to fly exclusively for them for a certain amount of years… everybody wins.

[@conor2439]

Making legislation based off one incident never works out. The 2009 crash was an outlier. The copilot was exhausted and only making around 25k, she had not had a nights sleep in 2 days and she refused to get a hotel room the night before the flight because of the costs. But paying regional pilots more is the responsibility of the airlines and customers, which was off the table. The responsibility was placed on pilots to go into debt to pay for the huge cost of flight training for a job with stringent requirements that has always had an uncertain outlook and cyclical nature.

[@AnthonyGale]

Disappointing the democrats just shut down the idea of changing the 1500 without any consideration.

[@williamloh9018]

Then she put the flaps up, without a word until they were in transit...and no amount of hours or training would have avoided that mess. That is such a glaring mistake it is hard to believe.

[@jnick1909]

@@AnthonyGale No big surprise there. All they ever do is make knee jerk decisions.

[@andry954305]

The crash that happened in 2009 was not caused primarily by inexperience, that was just the scapegoat. Both pilots had over 1500 hours of flight time. The real reason was pilot fatigue. Back then Airlines were allowed to work pilots to the point of exhaustion to maximize profits, the pilots that crashed that plane were half asleep behind the controls in the middle of the night and hadn't slept in 2 days. One of them did not sleep in a bed the prior night because the hotel wasn't going to be paid for by the airline and the pilot couldn't afford it due to the outrageously low wages. Congress blamed the pilot's inexperience so that the labor rule controlled by the FAA (the federal agency in charge of aviation in the us) wouldn't be to blame. Ironically, after the 1500 rule came out, new work rules prohibited airlines from overworking pilot's and their salary increased. If the general public were more informed about this, this stupid rule would be abolished.

[@sarahann530]

What FAA rule controlled where pilots slept ? The hours a pilot flies per day has not changed .The outrageous low wages were caused because airlines had an abundance of pilots to choose from with 250 hours which kept wages low . Now wages have increased because of the new 1500 retirement. Now we have more experienced better paid pilots .

[@jdoe4983]

No, as a pilot I can't believe other pilots are still advocating for removing this, it's extremely short sighted. Prior to the 1500 rule wages were trash, quality of life was trash, etc. You really want to go back to that? Just instruct for two years, it isnt that difficult.

[@andry954305]

@@jdoe4983 Dude you really think that us pilots would be working for the same low wages prior to the 1500 hour rule. C’mon you have yo be smarter than that. Especially in today’s inflation 😂

[@andry954305]

@@jdoe4983 i understand that you probably had to instruct for 2 years to reach 1500 hours and don’t want others taking less time to get where you are now, that’s understandable. I encourage the FAA to drop the minimum to something less than 1500. Doesn’t have to be what it was before but something lower.

[@davidt8087]

@@andry954305 agreed. It's possible to make it 750 or even 1000 hours without jeapordizinf the precious pay of current selfish atp pilots.

[@6862ptc]

Airline CEO's only have THEMSELVES to blame. The "pilot-shortage" was caused by low pay and difficult working conditions. The Regional Airlines have been the worst offenders. Decades of pay cuts, no benefits & long duty days have turned away two generations of prospective pilots.

[@pork_friedrice]

Both the captain and the FO of the Colgan air crash that led to this new industry requirement, ironically had in access of 3000 flight hours. This was a knee jerk requirement put in place that solved nothing, only made pilots harder to come by.

[@tthreepo4291]

The 1500 hour rule not only doesn't accomplish the intended goal it's 100% one of the major factors in today's pilot shortage. That and the cost of training. Today your looking at 100k to get all your licences and certifications. Then you get to be CFI for 20 bucks an hour for years while you rack up hours. Hours that will have little to no bearing on your skills as a commercial pilot. Let's not mention how am I going feed my family and pay bills as a CFI let alone pay off my massive loan. The system is broken.

[@joycoughlan1262]

Is it broken on purpose?

[@tthreepo4291]

@@joycoughlan1262 no. The rule is a horrid knee jerk reaction to a singular accident that was perpetrated by two highly unprofessional pilot's.

[@jmzg2721]

😂😂😂 I have been working in the Middle East as a pilot for the last 15 years. Airlines normally hire a cadet pilot with 200 hours. And they give them training until they reach the 1500. But that put the cost on the Airlines because they have to fly with an instructor until the are release as a FO (American Carriers have to have more instructors and the cost will be higher for them). At this point in my career I don't want to fly with a FO (I'm a Captain) and acting as an instructor (I'm not) because at least in the Middle East you need or a pilot needs previous experience 1500 or more. When I have to fly with a new joiner or a just release Cadet normally the just released Cadet perform better, but that gap is close in I'll say 6 months, then is no difference. The point is that to fly on an airline you need experience I'm not saying that 1500 is too much or too little I'm not an expert, but by experience the more is better.

[@amochkab4680]

Shelby could you do a video on international pilots that use EASA? How does it effect them?

[@bt8154]

Very good video! Several issues I also see in the shortage. Young people (understandably) are not willing to come out of college, work for 2-3 years teaching for food money, get a little bump in pay with the regionals before earning a livable wage. The FAA has huge (ridiculous) barriers to get a medical certificate which eliminates tens of thousands of pilots (Just eliminating the backlog of pilots waiting for OKC to reinstate pilot med certs would eliminate the shortage. I had my med cert denied because I was honest with them that I took a non- drowsey allergy pill at times and it took them 6 mos to get my cert back. Tip: don't tell the FAA ANYTHING about your med history). And as the video points out, the 1500 hr rule is the killer. Congress doesn't want to talk about how the NY pilots were sleep deprived. Any time you put something in front of Congress, common sense goes out the window.

[@MrOsvaldoFreire]

Congressmen know nothing about aviation ( most of them ).

[@soramame7528]

Let's not waive the 1500 hours. It's just not safe.

[@neelabkhattak5870]

I love being a pilot. But the cost to reach 1500 hr is enormous and the funds I have can bare get me a CPL.

[@asterixky]

Would it help if you work for Air France or KLM or even Air Canada until you get your 1500hrs, then come back to work for the majors?

[@usandmexico]

An interesting issue to consider, if it hasn't been done, is the reduction in the probability of fatal errors with each hour of training. And what threshold probability for a fatal error are regulators willing to accept?

[@sarahann530]

What probability of a fatal error are you willing to accept ?

[@marryson123]

Even though the minimum flight hour requirement in Canada is lower, at around 300ish hours, Canadian airlines wouldn’t even look at your resume until you have atleast 1500 hours anyways.

[@williamloh9018]

Hi Shelby... Thanks for the cool video...you really summarize things well. Watched this develop for decades, and it is sad how the people running things have not got the first clue...and will never go near the pointy end or the hot seat. This rule makes sure that some people will get the ratings just because they can afford it, and not because they deserve it. How many training schools will flunk out a below average "pilot" if they can get Mommy to pay the whole $150,000. They just need some more hours... The Atlas Air accident in Houston is not a good sign, and that guy was also able to cover up his simulator failures and busted check-rides. A good pilot with 20 hours would not have reacted like that. An open system to track these people has been discussed for years, but we are waiting on the same people who let Boeing not put the stabilizer on an airplane safely or correctly. Student loans and 500 hours is the only way, since we lost a lot of experience when all those pilots (with gray hair) took early retirement, and we also lost their training of the guys/girls in the right seat. I have recommended to some leasing companies over the years that they should invest in training to avoid this...but what do I know anyway. Not a pilot among them (or in Congress) of course and that is set up to get it wrong then...they don't know what they don't know. Those airplanes are not worth much if they are not moving...Leasing 101. Another concern: Too many airlines mandate that pilots go on auto pilot at 1,500 feet or whatever...so it is not really stick time...it's coffee time. So people with 20,000 hours actually flew the plane a small fraction of that time.

[@Ezel21love]

I have 280hr. I'm struggling- as many student pilots l- to build these hours. It's too much and too expensive. I wish they make it 800hr maximum..

[@designsbyphilip510]

So if the number of pilots were already going down before 2013. Maybe the 1500 hr rule isnt the core cause. It might have hastened the outcome, but honestly, many young adults aren't even getting a drivers license until they are 24 - 27. I think there is a bigger problem.

[@michaelhurlbert8383]

I liked you’re video! I’m a pilot the recently got all my pilot ratings and have about 400 total flight hours. I definitely believe that the 1500 hour rule should be reevaluated.

[@roguegaming5329]

As a ppl/instrument rated. It is expensive trying to pay for flight training and the thing is the more often you fly the more proficient you are and likely to be safer.

[@vanadium8748]

The pilot shortage is a myth, the issue is the pay. Trust me ⏳

[@TheThePrince123]

The 1500 hour almost rule almost ruined my career. It set me back years. I was a line pilot with Mesa(you put my CEO in the video:)). Anyway I was furloughed in 2009 but most my recall because of the 1500rule. I had only 950 with over 300 hours flying the line. The FAA would not grandfather so I lost my job. It needs to be rethought for sure.

[@sarahann530]

So you have been an unemployed pilot since 2009 ,that's sad 😔

[@real_wiam]

From 250h to 1500h. 5X training time 🤦🏿‍♂️😭. They should have looked into increasing the quality of training and a slight increase in hours.

[@TRANSPORTCANADAGURU]

Money is ALWAYS the problem. Cheap airline tickets=cheap pay for crew=difficulty attracting employees=labor shortage.

[@pablog5738]

The airlines should train the pilots, instead if expecting pilots to obtain the 1500 hours from their own money. Asking for taxpayer money to train pilots makes no sense.

[@thomasoffutt5715]

The 1500 hour rule was NOT a NTSB recommendation, it was just something congress dreamed up. It would have made no difference in the Colgan air disaster that drove the changes since both the pilot and co-pilot had more than 1500 hours.

[@seangajadhar8883]

I definitely think it's worth reassessing given the current environment.

[@danieladdo1588]

Yes , it should be revised bbecause the 1500 depletes proficiency

[@juniorcampbell2980]

This was interesting. In light of the disparity of requirements in other countries maybe 1500 hours might be too much, but what's wrong with having the most stringent requirements?

[@couchrou]

Lion Air flight 610 and Ethiopian Air flight 302. Think about that when you ask why the US has higher requirements then the rest of the world.

[@regionalflyer]

The 1500 hour rule is a useless metric for a couple of reasons. First is that the Captain on that flight had 3300 hours and the FO 2200. Second is flight time doesn't equal experience. I'd argue it's worse because most pilots get their time by instructing. Sitting in the right seat instructing for an extra 1000ish hours does not increase abilities and you rarely actually "fly" because the student is. Training quality is much more important than quantity which is why 141 schools allow for lower time requirements to be met. Pay also played a not insignificant part in this accident as well but that's a discussion for another day.

[@davidt8087]

@@couchrouthose are the MCAS crashes. It has to do with a poor design dumba55. And American pilots whether 250 hours like it was before or 1500 hours, learn at local flight schools and actually learn about aviation, aerodynamics, airplane systems, etc and have passion for it. In Ethiopia or Indonesia where lion air was. It's poor people who want a job, and get lucky an airline hires them with no experience, and they get trained as if it's on the job training, and are trained to be managers of the plane, and not actual pilots. Even in France. If you wanted to give a better example, air France 447 is the most egregious and dumbest pointless crash of them all. Literally no pilot in the USA whether 1500 hours, or 250 hours, or even 5 hours, would ever fkn stall that plane and continue pulling up all the way from 37,000 feet down to zero. Americans are the best pilot in the world which is strange because Americans are also the most ignorant, arrogant, and stupidest ppl in the world, but American pilots usually are the brightest and most professional ppl America has anyway, so if anything, other countries pilots need 1500 hours,.not the US. Us has everything backwards because like I said, most Americans are r3tard3d especially the politicians

[@hawkmurrell8264]

The 1500 hr rule is not the cause. The cause is regional airline spent almost two decades charging their pilots anywhere between $10-20k for the privilege of working for them. After that it was years of literal poverty wages. Most regional airlines had it in the employee manual that you were not allowed to wear your uniform while applying for government benefit programs, because they didn’t want the flying public to know you qualified for welfare. No person in their right mind is going to take on a law school size debt to pay for flight training, if that is the environment in which they know they are going to have to pay it back.

[@0226memo]

The 1500 hour rule was the single-handedly dumbest thing that Congress could’ve ever done. They should’ve never stepped into a field that they have no experience in. All it did was make flying unattainable for most people, because most people cannot afford the $100,000 price tag that comes with most flight schools. they want to fix the pilot shortage? Lower the price tag, or lower the hour requirements. It’s funny that we’re one of, if not the only country in the world that requires 1500 to step into an airliner, but we still have just as many accidents as any other country. So that alone proves that the 1500 hours required, has nothing to do with it. It's also insane that we require 1500 for airlines, but not military aircraft with rockets, missiles, and bombs lol.

[@georgesaleh3171]

I see lots of comments with none aviation experience people saying that they don’t want exchange safety with cheaper ticket. Just because any pilot has 1500 total flight time doesn’t make them safer pilot. Because the rule doesn’t differentiate between type of flight experience. You could be flying for creation by small plane for 1500 hours and then be hired by airline to fly big jets which totally different than what you been flying and you could have only 500 hrs total flight experience but most of this time was in complex plane and complex weather which you gain lots of experience then not meet the 1500 rule in result not be hired by airlines . As a commercial pilot I definitely would trust to be passenger with the 500 total time pilot vs the 1500 one in this scenario

[@findingmo7049]

One thing the video didn’t get into is, can US pilots who don’t have the 1,500 hours just work for international airlines since their require much less hours? What’s stopping them from working Emirates, Singapore Airlines, and even in China. Those foreign airlines have bigger demands than we do, and probably pay pilots more than our airlines do?

[@Hedgeflexlfz]

You can't just easily do that.

[@gordo1163]

Sometimes, its easier said than done moving half way across the country and adjusting to a new life there. Especially where I assume they are on a budget.

[@mikeyb8313]

Funny the Mesa airline CEO blames the ATP rule on the shortage. Yet his airline starts pilots at around 35k a year.

[@condor8442]

The way forward for fighting pilot shortage is not to lower the standards and quality , its to be more welcoming and open to other nations

[@gilbertomarquez9006]

Wow, just reading the comments makes me feel discouraged about being a pilot. Any tips of how to start off? I went to a flight school and estimated me 40-50k to be full blown commercial pilot but after hearing this 1500 rule is just absurd. Lots of money for a career that offers little pay im not understanding?

[@kyle2034]

The typical path is earning 20k to 30k as a flight instructor for 1 to 2 years to build your hours. You can also look for low time pilot gigs, the 1500 hour rule is just for airline pilots.

[@roadlaw]

Why don’t the FAA and US airline companies look at what successfully happens in other parts of the world? Regulated commercial pilot training schools exist in many countries that take complete beginners with zero hours and train them to become First Officers in the airline world. They finish their initial licence training with typically 250-300 flying hours. The airlines pay for their training costs, then often the individuals will pay back a proportion of those costs over a 5-10 year period, during which they gain experience in a properly regulated safe environment as an airline co-pilot. Before being checked out to fly with any regular captain, they operate many line training sectors (flights) with Instructor Pilots as they continue their airline training. They could be flying almost any size of multi-crew aircraft doing this, with passengers. As a 22000 hour airline pilot outside of the States, I can vouch for the fact that with the correct relevant training, this system has been proven to work. There is no proven safety case that says otherwise. Let’s face it, these guys and girls are already flying around US airspace, carrying American passengers in and out of the States, albeit for non-US airlines.

[@aquilotti1987]

Being a cfi myself I truly believe 250 hrs is not enough experience to jump straight into the airline world. But I also believe 1500 hrs is an overkill. I think that the very maximum should be 1000/800 hours tops. I’m definitely a better a pilot since the moment I became a CFI to now. My skills and feel for flying an airplane have improved but an extra 700 hrs which is what I still need, in a Piper single engine plane won’t make a huge difference.

[@MrOsvaldoFreire]

Emirates Airlines have its cadet academy and they're doing good. They fly all over the USA. Hypocrisy is the worst defect of all mankind. It's useless to spend your time flying over and over on a Cessna 152 in order to satisfy the FAA building flight time.

[@alirosi7381]

no different mate in emirates after 200 hours you can go airline !

[@davidt8087]

@@MrOsvaldoFreirethat pisses me off. But the problem with these zero hour airline hire to airline pilot programs in countries in Europe or Asia is, you don't get pilots. You get cockpit managers who only know how to operate the plane as if it's any other machine like a forklift or something. When something goes wrong, they panic and make idiotic mistakes that kill everyone. Air France 447, for example, and so much more where one single instrument stops working just on one side but not The other, and boom, crash. In America, there are no zero hour to airline cadet programs. You need to get your own hours, and pilots here have passion and love for flying. And actually understand how aerodynamics works, how plane systems work. Emirates pilots are just managers who know how to push the autopilot and program the flight management computer, and only turn off autopilot when 50 feet from runway, most just autoland, but crash in minutes if there is a small problem.

[@Hedgeflexlfz]

The pilots in that crash both had more than 1500 hours, ironic isn't it?

[@sloth6765]

But they both had joined with much less. It's the variety of experience prior to entering the airlines that's lead to improved safety.

[@Hedgeflexlfz]

@@sloth6765 Pilot do not have a variety of experience before they join airlines. They flight instruct in cessna 172 for 1500 hours.

[@davidt8087]

@@sloth6765this is the most dumbest post and shows how ignorant passengers are

[@leighsmith9668]

The reason for a pilot shortage is the CEO OF THE AIRLINES. No one is talking about the pay cuts the pilots took through the 90’s and 2000 to 2018. For starters I went through 15 CEO’s in 37 years who all left with golden Parachutes. While I took pay cuts! Pay cuts of 40 to 70%. What I made in 2000 took 13 years to exceed. Point is, had the Career been one without pay cuts and fighting with management their would be plenty of pilots. We all told our kids to do something else. Put the blame where it belongs, CEO’s. have them pay for the shortages…

[@autothrust330]

The airline industry had always been in a constant loop of ups and downs. If you’re a pilot wannabe, prepare for a turbulent ride on your career.

[@ps3songs]

The real question is why does this rule only apply to US carriers but not foreign carriers flying into US airspace. They implemented the 65 rule on foreign captains why not implement this rule as well?

[@linco-is5fl]

europe and other countries dont fall under faa

[@ps3songs]

@@linco-is5fl when airlines operate in US airspace they still need to follow US rules. Captains can't be over 65 rule is implemented to foreign carriers who fly into the US...

[@healthieryou7206]

There is no shortage of pilots, there is a shortage of work ethic .The major airlines are working on the hope , wish and pray business model. The hope is that one morning they get up and all the pilot slots magically got filled OR the government send them another fat bailout check. In the meantime are there highly experienced airline pilots sitting home for the last two+ years . Why... they live abroad and the airlines are too lazy to get them work permits. The airlines hope, wish and pray that the smaller regional players put in the work to get them green cards, and then the major airline grab them after a year or so. I know what I'm talking about. My brother has a FAA ATP and a ICAO ATP with 20 000 hours (Boeing 747 ,737 and Airbus 330 included) . Already has an American pilots license. Flown around the world many many times. He can't get arrested in the US because the airlines are too lazy to put in the work.

[@daveanderson2569]

my trade lic needs 5000 hors or 5 years to be qualifird ,reduce hours for colledge or unnivesaty , and if i mess up nobody dies

[@yuentsang6903]

The 1,500 rule would not have prevented the Cranston which the rule was based. The pilot and co pilot had over 1,500 hours of flight. Number of hours don’t equal flight experience.

[@nylapinsam6083]

Is 1500 hour rules for the lives onboard? I think it should keeping it. Airline need to change how they sell the flight ticket. I fully support for not refund the cancelled ticket or no show by passengers and no over selling. that is it.

[@lucho6888]

Human factor is the weakest schackle of the chain. The best mean to overcome this weakness is trough training and knowledge. As one of my mentors said “in aviation the most important thing is experience” just like that, there are no secrets, nor shortcuts. Having said that, I agree with the 1500 hour rule. Finally, even though a big number of flight time is not required in Europe to fly jetliners, doesn’t mean they hire unexperienced pilots, normally is not the case.

[@topofthegreen]

that rule is never going away, in fact it should be higher.

[@TomCook1993]

1500/1200 for part 141 schools is such a ridiculous arbitrary number. We were flying for 90 years with pilots starting with a couple hundred hours. And the world didn’t cave in on itself.

[@sarahann530]

Flying has got a lot safer in 90 years the figures are indisputable.

[@AnthonyGale]

Make it 750. It's not as if other nations with lower requirements are seeing frequent crashes and if crashes in other nations are happening, are they caused by pilot error?

[@benc1103]

Take 1960's-70's pay and work rules, and correct for CPI (inflation). New contracts with post-amendable date CPI increases to offset management dragging out new contract negotiations for years. Make labor contracts bankruptcy proof as in other first world countries. The current pilot shortage is the result of post-9/11 bankruptcies and management decimating pilot contracts. This was an instant turn-off for aspiring pilots.....for about 15 years, during which relatively few aspiring pilots made it a career. Easier to become a doctor of lawyer. Management made their bed and now they have to sleep in it. The Chinese Covid Flu caused the airlines to offer early retirement to pilots who were withing 3 years of retirement. While this worsened the problem, it was not the cause. No easy fix for this one. The big 4 carriers still have expired pilot contracts that have been in negotiations for 3 or 4 years, still dragging their feet. Ben Senior Captain at a Global Airline

[@adamworthington3274]

But if you have a degree in aviation, it’s 1000….? Like that really helps or fully justifies a safer pilot? At least reduce it to 1000

[@UTarcher72]

Some will say its a good rule and it is what lead to increased safety and pay. But in reality; its a quantity rule, not a quality rule. Why is 1,500 the magic number and do airlines and the FAA not realize that a skilled pilot with multi engine, turboprop and jet time reaching 1,500 hours is a completely different pilot than the pilot who flew a Cessna 152 for two years in VFR weather? There is no comparison in that example. So the rule is a numbers rule, not a quality or merit rule and it should be done away with. It is hurting aspiring pilots and it is also hurting the industry. Why do all present and future pilots have to pay the price for the Colgan crash? Especially since both of those pilots had more than 1500 hours in their books? It is an arbitrary number and it ought to be amended or done away with entirely. Lets get back to analyzing people on an individual basis. Some pilots at 500 hours are ready for airlines, while others may need more time and experience. A one size fits all is the wrong approach. Same thing with the mandatory retirement age of 65. Not all people are of the same health when they reach 65.

[@sarahann530]

What arbitrary number would you prefer they use ?

[@alex47_in_downtown18]

preach brother!

[@benjohnson2183]

theres a bit of misinformation in this video. you cant just go to any 4 year school get your bachelors in anything you want, you have to go to an approved university by the FAA ie North Dakota, Emery Riddle, ASU, St Louis, Auburn, Western Michigan just to name a few and be enrolled in those respective schools aviation programs. even though all you need to get a job at an airline (minus hours + licences) is a bachelors from a 4 year school. you can only get that reduction of 500 hours at the approved schools

[@johanexxxx]

I agree with the rule, yes it will mean fewer pilots, fewer schedules and higher ticket prices......so what? you have to sacrifice something, nothing comes without a cost. If more pilots and more flights mean more accidents than its not worth it.

[@ShainAndrews]

Ahh the "for your safety" argument. Always a classic.

[@Kipkemoi]

Pay more?

[@dl1965]

Yeah now after graduating from pilot school i have to go beg people to use me and take advantage of me for 2 or 3 years just to get my 1500 hr. Who the fuck put those animals in charge?

[@IzzyEatz]

We can’t even fix La ports. Congress won’t fix pilot shortages...... they don’t give a rip!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@cliffweinan3907]

Many retired pilots use to get there hours in military, at gov expense. Military reducing costs now by using drone pilots, which does not translate to in cockpit jet hours. Ordinary people do not have all this money for 1500 hrs of commerical time to get the ATR rating. Imagine robots flying don't need hours of experience, but regular software updates. So the solution is robots or air transport drones flowed by on ground drone pilots.

[@topofthegreen]

Don’t expect the 1,500 hour rule to go away anytime soon, they might even raise the requirement. I think that’s a good thing.

[@davidt8087]

That's cuz your not a pilot and don't understand how anything works at all.

[@victorborioli]

Hiring foreign pilot may be a solution. Not all country live the same moment. There are many pilots here in Brazil or many other nations. Due to political and economical problems where I live, we live in a vicious mode of airlines rising and falling. In emerging economies, pilot have the same training and experience as any other pilot of the world. Flying an Airbus, Boeing or corporate aircraft such Gulfstream, Falcon etc, we all receive the training in the same location.

[@noxii5191]

They should at least creat programs to make cancel the student debt they create with those rules.

[@imranrahman7320]

250 hrs with mil av.

[@Johnwillbegone]

What could it be? I guess you could say there maxed out. v

[@liquid_shadow8690]

A prime example of government interference f’ing up private industry.

[@DiegoAlCh100]

Temporary permits for foreign pilots?

[@velavanlaack9134]

Why Canada and Europe didn’t have the kind of accident? That’s the question to address

[@imranrahman7320]

Modern sofisticated Simulator hrs toward 1500 is also a good proposal

[@billyponsonby]

I don’t want to see countryside strewn with wreckage and little kids’ shoes and toys anymore. Good training is of paramount importance.

[@bamapilot9166]

Good training yes…but requiring 1500 hrs doesn’t mean a pilot has had good training. It’s a stupid rule and has no business being in law. 500 hours should be the minimum for part 121 operators.

[@phillyphill6871]

The 1,500 hour rule is a good thing. I’ve spent years flying in Asia with pilots who only had around 200 hours when they joined. 99% of the time everything is fine when it all goes to plan but that 1%, without a proper flying foundation, these low hour pilots really struggle to make safe decisions

[@icarus5391]

A few days ago a 747F (flown by chinese pilots) happened to hit cargo pallets by the taxiway. You could set a crew of 4 asian pilots with 20,000+ hours and they'll still struggle to figure out which line is the centerline on a taxiway. It's that simple. Hours are important for professional development, I agree. But bringing asian pilots to the table makes absolutely non-sense. I've done two type ratings (turboprop with >20t MTOW and jet >70t MTOW) and they were easy as a walking down the street. Second one was obviously easier, but I'd trust myself with 200h on the first type rating rather than an asian pilot with 20,000 hours.

[@davidt8087]

Agreed. I was mentioning this. In countries in Europe or Asia or Africa, especially the poorer ones, people don't go into aviation because it's a passion, in local schools, and learn about the fundamentals of aviation and airplane systems etc. They get directly hired by an airline with no experience. And basically learn to be cockpit managers, as if they're operating a forklift or a crane. Your right, it's all nice if everything is working perfectly and they have ILS for autoland or at least to go down to 50 feet above runway and then take over. The moment one minor issue crops up, they crash within minutes. So far pilots overseas have crashed due to small things such as autopilot disconnecting and they panic and crashes, airspeed indicator on one side isn't working right but the other one is, crash. Attitude indicator not working on one side but other one is, crash. Air France 447, plane enters stall at 37,000 feet, Mr first officer aka cockpit manager who became a pilot as if it's just any other career, thought "hey if I pull up on the stick, we will go up and not stall", and he took the plane down nose high all the way down to sea and crashed (something a 5 hour 172 pilot in the US would easily correct because we understand aerodynamics and why stalls occur and don't panic in emergencies). What else. Static port taped over, preflight missed it. Crash. MCAS, keeps trimming plane nose down in 737 max, never occurs to the moron pilots to turn the electrical auto trim off. Instead they keep pulling on elevator controls. A 5 hour us pilot would instantly trim if controls were heavy, and turn off auto trim if it interfered with controls. No ILS approach and landing, crash. Overseas pilots are the worst. Not even pilots. It makes me mad they get to fly in airlines when they're not even truly experienced or qualified. They have the experience, just the wrong experience. They aren't pilots, they're autopilot cockpit managers

[@Chengmaster]

Id say 500-1000 is fine, how daheck did it go x6 to 1500

[@bigj259]

I have 250 hours and can’t find a job as a pilot unless i spend more money snd become s CFI lol good luck solving this shortage

[@Hedgeflexlfz]

even instructor jobs are hard to get

[@kyle2034]

@@Hedgeflexlfz Buy your own plane, you'll have students lining up

[@Hedgeflexlfz]

@@kyle2034 I don’t have money to just buy a plane haha

[@numberLuan]

Pay a pilot what he is worth and there will be no shortages. You see a shortage of Doctors, lawyers?

[@alirosi7381]

all countries after complete cpl you can hire in airline without any problem I cant imagine this is insane 1500 hours flight just sit and build time for what ? pay money i think . to be fair is 500 or max 750 not 1500 !!!!

[@condor8442]

US pilot shortage is due to Visa difficulties. They are very discriminating when it comes to where people come from . I think there should be a Visa Weaver for pilots so then the Pilots from everywhere els can come and help US out with shortage

[@16sondra]

The last non us citizens to fly an airliner flew them into the twin towers and the pentagon. That’s the reason you have to have citizenship now.

[@johncronin9540]

Maybe we should pay Members of Congress at the same rate pilots are trained. Pilots simply are not being paid enough.

[@Itsbrayo]

Hey, Shelby.. This is a great feature you’ve done. Kudos! I’m a pilot on that route to the airlines & as much as the 1500hr rule has most aspiring pilots digging deeper to reach the said set # of hrs to join the airlines, We have to consider & prioritize safety. That’s it. SAFETY FIRST. Nobody wants to be that guy that made the decesion that resulted in countless fatalities caused by pilot error/incompetency. So I’m with the FAA on this one. UPHOLD RULE!

[@ShelbyHollidayWSJ]

Thanks so much for watching and leaving this thoughtful note. And best of luck with your career.

[@CarsonCreatesStuff]

The hours you fly after you complete your Commercial make you a safer pilot in the GA world, but trust me flying for the airlines is COMPLETELY different. The approach speed of that aircraft is higher than the cruise speed of a Cessna. You're managing 10 different aircraft systems, all while learning how to fly in a 121 environment. Not to mention the automation in these jets lead to a steep learning curve. Automation is great, but it also can cause major issues. I flight instructed, worked at a regional airline and now I fly for a larger carrier. In no way shape or form do I feel the extra hours after my commercial made me more safe as a regional pilot. If they want a safer pilot force at the commercial level, additional training needs to be implemented and they are already doing that with Extended Envelope Training. The answer isn't more hours, its better training that's applicable to the type of flying you do commercially.

[@CarsonCreatesStuff]

@Austin Han These are 2 separate issues. The cost of training is really what's causing the shortage. People simply can't afford to go to flight school, the cost has become astronomical. As mentioned in the video there isn't much funding available either. Unless you go through a college most of your money would have to be borrowed from banks and the interest rates on those loans are sickening. Also the shortage is felt at flight schools. I am a chief pilot for a small flight school and we are constantly loosing instructors to the airlines, which leaves us understaffed and students become frustrated with instructor availability. Not only that its nearly impossible to hire someone with good experience as an instructor because they are already flying jets somewhere and being paid more. So you end up hiring these instructors that have little to no experience teaching brand new private pilots. You don't pay for the entire 1500 hours, only they time spent training (about 250-300 hours). After that, its just building time either instructing or flying your own plane around to build hours. Those hours you spent building don't necessarily make you a safer pilot at the commercial level because it is SO different flying for an airline.

[@bittnerbs]

@@CarsonCreatesStuff 100% correct. Best comment that I’ve read on this video.

[@winstonsmith6204]

Airlines Nickel-and-Dime Syndrome

[@tacticalbacon8064]

Just for perspective for all you who think federal intervention is a good thing Average cost of lowest costing aircraft rental for non jet is $200 per hr Jet rentals for training Average of lowest costing $1200 per hr Now multiply those numbers by 1500 hrs and you see your answer why there is a pilot shortage

[@jdoe4983]

Yeah, you have no idea what you're talking about. You only pay for the first 250 - after that you can start an entry level flying job (getting paid) while you build up to 1500.

[@tacticalbacon8064]

@@jdoe4983 sure if you wanna be CFI for the school you graduated no one is giving you a job as a low hr civil aviation pilot with only 250 hrs and freqsh out of flight school unless your school was ATP even at 250 hrs thats still $50k- $80k based on your rental prices you act like thays not alot of money when most of the time its out of pocket or getting a loan

[@davidt8087]

@@tacticalbacon8064ATP gets a lot of hate. What exactly is the issue. I agree they don't treat you like a baby all the way to commercial or cfi and are expensive, but hours and certs and ratings are still hours ratings and certs

[@tacticalbacon8064]

@davidt8087 Money is the issue. Also, ATP is like Harvard to aviation. Most people dont even get in, let alone make it through the absurd cost of the school It's cheaper to become a doctor than an airline pilot Most grants and student loans only cover for schools like atp, which are few and far between in terms of locations I dont think you grasp the true severity of how expensive aviation has become, mostly due to over regulation and corporate gatekeeping Sure you only need 250 hrs to get commercial whens the last time you had 80k chillin in your bank ment to take risk with And even if you become a cfi and make it to airlines, uour gonna spend years and loads of money only to make 40k a year untill you have 10 + years seniority

[@davidt8087]

@@tacticalbacon8064 well atm I don't want to brag but I'm at ATP due to a loan, and have a business making $8000-10000 month. But living in LA, it feels like $500 a month. I agree it's absurd and ATP is greedy

[@alandiegovillalobos]

Maybe 400 hour rule...😂

[@HalifaxComputersRepair]

raise the prices on the tickets for all the planes and make really expensive then you dont need flights delays , because less people will fly and problem goes away on its on for short temp or there is other way , fly privately and your problems go away lol

[@ljthirtyfiver]

No they shouldn’t. Let all Take into account that there has not been a major accident with the exception of maybe a few mishaps such as runway overruns since 2010. You let the all these people In the airlines start to cut pay, you cut pay people will leave, then you’re stuck with a young guys in the cockpit. Bar enough There’s truck drivers with 10th grade education (no offense I drove trucks too) spending not even a fraction of the cost to get their cdl getting paid the same if not more than a regional pilot for operating less sophisticated equipment in a less demanding operation. You go back to paying pilots peanuts less than truckers then you go back to another shortage or worse…young underpaid pilots spreading everybody across a field somewhere. I’ll take older experience properly paid pilots over anything else. The government should jus stop touching shit.

[@MrOsvaldoFreire]

This is pure stupidity. Most of the congressmen know nothing about Aviation. Ethiopian Airlines has a flight academy and some Middle Eastern airlines are following with amazing results.1500 hours on Cessna 152 don't make it safer to fly on airlines. Air Force should send their pilots to missions also with 1500 or more hours.

[@bobthemagicmoose]

I question the framing of this... it's the pilots guild (union) putting undue barriers to entry to artificially keep supply down and wages (for those that make it in) up. They can rename it all they want and cast it in whatever light to obfuscate this fact... but the shortage is the goal.

[@bobthemagicmoose]

As a member of another guild (legal) I can tell you that the majority of requirements to "protect people" don't do what they pretend to do and just are attempts to legitimize the guild and increase the barrier to entry.

[@bobthemagicmoose]

And then this raises the question... why are pilots behind the stick in the first place when most planes can literally fly themselves.

[@CarsonCreatesStuff]

@@bobthemagicmoose Because automation and machines fail. Im pretty sure you wouldn't want to be flying in an aircraft that can take off and land itself when one of the navigation, autopilot or auto land systems fails. Yes it can be done, but those systems fail. It just happens. I flew a plane the other day with a deferred auto pilot. The unions at airlines want nothing more than to help the pilot group. If airlines can't staff, flights cancel, schedules get messed up and its a whole mess that directly effects pilot groups. The shortage isn't good for the groups. The unions aren't trying to sabotage the group they represent that's absurd.

[@ericrotsinger9729]

Washington should look at things from the view of the pilot ask Sully for God's sake. Shelby has got what it takes for video.