The Air War Before the Suez Crisis: Israel vs Egypt’s Early Jet Dogfights (Pt 1)

[@Spitfiresammons]

It’s weird how both Israel and Egypt air forces are the only countries to fought each other’s with British Jet fighters before Egypt replacement of the Soviet Mig-15/17. I Can’t wait to hear of the *Air war during the 1956 Suez Canal crisis?*

[@showtime112]

Yes, this part of the world was considered the British zone of influence so they tried to maintain a balance by supplying limited amounts of weapons to both side, I guess.

[@DaveSCameron]

Especially after es terrorist attacks upnto 1948 vs GB

[@anubisRN555]

Ironically, 1977, in Egyptian Libyan war, mig-21 fought mig-21 for the first time, too

[@joseftabone3366]

Great work Sir

[@SUomiist]

Israel fought with British Protectorate Jordan in 1967

[@MarceloBorba-t5m]

Excellent video. No missiles, real dogfights among brave pilots. Thank you very much.

[@999.9finegold]

The Israeli Air Force still uses cannons on all of its fighter jets, including the F35I, which is equipped with the GAU-22/A cannon, and they still train in dogfight style.

[@donparker1823]

Really interesting that these two British designs fought one another. I would have thought the Vampire would have the advantage since it was the second generation of British jet (entered service in 1946 vs the Meteor in 1943). But training and tactics huge factors. Really interesting episode and the graphics are sooooo good.

[@showtime112]

Glad you liked this one too! Vampire did come out a couple of years later but I don't think it had a big advantage over Meteor. They improved the engine to the point that only one could be used instead of two.

[@XtalQRP]

The IAF converted a pair of their Meteor T.7 trainers into vertical photography reconnaissance platforms. These flew flew unarmed operational missions throughout the 1955-56 conflicts and continued flying sorties into 1960.

[@showtime112]

Thank you for contributing info!

[@offshorequest]

Another great video. I always learn something new about these lesser known conflicts.

[@showtime112]

I appreciate your words, thank you!

[@TheKid9678]

As Always Showtime 112 your reenactments are Well Done and Extremely Interesting.

[@showtime112]

I am very grateful for your kind words, thank you!

[@pablopeter3564]

GREAT VIDEO. CONGRATULATIONS. Another contribution to aviation history. Thanks and greetings from Mexico City.

[@cannonfodder4376]

A great video on a conflict that really does need more attention. Such a fascinating conflict and equally fascinating engagements.

[@showtime112]

Thank you very much! You can find sources on YT which talk about the war but I found almost nothing focusing on the air war.

[@joewright2304]

I enjoy your videos. Not only are they entertaining, but they're educational about little studied conflicts.

[@RealDarko]

Nice to see this new "series" looking forward for more of this less knows engagements before the big clashes.

[@showtime112]

Thank you once again, more stuff coming out soon!

[@fernandosantos05]

Another great vídeo. Great historical content and great air combat details. Thanks for creating these amazing videos.

[@showtime112]

Thank you for being around and watching!

[@donparker1823]

Thanks!

[@showtime112]

Thank you very much for another donation!

[@DavidStanleyWalker]

Knew a Royalist Egyptian from this era Ex-REAF he was so RAF in affected style as a little boy I wa totally totally amased

[@showtime112]

Thanks for sharing! I remember reading that some of foreign volunteers in Israeli Air Force in 1948 had similar observations of a senior Jewish officer (who had served in RAF during WW2). That service makes a deep impression on people I guess 😁

[@tungteo1190]

Thanks

[@showtime112]

Thank you very much for another donation!

[@jerrymail]

One new video from Showtime 112 ? Hop! I like directly ! 😁 I really enjoy these stories about little known air combats. 👍

[@showtime112]

Thank you very much for that vote of confidence 😀

[@juancarlosperezcortes9259]

Very interesting chapter. Aerial warfare was created and feed by combat experiences all around the world

[@showtime112]

Thank you for the comment!

[@fernandosanchiz6731]

Keep making this videos. They are great.

[@carlhicksjr8401]

I agree!

[@swenhtet2861]

Politics aside, looking forward to see you cover the Israeli use of 109s in the 1948 War.

[@showtime112]

Yes, that is a pretty fascinating story.

[@999.9finegold]

They were junk. This is not the real Messerschmitt. They would fire out of sync and they had holes in the propeller at the end of the flight.

[@mhpjii]

Superb production

[@showtime112]

I really appreciate your comment, thank you!

[@christopherhanton6611]

very nice video, it's funny how in this first war between Egypt and Israel they both used British aircraft. later like you said Israel switch to French aircraft and Egypt Russian aircraft. latter Negotiations in the future France and Israel broke down and they had to find a new supplier and that was Usa .

[@showtime112]

Thank you for the positive comment! These stories about weapons procurement are quite interesting to analyze. So much politics in the background. Just like today :)

[@MobinBrown]

Great video. For a second I almost thought the switch to gun footage was actual combat footage.

[@showtime112]

I like to play with that a little bit :) Thanks for the comment!

[@ericsissenwein3601]

Amazing content and GRAPHICS! Subscribed. 😊

[@showtime112]

Thank you very much, I appreciate that!

[@carlhicksjr8401]

Great video... and VERY even-handed, which is not something you always see in videos featuring the Arab-Israeli wars. You stick to the facts as you know them and you put little if any political bias into the script. From a fellow historian, GOOD WORK

[@showtime112]

I really appreciate your feedback! I try to make these stories as neutral as possible. Of course, some people disagree :)

[@carlhicksjr8401]

@@showtime112 Ain't that the truth 😅 As historians, it's our job to teach the historical record without favor or bias. That is hard to do at any time, but for some subjects there is an emotional factor in it that has to be addressed. And God knows that makes it harder.

[@Robin6512]

Mooie video met goeie info. 😊

[@showtime112]

I appreciate your positive comment!

[@SGusky]

Yes yes yes Thank you soooooo much for posting this Working on my Vampires now!!!

[@showtime112]

What an enthusiastic comment :) Thank you and have fun working on the models (I suppose that's what you are doing).

[@anubisRN555]

Fun fact about suez war the British and French troops only managed to capture one city of the three cities in the canal area after the loss of portsaid Egyptian army knew he can't beat the invasion alone so he issued orders for army soldiers to dress as civilians and fight guerrilla warfare in portsaid and prepare the other cities to the same . finally, both US and USSR agreed that to end the war and mark them as new superpowers

[@ConradAinger]

That is no sort of fact. The British - French forces stopped on orders from London and Paris. The Egyptian Army was being routed by the Israeli Army in the Sinai campaign.

[@anubisRN555]

@ConradAinger only small numbers Egyptian soldiers was in Sinai in 1956 Egyptian army reach 500k active duty

[@ConradAinger]

@anubisRN555 Rather more than two divisions of thr Egyptian Army were in Sinai in October 1956. This was about half of Egypt's operational troops. Casualty figures for the fighting in October and November are as follows: Israel - approximately 200 killed, 900 wounded. Egypt- about 1700 killed, 5000 wounded, 6000 taken prisoner. Britain- 16 killed, 96 wounded. France- 10 killed, 33 wounded.

[@anubisRN555]

@ConradAinger you are right, but in Egypt, the army in 1956 took different baths. After the shock of the attack, the army turned for the civilians of the canal area for everything, food supplies clothing, etc. in In 1956, two divisions were in Sinai, but the army after that started recruiting non stop till Yemen war, and only after 1967 war stopped and started a new recruiting system from Sweden Basically, if Egypt lost the entire army in 1956, they always have new divisions to come

[@wilsonpickett3881]

Let's not forget that by nationalizing the canal and closing it to Israeli shipping Egypt effectively declared war under international law.

[@WgCdrLuddite]

When they nationalised it it became their canal, on their territory. At that point it was subject to Egyptian law, not international law.

[@nsatoday]

@@WgCdrLuddite not true. Navigable water way for international shipping. So yes, Egypt did an act of war with blocking shipping in that way.

[@carlhicksjr8401]

@@WgCdrLuddite Except that the canal was not constructed under Egyptian auspices and Egypt didn't pay a farthing for it. Up until 1954 it was an international shipping lane subject to the Freedom of the Seas. In this, it was in the same legal category as the Panama Canal, the Straits of Hormuz, the Straits of Gibraltar, and other narrow passages of trade. Nasser was trying to make new international law by fiat and got his nose bloodied for his trouble. Whether or not that was justified is a matter of opinion, but history has decided that, because of the Suez Crisis and his other provocations, Nasser got what was coming to him.

[@WgCdrLuddite]

@@nsatoday Under British and French control the canal was blocked to enemy shipping many times. Was that an act of war ?

[@nsatoday]

@ if you mean after Germany declared. Please read books and laws. You seem confused

[@chups1447]

Another great video, thanks 👍

[@showtime112]

Thanks, Chups!

[@branka4226]

Great video 👍

[@1czechit1]

to be exact the American stopped the Czechs from supplying Israel with weapons, having put an embargo on Israel in 1948, and threatening Israel in 1949, and throughout the 1950s (such as demanding that Israel ceed the Negev desert to the Egyptians.) But we digress.

[@dominiqueroudier9401]

2:09 Mystère 2C was a piece of💩. Only 150 built and used only by 5 and 10 EC. Heavy hours of maintenance and costly. Some crashes and issues. So after 3 years of use replaced by Mystère 4. At beginning this plane was like an improved Ouragan but🤔

[@showtime112]

So I guess Israelis did well to cancel their order :) I suppose it was a part of the learning process for Dassault. You need to make some crappy models to learn how not to do it and then you make better ones.

[@dominiqueroudier9401]

​@@showtime112now you know the continuation of Dassault ",s story😅

[@jovanlopez1660]

More videos please 🙏

[@showtime112]

There will be more, thank you for the positive comment!

[@gunner678]

Foreign Pilot training for the RAF was complex then. Arab nation pilots were at one end of the camp and Israelis at the other. Generally both groups were training on exactly the same equipment, instructors careful to avoid clashes.

[@showtime112]

I can imagine it must have been a rather complex organizational challenge :)

[@journeymancellist9247]

The music sounds like the Klingon theme from the first Star Trek movie.

[@bjornsmith9431]

Middle Eastern modern wars continue for 107 years, not peace in that region is in impossible .

[@showtime112]

A solution is quite hard to see

[@anubisRN555]

actually under ottoman rule they have peace for centuries till the French conquered Egypt Then Egypt and the Ottoman Empire fought each other for 20 years, then we had British troops come to Egypt, and the rest followed

[@franktreppiedi2208]

Nice graphics.

[@showtime112]

Thank you very much for the positive comment!

[@PappaBear_yt]

Great video, my friend! 👍🏻👏🏻💪🏻🍻🍻🙋🏼‍♂️

[@showtime112]

Happy to see you around, Pappa!

[@carlhicksjr8401]

Second comment: The British have a VERY complicated history with Israel, even more complicated than that of the US and Israel. They promised the Jews living in the Palestine Mandate Territory their own state, while at the same time promising the Arabs [who the British desperately needed to supply them oil] that they **wouldn't** support a Jewish state. And it buggered up the UK's plans mightily when Israel fought for and won its independence and statehood. So thereafter the UK supported most, but not all, Arab plans regarding Israel... She sold them arms at bargain-basement rates, she sent officers to train Arab forces, and no few British officers and men from all her services retired and took mercenary contracts to fight for this or that Arab state knowing full well that many of these states [especially Egypt and Syria] were hiding Nazi war criminals and that the forces they trained would aimed directly at Israel.

[@69columbus]

Wow...what an incoherent rant! Very entertaining.. please continue

[@carlhicksjr8401]

@@69columbus What was 'incoherent'? I said the UK has a 'very complicated' relationship with Israel and explained why. And every one of my assertions is factual. Feel free to look up any one of my statements. My premise begins with the 'Balfour White Paper' of 1917.

[@69columbus]

@@carlhicksjr8401 I reread your comments on this thread as you requested. I apologise for my reply. I literally wrote it on the fly and admit that it wasn't respectful.

[@carlhicksjr8401]

@@69columbus No worries. I took no offense at all. The subject of Israel and statehood is a hot-button one for a lot of people. That's why I try to stick to factual statements as much as possible. It's perfectly alright for two civil people to look at the same set of facts and disagree for perfectly valid reasons. 'I disagree' isn't a statement character or a personal attack. Thank you for your apology, but I assure you none was necessary.

[@69columbus]

@carlhicksjr8401 I completely agree with you. I think the Israeli-palestinian issue is one of the most polarising issues of our time. I hope that it can be resolved in an equitable way and that peace comes to both people soon. I also truly appreciate your calm and measured response. Peace friend

[@rev.dr.davidcole8915]

My father flew a Vampire jet in the RAF.

[@vonbraunwerner9067]

The Israeli MD-450 Ouragans got very rich and long careers. After French and Israeli service they were dumped to El Salvador, which retired the last of them in the early 1990's ! So the first french operational combat jet crossed the entire Cold War. Later Israel also dumped its SMB-2 to Honduras, and its Mirages & Neshers to Argentina. Wonder why their Mystere IVA never went to South America, too ?

[@showtime112]

Thanks for sharing info! That is an interesting question, maybe some viewer will be able to explain.

[@JoeCool_1962]

Mystère II was very dangerous, Mystère IV was safer Great video man

[@showtime112]

IV was a pretty good design. I'll explore its operational history in future videos.

[@staggabob]

"Diving from the sun and attacking the first Vampire" sounds like a scene from Blade.

[@adilsonvieiralopes8587]

Those planes had ejectable seats?

[@dominiqueroudier9401]

Yes, both

[@917guga]

Very interesting content aswell. I'm curios, where'do you get these mods of older jets for DCS?

[@showtime112]

Thank you for the positive comment! This video wasn't done in DCS but in War Thunder.

[@daviddanino8351]

כילד היינו מתרגשים מאד כשהגלוסטר מטאור שהיה בחיל האוויר היה עובר מעל חיפה ומרטיט את האוויר ואותנו מהתרגשות, לא נשכח לעולם.

[@yossital7128]

I wish to know about the animation of this movie and how was it made

[@showtime112]

Videos on this channel use flight simulations such as DCS World or War Thunder for the animation. Are you interested in any particular detail?

[@yossital7128]

@showtime112 I Myself fly in DCS but I never saw this aircraft's in it was wondering about it.

[@dominiqueroudier9401]

British planes vs...british planes😮😮

[@showtime112]

Yup. Not the first such case in history 😁

[@dominiqueroudier9401]

​@@showtime112and also Luftwaffe Bf109 vs ..🇨🇭swiss Bf109 😮

[@Damien-q8t]

Love it when you cover middle Eastern wars.👍👍👍​@showtime112

[@showtime112]

@@Damien-q8t And there's so much more left to cover 😁

[@Damien-q8t]

@showtime112 absloutley lots more to cover.😃👍👍

[@dominiqueroudier9401]

And if IAF could have F86 sabre😮👍👍??

[@showtime112]

I suppose, it wouldn't have been very different 😁

[@Ingulf_The_Mad]

God, I hate the Vampire, I don't know why. It's an annoying airplane. It reminds me of the jet-powered equivalent of the De Havilland DH 2.

[@showtime112]

It kinda does, I never noticed the connection 😁

[@Ingulf_The_Mad]

@@showtime112 lol intrusive thoughts of aviation enthusiasts.

[@guaporeturns9472]

I can’t imagine hating a plane😂

[@Ingulf_The_Mad]

@@guaporeturns9472 ikr? 🤣But it's not "hate"...it's more of a vague feeling of unease.

[@guaporeturns9472]

@ I get that..kinda the way the Mustang makes me feel

[@marcomarcon5802]

It doesn't matter which planes are involved, but the Israeli pilots always seem to have the upper hand over the Egyptians.

[@showtime112]

I guess they have to, they can't afford defeats.

[@anubisRN555]

@marcomarcon5802 in 1948, ww2 aces fought against Egyptian pilots who a lot of them didn't have or trained for dogfight, and actually, some of them didn't use aircraft cannons before the war In the following wars, you can see that Israel can't lose aircraft due to limited numbers of pilots and population in general Egypt is the opposite in 1967 they lost 90% of their aircraft and, in 2 years, purchased 250 new ones

[@byronbailey9229]

Single seat Vampire had no ejection seat

[@janlindtner305]

👍👍👍

[@showtime112]

Thank you very much for the positive comment!

[@1joshjosh1]

👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍

[@showtime112]

Thanks for yet another supportive comment!

[@janwitts2688]

This bold move.. lol ..

[@thesnazzycomet]

hell yeah

[@AnthonyHancock-s7v]

It was known as Great Britain in the 1950s .

[@alexclark5874]

In 1922, 26 counties of Ireland seceded to become the Irish Free State; a day later, Northern Ireland seceded from the Free State and returned to the United Kingdom. In 1927, the United Kingdom changed its formal title to the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland,[3] usually shortened to Britain and (after 1945) to the United Kingdom or UK

[@AnthonyHancock-s7v]

@@alexclark5874 I was already aware of the history, but we referred to ourselves as Great Britain during that period

[@alexclark5874]

@ it was and is perfect correct and right to call this country the united kingdom it was then and it is now.

[@daraorourke5798]

Eisenhower. The last US president with brains and guts.

[@Walkercolt1]

Oops, the Israeli Air Force flew PROPELLER DRIVEN Avia 2VA's (Me-109 with Spanish Hispano-Suiza engines) until 1958 when they bought retired F-86D Sabre Jets from the USAF. The Israeli pilots had a THIRTY-SIX TO ONE kill ratio over the RAF Sea Venom jet fighters (150 knots faster and MORE MANEUVERABLE than Avias, with six 20mm cannon vs. 2-20mm cannon and 4 .50 cal machine guns for the Avias). The RAF/RNAS had a numerical advantage of more than 200 to one...

[@showtime112]

You must be coming from an alternate universe 😁

[@hugocheung3833]

Is this DCS or War Thunder

[@showtime112]

War Thunder

[@byronbailey9229]

Pilot skill in evidence. IAF had seasoned fighter pilots from WW11. Egyptian pilots poorly trained in air combat manoeuvres. I flew the Vampire.

[@dante666jt]

Abdel Nasser was such a clown 🤡 😆

[@HamidShafiq-b8y]

Vampire was a useless British jet fighter

[@showtime112]

It was very far from useless when it came out, but the development of military aviation was so incredibly fast that any aircraft would get outdated in a few years.

[@Nedchilvs]

I'm guessing the Jewish pilots had gotten experience flying with the soviet air force during the war.

[@showtime112]

I don't think any of them came from the Soviet Air Force.

[@Nedchilvs]

@@showtime112 Quite a few came out of eastern Europe post war and joined the Yishuv

[@ediutama6836]

AND NOW, WITH ONLY CHEAP DRONES, THE YEMEN HOUTHIES THE MIGHTY AMERICAN AIRCRAFT CARRIERS HAVE BECOME USS SITTING DUCKS

[@ALIKN1-1]

5:15 it is always ISISreal starting

[@AdamAdamHDL]

This video only speaks on the air conflict, not the whole tactical scenario. There js no reason to believe either side is the instigator from this video. FYI. Gaza was not palestine at this time, Egypt has annexed the territory and raised their own flag, as Jordan had done in the west bank.

[@MobinBrown]

Go away

[@TheLincolnshireFlyer]

Another outstanding video. Thank you 😊

[@showtime112]

Thank you for all these comments!

[@branka1980]

❤

[@showtime112]

Hvala!