The Amazing Spider-Man Can't be Redeemed

I'm not an "engaged fan" anymore.
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[@WikiThis]

It’s kind of weird that a comic that was built on being somewhat grounded and relatable has become super over complicated.

[@NadeemShekh-uy9zn]

I have the exact same problem with recent Spider-Man movies as much as I love Spider-Man no way home and the animated spider verse movies I hope to god that the next mcu spider-man movie with tom holland is a back to basics Spider-Man story no multiverses and no infinite variants of Spider-Man I just want a good old fashion grounded Spider-Man film about him fighting crime in New York

[@NiCoNiCoNiCola]

Yeah, it was so relatable reading it as a teen, after coming back from a hard day at school, knowing that tomorrow I will do the same, probably fight against my best friend's insane father, a russian immigrant enfatuated by rhinos or maybe even fight against a black sludge that loves/hates me

[@andrewadams4815]

Didn’t Superman and Batman comics also start that way too and if anything they’re more super over complicated than Spider-Man ever will be.

[@ayrtonjoga]

I hope No Way Home keeps being a "once in a life time" event for the live action movies, I'm already done with the multiverse and just want the relatable/grounded spidey drama back

[@andrewadams4815]

@@ayrtonjoga Seeing as DC just released The Flash impossible the worst part is when those comics started out they were more grounded and relatable than Spidey’s but now they’re far more super over complicated even when they’re good which isn’t often anymore.

[@shonbera5246]

"I have to do what Peter Parker can't anymore.... move on." That straight up broke me.

[@whattheworldneedsiscreativ6421]

Peter Parker No More!

[@monkiking778]

Fr

[@spider-man9118]

this is why you should do everything in moderation and not put all your faith in people, because in the words of confetti, "people suck." 8 It is better to trust in the Lord Than to put confidence in man. 9 It is better to trust in the Lord Than to put confidence in princes. Psalm 118:8-9 reject lust, embrace God Also, we have various types of evidence for biblical events, if anyone is interested

[@jeggsonvohees2201]

Mendoza still has Miles, he'll be okay.

[@BugsyFoga]

Sad to think that bright bit optimism you had 5 years ago for Spencer’s run got completely crushed, I know that feeling all too well with the things I’m passionate about.

[@imnotkiddingg]

rest in peace, star wars

[@govnorelven4036]

​@@imnotkiddinggNah on the contrary star wars animated has always been as amazing as ever. Wonder if tales of Jedi is gonna get another entry. Maybe some of the stories in visions are gonna get expanded upon. Ahsoka is looking to be a star wars rebels sequel in live action. But speaking of star wars, this is a pretty weird take, as long as good content comes out nothing's really gonna change and starwars still is pretty much thriving.

[@MilestheDirtyMindedGoblin2099]

Very sad 😢

[@imnotkiddingg]

@@govnorelven4036 gurl i love ur optimism maybe u have a point lol animation department stays carrying, i just mean the way ppl feel about it is different its been polarized and nobody's excited abt the new rey movies, like luke skywalker is DEAD remember that

[@TacosAreWizard]

@@imnotkiddingg I’m excited about the film because it’s not going to be trying to redo the OG trilogy and focus on being it’s own thing. When ROSW ended I felt like I wanted to see what was going to happen next for the first time during the sequel trilogy. It’s a shame that so many won’t give it a chance because of the messy trilogy.

[@chrislister570]

I've come to a new appreciation for Superman, because he is the superhero who's allowed to grow and get married and have children. Everyone says Superman is so unrelatable, but ironically he has become the relatable character Peter Parker used to be.

[@looniemoonie5955]

But he's unrelatable. I can't relate to Sun God who's immortal and possess dozens of powers. For example, money aside, I can relate to Batman who worked to the top of his physique. I can relate to Spider-Man, loser with no job, who can still get shot if he doesn't react quick enough. But I can't relate to Sups, because he's "this needs to be done? Done" character

[@superioridiot3846]

​@looniemoonie5955 But there is relatability tho; he's a man who tries to fit into a world that differs from him. He, despite his objective superiority, almost always tries to help and find the good in people. He fights for everyone, good or bad. There are aspects of relatability with Superman as a character. Just like there's relatability with nearly every character. To argue otherwise is silly at best. Misinfo at worst.

[@lazaroskarmaniolas7410]

​@looniemoonie5955 You can relate to a psychotic, violent, billionaire madman who dresses like a bat? You can relate to someone who was just born with the perfect genes to achieve physical perfection? You can relate to someone who just mastered centuries worth of multipule sciences in 20 years? Man, shut up. Batman is a Gary Stu. Literally worse than Rey Skywalker. Y'all are just dumb manchildren that deny reality. Just like Batman himself.

[@jurassickaiju14]

It's almost amazing how much of an inverse Clark is to Peter at this point. He's been in a married relationship with Lois for literal decades now, and not even the New 52 retcon could wash it away forever. They have a son whom they love and has grown up to be a hero in his own right, and they recently took in more kids. I'm not caught up on the most recent comics, but they really seem to be pushing the Superman Family aspect, having all members of the Kent family and even extended family and friends, like Connor Kent or John Henry Irons or Kong Kenan, all of them working together closely. It hasn't been an easy journey. Clark has struggles just like everyone else, powers notwithstanding. But he and his family actually get to be _happy._ "Relatability" is one of those writing aspects that I've come to think people need to be more careful with, and I'm of the opinion that it doesn't always have to rely on pain or suffering in a character. Trials build character, yes, but piling on too much troubles can just drown a story in misery. And by now, Peter Parker is all but lying at the bottom of the ocean.

[@chrislister570]

@@looniemoonie5955 People just parrot the line that Superman is unrelatable because they've heard it so often that the whole thing has just become a big circular argument. He had to work to build a healthy and mutually respectful and loving relationship with Lois. He's constantly having to make excuses to sneak away that affect his relations and his standing with his boss negatively, and was doing it decades before Peter Parker was. He's a dad for crying out loud; how is that not relatable? Personally I find him a lot more relatable than Batman, who has more money than the global GDP and a bigger budget than the entire US military. He can somehow own a never ending arsenal of superweapons that includes things like a suit of armor powered my miniaturized red giants; a never ending fleeting of disposable military grade land, marine, and air vehicles; high tech secret bases and safe houses everywhere on earth, satellites in orbit, and secret bases and labs on the moon containing enough firepower to actually detonate the entire moon; and all that without putting a noticeable dent in his bank account. You think that is relatable but Superman isn't?! And his powers are not a magic instawin button. Bulletproof skin or the ability to fly do magically solve every conceivable problem, and has frequently been pushed to the brink and beyond by villains like Brainiac, Darkseid Lex Luthor, etc. And there are many other popular characters that are as power as Superman, like Goku, Thor, or Hulk; but nobody ever says they're unrelatable. There is no amount of punishment Wolverine can't heal from, and he has even recovered from being reduced to nothing but his skeleton, and yet I never heard anyone claim Wolverine isn't relatable. People don't think Superman is unrelatable because he's too powerful. They say that because they are mindlessly parroting everyone else they've heard say it, who in turn are also mindlessly parroting what they've heard.

[@anothergamer112]

This man made a Spider-Man video talking about its downfall without so much as mentioning Paul. What a legend.

[@Double-R-Nothing]

Who?

[@cbrock5529]

@@Double-R-Nothingbe glad you don’t know.

[@aguywithalotofopinions412]

_Shaking my fist angrily_ PAAAAAUUUUULLLLL

[@pyrosianheir]

And honestly, he didn't need to. As cool as it was seeing the Sinister 66 (or whatever you want to call them) all coming for Peter and him somehow handling them, it was in service to a plot that dragged WAY too long and ultimately went... kinda nowhere. If they'd at least actually reversed OMD, that'd be one thing, but they didn't. Spencer half-teased it, only for everything to be thrown out so Ben Reilly could be Spider-man for a while again before even getting to Paul.

[@zillafire101]

PAAAAUL!!! PAUL, ILL CHASE YOU TO THE ENDS OF THE WORLD, PAAAAAAUUUUL!!

[@sheldonlarmond6217]

More and more I see people saying "Miles is the spider-man people care about now," and looking strictly at the comic runs both are getting, I really see why. Miles is at least getting to learn and grow and do new things, whereas Peter just...well, watch the video.

[@galactic85]

Yep. Comic miles still needs some better villains and I think giving him his own clone saga was a mistake but the spider-verse movie was great as well as his game and since he is a younger character it's clear that he has more potential to grow and develop. He's simply more intriguing because he has a different home life and family dynamics. His relationship with uncle Aaron alone makes him more intriguing than Peter.

[@Padlock_Steve]

peter exists to suffer

[@tomasavendanozacarias5205]

also, Miles has the best movies

[@giftig9329]

​@@tomasavendanozacarias5205 spiderman 2 se viola a las dos animadas

[@classiest]

@@tomasavendanozacarias5205 Spider-Man 2 is still the best comic book movie unfortunately

[@gabrielperez4184]

That must be crushing, being forced to create a story you don’t want to create and being blamed for the idea. It honestly makes me feel bad for Zebb and what he must be going through.

[@tracark2255]

Thats true. But even without the executive meddling Zebs writing is still pretty bad sadly. which is disappointing cause i like his ant man stuff a little bit

[@Ando1428]

True. I'm pretty sure he apologized before all of this shit hit the fan. I decided to simply blame marvel going forward. I hadn't read the run I just got tid bits here and there. Thor and venom have been my highlights so far.

[@gabrielperez4184]

@@Ando1428 honestly my favorite run right now is Moon Knight by Jed McKay and Ghost Rider by Peter Benjamin, I wish more people talked about Marvels good runs, but Spider-Man gets all the press.

[@winterv.4715]

It is especially bad in this case cause this is the Spider Man fandom we’re talking about. You know, the people that tried to sue Insomniac cause they took out some puddles? If I was Zebb, I’d be fearing for my LIFE rn

[@Ando1428]

@@gabrielperez4184 well that's because he's popular. Black widow had quite a few good runs I heard since civil war 2. Hadn't had the chance to catch up for her. I liked the inhumans but I hadn't picked up anything since the black funeral.

[@hexenbex]

616 Spider-Man has been many things to us throughout the years. A role model, an icon, a cool superhero with a cool costume. But as we got older, he became more than that. He became a voice to us. Who spoke to us through his hardships and struggles and pushed us through our accomplishments and triumphs. It’s like he was an old friend whom we admired and looked to for guidance and comfort. But as of late? It’s like seeing that friend being abused and mistreated so badly, all because the people that shelter him either don’t care or care too much that they keep him to themselves. We as fans see how much it’s affecting him. And it hurts.

[@MILDMONSTER1234]

Venom keeps getting Ws while Pete stays getting Ls….. crazy.

[@matti.8465]

Peter can't even be married while Eddie and Venom are living their best life

[@BSM-vw6cf]

​@matti.8465 kinda, definitely better than Peter though.

[@PurposelessRabbitholes]

Great (and depressing) breakdown of both the specific ridiculousness of recent spidey and the effect narrative stagnation can have on even the most dedicated reader

[@teeemtee5739]

What's sad? Is that meanwhile at DC, Nightwing is finally getting the immense respect he deserves. He canonically surpassed Batman to become a better leader, fighter and overall hero of the verse. He's also leading the Justice League while the founding members are away, The heroes all agreed there was no other choice. I've always said that Spider-Man and Nightwing are Marvel's and DC's versions of the same character or at least as closest possible. If one hugely influential fan favorite character can get through respect they deserve why can't the other? It seems Marvel's inability to let Peter Parker grow Is the only answer.

[@pewdiejunior5928]

Nightwing is a joke

[@Benji568]

Tom Taylor is writing the Nightwing books now. He previously wrote a lot of the Injustice comic run from 2012 or 13 and he really has shown that most of the time he can MASTERFULLY handle DC characters. Yes okay in the Injustice storyline, Dick Grayson dies in a very shockingly stupid way but I don't think that was Tom's fault and it was probably Dan Didio or whoever was in charge of the books at the time who told him to write that shit, like "We gotta kill Nightwing" and they're like "Okay... why? And how?" and then "I don't care how or why, he's got to die in this story." But all in all, Nightwing is in great hands right now. It's on par with the Scott Snyder's run of Batman books for the New 52. Tom Taylor is an excellent writer. Hope they bring him on board for the movies.

[@psnfailout000]

I'm fairly certain Nightwing will never be a greater fighter than Batman.

[@Benji568]

@psnfailout000 True, Nightwing does rely on his acrobatics and his speed but Batman's reaction times and his brawling fighting moves are insanely powerful.

[@yurifairy2969]

@@psnfailout000 Batman isn't even the best fighter without superpowers at DC.

[@webslinger827]

Imagine how Spencer's run must've felt to guys like me who didn't even know much about the history it was trying to retcon. At some point I was just lost and didn't care to finish it

[@ianbruno237]

Don’t worry if your a fan you’ll end up reading those, not everything needs to be for newer fams

[@betaraybillfan1750]

Well you’re a miles fan and 80% of his stories are ripped from peter so you probably weren’t that lost!

[@RosePinkInk]

That’s the worst part about the run. It’s final 5 issues are completely unreadable to anyone who didn’t read a twenty year old story and a 30 year old story.

[@Jiub_SN]

@@ianbruno237 yeah, but not everything has to be convoluted and straight retcons. New readers are still picking up these books, there has to be a balance that these don't have

[@KillerTacos54]

sadly even though it had a clear trajectory that it was heading toward, editorial shut that down prematurely - as they tend to do

[@nikhilkapoor428]

This is truly the best “Spider-Man No More” adaptation of all time. Great work, my man.

[@StoneAxeArky]

It's kind of funny how Peter B. Parker from the Spiderverse films, who initially comes across as kind of a shlub, grows more as a character in the span of two movies than Peter Parker has in the mainstream comic series in a long time. I will also add that Marvel could very easily choose to let Peter Parker grow up again, considering we have the younger Miles Morales in the main universe and several other spider people as well that could please the younger demographic. But instead they choose to perpetually keep Peter in a stage of arrested development.

[@spider-man9118]

this is why you should do everything in moderation and not put all your faith in people, because in the words of confetti, "people suck." 8 It is better to trust in the Lord Than to put confidence in man. 9 It is better to trust in the Lord Than to put confidence in princes. Psalm 118:8-9 reject lust, embrace God Also, we have various types of evidence for biblical events, if anyone is interested

[@The-Beyonder]

​@@spider-man9118post all the evidence you have please

[@miguelmaturino2516]

@@spider-man9118 This isn't the place for Biblical Discourse. Sharing your faith happens through deep relationships with real people, not in internet threads with somebody you will never meet.

[@spider-man9118]

@@miguelmaturino2516just trying to get the word out, my fellow (Zoomer?) believer

[@GreenGoblinsOckVenom]

Frankly his story of Aunt May dying and him divorcing Mary Jane is what should've happened in the comics instead of making a deal with a demon.

[@NerdyKirikai]

Holy crap that final monologue spoke to me as a huge Spidey fan. I love the adaptations of this character, but I’ve also become quite jaded to the comic book as of recently. It’s the reason why I mainly read IDW sonic and Shonen Jump manga. Because those stories felt like they were going somewhere. Hell, it’s why I read all of invincible and loved it even more than Spider-Man Superheroes deserve better respect

[@kurodoodle4876]

It sucks when the fantastic four and more recently even the X-Men are allowed to change and evolve yet not Spider-Man

[@outermeowven]

@@kurodoodle4876 whats the current x-men run?

[@matti.8465]

Hell yeah, IDW Sonic mentioned!

[@kurodoodle4876]

@@outermeowven Sorry I haven't seen this sooner dude. So after a couple years of the X-Men comics being stagnant, a writer named Jonathan Hickman essentially did a semi soft reboot of the title that asked the question of what if mutants finally fought back against their oppressors and started a new nation, formulating their own language and culture? While the mutant species having a new nation isn't a new idea, Hickman made it to where the comic went full force on the concept. His run began in 2019 and ended roughly around 2021 but the impact still remained as he allowed his team to continue on with the story. Basically, the X-Men are currently in what is known as the "Krakoan era" named after the island the nation was founded upon.

[@spider-man9118]

this is why you should do everything in moderation and not put all your faith in people, because in the words of confetti, "people suck." 8 It is better to trust in the Lord Than to put confidence in man. 9 It is better to trust in the Lord Than to put confidence in princes. Psalm 118:8-9 reject lust, embrace God Also, we have various types of evidence for biblical events, if anyone is interested

[@majingojira]

The idea that they made Pete a character that people outgrow is probably the most damning thing in this video. A true observation, and a wicked line.

[@spider-man9118]

this is why you should do everything in moderation and not put all your faith in people, because in the words of confetti, "people suck." 8 It is better to trust in the Lord Than to put confidence in man. 9 It is better to trust in the Lord Than to put confidence in princes. Psalm 118:8-9 reject lust, embrace God Also, we have various types of evidence for biblical events, if anyone is interested

[@kruegerpoolthe13th]

I truly feel bad for these writers Could you imagine being forced to compromise your vision for a story? That’s so sad There’s nothing worse for a story than becoming stale because even when something is bad it can still be something of note or at least something to learn from but this is just sad

[@onemariobro]

The fact that Spider-Verse had him get a real divorce and kill off aunt may and then later made Peter a dad and everyone loves it feels fitting how marvel is shitting the bed

[@icedcapplord710]

This current Spider-Man run actually made miss Dan Slott. It achieved the damn near impossible Crazy thing is Chip Zdarsky was like the perfect choice for Amazing too. Spider-Man's appearances in his Daredevil run wrote him as a more put together, matured person than in his own ongoing, and his Spectacular run is the kind of stuff I love about how his stakes vary so much in scope like he's superhero Seinfeld. Its actually depressing

[@runbaa9285]

His storytelling isn't always the best, but Dan Slott consistently has good ideas that shake up the status quo and basically force Peter to grow up. Dan Slott's a thousand times better than Zeb Wells...

[@Dreadwing1000]

@@runbaa9285 that is when Slott isn’t being reductive & writing Peter as a man-child Slott’s writing had a lot of highs, but it had some pretty rough lows too

[@andrewli6606]

Spider-Man in Daredevil is like the biggest badass.

[@guillesuperior]

Chip won’t do it, he knows that the job would just drain his soul

[@Underhaven]

@@runbaa9285 Man, the standards are really lowering for this character.

[@andrews4717]

Well you see Xavier I can give you back the Spider-Man you remember on one condition You give up your marriage. Muahahaha

[@GodzillaMendoza]

Not today, Satan!

[@beachgirl_bev]

I was not expecting an emotional editorial about growing out of things we loved as children but damn

[@spider-man9118]

this is why you should do everything in moderation and not put all your faith in people, because in the words of confetti, "people suck." 8 It is better to trust in the Lord Than to put confidence in man. 9 It is better to trust in the Lord Than to put confidence in princes. Psalm 118:8-9 reject lust, embrace God Also, we have various types of evidence for biblical events, if anyone is interested

[@randomgamer625]

@@spider-man9118-_-

[@spider-man9118]

@@randomgamer625 what

[@randomgamer625]

@@spider-man9118 -_- you tell me

[@dastanovich2476]

This is the perfect video describing how Spider-Man felt like to me for quite some time. When the editorial keeps messing with my 3 favorite characters, being Ben Reilly, Pete and MJ, I don't have any drive to continue reading their stories. Mini-series like Humanity Agenda are great, but at the end of the day that's all they are, short stories that have "conclusions". All while the main book will continue to stagnate, eventually either getting a full-on reboot or outliving us all

[@bartoszdulas1703]

Shame that Zdarsky didn't want to continue writing on Spidey since no one understood what Spidey stories should be like more than him. Spider-Man Life Story and his run Spectacular are masterpieces.

[@ThorgisArcade]

People have asked me for years why I stopped reading Marvel and DC, and this video is point by point every reason I had to give up. Spidey is the worst example of it but this is how so much of comics work now and it just isn't fun anymore. So thanks for making this, it felt good to hear someone else put these thoughts into words.

[@clicksclacks]

Comics from the big two as a whole, particularly over the last decade or so, have had so many retcons, reboots, recharacterizations, etc. that it reached a point where every tease for a big event or change had my stomach in knots; I was just dreading what stupid thing would come and snatch away a character or run I enjoyed. I pretty much checked out when Marvel had The King in Black being the umpteenth event to derail multiple books I was reading while DC did the same with Dark Knights: Death Metal which was clearly leading into yet ANOTHER universe reboot... About the only good thing that came of the latter was Super Boy Prime getting a proper redemption and happy ending, so I took the meta hint and decided to stop reading to make sure things stayed that way.

[@marcosdheleno]

this is the reason that, while i love the characters, i hate the media. the fact characters arent allowed to grow and develop, instead just being rubberbanded back to the starting line after a few years because of status quo just feels like a massive waste of time and money.

[@TevyaSmolka]

@@marcosdheleno that's true and you're right about that sadly

[@spider-man9118]

this is why you should do everything in moderation and not put all your faith in people, because in the words of confetti, "people suck." 8 It is better to trust in the Lord Than to put confidence in man. 9 It is better to trust in the Lord Than to put confidence in princes. Psalm 118:8-9 reject lust, embrace God Also, we have various types of evidence for biblical events, if anyone is interested

[@TevyaSmolka]

@@clicksclacks except dc actually good stuff right now like Jeremy adams flash run is amazing

[@davidhall7497]

As someone who’s had many passions devolve into toxic or untenable relationships, this video hits home so hard. When you stand up for your principles and abandon the things that brought you joy, it’s the toughest feeling in the world. The comic industry is accelerating their death at rapid speeds by kneecapping the development of their most popular characters for the sake of “status quo” or “universe reset”. Thank you for this video, and I sincerely hope you take time with the things that bring you joy, rather than drudging through misery ragging on Zeb Well’s run like the rest of the Internet lol.

[@KaminoKatie]

The manga industry has clapped them so hard, it's pathetic

[@kingofhearts3185]

Well said, I feel the same way. It's why I jumped ship to Japanese stories instead.

[@Tyler_W]

​@@KaminoKatie and it's all because they're not only doing what the American industry used to be great at, but they've actually learned how to adapt to their business model to the demands of the modern market. The American industry started going astray when it stopped being run by salt of the earth people who had business savvy and just wanted to tell a good story.

[@Nick_261]

I just wanted to say, thank you Xavier. I've been following you pretty much since the beginning and, being pretty much the same age, I always felt so connected to you and your videos genuinely feel so cozy. I'm not lying, at least once every few weeks I'll binge the whole Spider-Man games retrospective, and you have seriously been someone I look up to for the longest time. I know this comment doesn't have much to do with the video (even though I whole-heartedly agree with you), but I just wanted to thank you for basically being like a slightly younger brother I've never had. Just another kid who shares the same passions as me. My girlfriend's pregnant and I've genuinely considered naming my kid Xavier and I KNOW IT'S WEIRD but that's just how much you as a person mean to me! I'm sure we'll never meet but still, I felt I had to tell you all of this for some reason heh :)

[@rubencabral1838]

This was a really beautiful comment friend, thanks for sharing and congratulations on your kid

[@Ninjatoad13]

Lo p😊

[@guto5285]

That so cute!

[@fishtanksamurai7786]

That's awesome!

[@anjel1433]

I just wrote a comment like this with out knowing you did the same thing a couple hours before me. We on the same vibe me and you

[@fanficlover]

This is so true. It's reason's like these that I typically stick to media like TV and Manga because at the very least the characters have the chance to grow and develop a story that could be good instead of trying to cram every idea a person can think of into one never ending story and ruining the flow of what was once special. Stories need endings.

[@iantwogood1142]

This video was well worth the wait. Your thoughts are really well articulated and I honestly think a lot of folks in the fandom would benefit from doing what you've done and just move on from ASM. Its not worth the time it takes to read it. Life is too short to waste on something that makes you feel angry and/or empty. Thank you for coming to my Tedtalk

[@luigikiller123]

I like to think the spider-girl comics are canon, cause thats the closest we will get to see Peter grow as a character, becoming a parent and loving husband and once in awhile helping mayday out with being a hero.

[@Tyler_W]

Renew Your Vows existed too, and that was mostly solid.

[@orlandojosemoraamaya363]

But that Peter died in spiderverse comics

[@kingofthegundam7974]

How is it that Superman comics are having their best time in decades while everyone else is suffering?!?

[@NewAlchemychan]

It’s crazy that the run ultimately retconned Sins Past because JMS wanted to do that with One More Day so he could get a victory out of writing the story but those in charge wouldn’t let him

[@joshstephens413]

I think Linkara stated it best when he said that the editorial at Marvel is a giant group of infantile manchildren that refuse to grow up and therefore refuse to allow their characters to grow up. That is paraphrasing from Linkara, sure, but it is basically how he and a bunch of people that used to like Marvel feel.

[@webslinger827]

You know what pains me most about the current run by Wells is that I can't even identify what the point is. With most stories, even shit ones, you can usually pinpoint an arc or a theme somewhere. Even Spencer's storyline was trying to build towards SOMETHING plot wise. Feels like the only thing this story has are dumb and "shocking" moments designed to rile up the fanbase

[@koushikraja331]

Wally West and Miles Morales are pointing at Peter from a corner and laughing.

[@Zero-hopper]

Barry:you too Peter:yes

[@JustSomeMexicanwithaMustache]

I am a big fan of Spider-Man, ever since I was a kid. I watched all his movies, TV shows, and played the games, but I never read the comic. I did read the Spider-Girl comic in the library and I loved it. I remember thinking this was the current Spider-Man comic run, and I was excited at the idea of the movies or TV Shows eventually adapting this. Later I was disappointed to learn that this wasn't the main comic universe. The only time I was interested in reading the main comic was when Shattered Dimensions came out, and I wanted to read the comic version of those characters to learn more about them. My dad got me some old issues of the Amazing Spider-Man, and gave me volume 6 of Ultimate Spider-Man (the one with Venom). I was only interested in collecting all of Ultimate Spider-Man, as that seem like the easiest thing actually do, but I never got around to it. Now in present time, I can never see myself buying a Spider-Man comic. The character I love so much is ruined because of people behind the scenes who want to make Peter Parker "relatable". Any progression the character tried to had since the 90's has always been stopped. The Clone Saga was made just so Peter and MJ can start a family, with Ben Reilly taking up the mantle of Spider-Man. Only to end with Ben to dying, Norman coming back from the dead, Peter and MJ losing the baby, and Aunt May coming back from the dead. Peter and MJ were happily married, with Ultimate Spider-Man telling stories of a younger of the character. What does Marvel do? They made Peter make a deal with the devil to undo his marriage, just so he can save his Aunt May's Life. They did all of this because they wanted Peter to be "relatable" even though they were making a comic with a younger Spider-Man. I find it so funny that the games and movies are doing a better job at growing Spider-Man as a character. Aunt May dies in the PlayStation video game, in the Spider-Verse movie, and in the MCU. Peter is married, happy, and has a baby in Across the Spider-Verse. Meanwhile the comics refuses to grow Peter as a character. Superman has a son now, but Spider-Man can't have children? The only hope I have is that the popularity of baby Mayday will make the higher ups allow Peter and MJ to finally have a daughter in the main comics.

[@darkknightfan7520]

This video resonated with me a lot Xavier, I feel like we’ve grown up together through shared maturity and burnout on caped comics for better or worse. It is unfortunate, but Peter Parker isn’t worth getting invested in anymore.

[@gorechomp6050]

Sad but true 😔

[@wyatttalley2233]

“Peter Parker isn’t worth getting invested in anymore.” Horrific, god-awful, shit-tier take. A few trashy comic runs isn’t enough reason to completely disregard the decades of legendary storytelling and cultural influence that we’ve had from this character.

[@linkfan6555]

I feel like there intentionally trying to destroy the character so we’ll just focus on Miles and they won’t have to write Peter. Idk

[@benwasserman8223]

@@wyatttalley2233 Bingo. You can say you’re not a fan of the current run. I understand some of the arguments why. But someone will eventually take over for Zeb Wells and write a different storyline. And if that run does well, post-mortem videos like these will be really dated in a few years.

[@brandonlyon730]

@@wyatttalley2233 Still it's hard to root for a character when Marvel keeps constantly evoke the status quo of making Peter constantly miserable and a single man who won’t grown up. It was annoying when they did that in the clone saga, it's was annoying when they did it in One more day, and it's annoying here. Though I’m more mad at Marvel themselves the Peter, because clueless editors are afraid of any sort of change.

[@radiant_ways0746]

While I do disagree over how Spencer's run was terrible, I do agree that the end was pretty bad. However I think the way Spencer characterizes Peter and his supporting cast was excellent and stayed true to who they are, especially with how Peter rightfully gets pissed off with Norman and how he used MJ to capture Kindred

[@slash.slayer]

I think his run gets way too much hate because of the ending lmao. Sure, it started dragging a lot because of the editorial, but the beginning of the run(firat 25 issues or so) is exactly what Xavier said he was hoping to receive

[@mangooverdose3204]

I completely agree, spencer's characterization of the cast was great imo, and the humor was spot on in the early issues

[@joshuanelson6795]

Absolutely. I think Nick Spencer wrote Peter Parker and his supporting cast far better than Dan Slott did and I maintain that it was a really solid (if imperfect) run until it cratered at the end.

[@demonteprice5870]

Need another follow-up vid for the first ten issue's of the new Ultimate (once ten issues have passed).

[@elusivegrain9162]

Wow....this was quite an emotional video I wasn't expecting it at all. While I initially thought you'd mostly go over the Well's run, it really paints to me two things: How much you've matured and respect comic writers and how the problems for this run started going downhill before Wells. Especially the whole Harry shenanigans. As an outsider of the comics, you've really shown me how frustrating this Spider-Man can be. While this may be my optimism speaking, I do think there'll be a writer who can steer away from this "cycle" that honestly won't show any signs of character bias. But only time will tell

[@depsoul1604]

I liked the Straczynski run. The mysticism there was just more charming than the whole Paul thing. Lots of MJ/Pete moments too to cleanse your eyes.

[@lynntaylor9681]

Me too. It was my favorite run of the series.

[@calebbilling4984]

That initial "Will-they-won't-they" aspect had me on the edge of my seat for issue after issue. I've never had a comic make me feel so invested in a relationship like that. Then the issue dropped where they Do decide to give it another go, and I felt a rush of joy that I don't think I've ever really felt from reading a comic afterwards. Now that, that was some quality stuff.

[@TheVileOne]

Sins Past

[@depsoul1604]

@@TheVileOne One More Day too, sadly

[@cantthinkofaname5046]

@@TheVileOneto be fair, that was marvel editorials fault and the writer didn’t want to do sins past or OMD

[@Ib10.]

You can’t call him Spider-MAN if he never grows up…😪

[@Max44321]

The main problem lies in that the (sometimes) writers, and (definitely) the people in charge forget what it's like to be a kid, to be young, to not be an old and bitter rich person. They can't relate to anything or realize how people other than them think.

[@Tyler_W]

Unless you're talking about the Disney executives, nobody at Marvel Comics is getting rich doing what they do. They don't sell well enough for that, and it's not because they couldn't be. It's because the industry hasn't adapted their business model to the modern market, don't give a rip about what customers and fans they still have, they don't humble themselves enough to learn the right lessons from the success of their competitors (I don't mean DC, and I don't just mean manga), and they keep keep chasing gimmicks and social media fads thinking that's what's gonna get them new readers. As to the actual point of your comment, spot on.

[@kendee_]

Shout out to the Spider-Verse team for giving us the 35+ girl dad Peter that we deserve.

[@windghost2]

Agreed!

[@Palidor]

We already had one of those, twice in different universes. The one where Pete is retired and his daughter Mayday Parker is Spider-Girl and the other is from 'Renew your Vows' where Peter and MJ have a daughter, Annie May Parker and they all fight crime together.

[@alextricoverload]

I understand a hero has to suffer, but holy shit. It's like Marvel considers Peter Parker being happy as a war crime or something.

[@MarioSonicBee]

You know, Spider-Man comics could’ve been so much more than what they are now. So much missed potential due to bad writing and decisions. If it were up to me I would’ve kept Peter and MJ married and given them two kids, (Mayday being 5 and Ben being practically a newborn). We could keep Paul but make him fall in love with Carly, focus on the actual people in Peter’s life besides MJ and his family if they feel like it’s gone stale. I honestly wished this was the status quo for Peter as it would be interesting to see how this would react to storylines like Superior Spider-Man, ANAD etc. So much potential gone because Marvel is scared to show their flagship character act his age.

[@andrews4717]

At one point during this video I got a ad for headache medicine and I think that was directed towards you man. Hope you’re doing better pal

[@wdcain1]

I appreciate what Nick Spencer was trying. Despite the problems, there were a lot of really enjoyable stuff. 1) The stories not about Kindred are good. Randy and Janice's relationship and their dads' responses felt like a good old story. 2) The demonic spider squad was such a powerful image. That cover is in my top 10 for Spider-Man ones. 3) The scene where Norman realized Ghost Spider was a parallel Gwen was really intense and nerve-wrecking. 4) The attempts to fix some bad stories were necessary. _Sins Past_ and Queenpin Felicia should have been fixed long ago. 5) Gibbon's death uniting all the animal-theme villains unite as an army under Vulture's leadership was so powerful. 6) I love these cool throwbacks to older villains like Slyde, the Tri-Sintinel, Sin-Eater, and the Lethal Legion. 7) The new villain teams (Sinister Syndicate, Savage Six, and the Sinful Six) are great additions to Spider-Man's rogues. 8) It was so wonderful to see Peter act mature and caring again after about a decade of Slott writing him as a man-child. The biggest problem is the pacing. Kurt Busiek did tons of fix stories during his Avengers run. The _Avengers Forever_ maxi is literally nothing but twelve issues of retcons to fix weird/bad stories. But he succeeded because his fixes were backed by cool action and character work; and were fairly easy to understand instead of going point-by-point to explain every single detail. Doing that just makes the comic feel more convoluted. In short, Spencer's run was great ideas with bad execution due to editorial mandate.

[@damienlarson4145]

Peter being the young superhero in the modern age is stupid because he grow and changed over the course his story and we already have a young Spiderman of the modern age and his name is Miles Morales.

[@KenMasters.]

No, it's Peter's own kids. F@%k Miles!

[@cartoonishidealism582]

Just let him be an adult! Let him get married, have a kid, deal with juggling his responsibilities as Spider-Man with his responsibilities as a parent, a husband, a teacher! If you still wanna tell stories about high school drama, about college aged drama, MILES IS RIGHT THERE. Let Peter grow up for God’s sake.

[@damienlarson4145]

@@cartoonishidealism582 I know right, Marvel made Reed and Sue parents, They made some of their X men characters into parents and They even made Venom and Deadpool dads But, Spiderman is where they draw the line.

[@futureboy314]

Tapping out at 21:46 because I’m worried about permanent brain damage. Thanks for taking the hit!

[@GodzillaMendoza]

I read it so you don't have to!

[@futureboy314]

@@GodzillaMendoza follow-up question based on your video and title: should spider-man be over? I mean obviously he will never be allowed to rest so long as there's money to be made, but should he?

[@GodzillaMendoza]

@@futureboy314 Maybe the original continuity can end. Like I said in the video, I find Transformers and TMNT appealing because they know when to stop and reboot so the stories stay more fresh

[@MarcanMC]

I know it sounds stupid, but this video made me shed a tear at the end

[@GodzillaMendoza]

That actually means a lot and I'm glad you connected with it like that

[@BrooklynAvenue]

Enjoyed your take as to how you age while Peter stays the same. Try doing it at 59. I'm supposed to be 18 year younger than Peter Parker.

[@MWhaleK]

I mostly agree with you and as a MJ fan as long time Spidey fan, the worst part is that the editors/creators seemingly can't let go or make their mind. They HAVE to keep bringing back Gwen and MJ, keep teasing fan with the possibility of Peter getting back together with MJ. It's like the madness of social media where people act as toxic and hateful as possible, because that is what get the most engagement and gets the most rewards, has taken over. At this point, as some one who has always liked Marvel more then DC? I am seriously considering switching teams. Because the whole Dawn of DC thing with Stargirl and kids form the Golden Age of Comics seems a lot better than anything Marvel is up to.

[@Jay_SGE]

That apology you issued in the beginning was brilliant and hats off to you my man! That part about not wanting to be in either camp RESONATED with me. Geek culture consumers are too quick to complain and insult. There’s barely any room for real discourse anymore

[@litiangparra6799]

I think this is why I have grown into liking other characters more, I had my time being a teen, I'm growing up into a young adult and there are other characters that I want to inspire to be, like optimis Prime, or captain America, or superman, their comics are actually doing something different, and stay true to who they are, spider-man isn't moving at all he keeps taking too many steps back and the higher up at marvel will NEVER let him grow, and it hurts seeing my favorite hero as a kid being left in the dust while others are moving on, i want to still love the og but his alternate version from the movies and games are just.....better.

[@nickasaro8789]

Exactly. With Superman and Cap, there’s still a status quo but they’re way better at shaking it up. Like there are two active Caps now. And Superman and Lois are married and he’s a dad. Even if I know some or all of it will be undone somehow, it’s stuff like that that’s fun while it lasted. And with the constant Transformers reboots, I appreciate new people trying to take big swings with characters like Prime even if it doesn’t always work. But it feels like Spidey doesn’t have that anymore and just feels like a series of people trying to paper over other people’s mistakes

[@ZenCoachingGuru]

One of the things I love about the invincible comic is that changes stay permeant, feels like what I’m reading has weight and meaning to it

[@wdcain1]

It was cool to see the damage inflicted by an alien attack early in the run was still being dealt with twenty issues later.

[@tjjordan4207]

It’s ironic that the attempt to keep Spider-Man young so he can be relevant to modern-day fans is actually what is ruining the character. They’re so focused on the past that they can’t focus on the future ahead. Yet, the best moments of Spider-Man/Peter Parker’s journey was when he took huge steps forward. From Gwen’s death to marrying MJ, to almost becoming a parent, and right down to becoming a teacher to help children when he wasn’t Spider-Man. In fact, him being married made him more relatable because that’s what we see couples do. Becoming a parent was the next logical step in making him more relatable, not making him single and young to date other women. It’s sad to see that such optimism and love for this character be destroyed. But it’s a sad reality we all must accept.

[@revolutionarydragon1123]

And it is strange because Superman got to take that next step and is more popular now then he ever been

[@tjjordan4207]

@@revolutionarydragon1123 Which in turn lead to one of DC's memorable runs with the Supersons comics. Although, I keep hearing rumors that DC wants to undo Superman's marriage to Lois to make him single but the one thing that is stopping them is that they fear having him be a divorce will age him up too much.

[@revolutionarydragon1123]

@@tjjordan4207 I think that was possible under bendis but as of now with josha Williamson and pkj the family is safe if anything the super family has expanded

[@Tyler_W]

The saddest part is that the problem with ASM is a microcosm of everything that's wrong with the Big 2 in general. That's at least true creatively. Don't even get me started on their outdated business model. They seriously need to learn a thing or two from manga on that front. I'd say they need to learn a thing or two from manga on the creative front, but manga is just copying what American comics used to still be good at.

[@natesnarrations7215]

The Superior Spiderman story was my favorite. Ironic that it didn’t really have Peter parker in it but I love a villain redemption arc

[@spectacularspider-man4886]

As a spider-man fan what can you even read at this point? As much as I love old comics I'm getting sick of coming back to them out of desperation. I feel like a dog wiggling its tail to dog food I eat for breakfast lunch and dinner every day.

[@JustAnotherJames3]

The enraged fan thing was apparently Tom Brevoort.

[@soggyman1098]

It just makes me appreciate Miles and his stories now. Writers aren't afraid to make new stuff instead of rehashing villains and storylines

[@apersonwhomayormaynotexist9868]

Also his comics have just been better recently. They've been improving ever since Bendis left his title, but they're honestly just good now.

[@DasNordlicht91]

@@apersonwhomayormaynotexist9868 Miles' comics tend to be good with some small missteps along the way (i.e. making Ultimate Universe Kate Bishop a Hydra agent for some reason, but that's a moot point). I just enjoy his stories better now, mainly because it doesn't feel like editorial projecting their midlife crises onto Miles.

[@windghost2]

@@DasNordlicht91 For me it was the writing, I love the original comics and I've been rereading them for awhile now, (I got a few omnibuses!) and while reading I was reminded of why I'm happy Miles has been getting better writers for him. They've gone to places Bendis never did (getting tortured and a ton of other things going on in the Saladin run) and we're still going to get more with his current run with Cody Ziglar, after seeing Rabble and how she relates to Miles as a villain, I only want MORE! I'm sorry for the slight fanboyism but I've been really enjoying the Ziglar run as of late and with Ultimate Invasion coming soon, I'm just really excited to be a Miles Morales fan.

[@DraftyRum]

I have a feeling they're sabotaging peter in order to push miles for the movies synergy

[@windghost2]

@@DraftyRum That isn't the case my guy. Peter was being sabotaged *years* before Miles was even created and even after he busted into the world of comics, Peter was still being sabotaged. The only reason this stupid theory about Peter being put down to prop Miles up is even floating around is because of the all of success Miles has been getting. In the 5 years since his first movie, Miles's comics has gotten way better writers, he's been noticed by main stream audiences around the world and he's gotten his own video game. And now with Across The Spider-Verse out he's getting even more success and recognition. I'm happy with all of it and I can't wait to see what's next for him. But this whole, "They're putting Peter down to prop Miles up." thing is just people scapegoating and blaming Miles for something that isn't his fault in the slightest. Marvel is to blame for what's going on with Peter Parker, that's on them. Not on a character who's just getting his recognition.

[@kingbash6466]

Insane how every other piece of Spider-Man media currently with respect except the one he originated from: the comics.

[@mayorovercorndog9132]

I think a better idea instead of retconning. Would be to just write an alternate universe version of the story to flesh out the fan’s personal head cannon. Like if Spencer just wrote all of his retcons in an extremely similar alternate universe story with a snazzy new title, fans would’ve appreciated it more.

[@unknownuser2897]

I kinda wish DC and Marvel did this more with their IP’s. Let different creative teams have their own versions of the universe to play with. DC has been doing this more in recent years with stuff like Black Label, and a lot of it has been pretty good.

[@Captianflame-w7s]

I want Spider-Man to be dad and happily married to at this point I don’t care who I just want my boy to be happy

[@josephhein9497]

Check out the new Ultimate Spider-Man series starting in January. It's exactly that.

[@peterdasher2843]

It’s truly so hard to put the frustrations of being a comic book fan into words, trying to voice opinions without sounding spiteful or finding some poor writer to make into a scapegoat. I truly value you taking the time to voice your thoughts and self awareness into a format we all enjoy on your channel. I’ve always enjoyed your thoughtfulness as you take the time to delve into the roots of what make a character of story great. I see you pal❤

[@rudygarcia37]

"WHOSE SKELETONS ARE THESE!?" Best bit for me. 😂

[@mmuchroom]

It's actually bizarre how the story for the current run of Amazing Spider-Man is being handled. I always thought that, by creating Ultimate Spider-Man, Marvel Comics would have these two Peter Parkers at different points in life: one is an eternal teenager in a modern world and the other is a young adult that keeps growing. One More Day blew everything up and these current runs makes the character of Spider-Man completely unrelatable for the reader which is a shame cause one of the main points of the character is this relatability (anyone could be under the mask and stuff like that). The sad thing also is that in every appearance of Spidey outside his main comic book he is written perfectly. I think that there's a recent issue of Joe Fixit where he goes to Vegas or something and you see this mature, confident and smart Spider-Man with all of his wit and charm. I really hope Spider-Man grows up.

[@cable.3538]

Spider-man not being allowed to be happy makes reading his comic not really a nice time, it's just always suffering and being depressed. I don't like it personally.

[@ScourgeZX]

You know something is really wrong when first 10 minutes of video are apology letter to Dan Slott

[@jonmorris293]

Cebulski is a Gwen stan and when he saw Spencer was aiming to undo OMD, he ordered a course correct to fix Sins Past instead. Allowing the segue into the Beyond story and then the Wells run.

[@WaddleMoogle]

I got that epiphany for Batman a few years back. Even though all the Bat-family is allowed to change and evolve, Bruce himself is also stuck in a miserable statu quo. Whatever he feels, whatever he accomplishes, it will never matter. "It was Clayface in disguise, he was brainwashed by Scareceow, Ivy manipulated his emotions with pheromones". What even is the point of reading it anymore, might as well go back to random issues from the last century for the same reading experience. Got similar feelings for the ending of Planet Hulk too, this felt like such a blatant "reset button" for the character and everyrhing he went through. And even when the arcs are good and brings intereating changes for a character, you know that 90% of the time it will never stick.

[@daikaijutony3534]

“It’s the Simpsons of comic books.” Holy fuck that has to be the most accurate description of ASM I have ever heard.

[@dimirockeropoulos6104]

We got Ultimate Spider-Man this century...that was a comic that was well written, planned out and consistently kept its high quality. .

[@GodzillaMendoza]

I disagree. Ultimate had many writing problems and I felt it started to dip in quality after the first 50 issues.

[@TevyaSmolka]

@@GodzillaMendoza hey good news actually we are getting a new ultimate Spider-Man from Jonathan Hickman so there's hope after all.

[@Nash1t0]

To me, The Amazing Spider-Man comics suffered the most tragic 'defeat' when it comes to childhood heroes. There was a time when Spider-Man's comic books were so good and entertaining that you would see a hero in action with a life, it wasn't just a product. As you pointed out, because of everything going on in the recent run (and even before that) i no longer see THAT hero when i read the comics... i just feel like i'm consuming a product and there's nothing else.

[@AutumnWoodham]

So... when did Mysterio go from "guy who couldn't get into hollywood" to "guy who plays devils wingman to fuck with Peter Parker"

[@cartoonishidealism582]

Hey man it’s hard for a struggling actor. You get every job that you can.

[@alvaroascencio8093]

Spider-Man is doing so well in the movies and games, and then there’s the comics.

[@benwasserman8223]

Have you seen critic reviews for the Wells comics? Dumb MJ stuff aside, they’re largely positive. Even Dark Web.

[@mikemorro140]

@@benwasserman8223 I mean the MJ stuff is a pretty major point, so saying that aside doesn't really help

[@benwasserman8223]

@@mikemorro140 It’s more of a paradoxical issue. Stuff like the Tombstone arc, Peter and Felicia and even Dark Web are pretty fun when they work (I mean Jameson tricking demons that he’s one of them… by being himself? That sounds gold). And they don’t always involve MJ. But that storyline unfortunately hangs over everything due to its bizarre mystery box nature. Meaning things always come back around to Peter and MJ

[@mikemorro140]

@@benwasserman8223 The Jonah stuff was fun, but the rest of Dark Web on the Spider-Man side was a mess with the massive character assassination of Ben, and being honest Peter didn't really do shit. Peter and Felicia might be fun if their relationship wasn't so non existent, like Xavier complains about Peter and MJ barely being together in Spencer's run but Felicia has maybe played a big part in three issues of this run so far, and in two of those she was written by someone else

[@benwasserman8223]

@@mikemorro140 Oh come on. Other than the Ben Reilly complaints, DW was pretty fun. Or at the very least the idea of sentiment, Demonic New York iconography gave me a lot of laughs.

[@DmDaPDm]

Ahh the invincible artist, love his work

[@billyboleson2830]

Knew it seemed familiar

[@shrimpfriedstudios]

I just wanted to tell you that I'm proud of you. I know that my opinion won't mean jack and you're never going to see this but starting this by telling your audience that you learned a lesson is super mature. Honestly, "comic book writers are people" is a lesson that *I* had to learn, too. I've been growing up with you, at the time of me posting this, I'm 18, and I'd like to think that I'm growing up *with* you. It's really inspiring. Never lose the gift that is the ability to admit when you're wrong. Keep on being great, true believer!

[@IvanDubsK7]

Before this video: Man I can’t wait to see him tear into Zeb Wells! After this video: Fuck Marvel Higher Ups

[@comixproviderftw_02]

Pretty much

[@Creed1610]

Xavier, what is your thoughts on ultimate Spider-Man? The new one with Hickman and Checchetto?

[@arya_from_club_penguin]

Comic books need to end

[@amazing_gator]

21:23 maybe it’s a good place kinda thing where the afterlife doesn’t run alongside real life, thus they met in this infinite point. Sorta working like the tva

[@knightmare3706]

"they still want to keep Pete the young relatable guy" how tf am I supposed to relate to the dude who has to freaking die a billion times for no reason?! How do I relate to the guy who got his girlfriend Stockholm syndromed and had kids with her own kidnapper from another dimension?! I just.........ugggghhhh........from what I'm seeing spidey has all just been getting Ls left and right from Marvel. Who am I supposed to blame here? The editors? The writer? The executives?

[@himynameiskobey.7994]

It's actually pretty ironic how Xavier's shift in opinion on Spider-Man comics reminds me of that one ATSV meme where Miguel is looking at videos of his past before it shows him in the present.

[@SuperSilver316]

After the current run, I’d take Spencer back in a heartbeat. In a way Spencer’s run is a be careful what you wish for monkey’s paw. You can have your retcons, you just won’t like how you got them. It also shows that you can give resets what they want, and they still won’t be satisfied. That being said, his Kraven story and Sun Eater story were good and deserve praise.

[@radrno7]

Yeah, this is the double edge sword in which iconic characters like Spider-Man have fallen into. Superman, Batman, Wolverine, all the same. You can give people what they ask and they'll still hate it, so you see yourself forced to ignore what they want and toss it up to luck on them enjoying it anyway. It's a lose-lose situation, so what matters is doing what gets you paid and keeps you employed because the fans aren't worth it anymore.

[@SuperSilver316]

Pretty much nailed it. No one holds back their characters more than their fans. The editors are a problem for sure, but the fandom as a whole will never really be satisfied.

[@Demiurgentcreative]

This one hit on a very personal level for me because I very much feel the same way. Nails every single point as to why I'm just not into superhero comics anymore. Still love the characters, the classic stories and adaptions coming out. I just can't get into the lack of momentum for so many of the stories. Great vid!

[@battleupsaber462]

lol i was literally watching that Nick Spencer video earlier today and thinking to myself how far things have fallen in only a few years.

[@retronerds6884]

People took Spencer for granted

[@hypersleepdialogues8889]

You thought Nick Spencer's run was crap...Zeb Wells: hold my beer

[@tomjames9681]

Oooh, Xavier is going through the video essayist “writers are people too, and being angry online has no value when critiquing media” arc. The number of times creators do this and corner themselves by closing off an entire spectrum of the emotional presentation of a point, is hilarious. Guess what, you don’t have to feel bad about critiquing a writer if you do it politely and have your references in order. Parts of Slott’s response were a lot of corrections, especially the Johnny Storm panel he was responding to, shown in the video. If Slott had made genuine mistakes that could be quantified, like for example a break in internal consistency in his own book, then you could point that out without saying he’s a terrible person and still claim he made a mistake as a writer. The problem with characters around as long as Spider-man is that there are reasonably references you could find that support any characterisation you like, meaning best faith interpretation, criticise it when a writer contradicts their own work. That is the least you could hold them to. It’s funny that the takeaway from the interaction with Slott was “character writing is subjective” and not “it just takes more effort to get the correct references in order so that your point is supported”. Hitop had the same issue sometime after Far From Home/Titans. He was like “I’m not going to be spiteful towards the media I talk about because it takes more effort to find the good in something than tear things down, and directors and writers are people too”. Call me an English teacher for asking for better references but it’s just a pattern that a lot of creators go through and end up limiting themselves. Or they walk it back or get mad and look like hypocrites. It’s fine to be mad at bad media and to express that online. Just maybe consider if the way you analyse stuff is robust enough to have your feelings so strongly attached to it. I liked this video for the most part though, believe it or not.

[@cheloxmv]

The core message is don't be a dick, don't harass people online and grow up. That's it.

[@tomjames9681]

@@cheloxmv Yeah, but as someone who has been online for a while, the message of “don’t harass people and don’t be a dick” is as obvious as “don’t dox people”. You don’t need some spirit quest Twitter convo with an industry professional to realise it.

[@conorowens8382]

He comes across as a guy who’s just been castrated by the subject of his critique. He’s now so scared in this video of just making a negative criticism. He has to preface everything three times before making a damn point.

[@tomjames9681]

@@conorowens8382 When you’re just criticising people’s work, you don’t have to be so apprehensive. Creatives in any industry need to be able to take criticism. The funny thing is I agree more with Slott’s response because he wasn’t whining about someone being mean to his writing, he was mad someone misquoted him and incorrectly portrayed his book.

[@MrMonkeyCommander]

Thank you so much for this. Such a perfect encapsulation of how mainline spiderman comics broke my heart. The older comics were just fun, and often had a lot of heart. It showed Peter Parker the person with a drive to do whats right, now we have spiderman the brand who sometimes takes off his mask. He cant ever grow up, evolve, be a real person because thats too risky for the brand. Its such a damn shame because Peter Parker at his core is a wonderful character with an inspiring story to be told, that anyone can rise above what was thought possible and do the right thing, and eventually be rewarded for that. Instead modern spiderman comics he just shows up places and gets relentlessly punished for existing. Its miserable. Rant over

[@Polar_Bear_Ron]

Years ago, we were worried about what would happen with Disney taking over Marvel. We missed the mark with some things, however, generally, we were right. There has hands down been a lack of creativity, stupid character choices, and more shoe horned ties to merchandising/movies ever since the take over. If anything, blame Quesada and Disney.

[@cia4u401]

There's a reason they call this type of comicbook capeshit. This is entire video is why.

[@biggamer7433]

It's great that you've taken the time to apoligize to Dan Slott. It takes alot of maturity to acknowledge mistakes you made when younger and actually go out and make an apology. The world would be a much better place if people did that more often. I know it won't mean much to the kind of sad and irrational people who go out of their way to harrass comic writers, but do you think you can take the 5 minute intro of this video and upload it as a separate video once the full video goes public. This is a great video that's definitely worth the full 40 minute run time, But i feel like it would be better for Dan Slott personally to be able to have a short 5 minute video he can link to whenever people misquote him, instead of a 40 minute video on a separate but related topic with a 5 minute apology in it.

[@Jiub_SN]

I also tend to do horrible and I rational things and apologize making it all better

[@tyrantgaming4142]

@@Jiub_SN uhh ok

[@mrscruffles801]

I don't see what godzilla did that was hotrible and irrational. He gave due criticism.

[@mikemorro140]

@@mrscruffles801 Yeah the thing with Slott is like, while I'm sure there were things editorial forced him into or stopped him from doing, he's also fervently defended a lot of really dumb things in his run to the point that I could believe they were his ideas

[@mrscruffles801]

@@mikemorro140 Yeah exactly. Slott is a coward who uses a small handful of toxic fans threatening him to play victim and shield himself from criticism. I disagree with mendoza about this; I don't care that he's "human", he brought the scorn he get's on himself. I am not going to be charitable to him.

[@naotohex]

I wonder why they refuse to go further and explore Spider-Man. The two animated movies even kinda make fun of modern Spider-Man calling out how he just repeats tropes through each iteration, yet people like Miles won't accept it. Hell, Peter B. Parker technically went against it and is going further showing he has grown and is ready to continue with his life by marrying MJ and having a child.

[@BrooklynAvenue]

Miles should just be in Amazing. Give us a backup story with Peter as an adult with children. Just retcon everything back to the birth of May and make everything else a fever dream.

[@cafeterialoca]

Tom Brevoort said that "Enraged fan is an Engaged fan"

[@cinemasaur]

Let me just say, I find it petty and un proffesional of Dan Slott to go on a Twitter rant over what I recall would have been a teenager's opinion on the internet. Like I think it's kind of cool that he talked to YOU, but at the same time he's a professional and it gives off the same vibes as James Gunn "shutting down" trolls on twitter, just like don't bother it makes them come off as immature children. Yes they're are people but he's a PAID well known writer, talking down to an internet critic giving his opinion. I think it's cool you grew from it all, but don't let this petty stuck up nerd think you have to feel bad for your takes. That tweet, "I knew you were a good egg" because now you agree with him. I'm sure the anecdote about him being harassed over being misquoted, just feels like bullshit. maybe over twitter he was called out, boo hoo. Human or not, it's a bad look on this grown ass adult's part to condescend so heavily about his comic book writing. You can disagree, I just find the man petty, and I like a lot of his writing!

[@mangooverdose3204]

I personally loved some of Nick Spencer's stuff that you hated. I thought the Hunted storyline had a lot of intimate character moments and I honestly did love the Boomerang stuff. I do agree though a lot of Nick Spencer's later stuff just keeps running circles with older material and its ending is goddamn awful, it is absolutely atrocious haha. Also, Kindred as Harry Osborn is a guilty pleasure of mine lol. I thought it was cool when he was Harry, even if it is kinda bad lol, I even made a fan animation on it a long time ago. I don't 100% agree with all this but I do agree it seemed like the higher ups were to blame for that terrible shift in the plot. Otherwise, cool video dawg.

[@ianbruno237]

Same here, it was like a treasure trove for older fans who love continuity. Just cause you don’t like continuity doesn’t mean it has to be ignored and I feel like this video is just kinda only about that. Editorial is most likely the problem for Spencer’s run I mean look at the new spider man run that’s example #1

[@ayaanabdullah937]

Thank you for this video, not only am I happy that you acknowledged your own mistakes, but also how you summarized why modern day Spider-Man is stuck in a rut without needlessly blaming any of the writers. The Spider-Man Fandom could really learn a lot from you, it is time to move on from the Comics.

[@CrimsonPizza21]

I guess it's true what they say "you never get a happy ending because there's always more show".

[@ronanthesuperginger]

I knew this video was coming. It was bound to happen spider-man has gotten so bad that Xavier even though he’s trying to stray away from spider-man content (or maybe not his opinion can change) but it really needs to be addressed by someone who the fandom really respects

[@GodzillaMendoza]

Wait, the fandom respects me? Since when?

[@ronanthesuperginger]

@@GodzillaMendoza I feel like a lot of the fandom does. The none toxic part I mean I’ve showed my friends your vid’s and they really respect your opinions on the characters you get a lot of views when you talk about spider-man because your view points on the character are always so interesting and make people get really invested

[@ronanthesuperginger]

That’s what I think at least I know when you talk about spidey I usually respect your view points maybe I’m wrong maybe I’m not but I feel like your a good person to listen too when it’s really about spider-man or anything your really interested in

[@Ili-v4z]

@@GodzillaMendoza since when the fandom hates you?

[@lastmanstanding7155]

​@@GodzillaMendoza Bro I swear to god we don't hate you. Us normal types just aren't terminally online and don't talk much or aren't as loud. But while I think we'd disagree here and there (as we should we're different people) I'm not gonna be like "woah you rascal. How dare you like/not like this thing I like/not like." I ain't got enough energy to hate tbh. And you always provide an interesting perspective on things. Not just on Spider-Man but on usually whatever it is you want to talk about.