The Animation of Guilty Gear Xrd & Dragon Ball FighterZ

[@themocaw]

One little thing I love: the character Baiken in Guilty Gear has one arm and eye. In prior games, her missing eye and arm would switch based on what direction she was facing, due to Sprite mirroring. In Xrd, with all their new tools and the freedom of 3d, which could easily solve that problem. . . Baiken's missing arm and eye still switch sides based on what direction she is facing. :shrug:

[@BknMoonStudios]

I imagine gameplay and story play a big part into keeping it that way. Remember Oro and his magically switching wrapped arm in Third Strike? The only way they can keep the arm and eye-patch consistent without breaking gameplay is to do what Tekken does and have Player 2 facing _away_ from the camera, but that brings its own issues.

[@Spiderdoom-hg3iy]

it's a fighting game, so that small detail comes second to being able to see the character accurately and be able to tell what move they'll throw out next

[@aguywithalotofopinions412]

Making something that in theory shouldn’t be possible using brute force is the most Guilty Gear thing I’ve ever heard

[@m0ckyzo185]

Something that is 100% possible can also be considered 0% possible AND INFINITY CRUSHES ZERO!!!!

[@theHMCenthusiast]

@@m0ckyzo185 -Sol Ungaguy

[@Ramsey276one]

Those Men: That Is The Way Sol & Baiken: *DID IT HAVE TO BE?!* "Later, ASUKA!" You *fu--

[@vincenttorrijos9680]

The most eye opening part of this is the manually added imperfections. They had to go through every individual frame and add in imperfections to further replicate an anime style, completely matching it while purposefully negating one of the most crucial features of computer assisted animation, all to fit the aesthetic. Imperfections are everywhere in 2d animation, both on-paper and digitally, you just have to know where to look, yet they're one of the most defining features of the style, so that just goes to show the dedication these animators have.

[@PoolNoodleGundam]

This is why strive's face animation during intros, outros and specials is so good. Eyes subtly change size back and forth, the only thing that moves cleanly is the mouth, that kind of thing

[@Canthary]

The DBFZ visuals looks so much like the actual series in motion it's still unbelievable to me.

[@amiablereaper]

Arcsys really caught lightning in a bottle with DBFZ. It captures the feeling of the anime better than any other video game anime adaptation.

[@ShapeDoppelganger]

The actual series that you remember, not how it was, anime of yore had really bad animation.

[@Canthary]

@@ShapeDoppelganger On the contrary, your average seasonal anime may look better now but i have watched DBZ recently and it actually looked way better than i remember. Hell, the shading, the consistency of the models and the lack of cgi made for quite a fresh experience.

[@thatguy3718]

Arcsys: this is to go even further beyond!

[@thessk_1]

David Rigdon I think the Naruto Storm games do their fair share of greatness as well

[@aganaom1712]

modern animators: " we use incredibly precise technology to make our work process as smooth and efficient as possible. And it's all thanks to how these machines are programmed." arc sys: "these dumb machines don't do what they're supposed to. so we broke every single one until they did."

[@magnusm4]

That's actually a pretty funny problem when animating as you might want a rather quick motion, but don't know how the hell to NOT make it render the in between. Even when you speed it up there's still those rendered parts that maybe gets noticed maybe, so that's not enough.

[@carlbloke8797]

Agan Mardrus I can totally hear Sol Badguy saying something like that since he works for Arc Sys

[@carlbloke8797]

magnusm4 This is why Arc Sys are wizards

[@odisclemons9700]

well said lol

[@ruthlessdraculigula1051]

Lmao

[@krystaLuvin]

"Rather than compete with their own products..." Their only competition in Anime Fighting Games is themselves. lol

[@geloXIII]

That's not true. There's French Bread who made Under Night In-Birth.

[@runbaa9285]

@@geloXIII published by ArcSys. It's still their product. They just don't develop it.

[@geloXIII]

@@runbaa9285 no. What I meant was that there are other companies who can rival their anime fighting games is French Bread. In fact, EXAMU the creators behind Arcana Hearts can also rival against Arc System Works. And ArcSys published their game as well.

[@Somethingwithoutatrace]

@@geloXIII you can’t have competition if you buy the competition

[@geloXIII]

@@Somethingwithoutatrace I mean, fair enough. Now with DNF Duel, they pretty much own the entire competition.

[@markthematey9873]

Literally 5 days later the new guilty gear is released and it has a new aesthetic. Still anime but instead of a tv anime it’s a high quality anime movie.

[@flamuralaj3302]

The new GG looks fantastic.

[@AntiNihilist]

@I Hate My Own Species. yes it is...

[@RenAki5]

@Dave Except it is. Pokemon, Yugioh, Dragon Ball, and Naruto are literally everywhere. They're all anime. Sure, the entirety of anime might not be as mainstream as other shows, but anime is huge part of pop culture now. Everyone knows what Pokemon, Yugioh and Dragon Ball are. Less people know about Naruto, but still a vast majority. They don't have to know anything about it, just the basic premise. Even though they aren't the best animes, they're hella ingrained into our society now. You even hear about newer/more obscure anime all the time. Shows like Attack on Titan, Sword Art Online, Tokyo Ghoul, Jojo's Bizarre Adventure (Which is so close to just being mainstream at this point thanks to how memeable it has been) are things you hear about from time to time when they blow up. Thinking anime isn't mainstream is like thinking Game of Thrones, Harry Potter, and Lord of the Rings isn't mainstream. Everyone knows about them. It's mainstream bud

[@yaeven4943]

No, it has not released..

[@markthematey9873]

Yaeven released the trailer, I’m so very sorry for not specifying

[@formoftherapy]

It hurts my brain to see that Dragon Ball game footage. It looks so much like the 2D cartoon yet 3D…wow

[@timtalksanimations9171]

@2d fighter fan How a channel that has 460k subs is considered nearly a million I'll never know

[@mngmng_]

you should take a look at Guilty Gear Strive

[@gabenewal8056]

Totally unexpected to see you here lol

[@Bapthard]

What are you doinc here PD ?

[@RL-DarkSpark]

People who call Anime cartoon 😐

[@marscaleb]

I'm gonna be honest here, I've been thinking about how games could try to look like this for a good 20 years already. I've noticed factors like failing to emulate low framerates and held poses for ages. I am so immensely pleased to see that someone has finally done it.

[@NoahDaArk]

What’s even crazier is that ArcSys has become so good at this… they can literally develop *and* support numerous fighting games that *use* this style of animation! Incredibly easy in fact! Don’t believe me? Just a few years ago ArcSys published Granblue Fantasy Verses and we’re still putting out regular content updates for DragonBall FighterZ, while *also* working on Guilt Gear Strive and most likely Dungeon Fighter Tag as well!

[@goruyorsunuzz]

15:39 What is the name of the game ?

[@marscaleb]

@@goruyorsunuzz GranBlue Fantasy Versus.

[@GuitarSlayer136]

"Imperfections" *Zooms on Aqua* A C C U R A T E

[@steveempiremantra2120]

Lmao

[@samfeels5608]

for me aqua is perfect perfectly useless man love this character she is not like the annoying tsunderes out there. she is quite the opposite she does not hit you when you are minding your own business for no reason, she is hit when she mind her own business for obvious reasons

[@tl1326]

hossam hossam she’s the punching bag everyone loves to punch

[@joemartin7451]

@@samfeels5608 her imperfections are her greatest charms for imperfection is the closest to reality.

[@zyaicob]

I think you mean yaku nai-sama

[@cruye9633]

If Arc makes a JJBA fighter in my lifetime I'll die happy

[@erwinlimawan3158]

Man, you’re making me remember that old arcade/dc JJBA game, and that was awesome, so yes please.

[@lightsinx]

I NEED IT.

[@ENFIKEFEPOKETC]

Imagine Jump Force, but made by Arc Systems

[@Kuon_latte]

Never I've wanted something so much until now

[@amenosaigiri873]

Mori sama already said they didn’t have plans to because there already was one a while back so it’s not likely but if because of their recent successes they get brought in to do it, it would be a holy day indeed.

[@liaminator4950]

This guy makes the most rewatchable videos i swear

[@dragonsswarm1987]

I know right.

[@EmmettMcMullan]

Totally! I've just really gotten into DBFZ properly lately, after first watching the video a year ago. Merits a great rewatch as I've just been loving how this game plays and how the characters operate.

[@TheDemonChara]

I've watched the Sonic one way too many times despite it being a longer one, it's great background noise for stuff.

[@FixTheWi-Fi]

12:18 "Kill Every Thing 3D" sounds like a mindless fun indie game.

[@riftis2210]

I'm imagining a game where you play as a weeb who kills all the real girls and collects all the anime girls.

[@diablo.the.cheater]

@@riftis2210 yes, ultimate weaboo simulator.

[@Ramsey276one]

There’s a game than technically has that plot Old school game mascots facing polygonal invaders!

[@kapnken2342]

lemme guess, classic doomguy fights classic quake enemies like just the literal sprite of doomguy shooting 3d quake monsters

[@splashor6361]

That actually sounds like it would make for a cool game. You play as a sprite and you have to fight against 3d objects.

[@AccentedCinema]

New Frame Plus: "How few drawings can you get away with?" Evangelion has joined the chat

[@Oldsah]

They probably spent lots on audio, where others wouldn't. Back then quality was much better even though budgets were smaller. To be fair now-a-days you're forced to create easily watchable flat arcs with shitty stories horrible music and graphics (especially motion and environment) that look like some newbie attempted to carry himself through 15hour workdays...

[@ZMusashiZ]

@Pedro Silveira 60fps ? NO, 1fp30s. And this frame will mark history (and your lcd monitors, years later)

[@marsupialmole3926]

Alternatively. Nichijou "How much money and time can we spend to over-animate the absolute hell out of this joke?"

[@ElZamo92]

Marsupial Mole I remember... A fully animated nuclear explosion that cast a beam of light across the entire solar system... because a high school girl poked her finger with a mechanical pencil...

[@boltmix7294]

@@Oldsah Can't tell if you are serious, lot's of recent anime have great animation, stories and music (music in particular, it's gotten ridicilously good and it's present in a large amount of shows) Again, can't tell if you are serious or somewhat delusional

[@poidnet]

They did such a perfect job on DBFZ, it will be petty much impossible to do a better Dragon Ball fighting game in term of graphics.

[@finnmarr-heenan2397]

its great but they can improve they have since granblue and strive, too bad strive is missing the likes of dizzy baiken and slayer

[@Wter-oy1dh]

@@finnmarr-heenan2397 welp, Baiken was just announced

[@mynameissongoku]

@@finnmarr-heenan2397 baiken is here.

[@DeertickDaniel]

@@finnmarr-heenan2397slayers here too now lol and I doubt dizzys gonna miss out

[@arbetor12]

​@@finnmarr-heenan2397 dizzy is back

[@RikXtreme4]

Anime games should STRIVE to look like this.. Good god, could you imagine a Shonen Jump game by Arc systems?

[@freddyromariovasquezcairo2250]

that would be awesome and not the shit they do now.

[@davidburke4101]

You can't really have a 3D stage fighter look as good as this because each frame needs to be curated, and animating 360 degrees of character movement just isn't possible, and that's with a fixed camera. A free camera would need a near infinite amount of custom frames. However, a fighter like tekken/budokai is doable

[@yugotokusatsu289]

@@davidburke4101 Kill La Kill IF Heck, if that was to much trouble for them, they could have just have a 2d fighter like DBFZ

[@B0K0691]

@@davidburke4101 Then just stop producing 3d arena fighters then

[@spade4acer]

My Hero Academia needs an actual fighting game with this aesthetic. Not this One's Justice game that looks the same as tons of other shonen-based arena fighter cash grabs.

[@Gilbot9000]

I might cry. This was so good, and just highlights so much of what made the Guilty Gear series my absolute favorite fighting games of all time. Dan, thank you so much for this gift.

[@KingClickMusic]

It's heartwarming this meant this much to you, brother! Glad we can all enjoy it.

[@LostSoulSilver]

I still can't believe this video is what introduced me to Guilty Gear and got me to give it a try. Now it's on my top 5 favorite videogame series ever

[@isadoracostahamsi163]

Computer: here you go! Everything is perfect, light, proportions, transitions! Everything! Me: urg. This is ugly! Arc System: there, I worked really hard and manage to break every single thing! Me: thanks, that is a lot better! Computer: but... but...

[@Zoular]

Computer: Am I a joke to you?

[@animalplant4445]

the fact that they worked so hard to break the animation and then adding motion blur in 3d is bonkers

[@DuvJones]

More or less, which is rather fascinating. At some point I really, REALLY hope that capcom attempts this because their fighters have always felt a bit off with the full range of motion that they have. New players seems to enjoy it, but I always find that things are just off with how the game flows. It's like it takes too much time.

[@DuvJones]

Which when I think about it, it's rather funny. Capcom first for the idea to move into full 3D/2.5D fighters from a ASW game. Battle Fantasia. Ono was taking inspiration from that which is ASW first attempt at a 2.5D Fighter, which they basically did everything.... Wrong. Want to know why BlazBlue rotoscope's.... Battle Fantasia is likely the answer to that question.

[@jman8194]

Arc: *ZA WARUDO TOKI WO TOMARE* *MUDA MUDA MUDA MUDA MUDA MUDA*

[@RubberNinja]

Fantastic break down.

[@revthescatman137]

Bro

[@marrowyoutube]

@@revthescatman137 Bro

[@AMBanosidhc]

Bro....

[@roelrodriguez9685]

orB

[@marrowyoutube]

@ashy best comment

[@MechaEmperor7000]

the trailer for Xrd was basically the moment I committed myself into 3D. That moment when Sol and Ky's attacks clashed and the *camera spun around the SFX* we all shat our pants. And to be fair, I've actually lost friends who saw this and declared it to be a fake because there's no way 3D could ever be comparable to 2D. There is also an animation studio that does this, Kamikaze Douga. They seem to have developed independently of each other, and they seem to have different workflows due to Kamikaze Douga being in film and television (their most notable work includes the intro for Stardust Crusaders, Batman Ninja and Star Wars Visions: Ronin, but stuff like their SACLA promo and Idolish7's Restart Pointer are even more anime than this game).

[@mocliamtoh573]

I've been looking forward to this ever since you suggested it as a potential topic. I've already seen the GDC talk, and this is a great, accessible complement to it.

[@ashlynnanderson1744]

Yeah, I remember commenting about just this thing on the 2d fighting game animation video! Really happy to see this finally out

[@ClarenceDass]

"They had to replicate what a DBZ fan sees in their head" So true. The DBZ game looks like how i remember the show. I actually re-watched DBZ in preparation for the fighter and when the fighter released, it definitely looked better.

[@Cat-meow-Cat]

I kinda want to see this guy also breakdown guilty gear strive

[@tzisorey]

Increase the anime-ness of the game by having each round start with 3 minutes of "Previously" and finish with 2 minutes of "Next time"

[@Reydriel]

That definitely would fit in DBFZ lol

[@tumamaencosplay]

At least the "previously" could totally be done with some replay clips before online matches whenever you fight someone again in matchmaking.

[@amiablereaper]

That's just the DBFZ load times

[@mzza]

And add 1,5 minute long opening and ending.

[@GeminiTasiri]

Asura's Wrath did that which tried very hard to be a playable anime

[@PierceArner]

I was surprised that you didn't mention how, especially in replicating the anime look for Dragonball FighterZ, the game itself runs at 60fps, but the cutscenes are rendered at the classic anime 24fps, so that it goes to even greater levels of tricking our brains about how it looks.

[@PierceArner]

@@chargeheby882 I didn't know why the cutscenes looked _SO DAMN GOOD_ but I couldn't stop feeling that they suddenly just _became_ anime sometimes. Then when I learned that they were changing frame rates when it wouldn't impact gameplay, I just can't get over how simple, utterly brilliant, and perfectly effective it is.

[@Mcpwnt]

@@PierceArner The frame rate thing is pretty obvious and while i think that is something that anime does i'm pretty sure things still look like anime without the limed frame rate given that still images can still look like anime. So i question how much making the apparent fps worse actually helps.

[@PierceArner]

@@Mcpwnt It's the same reason why people thought that the 48fps Hobbit films had a "soap opera" look to them. The frame rates of media actually change a lot about how we interpret them visually. The change between the gameplay and into cutscenes Dragonball FighterZ actually feel like anime cutscenes even more _BECAUSE_ they drop to 24fps to match the way we're used to seeing the anime look.

[@Mcpwnt]

@@PierceArner feeling isnt looking. It would also depend on a confusion between something being authentic and being good. Murder can be authentic.

[@PierceArner]

@@Mcpwnt it _also_ *LOOKS* the same as the anime.

[@qEagleStrikerp]

It would be interesting to see this technique used in the Anime industry itself. I don't know if it would actually cost less or more, but I could imagine a technique similar to this becoming a new animation standard sometime in the future.

[@Canalbiruta]

I'd say it wouldn't cost as much as cell animation, but it would be harder to animate in the same time.

[@jeremias-serus]

Honestly such a good question. Been thinking about it for a while, and I’m starting to think that at the point where you could make 3dcg perfectly mimic 2dcg, it would take just as much work as 2dcg. Thus being a wash. I sure hope that’s not the case, though.

[@vasilecusarmale7322]

2d animation has way more options. Like deforming of the character when doing an action. 3d would be cool but harder to get thoose visuals i think it would be a combination of 3d and actual 2d animation

[@qEagleStrikerp]

@@vasilecusarmale7322 yeah deformation and transitions are definitely harder in 3D

[@applepie1835]

@@vasilecusarmale7322 watch honkai cutscenes it has 2.5 D animation

[@Obi-Wan_Kenobi]

I honestly did not know that Dragon Ball Fighterz used 3D character models until I saw this video. I just thought it was highly stylized 2D animation. Even when the camera moved I still thought it was just really complicated 2D.

[@riftis2210]

I mean, if you wanna be real all animation is just really complicated 2D.

[@BlastoiseMaster]

It’s like Arc is using Jedi mind tricks on us

[@bobbyonasis]

@@BlastoiseMaster syths

[@thund3r632]

A R84. Siths

[@redharlock9237]

Oh come on it's Crystal clear FZ was 3D, from the intros of characters.

[@callowguru2611]

This is so cool. The games look perfect. I hope they realise they've done some sorcery here.

[@lrdalucardart]

Oh worry not, there is a reason why Bandai went to them, specifically, for making Dragon Ball Fighters Z in to what it has is now.

[@ekinteko]

Agreed. However, I also dig the aesthetics of Basara 3 and 4. It's true 3D but it looks more photorealistic-anime which blends in nicely. I think even DBZ would fit nicely with that game engine. Here's a sample from the PS3 (much weaker than a PS4 Pro or Samsung S10+): kzbin.info/www/bejne/p2GymJ2JndaGjZI#t=12m21s

[@xxmusashi]

Yes we should appreciate this level of dedication for animating all of this. But I’m mostly thankful for that guy who animated Ramlethal thighs

[@finnmarr-heenan2397]

om fond of both baiken walk cycles, foward is so cocky

[@goruyorsunuzz]

15:39 What is the name of the game ?

[@robertbroniarczyk9862]

@@goruyorsunuzz granblue fantasy versus

[@harrylane4]

@@finnmarr-heenan2397 I miss the early-games’ baiken animation, where she looked almost feral. Before, she looked like she had rabies, now she’s just “big boob sword girl.”

[@artarealmblazer]

You might want to check out the new Guilty Gear trailer to see how they've stepped it up.

[@sbhack2077]

next level bruh

[@AbdulAdas]

They went beyond Ultra Instinct in the new Guilty Gear

[@killymxi]

From the trailer I got the impression they are actually giving up on the 2D look, or they got a freshman team with less understanding of 2D. Feels like they pushed limited frames even further, but also increased level of details too much and switched to lazy-ass 3D shading. The honored 2D anime look of characters is now ruined. Definitely looking forward for professional animator analysis though.

[@shaveice8223]

@@killymxi can't say it doesn't look amazing though.

[@ChiriConCarne]

The trailer is too short to be evaluated, we can only see new character designs and a nice stage. Other than that, it's still the Guilty Gear we have loved.

[@FellaDudeMan]

One of the key points from that GDC talk that seems to be often glossed over, is that he said the process they used didn't necessarily save time compared to just working in 2D. In some cases, it took longer. This is important to note, since working in 2D has often gotten the stigma of being prohibitively more expensive than 3D, just for being 2D, and that's far from truth. 2D can still be practical and less expensive than an approach like this, depending on how it's used. The time and dedication required of the animators plays the biggest cost factor with both approaches. Making games in 3D is often considered less expensive, but that's while assuming the developers will use all of the cost and time cutting methods that the medium allows, rather than using the more time consuming hand-crafted approach that ArcSys used. All this to say, please don't expect every developer to suddenly make their game look like ArcSys under the pretense that this aesthetic was cheaper, easier, or more practical to produce. We should show much respect to the hard work it takes, and will probably always take, to nail an approach like this down.

[@davidburke4101]

Most people can't put two and two together so don't expect common sense and research to go into peoples thoughts.

[@SJNaka101]

I wouldn't be surprised, though, if tools start being developed to automate a lot of these processes. When something makes money, people will always try to find a way to do the same thing but cheaper. I definitely foresee some period in the future where the market becomes saturated with pretty close recreations of this style, once the tools arrive to do it cheaply

[@pedroivo7322]

This definitely needs a follow up now that GG Strive is released. Their use of dynamic lighting while still keeping faithful 2D visuals is amazing.

[@SAPProd]

Personally, I’d love for ArcSystems Works to be contracted by Capcom for a new Darkstalkers game!

[@velhomiguel]

Mr Sack SNK should just hand over KoF to ArcSys. They could do wonders with the incredible roster of KoF and the animation of Guilty Gear.

[@NoahDaArk]

Mr Sack I’d love to see NetherRealm team up with them to make a Mortal Kombat/Guilty Gear crossover

[@bonbon8899]

@@NoahDaArk nah mortal kombat doesn't have the right to cross over with a franchise as good as guilty gear

[@SovietMarmalade]

@kmden Rt a new jojo fighter is what we need for sure

[@KaitouKaiju]

@@velhomiguel KOF looks amazing though! It's Capcom that needs to hand over SF and MvC because they have effectively killed both

[@sir.raphimrevelator8644]

Them: Aqua is Useless New Frame Plus: Aqua teaches us about animation

[@raikiri000]

Other than that, she's still useless LUL

[@timothymclean]

"How to make animation look good when a stingy goddess is providing your budget."

[@arvy8096]

By being imperfect

[@OsirusHandle]

being useless is what makes aqua cute

[@ProfGarcia]

A Symphony of the Night remake with this technology would be a dream coming true...

[@cvanims]

This studio is absolutely amazing.

[@duchi882]

*Guilty Gear's Animation is great* Accompanied by kick ass music that is just as great

[@milkywayflea404]

Guilty Gear itself is great. Definitely my favorite fighting game of all time.

[@milkywayflea404]

@Jill Stingray is precious I haven't played Tekken all that much tbh, could never seem to get the hang of the game. I do own it though, it's a good game, and I want to try to learn it.

[@dreamEnd]

I hope that more future developers adapt these kind of animation for their future Japanese "made" games. It looks real stunning. The first time i saw DB fighter Z and GBFVS, it totally blew my mind at how good these games look

[@cryptocoin7098]

i hope they make a shonen jump game in this style, jump force looks good but its weird because of different art styles plus the 3d look

[@itsDjjayyArt]

@@cryptocoin7098 true are a my hero game

[@Shendue]

So basically they artificially set on limitations to improve the final quality. Extremely clever. When someone asks me why old game music, old animation, etc. have something special despite the technical limitation, I always say that they do BECAUSE of the technical limitations. "Less is more" is often not just a common saying, but simply the truth. Having limitations, or better, having to WORK AROUND limitations, sometimes produces marvels. I think it's because the struggle of overcoming limitations gives birth to extremely efficient and clever solutions. The "limited animations" approach the video mentions is a perfect example. I often use as an example Jack White, from the White Stripes, who purposedly used old, abused and out-of-tune guitars, and a technically limited drummer, Meg, because he thought it was more interesting and "genuine" to try and come out with likeable sound through those limitations. Nowadays he plays with a full band and a great drummer, yet he is mostly remembered for the great music he created when he limited himself.

[@riverpb5250]

silent hill

[@jasonwaltman3566]

You see it on the coding side of things too. Modern methods are sloppy. Programmers don't need to care about the hardware limitations as we once did and the art of efficient elegant solutions is being lost.

[@noname768397]

I see, just like my grandma said, if you wanna cook fadt do it with gas, if you wanna cook delicious do it with charchoal, she is right after all, thos extra steps wotn fail you

[@godmode3611]

It is an improvement to you. I prefer 3d perfection and smoothness.

[@tetraedri_1834]

@@jasonwaltman3566 On the other hand, without needing to care about nitty gritty have allowed more productive workflows, which in turn lower development time and makes ambitious projects more feasible to more people. I'd say that's pretty good trade off.

[@lloydhallam]

God I love, love, LOVE this style of animation! This is the kind of stuff that makes so happy to be an animator!

[@DinoMylo]

Dream job

[@neverclever0]

This is a fantastic video essay. Not only is it extremely informative, it presents that information in a digestible way, even to someone who is only passingly familiar with industry lingo. It also spins this information into a narrative. It has the sort of arc that a movie or play might, with a clear sense of introduction, escalation, and resolution. I watched it twice, then watched it a third time because I had to show it to me friend.

[@Patty-Q]

Man, I played Xrd and Rev 2 for a solid four years before realizing that it actually is 3D animation. It blew my mind at how well they did it and how long it took for me to realize it

[@jelaninoel]

SoupPlay 4 years?? I’ll admit I didn’t realize it was 3D in the trailer at first but the moment the camera pans around them, that’s obviously 3D

[@Don_Akane89]

whats even more wonderful is that even once you've known that they're actually 3D, its very easy for your mind to keep on seeing it as '2D' afterwards still.

[@sudo451]

@@jelaninoel probably means 4 hours, rev 2 hasn't been out for 4 years lol

[@raiga5-6-42]

I watched a doccumentary on GG XRD making and it's jawdropping how they used the game engine plus chara modelling

[@peeenguinne3858]

@@raiga5-6-42 really? Do you mind putting the link of the documentary, if it's still available online?

[@_Adie]

It's criminal that there isn't as many people talking about this. This is actual magic. I guess if it wasn't a Japanese fighting game, more people would be aware. Either way - awesome job covering this.

[@andrawyawikrama5620]

Eh... it's not a matter of "Japanese" or "Western" that made these games more well-known or not. The most popular fighting games have always been Japanese products (Street Fighter, Tekken, Smash Bros.) ArcSys, though pretty distinguished, still has a pretty niche market outside Japan.

[@_Adie]

The games you mentioned are popular for reasons that are completely unrelated to them being Japanese. For the most part. I guess what I wanted to say is that people don't really play (or care about) fighting games to begin with. (Compared to other genres, I mean.) Let alone very peculiar ones like Guilty Gear. Which is extremely Japanese in many of its aspects, and that may be unattractive to many people. If this was Mortal Kombat, way more people would be interested, I guarantee. Ideally if it wasn't a fighting game at all, just any popular, approachable genre. No matter the country of origin. I'm just bitter not as many people play fighting games as those games deserve.

[@Maxrepfitgm]

@@_Adie Fighting games are pretty crappy now. I say this as someone who has played fighting games since super street fighter 2 was released in arcades. No story, no game modes, season passes...I will get SFV when the 10th season pass is on sale in 2025

[@_Adie]

@@Maxrepfitgm lol For someone who supposedly played the games since SFII, you should know better than that. Why would you need a story in a fighting game? I don't understand why lack of one is everybody's biggest complaint. What would you expect anyway, it's just people punching each other. At The core those games are made so you play them over and over and get better. It's the arcade game in its purest form. And hell - games like CS or League don't have stories, but nobody seems to mind. Even Overwatch didn't at the beginning, and I haven't seen any complaints about that. Besides - what the hell are you talking about? Literally every recent major fighting game has a story mode in one way or another. For whatever reason. With the modes I kinda agree. There are some things that have already been done, but for some reason aren't in every fighter. Proper tutorials, trials, command training (for 3D games), Xrd-style missions, DoA Quest, team fights survival, etc. There are ways to incorporate all of those into any game. But, on the other hand, they're far from being a priority (outside of tutorials and trials, I'd say). That doesn't mean games without those are bad, or lacking, though. Not to me, at least. As long as there's practice mode, online, and versus, that's pretty much all you need. And Season Passes... I don't see what's wrong with them. The game is being constantly updated, worked on, and supported. Because of that, people keep playing. Maybe even some new people join. Look at Tekken 7. The game is constantly growing. And that's wrong? It's definitely a better approach than releasing the same game again. Because back in the day that's all you got. If you got any updates at all. And if you want to complain they're not free - yeah, no shit, nothing is. If they were free they wouldn't exist. But at least you don't have to buy them to keep playing with others. Only thing you're not getting is the new characters. So if you're not interested in them, it's the perfect deal. Go on and compare SFII to any recent fighting game and tell me which one's worse. Which one has more content, which one has more story. It's not the games that got crappy. It's the people.

[@damiangracia8111]

And everyone was losing their shit with Toy Story 4...

[@jokx4409]

This is one of the best explanations about this topic and I still link it to people whenever I have to explain the pain animators go through when making shows and stuff. You explain how different 2d and 3d are very well.

[@nycklex6956]

I love how you started it with HEAVY DAY. Guilty Gear DESERVES more recognition.

[@JoyceW-Art]

I've been so excited to see this covered by you! I've seen the presentation before, but you manage to explain this technique and information in such excitement that it just makes it extremely enjoyable to watch these videos ^^

[@222LoneWolf]

I'm sure you've gotten lots of these requests already, but allow me to toss in my own vote in support of seeing some kind of an addendum or follow-up to this video that talks about the refinements that the newly released Guilty Gear STRIVE adds to the playing field. Of course, it may also be worth waiting a bit longer to first see what kinds of details ArcSys themselves share about the upgrades they have made.

[@MrCervantesent]

Gotta give an honorable mention to SNK/ATLUS for KOF XIII's style of animation. They animated the characters by hand, and that was no easy task, and it was worth it. The gameplay was superb!

[@chillnight2663]

5:01 I guess you could say "Art System Works"

[@eSSentialplaysYT]

I am still blown away by FighterZ every time I watch a tournament or match. It's just unreal how good the recreation of DB's art style really is.

[@thesesimple]

Congrats on another super informative video, Dan and company! Just wanted to add one more (smart) trick they use to sell the 2D look: They force the camera to be orthographic on the characters. That way, it doesn't matter where a character is on the screen, perspective won't deform the siluette, selling the sprite look. Anyway, great video as always. Also, great selection of Guilty Gear OST tracks. All of those are bangers!

[@Thentavius]

I love how Faust was the example for 'extreme and bizarre ways models can be manipulated.' Dan must've taken one look at this kooky doctor and thought 'yep, that definitely needs to be shown in full'.

[@Anonymous-zThor]

I use to think i loved DB Xenoverse but when i started playing FighterZ i realized i wasnt going to settle anymore for Xenoverse and only for FighterZ they really did a amazing job making me feel like i was re watching my childhood anime over again even if i was fighting Goku vs Goku it just looked simply amazing never have i loved a Dragon Ball Game as much as FighterZ and Kakarot.

[@Demon0no]

"I can not wait to see what arc system works has in store for us next" Well, apparently a new guilty gear, that looks even better than the last one.

[@exquisitecorpse4917]

I hope it still plays similarly....top level Guilty Gear is a thing of beauty, and I really don't want to see them dumb everything down the way they did between BBCF and BB tag

[@Demon0no]

@@exquisitecorpse4917 BBTAG is a spin-off. The next real blazblue (if we ever get one) will be as complex as BBCF. And the next Guilty gear will be as hardcore as sign.

[@Thentavius]

@@exquisitecorpse4917 The announcement Ishiwatari made on the GG site says they're taking the game apart and building something new from scratch using the pieces that made GG unique in the first place. Gotta say, I'm excited.

[@arjVSwild]

@@exquisitecorpse4917 It unfortunately looks like they're indulging the myth that simplifying the game will appeal to a wider audience, ArcSystems Works has at least been communicating though and I'm still hyped and hopeful for the game. And holy shit does it look beautiful.

[@Madaragun]

I didnt even know I was watching 17 minutes worth of footage untill you stop talking. Something about the way you told the narrative made me wanted to stay tuned in and trust me when I say thats not easy because I have a short attention span lol. Awsome work

[@khi-jonchua985]

I got goosebumps and tears in my eyes when I first saw the reveal trailer for Xrd. So beautiful.

[@bluesteele5786]

Good choice of subject. The Dragon Ballz game has some stellar animation.

[@ValkyrieTiara]

I know you probably did it to troll people like me but I'm still fucking mad at you. 7/10

[@Changetheling]

Without Daisuke Ishiwatari, none of this would've been possible. From the character designs till the soundtrack, that's a true Renaissance Man for you.

[@FirithPanda]

9:30 - Nobody is going to talk about how ruthlessly Elphelt stopped to call Sin's jays fake before stepping on them and blasting him?

[@nellancaster]

YES! You've finally covered this game! Thank you! Guilty Gear is my all-time favorite fighting game, and Xrd's awesome pseudo-2D animations are something I've always wanted you to discuss for quite a while!

[@DennerBob]

The obsessive dedication to quality on display in these games is wild. I had no idea Arc Systems had actually been referencing 3D models for their sprites already. Now I really need to get over to that GDC talk. Thanks for the great video and for sharing your sources Dan!

[@GenericName0042]

Another thing about DBFZ: The VAST majority of character moves are recreations of movements that the characters make in the shows, films, and occasionally even the manga. And I don't just mean the special moves. I mean the individual, single button attacks are just ripped from the anime itself. And we can TELL, and it looks GOOD. That level of attention to detail for DBFZ is INSANE

[@SystemBD]

Oh, how I waited for this episode! The cell-shading tricks they explain in the GDC presentation are really interesting indeed... but there if there is something key to this aesthetic, it's a lot of passion and an even bigger amount of work.

[@Stocking13]

I think ARCS have perfected the 2D-3D animation after DB Fighters. Then they blew me out of the water with Kill La Kill. That game looks beautiful.

[@faidou9954]

Too bad the games dead now.

[@BknMoonStudios]

To put it in fewer words: *_ArcSys does not allow the computer to automate any part of the animation process. They manually craft each component, just as they did with 2D animation. By doing this, they get to keep all the "quirks and imperfections" that would be smoothed out by the machine._*

[@AugustoXRock]

Nice timing Dan!! We're just starting a fighting game in the studio I work, you're video came just at the right moment :D

[@solidjb]

Can you tell us about it?)

[@AugustoXRock]

@@solidjb Sorry guys, can't tell anything about it :/

[@shisuiki]

In any case good luck to you and the team!

[@tyrantravealpha]

Can you tell us the studio name? Even if you can't I wish you the best of luck!

[@ramsey276]

Great fortune in your venture... BUT AS SOON AS YOU CAN SPAM ALL THE INFO ON YOU CAN

[@bryanv82]

I applaud all the hard work going on at ARC, they managed to capture the same Db super Broly animation style into the game from watching the new FighterZ dlc

[@runbaa9285]

That Big Bang Kamehameha really distorts the model a whole lot. I never thought I'd see that kind of distortion in a 3D animation.

[@Xaivius]

11:30 This clip of Dizzy's victory animation is a wonderful example of what you speak of with limited animation. It is truly incredible how far we've come in 2 short decades, both technologically and aesthetically. Thank you for breaking down this principle of 'making one's tools work to benefit oneself' :)

[@Monroah]

On the whole cutting corners thing, often budget isn't the biggest issue (at least, for anime, from what I've researched, anyway), but rather just being able to get them done in time, because of how hellish the anime development cycle can be for many shows and studios (hi, A1 Pictures!) over there. Dragon Ball Super is a great example for how budget can't replace time, and OPM season 1 just had a great team on a modest budget, but still crafted a beautiful season. Don't get me wrong, budget matters, too, as more money = a higher limit on maximum frames per episode, but often time and manpower are what caused anime's limitations, more than anything. This is for the non-animation fans, by the way, I'm sure the guys working on the show probably are already aware as they are, well, animators, themselves, as far as I'm aware.

[@BouncyAnimation]

you can call it time but ultimately it is still more about budget... if they needed to draw more frames in a short amount of time, they would hire more animators.

[@Monroah]

@@BouncyAnimation Oh, budget definitely matters, particularly in games, where you're using software along with hardware, I'm not going to deny that, it's just everytime I hear someone say that animation in something is great, they usually go, "that's the episode with the most budget/where the animators actually tried," which is kind of doing the animators dirty by boiling their talents down to just money and not because of good scheduling/directionm

[@幽霊船-o4h]

The reason is budget and the fact that many anime somehow are made weekly while it's still airing instead of getting the 12 episodes done beforehand so that there is no stress

[@RanniTheMarketablePlush]

GG 2020 got announced and it looks fantastic I'm very hyped for it

[@phhase0203]

I came here to watch this video after playing the new Guilty Gear Strive. It amazes me how beautiful and well animated this game is. It's really impressive.

[@akiraishin7141]

You know, you just gave me a second wind to work on a project I've been making for the past 2 months. Thanks Dan! Let's go Raditz for FighterZ!!!

[@senza4591]

4:04 I love the terminology of two-and-a-half d

[@nowheredan27]

I-NO's intro animation with the sparks coming out of the guitar neck is grade A amazing. Easily my favorite from GG Xrd.

[@ZealStarMedia]

Why couldn’t these guys make Jump Force?!?!

[@sauceman5744]

MoJo Claw 'bandai'

[@ZealStarMedia]

Sauce Man What?

[@electronresonator8882]

@@ZealStarMedia is like asking why couldn't CDPR make Fallout 76 and Battlefield V

[@ZealStarMedia]

Electron Resonator Because they wouldn’t make the game any better?

[@94Ninsound94]

Budget. Jump Force is a weak effort project... Just good enough to be speak off and get weak anime fan wet enough to pull the trigger...

[@nougatbitz]

Once a year or so I stumble across a truly great new channel - this is it! subbed!!!

[@gwynbleidd7177]

All I can say is Bravo. Their techniques really brought the best Dragon Ball fighting game to life. They also replicate anime visually so damn well for 3D and their acardes games stand out everywhere. Really makes you lose your mind in terms of the overall quality they put into each game.

[@Reydriel]

Granblue Fantasy Versus looks even more impressive IMO, because the artstyle and colours don't resemble most actual TV anime, but rather the coloured illustrations you may find in LNs or manga, which have may too much detail to be animated.

[@themage1016]

Reydriel Funny enough ppl have been joking around that GBV exists so that GG 2020 could look better

[@ymeynot0405]

+Dan Your editing in this video was amazing. Really impressive work.

[@JO-hs1ue]

Just beat hifi rush, basically the same idea, but with a more comic book feel instead. Such a beautiful game

[@sweetasbloodredjam]

Sadly wer're probably not going to see this level of animation implemented in actual shows because the whole point of using 3D in Anime is to save cost. However, as you pointed out, in order to look convincing 2D style animation needs actual character model variations and swaps. Strech and sqash are 2D animation fundamentals and going beyond that breaking shape is one of the defining features of the anime aesthetic. While breaking shape is something that is relatively easy to do in a 2D space (when you're drawing every frame anyways, you might as well deviate in shape), but way more work when you have to fully model each new frame, negating the cost savings. That is why anctual handdrawn animation tends to look lively even with minimal animation, while 2D Style 3D animation often looks lifeless and robotic. On that note, the one thing, besides minor instances in the character animation, that imo Arc System works hasn't perfected yet, is properly 2D looking backgrounds. unually the illusion is broken as soon as the camera starts moving even a little bit. Regardless, tehir approach is amazing.

[@reverbthevocal421]

Personally, I think a good start for this 2.5D style is to make detachable skeletons for the models. That way you only need to focus on certain layers of the pose at a time. It's like how I drew action poses with a mouse. I used a 3D software to pose ellipsoids to make the basic shapes of the different limbs, which helped millions, especially with drawing using a basic computer mouse.

[@KaminariHouse]

On the backgrounds, I think that's because they are still trying to keep that Arcade feeling that they've had since the beginning.

[@TetsuDeinonychus]

Having 2D animators draw over the cel-shaded 3D to make corrections (and add smear-effects etc) and using shape-keys/sculpting tools to mess with the shapes are ways to add 2D level fluidity to 3D animation, while still being less work/money than pure 2D animation.

[@taltus674]

But.. but.. beastars

[@caiobruno8006]

Everytime technology and stuff like this starts to appear, new and clever ways to make it easier to be done is created.

[@trupotato]

This blows my mind every single time I hear anyone talk about it.

[@rentalsnake6542]

Every time I see this video in my recommended, I end up watching the whole thing all over again.

[@NoCapsNoSpacesofficial]

Hey, I just bought Lethal League Blaze after having enjoyed the original and have been absolutely blown away by the sheer awesomeness and style of its animation. Please do a video on it!

[@TaroOmiya]

When the line, "I really hope to see more studios take a crack at this sort of thing in the future," my first reaction was, "so what's Dan's thoughts about Lethal League Blaze?"

[@NoCapsNoSpacesofficial]

@@TaroOmiya imo it's not rly the same. While yes, it uses a cel shaded look, it's not trying to look 2D the same way arc's games are. I was more referring to the game's strong pose & character design, and I love the game's aesthetic for feeling like a hidden gem of the GameCube era

[@alcatrazclad]

15:33 And their 4th attempt has already knocked that out of the water

[@samfivedot]

I'll never forget watching that first Xrd trailer, getting to the bit where the camera spins around, and just completely losing my mind. Like, HOW ARE THEY DOING THIS

[@JBlackMage2]

And now you'll have to make a new video when Guilty Gear 2020 hits.

[@ニンジン-t3f]

作る側の秘話みたいなのを知れるのってワクワクするな

[@モブ3-c1y]

意外とここら辺の技術について触れてくれる人日本人でいなかったから嬉しい〜😂 最近ギルティギアハマってモーションいいな…と思ってたからこの動画にたどりつけて良かった。日本語字幕もすごく助かった👏👏

[@emptyvending8964]

15:03 and he's the protag

[@SAPProd]

3:51 is the moment 3D game graphics changed. This is the most underrated game-changing moment ever.

[@thewitchcoven]

As someone with a shit computer though, it was IMMEDIATELY obvious that these games were 3D

[@sonnybrown4758]

Honestly, this is the future. We are constantly walking things back with new tech. This is an example of how 2d techniques shouldn’t be thrown out and 3D running away with possibility needed to be reeled back to really make the feel complete. I’d like to see a game come out using this technique at 24fps. Can you imagine Akira the game?

[@TetsuDeinonychus]

I'd love if Capcom could embrace this technique to recreate Street Fighter III's animation in HD 3D.

[@mariokartgamecube]

Even though there are definitely times when you can tell it's 3D, when this style works it works *so well*. There were so many moments when I went "ok, but that part had to have been 2D right? right?"

[@ennueru6896]

13:22 I swear,this line makes me think i'm looking at an Animation version of Masterchef

[@brettd2308]

Fantastic video. It feels like there are a lot of lessons that anime studios working with 3D animation could take away from these games. Also I love seeing all that Konosuba in there :D

[@wazanne6820]

omg thank you for showing 1:25 , I've been trying to search for that one game I've played as a kid and immediately search for all Arc's NES games because you showed that and I finally found it TT Thank you for helping this man finding their childhood memories back.

[@notealist]

summary arc system works is super good at this and they made guilty gear with 5 methods 1. cell shading specific to a character to replicate handmade pixel art instead of a dynamic figure 2. no keyframe interpolation. kept at an artificially produced 8-12 fps. 3. make it look like you did it with hand drawn animation, holding frames. 4. artificially create "imperfections" so it looks like hand drawn animation 5. speedlines and smear frames bonus chapter for dragon ball fighterz - keep the style specific to your source reference material

[@agenthappypotato868]

13:43 ngl was expecting you to say "THE anime look"