The Best Web-Swinging Ever? - Marvel’s Spider-Man (2018) and Spider-Man 2 (2004) | Video Essay

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

Follow-up Miles Morales video available now! ;) kzbin.info/www/bejne/qp3IeJxrgKica7M And the promised Spider-Man 2 retrospective series begins here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/aIm0o32koc50qJI

[@Kinguardia]

Put them together

[@tylerhansen931]

I think you really had to be there back in 2004 to really understand how good that game is for being a movie tie-in. No other spider man game did web swinging like SM2 and it was so unexpectedly good

[@hioman]

What about spiderman 3? I haven't played 2 but I might end up buying it soon.

[@MagicMorales]

Nah the best web swing was Web of shadows

[@Kazuma_Drake]

The 1st game I ever owned and played it for Xbox I loved it even if Insomniac did do a great job they can learn from the past game.

[@tylerhansen931]

@@hioman 3 is a huge step backward in terms of web swinging. Its stiffer, slower, and more limited

[@hioman]

@@tylerhansen931 ok

[@silverking4215]

Remember in Spider-Man 2 when you could hold onto 2 webs at once. One in each hand.

[@centurionl]

Best part

[@GrizzlyTank]

You can control each arm independently with the left and right shoulder buttons. I actually prefer that to the newer game. It felt more intuitive.

[@Trigger200284]

@@GrizzlyTank me too. I have not even played the new game because I know it will never be what 2 was almost 20 years ago, which is pathetic

[@andrewdiolosa3861]

Yessss I remember it was perfect

[@Infergal]

And you could slingshot yourself 😭😍

[@LuigiTuazon]

I played the SM2 back in the day almost everyday just to practice web swinging and being more fluid. It really felt like I was a newbie Peter Parker at first but when I had more time practicing swinging and unlocking some swinging poses and abilities, it felt more rewarding. I never got tired of swinging in SM2.

[@boot5672]

Same thing for me in spiderman 3

[@EverRusting]

@home9dog2blue yeah, if I had to list cons of that game those would be - Lack of costumes (only because PS1 games had tons of them) - Very dull looking, no color vibrancy (again PS1 games were very vibrant in colors) - Combat was not fun (I was mostly spamming the helicopter move) - Getting into lategame is demoralizing since most spawns become those mechsuit guys But the traversing enjoyment is still unparalleled

[@Thejammindodgersfan]

WHY DOES NO ONE TALK ABOUT THE FACT YOU CAN HOLD A WEB AS LONG AS YOU WANT IN SPIDER-MAN 2 BUT IT AUTOMATICALLY LETS IT GO IN INSOMNIAC’S SPIDER-MAN

[@Motivation_snack6668]

Who told you that or where did u see it, that's a complete lie lmao

[@Thejammindodgersfan]

@@Motivation_snack6668 it’s a fact cause you can just play the game and find out yourself 🥴

[@imstuff205]

@@Motivation_snack6668 8:00 did you watch the video?

[@Motivation_snack6668]

@@imstuff205 i did, and it doesn't say in the video, but you can still hold on to the web as long as you want in marvels spiderman, and if you hold on for long enough, spidey will do his iconic pose upside down on the web

[@imstuff205]

@@Motivation_snack6668 I think they meant swinging forever on one web but you’re right

[@sethhuff1755]

The one thing that I miss from the 2004 game is the momentum you could build. Sometimes the Insomniac web swinging feels too slow, especially when you switch to 60 fps.

[@tsugikuniyoriichi22]

I agree with this in the new game even when you jump from the tallest building there is almost no momentum to it.

[@isaiahcooper203]

Thats why i like amazing spiderman 2. U had to switch hands and keep momentum

[@jeffboy4231]

that's because the game can't render that fast

[@dixienormus7289]

@@isaiahcooper203 in that game there's no momentum at all bro

[@daveski7]

rigid speed caps are really something that video games need to get rid of. especially games like these. Just let us go fast!

[@faizalnurajiz5490]

You have to understand, being a kid in the 2000, a huge spiderman fan, watching the movies, and playing this. Spiderman 2 truly let you feel like you're top of the world back then, it was an unforgettable experience.

[@lifeonmars03]

Definitely

[@HollowRick]

100% I was 12 when this game came out coming from playing spider man 2000 and spider man 2002 it blew my mind

[@happyraptor7986]

My greatest pet peeve with modern day video games is hand-holding/god-mode mechanics. I love the difficultly and freedom of the 2004 game. You'd get punished if you fell into the ground, but that's why it felt so good. You'd jump off a skyscraper and wait for the last possible minute to swing and be sitting on the edge of your seat hoping you wouldn't hit the ground. In the new game you know you won't die, that removes any edge of seat moments.

[@teneesh3376]

The major problem is that it's the only option. It would be fine if it was an accessibility option in the menu. The automation is great for accessibility. But it's not optional, so it can feel a bit too much and can make the traversal kinda boring

[@shehansoysa571]

I just played Spiderman 2 again. Man, it is good but not great. The "hand holding" definitely makes for a better swinging experience. That being said, I do hope that in the future they add things like button combos for wall running and other special swinging mechanics.

[@chudchadanstud]

@@teneesh3376 Yup. I wish their tests included an optional mode just to see which ones players will pick as they gain skill with the game. I personally would have turned it off and dealt with the frustration. It's also a missed opportunity for some sort of online competition.

[@AImighty_Loaf]

@@shehansoysa571 The hand holding makes for a more dull experience. Not better

[@EverRusting]

​@@shehansoysa571 You actually gotta unlock some speed upgrades in Spider-Man 2 (PS2/XB/GC) for web swinging to start being fun, you can't just create a new game and swing fast. Also if I'm not mistaken, speed upgrades also affect your jump height. When you just start the game Spider-Man is very weak in all fronts. Not one of those instant gratification games.

[@justincombs7900]

I actually like in Miles Morales how he actually messes up while swinging but somehow it is still a seamless experience

[@adhd3688]

I think That's Part Of the Game They Made Miles Really Accurate Because I think he is still trying to get used to his New Powers Like I heard when He zigline zags He Loses Balance or Something idk 🙄

[@The_Rude_French_Canadian]

Yeah the swinging is better in mile morales lol going back to the first one is kind of hard after playing this one lol

[@deadlyghost4021]

@@The_Rude_French_Canadian cuz Peter is a calm man and wasn't teenager and was heavier but miles is young he is new to his abilities his weight is very low

[@wwalton]

I think currently it has the best web-swinging especially with the venom abilities

[@Tyreker]

@@wwalton not to mention the air tricks After playing MM wit doing tricks in the air and then playing Spider-Man, MM tricks easier to pull off, there are more tricks and it’s a lot more fun

[@Spelonker]

Fully agree. I'm hoping they tweak it for the new one and add in things like web collision, or some sort of hardcore mode that turns off the guides, but I doubt it.

[@duke3250]

really burns me up that they let play testers have input at all. i know theres money to be made but i wish theyd leave it up to the developers.

[@ramsesclviii2584]

in 2077 we will have 50tb worth of animations bc we love animations. we are animation junkies. yes if there was a sim mode for spiderman. full manual controls and skill based gameplay. it'd be sick to play spiderboi in a peterparkour tournament of sorts eh. we will have enough animations machine learning and full manual controls to fully be killing our time in the future.

[@TheJungaBoon]

I always figured it's like this: Spiderman doesn't have to think when he's web-swinging. It's pretty automatic for him as another extension of his body. The best way to translate that to games is to have those guides to help the player's movement so they feel just as at ease as Spiderman does.

[@ramsesclviii2584]

you are right. marvel spiderman just did that. set the bar. now we dont want to change that. its great just how it is. Its alltogether a different thing here. we want a simulation. Because now we want to know how spiderman started his amateur career. We want to hit signboards during our first web swing in a more refined manner. Add a little flair with some homework. So that not everyone can do it easily and need not do it. This wouldnt please anyone. But it will sure please sadists like me.

[@duke3250]

@@TheJungaBoon sounds like this version of the game comes with a lifetime subscription to soy milk though

[@aliloomi]

Finally someone sees the beauty of web swinging in Spider man 2 over the new one.

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

I'm working on a retrospective for the whole game, and there's a 45-minute segment on SM2's swinging mechanics... I hope I do it justice there! I'm very happy to celebrate those mechanics. :)

[@EverRusting]

IDK it felt more like complaining. Not just the swinging, the entire traversal arsenal is much better in the old game, you can charge your jump not just when running and actually jump high, you can wall jump (which can be charged too), you can catapult yourself which Spider-Man does a lot in movies/shows. I have no idea what was going inside Insomniac's head when they decided to not include any of his traversal abilities from the old game.

[@antonellpr]

Don’t mean it’s better cuz it’s not

[@NTEDOG561]

@@antonellprit is

[@fuzzyotterpaws4395]

A game is supposed to be FUN lol. You're playing as Spider-Man, zipping through and having fun and just hanging nowhere or constantly dying isn't fun lol

[@iandean6316]

My issue with Insomniac is it stops and slows down your momentum. Sometimes you just cant stop feeling that the swinging is way too slow

[@surge2218]

I remember insomniac saying that the reason you can’t swing faster is because the ps4 couldn’t handle rendering everything faster than it already is

[@iandean6316]

@@surge2218 seems reasonable enough.

[@firesnakex8]

@@surge2218 lets hope it gets faster in the sequel then

[@TylerSane5]

I doubt that since you can't go any faster on PS5 either!.

[@surge2218]

@@TylerSane5 the ps5 version is just a remastered version of the ps4,it’s the same game.The main aspect is to enhance the games visuals and performance,they don’t really make big changes like that to the game itself.

[@Ace-hv7ym]

Spider-Man 2 web swinging takes skill

[@itsfishing_]

It doesnt it's very easy

[@Itsnoahscott]

lol

[@syminite1]

@@itsfishing_ It does take skill by comparison, Spiderman web of shadows, and Spiderman ps4 have a much easier and forgiving swing mechanic.

[@itsfishing_]

@@syminite1 it was easy for me back then

[@markaccino1786]

@@itsfishing_ you're just too good man xD, i think its kinda easy too, but compared to the new spiderman game, it seems hard to swing without being stoped by a building

[@TBAG]

you are using the Raimi suit so this video is already good!

[@juk3bug]

love to see t-bag watching spider-man videos. you should make your own!!

[@The_Kuichiki_man]

No

[@Sef-Lo]

Yes x9000

[@themasterassasin3665]

Raimi suit is a legend

[@davidcampbell3050]

Of course

[@zainalarshed1035]

Glad to know I'm not the only one who spent years trying to perfect Spider-Man 2's web swinging and finding creative uses for it.

[@desertfox738]

I can’t even describe how mind blowing Spider-Man 2 was back in the day, used to spend hours swinging around the city and fighting crime (and sometimes people would be hanging off buildings, so I’d go to where they were then watch them lose their grip 😂. Loved the little side missions).

[@fromthatday6334]

I still prefer sm2's real physics, it feels more satisfying since it's so hard to master and man your production is amazing, I can't believe you only have 905 subs

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

I only had 500 when I first uploaded this, so I'm pretty thrilled with the response so far. ;)

[@fromthatday6334]

@@TheWhoniversalMan would love to see more video game related videos from you and btw I saw you make music, I do too haha

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

@@fromthatday6334 Yeah, I've dumped a lot of random creative projects here over the years, but stuff like this video is my main priority for the future. The only issue is it takes a while to make videos like this! ;)

[@fromthatday6334]

@@TheWhoniversalMan I can tell it takes time but it's definitely worth the wait buddy 💯 can't wait to see more

[@superior2096]

I can respect that.

[@JayandJay223344]

Just the fact webs in SM2 can be caught on other objects adds infinite variation in the system which can be some of the most satisfying moments in playing a spiderman game like when a huge arc gets shortened by half and your speed skyrocket forward, also the fact that web attachment in SM PS4 practically means nothing does make the character feel like a pendulum since no matter how far the left or right the web sticks, you can always swing in the opposite direction

[@SharkHead]

I feel like insomniac’s new spider man game, Miles Morales, gets this right. I could watch those swings for so long cuz they are so smooth and satisfying

[@starrynight4602]

Definitely feel the same

[@JMex-eg5uf]

And just filled with the exaggerated swagger of a black teen

[@Raddarabba]

@@JMex-eg5uf lol, The memes generated off this

[@boredXsomethingXIDK]

They didn't improve anything tho they just added new animations.

[@SharkHead]

@@boredXsomethingXIDK new animations that FLOW into each other extremely smoothly. It’s super satisfying, especially because it’s amplified with the exaggerated swagger of a black teen

[@eziospaghettiauditore8369]

I feel like my heart goes to my chest with adrenaline rush when I dive off a building and swing at the last second in Spider-Man 2 not in Spider-Man PS4

[@prodigy410]

Did anyone mention being able to slingshot in Spider-Man 2. That was one of my favorite features

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

It seems I have a very unpopular opinion on that... I actually avoid getting that upgrade so I can do two-handed swinging without sending myself backward. I never found it fast enough to use compared to just normal Level 8 swinging. A handful of commenters have brought this up, and it feels weird being out of step with people on this one!

[@cuddi15]

​@Caleb Jablonicky Lol You Might Have To Go Back To It. Ik You Saw That "New" Feature In The New Spider Man Trailer

[@alcthetalc14]

I whole heartedly agree with this, Spider-Man 2018 is a great game but I could lose hours just swinging in Spider-Man 2. You sir have earned a subscriber.

[@ethancastillo7582]

The way I see it, Insomniac’s swinging is extremely accessible and responsive. However, it’s focused on forward locomotion and doesn’t really encourage changing heights and variable movement. Spider-Man 2’s has an extreme learning curve and is completely physics-based. While it takes a long time to master, it is much more satisfying to learn. I think Web of Shadows perfectly encapsulates both were its simple enough to play, but also deep enough with its several types of web zipping, swing launches, etc, that it also has a learning curve. It doesn’t ground the player to floating swinging or forward momentum like PS4 and it’s not the most complicated physics sim like SM2

[@Sophie_the_Sapphic]

This perfectly incapsulates how I feel, thank you.

[@ZanzibarWizard]

Nailed it.

[@ethancastillo7582]

@@Sophie_the_Sapphic no. thank you.

[@ethancastillo7582]

@@ZanzibarWizard thanks!

[@ZanzibarWizard]

Alaa eddine Abdelkader ok lol

[@joancolon6404]

Eventhough spiderman 2018 is a masterpiece, spiderman 2 will always have a special place in my heart, this game coming out in 2004 was good enough for that time

[@RZ_2K]

i still dont get how they made such good swinging in sm2 but then weirded it out and ruined it in sm3 for the ps2

[@sheriffdraws8789]

It's honestly better than Insomniacs which felt like autopilot

[@devourerinthemist]

Your vocal delivery is what I would expect from like G4 back during the time SM2 actually came out. Bravo for that alone, good sir.

[@clarkkent1473]

7:08 can we all agree that this is one of the best swinging moves ever?

[@RedHotSackboy]

I’m not sure how feasible this would be but I hope Insomniac gives us the choice between these two systems in the Spider-Man sequel for PS5.

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

One thing that's just about certain: the swinging will be faster. In the 2019 GDC presentation I mentioned, Doug Sheahan mentioned the maximum possible speed was capped by the PS4's ability to stream the city environment. We won't see any changes in the cross-gen Miles Morales, but for the full sequel, I think that would definitely add some satisfaction to dive bombing from the Empire State Building! Brian Intihar previously rejected the idea of an optional fall damage setting, but maybe with the system being familiar to many players now, there's some room to push things a bit further without compromising that empowering Spider-Man experience. As far as I can imagine, having more options to loop around on your webs wouldn't hurt anything!

[@umutakdeniz3399]

@@TheWhoniversalMan i hope they will make a system thats easy to pickup but hard to master.

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

@@umutakdeniz3399 The revamped air tricks/Venom Boost system in Miles Morales makes me hope they'll lean further in that direction-include optional tricks and such for both Spider-Men that will allow for speed boosts and stuff. So you can still swing the way you could in the 2018 game, but to get really good results, you have to find creative ways to get tricks in there. They also have a sort of fall damage if you don't swing in time while doing tricks, and I think they could double down on this risk-reward element and build out a more complex and interesting system. I think keeping those elements optional, but desirable, might be key to balancing both!

[@umutakdeniz3399]

@@TheWhoniversalMan thats nice to hear that they have changed the system a little bit. I myself have platinumed spiderman ps4 and at the end of the day web swinging became a bit repetitive for me. Im actually much more interested for the miles version because of the little changes that you mentioned and the animation ofcourse. Fortunately i do have the ps5 but i just dont have time to play the miles version :( Btw this video production was very amazing and professional. I thought that you had atleast 10.000 subs. Keep making these great videos :)

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

@@umutakdeniz3399 Aw, thank you! :) I hope you'll get to play Miles Morales before too long. I wasn't expecting many changes from a smaller game made so quickly, but they definitely seem to be heading in the right direction. So I think we have a lot to look forward to whenever the full sequel might happen. ;)

[@kenobi3]

why do you have such little amount of subscribers? this is actually an awesome channel! can't wait for you to hit 1k

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

Aw, thank you! :) I'm just getting started doing video essays and stuff, so I hope to pursue an audience with more material like this. It really makes me happy to hear your enthusiasm! :)

[@kenobi3]

@@TheWhoniversalMan no problem man, I've seen that most video essays get a lot of attention, especially Spider-Man ones. I'll definitely be watching every future video from now on. cya in the next one :)

[@imdaking2402]

Ye

[@fahimal-ashab2822]

Hello there

[@NvanRoblox]

This is true!

[@girlthatsjusttim3468]

Bruh when I checked the subs I was gonna think you had at lease 10k.. your underrated

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

Aw, thank you! I'm just getting started on video essay content, so hopefully I can get a little closer to that milestone eventually. ;)

[@RayyanKhanRayyanKhan]

@@TheWhoniversalMan Keep going. The numbers might look demotivating at the start but they will rack on if you make great consistent content like this.

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

@@RayyanKhanRayyanKhan Thank you! I just wish I could make stuff faster! ;)

[@VinnieSajan]

What a great way to give each game their due respect. Both games have pros and cons and as a result deliver different experiences.

[@Young_Special]

But we all want the BEST... And insomniac has that potential! They just need to open a lot of things up to enter a line of perfection.

[@boot5672]

I like that they fixed the running on the ground thing in spiderman 3, and that you could keep holding your web line for as long as you like. I want more swinging freedom in the other game

[@awesomeDAN2011]

I wish we could do loops and more drastic curves while swinging, Miles Morales has more air tricks than the 2018 game so that's a good start

[@Bloodhurl67]

Seriously I want to do the loop that Tobey's Spiderman does with the crane

[@ChaplinofEdits]

I still think web of shadows did it best.But overall I think this was an amazing video keep up the good work.

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

Web of Shadows definitely belongs with these ones at the top... I don't think any others even come close! I kept the scope a little narrower to make sure this video was focused, but WOS definitely deserves some praise, too. :)

[@dangersam6696]

@@TheWhoniversalMan Ultimate Spider-Man also has some pretty solid web swinging. Definitely wasn’t the best, but still really good in my opinion

[@bullymaguire2913]

What’s your thoughts on miles morales web swinging? How do you think it improved from the first game? 🤔

[@notever8401]

@@bullymaguire2913 it’s much more expressive and lively because of Miles’ style, venom powers add versatility and help maintain speed, it’s literally smoother with 60 fps, and the trick system is vastly improved with your tricks blending seamlessly into your swings, and there are 5(?) more tricks you can do while you dive. Plus the tricks look way cooler

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

@@bullymaguire2913 I agree with what Notever said here, and I think the most interesting addition is being given a concrete reward (Venom Boosts) for doing air tricks. I really think this could be taken further in future games and incorporate a deeper risk-reward system to get speed boosts and such. I think that could apply to Peter in some way, too. That and the smoother animations adds quite a lot to the existing system, and it's got me pretty optimistic about whatever Insomniac does next! :)

[@itsaxel8088]

I liked the swinging in spiderman PS4 but I prefer the faster and skillful swinging of spiderman 2

[@sca8217]

No. PS4 Spidey is essentially a extended QuickTime event whereas the PS2 webswinging was an art, took skill and felt immensely rewarding. The PS4 one is essentially the equivalent of walking forward with the forward DPad pressed , whereas the PS2 one is one huge platformer mechanism , where your skill matters.

[@Sentinel_Saturn]

Web of shadows movement and parkour combined is highly underrated with even combat (web strikes and the different types of them ) enhancing it even more. Nice in between for both games

[@marvoo6917]

Insomniac should definetly watch this video. It is exacly the same perspective that I have of the two games web swinging systems. I couldn't agree more with you, seriously. Your video is so professional: the editing, the soundtrack and your critics were all on point. Keep up the good work!

[@newdraftanimations]

So true man! Same as you here from Italy 🇮🇹

[@marvoo6917]

@@newdraftanimations ah ma potevi dirlo prima bro ahahaha

[@weaverquest]

We already know Insomniac play tested every kind of approach to swinging and this video just reinforces their choice. Even after 16 years of "player expression" with the PS2 game Spider-Man PS4's swinging clips look more stylish. And in Miles Morales the swinging got even better.

[@chauncyjohncastro7541]

@@weaverquest I played a lot of games which doesn't promote generic traversal and yet you could perform some cool stuffs,you know the fact that the only thing that ps2 game lack is animations right?Because if they really did it that way we can perform the tricks peter is doing rn but with dedication and skills,not just holding the r2 and then releasing it.

[@frogglen6350]

Insomniac literally hand the creator of SM2 play SM PS4. They already know about SM 2's outdated *clunky* web swinging. Spiderman ps4 sold like hotcakes. *majority* agree that the game is great. Insomniac doesn't need srome butpicky youtuber tmwho has never made a game to tell them what to do.

[@sirQB]

What I loved most about sm2 swinging was genuinely being bad at it at first, them gradually getting better because I was understanding the physics instead of just getting used to the game controls. No SM have had recreated that "learning how to swing" feel that sm2 gave me. It literally felt like an organic recreation of Peter Parker swinging for the first time.

[@newdraftanimations]

Oh my god!! Finally someone who actually understand fully both games and gives his own thoughts with reasoning and not just by saying: “yeah Spider-Man 2018.. is the mainstream one! Is obviously cooler!”. Totally agree at 10:00

[@Zukoiu]

I think the fact that Spider-Man 2 has a skill requirement makes it superior. There's nothing more fun than actually getting things right, as opposed to having things handed to you for free.

[@wichiewamirez5599]

The fact that you can hold onto a web and shoot another one in Spider-Man 2 is something that needs to come back

[@rorystrain6981]

6:56 never seen that animation b4, how?

[@gabrielcaro]

Shopping for upgrades :)

[@sebastianasantiago7382]

After playing Spiderman 2, especially after getting used to the web swinging and upgraded to level 8, the swinging in Spiderman 2 is so satisfying and rewarding that playing Marvel Spiderman feels so automated that it got boring, this is how I feel tbh

[@sebastianasantiago7382]

@dmn That’s the problem, most people who play Spiderman games, don’t want a challenging web swinging to get good at, believe me, anything that requires to get good at, will want you coming back for more

[@sebastianasantiago7382]

@dmn Even in Spiderman 2 there was an easy swinging mode, And I bet most people used easy swinging and saying that the web swinging sucks, and others who played normal swinging (most SpiderMan 2 videos on KZbin have bad swinging)

[@XYZip1]

@@sebastianasantiago7382 to be fair, both swinging systems kept the same physics

[@sebastianasantiago7382]

@@XYZip1 Have you attempted to finish the Challenges and their mega times?

[@dorkasaurus_rex]

Automated is a great word for it

[@jordanMJK]

FINALLY!!! Some one who understands 100% the real difference between the 2 swining styles. Your on point about how spider-man 2s swining when done well enough gives you a rush of speed and adrenaline till there is nothing left but the sound of the wind rushing past you. Plus to even get to that point to begin with takes time to master the swinging mechanics of old. In the old game I feel like I accomplished something finally getting good at swining without hitting building and keeping my style and momentum/speed going. As much as I love the cinematic wish fulfillment of the ps4/ps5 version. If I ever want to try webswinging on "hard mode" I always have the OG Spider-Man 2. P.S I love how clear and to the point you were with your review and how well you did your research on Spider-Man 2s webswinging. Ive literally watched dozens of comparison videos on the two and no one besides your self has ever really dive deep into the speed and complete control over your movements like you have. I can't wait to see more of what else you plan to offer man🤟

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

Aw, thank you! :) I haven't watched a ton of other stuff on this topic, but what I've seen (like the Evan Filarca and Game Informer videos I referenced) definitely doesn't show Spider-Man 2 at its best! Hopefully the research will again be up to expectations when I post my Spider-Man 2 retrospective. ;)

[@casedistorted]

Just bought Spiderman Remastered on PC and this exact question kept going through my mind. I was in HIGH SCHOOL when Spider-Man 2 came out on PS2. I remember playing it at friends houses after school ffs. I waited for so many years after 2004 for another Spiderman game on console to come out with web swinging just as good, but we never EVER got it. Until maybe now.. I haven't played the remastered game much but here's hoping it's anywhere near as good. I still don't think its as good but at least it comes a little closer.

[@juanme555]

If you go back and play Spider-Man 2 PS2 today, and you actually get good at it, and you master the web swinging in it....you will absolutely despise the web swinging in Spiderman Remastered, it will be too slow and just casual, frankly. Last time i played Spider-Man 2 was a couple of years ago on the PCSX2 emu and also on the Dolphin Emu (Gamecube version), really beautiful game, impressed by what they achieved back then, terribly sad that we cant play it natively on PC. Spider-Man Remastered is really beautiful graphically, the story is fine, i've been playing it the last few days, the combat is good albeit a bit too easy, i just learnt to cope with the bad web swinging by keeping in mind that they were severely limited hardware wise, the PS4 has a weaker CPU than the PS3, they couldn't have rendered such a high detailed city at insanely high speeds, its a fine game, it has it's weaknesses like any games. If you dont play Spider-Man 2 again you should be able to enjoy Spider-Man Remastered much more.

[@SNtrollzTF]

​@@juanme555Good points but its dumb to call the webslinging "bad" because it's slower, it's more realistic than the PS2 and the 2nd game provides the speed you're looking for regarding that

[@13ig4nt]

Its amazing to me how well Spiderman 2 holds up after all this time!!

[@OmegaSon]

I just hope future Spider-Man games are at least a bit more physics based. To be able to go faster and faster using physics and skill to your advantage is awesome

[@MrStanFungi]

This video made me want to play spider man 2. I also had a problem with the ps4 swinging because of how uniform it can feel after a while. I want to experience the chaos and execute the precision needed to swing properly. I love how in spider man 2, you can swing all the way around without you being forced to let go

[@jaroslavkusl.1049]

I'd like ps2 physic mechanics with nicely polished animations for smooth transitions from ps4 spiderman

[@MrStanFungi]

@@jaroslavkusl.1049 yeah. I feel like a mix of both games could make the perfect web swinging

[@streetsdisciple0014]

“Friendlier approach”? You mean baby the player with hand holding.

[@Spider-Fox68]

The fact that it is incredibly hard to fail is why I don’t understand why people make “pro” web swinging videos as if it’s a challenge

[@evilbread8771]

Back in the day my family went on a camping trip, and I begged my mom to stop at the store on the way so i could get Spider Man 2 on Gamecube. That whole trip i would spend hours sitting in a tent reading the booklet, and daydreaming about playing it.

[@fub3991]

Random civilian in Spider-Man 2: *walking around* sees Spider-Man fall off a building and web swinging weirdly

[@jmy.jr777]

Dude...This video was really...really good. I absolutely love the 2018 Spider-Man and I’ve never even played Spider-Man 2 but I still just got super engrossed in this video. It was very well thought out, very concise, the commentary was fantastic, the presentation was executed perfectly...this is just great content. Very entertaining, thanks for making it!

[@calelkestifer3570]

Web of Shadows is my favorite web swinging - Insomniac's is too easy, Spider-Man 2's is too clunky, but Web of Shadows is the perfect in between with just enough movement secrets to make me very happy.

[@tmsgz]

Dude, in Wb of shadows spidey web swinging over the clouds, it's crap for me

[@Jmislife]

@@tmsgz So you value webs sticking to buildings over skill and fun, ok

[@Regalieth9143]

@@Jmislife yes

[@govardhanposina17]

@@tmsgz it sticks to walls tf are you talking about?

[@govardhanposina17]

Web of Shadows is Spider-Man web swinging perfected, as long as these so called definitive videos about spiderman's swinging don't acknowledge it, they're as good as glorified ads for the Insomniac games to me

[@BiggieJ4224]

Hey Caleb! I’m pretty nervous if the second game will have better traversal than the original Spider-Man 2, what makes it so appealing is the control and skills you actually have to have and the fact that physics play a part in the swinging. So far it looks pretty much the same as the last game with only exceptions being web wings and faster swinging

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

Yeah, me too. Looks like there's a couple neat additions, and a faster speed should help, but the fundamentals (and even animations) are exactly what I've spent hundreds of hours with over the last five years, and I was hoping to see some more visible refinements. The tweaks made in Miles Morales made me really happy to see for a smaller game in a pseudo-sequel position, but it doesn't look like the leap from there to this full-blown sequel is too much larger. I guess we'll find out for ourselves reasonably soon, though!

[@TalhaMasood]

@@TheWhoniversalMan Same to same, my biggest problem is not colliding with the ground when you are at low altitudes, Spider-man ps4 magically lifts you up enough to avoid that, it's very noticeable and feels really awkward, the same thing is there in the water section of the gameplay footage they revealed. My interest in the game goes down 50 percent if it's the same system. It's because I can already play that system already.

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

@@TalhaMasood Yeah, there's a particular moment around the "poison cloud" bit where it hurts to see that floating-over-the-ground thing. I'd even be willing to accept no major physics changes as long as we had contextual animations (like Peter scrambling up his webline to avoid collision) to cover up the awkwardness, but we haven't even got that... seems the problem's being ignored altogether. Pretty far from the robust overhaul that seemed at least possible until this gameplay reveal.

[@chacharoni9638]

There are definitely pros and cons to both swinging mechanics. I like Spider-Man 2's mechanics because it definitely does feel faster when you time your swings right and takes a lot more control and thought from the player. For Spider-Man PS4, I really like how smooth the animations are and the poses that are iconic for Spider-Man. I also really like accessible the system is, yet also requiring some skill to time the button combinations right. But I personally prefer having to put more skill and thought into the swinging.

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

Sounds a lot like my thoughts. ;)

[@paradox4780]

can we get this trending on Twitter, insomniac needs to see it

[@antonn.mp4]

Web of shadows swinging is slept on its actually amazing IMO

[@boot5672]

I fell in love with it the first time I saw my friend play it as a kid

[@basementboy2167]

That is why I like PS4 Spider-Man, it’s just so smooth and the transition from parkour to web swinging is just so smooth

[@Zoza15]

Yes, smooth, but not particularly skill based since the smoothness is programmed into the web slinging..

[@dixienormous227]

The ground run while holding onto the webline was just ridiculously dope to me and i try to do it every spidey game. When you break it down like this, it comes down to user friendly vs skill induced.

[@sebastianasantiago7382]

While I enjoy both games a lot, Spiderman 2’s traversal and swinging mechanics are just more satisfying to pull off that it makes me coming back for more, doing loops and orbits are still fun as hell, I think Spiderman PS4 is more for casuals who want an easy to pick up game

[@jadennguyen2811]

So glad I stumbled upon this video. You’re channel is criminally underrated, this is some really great and clever content. Bravo!

[@Blobby-on3jt]

This guy could make an ad for a Spider-Man game and I'd be convinced.

[@TheSuperGamerPals]

This is the most accurate video I've seen on youtube. So glad someone else can express that SP2 PS2 feeling. Fantastic editing too. Subbed.

[@RydinTheBlaze]

i came to this video becuase i was remembering playing spider man 2 and absolutely loved spending time just web swinging. was playing miles morales and tested the web swinging by trying to catch the web on a building as i was already swinging on it, and it seems the web just goes thru other objects so you keep the first point of contact unlike 2 that will make a new point and the web gets shorter. i do like how they made it so you cant just swing in open air like spider man 1 and need something to connect to. absolutely love the spider man games.

[@hopefullyanonymous3466]

You stated this so perfectly my feelings couldn’t even match the accuracy. When you said it’s more like a sport and not a ballet that’s where it rung for me. I really hope insomniac watches this video for their next installment.

[@_Master_Wolf]

Insomniac's Spider-Man's swinging is a polished and smooth swinging that feels good and is great when you want to just sit back and enjoy swinging around. Spider-Man 2's swinging is a challenge that feels good when you master it.

[@pepekovallin]

Web of shadows also had great web swinging mechanics, it was satisfying, fast, stylish, and was also very acrobatic, from the time when I started the game I could tell my abilities were increasing, the way I interacted with the scenario, and everything were constantly improving

[@jrob4795]

Web of Shadows was sort of auto pilot swinging though. It wasn’t nearly as challenging as Spider-Man 2

[@abdelali9279]

I've been so used to fall damage that I unconsciously try to dampen my fall in Marvel's Spider-Man.

[@Jay-rk5mh]

The momentum was so rewarding back then as much as I enjoyed the 2018 game, I hope they include a physic based swinging. Phenomenal video ❤️

[@emanuelheard3236]

This is the video that will take your channel off. Such a great point and clean edits. I feel the same way about the swinging mechanics in both games🤙🏿

[@TheVideomaker2341]

For a very small channel like yours, this was a pretty well produced and well researched in this video. Very similar, if not, same video production to a big youtuber. You did very well complementing but also critiquing both Spider-Man 2 and 2018. I also thank you for that. I hope you keep this great work up. If you continue like this, I could see you being in a great place in the future. Once again, awesome vid and keep up the great work.

[@belakthrillby]

You just got yourself a new subscriber! I've felt the way you do about Spider-Man PS4s swinging from the very beginning when I realized the game wouldn't let me fail swing into the ground. I'm so glad to see someone express how I feel about it. Also, the video is really good on its own merits. I enjoyed all the clips you edited together and they worked well with your script. Bravo!

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

Thank you! It definitely took a little while to get it to flow on the editing side of things. ;) Working on another video essay now, so I hope you'll enjoy when it's done!

[@belakthrillby]

@@TheWhoniversalMan I'll look forward to it!

[@Nayops24]

1:13 Love playing this game to this day❗️👏🏼

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

Me too. ;)

[@master0fthearts894]

2:20 “Peter Park-oured around.” Can I just say that pun was glorious?

[@imdaking2402]

You’re the most underrated channel

[@mintyedge]

This video was so much fun to watch , I was about 3 when the spider man 2 the game was out and I grow up with it and see you talk about it just made me happy :)

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

I was about 8 when it came out, and it still makes me happy, too. ;)

[@blurieo]

This video is really well made! I'm so glad that I found you and I wish you the best for the channel! Can't wait to see you grow!

[@UwUYT]

One of the best things about insomniacs web swinging is that it's realistic. You can't swing without something being nearby to attach your web to (like you can't swing if you're swimming out in the ocean) whereas previous games' webs looked like they were attached to Uncle Ben.

[@leonamoonslasher7070]

So basically Spider Man 2018 is The Amazing Spider Man and Spider Man 2 well Raimi Series

[@EnslavedLonesoul]

I think spider man 2 swinging is better. Just compare jumping of the largest building with perfect swings out of the fall. Spider man 2018 feels like it scubs most of the fall speed right away in the swing. Where 2004 really let's the momentum carry through. Besides you could go over 300 mph in spider man 2.

[@PrixtoTNT]

The Spider-Man 2 web swinging is famous for being a big jump for the web swinging in games and for being really good, but was already overcome in the Spider-Man 3 videogame

[@legend98ish]

The Spider-Man 3 video game had terrible swinging.

[@jonathanw3909]

Thank you. Thank you thank you. THIS is the video I have been waiting for FOREVER, to the point of even trying to make my own. So well put and presented, you're truly incredible. Also cannot wait for that Spider-Man 2 retrospective, another thing I've been waiting for more videos on! You just gained a massive fan and I can't wait to see your other videos! I was wondering if I could get your email, I've been working on developing a series of videos of what I'd like to see in the sequel to the Insomniac Spider-Man game in terms of mechanics (traversal, combat, story missions, open world, etc) and I would love your insight, or if you'd even like to collaborate on it and fuse ideas and work on it together, I think it could be something great! No worries if not, but would love for you to see what I've got so far! You deserve waaaaayyyy more subscribers, I definitely see it in your future with the quality of your videos and analyses!

[@MR.GOAT.]

1. Miles Morales 2. Spider-Man 2 (Activision) 3. Spider-Man PS4/Remaster 3. Web of Shadows 5. Ultimate Spider-Man

[@pengu6335]

I disagree. I liked Spiderman 2 when I was way younger but Spiderman 2018 is the far superior game. I'd personally have Spiderman 2018 1st place and Miles Morales as 2nd place.

[@syminite1]

@Austin Batton Talking about the web swinging.

[@FireElFreak]

Why does no one ever remember or talk about the ultimate spider man game? I loved it

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

I certainly remember Ultimate Spider-Man-all the way back to playing portions of it multiple times at a local gaming store before I got to rent it and play it properly-but I wanted to talk about Spider-Man 2 because that one stole my heart in the fall of 2003 when I first learned of the game from Game Informer issue #122. ;)

[@Seetherfan25]

Ur voice and way of talking is so awesome that in the beginning of ths vid i thought i was watching a trailer for spider man ps4 like some game dev was explaining stuff or something like that. Good job buddy :D

[@TheHeavymetalman666]

spider-man ps4 feels way too automated. spider-man 2 web swinging "sucks" if you don't know what you're doing. can be very smooth if you get used to it

[@videodeposu8741]

it's all about that.

[@CalderProductions]

I just noticed that you only have around about 800 subs? That is really weird because you are such a good youtuber, you will defiantly get more subs!

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

Thank you! :) This is the first video I've done along these lines, so I'll see if I can reach more people with future videos. :)

[@Earth12181]

We need a spiderman 2(2004) remastered for pc,ps4/5 and xbox

[@ninemugetsu]

Hey just wanted to say amazing video! Find myself rewatchin it every now and then, I think it was the reason why I decided to try og spiderman 2 since I never played it back in the day and its now tied with Web of Shadows for my favorite swinging system.

[@cyber-thundr_]

Spider-Man 2 the movie game was the Super Mario 64 of Spider-Man, while Marvel’s Spider-Man for the PlayStation 4/5 was the Super Mario Galaxy & Odyssey of Spider-Man, because it has both amazing graphics & the ability to change outfits.

[@jonathanw3909]

I found that while the animations in Marvel’s Spider-Man are flashier than that of Spider-Man 2, their distinctiveness makes them feel even more repetitive after some time. With Spider-Man 2, because the animation for swinging is so basic, it’s a little more excusable as a baseline. Obviously, there are a lot of limitations on the tweaks Insomniac could make, especially regarding the speed and physics tweaks for swinging and dive bombing, but this is another area I hope they expand upon. It looks like they’re doing a little more in Miles Morales, but based on the footage I’ve seen, it looks like it might fall into the same trap after some time based on it not being an overhauled system (which is not a crime at all!) I don’t know if you’re a fan of Game Maker’s Toolkit, but he recently put out a video that talks about what makes a player/character feel awesome. He talked about Marvel’s Spider-Man as an example of the distinction between giving away the fantasy vs. making the player earn it, which ties perfectly into what you’re talking about here re: the skill levels and ceilings on the two Spidey games. Obviously it’s in Insomniac’s best interest to make the game accessible to as many people as possible, but like you said, the thrill is sacrificed. I think they know that what they gave us is only the beginning, a blueprint can that be expanded upon and improved, and that there are ways to give the player both accessibility and immersion. Other than the obvious speed, animation, and physics tweaks, I think there are a few ways Insomniac can improve the traversal using the capabilities of the PS5: -An accessibility/customization menu for traversal that allows you to toggle options such as fall damage (no damage or “splat” animation, splat animation only, full punishment), automatic vs. manual line breaking, whether or not you’re assisted by hovering above the ground (I get that it’s frustrating in SM2 to lose your swing speed and flow when you end up running along the ground, but I love what that adds to the immersion and I feel like there’s a way to implement that so it doesn’t slow you down or interfere with your flow. Think the scene around the beginning of SMPS4 in which Peter tries out the Advanced Suit after he makes it and that carrying over into gameplay.), automatic wall running (vs manual via input), etc. -An unlockable boost button skill to gain some speed like in SM2. I think this can be argued into logic because after 8+ years of being Spider-Man, I’m sure Peter has learned ways to manipulate his body to gain speed, whereas if Miles is still relatively new to being Spider-Man in the sequel, it could be a Venom Power ability. -More air trick options and a menu to assign them in different orders and to specific directional inputs. Imagine the variety! -More manual input overall, but especially pertaining to interacting with the environment. Currently, only being able to swing from streetlights and lampposts via the point launch input makes it feel automatic and like you’re watching an animation rather than being in control. -Aside from intrinsic motivation and motivation that the player is rewarded with from a higher skill ceiling, Insomniac could give the player XP or focus or a boost in speed for chaining traversal moves together in a way similar to how Spider-Man 2 rewarded you for style by filling your Spider-Reflexes meter. They did this a little with air tricks and XP but they can go further. -Although many of these ideas are inspired by Spider-Man 2, games like Web of Shadows and Ultimate Spider-Man make great use of verticality (particularly climbing up webs). Sorry for the long comment, you've just awakened this in me after some time and got me excited for the future of both Insomniac's Spider-Man and your channel!

[@prabeshgurung1067]

The fixed the animations for MM, by one, making his standard poses more, what’s the word, look simple and they also greatly improved the tricks move, like it looks stunning. However they haven’t made it more advanced yet. For the sequal, I hope they make 2 options, easy, with how it’s like but advanced where there’s little assistance and the physics and all are used to its fullest so it’s harder

[@jonathanw3909]

@@prabeshgurung1067 Completely agree! That'd be ideal! That maybe paired with a menu that allows you to keep certain features from each mode on or off.

[@batman44532]

This might be one of the longest comments I’ve ever seen

[@prabeshgurung1067]

@@batman44532 kid, if this is the longest you’ve seen, you have no idea what comments are out there. I have seen with my eyes, essays that never end. I have seen meme comments that get the FBI called on you and I have seen comments that make you question your existence. So what I’m saying is this ain’t that long really. It’s rookie numbers

[@jonathanw3909]

@@batman44532 damn right

[@jameyguylmao9189]

I like that you kinda lunge forward with the physics in Spider-Man 2. In Spider-Man ps4 you have to keep swinging for momentum. And how you can swing in circles around thin towers and Spider-Man ps4 you just go back and fourth

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

I missed my chance to talk about Miles Morales by just a couple weeks with this video!

[@jameyguylmao9189]

@@TheWhoniversalMan will sub

[@AlbertaTrailCams]

I would love to see a "realistic physics" option in the setting that doesn't allow you to swing in any direction that your momentum doesn't carry you for the next Spider-man. I assume the tight controls will carry over, would realistic be that hard to add on?

[@BonzerMrT]

Web Of Shadows was and is still is one of my top 3 Spider-Man games. The movement and combat really took Spiderman to the next level

[@DemetriosLevi]

Gotta love the Spider-Man 2002 game music in the background at the end...freaking love it!

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

It was originally going to be the 2000 Neversoft theme remix from the main menu, but that was a little distracting. ;)

[@DemetriosLevi]

@@TheWhoniversalMan good choice in the end, my man..."This is supposed to be the Skull's territory. I'll find Uncle Ben's killer if I have to go through every one of the Skull's to do it!"

[@WinderTP]

This comparison reminds me a lot of the hardcore Assassin's Creed community. Assassin's Creed 1 / 2 / Unity are often considered to have the best free-running system because they are *complex* and allows for much higher player input precision to do some truly impressive climbing while granting freedom of control, it's a more high-risk/high-reward approach to the mechanic. From AC Origins on, the developers went towards a more "smoothed out" approach to the mechanic, allowing for more fluid animations over user control. Things that were possible in the earlier games like ledge grab (manually jumping from a hanging ledge position and grabbing another ledge while in the air) and gradual descent were tossed out for "holding one button and look cool" climbing. The loss of precision is why a lot of hardcore players still prefer the free-running from the original games. But in the case of Spiderman, while Insomniac did smooth out the animations and physics for player satisfaction, the element of precision is still a major point of consideration which makes it a lot more of an improvement when compared to AC, which I find very respectable and would probably result in a more fleshed-out and fun playthrough (I can't speak from experience since I don't own a PS4, tho)

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

This is such a thoughtful response! I have very little experience with the AC series, but it's interesting to see that same freedom vs. accommodation dynamic crop up there. Insomniac's swinging definitely limits your options in some places (like kicking you out of your swing if you get too high), but by and large the system does a better job of allowing you to achieve exactly the results you're after (especially with the zip-to-point system)... it's just less satisfying when it's so much simpler to do! I'll soon be finishing a follow-up video discussing where these mechanics could be developed in future games, as I think the additional mechanics of the recent Miles Morales game suggest some opportunities to better resolve that tradeoff in the sequel. Meanwhile, I'm not sure whether Assassin's Creed is poised to overhaul its traversal system, but I hope for the sake of the franchise's fans that it will! I may have to track down some videos about AC traversal since I'm curious now. ;) Thanks for watching and sharing your thoughts! :)

[@WinderTP]

@@TheWhoniversalMan Hey, thanks for the reply! If you're interested in more of that particular slice of the community (I wouldn't say it's a majority but they still have quite a voice) I wanna recommend the 2 videos below: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eaWypmCQhbRrnLM kzbin.info/www/bejne/Z6m6k5mtrJerrpY

[@juanme555]

The swinging in the ps4 game is aesthetically prettier, but only aesthetically. In every other way it was a pretty heavy downgrade from the PS2 game.

[@9r4ss_]

everyone forgets about web of shadows system also made by treyarch

[@TheWhoniversalMan]

I certainly didn't forget about it-I bought that game day one in 2008 and watched the "making of the combat" video tons of times before release!-but Spider-Man 2 still remains my favorite, and just talking about how the new one compares to the most well-known and influential game seemed like the most concise way to go about this. (Incidentally, Shaba Games developed Web of Shadows, but they worked from the engine, code, and animations from Spider-Man 3 by Treyarch-you can actually find a ton of playable Spider-Man 3 stuff in the files of the PC version of WOS!) I do prefer Spider-Man 2's and Insomniac's swinging to Web of Shadows by a hair, but that game is vastly above all the others to my mind. The only thing I really find lacking in it is a sense of weight and momentum-you move REALLY quickly, but it feels like Spidey weighs nothing, and I really miss the heaviness and intensity you get with Spider-Man 2's movement. (Basically, the "tactile" stuff I talk about in the video.) And I hate how a fraction of a second in timing will make the difference between heading forward with your current momentum and being flung literally well above most skyscrapers, forcing you to wait an extended time to fall far enough to swing again. But it's pretty smooth and good at avoiding interrupting your momentum due to collisions, and it's absolutely loaded with fun non-essential embellishments like sliding, pole-swinging, etc. I had a reference to WOS in an earlier draft of this video and just ended up cutting it because I figured a lot of the audience would have no idea what it was. It was when I say "To answer that, we have to go back in time...," I cut to the Moonlight Sonata opening, then did a record-scratch freeze... "Nope, further back! We'll talk about that one some other time." Something like that. ;)

[@9r4ss_]

I’m subscribing to you dog you made some hella good points

[@gplgs4640]

Insomniac’s Spider-Man is what you’d imagine you would look like if you were Spider-Man Spider-Man 2 (2004) is what you’d actually look like because you didn’t pay attention in physics class ya doofus.

[@golem_of_sin5874]

My favorite thing to do in the 2004 game was jumping off the Empire State Building and either saving myself at the last second with a web swing or let myself bounce off the ground to watch the ragdoll physics.

[@revanseyfullayev7137]

How this Guy has only 2k subscribers he explained 2 games very well