The Big Problem with Surrender In League of Legends

The surrender vote is the topic heading further into the 2024 League of Legends season. People abuse the FF function and it damages gameplay for everyone. This problem should be fixed by Riot as soon as possible to improve game quality. This is only my opinion on the matter. You are free to think for yourself.
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[@boygamer8985]

Surender is really becoming problem. 90% of my game ends with surrender by my team or enemy team there is no actual ending.

[@Nartanek]

This is a result of the high burst damage oriented meta with super high snowballing. A game 5 vs 20 kills at 15 minutes seems unwinnable wether it is or not. Most would rather just go next. I think if the game was more team fight oriented rather than solo 1v9 champions the ff rate would go down. But hey then there would be less flashy yasuo 1v5 montages so that's not gonna happen

[@defenestrationstation5771]

One thing that I think would help the honor System a lot is having a separate vote for who carried the hardest because I feel like most of the time players just vote for the person who are carried or support

[@VictorDavion]

You forgot the 4th type. The 15 minute ff no matter the state of the game.

[@glenzi7473]

Like always a clear cut approach. Nice, short understandable opinion and very healthy communicated. I like your ideas, especially regarding the honor system. keep up the good work!

[@ravesage]

I think a more straightforward solution for the surrender spam itself would be to increase the cooldown time after a failed vote.

[@ECPlaysLoL]

They have already done that. Its up to 6 minutes now. The only thing this does in my own experience is that it increases the amount of FF spam in chat, and it makes people stop playing seriously. If there were bigger downsides to FF spamming, then logically more people would tryhard instead of FF spam.

[@jakemidgett105]

You forgot though that sometimes a game is just unwinnable and the rest of your team will refuse to surrender even if it makes the game last 10 or more minutes.

[@ravesage]

@@jakemidgett105 No, it's fine if the game ends up like that. I suggested increasing after a failed vote to disincentivise people who like to insta-vote potentially winnable games so they actually try to focus on playing. Ends up being moot anyway I guess considering this was already done it seems and isn't having that result. Ultimately comes down to the behavior of the playerbase.

[@saskeuchiha9942]

omg we need to get this guy to in to riot games asap i AGREE 100% with you my brother GOD bless you and your channel

[@vincentvindevogel2368]

The extent of how many dodges you're allowed to have, how many ff votes you're allowed to initiate/game, maybe even how much loss-prevention actually prevents etc should all be tied to the honor system.

[@mathiasstorm205]

Maybe they should further reduce snowballing, right now it feels like that if you die once early your lane opponent just scales uncontrollably from there, sometimes it's hard to see a reason to keep playing when the laning phase is over the first time you die, the game might be winnable late game but it's still frustrating and not fun to play against for 30-40 minutes. I'm part of the never ff group tho so i dont try to surrender if i lose lane, but i do feel frustrated about the snowballing and the feeling of not being able to come back after a single death. Maybe it's just a skill issue from my part. Just sharing my thoughts :)

[@trymbruset3868]

I was hard stuck for a couple of years as a support main. There are a few champions I could play at plat level, and have a lot of friends in those ranks, but I kid you not 20+ times I've been in promo to gold and had the whole series thrown by a single player. If you're playing 1v9 champs you might carry despite this but as a support there's only so much setup, map control, roaming and peeling you can do. Unless you pick a carry champ and tilt your adc

[@reddragon4416]

I tink they also need to fix the rank sistem i spens so many games were i get a laner that will go 0/15 because they first time a champ or play him because he got a new cute skin ignoring the impact that can cause in the game and teamates

[@Mark9150]

It's incredibly frustrating to face this issue. I'm also considering quitting because it feels like the game ends just as it's getting interesting. As someone who enjoys playing late-game champions, I find it disheartening that only 2 or 3 games in an entire day of continuous play actually reach level 18. I remember when the game was more balanced, giving everyone a fair chance. Nowadays, most games conclude around levels 12-13, with surrender votes being a common occurrence, either from my team or the opponents. For champions that thrive from mid to late or even very late game, this trend makes playing feel like a waste of time. Surrendering does have its place, but I often find that just as I start to make an impact, my teammates, realizing their early-game champions have lost their scaling, decide to give up. This diminishes the role of the Attack Damage Carry (ADC), which is critical for late-game success. The Early Champ's role is to either win early or ensure their ADC survives to let him carry the late game. Unfortunately, it seems many players focus solely on ending the game early for and by themselves. They are not interested in winning as a team. They want to be the sole reason themselves. And if they cannot do that... Moreover, ADC has now become a priority pick role, necessary just to queue up, similar to how support was back in the day. This shift speaks volumes about the current state of the game. I'm seriously contemplating the idea of a private server with a non-surrender mode. It would attract like-minded players and let those who prefer frequent surrenders play amongst themselves. This change could address many of the current frustrations.

[@DjXennom]

im about quit the game cause of this. i play till the lose or win

[@longvu3922]

pp should have the right to ff, also we need 4 vote to Surrender, majority choice

[@henrycastle6584]

what you describe here, is something ive personally never seen happen. Usually ppl refuse to surrender on games where the enemy team has like double the kills... These ppl need to get banned honestly

[@bite12344]

There are all kinds of people on this Earth we call home. It is extremely egregious to expect everyone to conform to any kind of norm. People that have the mentality of a 5 year old and cry and want to FF is their right to do so. In a team game that sucks and everyone will hate them for it, but forcefully trying to solve the problem will not bring about a change but instead make it worse. People that have the mentality of never surrendering sometimes are more toxic as their delusions will make the rest of team look like hostages playing something they do not want to be a part of. And the balance between a game that is winnable and you can tryhard vs a game that is lost and no comeback system will help you recover is hard to strike in a competitive random players together forming a team scenario. Pro players also don't help, not just streamers as many times people hear about their scrims where they are free to surrender and if their scenario looks bad at 15 they FF and rotate. The assumption is that if the enemy team has a lead and they are at a similar skill level as you, they will keep it and win the game. In an official match they can't do that so when you see people saying this team already won and you are in the waiting room for the next game is true, since even though you are supposed to be tryharding to make a comeback to try and win, you won't since the mentality from the scrims carries over to officials. So from all angles that are publicly available and the larger playerbase gets to see the problem is deep rooted and cannot be solved with some system changes. Another thing that doesn't help is the fact that different kind of champions exist, ones that are strong early and try to win as fast as possible vs scaling champs. Create a scenario where the early never wins a game and you get a lobby with only scaling champs, do the opposite and then you get only early champs etc. This has been proven throughout the metas that league has had and is an impossible thing to predict, hard to balance and even large swings coming from updates to the game don't solve the issue. To truly solve the problem there needs to be an entire re-design of the game from the ground up with a clear focus on solving these problems, but at that point, that will not be League of Legends anymore.

[@omarbida6263]

(I didn't watch the video I'm commenting just because of the title). there is no problem with surrender in league I hade so many games where I'm fed and can carry but my team is so behind and want to surrender because they are not having fun and I understand that it's a game after all why play if you are not having fun and to be honest even if you are fed if you are alone wining is almost impossible and yes you may win but does it happen every time ? most of the time? or rarely

[@a128j]

they should just allow ff if you have bounty objectives on your side

[@absolutetrash7880]

As a player who plays both Dota 2 and League, I will say Dota's limits on low Behavior Score players is a nice addition I wish League did implement, as a newbie to League it can be really frustrating BC SOOO many low tier games just get griefed by toxic low tier players, 1/2 the time it feels like as a Newbie the games are out of my control since even if I play well I can get a 0/30 teammate who is spamming FF BC they got First Blooded 20 minutes ago, or such. Anyways I'm in the "never FF" group but I do wish there was something in the game that makes non-toxic players have a lower chance of getting historically toxic players on their team

[@deatheed]

Delete ff from ranked. And rework the current ff functionality. New system : In the top left corner of the tab a button that you can click to vote ff and if 4 person click the game is ff. In that ways no spam ff toxicity

[@DarkSatan95]

This mentality costed me emerald rank today, it's actually tiresome to play support when your mid yas just ff15 after 1 dumb early death etc. I hope something changes because playing with people with this ff15 mentality is exhausting and is making ranked incredibly unfun.

[@GameJames-Arkveveen]

I really feel like these narratives about League of Legends are EXACTLY what is helping to increase the toxicity and make the game worse for everyone, which in turn feeds into the narratives, it is a self-fulfilling prophecy of self-sabotage. I just want people to stop being so toxic, there's enough problems in the world without having to make a fun video game with such an intense competitive atmosphere so miserable.

[@bensparrow3356]

I can empathize to a certain extent as playing many champions after starting 0/2 or 0/3 is not fun, and most people would rather play the next game than figure out how to win while behind the curve. They also know that their teammates will not go out of their way to try to get them back into the game. The main problem in my opinion is the deflection of blame for not performing on these champions. I don't blame anyone for mentally checking out after having a bad performance but it is in your own hands. Draven is not easy to play, and if you are low elo you should focus on learning the game through an easier champion that may be able to offer more utility like Jhin.

[@ECPlaysLoL]

I personally dont mind people mentally checking out, but at least try to funnel as much farm into the remaining win con, and try to do something. If that fails, then we all FF and we can say that we tried. But when my Katarina flips the game level 2, dies and cries FF for the rest of the game, it just makes the entire gameplay intolerable.

[@kontobiol3020]

yeah sure play in elo hell, it is better to play on boosted one to gold 1 because progress is more likely in mid divs than in low one

[@wybe211]

Jungle is worst role to carry by far , especially in low elo. In a recent game i had double the cs of enemy jungler (60-121) and he was still the same level as without a kill lead

[@SindyxLotus]

That first clip, they didn't even have a single fed carry.

[@ECPlaysLoL]

Nidalee was really fed, Yasuo had 2 items, Xerath can extend the game and scales like a monster. janna has potential to counter and kite Darius, Fiddlesticks and Yone and Lee Sin and Janna can enable Yasuo to go deeper into a fight. That game was rough, but 100% winnable.

[@SindyxLotus]

@@ECPlaysLoL I meant the enemy. Nidalee's team had no reason to ff there.

[@ECPlaysLoL]

@@SindyxLotus My bad. Yeah Jankos team is stronger here for sure.

[@SirButterlegs]

I mostly despise the 4th category the most, the players who hold everyone else hostage in game and dont simply surrender.

[@coconut1173]

That's the first category and honestly the best one if you plan on climbing, since almost every game is winnable

[@DarkSatan95]

A comeback is always possible if people's mentality isn't as fragile. as a supp, if i notice my adc is lacking/getting outplayed hard, rather than cry and say ff15, i'd rather roam, focus ganks on mid/top, counter their jungler and try to make the remaining lanes win and hope the adc is capable of atleast holding the lane for a while or catchup with solo exp.

[@janchvatal1538]

Suuure.....baaad baaad streamers...it is not like all of toxics in the game retake things. Not every toxic is streamer and not all streamers are toxic. Everyone should adress their own game and behaviour...do not blame others.

[@ECPlaysLoL]

Its almost like I was very specific that streamers that played a "certain" style, had a very high chance of being toxic. Of course its not all streamers. You wont see a toxic Ornn player in my experience, because the playstyle does not warrant winning every lane and matchup or the game would be over.

[@janchvatal1538]

@@ECPlaysLoL And what will happen when you switch word streamers with word players. Players that played a "certain" style, huh? Quite the same. Being streamer is not what decides there, being toxic and hostile/selfish is. I think you hit everything else quite on spot, but was wondering why the grudge against streamers...it simply does not make sense.

[@ECPlaysLoL]

@@janchvatal1538 Ive played for a long time, like since Season 2, and I have noticed words and phrases and playstyles getting popular in game, that came from the streaming community. Streaming has a huge influence on players. Just look at Baus as an example. I think hes a funny chill guy, but he has ruined Sion for SoloQ because of players copying him without understanding why he plays like he does. Look at Draven for example, a large percentage of people that play him are toxic af and mimic what they see other high profile Draven streamers do. Draven is not a toxic champion. But the stigma around him is. Yes, at the end of the day, players are the ones who decide to be toxic, but they are influenced to some degree by streamers. Not all streamers are bad. I would say 90% of them are really cool people. But that last 10%, has a huge toxic influence on the game and that is enough to make the game feel a bit worse.

[@janchvatal1538]

@@ECPlaysLoL Yeah i believe i can agree on this. There realy are some bad seeds, but maybe its just my bubble, but i feel that ppl care less and less about rowdy toxic punks and is looking more and more for cool non-problem streamers. Sure...drama will always draw atention and toxics probably will probably find their like-minded audiences, but i believe it will be more and more nieche side content and as you say....there is more that is good than that is bad...only sad thing is it takes 1 of 10 players to ruin the game.