The Confusing History of Mecha Sonic

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Today we finally look at MECHA SONIC! ...well, Mk. I Mecha Sonic, since there's more than one. Or Silver Sonic. Or Robo Sonic? It's confusing.
Shout to Snick for all the help in the research! Check out his Twitter at / snick_wt
Stevie killed it AGAIN with the thumbnail art! Go check her out at / steviejoycole
And thank you to @ChannelPup for editing! Click his name and support his channel!
If you wanna support my channel a bit more you can do so at / gameapologist

[@GameApologist]

Sorry for the reupload! For those curious or confused, video rendered without the first couple minutes and without the Patreon credits. Hope you enjoy the final cut!

[@Shadow_The_Edgy]

At first I thought you did something that pissed off KZbin 🤣

[@LuceoX30]

I wondered why you were randomly talking about beards at the start.

[@ultrashinymew]

Great video ❤ also, it's not Judy Toyota, it's Judy Totoya 😉

[@robertomartinsvalero6097]

@@ultrashinymew f@#$ the patreons!

[@aliastheabnormal]

I thought Mecha Sonic was a Zaku II reference.

[@banobobot]

In Sonic 4: Episode Metal, the ultimate Sonic robot was shown to be left behind on Little Planet, so Sonic CD taking place after Sonic 1 starts to make more sense. Since Little Planet only comes around one month a year, that gave Eggman little opportunity to recover Metal Sonic until the aftermath of Sonic 4 Episode 1, so it's implied that Eggman made the various models of Mecha Sonic in the meantime.

[@mythosinfinite6736]

I really like this idea. This is what I subscribe to now.

[@Rexy_THE_T-REX]

Yeah i had the idea he used the futures tech to build him aswell so thats the story i guess

[@Gardow]

Scrolled down into the comments to find this post. Sonic 4 may have sucked, but you've gotta admit it offered a good solution for the metal sonic conundrum.

[@banobobot]

In addition to this, the reason I believe he keeps Metal Sonic around and doesn't make any more Mecha Sonics is not just because he was able to properly recover him in the first place. He made a strong first impression in Stardust Speedway. Eggman clearly saw potential in Metal, so when he was recovered, his powers were further enhanced in Episode Metal, both with that strange power source he gained in Lost Labyrinth, as well as Eggman enhancing him further with a machine in Mad Gear.

[@SisterRose]

i believe the timing is wrong for that though in that it has the Modern Eggman doing it, it should have been the classic doing it after S3K, Metal was already in storage by Sonic Adventure and had various appearances in later Sonic games - people don't like Chaotix much either but he was there.

[@epikprodukmins5189]

Here’s an idea I had since CD takes place between 1 and 2. After CD, Little Planet disappeared (as it does) and Eggman was unable to retrieve Metal before then. So he used the Mechas in 2 and 3 & Knuckles in the meantime while he waited for Little Planet to return so he could find and repair Metal in Sonic 4.

[@Jamfrog35]

that...makes sense actually.

[@kanewilson8624]

@@Jamfrog35 I personally was under the impression that Silver Sonic from the Genesis version was something that the Doctor quickly cobbled together on the fly while Sonic was trashing the Death Egg, leading to mecha Sonic from Sonic 3 &Knuckles being the “completed version”

[@RemyRP]

​@@kanewilson8624why does this actually make so much sense

[@Raviolling]

Smartass. Cybershell hire this legend!

[@RotaAbyssian]

One theory I have is that Metal Sonic IS a superior Sonic clone, but that comes with rarer materials. Thanks to the Time Stones on Little Planet, Egg Man was able to use the Bad Future resources to gain rare materials and speed along R&D to reach Metal faster than he would have normally. Essentially, Egg Man was really feeling himself and used better resources and intricate design work because he was dead certain it would work, how couldn't it? Once access was cut off by the end of CD, Metal had to be shelved for a lengthy repair process due to the rare materials and sophisticated programming. This caused him to fall back to the drawing board to try and replicate some of that success, but with easier to access resources. The only reason we see Metal so often nowadays, rather than any of the Mecha line, is that Eggy has recognized this stopgap fallacy, and as such stockpiled everything he would need to repair Metal, from the ground up if need be. He no longer needs a substitute now that he can more easily repair his pride and joy.

[@BazztheBazz]

My headcanon resolving the whole "Metal came first but is also more advanced than Mecha" problem, is that Robotnik/Eggman used the Time Stones in Sonic CD to pull a secret weapon from the Bad Future timeline to counter Sonic, and found Metal in the timeline where he already won. The Mecha series would be Robotnik's attempts to reverse-engineer Metal, the 'masterpiece' his future self made (and this would probably be why Eggman has such favoritism towards Metal).

[@warioskapelli3100]

I’ve heard some people justify Metal’s special-ness due to being made from resources on Little Planet, but I like you’re headcanon more! (Also explains why Eggman can’t seem to make another good mechanical hedgehog. He didn’t make Metal, his *future self* did, and he can’t figure out how his future self did it!!!…but he’s ok with that because obviously that means he’s an absolute *genius* in the future mwahaha)

[@cxthednalien]

I really like that tbh It explains why the other versions(other than Mecha Sonic in 3&K)are inferior to Metal

[@hilariousandoriginalchanne327]

@@warioskapelli3100 That doesn’t really make much sense. If he doesn’t know how he was built, how can he reprogram him? How did he upgrade him to Neo? It’s a nice headcanon, but it’s got way too many holes.

[@djayacedaking26]

@@hilariousandoriginalchanne327 Metal Sonic upgraded himself into Neo Metal…

[@deborahmiller9984]

My theory is that Mecha-Sonic is a prototype version of Metal Sonic.

[@jordanslocum3903]

My headcanon for why Mecha sonic takes place after cd is that, robotnik was trying to stall sonic for as long as he could, so he brought a prototype for the robot that sonic fought not too long ago to stall time so that the death egg robot would activate. Just a theory.

[@Rexy_THE_T-REX]

Or metal was left on minus planet and was bulid using the futures tech

[@skellysilverlight8669]

Mine is that in CD metal sonic time traveled from the future back in time to before robotic had gotten to that model

[@scottcarse9962]

I've always thought something similar. I theorize that Eggman made Mecha Sonic MK1 first as a prototype, but never used him due to him being to clunky and slow, eventually refining the design into Metal Sonic, who was faster but more fragile. Than, after CD, 2 takes place, and Eggman just throws his old prototype at sonic to stall for time. Afterwards, he then attempts to combine their designs in Mecha Sonic MK2, but after his defeat, he just decided to recover Metal Sonic and work from their, as he had been the most successful of the bots.

[@neptuneplaneptune3367]

I agree with this, I too think Mecha MK1 was Metal Sonics prototype that was shelved after the initial tests wherent too Robotniks liking so he went back too the drawing board and only deployed Mecha as a stalling tactic on the Death Egg, and in Sonic 3 simplye didnt have the time too get ore rebuild Metal Sonic, so instead he simply build a modefied Mecha Sonic out of MK1s remains

[@deborahmiller9984]

I also agree. Mecha-Sonic might as well be a prototype version of Metal Sonic

[@MarioSonicB127]

I always thought that the Metal Sonic from CD is simply 1.0 and was purely designed for speed, not fighting Sonic which is why he gets destroyed so easily. Mecha Sonic on the other hand was designed to fight Sonic. Eventually Metal Sonic would be upgraded into 2.0 (which is the Metal we have today) and Mecha Sonic would be upgraded to MK 2 then MK 3 then never seen again. This would explain how Metal came before Mecha, simply put Metal wasn’t made to fight unlike Mecha.

[@SentinelHirsc]

Honestly that's the only theory that's ever made sense to me. It's canon as of Scrapnik Island that even a damaged Mecha Sonic Mk. II is almost as fast as Sonic, but Metal is canonically faster. It makes sense that Metal would be upgrades with some of the Mecha Line's power without compromising his awesome speed.

[@Crimson_the_Hunter]

And then there is Silver Sonic Mark 3

[@hackerman203]

​@@SentinelHirscthat comic also featured a popular line of Mecha sonic mk2 that's not even his. I'LL CRUSH YOU

[@timotheravetier9442]

This would also explain that our current metal is 2.0 wich is why metal 3.0 is called 3.0

[@Mehtaru]

Yeah, I'm thnking this too. Metal has the speed down but if you notice how he attacks in CD, its completely nothing like Sonic, if CD takes place before 2, I can see the Mecha line basically being Eggman experimenting with designs capable of replicating Sonic's method of attack. And if may invoke Sonic 4 for a second here, Episode Metal gives a good explanation as to why Metal Sonic was M.I.A. with him not being immediately recoverable after the events of CD which would force Eggman to build a new robot Sonic.

[@cassyettetape]

How I always saw it (And hear me out, if we consider CD and Mania) It's likely that Metal was destroyed and left abandoned on Little Planet twice, and the Mecha Sonic's were prototypes that Eggman repurposed last minute to stall Sonic (And/Or Tails)

[@GameApologist]

That's a fair point, they did clearly show busted Metals in Mania!

[@danpinthethecond]

@@GameApologist actually for those in that room template we can just point to CD and Chaotix. In the chaotix manual Eggman managed to scoop up metal and place his mostly undamaged innards into a new shell, with some upgrades, and we get Metal Kai. And Metal also gets quite fucked up in Chaotix itself, plus we get a slightly nerfed Kai Titan in Mania. Could be his shells from those 2 instances, but either way they're there for flair.

[@EonTheAien]

That transition into the sponsor segment was amazing

[@thisisasupersayin376]

"The men's hygeine fandom is dying, retweet if you're a proud groomer"

[@RadikAlice]

I was like "Noooooooooooo🤣"

[@skrappothemonster1436]

😂

[@Terminal_Apotos]

That Sonic Destiny type transition

[@Mario-im1rk]

That transition is not gonna age well oh boy

[@lf222]

Suprised you didnt bring up that his designer posted brand new art of him late last year, and he also explained that they planned for him to have a ton more attacks, include eye lasers (which would technically show up in mecha mk2) and missle spam.

[@poopyfart89]

didn't know that could you send me a link :) thx

[@_G.C]

That would've been great. As of now he still only uses part of what he could be doing

[@user-el1nv9hd1l]

Putting a reply here in case more information comes

[@marcasmannarino2924]

@@user-el1nv9hd1lGood Idea

[@TheZeroNeonix]

One thing to keep in mind: Even if Mecha Sonic was the first robot Sonic to be built, that doesn't necessarily mean it was the first to be used. It's possible Eggman built Mecha Sonic Mk. I and Mk. II, but wasn't satisfied with the design yet, and just had them stored away while he continued to streamline his idea. Then Sonic CD happens, and the completed Metal Sonic is trashed. Because CD takes place on Little Planet, which mysteriously disappears for most of the year, Eggman could not retrieve Metal. So when Sonic 2 takes place, after Sonic makes it to the Death Egg, he takes Mecha Sonic Mk. 1 out of storage and uses it. Sonic 3 & Knuckles takes place immediately after, and Eggman takes Mecha Sonic Mk. II out of storage. Finally, in Sonic 4 Episode II, Little Planet reappears, and Eggman has his opportunity to collect Metal Sonic's body and repair him.

[@sputnikmann6541]

This makes the most sense to me. Mecha Mark I was built first but wasn't satisfactory, Mecha Mark II began construction but was left incomplete, Metal was built and finished but was defeated and accidentally left on Little Planet. Mecha Mark I was a panic button in Sonic 2, Mecha Mark II was a finished version of the unfinished design in Sonic 3K, Metal was retrieved and repaired in Sonic 4 and would be used from there onwards. And then there's Mecha Mark 0 / Prototype in Sonic 2 GG that was the precursor to all of them.

[@miniaturejayhawk8702]

Sorry but no, little planet and metal sonic inspired the death egg and the mecha sonics.

[@Spazy912]

@@miniaturejayhawk8702but they weren’t working together and they had no idea of metal sonci

[@ytgamerm3526]

That would work but CD comes before 2

[@TheZeroNeonix]

@@ytgamerm3526 - That's what I said. lol

[@kraikein]

With the new lore of CD taking place before 2, I’m thinking the reason why Eggman could’ve made so many different mechas was to both experiment, and gather more data that could be put towards Metal later down the road. Maybe Eggman was trying to mix and match and see which Sonic robot was the best to truly counter him, and experimenting with different modes and data mixed with each other.

[@itsgab5745]

Aight. So. I've seen the video already and was going to comment this before it re-uploaded. I think a lot of confusion in lore of who came first can be easily scrubbed. With Mecha being built first and Eggman testing the bot. Only to realize it's flaws and make Metal. Metal would be sent out first and get busted in CD. Due to requiring repairs, he uses the older Mecha in Sonic 2. If we go by this, it irons out a lot of the confusion. With Mecha still being first, but being used as a stop gap while Metal is MIA in Sonic 2.

[@jadendafinger]

I like how Sonic 2's Mecha Sonic mimics the American "Mohawk Sonic."

[@feathdev]

“Something that’s on every Sonic fan’s mind: Grooming!” Is CRAZY 😂

[@SpiderGoblin2012]

When it comes to the order the robots were created, I like to think the time travel element of Sonic CD explains everything. Eggman probably prototyped Mecha Mrk I before the events of CD, then when he took over Little Planet, he was able to use the technology of the bad future to perfect the design with Metal Sonic. But after Sonic comes in and defeats him, Metal is lost as the Planet goes back to... whereever it goes when it's not at Never Lake, so he had to go back to the drawing board, as he no longer had access to the tech he used to make Metal, and finished the Mecha design. Is it a perfect solution? No. Does it make more sense than Metal being made first outright? I think so. Plus Metal being from the future also explains all his bizarre abilities that no other Eggman mech has, like the copy ability, as well as why Eggy doesn't just build a whole army of him. He can't. The tech he used to make him no longer exists

[@aliastheabnormal]

The game canon states that Metal's copy ability was an upgrade from Heroes. And that there are no more Metals because of the events of Sonic Heroes. Since Metal, Gamma and Omega's rebellions made Eggman stop using advanced AI. Sage is an exception since she is a mix of Eggman tech mutated by Ancient tech. So she actually works as intended.

[@neptuneplaneptune3367]

Thats more because Eggman has stoped yousing advanced AI as they tend too betray him. You may have noticed Metal Soncis threat has deminished over the years, my guess is after Heroes Eggman DRASTICLEY reduced his AI independence, making him far less effectife in combat but atleast he now was following orders and wasnt betraying him.

[@FrostGlader]

@@aliastheabnormal Eggman seemingly never found out about Gamma’s betrayal, as he continued to develop the E-Series Robots, with Omega being the final one he developed. (Omega is Final, so fitting) Omega was incredibly annoyed that he had all the offensive presence he has and was being used to guard Shadow, defecting because of it. Eggman only learnt of his defection upon seeing him at the end of Heroes. Plus Eggman, uh, hasn’t actually stopped making advanced AI, like, at all. Orbot and Cubot, as stupid as they are, are fairly advanced for AI, and Sage exists (she kinda betrays him to keep him safe, but he clearly doesn’t hold that against her). It’s even shown the Robots around Eggmanland in Unleashed have some semblance of choice in what they want. Not technically free will, but they’re advanced enough they can communicate freely. Orbot first appeared in Unleashed, and it’s shown in Colours that Eggman upgraded his AI to an insane degree between then and Colours.

[@aliastheabnormal]

@@FrostGlader I think that's because of the Ancient part of Sage's programming. Otherwise it would have betrayed Eggman like all the rest. Also Orbot and Cubot are too lazy and too dumb to betray Eggman respectively. Or maybe Eggman just got smart and not made the pair evil at all. Since when Orbot was given a dose of ambition in Sonic Boom he quickly betrayed Eggman as well.

[@smoothie7362]

The way I look at it, metal sonic is a completely different line than the mechas. It seems like with metal, Robotnik had some sort of actual sonic bio data to work with when making him, whereas with the mechas it seems like he made them completely from scratch

[@danpinthethecond]

Actual Metal Sonic runs on something known as Orgone Energy, which is essentially life energy. Metal Sonic has a form of artificial soul. And yes he is in his own line, consisting entirely of him-fucking-self because Metal Sonic at least in the OG canon, has never fucking died. He's only been damaged and upgraded until Heroes where we don't exactly know what happens to him after.

[@BassDS1990]

Honestly for me, Mecha/Silver Sonic was clearly a prototype Eggman experimented with before shelving it in favor of a more streamlined design with Metal, and after he got left behind on Little Planet when it vanished, Eggman was forced to relay on Mecha/Silver as one of the last defense lines for the Death Egg. In addition to that, I view Eggman’s capture of and metallicizing Little Planet as being what gives him the inspiration to build the Death Egg in the first place, with both idea coming to a head when he recaptures Little Planet and uses it for the basis of the Death Egg MK.II in Sonic 4 Episode II in addition to finally getting Metal back after being abandoned there in CD. It makes the most logical sense to me.

[@denishiawilliams895]

Although, There's no way that Robotnik would've built the Death Egg THAT fast, and seeing the Miracle Planet in its' sorry state couldn't have inspired him to do so. I believe that he was building the Death Egg way in advance.

[@mediaknight]

My interpretation is that Eggman was so busy building the Death Egg in Sonic 2 that he just used an unused prototype of Metal Sonic he had laying around for defense.

[@greyt00th]

I like that Mecha Sonic 2 got a good story in Scrapnik Island!

[@VincentEternal]

I always liked the idea that the reason Eggman moved onto other robots even though he had Metal was because Metal got left back on little planet. In Sonic 4 episode Metal, Eggman goes to collect Metal Sonic who is still on little Planet and considering little planet only appears once a year I figured that at the end of cd since little planet left Eggman couldn’t get Metal Sonic. So since he didn’t have Metal he made quick robots that could fight Sonic. Sonic 4 canonicity is questionable now, especially with it never being finished but I always liked that idea.

[@cadenmcmexican7999]

To me Sonic CD taking place before Sonic 2 always made complete sense. Dr.Robotnik was impressed with Sonic’s speed in the first game and decided to replicate it, so he prioritized speed with Metal Sonic in a race to the death with Sonic. But Robotnik messed up only focusing on speed and not power, I mean heck Metal was defeated by a wall he clearly wasn’t the strongest. So Robotnik forgot about Metal Sonic for the time being and focused on the Mecha’s for brute strength to match Sonic’s and after S3&K Robotnik realized he needs a combination of speed and power so he revived Metal and upgraded him to be the true match for Sonic that we know today

[@keeby4]

Theory: Mecha sonic is a prototype of metal sonic that eggman built before CD, but when metal was destroyed, he used the prototype as a last ditch effort in sonic 2.

[@ifaniscool]

the way I justify the Origins timeline in my head in regards to the different Sonic doppelgängers is by interpreting that Eggman tried to improve upon Metal Sonic so much after CD but then realised that that model was the closest he ever got to rivalling Sonic and chose to go back to it in future

[@AwijoshSun]

A random bit of headcanon that just occurred to me while watching this, is that Mecha-Sonic from Sonic 2 might be using a form of the Sonic CD Spin Dash, since he sort of spins in place for a moment, and only launches off after spinning for a while (implying that Eggman possibly learned from Sonic's movements in CD and implemented them into the programming of the robot).

[@PyroNick01]

Mecha Sonic (specifically the one from 3&K) is my absolute favorite. And after seeing some of the stuff from Super Mario Bros Z, it just made him far more cooler

[@ashtiboy]

well then in offcal cannon the 3&K mecha sonic in the idw comics is a bit more lets just say old,rustic and a bit more lets just say it likes to garden and laso wants to protect his scrapnick friends. also iornicly entogh also became frends with sonic and pals after all of its eggman protocalls are fully and complty removed and is no longer contoeld by anybody.

[@PyroNick01]

@@ashtiboy I am aware of that. Also, it's canon, not cannon.

[@toptextbottomtext3062]

I'LL CRUSH YOU!

[@_SoniX_Mania509]

​@@PyroNick01it is

[@PyroNick01]

@@_SoniX_Mania509 What is?

[@PurplePikmin383]

For more things that Sonic took inspiration from, Neo Metal Sonic seems to share many characteristics and abilities to T-1000 from Terminator 2: Judgement Day.

[@hydrocityshark]

My explanation for why there are so many Sonic copies comes from Eggman attempting to find a genuine version that could surpass the actual one. After Metal failed at outracing the blue, Robotnik created Mecha Sonic as a means to directly combat Sonic and would upgrade it from the “Silver” model to the Sonic & Knuckles model. After failing to again the Master Emerald from Knuckles, Eggman discontinued the Mecha series and upgraded Metal to carry speed and strength.

[@thesmilingman7576]

6:38 the game (and presumably this artwork) was made in the US so that makes sense

[@tristrumwilliams7386]

My thoughts on Eggman's reasoning for the two lines are, the Metal series was to out speed sonic, & the Mecha series was to out power him. I always thought the Mecha Sonic from SA was the original playable robot before Gamma, Gamma moves a lot like how a Macha would & it has gun fingers so it fits the gameplay as well, so instead of wasting the model they left Mecha there for us to see.

[@Solesteam]

4:05 Mecha Sonic and Robo/Silver/Mecha MK1 Sonic both share that hilariously cyclops look, so his true name may very well be Mecha MK1, he does also share a similar pause then cycle between one of few attack kind of pattern...

[@skullivan2310]

Wait couldn't mecha still have been made first but used after. Because we don't know when Mecha was actually made. For all we know the timeline is CD first but Mecha was still made before. However was used after Metal since he lost Metal on little planet and had to use a quick replacement. Aka the old model

[@itsgab5745]

My exact same thoughts lol

[@Richforce1]

I love how you can rev a spin dash as Mecha is dropping down, sap him for half his health and make the fight MUCH faster.

[@truemetalsonic]

i could see Eggman putting all of his resources into Metal Sonic on Little Planet so when that got lost and presumably destroyed (before he found him again in Sonic 4) he had to go back home and slap together something that would act as a final line of defense for his death egg. if he had metal - he would have used him but this ended up being the best he could muster in such a short time.

[@zephyrorsomethinh1528]

I think you could make a case for why metal sonic wasn't reused in Sonic 2 maybe with it losing the race with Sonic Eggman then believes more raw power could take out Sonic rather than trying to match him perfectly only for that plan to fail harder.

[@DarkAura19]

My own personal headcanon for the evolution of the bots is that Silver Sonic was more thrown together and messy than when Eggman made Metal. His priorities were with the Death Egg, after all, and I can't imagine Metal was easy to produce, so he just needed something to keep Sonic on his toes. And Sonic & Knuckles was his attempt at kind of combining the two. Hence a more sleek, but still bulky and powerful Sonic robot. But when all else failed, he went with the robot that he, technically, DID win with when he took over the future of Little Planet.

[@knines6279]

Gotta say… I love Macha 1’s design so much. The shoes with wheels are so cool, the orange instead of red is crazy pleasing to look at, and the bulky design is distinct

[@AlexanderTheSwell]

I can finally rest easy knowing more and more people in the fandom are finally accepting "Mecha Sonic" as the official designation for this guy 🙏 Great video, dude!

[@GameApologist]

YOU ARE UP NEXT. I saw your preview clip, it's looking AMAZING

[@TheTakerFoxx]

My take is that the Mecha and Metal were made for different purposes, with Metal designed for speed to better help with the conquest of Little Planet while Mecha was designed for power to better defend the Death Egg. But since Metal's function required some degree of autonomy, he had a more complex AI that allowed him to form his own personality, leading him to become the enduring character that he is, while Mecha had a much simpler task. I presume that after the Death Egg crashed, Robotnik took what he learned from both to create Mecha Mk. 2.

[@conradojavier7547]

Metal Sonic = Speed Mecha Mk. 2 = Technique Mecha Mk. 1 = Power

[@Tazer_Silverscar]

Mecha Sonic might also have a nod to Gundam in it, some of its details are very similar to Zeon mechs, particularly the Zaku and its mono-eye. Notably, Zeon's early mechs model numbers all begin 'MS', standing for Mobile Suit.

[@BasementDweller_]

I like to think that Sonic 2’s Mecha Sonic is a prototype. So after Sonic CD Eggman could only use the Prototype as it was the best he currently had at the moment. Metal Sonic was probably at Eggman’s main base during the events of Sonic 2.

[@Solesteam]

this was utter agony in my first playthrough, since you only got 1 shot and it's essentially a race against time before the moveset becomes too many steps to memorize.

[@andagean]

I could see the Origins canon order making sense if you assume Robotnik worked on the two robots simultaneously kind of a plan A and plan B, destroy sonic via force or speed. Alternatively what if Robotnik abandoned the Mecha sonic project to work on Metal Sonic, but still kept him around on the Death Egg because Metal was being repaired or something. So Mecha sonic is older but sat in the closet till after Sonic CD. its a reach but with software and technology that kinda thing isn't unheard of

[@Tapi583]

I have a feeling that everyone forgets about the first mechanical counterfeit of Sonic. Roller from first Sonic the hedgedog. Maybe he's not a hedgehog but just by his design and attack you can say that he's a Sonic counterfeit in some way. I like to think he was Eggman's first attempt at making a fake Sonic.

[@toonman5099]

This doesn't solve the timeline placement of CD, but I DID think of an explanation that can be used for either one: I think Metal is more or less the case of Eggman having access to resources and a level of technology he didn't have access to at the time, be it either the start of his more advanced tech like the Death Egg in 2, or something he was about to make a breakthrough with after 3&K. As an aside, for Sonic 4, I think a way we can categorize it is him having the means to be able to capture Little Planet (maybe through some trial and error? although I have a whole recent theory of the item monitors being "ring/chaos energy traps" and building off one of the moments in 3&K's levels, the animal capsules using the same tech to make "Badnik exoskeletons" to explain why the robots seem to just vanish after being hit, basically Eggman taking physical Ring matter and converting it to resources for his tech) with 4's Death Egg being able to snatch Little Planet while no one was looking, "resetting it" to the "Bad Future" to get his resources going, and while he had it in his control, picked up Metal along the way (this mostly to clear up why Metal always seems to be shown in the Bad Future of Stardust Speedway and stay true to the original game where you fight Metal even if you set the game to be a Good Future every time up to that point no matter what, basically every time we see the area proper, it's Eggman "resetting the area" to be more in his favor).

[@toonman5099]

Little addendum, I realize my idea regarding Badnik parts being made out of Ring/Chaos energy specifically doesn't really work considering even back then they saw it as scrap parts would still be left over considering one of 3&K's endings has an Eggrobo rising out of a pile of scraps of other Eggrobos. So it may just be that "Badniks blow up and only leave a puff of smoke" may just be game mechanic related due to trying to keep track of Badnik parts isn't necessary unlike the flower drops in CD being a method to help players keep track of where they've been if they get lost.

[@xaytana]

I like to think that, somewhere in the Sonic universe, there's just a mass grave of failed mechas, metals, and silvers (which really needs new naming post 06's introduction of Silver the hedgehog), robos, potentially along with other robot variations, along with other badnik variations. This would make for a really good roboticized body horror segment with half-dead robots; imagine Sonic, or another one of the prominent characters, just stumbling across this robot graveyard in a random adventure, possibly with the horrors of how these robots originally came to be. Honestly, this spin on it could also be potential for a robotic ally to Sonic and friends, say an origin story where a more advanced robot (post Sage's introduction, as that AI _does_ show emotion and empathy, logically Eggman would throw something that advanced into a new robot), and through emotion and empathy understands the horrors of what they encounter, which leads into their own redemption arc against their creator; much like the behaviors seen in the E-100 series, notably E-102Γ and E-123Ω, but much more in-depth and 'human.' Imagine if this same character also shows trauma, regret, questions their own existence, eventual impostor syndrome, dysmorphia, etc.; not to make the character the token mental health struggle character, but a character like this could definitely tackle subjects that would otherwise be mostly foreign to an IP like this, though Shadow somewhat was this early on and alternate media for the IP has gotten darker within some periods of their longer runs. As far as the release and chronology disparity goes, I personally like to think that Mecha and Metal, as well as Silver, are all different forms of a robotic Sonic. Metal is very obviously speed-oriented, while Mecha is anything but. Whereas Mecha sonic is attack-oriented, to the point of mimicking Sonic. Then Silver is just a mix of the two within it's own style. We also see evolution of Mecha and Silver, and Metal has had at least design evolution throughout the years if there's not canonized iterations of Metal. SA1 also shows the Mecha line coexisting with Metal, which is further reason to believe that there are multiple robotic forms for different uses.

[@agentomecha634]

While I personally prefer Mecha Mk. II design’s over Mk. I, I still think Mk. I is a cool design overall and it’s cool to see SEGA still reference all of these different robots to this day. Although it’s crazy how much mystery and lore surrounds this robot and where it falls in the Robo Sonic timeline. I also always knew Mk. I as Silver Sonic personally not because of the comics but because that’s what my friend told me he called him.

[@robertlupa8273]

Personally, I use "Silver Sonic" to refer to the 8-bit Mecha.

[@quagsirefan24]

My headcanon is that the Mecha Sonic from Sonic 2 is a prototype for Metal Sonic but, depending on the time between CD and 2, Robotnik didn't have time to rebuild Metal after the events of CD (or left him behind as suggested by Sonic 4 Episode Metal) and so sent out Mecha on the Death Egg because he already had that robot built and ready to fight Sonic.

[@overall_great213]

For me, my head cannon is that after sonic CD and in sonic 2 Eggman beefed up metal sonic for combat so he could hold sonic off long enough to finish the last finishing touches on the Death egg robot. Behind the wall in sonic 2, when you can only see Eggman’s face and the rest of his body is obscured.

[@charleschamp9826]

I wonder if the legs of the Genesis/Mega Drive Sonic 2 robotic double in the concept art is a reference to Robocop? Those pair of pistons(?) they have on the back of each leg just remind me of Murphy. Also I never noticed this before, but when Mecha changes stance to dash across the room you can see those pistons on the sprite itself, neato. I did not come up with this, I read this somewhere a while ago, and have no idea where it comes from, I just like it. As for Metal Sonic coming before any of the other Genesis/Mega Drive robotic Sonic doubles despite being so much sleeker and streamlined than them. I like to think Metal was only possible due to Eggman using time travel to get technology from the future. Being unable to escape Little Planet with Metal or anything else, save for a little hover scooter, that he could reverse engineer all he had to go off of was his memories of that tech, so it would take a while for him catch back up to that level. I also have no idea how Sonic 4 or Sonic R could fit into this considering those games' dubious standing in canon, far as I know anyway. I hope the 8Bit Mecha Sonic gets a Jakks figure, I think the 2 Inch Line would be great for them. Titan Metal Sonic from Knuckles' Chaotix would be great too, I imagine in terms of size/scale something that's somewhere between that Movie Bowser figure to the Death Egg Robot.

[@mechajay3358]

I always like to think that both Mecha and Metal Sonic were created around the same time, and Eggman brought out Mecha as a sort of test run before unleashing Metal.

[@cjs_v.j.6350]

This is a genuinely fun and unique video from you today, Nick. Happy Mecha Madness!

[@zephon6745]

My theory is that Silver Sonic was the first Sonic robot, after that Robotnik made the Mark 1 Mecha Sonic, he stored the Mark 1 on the Death Egg and then made Metal Sonic for Sonic CD. After Sonic caught up with the Death Egg Robotnik out of options activated Mecha Sonic Mk1. After the Death Egg crashed Robotnik didn't have enough time and materials to make a new robot Sonic, so he instead upgraded Mecha Sonic Mk1 into Mk2.

[@NotBrainytrust]

Sonic 2 Mecha Sonic was always my favorite sonic copy I just liked his design. Also, I thought the one from 8-bit sonic 2 was always called silver sonic.

[@leonardoalvarenga7572]

It was in the Unitedstatesian manual, which isn't canon.

[@NotBrainytrust]

@@leonardoalvarenga7572 I have no idea what your talking about

[@Elec.Balloon]

​@@leonardoalvarenga7572 what

[@ehhorve857]

@@NotBrainytrust I think he said 'united state-eesian.'

[@leonardoalvarenga7572]

@@NotBrainytrust Can't make myself more clear than that.

[@Soulessblur]

I've always liked the idea of "Silver Sonic" being the nickname, but it still officially being called "Mecha Sonic Mk. I". Like Tony and his armors, they're all serialized, but he gives catchy names to unique suits he's built.

[@carljameson3082]

I always just assumed that the mechas were prototypes of Metal Sonic, and that Metal himself was so trashed after CD that Robotnik just threw the older protypes at Sonic to try to stop him until he could get Metal working again. (And them Knuckles immediately trashed him again in Chaotix and put him out of commission until Heroes)

[@ArtHollow]

You talked about how much fun you have reading your Patreon supporter names at the end of these videos as I was typing this comment to talk about it, haha. I don't comment as much as I'd like but I just had to say: honestly, I cannot think of any other KZbinr who has such a great time with these. You have developed such a great relationship with your Patreon supporters, the fun they have with these wild names and how much fun you have shouting them out is a joy (that one person making you shout out a company that wasn't sponsoring the video is one of my favourites). I like to watch through the ending Patreon shoutouts of as many KZbinrs as I can to show my support, but yours are the only ones I can think of that I actively look forward to - it's like they're a feature of the videos at this point. Which is a good thing because they're only getting longer as you get more and more well-deserved supporters. I've somehow managed to type two paragraphs about the Patreon shoutouts of a video instead of about the video itself - I hope that's a testament to how good a job you're doing with these. One more bit of appreciation I want to give: ChannelPup has been killing it with the editing, he is doing a grand job (that final music choice for the video is perfect). Keep up the great work, Nick and Pup! Until next time!

[@benogle4951]

1:12 I have watched this video multiple times and just now I finally got that joke

[@wanderlustwarrior]

"Does any other youtuber have this much fun reading patron shout outs ad the end of videos?" At least for me, you and Overanalyzing Avatar are the most fun to listen to.

[@OtakuUnitedStudio]

I love that we have no less than 4 different robotic Sonic dopplegangers that all have their own unique names, and none of them can keep who is who straight. I hope we get 8-Bit Silver Sonic and Mecha Sonic Mk II figures at some point. I saw they recently redid the Metal Sonic in the 3 inch scale, and it's a big improvement over the original which had some odd joint placement.

[@ZX_STH]

Wild that Eggman thought the best counter to Sonic was another Sonic, after his grandfather made a sonic-esc being as the ultimate life form. Like Sonic is supposed to be the image closet to what perfection is in his world.

[@pikapwn345]

I personally always thought the order was 1,2,3, CD, and that the reason for the three different versions of Mecha/Metal sonic was because they were three different prototypes designed around the same time by Robotnik, who decided to keep with the Metal Sonic design after trying out all three in different schemes. But maybe that’s just my own headcanon.

[@denishiawilliams895]

You're not the only one with that thought, bud, I always thought CD was after 3&K (at least during Knuckles' story), personally, I always took the advancements of the robot in account (that and the Gems of the games, but that's just my thought)

[@webfox100]

I'm a fan of the name Silver Sonic and the look/size from the Archie comic but was about a year after I started reading those comics as a kid. He was a scary beast in Sonic 2 (Genesis) for years when I finally got to him.

[@EpsilonZolton]

If we’re going off purely the origins set timeline I would say that the Mecha MK 1 fight makes some sense being after the Metal fight yet still designed before Metal cause it probably takes a long time to build a death egg and Eggman could have just not had the time to update its defenses or something by the time Sonic made it so they have to work with whatever is on board that being old MK 1 Mecha

[@dcbandit]

As a fan of the Jakks line of Classic Sonic figures, the best for scale is 2" $5 figures for Sonic and pals, and 4" $10 figures for Eggman and Mecha Sonic, as well as his larger robots. These end up at the same scale as close as they get. Modern Sonic figures work the same, but the 4" Sonic sized characters aren't guaranteed to be the same scale. The same deal for Mario characters, but some might be off, like the Princesses or some enemies, but otherwise good. Bowser's best at 4" if you can find him, and the friendlies are best at 2". I think some of the items with the 4" characters might be best compatible with 2" figures at scale.

[@thesmilingman7576]

16:57 I'm pretty sure the CD dev team knew of MK1 since some of Metal's concept art resembles MK1

[@rosetteinspace6574]

The fact that we were talking about this yesterday in the Discord server makes this so much better.

[@darkhorse744]

The one from Sonic 2 could be a Gundam reference, MS standing for Mobile Suit and it also has a Mono-eye like the main enemy factions Zeon's Mobile Suits, most famously the Zaku.

[@comet30265]

Thanks for the badass video man, about this cool character. I’m sure my son will get a kick out of it since he also has that sonic toy. Keep doing this for all us sonic fans of old and new adventures.

[@SleepTastesGood]

I thought for many many years that CD happened before 2 (the Sonic 1 shield, "incomplete" Spin Dash, and lack of any hint of Tails were major players in this). Though it is possible that Robotnik made Mecha first, then got bored and designed Metal instead. Mecha would be mothballed during CD but when Metal was lost and Sonic was closing in on the Death Egg, he put a rush job on Mecha to buy time

[@chimericalical]

My headcanon is that this is the timeline of events. 1. Sonic 1 happens. 2. Robotnik/Eggman manages to escape without the power of the 6 (known at the time) chaos emeralds. He’s frustrated and annoyed by Sonic foiling his plans and begins work on Mecha Sonic, which he completes and places on a project of his, the death egg, as a guardian of the or orbital space station that’s not yet complete (he maybe even has Mecha work on completion of the death egg project) 3. He updates the design and makes silver Sonic. 4. He refines it even more and makes Metal Sonic and around completion discovers tiny planet and the time stones. 5. Sonic CD happens and Eggman brings his A game. Sonic defeats him, Metal is damaged and in need of repairs. 6. During the events of (forgot the name of the game silver Sonic is from) he’s repairing and refining metal Sonic and uses silver Sonic as a means to collect data on Sonic and/or just kill him… he collects data, Sonic kills silver. 7. Sonic 2 happens and he’s still refining metal Sonic who’s not yet complete, but he’s still got metal Sonic and when the death egg is ready to launch not everything is complete. He has Mecha Sonic as a last resort. 8. Sonic destroys Mecha Sonic, the original doppelgänger as well as the death egg and Eggman robot. 9. Crash lands on angel island and while Sonic 3 is happening he’s still refining Metal Sonic and scraps Mecha for parts and uses them in the refinement of Metal. 10. S&K happens and blue mecha Sonic is the new combined version of Metal and Mecha and can now use the chaos emeralds and master emeralds to become super. 11. By adventure he’s made Mecha mark III (given the one is S&K is Mk. 2 of Metal and Mecha) as well as Metal MK 3… 12. During heroes the Mecha didn’t work out but metal is the main antagonist.

[@BigHairyMarty314]

Regarding the name confusion, I think STC (aka Fleetway) made things much easier when they opted for the name "Metallix" to refer to any Sonic (and later, Knuckles) based robot from issue 22 onwards. Keeping in line with that naming scheme, I like to refer to the Sonic 2 robot as the Metallix prototype. As for Sonic 2 and CD's place in the game timeline, I'd imagined CD taking place before 2 since I first replayed it back in 2005. Admittedly, I hadn't thought back then of the implications of the more advanced machine being built first, but thinking about it now, I like to think Robotnik kept a prototype around as extra backup.

[@Jamfrog35]

I have a theory. since CD was using time traveling as a concept to the game, what if metal Sonic was created in little planet's future where Eggman won, and when Sonic and Amy enter little planet, Eggman realize there is a shift to the timeline if Sonic manages to get the time stones, so he send Metal Sonic to stop in his tracks, but after CD Eggman created Metal Sonic in his own right and thus created Metal Sonic after Mecha. It could explain how Metal Sonic show up before the previous models.

[@charlesinatortheponyfeatur224]

Here's a possible fix for the timeline confusion: sonic cd has time travel. As far as I understand, the past and future timelines are never specifically given a numbered date away from the present timeline. Like, sure, at the end of every zone, sonic ends up in the future timeline, so it could be argued that somehow little planets ecosystem evolves in a mater of days or something, but at the same time, it's not like you start every zone in the past timeline either, so perhaps sonic simply uses a future sign to battle eggman for some reason. My point is, depending on how the time travel works, the future timelines could be years in the future, and metal sonic is still an upgraded version of the mechas. Now, to be fair, metal does show up in collision chaos present to steal Amy, but since sonic can use the signs to time travel, and presumably eggman too, to place the robot generators, it wouldn't be impossible to assume that metal can also use them. So, what I'm saying is that, while for sonic it seems like he's fighting metal before Mecha, he could be in 199t or something while racing in stardust speedway, then go back to his present and fight on the death egg before metal sonic is even built. Maybe.... Look, I don't know, given how sonic cd has time travel, I'm just saying that that alone could help fix timeline issues regarding the order of events in the games

[@charlesinatortheponyfeatur224]

Im just saying, there's nothing stopping metal sonic from being built in the future, but it seeming like the present to sonic, because of how time travel works and all that

[@ChaosInferno101]

This was a unique history video good job bro and Mecha sonic should get a little more attention sometimes

[@pikachurino_2396]

I've always personally reasoned that since eggman was using time travel in cd, metal Sonic was way more advanced than everyone that came after him cus he's from the bad future , like a reminder of what eggman could achive if he won, and the mecha sonic line are attempts at recreating the metal sonic concept but with modern day technology so they're weaker than him until we reach far enough into the timeline that eggman reaches that same level of tech and is able to create or repair that metal sonic under normal circumstances

[@takkoy8658]

The original Mecha Sonic not only has traits from Mechagodzilla, but from Gigan as well. Considering both have a cyclops eye and buzzsaw weapons built-in their bodies.

[@DrevikkDrevik]

Idea on how metal is the evolution of Mecha. After sonic 3, eggman landed near Never Lake and discovered the time stones. He set up a temporary base at the lake and brought mecha sonic from 3 to the base. He then used the time stones to go back to the past, where little planet was a moon orbiting Mobius. He then chained up the moon and turned it into a third Death egg of sorts. Eggman then set up the robot generator He then turned Mecha into metal, before going back to between the events of sonic 1 and 2. Where he saw past sonic running towards his new death egg. Also after sonic frees little planet from eggman, the planet flies away so it would not be captured or exploited ever again. So what do you think about this idea?

[@MzCJ]

I’m a whopping 36 now and sonic 1 and 2 were some of my first ever games on my Megadrive (I’m in the uk) when I was a kid and when I first played the metal sonic level, I was literally terrified! The music, the lack of rings, a METAL sonic, it really created a genuine fear in kids at the time. Even more than robotniks giant robot afterwards. Maybe it’s one of those things where ‘you had to be there’, but Sonic 2s Metal will always be the best of all the robo/mecha sonics ever designed.

[@calamario8]

My headcanon is that Sonic CD takes place inbetween 1 and 2, and that during CD Metal gets fully destroyed from that lazer in Stardust Speedway, and Mecha Sonic was the scraps from his code and stuff. idk tho

[@AceNX]

What a great video! Just like Metal, it has no revisions made shortly after! (Nah but fr this video is awesome, I'll watch again lol)

[@DonPuffles]

Only the REAL and most obscure Sonic fans will know that the first Mecha Sonic is Roller the Badnik

[@epsi]

To sync with the Origins order, i like to think of Mecha (2) as a failed attempt to improve on Metal (CD), who was just not powerful enough to defeat Sonic. He tried again in Sky Sanctuary, improving on the Mecha (2) design to create the one we see in S3&K. He went back to the drawing board after that, which is why we see Metal return in Sonic 4- I mean, Sonic Mania. 🤕

[@CassiusStelar]

Suris in the patreon shoutouts is like every time Alex Kister comments on an ARG or horror related channel. Makes sense but no one really expects it

[@eNCy.]

Didn't this video already come out? Am I going insane?

[@J.R.Unbound]

Yup, it did. Dunno why it was reuploaded, but if you are insane, it's not due to that.

[@AzureGalaxyStudios]

This video was reuploaded because Nick forgoten to put the name of the patreons in the video credits

[@J.R.Unbound]

@@AzureGalaxyStudios Ah! Thanks for the info!

[@Elec.Balloon]

That, and there wasn't a proper intro

[@KnucklesTheRizzful]

I never knew there were this much Sonic Doppelgängers! Very informative video!

[@vexzel5550]

I love that Eggmans' greatest threat to Sonic is robot versions of Sonic. He treats metal Sonic like a son which is adorable in a twisted way. I've always loved Eggman's origin in Sonic the Comic of Dr. Kintobor turning in Robotnik by accident. If I could create a Sonic story. I'd have Kintobor be a doctor who wanted to use his genius to create technology that would bring world peace. Upon discovering the chaos emeralds the negative energy turned him into robotnik, and the positive energy turned Sonic Super. (Foreshadowing the picture of super Sonic vs Eggman in Sonic 3) Both pass out, and from there a story can begin. I wish Eggman would also make Robot versions of everyone. Seeing how Sonic had his friends to rely on. Eggman would think to make TEAM METAL.

[@NelStone1]

Literally just got around to watching the Scrapnik Island video. Timing is impeccable.

[@AkiDave]

My eyes when cross eyed when you mentioned “Mecha” multiple times in succession lmao. Great video Nick!

[@megaskully6709]

The way I've always seen the metal mecha debate narrative wise was despite metal being arguably the best at matching sonic in speed, he was still pretty fragile in the games at least, sacrificing defense over the pure speed and some of the laser stuff he can do. The MECHA line on the other hand was more focused solely on combat and could take more hits than metal on account of their more bulky looks. Until after they were obliterated eggman just gave up on that line and focused on making metal better, hence why we see him more often

[@danpinthethecond]

>pretty fragile >Can't be hurt by sonic >Can't be hurt by spikes >can 100 percent hurt you >Literally steamrolls through stardust speedway and shows more advanced strategy than either of the mechas and even surpasses Sonics speed with his overclock (which is can be seen as an evolution of mk2's energy absorption.) >Gets damage to his outer shell in essentially a machspeed car crash >Literally comes back to fuck with knuckles and his crew of intruders and you STILL can't hit him head on you need an entire ROOM of explosions to damage him + he becomes a titan that canonically took 7 fucking people to take down with the added power of slingring launching.

[@danpinthethecond]

Like SuperMecha MK2 is only a little over Baseline Metal and even then he still needs to absorb energy in a longass power up to obtain what metal can with like a 2 second charge while he's still moving, and he has multiple uses for this overclock.

[@danpinthethecond]

Not to mention he's using the MASTER Emerald which is way more powerful as opposed to the Chaos Emeralds which are presumed to be what he was intended to get his power up from, so god knows how long it would've taken him to obtain his SuperMecha form with the intended method rather than going beyond that.

[@megaskully6709]

@@danpinthethecond you know you had good points in here but the fact you had to type out three separate comments debunking me makes legally required to reply with "that's a lot of words, too bad I'm not reading them"

[@danpinthethecond]

@@megaskully6709 hey could've been one but I just thought of more points as I went on

[@AKablalik]

Oh, I just forgot, it’s Mega March MaaaAAAAAAAAAADness! For one because the sonic series is filled with madness and two it’s madness when you find out you forgot. 😅

[@kabob0077]

5:08 Yeah, he's a definitely a Mechagodzilla reference. I wonder if he has backup head under his normal head like Mechagodzilla had when it showed up again.

[@walkerphillips2818]

My personal headcanon is similar to a lot of other comments here, but it also ties all four/five Mechas together. After Sonic The Hedgehog 1 Master System, Eggman has some data on the Hedgehog, and what’s a egg to do but make a bot as Speedy as Sonic? Metal Sonic enters the picture in CD, gets left behind on Little Planet, and Metallic Madness is destroyed, no data on Sonic. So seeing how Sonic has a “Spindash”, Eggs throws a dinky bot together with that capability, Mecha Sonic Mk. 0.9, aka Silver Sonic. He fails, but Egg salvages his processor and rebuilds him into Mark 1, and he creates a copy and placed it into storage. Mark 1 fails in STH 2, and Eggs once again rebuilt him into Mark 2. Mark 2 then follows his story in Scrapnik, but what about the copy of Mk.1? Eggs refurbishes him into Mk. 3, and Metal comes around during Chaotix. That’s how all the Mechas are connected.

[@Blaze4ification]

Mecha Sonic was my 1st introduction in Sonic 2... maybe... wait... maybe it was Mecha? Not sure been too long, Sonic & Knuckles was 1 my 1st Sonic game, but it was at my cousins on the Mega Collection, my dad said he had Sonic games at home on his Sega, and I'd go on to play the crap out of Sonic 2... love the Iron Man reference too. However I've always kind of viewed CD as fitting more between 1 and 2, partially cause Tails wasn't there (until Christian Whitehead remade it). I always viewed it as oh he got the perfect one, to match Sonic right out the gate, and either 1, he was incapable of recreating such a beautiful and perfect design no matter how hard he tried thus his deviation, or because Metal Sonic failed despite being a match for Sonic especially in speed, he needed a bit less speed and a more power. Thus why Mecha Sonic from 2 is clunky, but then slimmed down by Sonic & Knuckles Mecha Sonic. Not only that, but with Super Sonic's introduction in 2, he found a way to harness that power, and thus why mecha sonic could go super, and yet... metal Sonic has never been capable of going super (aside from the Mania animated post Forces cross over). Thus also explaining why CD could be before 2, Super Sonic hadn't existed yet, and maybe the Doctor has never found a way to implement a super form, thus why he absorbs and has battle data on Chaos, turning him into the dragon form in Heroes, he can't harness good chaos, but could harness pure unadulterated evil chaos from the emeralds' power.

[@bluestreak711]

My grandmother and I called him Metal Sonic growing up because we didn't know better, but at some point, I started to call him Mecha Sonic, but I do not remember when or why. I do believe the animated movie in 1994 helped me distinguish that there was a difference. Also fun fact. When Mecha Sonic charges you, you can time a jump just right you will look like you are walking through him and deal him damage.

[@Celtic1020]

I know this is a little convoluted, but my head-canon is that CD takes place before 2 (Which is what all of the media and timelines have been saying) but Metal Sonic is a design from the future that Robotnik took when he controlled the time stones. Then after that's destroyed he goes back to the drawing board but keeps making copies because it was still really effective. That's how we get Mecha 1 & 2.

[@callumsparrow4379]

Scrapnik Island’s concept art proves that CD takes place after 3&K. To paraphrase, Mecha Sonic is an imperfect doppelgänger that’d be later perfected with the creation of Metal Sonic.

[@IceFire2050]

The Sonic Adventure games shows Eggman keeps the older models around, at least for the Anti-Sonic bots. It's possible that Mecha Sonic was built as a prototype first and then he built Metal Sonic, and he just used the older prototype bot because he was available at that point and Metal Sonic wasn't. Like, Sonic got to the final base, he's got nothing left except the old prototype, throw it at him to slow him down while he preps the final fight. As for why Metal Sonic wasn't used, could be that Metal Sonic was left behind on Little Planet since Eggman couldn't retrieve him in time, or Sonic managed to do enough damage to him that Eggman didn't have time to repair him. Basically my idea being... he builds Mecha first, then builds Metal. He puts Mecha in to storage and uses Metal against Sonic in Sonic CD. Metal Sonic vanishes with Little Planet at the end of that game so he's not usable for the next few games. In Sonic 2, Eggman ships Mecha to space with the rest of the supplies while building his base. Mecha is used as a last ditch attempt to stall Sonic in a panic (since Eggman is nervously watching the fight the whole time). In Sonic & Knuckles, since Metal is still lost, Eggman uses the remains of Mecha or at least Mecha's designs with some improved design changes used in Metal to create Mecha MkII. Basically like you said, comparing it to Iron Man, Mecha is the Mk1 Suit, Metal is the Mk3 suit. Mecha MkII is the Iron Monger suit. It took the older design and improved it knowing the capabilities of the newer design without having access to the plans or newer suit to reference.

[@vixenfox1910]

So we're gonna ignore the fact that Little Planet doesn't stay around forever and it only comes once a month per year, and most of the time Robotnik spent there was probably setting things up, transporting bots, and building things. Well it's safe to say he didn't have much time to get what was left of Metal after accidentally blasting him with his own beam before Sonic showed up to put an end to his plans

[@darkexe3161]

in my headcannon it always was that "Classic" Metal Sonic was only created to match Sonic´s speed while Mecha Sonic MK2 was created to match Sonics skills while Mecha Sonic MK3 was created to match Sonics Power and that Metal Sonic got the datas of both Mechas in Sonic 4 Episode Metal

[@Chibiknux]

My headcanon is that Robotnik didn't make Metal, Metal Sonic is just Sonic robotized from a bad future, and Eggman brought him out of little planet's time travelling shenanigans, and he's tried to replicate him ever since. That would explain why Metal isn't always loyal to Eggman and believes so hard he's the real Sonic. That way Sonic CD ocurring before 2 makes perfect sense.