THE CURSED FOUNDING: MISTAKES WERE MADE | Warhammer 40k Lore

[@Adeptusridiculous]

Thanks to Bespoke Post for sponsoring this video! New subscribers get 20% off their first box - go to www.bespokepost.com/adeptus20 and enter code ADEPTUS20 at checkout.

[@Prenz01]

Rest in rip DK died of die this really is the warhammer 40,000

[@TonyRedgrave]

Anyone know what the music was that played in the ad? It was incredibly familiar.

[@darthrevan3342]

44:20 You are mistaken, Inquisition isn't a hive mind you have a shit load of inquisitors with their own philosophy and politicals partis and factions. The Inquisitor that called the grey knight was not from a evry tolernat faction.

[@darthrevan3342]

Do'nt you make teh link between flame falcon and legion of the damned?

[@renegadegodmalice6996]

Cursed founding Minotaurs and The babad wars Minotaurs ( with the red taurus and brass armour) is not the same chapter.

[@exzyyd392]

That whole RussianBadger bit perfectly sums up the Lamenters. "Y'all built different, I'm built incorrectly"

[@SamueL-td7fb]

"I should not exist"

[@alexmartinez5859]

“Constructed in an unorthodox manner.”

[@Channel-23s]

“Built stupid” (unlucky to the max)

[@benneeds_a_name7398]

Constructed alternatively

[@samfire3067]

Nah , its "i'm Built Stupid"

[@IdioticSynergy]

Tonite on Ridiculous Gear: Shy regrets life choices, DK gets yeeted by a black dragon and Bricky wonders if he could replace DK with kirioth

[@bladestormviking]

replace Bricky with Kirioth, you'll get something besides endless riffing and overdone jokes.

[@Kirioth]

The most prophetic comment you've ever made...

[@wheekwarrior1406]

You were right.

[@Vulgaels]

@@Kirioth please stay

[@bladestormviking]

@@Kirioth my visions are JUST accurate enough to not be ignored.

[@henrywhitmore8344]

Bricky: *gets quote wrong* DK in the distance: YOU GET WHAT YOU F'N DESERVE, BRICKY!!!!!!!

[@heboric6136]

Hell yeah brother

[@andydandy8525]

this explains the poor reception in canon of the primaris marines. imagine being a dark angel and Cawl comes up to you and says "hey remember when the ad mech screwed with geneseed and made a bunch of traitor chapters? well we did it again but i swear it will work this time."

[@Qardo]

Well, I do not know why people are pissed. Then, again 40K fans are weird. They love all the depression and pure despair of the setting. They hate anything that seems to have anything going right, unless it is Orks (Orks never fail). So they want humanity to just be the whipping boy all the time. Never allowed to have success or even get cool shit. My opinion. Which to me writing all of this. I think those who love being depressed and in despair. They need help. We get that the universe is the "Grim Dark" but come on. Humanity is allowed to learn from its mistakes and get over stupid dogma and fucking improve! Plus GW wants to make money and Primaris Marines are new bigger Space Marines. On their level people! Open up your wallets! Or be a bastard (hero) and 3D print your own versions. After all, they can't trademark "Marine"...even though they tried and failed, badly.

[@isuckatusernames4297]

to be fair to cawl, the emperor told him to do it. also it's spread out throughout every chapter

[@exzyyd392]

@@Qardo I'm pretty sure people hated the Primaris because at first it seemed like they were trying to completely replace all of the standard Space Marines and then some books or something had the SM acting the same way so people calmed down a bit

[@Qardo]

@@exzyyd392 While that was likely originally what GW wanted to do but the backlash was so big. They made the smart move to back off. Just have both types of marines to exist. Though they would have to buff the shit out of the Chaos Marines on the tabletop. Because they just suck compared to even a normal Space Marine. A Primaris would trash them....unless the guy rolling the dice are outright cursed and cannot roll a good roll to save their life, lol.

[@ThatGuy-eu2vt]

@@Qardo i hate them because it was just a way to make space marine players buy more marines.... and half the range looks like shit and is mono pose

[@natzo89]

To be fair, "MISTAKES WERE MADE" summarizes the Imperium, if not the whole of 40k.

[@BrunoWolfMetal]

If the Emperor cured male pattern baldness we would have a lot less heresy

[@Volvith]

I think not just the era of the Emperor either, just take the Old Ones' reaction to the Necrontyr. Necrontyr: "Please, we're dying of ultra cancer, help us, we just want to not die!" Old Ones: "LOL, look at these growth defect dudes. NO." C'tan & Necrontyr: *"FUUUUU-SION-PAAAAA"* Old Ones: _"wait wat"_ Necrons: "[EVER] [WONDER] [WHAT] [PAIN] [FEELS] [LIKE] [?]" Old Ones: _"oh god oh shit oh fuck uhhh UHHHH _*_ELDAR!!_*_ uhhhm UHHH _*_ORKS_*_ uhhh... oh god we fucked up"_ Necrons: >[LAUGHS] [IN] [GALACTIC] [GENOCIDE]< ... 60 million years later: Human: "Yo what's this weird alien tomb th-- ... _oh no it's moving"_ Necron: "... [HI] [.]" Humanity: _"fuck."_

[@justinkroboth360]

I'm pretty sure it's etched on the Golden Throne somewhere.

[@jasonZoo123]

The whole 40k is just one big Oopsie yes...

[@antigrav6004]

with an asterisk on orks, their plans are going swimmingly.

[@Zivon96]

Valerian, the absolute Chad Custodes, who regularly fights in the Blood Games, battled a horde of daemons on the steps of the Imperial Palace, regularly hangs out with the Sisters of Silence without even pausing to pop an aspirin looked out at Asterion Moloc, Chapter Master of the Minotaurs and said to himself "... Shit. This won't be fun..." And that right there is the closest a Custodes has ever come to wetting himself.

[@Lazrael32]

yeah there is nothing that makes an opponent more intimidating than a custodes being unsure if he can take him. I think it helps that Moloc is just a giant question mark of who he is what his skills are and what he knows.

[@johnj.spurgin7037]

The guy is named after a caanite god. You know he's going to paint the walls with your entrails if you're so much as in his way.

[@ComradeOgilvy369]

​@@johnj.spurgin7037 I've always wondered about the implications of that planet with the warp gate Big E went through to make the primarchs having the same name, that being a god that children are sacrificed to 🤔

[@CuriousLumenwood]

Personally I hate how much of a Mary Sue he is lol “Yea man this is my chapter master he’s so fucking cool and powerful that even a Custodes was unsure if he could beat him also he uses this super unique terminator armour and he’s got this fuckin sick weapon that coooooould be a Custodes spear but it’s unknown what it really is and speaking of unknowns no one knows anything about him and he’s ancient and mysterious also he’s one of the biggest space marines ever”

[@Alzir-n9m]

@@CuriousLumenwood That's not a mary sue. A mary sue is someone who the entire story bends around to make them utterly right in every way. it makes more sense to think of Moloc as a horror monster.

[@diestormlie]

The Minotaurs: There is no such thing as 'Overkill'. There is 'Open Fire' and 'Reload'.

[@razagan1343]

I did not ask about the location of our allies I Ordered to fire.

[@PALACIO254]

Always on fuller auto indoors or out

[@stalinsoulz7872]

@@SWProductions100 Basically The guys that are "Everything is free real state" when it comes to the High score

[@skynyrdjesus]

Overkill implies you could ever be dead enough to satisfy me. Men, fire the cancer bombs.

[@BlazeMakesGames]

I've always enjoyed the theory that Cawl was actually the one behind the Cursed Founding. Like that it wasn't a general Mechanicus attempt at improving the gene seed. Rather it was his first public attempt at finishing his primaris project. And that when it started going wrong, he wiped all records of his involvement with the project to avoid getting in trouble.

[@Kirioth]

I love that, that's a great theory

[@LilacMage]

So cursed founding was primaris pre alpha build? Beta test?

[@TheNaturalnuke]

@@LilacMage first test mixing batches

[@Fourtytwo4242]

@@LilacMage It why the black rage was not 100% cured for the primaris, they would all be lamenters if they did.

[@andreykuzmin4355]

This would fix problem many people had with Primaris: sacriledge of thought, that gene-art of the Emperor and Astarta could be surpassed. Tale of the Cursed Foundation would affirm, that creating improvement over the Firstborne was a herculean task, and the road toward it would NOT be covered with flowers.

[@garpogods8323]

Game Theory: The Lamenters being yellow and having such a difficult logo was done to play on the joke of them being unlucky and hated. Both in universe and by those wanting to paint them.

[@kiddo6393]

Deyz yellow cuz dey keep gettin' blown up and krumpt, stoopid beakiez, dey shoold be green cuz green is best

[@theepicspacemarine8684]

Black dragons are the best chapter as they just don't care about the rest of the imperium judgement on them and just complete their mission and then leave to annoy the inquisition

[@custodianguardofthemagyari216]

If someone would care,about them i think they would be like the salamanders in their view of humans

[@theepicspacemarine8684]

They do share the salamanders general kindness, which is part of their charm is how much less edgy thry actually are compared to how edgy they seek like they should be

[@jamzee_]

@@custodianguardofthemagyari216 Black Dragons basically hold the same viewpoints on human lives. They were made to protect, and so they shall. Although, having a lil bit of door sized mutations doesn’t help all too much when you want to help the family stuck inside a burning building

[@judeblack4360]

Don’t worry about DK, folks. He’s currently being mailed to Yvraine for resurrection, so he’ll be back next week.

[@majormajorasic]

DK fixed Slaanesh and they got married, don't go to realm of slaanesh, you'll see him nude

[@exzyyd392]

Oh nooooo I think I'm dyyyyying Better mail me to Yvraine

[@NCRForLife]

@orkwaagh23 whats bofa? (i already know

[@gerald2508]

​​@@NCRForLifeI do not, but I am sure that I will regret hearing the answer.

[@halocrafter300]

@@gerald2508bofa deez nutz

[@DragonfameDracas]

A few small but important facts that were missed this episode. 1) The Lamenters were thought to have been a success at first because they didn't suffer from the Black Rage. Then the constant misfortunes started and kept getting worse. 2) With the Black Dragons, their venomous fangs NEVER stop oozing poison and as such has scarred their mouths black and given them pointed tongues along with a dour attitude. 3) With the Flame Falcons their catching fire happened in the middle of a battle, in front of an Inquisitor, and slowly spread to the rest of the chapter. These flames, didn't stop. Once they started burning they kept burning, but they celebrated being forever burning warriors because clearly Emperor's Blessing.

[@pogsothoth]

The fact that Moloc might be a personality engram forced into marines after the last one dies (He's been seen dying a lot on many battlefields) seems waaaay cooler than just making him Greek tyberos

[@ItamarO93]

The Cursed Founding: when 40K is not Grimdark enough, take a look at the guys that exist for the Grimdark to bully them

[@rogerarmy8659]

best comment

[@Volvith]

Yeah... ... ... _yeah..._

[@brigidtheirish]

-sad lemon noises-

[@Balrog4242]

Now I really really really want an ep to open with a "some call it the cursed founding" giveaway type quote just so I can listen to DK over analyze it and try to find the trick. Also I love the idea that Cawl isn't a genius he just wrote his name on the Sons o Antaeus' homework.

[@Hartmansgrad]

You might describe it as a Cawl-Back...Cawl did the cursed founding as proto-primaris. Cawl sending Lamenters new Primaris like 'lol, they sad, lmao'

[@Rogerv1032]

Didn’t Bile trade with Trazyn a perfect clone of Fulgrim in exchange for pure geneseed? Wonder if maybe he used the third subject for that.

[@williammontag4388]

I'm pretty sure that Bile has at least tried to clone all eighteen primarchs. He may have cloned Ferrus Manus multiple times so that Fulgrim could try to sway him over and over again (with no success).

[@Volvith]

INB4 Necron-created Astartes. ... I mean we all know Trazyn would get someone to fuck around with it just for fun. Step 1: Create Canoptek-style living armour space marines. Step 2: Drop them at the imperial palace's doors. Step 3: Watch everyone lose their shit over xenos heresy in the capital palace. Step 4: Giggle like a mischievous child because you're Trazyn and literally everything is just a fucking lil game to you.

[@Killerrpg123]

@@Volvith but hes expressed disgust amd pity at their creation process. I dont think he would make new ones. Maybe alter existing.

[@kaynesylvar8277]

I thought that too!

[@samsara5214]

He just slaps a wig on a giant astartes and tries passing it off as captain fucking handsome 😭😭😭

[@Notbatman374]

Kirioth should just be the third commentator at this point. He's got a great depth of knowledge and dry bri'ish humour.

[@sloshed-rat]

I'd love to see another episode with Pat Boivin

[@heboric6136]

I honestly see why rotating hosts once in awhile might be useful. Personally no preference but I understand if people need a fresh voice every now and then

[@Shark-Puffs]

Facts

[@mrsamaritan6881]

Where the Legion of the Damned are concerned, the Firehawks are a red herring. The Legion of the Damned don't use spaceships and appear and disappear from literal thin air. The "Ferrus Mannus" thing was ONLY during their very first appearance (during the Horus Heresy - way before the Cursed Founding) suggesting they may or may not be the spirits of dead space marines.

[@comradestarbucks2726]

Ahh, the cursed founding. Also known as the main reason that primaris marines annoy people.

[@andrethibodeau3203]

"shy went to get a chicken" the image in my head is a cherub chasing a live chicken with a boltgun with a huge grin on her face lol

[@javibertolo1968]

The first madeup quote was awesome. It seemed totally lore accurate to me. I was sure as well that the "angels without wings" would be picked up by Brecky

[@jakebailey1636]

Small thing about cawl as he was brought up near the episode's end yes; he is 10,000 years old, as he was active in the Heresy, faking loyalty to Horus when the system he was in came under his control. He was also so damn smart for a few reasons but it probably helps he absorbed the mind of Ezekiel Sedayne- one of the main and later the lead figure on the project making the first space marines

[@bloodwolfkoji]

He also built a servitor from scratch and self modified his own implants to upgrade them

[@jakebailey1636]

@@bloodwolfkoji Aye, he clearly is smart, but when you got the brain and memories of one of the key figures for making space marines, it's not much of a shock that he knows how to make better ones; moreso if we factor in the resources he was given

[@the_mini_axe2817]

@@jakebailey1636 not just the resources, but also just raw time. you give near about any scientist 10000 years of cognisant life and come back they will have made some fucking progress

[@jakebailey1636]

@@the_mini_axe2817 True, he's probably been given acess to things over that time that just were not available elsewhere

[@ryanadams0922]

Starting to feel like DK when Shy uploads a teaser and I THINK I know what topic they will do when in fact Im always wrong. And it doesnt help that a lot more people are able to guess correctly or close to it. I saw people saying cursed or dragon chapter like COME ON! I thought we were going to do a Raven Guard Ep. But People see a blade on an arm and its just " *SLAMS HANDS ON TABLE* CURSED FOUND! CALLING IT NOW!"

[@bobbymorris2979]

I just thought black dragons because I like them. I didn’t think cursed founding.

[@HunterSentinel]

....yeah, I legit saw the blades arm and knew it was gonna be the dragon chapter. Exactly what their most prominent feature is. But don’t feel bad man, just gotta change your perspective, due to you NOT being put on the spot infront of a million fans and potentially looking dumb like DK, YOU get to be surprised every week with the next episode. It’s ALWAYS gonna be a curve ball for you... cause you’ll never get it right.... But seriously, teasing aside, there’s been times I didn’t guess it easier. It just means you haven’t committed that particular feature to memory like some of us do, and that means you can learn about them again for the first time with bricky and the boys... and shy....

[@thompsonel-melloi9270]

I had just listened to the Imperial fist episode than saw that teaser. I thought it was black templars

[@heboric6136]

.... Don't hate me cause I'm fabulous 🤩 but srsly don't feel bad lol I thought raven guard yesterday but blade arm should have been a solid ringer on the founding or BD. Happens to the best of us

[@Jsay18]

Literally Skill Issue, I don't know how else to make it any nicer I am sorry I have failed you.

[@danieljacob9717]

To be fair about the blood angels and space wolves they are one of the original space Marine legions so that affords them a lot of leeway when it comes to their issues.

[@Volvith]

I mean yeah but i wouldn't consider your marines going absolutely fucking apeshit after a certain point, and wanting to murder everything and drink blood and shit as an 'issue'. _That's a little bit more than a mere 'issue' there bud._ ... *_Also Big E is just a furry don't deny it._*

[@cryamistellimek9184]

Most people, including the inquisition, don't know their issue exists.

[@JudgeNicodemus]

The founding that made my favourite sad-bois. "For those we cherish, we become punching-bags"

[@BenLJudy]

Legion of the Damned as the restless souls of cursed marines who don't die feeling like their battle is over is my personal favorite, not Fire Hawks. It would include loyalists from traitor legions while still not being *just* old, dead marines from 30k. I also want a Contemptor Dreadnaught to be recognized across a battlefield by Fulgrim. The Ancient awaits.

[@jacobbosecker6916]

That is my favorite theory as well.

[@thewerdna]

Said dreadnaut proceeds to run up to Fulgrim and nuke him in the face... Then after respawninh some time later does it again. And repeat.

[@gabrielmarquez4029]

Perhaps their leader is an armored giant whose helmet seems mysteriously empty….

[@phylippezimmermannpaquin2062]

Yeah, lets remove the weight of his sacrifice

[@hihowdyhellohi5231]

I like to think it’s multiple different factors, like the survivors/deceased of Istavan, with general dead, united by Ferrus’s and the Emperor’s will, and then the Fire Hawks helped with bodies and extra spirit

[@HunterSentinel]

57:14 my head canon is that the Minotaurs are embarrassed by their first company paint job and the high Terran lords are blackmailing them with this info so the Minotaur chapter do everything they’re told to do.

[@ryanzahn6581]

Who has read the black dragon book "The death of Antagonis"? it explores the idea that there is a small segment of the black dragons that dont mutate at all for some reason, and they have to draw from them for the inquisition's tests, its neat

[@coadiemacleod3909]

One of my first 40k books. I loved the idea of using the 'pure' members of the chapter to pass the gene tithes.

[@molenat9973]

Spoiler Alert ​@@coadiemacleod3909 I know you read it but for those that didn’t That small group of black dragons that didn’t mutate is exactly what broke the chapter apart. The black dragons that didn’t mutate turns to chaos and the ones that were mutated stayed loyal. The loyalists absolutely slaughtered the traitors and now they are all mutated. The “main character” of the book even got special bone blades due to fighting the traitors

[@BarokaiRein]

Kirioth needs to be a permanent member, episodes with him in it are always the best! If we have to kill DK to make it happen then that's a sacrifice I'm willing to let him make.

[@darkpit37]

Bricky and Kirion: talking cursed founding stuff Shy: *"Oh no, my chicken"*

[@PhthaloGreenskin]

Yellow is insanely easy to paint. Just prime in Pink and zenithal highlight ivory from above. Seriously almost all of the hard colors to paint can be made easy just by changing the color primer you use.

[@kaleoarnold3709]

Really? How does that help with painting yellow?

[@PhthaloGreenskin]

@@kaleoarnold3709 the undershade, yellow is a transparent color so whatever is underneath is going to influence the final color. Pink will give you nice shadows while the ivory gives you your highlight via the zenithal. The same principle applies with painting red or orange. For those 2 colors prime in brown and ivory because both of those are warm colors. When you try to paint warm colors over a cold color like black or white it desaturates the color. Now yellow is neither a warm nor cold color but it's very transparent hence why the undershade is so important. The final result is a warm sunny yellow that looks like you spent hours doing highlights but it actually took you 10 mins because all you did was slap yellow over that primer.

[@kaleoarnold3709]

@@PhthaloGreenskin That’s epic! I’ll have to try that if I ever do anything yellow!

[@zincgoblin7538]

What I love about the cursed founding is the blurred line between being chaos and still loyal. When Bricky released the video about every 40k faction two years ago, I decided to take his advice and get a small army of space marines. However I went for cursed founding and gave them a physical disability that turned tactical marines into a semi-possessed squad that functioned like death company from blood angels, OR have the limb or part amputated and have prosthetics like iron hands. The cursed founding gives a lot more freedom, and a lot of good and bad comes out of it, in lore and in real life. I know a hobby store manager who has a 'cursed founding' chapter that's just bright pink hello kitty marines. very cursed.

[@hihowdyhellohi5231]

Like you can say “Oh yeah they’re made of multiple parts of legions but look like (legion) and play like (other legion) since the admech tried to fix impurities by combining different legions”

[@boredashell124]

This episode was worth it for no other reason than to hear the incredulity in Bricky's voice when he asked Kirioth "Are you gatekeeping chicken?"

[@jacobfreeman5444]

Not sure what is funnier about Cawl. That he might have an A.I. or that he perhaps figured out some kind of warpy technology that would allow him to reply to others in real time despite distance. Because we all know there is no way he anticipated the kind of responses another might make to the kind of detail his little abomination can.

[@FunnyTaco143]

They didn't talk about the Blood Gorgons that much which makes me sad as they do have a decent amount of info on them since they have a book series. Besides what they said about being more tactical and not aligning to a specific god they also try to purge themselves up corruption to the best they can, and have fought death guard/plague marines on multiple occasions. When they first when traitor they moved into a giant space hulk and ended up infighting and breaking up into multiple small warbands that fought inside the ship until their old chapter mater defeated the other warbands and reunited the chapter now smaller into a cohesive group that are now totally loyal to each other. Their Apothecaries now powerful psykers called Chirurgeon‐Witches know a ritual called blood bonding that allows two marines to almost sync their minds together making them know of each others actions without saying words. For their tactics they make small squads that are made up of several group of bond brothers. They also treat their cultists/ human followers with more care then normal CSM as they see them as valuable assets/ property that belong to the marines and when the marine that owned a slave died those slaves are also killed and buried sent off with their owner. The Blood Gorgons are cool but since the stuff with their author I doubt we will see anything else from them again which is a shame. Also their chapter master/chaos lord now has a crab claw.

[@kevincass9917]

What happened to their author?

[@Kuziminski]

@@kevincass9917 In theory, at a glance in the searches: Plagiarism. Some chunks from other BL books and a book called "House to House" which is a memoir of the Iraq War. Back in like 2009-ish, but only grabbed discussions about it in 2014.

[@kevincass9917]

@@Kuziminski Ah damn.

[@YoBen100]

Black Dragon: X-men theme music from 90s cartoon. Enough said with this chapter of Space Marines.

[@curtislangdon8294]

Honestly I rather like the idea that wasn't covered in this video the idea that not only were the Ad Mech trying to fix the flaws of loyalists geneseed but also reintroduce traitor geneseed. The Sons of Antionus may have been infact inhereted the Geneseed of the Deathgaurd, hence thier strong indoskeloton and resiliance in Attrition warfare, the same style of the stinky boys. The Minotaurs as well feel and act like Text book Iron Warriors, and the perhaps the reason the Fire Hawks were so hawty and arrogant may have been influenced by Emperor's Children Geneseed.

[@curtislangdon8294]

Now that I think about it, the Flame Falcons spontaneous combustion thing could have been due to having Thousand Sons Geneseed which is why when it manifested, the Inquisitor happened to suspect Thousand Sons problems and opted not to take any chances.

[@silenthermit4637]

I think they're a hybrid between Alpha Legion and Death Guard Gene seed. Explains them being taller and stronger , and explains their very secretive nature since they always immediately leave once they're finished fighting a battle.

[@isaachaahr8691]

The abominations from the Cursed Knights sound like the flesh change curse. That would suit them being Thousand Son gene seed.

[@curtislangdon8294]

@isaachaahr8691 Oh yeah, that reminds me of the Fire Falcons and their human torch abilities. The Ksons are Psykers with an affinity for fire, which might explain why the inquisition was so quick to declar exertmatus on them immediately after this power manifested.

[@xanderlee51]

“I was there, the day DK screwed up the upload.” - Me, 3rd millennium.

[@MrFatalisDev]

"I Was Here." said another KZbin Lurker.

[@mr.potato2223]

"As twas i" - potato 3rd millennium

[@YoBen100]

"I was there"

[@MakeLoveNotWar687]

“I was there” a slice of ham

[@12ratsinatrenchcoat]

I was there the day the upload schedule fell! Some random Memorator.

[@LeoKisomma]

"There's too much shit on Cawl to model him for that" - Bricky, I have already 3D modelled a Knight, Commander Farsight and a Tao riptide as Ad-Ric fan-art, don't underestimate how far I can go to provoke the memes :3

[@mikcon63]

They made a great introduction to the destructive power of marines when horus fell and they were hurrying to get him to the medical deck. It was a massacre because they simply "hurried through the crowd while beating people out of the way", killing and injuring tons of people in the most casual manner possible.

[@JOJO-Bub]

FABULOUS BILL, THE WRETCHED SCIENTIST OF CHAOS

[@PingachuWarham]

After hearing about the Black Dragons now I really want an episode on the Soul Drinkers. For those who don't know they suffered spontaneous mutations at the hands of Tzeentch, were tempted by chaos in multiple ocassions and were ultimately excomunicated by the Imperium, and despite all of this they still remain loyal to the Emperor. Also their chapter master, Sarpedon, is a librarian whith literal spider legs, having replaced one of them with a mechanical prothesis. Finally there's the fact that they come from the Second Founding, being one of the three original successor chapters of the Imperial Fists.

[@robertbodkin9916]

The flame falcons, now know as the Pheonix Bretherin, burst into flame that burn away chaos and corruption when they are in the middle of battle. The inquisition thought it was corruption, mainly cos most of the chapters of the Cursed founding were on short leashes due to the curses. A few of them escaped and have a new world they live on as they dealt with an Dark Eldar raid on the planet they found. They are pretty neat and it was just Inquisition going nuclear for no reason.

[@Volvith]

Ah yes, the founding that spawned the 'i'm horny, literally' dudes, the _(allegedly)_ Legion of the Damned, *_LITERAL FUCKING DEPRESSION IN STORY FORM,_* and the 'we're not heretics for murdering our brothers if they were heretics first' Sparta fanboy club. Also the two chaos ones, and the goop juice stronk marines. _Their crayons are solidified steroids._

[@collecter343]

Them: Explaining how terrible it is to paint White Scars My Dumbass: Looking at my very first models that I decided to paint as White Scars that I still haven't finished.

[@Ghostly_One1]

Maybe my favorite thing with the Black Dragons is a short story of an imperium vessel getting boarded by Drukhari. It goes about as..."well", as you might imagine, although they do get a distress signal out. One of the remaining few free survivors is absolutely booking it down the hallway, and in comes the boarding party that both saves and stuns her terrified silent. And honestly you would be too, if you saw enormous armored, clawed, horned nightmare black walking tanks that carry equally huge guns. One of them jokes to have pity on the poor woman, since he was certain she was hoping the ultramarines or some other more aesthetically pleasing chapter would have shown up, while another just nice and calm demands to know where the Drukhari are so they can go massacre them.

[@mutantmaster1]

Ah, the Lamenters The only group to make TTS Emps cry long n hard

[@steelgreyed]

*(reading the title)* "Mistakes were made." "Yup that pretty much sums it up."

[@calvinheslop2585]

I really hope that we get a story about how the big guy that fabulous bill made off with is in fact the big dude from the carcarodons and tells us how he escaped and took the gene tools back to start his own chapter.

[@jasonburke1671]

I woild honestly be more surprised in a story about how Fabius Bile mamaged to capture ALIVE Tyboros the Red Wake as the man is the size of a dreadnoight, three times as pissed off as a world eater, and about as blood thirsty

[@HexManiac-nf1yg]

@@jasonburke1671 well he would have made off with him before he woke up

[@josemontalvomelendez5642]

@@jasonburke1671 no my friend world eaters WISH they were as pissed off as my boy tyberos his rage has gone full circle twice and landed in a state of calm fury so palpable that It unnerves lesser tyranid Bioforms ( gaunts and warriors) and gives pause to the usually indifferent admech

[@jasonburke1671]

@@HexManiac-nf1yg the mans at least thoight to have been around longer than the cursed founding, but no one knows because the Space Sharks only appeared in 41M, but are theorizd to be what remains of the Pale Sons, the sons of the Raven Guard cast out bh Corvus

[@calvinheslop2585]

@@josemontalvomelendez5642 Maybe hes like that because of the crap Fabulous Bill did to him trying to turn him because I can't see the emperor giving the go ahead to use shark dna if they already weren't happy with space wolves,the guy was supposed to be smart so Id figure the last thing you'd want to use if trying to make better uncorupptable marines is the Dna of the most godless creature in existence

[@Creepler89]

Not only do the black dragons have a bone to pick with you, they also have a bone to pick you with.

[@Jack-0-lantern]

The surviving Flame Falcons actually did rename themselves as the Phoenix Brethren.

[@calebtesfaye3925]

isn't that just a homebrew creation?

[@IrishEyesBlackDragon]

Ah i would love the crew to do a Minotaurs episode, the lore of this chapter is Ridiculous. And I love it.

[@danieljacob9717]

One of the reasons why other chapter shunned the fire hawks was due to their participation in the Great Malagatine Purge where 5 chapters were ordered to slaughter every man, woman, and child in the Malagant system. What’s suspicious about this is that any information about this operation is unknown even to the inquisition. As such the reasoning for such a brutal slaughter are unknown and when I mean slaughter I mean the usage of exterminates and virus bombs to ignite a planets atmosphere. For their work the hawks were given a feudal world of Costeau XI as a recruitment world. Because of their willingness to commit such slaughter on civilians whose guilt is still unknown they were shunned by many other chapters. It should be noted that the other participating chapters were the Charnel Guard and Silver skulls. The last two are unknown.

[@Analog_Mind47]

That was a great intro you wrote Kiroth, really fits the setting

[@Kirioth]

thank you!

[@bthsr7113]

I already made a longer comment, but TLDR/final point, this founding is honestly less cursed than the reputation would suggest. 7 chapters made. The 3 successes: 1 became the military police 1 was big and tanky 1 got extra offensive additions to their bodies Of the 4 who "went bad" 1 was so unlucky that I assume it has to be from a certain faction in the warp. Still had heightened resistance to the faults whose correction was the point of tinkering with their geneseed. Also fine conduct and humility. 1 was immediately taken behind the shed for the first odd thing 1 got lost in the warp, and their possible/presumed fate as ghosts is uncomfirmed, let alone definitely rooted in their modifications. 1 did admittedly turn traitor, though more subdued traitor than most.

[@skullreaper7102]

This made me want to see a black dragon dreadnaught. This hulking mass of sharp bone and steel. Just imagine a dreadnaught but since the bone didn’t stop growing it is boarder line chaos looking self

[@agent5333]

*I AM THE BONE OF MY SWORD*

[@lexisking152]

I just realized something because of this video with that mention of several really big space marines. The war of the False Primarch took place within ~100-200 years of the 21st cursed founding, and we know Imperial records are inconsistent and that the mechanicus were likely doing some weird stuff with it for a while. What if that nominal false primarch was one of those weird big space marines? Like that would explain part of why the 21st cursed founding chapters are so skeptically looked upon, it would explain what could've been considered a false primarch, and the 21st founding, as this video attests, was the mechanicus attempting (and failing) to make primarch-level space marines. What if the false primarch was an escaped one of these things? Like, god-emperor knows how long the mechanicus were doing that experiment or when they exactly they started. And that could explain the 11 chapters that followed the False Primarch as well! God, the ideas this is giving me now.

[@marneuscalgar4361]

Honestly 40ks whole tag line could be "we done fucked up"

[@gartankthesecond3726]

Cursed Founding Chapters be like: Sons of Antaeus: I’m just built alternatively. Constructed alternatively. Black Dragons: Constructed in an unorthodox fashion Minotaurs: Built STUPID Flame Falcons: Crafted without the preset parameters Lamenters: Y’all built different, I’m built incorrectly. I’m just wrong. In every way. Legion of the Damned: I should not exist Lamenters: I should not exist

[@ComradeOgilvy369]

Fire Hawks: became legion of the damned Flame Falcons: hated in life for burning heretics with their mere presence

[@rebel1717]

The reason why the Sons of Antius are labelled “cursed” is because their toughness and durability is eerily similar to the Death Guard and Iron Warriors during the Horus Heresy and Great Crusade. And because both are traitor legions, suspicions are rising.

[@guy_autordie]

I like the "no fucks given" "let them regret their birth" minotaurs.

[@jmr2408]

Thanks immensely for that quote about the Sons of Anteaus. I thought it was just a cool name and didn't see the full connection to the original legend until that quote about "Never losing on solid ground" brought the whole thing into focus. Now the Sons of Anteaus rank even higher on my list of favourite chapters. I just wish we knew what they OFFICIALLY look like.

[@zacharycoash6380]

20:50 ok ok, here me out here, didn't he have that clone of fulgrim that he traded to trazyn, do we know if this was before or after that?

[@IronheadEli723]

One of the coolest parts about the black dragons: some of their members have literally turned into dragons and are unleashed in battle upon their enemies.

[@Bonavire]

4:47 patiently awaiting the day I get to meet Mr. James Workshop

[@GreatgoatonFire]

I really want to see what the Primaris Marines of the Cursed Founding would look like.

[@Jack-0-lantern]

I wonder how much more jacked the Sons of Antaeus are becoming with their Primaris.

[@r.cdahuman7682]

@@Jack-0-lantern the Arnolds of marines

[@michaeldimare3786]

Black dragon primaris don’t look that interesting but I guess GW expects fans to do that work

[@alexlloyd2198]

Nice, just to add, fire hawks have only been hinted at being the founding of the legion of the damed, but never confirmed more than any of the many other possibilities. Also back in the day the cursed founding was an experiment funded by the faction of the inquisition that wanted to bring the emp back and needed a new body strong enough to hold his immortal soul. But chaos corrupted one of the marines who gave away the base location the first time round.

[@arathbautista4131]

As someone who who started work at 10 and was hoping to listen to the Chaos that is Ad Ric i was Disgruntled to find it WASNT LIVE

[@JeancarlosRPerez]

*Every Gene Seed Power!* Lamentors? *Super Unlucky*

[@rycolligan]

That countdown animation before the premiere is dangerously hype.

[@vontheunknown7982]

The minotaurs are 100% from the iron Warriors, what do you guys think?

[@loganb7059]

Nah fam. World Eaters. Maybe a hybrid of both.

[@jerelly9469]

Definitely 100% iron warriors, same attitude, similar fighting style, only cares about completing the mission

[@jerelly9469]

Minotaurs is also Greek, iron warriors came from Olympia, so that is another connection between them

[@Fourtytwo4242]

@@jerelly9469 Also Iron warriors were seen has less traitorous since unlike other legions many iron warriors even after the purge stayed loyal...mostly out spite but still.

[@davidfrancisco3502]

@@Fourtytwo4242 The Iron Warriors are the ultimate agnostics. They know gods exists yet they refuse to worship them, calling them gods and they see angels and daemons as nothing but another resource to mine and exploit.

[@meccevil321]

It was the best of foundings, it was the blursed of foundings.

[@PrancingGoldfish]

Personal head canon ahead: I like to think that in researching/testing/preparing for the Ultima Founding, Cawl was probably to at least a small extent involved in all the space marine founding except for the 1st & 2nd. It would only make sense that he would want to field test any ideas he had. To further expand this, I personally believe the Sons of Anteus were early trial primaris marines.

[@SumDude129]

40:31 The Firehawks being the LoD is pretty much not legit anymore. I know nothing has been confirmed for the LoD but most of the evidence points to Imperial Daemons. Not saying the Firehawks can't be part of the LoD but not the beginning of the LoD

[@chrisa7101]

Not gonna lie, I wouldn’t mind if Kirioth was a permanent member of the podcast.

[@The_Bird_Bird_Harder]

And a year later, your wish is granted.

[@OddFellowGaming]

DUde, the RussianBadger vid joke is SO spot on XD

[@robrib2682]

for the black dragons if I remeber Arch's video they will have unmutated "pure" astarties that they are very protective of so theres a good chance thats ALL that they send to be tested

[@settratheimperishable7800]

Seeing Bricky struggle with the quote is so surreal

[@ancientgearsynchro]

Stoically sufferings while painting yellow minis? Sounds perfect for any Imperial Fist fan.

[@heboric6136]

Grey knights really do have the power of god and anime on their side Interesting

[@NotoriousTim]

Love the Black Dragons, definitely my favorite of the 21st founding. I'm also a huge fan of the Salamanders so maybe I just really like dragons, lol.

[@ezequielmorales4221]

The giant marine being Tyberos could be cool af if they do it properly.

[@Tommy9834]

I think Kirioth is no longer a guest. He dunks on DK and pisses Shy off, he is now officially a part of the crew. I guess he is now an "Inconsistently Regular Host"

[@TuShan18]

I like to think Sons of Antaeus are prototype primaris and/or messing with Mortarion’s geneseed. Also, I love the idea that Cawl’s mind has a cruise control

[@Archon3960]

I can't believe they completly skipped the theory that the AdMech used Traitor geneseed to create these chapters. Heck, they mentioned the connection between the Sons of Antaeus and the Death Guard! X/

[@Riunix7]

What is the thing pictures when talking about cooking a chicken at 9am? Looks like something I'd want to make

[@karmaschampion8940]

Cawl gets ADHD hyperfixations

[@vontheunknown7982]

My 3 favorite cursed founding chapters are: 1. The Black dragons 2. The Minotaurs 3. The Lamenters Who is your favorite cursed founding chapters?

[@MrFatalisDev]

You've literally named the only ones I know...and I only knew two of them.

[@muffinman9182]

Sons of Antaeus, just bigger and more physically robust space marines

[@GrumbleGrimbus]

@@muffinman9182 My theory is they were a sort of proto-primaris

[@Stop_Gooning]

Same, but in the reverse order.

[@BrianHall33]

1. Lamenters 2. Sons of Antaeus 3. Black Dragons

[@bobbysmith669]

To answer the Blood Gorgons book bit: yes, they have a book by Henry Zou. But in the novel they're Chaos Marines. I'd recommend it though, while not the strongest 40k novel I've read the Gorgons are really unique in how their Chaos Mutations work. And, if I recall right, despite being Chaos they're not super assholish to their slaves (kinda like Talos in the NL Trilogy) and drop everything to go rescue a recruitment world they use regularly and treat the locals pretty well.

[@Duganator]

I'm surprised you didn't get further into the Black Dragons. There's some cool story there. But I am happy to see all the love for them in the comments!

[@tomicecold8681]

Maybe the SoA curse is the fact they have the highest luck basically anti lamenters

[@DirtyDanRichards]

Poor one out for our boys, the Lamentors.

[@TheRealSharkface]

Wouldn't it be cool if the Flame Falcons became merc marines or Rogue Trader guards like the Astral Claws??

[@Ajacks1]

LOVE your easily digestible videos! I’m in my first narrative playing a Minotaur space marine and I’m in love! Share the brutality & kin killing with the Minotaurs video promised 2yrs ago?

[@vanstarate]

>a squad of space marines can take over a planet Yeah, sure, buddy

[@haraldbredsdorff2699]

In my head canon, I always thought the cursed founding was the tech priests using the traitor legion gene seeds, to try to make "faithful" legions.

[@SkuubaSteve]

"It was the old days, where the rules were totally messed up." Implying the rules now are not an absolute shitshow, Bricky pls