The Dark Side of Modern Forza

[@mustuff1242]

You know the game is dying when you get banned for playing too much but the leader board is full of cheaters from day one.

[@frLucz]

Too much indeed

[@FakeJeep]

Ironically. I have a friend that played Fallout 76 12-16 hours a day. He lost his job and while applying for new ones/searching he played F76 nearly religiously. He power leveled so quickly using knowledge from other mmos and previous fallouts that he got temp banned, and then later on got banned for offering to help people level/quest "too much, for views" when he wasn't a streamer or even had a youtube/twitch channel. So this is a thing in other games too if you play "too much" and your hours are not taken into consideration, to which comes off as very lazy to me. "Why does this guy have x amount of money? -checks- oh, he has like 7000 hours logged..."

[@Tha-mountain]

@@FakeJeep 1: wow f76 was lame for that 2: is he back playing f76? If so (if he minds) any tips?

[@FakeJeep]

@@Tha-mountain Nope. Didn't even try to appeal. Moved on to some Arma 3 fork... can't remember name.

[@julius2538]

Having played 1000+ hours on GTA Online, I can confirm this ist true.

[@v0ldy54]

FM:"You got a fancy paint in your car, get banned" Assetto Corsa:"Come to my server, we race a T-Rex vs a plane and Salvatore Ganacci's shoe"

[@zhila5958]

quitting the forza community for assetto corsa and beamNG was one of the best decisions i’ve ever made

[@code066gaming]

@@zhila5958 same

[@zhila5958]

@@code066gaming like they are way better. forza died for me with forza motorsport 7 and horizon 5

[@code066gaming]

@@zhila5958 im still holding out hope for the motorsport games cuz of the online community but horizon is dead to me

[@chrismusiclover9893]

​@@code066gaming nah honestly Forza's community is dogshit nowadays

[@piotrwojciechowski5846]

“Forza motorsport is being destroyed by the competition while horizon is dying by the lack of it” - wow couldn’t have said it better.

[@sumergill1351]

Gran turismo is always king And the OG

[@piotrwojciechowski5846]

@@sumergill1351 For track racing I agree, gran turismo takes the crown. But I also really enjoyed the open world aspect of forza horizon. Unfortunately the last good one I’d say was forza horizon 3.

[@tilburg8683]

​@@sumergill1351 old GT yes, GT7 is a borefest slotmachine. It's all about paying for getting a car and not falling asleep because of how lack luster the driving and basically everything is in that game. Meanwhile the chad GT1-4 didn't only have much more cars a overall much better look, be it in a race be it the much better looking menus. Content, be it the much larger and diverse car list, track list, or the actually existing single play campaign. Or the fact it's even playable at all because GT7 is online only, so some day, you literally won't be able to play it no matter your opinion on the game, meanwhile everyone else is still enjoying the older GTs to their fullest. New racing games are all meh, but because they're all bad no one is trying to be good. FH5 is one of the best moder racing games simply because most of the rest are complete utter garbage. The last really great modern sim(cade) I've played is AC on pc, or driveclub. The rest is just garbage. Even garbage would be better actually.

[@falcon1378]

@@tilburg8683 Mostly because GT7 caters to a more competitive community, there is virtually no room for casual players. The older GTs were more diverse in that aspect. Does that mean GT7 is garbage? Not really. It certainly does it’s job better that Forza Motorsport.

[@tilburg8683]

@@falcon1378 while the most competitive thing to do is see who can stay awake the longest while playing such a boring game. I guess it indeed has this whole terrible e sports scène. And that doesn't make it terrible (although e sports tend to make games a lot worse, look what happened to r6 siege, went from really good to some weird cod rip off that is unbalanced as hell) Gt7 is mainly just a slot machine, or something to help people who can't sleep to fall asleep as it's the moest boring thing ever. Driving in a traffic jam feels more intense than anything that game could ever offer. And forza does 1 basically not exist and 2 not have an e sport, but it's technically better on those things that Forza doesn't attempt. (Not that anything past fm4 is good anyways).

[@BiggieCMAN]

Ah yes this game, the game that banned me for buying a car on the auction house until the year 3043

[@fanbrykcs]

I once had a simple cheat to be able to have all cars before the premiere and sell them at auction, what came out of it? nothing XD (and its sad)

[@Lynnfield3440]

​@@fanbrykcsyou see, that is because actually cheating isn't against the rules. Only playing legit is.

[@meehdrescher]

and they banned me for having 30 million credits because apparently i had too many credits within the first week after the first logon... i was playing on that acc every day for 2 years but ok

[@Chiller07]

"Built from the ground up... to the floor"

[@user-ju1li5jw4h]

Buying a car from a cheater is cheating lol

[@tommynobaka]

I was a tester for the then new FM7 and they said to leave as much feedback I told them the menu music was too loud and obtrusive to the xperience of the game, the overly shaky pov driving and action cam was nauseating, and progression lacked substance. It didn't feel worthwhile to progress. All of my game tests after were canceled with no reason. To this day, I still can't test games for MS because someone at Turn10 got offended of my criticism

[@Geert890]

Whatt🤣🤣 that's crazy Man I'll never understand people who get offended after asking for feedback

[@BlueMoon1890]

When Forza horizon 5 was first releasing Game Pass subs got to play a little bit early. They encouraged feedback, and all I said was a tree in one part of the map was floating. I got banned. The tree is still floating.

[@nst1981]

No happen. That's not how game testing works

[@SoheiJayce]

The hud exaggeration could be be tone down in the options menu.

[@Invis_Space]

Yeah this checks out. Respect your honesty brother 💪🏻

[@dp12480]

I like how much of the issues with the community rn is because of the constant "clean" image Playground games wants. When the devs care too much it makes it so hard to actually enjoy the game in its true potential. No wonder forza mods are created, the community its trying to make the game more enjoyable

[@laco6352]

squeaky clean to get more parents to buy it for their 5yo kids

[@dp12480]

@Laco 100% that's why, but it divides the core audience and in the end makes a worst game imo

[@plav032]

But they attack modders and make the game increasingly harder to mod.

[@kpegc]

Seems like a pretty senseless quest when the first Horizon was rated T and many of the original PG staff worked on T and E10 rated racers like DiRT and Burnout.

[@laco6352]

@@dp12480 fr

[@sehajkaler9285]

I saw my drift score on the long mountain drift zone (was like 1.1M or something) got taken down, but I still see speed cameras at 500mph. 10/10 perfectly balanced game

[@bgirl47]

Everyone's PB was deleted, they announced it a while back

[@sehajkaler9285]

@@bgirl47 yeah, I think I remember reading that. I remember it happened a couple times in FH4 too

[@sparkietrap6257]

@@bgirl47 the point still stands. I had a world record on Restos cross country in a FD car which got deleted but other obvious cheated times are still up

[@thesprawl2361]

@@sparkietrap6257 I was in top 200 in the world on every drift zone I ran and those records are all gone. Everyone's been shafted.

[@sparkietrap6257]

@@thesprawl2361 everyone’s drift zones have been wiped for the 1st month of the game. Other things that have been wiped were automatically deleted with PGGs “anti cheat”

[@fortisch]

Everyone needs to see this. It doesn't even matter if the devs think they are right, as they do not communicate with their community. They all behave like old teamspeak mods.

[@thatpersiandude7386]

FH5 is ass, playing 2 and 3 was way more enjoyable

[@PoutineCrusader]

Forza devs: Tell you to play motorsport for serious racing also Forza devs: Prohibit you from buying the entire series except for Horizon 4&5

[@brunaogemeplay2439]

Exactly mate,i got so bummed out when fh4 stopped running properly on my and i could only get fh3 for "free"

[@JZStudiosonline]

@@brunaogemeplay2439 The free version of H3 actually works? Haven't tried in a while but it seemed confusing.

[@brunaogemeplay2439]

@@JZStudiosonline yeah It does,the first time i tried it i didn't know you had to follow a little tutorial to get it to work,i got it from a certain fitgirl-repacks,in the comments you'll find said tutorial. Also fh3 is way more fun than 4,map's pretty sick.

[@xthund3rtrap]

They will always focus on the casuals, they know that they will have a comp community when theres causals everywhere, its been prooven mutiple times that forza can BE a comp franshcise, sadly i will trust it once i see it happen

[@TerminallyOffline2]

Even 4s on the way out

[@HandsomeHuber]

I've been a Forza Race Marshal a few years ago which meant we had direct access to the devs. (around 2017-19) I was there from the very beginning of the program and we were supposed to flag ramers, cheaters, people who make offensive stuff, you name it and directly bring them to the devs attention who banned them. In the time i was there i noticed that there were a few mods who could do "anything" . And i mean anything. It started of with their opinion being the gold standard. No matter what the topic was if you had a different opinion they would shut you down. And because they had really close ties to some of the devs, the devs usually backed them up. I say "devs" but in reality i mean 3-4 people in their community team. But things turned more serious over time when i noticed they targeted specific community members and had major gripes towards some people. It got so bad that harassment was covered up by them and of course some directly engaging in harassing behaviour towards targeted people. And some people in the T10 dev and community team knew of it. They knew exactly what was going on. But instead of shutting it down and removing the problem makers they covered it up and removed any mods who spoke out about it. Thats how i got removed. I was promised that i can return back in a time span of 3 month but i got ghosted and recieved ban on my user generated content in FH4.

[@EmoDKTsuchiya]

We used to have a mod like that back on FM2-4. His name was Dragnet

[@GODBLESSUNKNOWN]

How much fake do you want ? This comment...

[@TheFishE77Official]

​@@GODBLESSUNKNOWNNo, he is 100% right. Forza forum mods are insanely power-trippy. I got banned for 300 years or something stupid like that back when FM5 came out from the forum because a mod had a personal vendetta against me and a couple of the other prevalent livery creators of the time, and he literally went to _other websites_ and banned me for the stuff I posted there. Noting he has ZERO athority to moderate other websites, but still cites them as the reason for my ban on the FM forum. And of course they completely block you, so you cannot point out their hypocrisy, and when I contacted the devs their response was "we trust our moderation staff"

[@garyclarkiii730]

Typical pussies hiding behind a monitor, bullying people online to relinquish the power that they never had at any point in their life

[@HandsomeHuber]

@@EmoDKTsuchiya Dragnet was actually one of the trouble makers.

[@NDL_Silva]

More people need to see how corrupt the franchise is because the more of the player base knows about everything the more likely we are to see a change. Forza wants to keep there reputation as the E for everyone game and if they get known as the corrupt franchise I think they will need to sort out how they do stuff

[@GTPlanetFamine]

Guy gets banned 5 times community: omg corrupt devs lets shut them down and arrest

[@sparkietrap6257]

@@GTPlanetFamine I think you missed the point of the video

[@ZetaRidge7]

​@@sparkietrap6257 Exactly. It is a shame that so much people are not understanding nor even listening of what SP4 is trying to say even with clear as day evidence shown. We have come to a point where many fans are either apathetic or outright not care of what's truly happening now that is affecting nearly everyone's enjoyment of the game.

[@tilburg8683]

​@@GTPlanetFamine how are those boots tasting?

[@RukaGoldheart]

​@@GTPlanetFamine remove Kimi's name from your account.

[@JailbreakMoments]

As someone who is in the game design industry I very much appreciate the fact that you brought up our little freedom. We cop the blame by players across basically all games, but we are only doing as we are told. A lot of us want to make a polished game for release, but if it’s not in the project brief we are not allowed to do it.

[@jibzzztm]

Gaming is sad sometimes

[@maddscientist82]

I don't think it takes a genius to understand that people that make things for a living care about the end product being good and it's the 'middlemen' selling it that do not, thereby pushing for unfinished products to be sold to consumers. I realized that in high school but people still like to point the finger at devs for these kinds of things. It's really unfortunate. My heart goes to y'all 😭 Still tho, keep making great games for us 😁

[@c97x]

I'm not exaggerating when I say all of my friends got out of gaming. I can't share my opinion about a game on KZbin Reddit or discord without being banned. It's truly a disgusting state.

[@JailbreakMoments]

@@c97x Yeah I do agree. A lot of games being pushed out these days are straight up cash grabs, released pre-maturely, or both.

[@DurkDiggler]

not our problem you chose a steady paycheck over artistic integrity

[@zerozero_73]

I've been waiting for a video like this. My account has been flagged in H4 and H5 at random times without any reason so it's basically banned. Got automated replies on Forza Support and later got banned on there as well because I kept asking for a better answer. So I went on the discord and asked why I got banned, and got banned on the Discord as well for speaking about me being banned. Exactly what happened at 4:26

[@eefm99]

Oh yeah, I remember the Discord apocalypse, you'd get banned for asking why you were banned lol Since there you could see how 🤡 they were

[@TheOneandOnlyGodHydra]

I got banned three times for "talking off topic" (making passing comments about FM in the FH channel)... Then one of the mods sneakily unbanned me. Then I got banned another three times for not-so-off-topic chat. It's probably for the best not gonna lie

[@xthund3rtrap]

​@@eefm99 the forza discord has always been corrupted, nothing will change, stay far away from there!

[@evandaymon8303]

I was in that discord. It’s nothing but trouble. Mods there and devs are assholes if you talk shit about them or criticize how they run things. Which is why that ban apocalypse happen. I feel another one is coming due to all crap going on with second expansion and recycle cars

[@meehdrescher]

I got my old XBOX FH4 account deleted with no reason or ban given, 1k hours lost. Then, on PC, I got an account banned from online because apparently I "had to many credits after the first week after first logon" even though I've played the game for 5 months and 500 hours on the account at that point. Absolute fraud.

[@mannofnope6836]

I'm surprised that there was no mention of NitroGlitter, who conducted a massive ban wave, following her banning Forza's biggest KZbinrs, including AR12, DonJoewonSong and Shinyodd.

[@seP4]

those bans had good coverage by said youtubers

[@jacobebernos8403]

​@@seP4 Where do you check the ban log? I once used a glitch for 999mil credits and then i havent played for a year, now they decreased it to 10mil and im curious if they also banned me Xd

[@seP4]

forza.net/myforza/banhistory/

[@croc_moat2327]

women ☕

[@Thorocious]

whoa, they banned donjoewonsong?? Why???

[@midnight71_DRVR]

Forza Horizon 3 was such a great time the franchise. I miss the fun factor of that game, my greatest moments in multiplayer were on that game. Usually I'm trying to not be nostalgic but everything like the map, the servers and the career were so much better on that title in my opinion.

[@Debosaur]

Tried redownloading it and it doesnt work with my version of windows. Sad

[@razkinzmangowurzel]

Just downloaded today, cant wait to get started

[@razkinzmangowurzel]

@@Debosaur pgg shutdown servers on pc for no reason

[@Kyush4]

The beginning of the end, wish h2 came to pc

[@Delimon007]

You can still go back and play it :)

[@LestZA]

I particularly love how they willingly turn a blind eye to griefers and go straight for the people who stick up for themselves in online races. I got spite-reported by a griefer coz I put them in their place during a race, and surprise surprise, I got banned. They claim they did a "thorough investigation" and that they "reviewed my account activity and conduct" before issuing the ban, which is absolute bs because if they did they would've seen how I play online. Hialrious. They're Clearly lying about that. They didn't check sh*% and they don't care. Honestly Turn10 and PGGames deserve to be boycotted. Maybe then they'd take us seriously.

[@krisbarr5663]

Yeah they'll do nothing to the griefers but ban the people that try to deal with them due to the lack of lobby policing.

[@captainbeatdown6254]

You know the game sucks when not only the bots are cheating but the AI as well.

[@NewRodin]

GTA 5's rapid-firing NPC's joined chat

[@fridaycaliforniaa236]

Pretty much all of the racing games have cheated AI. Even some "sim" games actually 🙄. When you edit the files of the AI cars, you find that they have 8000 Hp engines in Honda Civics, Ford Fiesta ST or else...

[@shadow-_-nixx4218]

@@NewRodin GTA V it's normal is for not be easy and it's not a racing game so you can't compare

[@joshuaquinones9760]

​@@Lamborghini-ml9moYeah they're cheating, there's no way you can put an MX5 in X class

[@ForzaMemories]

⁠@@shadow-_-nixx4218oh brotha do a bunker sell mission and get spawn killed by the AI Valkyrie that doesn’t miss with the explosive cannon from 1000 miles away and you’re gonna change that comment real quick. I just did a sell mission today and the Valkyrie was so far that it was a small spot on my screen, and yet it somehow destroys my freaking cargo with the explosive cannon.

[@Z38_US]

I find their ban policy extremely questionable. If you cheat yourself Credits or XP (both things that are incredibly easy to obtain and virtually give you no advantage in any way) you are instantly hit with a permanent ban no matter what but if you cheat in an actual race (grip or speed hacks for example) there is a 3 strike ban policy which for the first offense only bans you for 3 days. So you get yourself some more credits or god forbid you change the number beside your name that is an instant perma ban but if you ruin the experience for literally everyone else in a online race yeah that's 3 days and lesson learned like tf????

[@hertzwave8001]

brand ambassador gotta get those sheckles 💰💰💰

[@caiuscosades1791]

I know a guy who got banned because he had too much credits. Not a single reply back. So sick of Playground Games and their corrupt bullshit.

[@nemethalex1087]

And I got 7 day ban for asking a rammer why he had to do that while i still won. Sure

[@hertzwave8001]

@@nemethalex1087 should have been a good noodle and died at turn 3 like god intended smh

[@borger99]

I haven’t played online since install and I only use it as a car simulator to wind down driving on the main roads. I’m not competitive at all, I just want the cars to drive. Banned banned banned

[@XtremeGaming179]

I was really surprised to see that the game was rated so high while it seemed like they didn't listen to what people actually wanted out of a game like this.

[@P_D-px6iv]

For real it's really not that good of a racing game I think it just gets praised because there's no competition anymore in terms of open world racing games Like in the early 2000s we had Midnight Club, Fast and Furious, several NFS's, Test Drive Unlimited, LA Rush, Street Racing Syndicate, etc Even 7th gen we had Midnight Club LA, Test Drive Unlimited 2, NFS MW, Carbon, and Undercover, Import Tuner challenge, Wangan Midnight, etc Nowadays we have Forza Horizon or the new NFS games made by shitty devs The main thing that pisses me off is how lazy the Forza series is and the fact nobody seems to care. Like the damage system is awful if you go back and play something like the original Grid it's very clear FHs damage is worse than some early 6th generation games. There's also the lack of actual 2-step and anti-lag which NFS has had for years now, and while I understand it's supposed to be a more realistic approach the lack of Nitrous is a huge bummer imho especially with the fact they teased Nitrous with the F&F spinoff of Horizon 2 that featured a Toyota Supra with NOS There's also a bunch of minor details it's missing, like the ability to increase and decrease the tire profile aswell as the rim size I mean FFS even NFS Prostreet allowed you to have total control over the tire profile, rim size, width and even allowed you to stretch the tires

[@canehdiansteve3455]

I agree. It's a step backward from 4 in multiple ways and I can't really find anything 5 does better. The Forzathon Live events are a great and easily identifiable example. Nobody does them in 5 because they made a bunch of changes to how they work, all of them bad. Zero people. I've never seen anyone even try to play them at all. And how can the devs see that nobody is playing them and not realize they should revert them to how they were in 4? I'm done with Forza after this. I played tons of 4 and genuinely loved it, it's been years since I've had so much fun in a racing game. 5 is just boring and the obviously bad changes aren't being changed back to the way they should be. The devs are sticking to their guns and that is undeniably the wrong choice. 5 sucks.

[@P_D-px6iv]

@@canehdiansteve3455 FH4 & 5 are basically the same thing. 1-3 were superior in every way

[@jebusnazareth1869]

The rating is directly proportional to how much money MS used to promote it by paying streamers and youtubers to shill for this absolute garbage tier of a game. The last good game of the series was Apex.

[@XtremeGaming179]

@@canehdiansteve3455 It's actually hard to watch when I see that no one is playing the events, but at the same time, I find myself never wanting to play them myself.

[@bleedszn]

dude this games player base is just a revolving door of new players who get bored in a couple days

[@bleedszn]

it’s just syndicated everywhere

[@matthewmotor18]

Lol yeah

[@vladvulcan]

As a new player to the series, I can confirm: got bored in a couple days

[@ShockInazuma]

I mean, there’s no thrill. I can pick up an NFS game and play it for hours. Why? Because it’s actually fun, especially when cops are involved. I love doing burnouts, drifting is always smooth when done right, the cars are fast, the cops are brutal… All of that for far less storage too, no less.

[@valentin7574]

I find it so infurirating that you can get banned for liveries but they refuse to roll out a simple anti-cheat for online racing or stuff like the Eliminator. It's quite obvious a lvl 1 Beetle can't do 0-60 in 2 seconds so why are such cheaters not insta-banned?

[@shaunnolder7211]

I had no idea things were so bad with this game. I'm a casual player, but I'm also a compleationist who is now kinda scared to get my goal of owning every carjust because I may be banned because they think I cheated to get there. I've put hours of my life into this and the previous games, and this just makes me sad.

[@borger99]

That’s me. I added every car because I have autism and cars are a big deal for me. I’m banned and it sucks. I just like to drive it keeps me happy.

[@117johnpar]

This is just the community side of the issues. The actual issues with the games and franchise are so much deeper and bleaker. But SP4 is pretty delusional with what he's saying about "everyone who cares about track racing will just play Grand Turismo, so Motorsport basically doesnt matter" (To paraphrase) Thats some weapons grade dumbfuckery that I dont even understand where he could possibly be coming from. Motorsport has developed some massive issues. But none of them have anything to do with Grand Turismo.

[@unclefucka80]

You can't have all the cars in the game just by playing it. There are cars which involve IRL purchases of various items. For example: Lipstick Ford GT, Oreo Pagani Zonda, etc. These cars can't be sold in the auction house, so the only way having them is via legitimate redeem code (which can be easily checked), or "cheating" (for which you will be -rightfuly- banned). So do not worry about collecting cars within the game.

[@ER1CxF]

@@borger99 then you shouldn't have gotten greedy and added every car

[@chikenkill]

@@ER1CxF bro what your comment makes no sense

[@xjserpent7665]

PGG is like Rockstar Games - not addressing the obvious cheaters and broken scores but bans any harmless things that make the game better (painter tool compared to clothing glitches).

[@NO-2019]

Ikr, it's starting to seem like that and will probably just get worse

[@bencezavarko7312]

Even Rockstar is better at this point

[@adlibbed2138]

​@@bencezavarko7312 not that they're any better for ppls like myself when they shat out "gta tragedy dysfunctional edition" out of desperate attempt to scrubbing away the shame of releasing gta 5 for the 3 console generations and counting

[@blackwidowtv5064]

@@adlibbed2138 And rockstar is the worst of all they absolutely doesn’t care about protecting the community against cheaters for gta V on pc. You can lose your pc or your real life money just by going on online mode.

[@deth1634]

Rockstar Games is handling this stuff far better than PGG ever will,and comparing a Modding Tool with a Glitch which is unintended to happen isn't a valid comparaison

[@Godssecondcomingissoon]

Forza accidentaly gave me the ultimate edition and one day i just logged on and had the car pass and all the car packs idek how.The best part is they still have not removed or fixed my glitch

[@michaelross5404]

Great video . I am a co-owner of a relatively big Forza group from FH4 now in FH5. Glad you mentioned FH5UK - for a group so big they will treat any group as a threat. One of the admins for that group had one of our members blackmailed going on to stalk his Facebook sending photos of his daughter to our members with hurtful and inappropriate messages. Police where involved and it turned into a huge mess - but that’s who these guys. I have no doubt it’s the same in US and across Europe. Hopefully the devs clean up after themselves and fix everything before Motorsport.

[@seP4]

thats so horrible that even forza moderators wont be able to ignore it. if you got proof send it to them

[@michaelross5404]

@@seP4 we have and we believe *most* members responsible were dealt with by police. Our member who was attacked does not play the game or on Xbox anymore I believe as they couldn’t do anything about him or his account. Some of the higher up admins in the group are truly immune to any kind of allegation like this.

[@apophisstr6719]

The instant I saw those old aero kits on the MX-5 in the trailer, I instantly know that the new FM is going to be the new FM5. If a developer is not showing you new stuff in their shiny trailers, then that means they've got nothing new to show, done.

[@still_guns]

Watch Sepi get banned again for 'unexplained' reasons. This is just... sad. I missed the heyday of this series, now I'm stuck in the cesspool with the rest of you.

[@GreenEggsAndSam_]

who are "the rest of us"?

[@still_guns]

@@GreenEggsAndSam_ The people who've been playing Forza games since before 2020 (when I started playing)

[@GreenEggsAndSam_]

Oh. I thought you were one of those people who are like “I’m an OG forza player so I’m better” (they’re usually worse tbh)

[@jbt5175]

@@GreenEggsAndSam_ They made 4 wonderful Motorsport games, 2 insanely good Horizon games, Forza Motorsport 5 was a borderline mobile game with nothing in the way of a meaningful career with little to no meaningful pacing or progression, you can literally drive supercars in the opening hours of the game, it's boring. Horizon 3 is when wheelspins became a thing, essentially negating playing the fucking game, because you can get all your credits and cars just from leveling up, and it's pacing was shit compared to 2, because yet again, you could literally drive hypercars after the prologue with nothing that even remotely resembles proper progression and pacing. People like me who grew up with a better class of racing games watched the genre die a horrific death after The Crew's release in 2014, I still genuinely believe Horizon 2 and The Crew will be some of the last truly great standalone simcade titles unless Test Drive Unlimited Solar Crown saves us from the last 9 or so years of playing the same fucking game over and over again.

[@GreenEggsAndSam_]

@@jbt5175 good for you. I like horizon 3 and I thought the wheelspins were pretty balanced compared to the super wheel spins in later games. Plus the most you could get from a wheel spin was 300,000 and that was pretty rare. Personally I don’t really like the Motorsport games but I understand why people like them. There’s really no need to act like such an asshole about this stuff, people like you that consider themselves better than others just because they bought a game before someone else are the same people who drive Mazda Miata’s, so all in all, I do not care what you think of yourself and you are a somewhat annoying human being.

[@Aheguuuh]

I wasn't aware of how bad it is. Since the community, audience and dev wise, is this bad, I'm going to stay away from it. Appreciate the information

[@henrikhetland]

I hope a lot of people are gonna watch this. i learned a lot of new things

[@rashadvq]

Right

[@adlibbed2138]

Especially since for the longest time, Forza (and hardcore racing sims like Assetto Corsa and iRacing for that matter to an extent, which both gets their own well deserved slander by Raycevick) tend to be left out from the discussion of why modern racing games is on the decline just because they had state of the art driving physics

[@hectorzambrano4092]

That Forza livery tool is literally like that one tool from Gran Turismo 7 and Sport, they have instructions on how to create your own decal and upload it on their website via your account in a specific format. And thanks to that, I was actually able to create a few decals of my own in GT. Meanwhile in Forza you literally have to work with the same old stuff that would turn out even worse than you would've imagined.

[@superninja252]

i Think the reason they has stuck this limbo on "ban or not ban limbo" is exactly beacuse they want copy the tool from GT and put it on Forza (both motorsport and horizon)

[@BLGDrive]

If GT just released on PC I would completely abandon Forza

[@markhd3059]

@@BLGDrive Soon bro soon, it was in the nvidia leaks; we just have to wait for Sony's slow ass to put it on PC.

[@maynardburger]

@@BLGDrive GT is a shadow of what it used to be.

[@BLGDrive]

@@maynardburger True, but still miles better than Forza. I played lots of GTSport, GT6 and GT5 and enjoyed all of them. Though I've also spent 2k hrs in forza games, the developers behind the GT series I feel are a lot more trustworthy and at least try to revolutionize the franchise, look at changes like the UI and handling (Which I feel hasn't changed in forza since FH3)

[@lolschrauber]

It takes a few minutes to permanently ban & delete all cheaters on a leaderboard. How are they not willing to spend that little effort but are willing to harass legitimate players constantly?

[@Vyctrr]

Well, let me awnser with a question: what do you think takes more effort? 1 - creating a proper anti-cheat system and manually going through at least the top like 300 on the leaderboards to clear out the cheaters, benefiting the remainders of the community, and maybe bringing some new people to the game; 2 - sending "ur mum lmaooo" in a discord server, because you can.

[@lolschrauber]

@@Vyctrr it literally takes a Minute to Filter out 99.9% of obvious cheaters and ban them with a ridiculously simple SQL Statement.

[@spartanx169x]

Its the PC playerbase and its crap. This is the result of forced platform crossplay.

[@Mernom]

@@spartanx169x That's a shitty take. Cheating communities only develop for games that are a ripe target for them.

[@jordanwardle11]

@@spartanx169x its been happening long before the games came out on pc

[@CrashedmyCBR929rr]

Right on dude. Keep up the good work and fighting the good fight. All these reasons are the main reasons that I could care less about even attempting to care about any leaderboards in FH5. I do the unbeatable trials on repeat every week just to help other players out and when I do play online, I’m usually finishing in the top 3 or better. I think that there are a LOT of other good racers out there that tend to avoid the competitive side of Forza for the exact same reasons. It’s too loaded with drama and dirty cheaters. Thank you for pointing all of these issues out!!

[@JustinBeBustin9]

I've submitted around 30 tickets since Horizon 5's launch and the responses are dissatisfying to say the least. Automated with no resolutions. I've played Forza since the first motorsport and agree with you in regards to the series going downhill. All we can do as a community is continue to voice our concerns on their forums and submit tickets. That's why I appreciate you making this video because more people will become aware and hopefully it will drive change. Anyways, thanks for bringing all of this to light.

[@Buckwheet1981]

I feel like at this point trying to get a company like this to change is pointless. they will only give more promises which are lies and try and take advantage of their players

[@tatewaki11]

@@Buckwheet1981 It really is pointless

[@stereomato]

> sending tickets is dissatisfying > lets send more guys!!

[@uberschnilthegreat22]

I've been playing the games since Motorsport 2, and I genuinely love this franchise with all my heart, but if Motorsport 8 / 2023 fails like 7 did, I may drop my investment for future titles altogether.

[@niku4154]

​@@stereomato What else are you supposed to do? Bro wants his 120 Bucks and legitimately aquired stuff back.

[@lukeberes2493]

Thanks for the informative video. I had never known FH and FM had so such corruption within the devs and community. I’ll definitely keep my eyes peeled as I’m a big FH fan.

[@Neo-Midgar]

😊⁰

[@Jazril]

This game clearly had a lot of potential but management ruined it. What a fine work exposing these spoiled brats. Great job, great video, liked and subscribed.

[@spartanx169x]

I have played the game since its launch and I can't remember having any significant glitch since it launch. I don't know what he is referencing.

[@TheUnimate]

this is a really good video. Something you didn't talk about is the lack of "help" people get when they have issues with the game. im mainly talking about the "crash upon start-up" issue, me and many others have quite literally done EVERYTHING to try and fix this issue (even literally reinstalling windows) to the point where the only conclusion is an issue with the game itself. as far as im aware, they havent done any fixes to this issue, not to mention that asking the devs what to do (through a support ticket or on forms) the only answer is "turn it off then on again" (i mean its not EXACTLY what they say but its pretty much the same thing).

[@BrunoRuiz-yx9ql]

Yo e tenido el mismo problema y estuve meses intentando resolverlo, y la unica manera en la que pude fue reinstalando el juego varias veces hasta que mágicamente pude entrar de nuevo, es absurdo

[@seP4]

Update 2023/4/17: Forza updated their code of conduct: forza.net/news/forza-code-of-conduct We yet have to see how it turns out in action, but here are the supposed changes: 1. "cheating/hacking to gain an unfair advantage on the road with race results, credits, or XP" is bannable. Unclear if it includes glitches and exploits. 2. Only "Unapproved Modding" is now bannable, although i don't buy it since one of the community leader groups recently banned model replacements (ex. replacing forza aero), and "modifying game files" is still bannable in any way. 3. "Auction House automated scripts, stream-sniping, piracy, and more" are now bannable. Not sure how you "stream-snipe" in a racing game. You can snipe the lobby but you can't cause any harm without violating other rules. 4. "leaking unannounced content" is now against their code of conduct. Basically activating Rockstar mode 5. "Violators can experience initial warning messages, and suspension times ranging from 24 hours, to 1 month, to permanent account and console bans, all depending on the severity of the violation and the frequency at which you are collecting these violations" Positive change. Bans used to be 7 days at minimum. 6. "These suspensions can be enacted to remove player access from specific features from the game like matchmaking or using the Auction House and will result depending on the type of violations" Positive change. Some bans no longer lock you out of every feature. 7. Ban appeals are supposed to matter now. "We will always have a different moderator evaluate the appeal than the moderator who issued the suspension" although they started hiding employee nicknames in tickets. We yet have to see this in action along with other changes. Overall these changes only make the bans not have as big of an impact anymore. Barely a step in the right direction

[@seP4]

none of the comments are deleted unless flagged by youtube. if they have a strong case im sure it would have been widely known

[@TianLong72k]

@@Twiggo_The_Foxxo lol id bet it was your alt

[@Twiggo_The_Foxxo]

​@@seP4 I was wrong about the comment deletion but you did do that dysinc cheat back in fh4 and you even posted a video on how to do but you deleted the video

[@seP4]

and? hijacking the pinned comment to make a big deal out of a minor glitch that many of the "well respected" community members also used to perform 3 years ago? final reply

[@TianLong72k]

@@seP4 he's definitely a fan boy/thumb sucker for the corrupt devs

[@DJchestr]

Great video, I can see why you're targeted, it's because of your skills documenting and exposing these hypocrisies. I play almost every late night US time on B Dirt and the core group is very close and communicates with each other. Over the last few months we had a very obvious cheater who had even admitted to being on his third account after bans though saying it was for his words "internet issues". I finally managed to get him banned (hopefully permanently) last week. I had to submit a ticket showing his exploits and hostile behavior from clips from multiple players and that was my third ticket on this guy. Again a great video keep holding these guys accountable we need to remember the players keep the devs working.

[@FurryWrecker911]

FM2 was my introduction to Forza. Loved it at the beach house I stayed at for a weekend. I then got to play FM4 while in college borrowing my roomate's xbox 360. Again, played the life out of it. Horizon 1 dropped and it was a wet dream. Moved on to FH2, and it felt like a step backwards with the abandonment of a story in favor of a more endless festival, but it was still good. FM6 was a buggy mess when I got it, and doing events felt stale for some reason. FH3 I often forget existed despite fully upgrading all the festival locations, and the only reason I bought FH4 was because I liked the map. I had friends ask me why I wasn't going to buy FH5, and I told them it had everything the last 3 games already did, and I already grinded for the limited time cars in FH3 and FH4 and there was no way in Hell I was going to do it a third time.

[@GeorgeCowsert]

Forza somehow won a Steam award for best art direction when one of its competitors was Psychonauts 2. Forza, a game that only needs to do the bare minimum required to pass as having cutting edge realistic graphics. Forza, a game that just uses realistic models instead of having a deliberate artstyle.

[@FiatUno2003]

Forza Horizon peaked at 3. The map, vibes, career, soundtrack and the overall content were so much better in that game. I remember just driving around at night, going to the city, admiring the views and having a good time. Yeah, you can do the same in the new games but it doesn't feel the same. I'm not being nostalgic, it's just the truth. Forza Horizon isn't the same. At one time, Forza Horizon was the best open-world racing game, but know it just feels like another generic game with no depth. Sure, FH5 has amazing car sounds, the Blueprint Builder is an awesome feature but other than that, there's nothing else to say about that game. Sometimes I just go back to older Forza titles so I can get that feeling that the new games don't have

[@acurisur]

The original Forza Horizon was my favourite as it actually had a good story behind all the racing.

[@TheJayden3977]

@@acurisur Agreed. Horizon peaked with the first one, then overtime went downhill. 3 and 2 were pretty much the same for me, 4 and 5 the drop was horrendous.

[@potato_dbd]

The only thing I hate about this game is the limited time shit, or the Festival Playlist for short. I've been in Germany for 8 months because of work, and when I came back home I had to camp AH for a chance to get the cars I needed. I'm only missing 2 now which are basically non-existent honestly (AMG GT S and 911 '90). What I'm trying to say is that I paid $100 for the game.

[@JZStudiosonline]

I thought Horizon 5 wasn't supposed to have cars locked behind arbitrary things like Horizon 4. That irritated the hell out of me in 4 knowing there were cars I wanted but just wasn't allowed to buy for no reason.

[@amr1t_]

its so fucking irritating, I started traveling on and off for work after the game launched, and after paying so much and getting early access and stuff ( yes, I know it was my choice and mine alone, oops) I had to miss out on cool cars that I did not see ever again except in AH, same as you. It's ridiculous that the devs basically are punishing you for leaving your house. Can't help but feel a little scammed, honestly. :/

[@potato_dbd]

@@amr1t_ Yes, it is your choice, but not your fault that they do not have any other way to obtain these time gated cars. Other than camping AH, waiting for it to pop up or just straight up cheating it in.

[@Eclipse.7897]

I missed the new Nissan Z by a week and nobody is selling the damn thing in the auction house. I got like 100 mil sitting around in that game (funnily enough most of that from selling such limited time cars I didn't care about) yet I can't buy a fucking Nissan! It's ridiculous that the game expects of you to log in every week and sit trough hours of boring ass content just to get some car which with you can't do much else anyway, because the game is just not fun enough to invest so much time into it. I just got better shit to do and even to play than that, simple as that.

[@JZStudiosonline]

@@Eclipse.7897 The new z is a locked exclusive car? Why did they even start doing that shit? It's already worse than FM because you can't "rent" cars, you can't even try cars before spending money on them.

[@seeyeahboss6898]

作为一名中国的极限竞速地平线玩家，我也慢慢的对地平线5失去了乐趣和信心，每次更新后都是一些无关紧要的内容，作为老玩家的我们更希望把排位模式，团队竞速模式，无碰撞模式更新回来，至少这三点能让很多老玩家回归，但不知道官方有没有这些打算

[@roboticvenom1935]

I'm from America and I agree!

[@scther4938]

Yeah good point ! Without playing with a freind it’s just sad

[@cdudeNYR]

My tunes making no difference and the amount of inexplicable frustrations i experienced playing this game all makes so much sense now. I knew there was no way so many people just suddenly learned to drive better at A and S1 (my favorite classes.) FH4 I was nearly always on the podium. FH5 I had extreme difficulty placing even top 5, all my tuning and driving knowledge from Forza Horizon history, apparently null and void. I'm so happy in hindsight that I dropped this game a month after release, and never went back. The odd feeling I couldn't pin down, has been pinned down 😂

[@Lucas-ck1po]

I gave up Forza and it's been a couple years as i notice the same issues. I started so full of enthusiasm for the game, joined the communities, got engaged in the developer's researches, reached the communities and the developers about glitches and broken practices to only notice i was speaking to walls. And yeah, also noticing how the devs abandon the current game to update it on the next title was the last straw.

[@Bloodhoven]

Forza peaked between Motorsport 3 and horizon 3. after that it went only downhill with the series

[@thiccnoodle338]

Same tbh stopped playing fh4 got fh5 cuz why not 🤷🏽‍♂️. Then dropped it realizing it was the same game

[@Lucas-ck1po]

​@@thiccnoodle338 Well, lucky i guess. FM7 was actually worse than FM6 in so many ways, there where things not just functioning but extremely well made in FM6 that they completely botched in FM7 just for the sake of making something different. Contacting the community servers, mods, posting things and responding to polls about these details was the same as talking to walls. Some shit is broken since launch and they are still broken, like, not even finished or actually tested. They give absolutely zero fucks about player feedback

[@GraveUypo]

@@Lucas-ck1po fm6 is also worse than fm5 in a very important way to me. the AI. it had a MASSIVE downgrade in order to fit 24 cars in the field. fm5's AI would work as you expect in multiplayer lobbies, while they did some bullshit distributed processing in fm6 that DOES NOT WORK. each xbox controls only a few AIs and the AI will only react at all to the player in the xbox that's processing it. to other players it might as well be an infinite mass rock tumbling down the road. they won't react to you and if you touch them, you'll fkn die because they will not move an inch and will even literally (and i mean literally literally, not figuratively) run you over like you're not even there.

[@KutsugeMindUrmoks]

Same here.

[@FullCourseRacingDK]

Whenever people get to control something, in these cases moderating users and their content/how they act, they get power hungry. Usually because they can’t act that way in real life. Not all mods are like this, and some are really nice… But more and more often I see that being a moderator brings out the worst in people.

[@ronnythehero]

how weird is it to self promote?

[@belltolls1984]

TRUTH

[@Reeceficek]

When i bought FH4 i was amazed. I just wanted to play it all the time, I even got into a good relationship with one of my classmates because of it. I waited for FH5 to come out really badly. I expected the same good feeling and never ending love.. Instead I got a game that is full of bugs, not only that however. The game just felt too much. Strange, right? But think about it. Every single story is sooo long for no reason. Or I mean there is a reason, they want you to play more, but still, its just too much. A short Top Gear mission in FH4 was more fun for me than the whole FH5 so far, and im not joking. I have a really expensive pc, but still the map refuses to load completely. And that ruins the experience really badly. Also, everything is the same. The races, the buildup of them, the cars, the tunes for them.. Everything is the same with really little upgrade.

[@Reeceficek]

@@0Blueaura I have a samsung 980 pro xdd

[@Anonymus-ih7yb]

What disappointed me the most in FH5 is where the weekly event. They always use the same tracks and 80% of the time the roads were wet or it was raining making the cars understeer or oversteer through corners. And then always these low classes, your lucky if you get to use A class cars. I have S1 and S2 cars tuned exactly to my liking but I can’t really use them. All these different festival locations where a nice throwback but FH3 showed you the progress you made by having the sites get bigger. And from what I experienced the AI was a god as long as they were in front of you, but as soon as you overtook them they lost their ability to drive. And I have the same problems with the world not loading, I had high hopes for the game and was very disappointed.

[@Reeceficek]

@@Anonymus-ih7yb What I noticed with every FH game so far, that increasing difficulty only made the ai faster, not better. And when you overtake the fastest someone else becomes the fastest, and suddenly the person you overtook with ease before chases you like he is some kind of a god

[@Anonymus-ih7yb]

@@Reeceficek I regularly finished 2 or more seconds ahead even if I increased the difficulty, especially during the seasonal events where they took away the option to increase the difficulty. Mainly because while they were in front of me they followed the racing line perfectly making almost no mistakes, but as soon as they were behind me they kept crashing constantly.

[@holyother1]

Don’t forget the ai slamming a tight end corner or a hairpin at like 200km/h

[@Vok250]

Wait they have ONE guy handling bans????

[@APPLEX._]

FR THIS GAME IS A JOKE

[@MJTbreww]

That paint modding tool looks amazing and I’m sure that all in one can achieve some fun things. Always thought an unrealistic class should be added. Any car with any engine but it’s in it’s own class.

[@bennyb.1742]

AWD swap all the things is basically that anyways

[@drift400]

Play racing lagoon. It’s a ps1 racing open world rpg. You can engine swap, drivetrain body swap anything with any combo of mix match of parts. It has an English translation by hilltop. There’s the game you want. It’s amazing

[@tyreksimmons4167]

Me omw to get destroyed by awd rally tires on a wide body Honda nsx

[@raka9220]

@@tyreksimmons4167 nah. Wide body rwd nsx + drift tyre maybe.

[@thedaxter962]

@@tyreksimmons4167 an aixam mega track maybe? XD

[@wieldylattice3015]

Since trouble creating a smooth incline was mentioned, I’ve discovered what you need to do (for now) is place asphalt platforms longways. Most people new to EventLab like to place it short ways (like you did) when placing platforms longways is much easier to work with. Also try to make sure only the ends clip into the previous platform, otherwise you get some incredibly extreme inclines that end up very jarring

[@seP4]

thats so much effort and it still wont be perfectly smooth. games like trackmania and hot wheels unleashed had this figured out long ago

[@genmeriphoton7655]

​​​​​@@seP4 I can confirm TM's Track Editor is simple, intuitive and surprisingly deep, as someone who used to play a lot of TrackMania United and TrackMania2. The course editor is mostly block-based, but they make up for its polished and unique pieces (to name a few: loop-de-loops, terrain road pieces, varying jump blocks, etc). The improvements they've made overtime are also worth mentioning, such as the ability to intersect one piece/block with another (since TM2), make & import custom models as props you can plop to the map (since TM2) and outright place them without the "blocks" limitation (since TM 2020). It has its own janks like terrain blocks not operating correctly, but overall, it's pretty great to operate for noobs and pros alike. I know this sounds pretentious coming from a nobody, but I'm speaking from experience, and I'm hoping more people are aware that they don't have to resort to tedious and unrewarding processes just to get simple things working.

[@wieldylattice3015]

@@seP4 Man I'm just trying to help a fellow dude out 😂

[@genmeriphoton7655]

@@wieldylattice3015 Nothing wrong with that, but ngl, these smooth inclines should've been in the base game from the start. Here's hoping Playground Games snaps back to reality and add more viable track pieces to the Event Lab.

[@rcnumbers3562]

@@seP4 even GTA5 creator was very good at it, it was not as perfect but the stuff u had was more than enough to make great and smooth tracks from it.

[@acropophia8857]

Holy crap man i had no idea the rabbit hole went this far. No wonder i felt off about this game.

[@Invis_Space]

Every single thing you said is spot on! This is why after playing since forza2 I bought a PlayStation for GT7. Genuinely a sad time. I’m still adjusting, but the experience is far greater and consistent. I stop believing “built from the ground up” after F4 🤷🏻‍♂️ every game they’ve said the same thing. Thank you for your thoughtful review. Hopefully this saves some players the money and Turn10 go back to the drawing board, to genuinely build a new games from “the ground up” lol

[@kiemet94]

Im a part of the FM7 community and its been struggling for years. As you've highlighted, developers are more interested in profit than creating a good game. They've neglected the title since FM4 and continue to re-release the same features, usually removing one old feature in return for a new one. I will try FM8 but I already have one foot out of the door when it comes to xbox and Forza

[@maynardburger]

Forza Motorsport suffered primarily cuz they needed to have a new entry every two years. That's it. This idea that developers dont care about making a good game is ignorant garbage. Today's games simply require more time, and this is why Forza Motorsport was given a big break so they could do more substantial changes that they'd never be able to do if they had to deliver a full experience in just two years. How are y'all gonna ignore that obvious point? smh

[@minewrecked5775]

@@maynardburger I might be a bit late here, but you have made a great comment here. Some people are also complaining that Forza Motorsport has been copy and pasting everything again and is not at all building anything "from the ground up." Thats obviously not entirely the case, because there are still many things in the game taken from previous games to add more options and save development time (Stuff like the Forza Aero). The developers at Turn 10 have taken a large portion of the extra time they have gotten to make substantial changes to the base mechanics of the game (and new big pieces of content), many of which are already confirmed. Glad to see another person in the comment section that understands this point.

[@xXVibrantSnowXx]

It's basically the same for every game, including all racing games, people are bored/not happy with a way or another Maybe because of already been played all past games, i bet it's different for people who are new to video games

[@speed4brainz]

I already knew Forza was dying a long time ago but I learned some stuff I didn't know about Forza today in this video. Been following forza closely for about the last 2 years and been playing it since 2016. I didn't know all this corrupt crap happened.

[@maynardburger]

Forza Horizon 5 was massively popular. It isn't dying. Stop buying into bullshit outrage videos.

[@tornobiili]

I do hope this video gets relevant. I only joined playing the at forza horizon 4 and thought the game was heading in the wrong direction just from that. I also Farmed accolades autistically to top 2k People just to find out People at the top had impossible scores I never really cared abiut leaderboards, but after seeing how they are manipulated for the first time, made me feel really weird. Hearing the corruption behind all of this as someone who has not really cared puts things into another perspective. With things like this going on, it is hard to feel any interest in the upcoming games they release. I am very happy i followed your channel. All the information you give to a noob forza player like me is really helpful.

[@Ongomar]

The virgin Forza vs. the chad Gran Turismo

[@hubbyofmad5122]

The other dark side is their coding and save file corruption. I've had my save "repaired" by Forza 3 times but every time after a fortnight of playing it corrupts again and I can't download liveries or buy and sell cars or modify cars chucks error messages. They need to allow multiple save files like RDR2 or GTA5 etc so if your save is corrupted you can at least revert to the previous without losing EVERYTHING.

[@seP4]

this issue was even worse in fh4. the only workaround is to backup your saves once in a while which sadly only works for pc

[@muhammadzidan5078]

I also have the same issue on fh4. The part i hated the most is claiming back your item one by one

[@DarkPatro56]

@@seP4 Had that happened somewhat recently. The actual cause was me often interrupting the cloud sync (awful connection speeds forced me to it), however I've been only uploading save files and never downloading them. How uploading a save file can corrupt your local one is beyond my comprehension. If not for manual back up, I'd lose all my progress (~550, 5 prestige star). Fortunately I've only lost 2 weeks or progress instead.

[@izzieb]

I had this issue with FH4. The thing is, despite backing up my save, the game would continually overwrite it with a corrupted copy from the cloud, even when I said not to. Eventually I was "gifted" my cars back. After claiming them one by one, there were many, many missing. I asked Forza support about the others, they just kept closing my ticket...

[@ahlana5372]

I can assure you Saenu has absolutely NO "protection" from ISAD... ISAD is one of the nicest people you'll ever meet and by far the most neutral influencer in the forza community, doesn't hold grudges and couldn't care less about drama, he just wants to play racing games

[@seP4]

there are more people an i only used him as an obvious example. he has been reported to forza support twice and even mentioned by my t10 contact that he would get banned for this, and yet nothing happened despite their trigger happy ban system. i also reported a large forza creator for blatantly ramming in public lobbies just to see if anything happens and ofcourse he didnt get banned either

[@IsuckAtDriving]

Nalak is still banned 😭😭😭

[@jakethreesixty]

​@@IsuckAtDriving I was wondering what happened to his tunes 😭

[@gopikrishnapremchand]

​@@seP4 lmfao this is by far the most funniest shit u have said today. U really had me laughing hard 🤣

[@seP4]

fh4 era was a bit different, but even nalak wasn't banned until right before fh5's release. the car he modded in would get your account instantly flagged, so the fact that he wasn't banned until like a year after was still weird to me. maybe its just a lucky coincidence but as someone who has been following the community for this long the dots are all there to connect

[@MuYe]

AAA racing games are dead, especially with indie titles offering overall better experiences, and at a lower prices Great video btw 🗿

[@fikridroid]

Pretty much, with GT and Forza being the worst offender I'll just accept that GT4 was the franchise's pinnacle, and nothing has come close since, even though I enjoyed GT7 to some extent. The same does for Forza with FM4 and FH1 in contrast to their modern iterations

[@danhobart4009]

@@fikridroid Personally I liked gt5 the most (could only do arcade races on gt4 because I diddnt have a ps2 memory card) but I've really been enjoying gt7 these last couple months.

[@themadtrax6507]

0:14 oh my god, the mass effect musik in the beginning. takes me back so badly

[@alenko4763]

And RIGHT after that banger of a soundtrack, they play Deus Ex - UNATCO Theme Extended... :') perfection

[@BCGLegacy]

Yeah, I clicked on a Forza video, I didn't expect to hear the star chart music in the background.

[@6ixcars]

Great video man, this needs to be exposed. You could also add the recent forza motorsport development where they removed 6 new to forza cars from the car list that have been shown off in detail in all the trailers to market the game. They just added a small blurb at the bottom of the blog post with the car list that says some cars were removed and won’t be available in the base game but don’t tell you which ones. Pretty obvious they will be added back as paid DLC as they know people were excited for these cars and will pay more money for them. It’s borderline criminal as it’s completely false advertising and I feel sorry for anyone who gets the game wanting to drive those cars they saw in the trailers only to find out they are not there. Turn 10 needs to be called out for this.

[@dawnslayer]

this is part of the reason i've been playing games like FM4 and Horizon 1 and 2. sure they're dead but those were actually pretty enjoyable. didn't have to deal with a 10 GB update every week either.

[@Bamba513]

At least in FH1 you could mod your game in single player.

[@flawlesspwrs]

thanks for compiling and shining some light into the major issues with this game, and why the franchise wasnt as good as it used to be

[@Recordspin]

I didn't have more than 1 or 2 glitches in Forza Horizon 5 at release, but my problem is that the series has no character anymore. It's so reliant on online, that the whole identity for singleplayer is lost after the first couple hours of gameplay.

[@ROYteous]

This is super unfortunate that Forza has devolved into this. It's also very dissapointing that it could be so much better if the devs weren't so sketchy and just don't care to try. Thank you so much for exposing all of this! Unfortunately, I don't think enough people will see this or care enough to foster any change. I hope I am wrong though. Keep up the great work!

[@voinrima]

I Played Horizon 4 since release, got 1.5k hours, mastered every track online, made some popular tunings and designs. Horizon 5 was such a sh** after 4, I deleted it after 120 hours

[@frolix1458]

skill issue🙏💯💯🗣

[@shrek9025]

@@frolix1458 witty

[@FiatUno2003]

@@frolix1458 you can't have skill issues in a game if the said game doesn't work

[@jacqueshansjosten4755]

Same here. I played fh5 for like 2 or 3 hours but it was and is still unfinished and messed up so I returned to fh4

[@sabersz]

Idk man, I've got 6000 hours in 4 and 1300 in 5. Still fresh. Sounds like a skill issue

[@Amigothemango]

The-fact that alot of the forza devs are honestly this way is horrible The fact a lot of them do this to are faces is terrible it feels like some other gaming franchise I’ve heard of hmmm… Also perfectly described it good video!

[@nonyabusiness-f9e]

that livery making tool is insane.. hats off to whoever made that.

[@infamoussquire2955]

you are right, in the perfect world these racing games and their different styles would all come together to create this 'perfect racing game', but i think that we might have to take it out of official hands to make that happen. bigger development companies are going to want to divide playerbases among different titles for more revenue, so this way we might just have to find a way to come together to create our own? that or quit settling until we start getting releases we can really stand behind

[@FirekingBarong]

This is a very, very much needed video at the moment. Thank you SP4, well done!

[@zybch]

Its also chock full of utter lies and bullshittery.

[@philippmayenburg7282]

My main problem with the game was how fast I had all of my dream cars. The main drive for me to play was so I could have all the cars I want dreaming about once being able to tune it and play around with it. I had my dream garage within the first two months of playing fh5. And I wasnt playing THAT much. So very quickly there was no incentive to play anymore.

[@flyingplantwhale545]

Yeah. It's baffling how they have such a huge roster of cars, and they build such a piss-poor progression around it. It could have been a proper long-lasting game but they just throw all this stuff ar you like confetti.

[@hughmungus1572]

@@flyingplantwhale545 Being able to afford a Bugatti after a couple hours of gameplay is more appealing to the masses. But it is what pushes me away from Forza these days

[@ronnythehero]

how weird is it to self promote?

[@philippmayenburg7282]

@@ronnythehero wdym

[@JustSomeDinosaurPerson]

@@hughmungus1572 Not about being able to afford it. It is the horrendous super wheel loot drop system that ruins good progression for a game like this. Not only does it essentially boil your obtaining your dream car down to chance of it being handed to you, but it makes your grind feel pointless because it is a matter of chance.

[@GravitronGaming]

IF BUYING ISNT OWNING, PIRATING ISNT STEALING! Let the devs know we won’t take this BS. Stop buying these games

[@VictorGiordan2]

After more than a year completing challenges every week to get the cars and other prizes (but most of all to never fail a single season until FH6 or something), I completely forgot to play FH5 past week. I finally found everything else more interesting than wasting 3 hours every week to complete challenges in a game that wasn't fun anymore. Almost 460 hours spent on this game. I don't even know if I'll get back to play the new DLC.

[@jaybugo]

Just got FH5 on a steam sale and I was having a blast. To think this much bullshit was going on when it initially released. The modding community are the true MVPs

[@chargedx5768]

There is no bullshit going on lmfao...once in a while some random just has to make a vid ranting about how the game was made bla bla bla with ZERO evidence to support anything he's saying for the views and likes of idiots that are bad at the game so they can justify their dislike for the game

[@jaybugo]

@@chargedx5768 Ok

[@crupt1023]

Keep having a blast man. Just like the creator of this video said himself, this is all just cringy drama. This is all happening in some niche corner of the online/dev community. Has nothing to do with 99.9% of us and this video was a rant and nothing else.

[@eileen88]

Yeah me too having a blast! I completed FH4 (not entirely, but 95%++).. And i still have tons of things to do on FH4, i enjoy it very much!

[@donkey4176]

@@chargedx5768 if you played the game at launch you would know. It was awful, mainly the servers. You could only really play multiplayer with your friendswith out constand disconnections and ghosting till a few months later.

[@KomodoPrazision420]

Im happy the algorithm has brought me this important drama compilation for a game I used to care about, from someone as small as you in the grand scheme of things. These are all things I learned the hard way going from Horizon 4 (where I was a really good photographer) to Horizon 5, which I got bored of after 3 weeks and gave up on it, taking much more interest in modded Assetto Corsa and FiveM, Both of which I have been continually playing now for over a year. Forza doesnt bring me enough interest to move to a next gen console for a future horizon, but I do consider getting a PS5 and GT7. I hope all the issues here can be fixed but honestly I don't see it happening until another few games launch and by then nobody cares anymore.

[@apdiesel6634]

The terminator cobra was finally added to a Forza game and obviously it was only a prize for playing the season challenges and for those who got the chance to win it have it up for 20 million credits in the auction, but if I wanna auction a car the game limits me on how much I can get for the car. And yes when u try to look for the 03-04 cobra it’s going to show not available but you’ll have to auction snipe for it to finally show up

[@joelpena7661]

I just got my series S for Christmas because my wife was tired of the humming of my 360 when I played fm4 all the time so I’m new to the horizon series. I loved the online open world environment but was shocked to see how the decal creator was exactly the same. I was wondering how people created some of the more detailed liveries but this video answered my question. I would love to use the other program but not I’m scared to get a ban for a cosmetic mod when there’s literally 500+mph top speed scores while I’m struggling to get over 306-307. Thanks for shining light on the subject. Didn’t realize the creators were a bunch of Nancys that liked to play favorites. Learned more reading the comments, sucks for those with the BS bans starting to sound like Facebook. I genuinely like the game but they can’t allow some and ban others when they haven’t done anything wrong other than play better and more often

[@andrzejplaszczyk3371]

We need videos like this striking at devs. Games like Forza and Fifa became a straight up cash grab...

[@der_phillip1]

Oh a new fifa? Let's go and pay 60+€ for the same game since it released.

[@maynardburger]

Devs are rightfully going to ignore trash clickbait videos like this that just exploit the fact that y'all are addicted to negativity on KZbin.

[@andrzejplaszczyk3371]

@@maynardburger people like you are the reason why the world doesn't change for good.

[@yuu22061]

@@maynardburger keep drinking your soy and consuming the same content every year

[@froggodoggo79]

​@@maynardburger Finally a non-whiny comment

[@DeltaStridePLZ]

The fact there’s little to no one speaking up against these issues has me worried for the future of the Forza franchise.

[@hertzwave8001]

i think alot of the people that could just hopped over the GT and just didnt look back

[@GeeMannn]

@@hertzwave8001 yeah. Seems people who didn't like the direction Forza has been going have either moved on to Gran Turismo, went back to older racing game titles, or just flat out dropped racers entirely. A sad yet inevitable state of affairs for this franchise and many other franchises in modern day gaming. Oh well

[@shogunmyoung9932]

This has got to be one of the most dark, informative Sepi video up to date. I kinda see this video coming, since Sepi just seems to be the guy that is hated by everyone, and is also someone that has a lot to tell. I do want to express something like this regard: I have been knowing Sepi and many people mentioned in this video for a long time, and there are definitely someone who doesn't like him for various reasons. After many of Sepi's vids on controversy, I became more careful when I'm playing/communicating with others that also play FH5, because I never know who is against him, who isn't and such. I also looked back at some of this FH4 vids out of boredom and recognized them. This is when I noticed Sepi is a sensitive person to mention in front of the people that are highly admired in the Forza scene(Top players, painters, etc.). Another thing that I really dk is what happened during the twitch stream shown in this video. I was Racing that night(you can see my gamertag, although the club tag is no longer there now), and I had no idea there was so much happening that night. I do know and remember the hacker bragging about his hacking, but not anything else shown. This shocked me of how all the things have been strangled together for this long. (The streamer shown doesn't and will never stream Forza again btw). Final thoughts: After this video, I know a lot more from Sepi's perspective: Why he was hated, the true face behind some people I always knew and respect, and the intentions of Sepi. Ofc, I couldn't trust anything he says fully just yet, but I will definitely keep this in mind. I will be more careful about this as I might be in trouble after this comment(idk, sorry). I personally don't want to race competitively in Forza as well because of all the drama/controversy I've heard. Lastly, thanks Sepi. I feel like I have a lot to say, but can't put it to words. I'll end it here then.

[@seP4]

yeah i see you racing there. i recorded the relevant part of the vod and will put the link in sources tomorrow

[@geeterdonee]

I just love how my face occasionally pops up in a video now and then. This makes me happy 😂.

[@seP4]

as it should

[@crankycow35098]

Yup😂

[@yyyhhh8481]

who are you?

[@AidanBenny]

Thanks for featuring my video I much appreciate it and I do hope your videos some home make the franchise great again I really do miss the way Forza used to be

[@paulhenry1578]

I have been playing Forza Horizon and Forza Motorsport for many years starting with 3 then 4 and finally 5 in FH. I am good at the game, having achieved top 1 % on the honour board, have nearly every vehicle, lots of spare honest credits (100 million) and am something like level 220. I can't remember exactly as it has been a while since I played it. I have never cheated or modded as I believe that the real challenge is to win with what you got. It is really a challenge against myself to keep improving. I love the leader boards and have figured highly on them. However, I have basically stopped playing due to the lack of control over the game by the administrators. The leader boards are unfortunately a joke with all of the "kiddies' applying mods to achieve ridiculous results. The behaviour of some in multiplayer races is another issue. Being shunted into the fence while leading or pushed off the track just before a yellow flag while leading is very frustrating and so unprofessional. In the end I gave up. It is not the game I had hoped it would be because of the cheating and I blame the administrators and, to some extent, the mods, for allowing mods to be applied to the game code. As a software guy, I know this could have been controlled (as an example, Apple won't allow changes to their software) and the game has just descended into a "kiddies" playground cesspool. Playground Games and Turn 10, why waste time and money developing FH6 when it will be degraded once again by lack of proper administration to preserve the integrity of the game and allowing the "kiddies" to run rampant through it. It is like creating a really nice building and then let anyone come in with sledgehammers and paint to destroy it. A lot of players are banned for ridiculous things and the real issues such as I have mentioned, seem to be ignored. It would be quite easy to remove the obvious cheaters off the leader boards, even I could do it, but there seems to be a lack of desire by the administrators to do it. The game software could be changed by the mods to "read-only" to stop the use of mods. I don't think I will be playing FH6 for those reasons. Assetto Corsa is far more appealing because of this.

[@cornedbeef4332]

This video reminds me of the little dark age meme format that was going around almost a year ago, where you put the older versions of anything against the newer version, suggesting the better times back then. We're living in the little dark age of anything, nowadays. Greed will always take over instead of companies that put real heart into their products.

[@dhruvrai2054]

You know I was considering buying the new Motorsport title and was definitely considering buying the final Horizon title solely because it might be in Japan, but now I feel like I shouldn't throw more money towards a group of developers who don't care about their player base and rule in their own game like tyrants.

[@ramyabouhassan]

true

[@wozzord101]

Pretty sure Motorsport is made by a different company and a different set of devs

[@chrismusiclover9893]

yeah no they'll never put a horizon game in Japan they're too square for that.

[@lnfinyx]

I have been cracking my forza games and it all works as it would when actually buying, i also dont support big development groups cuz enough people buy into that shit anyways

[@chybaignacy5368]

I really hope The Crew Motorfest pops off and forces T10 and PG to rethink their strategy and at least TRY to make something better than just "good enough".

[@o_sagui6583]

it's Ubisoft, what the fuck are we even expecting, The Crew was always a cracked and uncreative disaster on the inside

[@chybaignacy5368]

@@o_sagui6583 pops off in terms of player onvestment. Im fully expecting that midpack but if it means that Forza devs will have to work harder to retain players im all in

[@brechtxt8096]

Wishful thinking

[@GatitoCarreras]

sadly not with the those horrible physics 😭😭

[@aurastrike]

@@chybaignacy5368 TDU Solar Crown is likely to steal a lot of Forza's playerbase, so I expect PGG to have to start working hard real soon

[@TyranniRed]

Fact: Being denied service for a specified length of time is called a 'suspension' - not a ban. Apparently the devs have spent too much time on reddit.

[@satnav1980]

I'm so glad I got the chance to play Forza 1 and 2, as well as PGR 1 and 2. Those were the days. Fun fact. The Devs from PGR originally came from the Sega Dreamcast racer Metropolis Street Racer.

[@Joaquin__]

i was expecting you to talk about how they rendered fh4 unplayable on nvidia gpus and their "fix" is to revert to older drivers or get the new game

[@DaZzEditing]

It only works with a fresh started pc for me

[@Joaquin__]

@@DaZzEditing it still doesn’t work on windows or steamdeck for me with both on latest drivers

[@jout738]

It seems like Forza has compleately ruined their reputation as car games making brand. People are no longer as excited for new Forza motorsport game as they used to be back in 2011.

[@nikerailfanningttm9046]

I played FH5 for like one year on my Halo Infinite Edition Series X, then I got sick of seeing the cheaters on the leaderboards for dangersigns, speed traps, drift zones, and speed zones. Sadly I returned this year, only to see the cheaters still there. So as a veteran player of the Forza series, horizon 5 is my final for a long time. When Microsoft starts banning hackers and cheaters when you report them, I will return.

[@takumikid]

Same im probably going to try Forza 8 tho because motorsport still has some chance of living

[@jordanwardle11]

Microsoft wont care until it starts affecting their bottom line.

[@baconwizard]

@@takumikid wait for reviews and videos. don’t become a beta tester!

[@ronnythehero]

how weird is it to self promote?

[@DeadAmericanBestAmerican]

I did know some of the shady stuff due to your channel and subreddit, but now it's clear the devs are in it too. Milking more money from Microsoft doing a poor job meanwhile the community is punished by those who don't do the work. Thanks for your video Sepi

[@thatjackass1403]

main problem i have with forza is the fact they focus on the grass more then the car list and body kits

[@SizzaE60]

What really killed forza for me was starting out on the first and 2nd for as where getting a entry level super car like a r8 or Ferrari scud was pretty time consuming you really had to work for credits and spend it on things you really wanted but now you download the game and can be driving 4 different supercars in the first couple hours.

[@scottish_lunatic]

fh5 shows you 3 starter cars in the beginning, one of them literally being an s1 class super car, and tells you to pick one, then gives you all 3 and up to 11 cars if you played the previous horizon/motorsport games, then gives you ANOTHER car in one of the first races, and it takes about 4 minutes to get a konigsegg capable of up to 300mph

[@rosaria8384]

I was actually appalled when FH5 gave an A class car from the very start. The sense of progression is clearly absent, and wasn't really great in the first place because of it. If the next Horizon continues this, who knows what would happen

[@notbryun]

I've been playing Horizon religiously since it first released after FM4. I never knew it got this bad and I couldn't believe what the competitive scene and car designing scene felt through all of this. Alas, I am but a measly tuner that stays to himself and does random stuff, never did I think my fun lil funny racing game was this crazy haha. Hope the next game is ok.

[@chargedx5768]

There is nothing bad going oon lmfao...once in a while some random just has to make a vid ranting about how the game was made bla bla bla with ZERO evidence to support anything he's saying for the views and likes of idiots that are bad at the game so they can justify their dislike for the game

[@chargedx5768]

There is nothing bad going oon lmfao...once in a while some random just has to make a vid ranting about how the game was made bla bla bla with ZERO evidence to support anything he's saying for the views and likes of idiots that are bad at the game so they can justify their dislike for the game

[@chargedx5768]

There is nothing bad going oon lmfao...once in a while some random just has to make a vid ranting about how the game was made bla bla bla with ZERO evidence to support anything he's saying for the views and likes of idiots that are bad at the game so they can justify their dislike for the game

[@notbryun]

@@chargedx5768 Sounds like you're upset people don't like a game you like. I recommend a therapist or growing up.

[@TugiDeg]

10:54 The honest guy is always the bigger threat. According to corruption.

[@ZetaRidge7]

After watching this video I am actually glad to have uninstalled Forza Horizon 5 from both my gaming PC and from my Xbox One S. Ouside from broken updates after broken updates, the outright corruption within the company and some of the community made me realize how much of a disaster this round up being. It is a shame too because aside from the mentioned issues, the game is still a blast to play on terms of singleplayer/offline content and an improvement over FH4 in my experience. At this point I might as well play FH3 or even FH4 over this game if only because I won't be banned for literally nothing. Thanks for exposing the darker side of modern Forza.

[@GTPlanetFamine]

its the community's fault and guys like this gaslighting people when 99% dont get banned only this guy who wants to start a crusade

[@buss1205]

@@GTPlanetFamine no no, horizon is just a shit series now. the community is the ONLY reason this game is still kinda somewhat relevant

[@oscarljungberg8821]

the game that really needs to update the paint tool as well is The Crew Motorfest, because it is so clumsy and awkward to use, so I don't see most people do paintjobs at their best.

[@ARZZiO]

So Forza is basically the Reddit of racing games

[@WSX-]

Except the devs put their pride first over the community's wants and needs

[@tommy7837]

For me it was the politics, just getting ever more overwhelming with every game. I couldn't even do those yellow missions due to the insufferable characters, and unskippable scenes. I really regret buying the Ultimate Edition, won't be buying anymore Forzas despite owning all since FM1. I wanted to move back to Gran Turismo, but that turned out to be a complete mess too.

[@frolix1458]

Who we voting for president mane!??!?!

[@BallTickler420]

Yeah, the whole inclusion thing is not a bad thing, but when games force it upon their playerbase it's just annoying and unnecessary. In a racing game I couldn't care less about which pronouns my character uses or that I have the option to equip 25 different prosthetic arms or whatever, I just want to drive around. And the whole fake-happiness all those stereotypical Mexicans have is just so annoying, I hate doing those story missions or whatever they call them. The only good story they released in the past 5 years was a quote of the radio mod in the 10 years update talking about how they added stuff like that terrible battle Royale mode and how nobody ended up liking it.

[@Thomas-rk4rl]

@@BallTickler420 You have to choose it once at the start of the game, I literally have not touched the player character since the beginning because idgaf about character customization in a car game, default white guy and he/him is fine for me. If you're mad about choosing pronouns once at the start of the game that ain't forza's fault man

[@BallTickler420]

@@Thomas-rk4rl I know, but how is them implementing the pronoun choice system not their fault? My brother in christ they literally developed it 💀

[@Thomas-rk4rl]

@@BallTickler420 I never said they didn't develop it, I said clicking one option at the start of a game that you never touch again isn't worth getting mad over