The Death of the College Degree? (Graduates Are Making Less $$$)

[@TheSteve3]

The kids don’t come up with these expectations out of nowhere, they get these expectations from the adults surrounding them who have lied to them their entire educational life. The teachers, guidance counselors, coaches, and parents tell these kids their entire lives “go to college make more money.” I’m a college graduate and that is the worst advice I ever received.

[@keeperofknowledge4120]

On average, college grads do make more. BUT the types of degree matters. STEM graduates on average will make more.

[@NoDebt]

May I ask what degree you got?

[@keeperofknowledge4120]

@@NoDebt PhD in health science. I also hold an MBA.

[@sab-vl4jg]

If you're degree isn't a STEM, Law, nor a medical field, I don't truly see the purpose of going to college at all!! Not to even mention how awfully deep debt students would be digging into. Especially accounting for inflation that recently occurred, idk how students would be surviving even after getting out of college with even a demanding degree!

[@RoddieSimmons]

I think they are right, however the video is HOW MUCH Money, not that you will have money. I doubt the teachers, guidance counselor, coaches or parents are giving them these figures.😎

[@kindredkey]

I agree to the message "Have a plan." Gone are the days of mindlessly following what parents or guidance counselors say. If you don't know what you want to do, get a job to make money and live life while you figure it out. If it requires a degree use the money saved while working to pay for it. I'm climbing out of six figure student loans and I wouldn't wish this on anyone! What ever decision you make always consider your freedom and the quality of your life.

[@agentooe33AD]

This is exactly the advice I've given all 3 of my kids, and thank the Lord, they followed it. My daughter started her own business, and my sons are working and piling up cash until they decide on a career goal. None of them are in any debt at all, and doing well. I myself am in a bunch of credit card debt, and although I've done well to get half my debt paid off, I've still got the other half. I agree, I would not wish this on anyone, it's terrible living in debt. God bless you, and hope you're able to be debt free soon!

[@kathaiti]

Amen to that!

[@WarriorsPhoto]

I respect anyone that put forth the effort to get a degree. I also respect anyone that worked to achieve what they have achieved. 😊

[@thedude5040]

I dont know why everything as to be compared with money. A mentally stable person earning $50k is better than that same person being unstable earning $120k working 60+hours a week.

[@formula112967]

Do you also respect the car mechanic that fixes your car that doesn't make 'degree' money?

[@thedude5040]

@formula112967 car mechanics don't make "degree money", not sure where you take your car.

[@WarriorsPhoto]

@@formula112967 Absolutely! Thank you for your comment. You are appreciated.

[@WarriorsPhoto]

@@thedude5040 I know what you mean. I've seen plenty of mechanics driving a Lexus or Benz. Which is okay too. (:

[@kleindropper]

Having skills and being willing to work is exponentially more important than owning a piece of paper, especially with the internet at our fingertips.

[@codywilson7009]

Company’s don’t hire off of what you learn off the internet.

[@kleindropper]

@@codywilson7009 Ask Google about that.

[@chocolateangel8743]

Not all trades are good or pay that well. I live in the Southern U.S. The last time I had to hire a plumber, he said that they kept things "all in the family." Even with credentials, who you know matters. Those that make the good money are either owners or family members of the owners that work in management. College can be worth it -- if a person is educationally-quipped to go into a high-paying field.

[@kenofken9458]

Unless you're in a union state and well connected, the trades are often not much better than low-end retail.

[@Dividendflywheel]

@@kenofken9458my neighbor got laid off went and got himself an HVAC certificate license. Fast forward 10 years he started his own mom & pop HVAC repair business. Annual income is well north of $300k. His 3 sons joined the business. Including the one who (went to college) graduated from Auburn University. They are so busy it’s incredible

[@chocolateangel8743]

@@Dividendflywheel They were able to fill a need. Where I'm from, in the South, there is an overabundance of men that do any kind of manual labor you can think of. As such, more and more have decided to go to community college and study computer science, IT and so on.

[@Dividendflywheel]

@@chocolateangel8743 Chocolate Angel (nice name). The guy I am talking about lives in the south too. Hint: Roll Tide. • One life principle I learned from Jim Rohn (he is on KZbin) is this … “the questions we ask, determine the answers we get.” 25 years ago I started asking to meet and interact with people making six figures. • That thought become a magnet that attract specific types of people into my life. • My handy man routinely makes $600 to $750 per day (cash), if not he doesn’t take the job. And has a waiting list thats at over 60 days. He was replaced flooring across the street when I introduced myself to him and asked if he could do a few things at our house. • The teenage kid that mows my lawn (when I’m too busy) dropped out of high school because he was making $100k per year. I tried to convince him to get his GED but it was futile. • My plumber is self employed. Yes he works long hours. And yes he makes over $100k • I was having lunch at BurgerKing one day and a guy came into the restaurant to wash the windows … I engaged him in a conversation… I asked what I would make washing windows (if I worked as hard as he did). He paused for a long time and decided he would NOT give me a specific number. But he told me he had paid off his house, and sent his 3 daughters to Univ of Alabama. Washing windows for fast food companies. • Chocolate Angel dare to ask yourself bold questions. The answers that come to you will shock you. • 2001 one of my questions was answered when I met my first BlueCollar 401k millionaire mentor. I have since met over a dozen more. Iron sharpens Iron

[@NickThiller]

The great thing about the trades is that you can go anywhere in the world and make a living. You aren't necessarily stuck in one town.

[@TheBeardedSandman]

For my whole life, I knew I wanted to go to college. I sacrificed years for my degree, now I make gross 62k a year. Many people who don't have a degree make way more than I do

[@dec23]

same here buddy. I have an MBA, comptia cert and I'm making 63 as a tech business analyst. 20 yr olds are making more than me.

[@samlee1546]

Walmart pays truck drivers 110,000 a year

[@jarviswilliams2465]

This is true but far more people without degrees don't Make such money.

[@taylorsmith9629]

What’s your field?

[@silverltc2729]

You can always retrade.

[@familyman4668]

Depends on what you do. My wife and I graduated with different engineering degrees. Our starting salaries were 56k and 60k, we paid off our student loans three years after graduating college. My wife has been a stay at home mom for four years to our ever growing family and my salary has increased exponentially. Certain degrees fast track you to a gateway of opportunities, while many will never allow you to pay back a doctorate program.

[@sasukesuite1]

I have an aerospace degree and I started at $75k 2 years ago. Idk about the other engineering disciplines, but $56k - $60k is kinda low for engineers.

[@familyman4668]

@@sasukesuite1 back in 2013/2014 this was good to us. Plus the point is some people never reach that salary in their career, yet it's what we started off with coming out of college.

[@aolvaar8792]

From SPE, the average engineer working in oil and gas earned 6% more this year than last year. Total compensation for engineers increased to 146,861 USD on average from 138,536 USD last year. Back in the 1990's, I made ~$250K/yr overseas, in a GOD forsaken Hellhole, extreme hardship position. I then took a two-year vacation to heal my mind and soul.

[@sasukesuite1]

@@aolvaar8792 oil and gas is pretty insane, same with computer science/engineering. I’m currently in a senior SME role which is the highest aerospace engineering position and I’m basically at the salary cap of $190k at age 26. Usually it requires 20+ years of experience to make close to $200k as an aerospace/mechanical engineer but somehow I got this role with 1 year of experience lol.

[@LV-1969]

My daughter had a scholarship for 2 years (only cost me books). she decided that school wasn't for her. She can out-work anyone. By the age of 22 she was a store manager and was doing very well just by using her work ethic. College wasn't for her and she is not saddles with a crap load of debt for a degree she wouldn't have used.

[@DG-kj6yb]

Still think college is the best bet, even if u go part time, working in a retail is unstable

[@LV-1969]

@@DG-kj6yb Depends on the degree. My friend's daughter got a psychology degree (80K) and is working in a real estate office answering phones.

[@boomn216]

When mom and dad give you money you don't need a credit score. Every bank I went through required a credit score. Every place we tried to rent required a credit score. That's a bunch of Bs.

[@amireallythatgrumpy6508]

You will note that credit scores only exist in backwards countries like the USA. Civilised countries do not have them.

[@christofl6523]

I know! These guys are delusional when it comes to credit scores.

[@michaelb.8953]

Unless you have more money than you know what to do with, you need a credit score to help get you there.

[@amireallythatgrumpy6508]

@@christofl6523 You will note that credit scores only exist in backwards countries like the USA. Civilised countries do not have them.

[@amireallythatgrumpy6508]

@@michaelb.8953 You will note that credit scores only exist in backwards countries like the USA. Civilised countries do not have them.

[@Wooooahhh6272]

A degree can get you into positions a lot quicker in some cases. For example, I work as a regular warehouse associate at Amazon making 42,000 entry level. People younger than me with bachelor degrees automatically get put into Operational manager roles making 57,000 out the gates. Without a degree, I potentially have to work 3+ years to MAYBE get that position. And when I do I’m paid less than a graduate.

[@donnakenny9345]

Go to college to get a degree that will lead to employment. A white collar job will extend your work life and lifelong earnings by 20+ years. My husband and I both had to retire in our late fifties because out bodies were worn down by hard physical jobs. My sons have careers that require a degree and pay well and they could work until age 80 if they want to. I have a relative who had a trade and he was a valuable employee who reached his ceiling of advancement because the next level in management required a degree. College is still the best route for the average person to get ahead if it is accomplished wisely.

[@ezinneerhirhieneeukaogo1439]

Nice perspective, never thought of it this way

[@mattclark2655]

If you work a trade you have to be disciplined to put away a large chunk of all that money you make and become an OWNER when your body can no longer do the work. Thats the major key.

[@crashtestdummy1972]

I think it depends on the person, if you get injured or have health issues maybe a trade isnt the best for you. I am in the automotive field and have worked with lots of older folk who stay working because it keeps them feeling good. Also i am commission based so no limit for me which is great!

[@johnnybrown12]

@mattclark2655 BINGO, most want invest

[@aolvaar8792]

A white collar job will extend your work life and lifelong earnings by 20+ years. Reduce, because I retired early on a pension.

[@OmitsBagels]

First, you talk about how high school students have unrealistic expectations about making $100k with a college degree... then you go on to say "I'm 19 and make $80,000 as a welder."-which is about $40k higher than the average beginning salary. So you're just giving people unrealistic expectations about how much they'll make in the trades. Why can't we just have an honest conversation?

[@bradwilliams4921]

Business degrees, especially graduate degrees, might start you out at a lower than average income but they lay the foundation for unlimited income potential long term. Additionally, God calls some people to work with their hands and others are more academic. Follow God’s calling for your life and you can’t go wrong.

[@MaryEverling]

Hate to tell u this, but just because someone works a physical job or with their hand does not preclude them from using their brains along with it....

[@bensondentalassociates8690]

⁠@@MaryEverlingHate to tell you this but usually people in the trades have lower IQ’s

[@MaryEverling]

@@bensondentalassociates8690 You sound like an affirmative action hire, What snobbery! I had a friend in San Diego who had a PhD innPsycogy n had a very large large practice, been practicing for yrs, one day told his wife he was sick of it n sold his Practice n went into the plumbing industry, he ended making way way more money n had several Locations n worked it until retirement two yrs ago... So u see that's just nothing more than liberal BS Snobbery!

[@bradwilliams4921]

@@MaryEverling True. Also trade workers have unlimited income potential.

[@MaryEverling]

@@bradwilliams4921 it's easiest way to own ur own busisness, if u think u don't use ur brain in the trades... well that's a big mistake to make!

[@luisbarrios4430]

Straight out of highschool I didn’t know what I wanted to be but I knew I didn’t want to get in debt and go to college for something that I would eventually not like doing so I got to work and became a truck driver, I am now 23 years old and about to make 90k this year with no debts and couldn’t be happier about what I do and how I got to this point

[@jasonrodgers9063]

25 years ago my stepson got a job with a subcontractor for AT&T. He was a high school dropout with a GED. Worked his way up, after about 10 years or so, he was supervising 80+ employees, was responsible for ANYBODY who got their DSL internet through a traditional copper phone line in the state of KY, and parts of surrounding states (that was the norm back then, fiber for home internet wasn't really available yet). He was making $180K.

[@kennnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn1242]

I finished my AA & B.S. debt free - cash flowed it by working throughout school now I make 6 figures and I’m 25. I made the 6 figures before graduating because I’ve worked in my industry for 7 years

[@MissJayR692]

Great job! 👏👏👏

[@eplugplay8409]

I have a Computer information systems an IT degree from my local university probably paid 45k for my bachelors and now I earn 135-140k that includes bonus a year as a software engineer. Started at 45k 10 years ago but it took me 10 years to get to six figures.

[@retrojay86]

Good for you 🙏🏾 Way to go on persevering

[@DigiMyst]

I've been thinking about switching to IT, but I have zero experience and a bachelor's in art lol. Could I get an IT job with an Associate's degree and a few certs, or would a Bachelor's be better?

[@JR.reeves589]

​@@DigiMyst Yes, IT or IS (Information Security) are great targets for what you mentioned. I have seen really smart and talented people in IT/IS with arts degrees and certs in the field. It will be hard work but not uncommon.

[@eplugplay8409]

@@DigiMyst I think any degree is fine as long as you learn by yourself. I’m mostly self taught and my IT degree just got me through the door for interviews. If you can build home projects to showcase your skills and talk to head hunters, they don’t care as long as you have some bachelors degree. Some of my peers that earn similar or even more have different degrees than comp science or IT, even psychology degrees. And yes certs will help a lot for example if you’re in Microsoft stack, get azure certifications.

[@suntzu94]

How much will you make once AI takes your job? 😂

[@trebmaster]

Generation Z is waking up to the fact that Mike Rowe said many many years ago: the TRADES are where all the opportunity is!

[@kenofken9458]

And yet Rowe is himself a college boy who make his living with a communication's degree, not blue collar work.

[@TheeSamuelNelson]

People are dumb who think the trades are some financial silver bullet. You can't do hard manual labor for years without beating up your body. I've seen how jacked up hands are on a man who's been a plumber for 35 years. Also, how many people make good money in construction, but their knees are gonna be jacked or back.

[@Cbr600rr16]

I look back and laugh at my teachers who would push college on me. My response; “I will make more money than you working trades” Long story short my best year ever 280k @ 35 years old and 2 houses later. Pipeline for life!

[@stevenporter863]

Don't know how old you are, but times change. It may have been true then.

[@Cbr600rr16]

@@stevenporter863 35 and been doing trades since I was 18. I assure you electricity and gas will never go anywhere.

[@krombopulousmichael1943]

I'll never forget a college prep after school program I was in during high school. They were supposed to be telling us how to fill out applications and talking about student loans. The instructors actually said that you won't need to pay off your student loans; they don't expect you to. When I told my dad that, he pulled me out of there immediately.

[@dachicagoan8185]

you had a good dad guiding you. the vast majority of parents don't care and trust teachers and counselors to lead their kids to financial ruin.

[@WickstarRunner]

I'll do ya one better, my guidance councilor in High School told us to use Credit Cards to pay for College then have them discharged in bankruptcy immediately upon graduation.

[@r8alvar]

​@@WickstarRunnerthat teacher sounds like he would buy new items on FB marketplace and return them to a retailer for a full price refund

[@josephruocco7571]

Right... So who here wants to volunteer to fly on a plane not design by engineers? Anyone? Or have surgery by anyone but a surgeon? Anyone? How about getting represented in court by someone other than a lawyer? Anyone? I get the point they are making, and yes for SOME professions you may not need a degree to work in the field you like. But for others, mainly STEM and Medicine, you definitely need a degree. Another thing, starting salaries are important but career progression is also one should consider. If you become a plumber, you'll like be a plumber forever unless you try to create your own business. But as an engineer, there are so many fields you can go into, jump into project management, people management, auditor, etc. So please, consider your own scenario and make the best decision for you today and down the road

[@EsiriE]

Yeah it depends on what you want to do. But university/college shouldn’t be rammed down everyone’s throat like it’s the only option.

[@drlax15m]

@@EsiriEit artificially inflated the cost for all

[@patty109109]

Facts. Many without degrees seem to insist on rationalizing why they never got one. I have a very cushy white collar job making six digits. This is much harder to achieve without a degree.

[@angieferrell4622]

All they're saying is a degree is worthless for a lot of people which I agree

[@cmiovino]

I've offered great finance positions to new grads or people with 1-2 years of experience for ~$70k in a LCOL area and had many people decline because they were wanting $100k+ straight out of school. It boggles my mind.

[@Matt-cr4vv]

For true fresh grads without experience they have no perspective to appreciate the offer. When I left college to be a financial analyst for my state government I started at $47K but had four years of prior experience to appreciate the job. And within a few years I was up to &60K. I left to attend law school and went back to the same place and now make just under $90K. I could earn more elsewhere but having worked in many other places to appreciate where I am at the balance of the complete picture matters to me above the check alone. I also paid for school as I went so having no debt has allowed me to choose behind the check alone. But that comes with perspective that many who never truly worked before don’t have honestly.

[@EOkeem]

Student loans aren’t the real issue. It’s THE PAY. They want more work but don’t want to pay more and jobs are barley hiring.

[@CatholicTraditional]

Well, if there was no student loan tragedy, people would focus more on the lack of pay.

[@EOkeem]

@@CatholicTraditional I’m saying Student loan could be as high as it wants. If most people got paid enough to be able to pay it off in a decent amount of time or exactly get jobs in their field. Most people wouldn’t complain

[@MarkfromTexas73]

My son is an electrical lineman, and works for our local COOP. He made $100K last year at 22 years old, and had his certificate before he graduated high school. He has also invested in his 401K for the last 4 years, SO FAR AHEAD of all of his classmates just now graduating college, and some of them with a ton of college debt. Oh, and he bought his first house at 19 yeas old.

[@MarkfromTexas73]

@@justakidfrombrooklyn1517 That is so encouraging. I will show him this.

[@MarkfromTexas73]

@@Travis12861 He owns his home here in a rural environment. He doesn't like the city.

[@Ravetar101]

They're expecting 100k right out of school? Drop out fast

[@joshstieneker4615]

You still have to go through apprenticeship before you get the actual electrician, plumber, etc. Pay. That can take up to 5 years. The big thing though is, you won't be in any debt and will make excellent money when becoming a journeyman.

[@bunscita]

The problem isn't delusion, it's that colleges are incentivized to admit stupid people.

[@cscka00]

colleges are incentivized to make money and US society keeps pushing for EVERYONE to get degrees. The numbers are only beneficial to the universities themselves.

[@richardgalvan4639]

Well, I agree with that, however, colleges are definitely misleading students with hyper inflated post graduation starting income projections

[@Dividendflywheel]

Colleges get paid via government originated student loans. Regardless of the relevance of the diploma. The colleges get paid. We talk about big Pharma, big oil. It’s time to talk about the scam big Ed is running on the economy.

[@shoefit2stayfit920]

How about making 0? I have a Kinesiology degree with a single-subject teaching credential and no job with a 24k debt which I will pay in full this August. This was a great lesson learned, which I will never ever tell my daughter to persuade. Teach your children about financials; a piece of paper degree will not put you on top unless you're going for an RN, Lawyer, Tech, or Engineer lol.

[@Jedi12789]

You can teach with that degree if you choose to, however, the profession has changed. The advice I’m giving to my children is unless they are 100% focused on a high paying degree, go and work a few years and figure out what you want to do bc more than likely at 30-40+ what you studied at 18-22 will not be what you want to do or where you passions are at unless it pays very well and is somewhat fulfilling work.

[@MosesJacksonII]

The system is definitely broken. When certain professions require bachelor degrees, and additional certifications, but starting salaries fall below the cost of tuition, it is a setup for failure.

[@martinlazar9420]

The reality is that in a lot of companies you need a degree. The joke is that unless you are just starting out of college your degree doesn’t matter. I am a Director in Analytics. One of my best hires was a person with a degree in music appreciation and I had her developing data visualizations and ETL data pulls. But if she didn’t have any degree, by company policy I would not be allowed to consider her.

[@Lonovavir]

This is one of the problems with hiring/promotion policies. Degrees are basically useless as they don't indicate if you can do the job, but you need them so the HR people have to look at fewer resumes.

[@barnabusdoyle4930]

Yeah, the company policy that a degree is required for a job, but it doesn’t matter what degree you have, means the job doesn’t require a degree. That practice should be banned. Companies with policies like this are only making the situation worse.

[@justvincenturb]

A lot of companies don't NEED a degree. They WANT a degree. Very few fields actually require a degree. In fact, unless you're in the public sector, college degrees are being requires less and less every year.

[@r8alvar]

I work at a fortune 500 company and don't have a degree. Butii worked my way up to a position that requires a degree. I now oversee positions that require at least a bachelor's and tell 3 engineering firms what to do. Life is good so far, next step up will be director level.

[@cw48494]

I was always told to 'get your foot in the door', even if it means starting as a janitor. Get to know people, work your way up, smooth talk etc etc; No degree required, most companies will even pay for schooling if they require it for a promotion.

[@missgui4400]

It depends on what degree you’ve taken.

[@Vagkit1]

Under water bb stacking 😢

[@realbeautyness25]

THAT CONFUSION IS BECAUSE RECRUITERS LIED ABOUT EARNINGS AND EMPLOYMENT AFTER GRADUATION 🎓 BUT NO ONE HOLDS THEM ACCOUNTABLE FOR THIS STUFF

[@dachicagoan8185]

There are too many people responsible. Lenders for taking advantage of government backed loans, university administrators for increasing tuition, and politicians for ignoring the problem while it ballooned.

[@tswagg504]

They sure did lie.

[@MJMonroe]

FACTS

[@angelbabe1977]

You are absolutely right! A while back I found documents saved and emails from college financial advisors and academic advisors. The lies and ignored questions in emails was ridiculous. One being an associates degree was required in order to obtain a Bachelors degree. Another being they helped with finding internship positions to help those who had no experience, which included me, to allow for experience ce to be earned before completing the degree. Another was a huge discount in cost for being Alumni. I got ZERO discount. The list of lies and misinformation can go on and on.

[@serion9325]

Say it louder for the people in the back! I graduated high school in 2014. I honestly believed that $60k was a low salary and entry level for having a college degree. I was constantly told by advisors that I could be making six figures within 10 years just by having a humanities degree. I'd never been in the work force. I was 18. I didn't get the hard slap in the face reality check until I graduated and didn't understand why entry level jobs were paying half of what I was expecting.

[@JackTheGiantOne]

I graduated in the class of 2021 with my bachelors degree. I made 32k per year starting out with my career working for a bank. After 2 years now I’m at just under 50k. That’s with 2.5 years of experience and a degree in information technology. I made as much as the 19 year old working next to me. Maybe I took a bad job offer but I couldn’t afford to sit on my but and wait. I took an offer with health benefits and I was making more than $15 an hour.

[@BboyDaquack]

what degree did you graduate with?

[@JackTheGiantOne]

@@BboyDaquack BSIT. Information Technology. What I learned is the tech industry doesn’t care about your degree because it doesn’t prove you know anything. They want to see certifications. Those are a universal standard that says you’re competent.

[@BboyDaquack]

@@JackTheGiantOne you're not wrong. I have friends that went and got a single cert. Worked some personal projects. Complete career shifts and within 3 years were making 120k+

[@aolvaar8792]

@@JackTheGiantOne The company wanted to test me, The flew me to 3 different cities for testing, Physical, psych, knowledge, can you learn, function under physical and mental stress

[@drlax15m]

@@JackTheGiantOnemost of my work is IT and i self taught, i get small biz clients and dont bother with certifications - i did engineering degree for the challenge, but market demand pushed me to IT anyway

[@RenyGD]

100k starting is not unrealistic. I started making 100k back when I graduated in 2020. I was 22 at the time

[@scoobie8amg]

What do you do though?

[@RenyGD]

@@scoobie8amg I’m a Registered Nurse

[@mathisnotforthefaintofheart]

One of my students graduated with an Associates (two year degree) in Radiology (tech) Got his state certification and got couple of offers from local hospitals. Starting pay: $50K (had a sign-up). No student debt and lives with his parents. His hospital is cycling distance from home, so he ditched his car to his younger sibling. He allows himself some pocket money and says he is going to save for his house...literally!

[@sab-vl4jg]

Someday in the future, I'm now scared that some people will even say $200k is not a lot which would PISS me the f@$k off!!! 🤬

[@purposebydesign]

I'm grateful for my time on active duty in the Army. I used my GI Bill to get my bachelor's and I am now using my Hazlewood Act benefits for my graduate degree in business. I did get a few loans during my undergrad years (personal stuff) but those loans (40k) will be paid in full next year due to 120 payments that I've made under the PSLF Program. I agree with having a plan. Please don't let your parent(s), friends, guardians and/or loved ones talk you into going to college....go on your own terms or....don't go at all. ❤😊

[@MissJayR692]

Perfectly worded advice ♥️

[@LaitoChen]

Dont go to college unless the job/career REQUIRES a license to practice e.g. doctor, lawyer, architect, teacher

[@barnabusdoyle4930]

Don’t go to college to be a teacher, they don’t pay, force you to pull money out of pocket for school supplies, are run by school boards with no education experience or background and are just horrible positions that require a degree. There are way better degrees out there

[@wtk6069]

I'd narrow it even more. Beyond the big three tentpole professions of Engineer, Lawyer, Doctor, it may be best to avoid traditional university track.

[@Big_talks.]

Nurse?

[@KatieBellino]

@@wtk6069 You're look at "high pay." Original poster is mentioning jobs people might want to do that they can't unless they get that degree. Nursing is another one.

[@Nigriff]

I have a master's degree, but I run a business making six figures annually I didn't even need a GED for.

[@AbidingHopeMentalHealthCoach]

Does the job require a degree? My brother is a surgeon. He couldn’t do that without a degree, and I’m glad. My husband is a counselor. He has a degree too, and a license, and that’s not a bad thing. I am working on becoming a mental health coach. I won’t make as much as a licensed counselor, but I’ll make enough to be okay. And maybe someday I’ll get a degree. But I need to make enough to cash flow it first.

[@aolvaar8792]

A good friend of mine is a Field surgical technician, (Military) He tells me: That he is a very good surgeon. He has no degree.

[@AbidingHopeMentalHealthCoach]

@@aolvaar8792 Cool. But he’s not making nearly as much as a surgeon with a degree does. I am training to be a mental health coach, but I won’t ever make as much as a licensed counselor, even if I get as experienced as one.

[@kclefthanded427]

If you're more of a problem solver than a leader, maybe you're better off going into Trades

[@DominickSpano]

It is social media that creates these ridiculous expectations. It is also the way these young people are raised that they deserve everything. Hey, I felt the same way 15 years ago upon BA graduation. In 3 weeks I graduate with a PhD. I am not expectations to make a million dollars, that is for sure. You live and learn, so is life.

[@sblijheid]

A Phd? Didn't you learn to review and edit yohr text?

[@DominickSpano]

@@sblijheid There is always that guy isn't there? Dude, I do that all day long ever day! I work with students and revise, rewrite, and work with papers all day, usually 6 days a week. On KZbin I don't think it needed to be spot on perfect like in my two jobs (yes two, I am a consultant as well). Translation, your an ahole!

[@Lonovavir]

Late 30s here, most people my age make more money from trade school certificates than Bachelor's degrees. University should only be attended if your ideal job (Doctor, Lawyer, STEM) requires it. Otherwise, skip it and get a job or go to trade school.

[@CatholicTraditional]

If you can get work after graduation from trade school, you’ll do 👍.

[@Sophie3647s]

Graduates are making less because too many accept low wages with there degrees. If they all collectively say- hey with my bsc I wont accept less than 40/hr, then there would be a rise in wages. Likewise for those with bas

[@christofl6523]

How could anyone get them to collectively do that?

[@Sophie3647s]

Its starts with there faculty instructors. I remember 5 years ago my professors would make us chant 50/hour, and 5 years later starting rate in my field now 55

[@christofl6523]

@@Sophie3647s How do you get the employers to pay that? There is always someone who will work for less, especially those on foreign visas.

[@Sophie3647s]

@@christofl6523 You congregate all the new grads and tell them to refuse the job and then employer has to hire a temp (1099 temp that charges 10-25 more a hour). Most employers will budge because its better than losing a day of clients. There will always be someone that will work for less, but thats where u have to remind ur coworker there worth

[@Sophie3647s]

@@christofl6523 I work in dentistry, and the licensing to work it harder to attain creating a shortage

[@r.3559]

All I know is, generally speaking & rule of thumb for myself is this: as long as the person can max out their IRA every year and can afford the lifestyle they are living, there is no reason to necessarily bash or not respect them. Even if you have a degree or graduate degree and your parents let you live at home while you are paying it off or saving, that's not a problem for me either. Graduate degrees still get you a leg up in society to an extent because people, believe it or not, care about this stuff even if it seems ridiculous to others who don't. Your networking and ability to move up still stands at a higher level. You can make $200K a year as a plumber or mechanic but you might also be the exception to the rule. Not everyone makes $100K as a plumber and not everyone makes $100K as a college graduate. Plenty of people want to justify whatever lifestyle they chose but remember that most people got where they got because they figured out a way, whatever way that was, to BEAT the system. They had a niche and found a SOLUTION to a problem. I ultimately view someone who makes $80K a year as a college dropout that can invest $20K of that each year as a more solid thinking individual regardless of how they got there. If you make $200K as a dentist but you spend $190K of that yearly salary, you're worse off than the guy putting away $20K when you only put away $10K. Ultimately, people should remember that education and further education is a luxury. You'll attract a certain group of people into your lives. The wealthiest people send their kids to private schools AND/OR teach at home and likely try to get them to attend the best university possible because they know it is a leg up. Rich people aren't just sending their kids to school for no reason....especially a top 50 school. So when people want to bash the degrees and bash the social classes, remember it was all set up by the top players as well but it's also people hating on this luxury that they could not afford (due to grades, finances, etc.).

[@jray9661]

Going into debt for college isn’t worth it. I’m not against college if you can go for free though or hardly no debt. I didn’t go to college and I’m happy I didn’t. Went to the military and they paid for my education/ trade skills

[@paulmarshall9189]

Well, the taxpayers the government took the money from paid for your education and trade skills.

[@jray9661]

@@paulmarshall9189 but at the same token I’m defending your freedom and my life is on the line so I paid for it bub

[@justiceonthebeat]

​@jray9661 fellow veteran here... Marines... I'm in my 30s now and was a 6 figure man since I was 27 with no college debt... don't worry about these individual's... they called us "dumb" for joining the service and now they regret their life decisions...

[@krobdawg]

Unless you're a Doctor, Lawyer or a few other things, degrees are basically useless these days

[@adithalee8660]

They were useless in the 1990s also. Most college graduates back then didn't start making a somewhat decent paycheck until they got in their 30s and it wasn't large salaries either. As an educated person you don't really start making a REAL PAYCHECK until you have worked for more then 5 years or seniority (older person whose been in a job for a long time and you're only getting $60,000 b/c you've been working for less for years) payment or you go back to school and stay in school and get in debt getting a Masters or PHD degree. Most of the starting salary was $30,000 back then and you have to spend more money to get higher degrees and all of that costs more money, not to mention any tests you have to take which is $200 or more.

[@dachicagoan8185]

Or STEM.

[@phipsdeus2]

Kinda. Every entry level government job making 50-75k a year required a bachelors degree.

[@eplugplay8409]

Certain engineers.

[@Project-Masculinity]

Or Marxist Unicorns 🦄 Studies…

[@kazgaming5088]

The real question is how to do you make the switch to trades or other paths if you're already struggling to just stay afloat supporting a family? I know too many people in that situation.

[@brianparrett114]

Maybe they shouldn't have had families that can't afford.

[@kazgaming5088]

@@brianparrett114 really hard to tell if you're trolling or just that dumb... 🤔

[@thedude5040]

@brianparrett114 what a mean thing to say. I warn people that if their pet wonders onto the ice I will use my rifle to kill the dog so you dont try to save it and fall through the ice. With you maybe I'd let you walk all the way out.

[@brianparrett114]

@@thedude5040 You think suggesting that people who can't afford their children should have considered that before they had children is mean? But killing someone else's pet is okay? That sounds like of fucked up. Maybe you should get some help before a pissed off pet owner goes after you for killing their animal. Have the miserable day you deserve and please leave the planet sooner rather than later.

[@timmymiron2727]

That's the problem with this generation. They're constantly thinking that their salary will be what they think they deserve. It works with the market value, not what you think you're worth

[@scoobie8amg]

I graduated in 2010. Took me 13 years to make $86K in marketing now. First job had me at $32K.

[@aolvaar8792]

Carbon filter change-outs in a Lethal atmosphere facility. In the 1990's, $180K/yr after taxes. It's the airlock quarantines that are hard.

[@eniak00]

I like and agree with much of what this show speaks about, but most white collar professional jobs require someone to have a college degree. You won’t become a civil engineer or biologist via tech school or community college. This show is so anti college now (rather than just being anti student loans). You won’t be able to have a career in many fields just by “working your way up the ladder” like Ken seems to think.

[@Darthzilla99]

Not to mention that even for general college degrees, 1. Not having a degree limits your long-term promotion potential for the majority of industries. If you're planning on owning your own business or doing trades it may not be necessary, but in white collar careers there's still alot of higher ups who won't promote non-degree individuals past a certain experience threshold. Logistics and Marketing have a lot of career paths for any degree people as examples. 2. If you live in a decent size city, there’s usually professional networking groups specifically catered to college degree people.

[@anniegreen9966]

Schools, college and trade, both tell these kids what they're going to earn after they finish. That's where young people get these crazy ideas.

[@drlax15m]

@@Travis12861the projections are usually medians, which are far from most starting salaries, and they fell apart real quick post 2008

[@gabrielcastillo3236]

Yes, some blur collar jobs (trade jobs) pay more starting than most entry level jobs (that require a degree). However, I would make the argument that the longevity of the career will outgrow, salary wise, than a trade job. Moreover, the level of comfort and flexibility is also a big factor. Regardless of the decision being financial responsible is crucial. Pick a career that you enjoy and pays well. I would agree that the mentality of majority of college students of salary expectations is somewhat unrealistic. However, the job market is hard, not matter what stage your in or if you have a degree or not.

[@foolishEmporer]

FYI. Trade school graduates do not make $100k coming out. That is also setting unrealistic expectations. Money comes with experience. Some college degrees aren't worth the money, but please exclude engineering and medical. We need more engineers in this country. Encourage your kids to pursue these degrees

[@TheRiiiight]

The truth people are uncomfortable with realizing is the current valuations of stocks, cars, assets and houses is unsustainable unless 100k becomes the average wage. I don't know which is happening but math is math and one side of this equation is about to snap.

[@JosephLovesMovies]

I couldn’t agree with you more

[@thedude5040]

Uh... sorry you cannot buy a class A share of berkshire hathaway. Neither can I, but there are plenty of other things to invest in. Whats wrong with renting for 10 years. My wife and I didnt own a house until we turned 30 and just built a 5bed 3bath house because we didnt like anything in our market. We just lived in a 1 bed 1 bath apartment and saved up $80k for a house.

[@Thezedword12]

You got the issue backwards, the problem is too many people spend like they make 100k a year on cars, houses and stocks. The housing market is definitely crazy driven up by the fed, but decent used cars can be had for around 10k, and investing is easier than ever with the option to buy partial stocks. Gotta live below your means

[@thedude5040]

@@Thezedword12 the fed did not drive up housing demand

[@TheRiiiight]

@@thedude5040 I'm basically retired so I don't write this because I personally struggle. I'm thinking of global incomes and how much a fully financed individual saving no money at all can realistically afford to spend. If you take on massive debts like consumers have recently that pulls forward so much of their future spending power meaning they have to majorly cut back, unless they give it back to the lender and declare bankruptcy or make considerably more income to have room to continue making the same bad financial decisions that corporate profits rely on.

[@ryancraig4811]

Problem is that career exploration doesn’t start early enough, and too many people are innumerate.

[@MarshallWilliams-ey2wl]

What do you mean it doesn't start early enough? You mean people choosing a degree they don't like?

[@limbeboy7]

WRONG! that is abit general. Class of 2022? doctors, engineers and lawyers will have a higher starting salary than an art major. Average is skewed. Some will start at 35k and others 90k. which is why average is like 55k. doesn't tell you the whole story.

[@elicash315]

I make 100k working 3-4 days a week and I travel all over America working as a field service tech.

[@TShirtAndReeboks]

Some of these jobs that "don't require a degree" still prefer a degree. My brother in law has worked in cyber security and tech for over a decade. He has always had a job, but has been looked over for promotions at times because of the lack of a degree, even though he has certifications showing he knows what he knows.

[@genxx2724]

I wonder if the company would offer tuition reimbursement and he could take one class at a time while working. Many people are attending on-line nowadays.

[@blackworldtraveler3711]

I think everyone should at least get a two year degree. Where I worked they got tired idiots with no skin in the game for support and began hiring only with two year degree. Grandfathering current employees already skilled in the parts,supplies,warehouse,and stores positions. Salary increased to $70k/yr. or more.

[@cnh7262]

Nice, how did he get his foot in the door initially?

[@chulo6561]

Many white collar jobs have people who are high earners who haven't left their fields yet. I work with a know a bunch well into their 60s and older who aren't retiring. Either they didn't save or they can't stop working for some reason. They all left the blue collar feilds years ago and there aren't as many people who were born to go into those feilds since they had fewer children than their parents. Before you write off degrees know that these people haven't retired yet and have jobs that will allow them to work for several more years.

[@YoPhocFays]

Education inflation (been saying it forever) Medical field jobs that used to be just a BS degree now require a doctorate. Yet the job duties and responsibilities havent changed that necessitates a doctorate.

[@Wilky2526]

The math hasn't changed; the science hasn't changed. But some empty suits have arbitrarily placed more obstacles in the way of people getting to where they want/need to be.

[@YoPhocFays]

@Wilky2526 that and more money for universities to make for these frivolous degrees. There are people in my field with BS degrees with decades of experience who can run circles around me even though I have a fancy doctorate to do the same job they do.

[@Big_talks.]

@@YoPhocFaysso doctorate means nothing?

[@YoPhocFays]

@@Big_talks. I'll let you figure that one out.

[@CatholicTraditional]

Yeah, doctor of nursing, etc. My mother’s cousin was a dean of a nursing program and had such degree. But outside of academia, there’s no need for an RN or LPN to have these fancy degrees. Even my state’s licensing board just requires a 2-yr degree! A couple of my aunts (now deceased) just went to the hospital’s nursing school.

[@MrJimmy3459]

It was bound to happen, when you flood the market with people with degrees value goes down

[@dachicagoan8185]

And then trades jobs are begging for workers.

[@blackworldtraveler3711]

@@dachicagoan8185 Hopefully the smart ones figured that out.

[@handleyobusiness]

Also, masters degrees have a terrible ROI. I know a couple of masters grads working fast food and retail.

[@cutehumor]

they owned themselves 😅😂😂😂

[@MrMtanz]

It depends on the field and experience. I work in the life science industry and went from $60K after 4 years to $100K after my MS and new job.

[@KatieBellino]

It depends on the Master's. As a teacher, my school paid for 3 classes a year and my raise was $4-5k a year after finishing.

[@handleyobusiness]

@@KatieBellino That’s the only way I’d get a masters, is if a job paid for it. Long-term teachers need master degrees to max out their pay.

[@bigcahuna42366]

A few courses I wasted tuition money on when I went to college were chemistry, music theory and history, American lit, and theology, which were required to obtain a Bachelor's in Accounting. Not all, but some general core classes need to be removed from the curriculum that have nothing to do with the field of study a student is pursuing. The most useful courses that I took that were not directly related to Accounting were business communications and anything dealing with computers.

[@CatholicTraditional]

I don’t know what affiliation of the school you went to, but Catholic education has it’s own problems. If the Theology courses aren’t aligned with the Council of Trent, they’re useless!

[@perotal]

Out of the top 10% earners at Ramsey Solutions, how many don't have a degree? Also how many of the C-suite execs at Ramsey don't have a degree?

[@OmitsBagels]

I'm guessing close to zero.

[@amireallythatgrumpy6508]

@@OmitsBagels I'm guessing they don't keep those stats because they care about what matters - can they do the job?

[@rave400v6]

Trades work only if you join a union and it's difficult to get in. You're not making 80k as a welder if you're not already in a union. Realisticly if non union, it's half of that.

[@NickThiller]

I think they expect to make (not earn) what their parents are currently making, not realizing how long it took their parents to earn that much.

[@John3.36]

Start with the job that you want, look at the qualifications, then go get them. It is all about supply and demand. Currently there is a low demand and high supply of college degrees. Now everyone is pushing toward trade school, so in the future there will be a high supply of tradesmen with low amounts of jobs.

[@Dividendsmattertoo]

Rather just invest and live off the j retest asap working till 67 overrated

[@cuh720]

I bet George and Ken make more than 6 figures

[@anthonybrown06]

@@Travis12861def hope so lmaooo

[@cuh720]

@@Travis12861 maybe Dave doesn’t Pay them well

[@shilohmorris5527]

Certificates and trade schools are where it's at now.

[@deathblade909]

Graduates in what field ? My brother has Bs and makes 150k in stem . I myself only have BS and make 180k non stem. People gotta choose right degree

[@kathaiti]

Glad to see the younger generation are learning from the mistakes of the older generation.

[@Starcraft2er]

UPS paid for my college degree. I worked 3rd shift for 5 years and graduated 100% - $64,000 in total aid and tuition bonuses. It was hard work, but it was worth it!

[@aolvaar8792]

From SPE, the average engineer working in oil and gas earned 6% more this year than last year. Total compensation for engineers increased to 146,861 USD on average from 138,536 USD last year.

[@knightfox4121]

Overpaid

[@knightfox4121]

@@Travis12861 How is the value even determined? It’s completely arbitrary and artificially inflated for specific sectors.

[@samlee1546]

1104 and 653 inspection guys make 150 000 to 200000 usually contractors though

[@goofygirl1311]

This is why we have impressed upon our kids the importance of paying as they go through school. Graduating from college debt free is a great feeling. Assuming that all college grads carry an enormous debt burden is simply not true.

[@nickhershey3358]

75% of the working population makes less than $50,000. 90% makes less than 100k.

[@bcjammer87]

I’m in the science sector and work for a very large company. They start their lab chemists @ $16/hr. Bachelors degree required. Tell me that’s fair then we’ll talk.

[@georgewagner7787]

Define fair. Salaries are determined by Supply and demand. If there are many people willing to work for that salary, that's what the company is going to pay.

[@EOkeem]

I made that working at a restaurant my senior year in high school living in Georgia.

[@aolvaar8792]

My City has afterschool/summer daycare (a gubment job) My 16 yr old makes $16/hr. Pension and retirement healthcare. My daughter will retire at 48 with 32 years of service>> 80 "points" ~$60K/yr and Free lifetime family healthcare. She's on the house title and walks to work.

[@LogicalEquationEnthusiast33]

What company is this and the location? I am a quality control chemist and make double that and i have a bachelors in biology. I am sorry to hear that. That pay is really low. There are fast food workers making more than that and chemistry is not an easy curriculum whatsoever. I read on multiple forums and discussions that the chemistry major isn't worth it unless you pursue a masters or Ph.D. That would make you the big bucks in many cases. However, If you had a bachelors degree in chemical engineering, you can start off at 60k on the low end in some cases and easily reach six figures in like 5 years or so and never need a masters. A bachelors in chemical engineering is way more valuable than a bachelors in chemistry. There is hardly no demand for chemists (lab rats) but a massive demand for chemical engineers due to the curriculum and what they bring to the company. You might need to change jobs.

[@cdub7373]

It's possible to make that money with a stem degree & the proper career path.. too many people today go to college to learn how to collect stamps but expect that to translate into an 8 figure entry level gig

[@dc76384]

That's what they were told would happen. College at any cost is the golden goose

[@sblijheid]

Or be that guy who graduated law school, but lives on foodstamps, because he can't pass the bar exam.

[@Nate_Tom]

Not only is the salary less than you expect after graduating, but the take home pay after taxes, medical, retirement, etc. is astonishingly small. My family and I moved into a more luxury apartment after graduating because I got a super amazing job as an aerospace engineer. The apartment was 20% of what I thought my take-home pay was, but after getting my first paycheck, it was 50% of my take home pay. I extremely underestimated taxes, medical plans, and 401K. When my contract was up I moved straight back into a tiny run-down apartment. It's hard to face reality because I'm an aerospace engineer working for this big fortune 500 company, so I felt like I deserved decent housing, but I still need to live in a small, 60-year-old-apartment. Funny thing though, I'm way happier in this smaller and older apartment because the community here is so nice and I am saving so much more for a house down payment. You don't need luxury to live a rich life.

[@RichardMitchell-nk9ec]

The woman said she is making 63 thousand but it is a safer job than truck driving truck drivers can die

[@bobpeshak]

It’s because society has told its children since the 90s to go to college or you won’t make any money. Of course they think they’ll make 100k right out of college. I thought the same thing when I graduated from college in 2011!!

[@BTrain-is8ch]

In under an hour people can find out the median salary for a recent grad or new hires in a profession, the median mid-career salary for a given profession, the fact that a 100k salary puts that individual into the 76th percentile of earners, and that a 200k salary after 10 years puts that person into the 95th percentile of earners. It isn't society's fault people aren't doing any homework.

[@Lifecounselor710]

The problem is the 80s and 90s kids were shamed into going into to college. If you didn’t do good at school you were told you would end up flipping burgers. Now graduate students don’t have jobs and won’t flip burgers for $15/hour and rather have no job and live with mom and dad. Any income is better than no job.

[@CatholicTraditional]

This was the case at least through the 2000’s. (HS class of ‘09). We were told that the 4-yr degree was the only way to success. And to make matters worse, this was at a tech HS, where it’s generally inappropriate to promote college where the purpose is to prepare for the workforce. Yet, thanks to that Recession, nobody in my graduating class got a job in their respective fields. 😢

[@Lifecounselor710]

@@CatholicTraditional I also graduated in 09. It was rough going through school during these times. I remember a teacher in middle school would hand out McDonaldss applications to those who failed a math test

[@CatholicTraditional]

@@Lifecounselor710 😁😄 I don’t think any of the kids who failed the math test would even get hired at the Golden arches. If these were jr. high kids, they were only 13 or 14. Many places won’t even hire under 18 anymore. Things overall are worse today. Glad I got properly educated when I was able to.

[@OmitsBagels]

Why don't people ever mention how the trades can destroy your body? I have friends who have been electricians, plumbers, etc for 20 years and they all talk about how their bodies are falling apart and that they're in constant pain in their early 40s.

[@dc76384]

Yeah stupid trades people.

[@knightfox4121]

Great point

[@TexasMade903]

Same thing with the military but at least with the military you can get disability pay for the rest of your life.

[@reese85]

Do they workout regularly and are overweight?

[@ColeKeenan-lp1xf]

​@@reese85doesn't really matter that much. You can still be physically in shape and work manual labor jobs and they will still break a person down. I talk with guys that are definitely more in shape than me and their bodies bother them everyday doing manual labor.

[@DC-rd6oq]

People need to look up stats on median income by age and by education. They need to know whether they are looking at household income (often two earners) vs single earner median figures. They need to understand the difference between median and average. Average is useless because the top 1% of wage earners skew that number way up. They need to look at income percentiles. Only then will they realize that their expectations are totally unrealistic. Just because they "want it" or think they "deserve it" doesn't make it so. And they need to understand that the higher income earners probably work way more than 40 hours per week.

[@addisoncoughran7326]

Thank you for validating the fact that having a degree doesn’t always mean sh*t. I have a colleague that loves to throw digs about needing a social work with masters to do A, B, C D hence my job description and yet I know everything forwards backwards upside down and encrypted compared to her Bachelors . I am younger but experienced as heck in my field and don’t need a piece of paper to do my job. I invest in myself by learning the most I can at every single job in every title I have held.

[@MaryEverling]

R u referring to me? Because I'm really not sure n if that's a yes... Well woohoo for you!

[@merylparks1584]

I remember hearing you’ll go nowhere without college in 1969 it started back then , you’ll make more then just having high school degree, I also say friends and family going to college and they should never be there one friend make furniture loved working with his hands but according to his parents if you don’t go to college you’ll go nowhere, he was miserable not doing what he wanted to do, I knew so many people like that, then it went to no college degree your not as smart , bull , I’ve met so many people with great degrees who aren’t the smartest people I’ve ever met, glad to hear that things are changing , we need trades schools to I know people who were plumbers and looked down at, but these people made a fantastic living and we all need plumbers don’t we

[@S2K2121]

Most Electeical, software, biomedical engineers will come out of school making over 100k and will creep into the 200k arear in management roles. My first year as an electrical engineer I made 105k. Choose that degree wisely or don't go to college at all.

[@Petruskinhap972]

Of course they expect to make that much. On social media everyone is rich and owns a beautiful home and travels everywhere. They think its so easy. They will see. Lol

[@dairdb]

Its not our expectations that are off, recruiters are lying about what is realistic and they are under paying. I have a masters degree and i have 2 years of expeirences in my field while i was getting the degree. Shortly after getting hired, i found out i was making the same as people with a bachelor degree and no expeirence. What happened was HR took my previous salary into consideration as an excuse to pay me less. They advertised a huge range, but make an offer based on "market analysis". I work for a public entity, so we are allowed to see everyones salary for project purposes, and i was very upset when i found out.

[@stevenporter863]

First job out of school with no experience $103,880. Then $200,000+ a year in. 😂😂😂😂 More like $50,000 start and $65,000 ten years in on average.

[@aolvaar8792]

From SPE, the average engineer working in oil and gas earned 6% more this year than last year. Total compensation for engineers increased to 146,861 USD on average from 138,536 USD last year.

[@KatieBellino]

Yes, I think a lot of Gen Z doesn't understand this.

[@DC-rd6oq]

If you have a college degree but are working in a job that doesn't require a degree, you are making less than the person who did not go to college because they likely have more experience than you do. A non-college student probably started that job at 18, but a college graduate started that job at 22.

[@unelectedleader6494]

Well, we have to be careful. Degrees are not created equal. If a degree name/program name does not correspond pretty closely with a job title, you’re already in trouble. Besides, we know that a third grade teacher isn’t worth as much as a petroleum engineer or somebody working in materials, science or even necessarily a senior network administrator, configuring routers, and switches.

[@appollo1826]

There are too many unecessary degrees that could be certificates with less than 600 hrs to complete. I dont understand why students get into over saturated fields that has no money come from it and fields with no money prospect unless you have a Master or above. It is similar with cars. The society tells you get a vehicle but most get the one that is out of their budget at the time with no inclination that the expensive vehicle will give them a better ROI, it just nicer to be in it because they were interested in that one.

[@garfieldGG]

The student loan crisis is just a complicated mess. For one, kids like me were 16 when we agreed to take out these loans, at 16 and up through 20 I didn’t even understand the concept of loans. I was just lied to that college is needed to do anything. And even though that was a lie, college is the best option still, bc most people aren’t great with their hands enough to do valuable trades. And most desk jobs now either require or prefer a degree. But now those jobs are so competitive bc so many people have the degrees, they don’t actually pay much. Edit: also have to add, right now no one talks about it, but college degrees are either a sorting metric or a networking piece. That’s something that needs to change.

[@georgewagner7787]

If more were taught trades in high school, they might find they were capable

[@garfieldGG]

@@georgewagner7787 my high school had the option to go get taught trade stuff at the community college, but it was mostly done by kids who were otherwise doing poorly in school who chose to do it. So the kids like me, who were doing mostly pretty well in school saw that as a joke and there was no way we were going to do that.

[@9libertybell]

Military recruiting was common in high school. I served and had all my degrees paid for. The government pushed people to this and defunded colleges to get kids into loans. It was by design. Graduates pay more taxes anyway. It is not a loss to have student loans forgiveness because the money will support local jobs and business instead of being wasted by the government.

[@barnabusdoyle4930]

Most adults I deal with don’t understand their mortgage paperwork when they are 30+ years old. Expecting a kid at the age of 17 to understand the even more complicated and less regulated student loan paperwork is just ridiculous. The argument that “you took out the loan now pay it back” should be applied to businesses allowed to bankrupt their company and move on, not to teenagers being exploited by the system. At least allow student loan debt to be discharged in bankruptcy.

[@9libertybell]

@@barnabusdoyle4930, student loans are a way for the government to put debt collars on young adults and keep them on for decades.

[@MaryEverling]

So what about healthcare... Nursing, Engineering, accounting etc?

[@austinwhite1268]

Many students are going for Liberal Arts degrees.

[@MaryEverling]

@@austinwhite1268 hubby got a BSN in Nursing and I got a BS in Speech Arts n MS in Counseling

[@MaryEverling]

@@austinwhite1268 people have to follow their interests n their aptitudes, that plays a time too

[@sowek4576]

Entry level accounting is about 45-50k -- I work at a corporation with over 1.5b in annual revenue, with 1 year of internship experience and 1 year full time work and Im at 60k

[@Will-wp2cp]

My first job after college (I graduated in 2006) was about $24,000 a year plus lease commissions. I now make more than 3x that amount, but holy cow, these HS Grads and College Grads are crazy. $100k in your first year working? Not unless you're doing something very technical that's in high demand in the market - like an electrical engineer or lawyer, doctor, etc.

[@aolvaar8792]

HVAC filter change-outs in a Lethal atmosphere facility. In the 1990's, $180K/yr after taxes. In the 1990's, I worked on an island with an oil shut off valve. The Company was legally required to Man the island. 45 days on/45 days off at $1000/day Like being shipwrecked.

[@sha2596]

Ditto. My first job out of college paid $28k full time. It took me a bit less than 20 years, but now. Make 6x that and have no debt. I had some student loans, about 40k, which took me forever to pay off, but I had friends graduate with 100k+ debt from an UNDERGRADUATE! And for business degrees. Sad. The best thing my mom could do for me was tell me I was on my own for school funding from a very young age. So I knew if I wanted to go, I was going to have to pay it all.

[@ndwhitlow]

Even with an engineering degree that's hard to do! Graduated in 2018 with a mechanical engineering degree. It took me 4 years of work experience to get over $100K. A lawyer friend of mine (with a PhD) did not start out making over $100K either. I tell you what though, every engineering student that I knew in college knew about how much we were going to make when we graduated and we were correct because we looked at the data!

[@MrFrankEast]

Yall even have skewed ideas of salarys lol Lawyers almost never make 100k starting Most are Public defenders the other large swathe are starting their own practice and then like 10% are getting hired at the big firms for 100k. Even if they get hired at the big firms most aren't making 100k they are doing doc review and bitch work for 60k Nobody anywhere knows what they are talking about at all

[@jeffdarleneriel5628]

Typical young workers with college degrees now outearn their high-school-graduate counterparts by a record-high $22,000 per year. According to new data from the Federal Reserve Bank of New York, the median annual wage for a full-time worker ages 22 to 27 with a high school diploma is $30,000. For a full-time worker with a bachelor's degree, it's $52,000. The difference marks a pay gap of $22,000 - the highest on record with the New York Fed, which tracks earnings going back to 1990. Overall, though, the return on investment for a college degree is substantial - worth upwards of $800,000 or more in increased earnings over a lifetime.

[@cantgetright742]

I graduated 3 times and don’t make any extra money from it. Never have. A lot of the work pays even less than shit work. Best paying job (by the hour) I’ve had is mowing grass

[@joepic85]

Unless you are specializing. Don't go to college. I have a business degree but when i graduated in 2008 it wasn't super crazy expensive. If i had to go now, I would do HVAC or something.

[@Jedi12789]

There’s nothing like working for yourself. Feast or famine. You realize that around 15 years into your government or corporate job and wish you could work for yourself.

[@zenthegeneral]

Best things to get college degrees in: STEM fields; science, technology, engineering (especially), mathematics Mostly for tangible resources, lab equipment, dangerous solvents, access research projects and university library networks and journals, networking with professionals in the field If you're not going to college for rare resources that can only be offered in college while pursuing highly technical fields with further graduate schooling/training, you're not going to college for the right reasons If you're going to school for like history or business or something, there's basically no point. You could learn all that by yourselves for free with literal free books and resources, and you can just start your own business. College is only really useful for learning and handling things you couldn't do by yourself, like having a lab and expensive, dangerous equipment.