The Disputed Origins Of The Star Phantoms - 40K Theories

[@burniejarvis9298]

I don't even play the game. I just love the lore.

[@40KTheories]

Nothing wrong with that :)

[@morgoth9846]

Same bro . Also I don't have any friends to play with lol

[@Mike_Viola]

Same

[@GRBoi1993]

Same here man! I think the models are cool af but I couldn’t afford the game with time or money haha and yet I’ve an encyclopaedic knowledge of the lore lol

[@updfdrakkell143]

I play video games of 40k but im with ya on the lore.

[@Big_E_Soul_Fragment]

-Prefer to use artillery -goes in melee only if absolutely necessary -no form of combat is more glorious than the other Apart from the whole death cult thing, they are quite reasonable, not gonna lie

[@40KTheories]

@@bradleymills3185 _The Raptors Chapter would like to know your location_

[@GreenBlueWalkthrough]

Almost like they are descended from the imperial Guard.

[@mikd157]

@@GreenBlueWalkthrough or the tau

[@rajamajapetraea]

the Tau marines we all wanted

[@Original-Yellow]

@@40KTheories oh yes the scaredy cat marines. Walking tanks that prefer to wear camo and walk very slowly in tall grass

[@enricopaolocoronado2511]

Well since they called in artillery on the Marines Malevolent (indirectly, but still), the Star Phantoms are immediately cool in my eyes.

[@Southern_Crusader]

As someone who spiritually identifies as a Marine Malevolent… yeah they are cool.

[@onionhat745]

I actively collect Marines Malevolent, and even I love the Star Phantoms. The Salamanders, not so much.

[@kybercat7]

I know this is kinda out there but here me out "Death Guard" Plain white armor (pre heresy) straightforward no nonsense practical tactics and a odd infatuation with death. Plus it gives them a good reason to hide without all the first legions shenanigans.

[@Darkhoof]

I like this theory.

[@borisdorofeev5602]

Your theory makes perfect sense. Also, Death Guard had a stable gene seed. I'm sure many Chapters are created using the traitor Primarchs gene seed since many Astartes of traitor legions remained loyal (hence the virus bombing/ Drop Site Massacre). The gene seed itself is not the cause of a Space Marine embracing Chaos. Why waste perfectly usable gene seed (many of which is stable) and shy away from a diversity of Chapters. I'm also wondering if many Chapters have combined gene seed from multiple Primarchs, which would be a cool concept to explore. Like imagine combining Imperial Fists and Iron Warriors gene seed; You would get Astartes that are great at siege and defense. Or Raven Guard and White Scars; Stealthy sneaky half Asians on fast Jet Bikes. However, combining something like Night Lords and World Eaters would just be a recipe for disaster. You can argue that the seed is stable, but the Astartes from those legions are far from stable individuals. Like getting the Butchers nails was optional, you've got to be an idiot to have those shoved in your brain because you wanna make Daddy proud. On a final note; I wonder which Chapters use the 2nd or 11th Legions gene seed? Would be nice to get a glimpse of how those legions operated.

[@questofknowledge8788]

@@borisdorofeev5602 Well it is highly implied that the “space sharks” poses a chimeric gene seed, often believed to be a blend of night lord, raven guard, and even world eaters. Now how this works is interesting considering they may have been founded by a Horus Heresy era night lord who escaped imprisonment, or founded from the ashen claw. It is rather interesting that even traitor legions are not sure to the point where one commented that they fight eerily similar to the night lords, but with more brutality.

[@wikipediaintellectual7088]

It seems like the Star Phantoms are more about funerary/afterlife practices than death itself. The uncorrupted death guard would consider such practices as "reeking of sentiment". However, if they're descendants of the 70 on the Eisenstein, they'd definitely have embraced ritualism.

[@91rumpnisse]

Isn't the Pre-Heresy Death Guard more interested in the idea of enduring hardships, rather than death itself? It's more that they just see death as a challenge to overcome, rather than something to just accept and embrace.

[@gryphonofmight]

Backup marines that are used for plausible deniability missions

[@zachschreck]

Absolutely. My bet is there was publicly a fake schism where the Dreadwing "left" to become their own chapter during the Second Founding. If anyone had weird, unnecessarily secretive plots after the Heresy, it was the Dark Angels.

[@CausticLemons7]

So...Alpha Legion descendants?

[@seanread5556]

its simple: the reason they refuse to associate with the dark angels despite seeming to have their iconography is because they used some obscure administratum loophole to steal that iconography without asking the DA first and have been hiding on the other side of the galaxy to dodge copyright claims ever since

[@TheOnlyeX]

Ah, another episode of the 42k hit show in everyones pict-screens "You are NOT the Primarch!"

[@internetzenmaster8952]

...With your host: "Jerrus Springar!" _[chants of "Jerrus! Jerrus! Jerrus!" intensify]_

[@chadsknnr]

@@internetzenmaster8952 Ha ha! You beat me to the punch with that one!

[@chadsknnr]

I would have said Jerro Springarius, tho . . . .

[@Alexander-uf9ls]

I mean, Dreadwing was notorious for its destroyer squads, and Star Phantoms do prefer using artillery and heavy weapons.

[@40KTheories]

Yup, which is brought up later on :3

[@edmundthespiffing2920]

You should make a video about the Macharian Crusade and Heresy!

[@ninjabreadman8166]

Wasn't this the chapter that was constantly hounded by the Inqusitorial Retinue of Scooberticus Dooberticus?

[@Br3tz3l]

I see what you did there

[@matics453]

It took me a while but I too see what you did there

[@Gwolfsoun]

Scooberticus and his flag ship Mysterium Machina. One of the greatest hunters of heretics and daemons. Oddly friendly to xenos tho. It is said he would investigate anything, no matter how frightening, for a sufficient food tithe from the administratum.

[@Br3tz3l]

@@Gwolfsoun that's true

[@jeremydyck5989]

@@Gwolfsoun this is my favorite thing on the internet today

[@canis2020]

The Star Phantoms. On one hand a most practical of chapters, but also naively correct.

[@jendreg1935]

Considering their beliefs they may be 2nd generation Ultramarine successors of the Mortifactors.

[@solvdrage1456]

[Post number lost due to 189 meter stack of records falling over and crushing the adept recording the information] My theory is that the Star Phantoms are not Unforgiven genestock that inherited the livery of the Dreadwing successors and that pisses the Dark Angels off something fierce.

[@Aceshot-uu7yx]

I love this answer. I think it would be cool if they were ultramarine. The idea of the smurfs, who basically took the role of the angels during the horus heresy and have basically been an indirect thorn, being the father of a chapter given the name and heraldry of one of their lost wings, which were removed because of forced compliance with the codex, they would be absolutely livid.

[@willnox1]

Star Phantoms use the exact same heraldry that closely matches the skull and hourglass icon described for the Dreadwing.

[@40KTheories]

Yes, I mention this several times in the video :P

[@calebolds9609]

40k theories: "they have a very stable gene-seed" Gulliman: "my spider sense is tingling"

[@phreakazoith2237]

Well....the Mortifactors are Papa Smurf's offsprings. See any cultural similarities to the Star Phantoms?

[@Chris-et2fm]

The Lion: zzzzzzzzz Watcher in the dark: he's still napping

[@stephenkenney8290]

Whispers in Lion's ear: Luther's escaped.

[@Aceshot-uu7yx]

@@stephenkenney8290 takes one year to hear you. dad?...DAAAAAAAAAAAAAD.

[@ovk-ih1zp]

Whelp, looks like another covert group of Alpha Legionnaire's are on the loose.

[@Zero01k]

Hydra Dominatus

[@mrmora1673]

What if, and I do not say this lightly, they are alpharius?

[@icealkion]

Everyone is Alpharius

[@przemek0980]

Hi Wh40k Theories. Would you be interested in making a video about Mandrakes? They are a pretty mysterious race. They do crazy shit like asking for your heartbit as a payment and, as shown in Path of the Archon, their realm of pure shadow is pretty much alive. There is also this fragment from Jain Zar book that many take as a hint to their origin: "The daemons that encroached into the space between realms were not the only threat. The majority of survivors from the Fall were former members of the sects and cults that had dominated society in the slow decline to cataclysm. Blood-worshippers, body-changers, warrior creeds and half-corporeal spirit walkers - all manner of deviants and pirates continued to vie with each other, seeking to dominate the webway tunnels and pocket realms as they had the streets of the cities now consumed by a ravening god." Their powers seem kinda-similar to the Watchers in the Dark and in the Gathering Storm their shadows absorb demons. However some of them still became Chaos Champions. Overall there is a lot to unpack

[@luanamorim189]

Hey I saw your posts on Reddit. Very interesting stuff, keep it up.

[@przemek0980]

@@luanamorim189 I didn't expect that. Thank you.

[@-Bile-]

Thank you very much, the Star Phantoms are my favorite chapter. :)

[@r.cdahuman7682]

Ya know, the star phantoms having the opinion that no form of combat is more honorable than another, raises a question. How, and why, did the idea of melee being more honorable than other types of combat come about? Many space marines see xeno species as abominations, yet they still see one type of warfare as more honorable? Why?

[@40KTheories]

Probably due to a simple warrior's mentality, to slay an enemy with your own hands as opposed to shooting them at a distance like a coward, or something to that effect.

[@r.cdahuman7682]

@@40KTheories yeah that is what I was thinking, but a lot of the space marine chapters are seen as brutally efficient. Surely that's hypocritical. Then again, space marines aren't unfeeling Juggernauts, they are human to, in a way. Perhaps its a mental thing inherit in some chapters, or the worlds they recruit from? I guess there are thousands of potential reasons, but its still an interesting question.

[@Triumph263]

@@r.cdahuman7682 Combine this with the fact that Astartes are absurdly good in melee combat compared to most forces they faced in the Great Crusade (heavy weapons a technologically advanced human world had could probably take an Astartes down at range, but in close quarters these weapons are impractical) and it makes sense why they would value (and thus glorify) this form of combat.

[@r.cdahuman7682]

@@Triumph263 another good reason. Though the days of the great crusade are long gone, the effect it had on the Astartes is deeply imbedded within them.

[@phreakazoith2237]

@@r.cdahuman7682 I guess what's also embedded within them is quite often their homeworld's customs. Those recruited from feral worlds will most likely prefer the rather direct style of combat they have always been used too even when they are trained using long range weapons when becoming Astartes.

[@boutinpowered8373]

The Star Phantoms came from Kamino. Their Primarch is Jango Fett.

[@hisnotsolonely2961]

DAKKA CHAPTER!

[@jmagowan12]

Hope your not as lonely now

[@hisnotsolonely2961]

@@jmagowan12 thank you for liking the comment friends!

[@faucet5137]

A lovely video, thank you my good sir!

[@DJCPreston]

My theory hinges on whether there were Dreadwing on Caliban or not during the fall, and as far as I can see there actually wasn’t? Maybe a quirk of their specialisation and lack of prestige when compared to the Deathwing or Ravenwing, or maybe just not been fully fleshed yet. Though if they weren’t there, can you imagine the sheer loathing the Dark Angels would have for a wing of them who weren’t secret traitors like the rest and thus didn’t have to feel the burden of guilt to both the Emperor or the Lion? Or for that matter the contempt that the Dreadwing would hold for the other wings knowing they were so weak as to fall foul of the traitor’s promise? That’s what I believe happened, and why each reacts so poorly to the continued assertions that they’re genetically related.

[@lonewarrior1]

*removes the Hourglass and Skulls....* What are you left with? II

[@nestorgamer9746]

I see what you did there

[@updfdrakkell143]

I have no doubt that there are marines still alive from those the lost legions AND there have bein more made

[@StylesV13]

@@updfdrakkell143 If the stories are true in that those two legions were folded into the 13th Legion, then several second founding chapters are really from them. The question then would be would they get gene seed from their lost Primarchs or from Guilliman? Cause if new marines could only use 13th stock then overtime the lost legion marines would die out and not be replaced. I would imagine Guilliman knew which marines were not his real sons but let them keep their father's gene seed out of honor. After all he had a table made up for all his brothers, loyal, traitor and lost and did so out of honor.

[@kieslingsfilms]

As usual. You done a great job. Thanks you for the great video.

[@aapjeStom]

some inquisitor: so what's your origin? pretty much all 2nd founding chapters: [redacted]

[@DJCPreston]

Given the Death Eagles and Silver Skulls claimed heritage I’m pretty sure they all just say “definitely Ultramarines, 100%. Go Codex Astartes! See...” and that’s enough for the Inquisition.

[@GRBoi1993]

10:20 Speaking of the Minotaurs: I’d’ve loved to have seen them get their teeth kicked in by the Custodes during the Hexarchy Crisis but whatever 😒

[@spookyghostwriter3110]

Eh. The Necrons got there first.

[@GRBoi1993]

@@spookyghostwriter3110 good to hear haha

[@kylecasler8239]

One thing I never understood is when chapters pay the geenseed tyths how they dont know what primarch they are from while they looking for problems

[@crewie94]

Rare for chapters to believe that the Emperor is a god incarnate? Is it? I know it was initially but in the 41st millenia doesn't every chapter pretty much think that? Or is it just a front to keep the inquisition at bay?

[@40KTheories]

Yeah it is still fairly rare. Most chapters revere the Emperor as the ruler of humanity and the mightiest of men, but still just a man.

[@crewie94]

@@40KTheories Thanks for clarifying Lord Theories! I definitely thought that Marines became more radical over time but they're far too awesome to believe the all of the new religious stories. Great coverage as always sir. Thank you kindly.

[@Lightman0359]

@@crewie94 Only some of the nuttier chapters like the Black Templars or chapters who don't know their lineage usually descend into the cult of the God-Emperor. Others, especially those that were founded before the Age of Apostasy typically worship what TTS calls the Man-Emperor of Mankind. The Emperor is the pinnacle of humanity, the Primarchs [especially theirs] are his perfect sons, and through the Primarchs, they are his vision for humanity's future, the Ultramarines are a prime example of the latter, being integrated into the ruling class of Ultramar as demigod-kings [especially the Tetrarchs] as opposed to most chapters who are the scary beasts that live on the moon or tallest mountain that take children every so often [Space Wolves are an example of this]. The Chapters whose founders fought in the Great Crusade and Horus Heresy [with the exception of Black Templars because... Sigismund] had OG Chaplains whose job was to stamp out worship of gods of ANY kind, especially of the Emperor [because... Lorgar] and for a time enforce the Edict of Nicaea. Again Ironic that the Templars would keep that order, even though it was rescinded during the Heresy as Psykers were shown to be the most effective weapon against daemons, but ignore the whole "I am NOT a god" command.

[@Matt-md5yt]

Glad you recovered these guys my friend. They are pretty cool

[@Alex-re3qm]

PLEASE do a " who are the iron hands" video!

[@40KTheories]

If someone on Patreon nominates them as a topic, I will.

[@inquisitorquinnge8762]

The dark angels getting prissy and denying yeah they’re definitely dark angeks

[@Hakazu]

*chuckle in Alpha Legion* Good video as usual man.

[@project4061]

I would like to propose an alternative to the heraldry of Star Phantoms, perhaps if the denial of their ties with the Dark Angles is true, then the only other lineage that they might hail from is that of the two lost legions. The reason being that we do not know much about the two lost legions and their purity. Plus it would also explain why the Star Phantom mantle was shared between the current holders and one of the Dark Angles legions, the two could have been part of the same conflict and would take up the mantle of their fallen comrades to honor those that were lost.

[@Kill3rballoon]

I always like to think they are indeed the Dark Angels Dreadwing, but are ashamed of their actions during the Horus Heresy. After all, they were the Wing with the most destructive weaponry in the legion which, if it was unleashed on Caliban, could have done the most towards the planet’s eventual destruction.

[@oldeskul]

It would make sense(at least to me) that chapters who don't know their primogenitor legion might have a chimeric gene seed.

[@venerablebrothergoriate5844]

The Star Phantoms sound like Iron Hands with their combat doctrine of smashing the enemy through superior firepower, rather than rushing to engage in melee and risk unnecessary losses.

[@julianpourdanesh3339]

I’m honestly going with the star phantoms being from the death guard geneseed they are just so familiar with one in another in terms of fighting style

[@alexbartschi602]

Can you make a lore video about the original wings of the dark angels? It might be very helpful for my successor chapter lore

[@brucejedilee5290]

Have you done a a video on the Rak'Gol? If not please do, they deserve more love in my opinion

[@Duppyman695]

Agreed....... We need more lore on the lesser xenos races !

[@axaldusteliora2956]

The Primaris known as the Prime Absolvers do not hunt the Fallen and do not really care for them aside from being traitors. So I doubt the concept of denying the obsession of the Unforgiven to be the case. I feel that perhaps their lore is somewhat stretched and GW at some point would do some kind of reveal that all this time they were as you said, probably Ultramarines or Imperial Fists who were handed down the color scheme of a DA 2nd or 3rd founding Chapter and just had it at random, the question Is... how do chapters go through the process of heraldry and colors if some like the star scorpions are handed down

[@michaelhowell2326]

Of all the stories and novels I've read from the 40k Universe I've never, or can't remember, an instance of Astartes using his ability to spit acid. With most chapters having the organ that produces it, why isn't it used more often?

[@phreakazoith2237]

In "Void Stalker" a Nightlord spits acidic saliva into a loyalist champion's face. But their fight to the death may also answer your question: Against unprotected flesh this ability is a neat trick. But helmets are very common in Warhammer.

[@Aceshot-uu7yx]

The betches gland is hard to write for because it's just relly extra. Why spit on them when you can stab or bolter.

[@lsynno]

Fiercely independent, fights on the outskirts of the imperium and eschews some traditional notions of honour. They sound a hell of a lot like White scars to me.

[@robertbarnes5242]

Mephiston needs to take a stroll over to this chapter, they would love him.

[@jeangale6914]

How many chapters are obsessed with death?

[@cliffnpaige2009]

6th. Imagine that.

[@40KTheories]

That's convenient, isn't it?

[@cliffnpaige2009]

@@40KTheories yes, yes it was. Great work as usual, by the way.

[@axelNodvon2047]

The Changer of Worlds smiles upon you ;)

[@cliffnpaige2009]

@@axelNodvon2047 ask Magnus how that went. That knee gives me issues during heavy winters to this day.

[@daviddickson412]

@@cliffnpaige2009 Lmao

[@rockjock3]

I wonder if Remleiz will ever do a spotlight lore on the various homebrew chapters/forces from 1d4chan? Angry Marines, Reasonable Marines, Pretty Marines, and even the more serious offerings like the Star Krakens.

[@40KTheories]

Only if the original writers of those homebrews submit them themselves.

[@williamblack6912]

Chat I have a question. If horus had chosen to die after he was wounded by russ would lorgar as warmaster had any chance to kill the emperor? I think big e wouldn't have hesitated to mop the floor with him like he had with horus. Or would the whole traitor force just collapse under it's own corruption?

[@Duppyman695]

Lorgar (the ultimate book licker) would of failed just as badly

[@tnttv5360]

Just because both chapter deny it, doesn't mean it is not poyssible.

[@Sommeill]

It is also likely that the Dreadwing and the rest of the Dark Angels legion did no part ways in the best of terms.

[@Aceshot-uu7yx]

They were forced to comply with the codex, they were saddened but not enough to fight a civil war... now Luther!

[@____________838]

Wow. There’s a lot of good possibilities here.

[@bgcvetan]

Probably the Dark Angels disowned them.

[@Duppyman695]

When the Unforgiven don't forgive you , they must of done something really bad.......?

[@bgcvetan]

@@Duppyman695 The Unforgiven exist to punish a certain TOTALY NON-EXISTENT group for hitting at allies, and the SP have history of doing that, i would go as far as to say that Star Phantoms are to Azrael what the Angels Vermillion are to Dante.

[@Duppyman695]

I agree , whether it be to not be associated with Unforgiven or like you say disowned by them! Unforgiven a collective term for Dark Angels and all successor chapters....!

[@hydradominatus3641]

Self important, secretive edge Lords with an inferiority complex? Sounds like Dark Angels to me.

[@Dennis-vh8tz]

The new Star Phantoms might have been created from geneseed tithes collected from the original chapter of the same name, and thus inherited the name and iconography. My guess would be that they're Dark Angels successors but the High Lords of Terra kept it secret because they don't want any more Unforgiven conspiring together, but the Dark Angels gene-seed is too good to waste. I'd guess that a decent number of chapters believed by everyone including themselves to be Ultramarines successors are secretly Dark Angels successors.

[@chadsknnr]

Clever tactics?! HERESY!!

[@timothylyons5686]

The fallen are loyalist Terran based Dark Angels. The unforgiven hunt them because they know the truth. The Lion waited and would have betrayed his vows had Horus won

[@MustacheMenace117]

Was this chapter in in the youtube video ASTARTES? Specifically the 2 marines hanging around the psycer

[@chrisfrombeyond4240]

My money is on Lion El'Jonson being the father.

[@Duppyman695]

Yeah, I could believe that, maybe they or The Dark Angel chapter know they would be Unforgiven if this was discovered. ?......?

[@Julian-cn1ey]

Is this not the Chapter of Astropath Marines that helped the newly formed Black Legion escape the Eye of Terror for the first time, prior to Abaddon obtaining Drach'nyen? In 'Black Legion' by ADB, it appears as if they are a neutral renegade chapter. As a price for ferrying the Black Legion out of the Warp, which Abaddon offered 'whatever you need' they took the majority of psychic sensitive male children, and all of the astropaths in the Black Legion fleet, seemingly with the intent of recruitment. They seemed to be somewhat timeless as well, with the negotiator of the chapter being one of the taken souls, having aged thousands of years.

[@40KTheories]

If you're referring to the Warp Ghosts, we have a video on them :)

[@Julian-cn1ey]

@@40KTheories good catch! I always struggle with the Chapter names that are synonyms. Love the videos!

[@dstubby82]

Who *typically* chooses the name of a newly founded chapter? New chapter master, parent chapter, etc?

[@internetzenmaster8952]

"but to insinuate such a relationship to the Star Phantoms themselves... to be an insult of the highest order" The important question here is *_why_* the Star Phantoms get so offended by being compared to the illustrious 1st Legion... I mean, I can see them get pissed about it, but _the highest order_ seems a bit excessive.

[@jaqdraco]

Why do these guys have similar iconography to unrelated chapters *Guy on fiverr. com who offers cheap branding* ...well, I can tell you I definitely don't just search the internet for images and alter then slightly. I errrr, look over there the Emperor blinked! *Scarpers*

[@lolply54]

There’s a chace of you covering the battel for Xana? I ne ero understood what happened to the planet after the event and i would be very grateful if you could cover it (if you delle like it ofc). EDIT: i mean specifically the destiny of the planet, you already covered a bit the events in the recent video of that balckshield (can’t spell the name sorry).

[@eceldran]

My headcanon seems to be that the current Star Phantoms founded in the 23rd Founding are unrelated to the Dark Angels' successor chapter, the "original" Star Phantoms, who were destroyed for whatever reason. The new Star Phantoms just use the same name and iconography. Seems sensible, right? Right up until you realise that the reason that they get *so* annoyed at being linked to the Dark Angels is that they're being compared to the "old" Star Phantoms. It's like calling the Crimson Fists successors of the Ultramarines because "they both wear blue", or the Blood Ravens being successors of the Blood Angels or Raven Guard because of their name, whereas they're really descended from [redacted] (Oops!). My point is: Imperial Officer: "Ah, yes, you're the Star Phantoms? Dark Angels successors, isn't it?" Star Phantom: Oh for the Emperor's sake...! FOR THE LAST TIME, YOU IDIOT...!" *gestures to chapter iconography* "NO HOODED EMO SECRECY MEN!"

[@NetMoverSitan]

Then again, the Fire Hawks were believed to be Ultrasmurfs, but act more like Loyalist Emperor's Children...so it's understandable that there would be a problem with that. | 1:40 - So they're unlikely to be Ultrasmurfs. | 4:20 - We can rule out them being Space Wolves or Salamanders then. | 11:50 - Well, they're still around, so they're not the Fallen either.

[@Aceshot-uu7yx]

Not all smurf sons respect authority. Titus my boy was taken too soon.

[@Typhoonatlas]

Was the word bearer gene seed super stable? Because they were also pretty devote

[@mobiusZero2]

" Sweepers "

[@virnecannon4248]

What is this song playing to through the video

[@UNSCrearadmiral]

hawk lords are an ultramarines chapter with their iconography reflecting the raven guard.... are you sure they aren't Emperor's children?

[@vontheunknown7982]

It's hard to tell which former legion they come from for the star phantom's

[@wolfjaw7104]

Practicality mean Dark angels to me

[@RSBurgener]

I think they're either relatives of the Dark Angels or they have the genes of a Traitor Primarch. Maybe they came from the Alpha Legion somehow? There's a reason they are so secretive.

[@Theotherlostprimarch]

I’m saying they’re sons of Dorn. Gun lines, emperors a god, practically over glory.

[@j.mangum7652]

Look, I am a total effing noob here but just how many loyalist and traitor Astartes chapters in canon are there? Some seem to be more or less fairly obscure from more legendary ones.

[@40KTheories]

At least 1000

[@j.mangum7652]

@@40KTheories Lordy...the Emperor protects.

[@JohnTandy74]

You never know with the Dark Angels!! Maybe they ‘Doth protest too much ‘ and they are a Dark Angels founding: after all, they’ve got more secrets than Alpha Legion!!!

[@sickofwashington]

So, less social, long range Black Templars? :-P

[@daviddickson412]

😂😂😂

[@ivanthemadvandal8435]

What 1st founding chapter do we know that is known to be tactically pragmatic and spawned a chapter that is highly religious and obsessed with death (the Mortifactors.) HINT: They wear blue HINT 2: Spiritual Liege

[@mohammedimran3670]

Have you ever heard of the sons of dorn?

[@TheSeanoops]

Why would the Star Phantoms and Dark Angels vehemently deny association with one another...because they’re Dark Angels.

[@ivanthemadvandal8435]

Or are they Alpha Legion pretending to be Unforgiven? It's kind of perfect. Having loyalists, pretending to be traitors, pretending to be traitors pretending who pretend to be loyalists.

[@Fyrwulf]

It could just be the Dark Angels being uptight, overly chivalrous assholes about their Destroyer bretheren. I mean, just look at how the Ultramarines are about the Nemesis Chapter. Guilliman didn't like them and didn't take the leash off until the traitors revealed themselves during the Heresy. Marneus Calgar sacrificed his 1st Company holding the polar fort and it didn't even occur to him that would be the perfect ground for the Nemesis Chapter to hold as their preferred weapons wouldn't be a risk to anyone.

[@phreakazoith2237]

overall fascination with death, imperator mortifex, bones of comrades are held in high regard, like to stay among themselves? pure geneseed? I say they came from the Ultramarines like the Mortifactors!

[@rehanashrif8167]

Hey great video also I was wondering ,do you know of A fan with too much time he is a great KZbinr he makes a WH40K Vs star wars series I don't want to spoil anything but we are on ep18 so yeah pretty deep he also does not get paid for this he is doing it all on his own so yeah check him out

[@sonofloki-wn3vj]

The Dark Angels always tell the truth.

[@captainpuffinpuffinson4769]

Deep breath ... GLORIOUS MELEE COMBAT IS BEST, WHAT A CHAPTER OF WIMPS ... But hey it works

[@jackwong4198]

Star phantom:well...heavy bolter got brrrrrt and las cannon go bwwww

[@joseantoniosantiago1258]

What if Vulkan led the Imperium after the War of the Beast?

[@daviddickson412]

STOMP STOMP!

[@derrabbit7289]

The Star Phantoms protest too much, me thinks 💀 😇

[@Duppyman695]

Sounds like Dark Angels to me...... "deny EVERYTHING"

[@chaptermasterpedrokantor1623]

What do I think? That it is a goddamn disgrace that the Mechanicus can't even identify the genetic lineage of a chapter's geneseed when we can track mitochondrial DNA going back thousands of years.

[@id9907]

Probably a mistyped or corrupted string of code in their biology sub routines...and they won't fix it because an update patch or system restore is tech heresy. 😋

[@ffejpsycho]

Bah, they death guard

[@manuelcordoba5394]

I'm calling it already they're ultramarines

[@lukemcdonladson6648]

👍😊💚

[@mouseketeery]

Nah. At least I hope not - sorry Remliez, but that's a shark-jumpingly convoluted scenario (not that the Dark Angels aren't all about stupid convolutions) and if it ever becomes canon I shall track you down and flick bogies at you. They're probably Ultras - most Chapters are.

[@gp-1542]

I still think there lorgar’s boys

[@benjaminwellstead4733]

I would not take 'Flesh Of Cretacia' as canon lore, as there are several contradictions in that novel to pre-existing Flesh Tearers lore. For example settling Cretacia so quickly after the Horus Heresy, when the lore stated the Flesh Tearers were a crusading Chapter for thousands of years. It's also a disappointing read if you are Flesh Tearers player.

[@Fourtytwo4242]

Sounds like iron warriors, uses heavy weapons in a siege format, stubborn, sees them selves has tools of death, does not see any difference in killing, stable gene-seed. So I just put them with the other 50% of the ultramarines who are so not Iron warriors.

[@phreakazoith2237]

don't Iron Warriors have a crush for getting bionics and stuff to enhance their weak flesh? Did not hear that about Star Phantoms.

[@Fourtytwo4242]

@@phreakazoith2237 that is iron hands.

[@phreakazoith2237]

@@Fourtytwo4242 thanx. I mixed them up.

[@IronWarrior_69]

After many studies the symbol that the Star Phantom use appears to be based on The Unus anus symbol.

[@albertoteruel1695]

4th

[@jaredpugh4037]

If you want to watch a new vs channel watch a fan with too much time star wars vs warhammer 40k story on KZbin.

[@wmen48]

First

[@MrBluman999]

2th

[@thishonestgrifter]

3nd