The Drydock - Episode 109

[@Drachinifel]

Pinned post for Q&A :)

[@ibbi32]

What is in your mind a universal battleship and what is the closest real life equivalent of your opinion

[@mikemartin6790]

HMS Hermes is due to be scrapped soon, she’s had an interesting life, I know it’s kind of outside your channel remit as of her late commissioning, but it would be great to have a 5 minute guide before she’s turned into bicycles/mopeds. I remember when she was a flagship.

[@Moredread25]

Kind of a random question, but in what year did the British spend the greatest percent of their GDP on the navy besides during the years of large wars? What peacetime year did the British spend the most money on the Royal Navy?

[@shadowwarriorshockwave3281]

Drachinifel what do you think is the most significant stride in the Boshin Warmtaken by the Japanes Navy

[@GaldirEonai]

You're stuck with either the japanese 25mm AA or the US Mk.14 Torpedo for the whole of WW2. Which do you pick?

[@mbryson2899]

Uncle Drach, you are clearly an exceptional human. THANK YOU for another amazing Dry-Dock! My hat is off to you I am once again in awe of your knowledge and skill.

[@michaelimbesi2314]

The big reason that slipways were largely abandoned is that constructing a ship on a slipway means that nothing is straight up-and-down. This makes lining things like vertical bulkheads up much, much harder because you can't just use a plumb line, and anything flat can't simply use a level. The extra amount of work that this requires is surprisingly large. It also makes using block-style construction much harder, which further increases costs. Source: I'm a naval architect and I also used to work as a planner at a large shipyard.

[@andrews2990]

Well, sir, I believe your source is sufficient for this channel! That makes incredibly good sense, but it’s something I never would have thought of.

[@danhammond8406]

There are side slip ways still being used where the ship is level then launched to the side into the water.

[@brianpetricone4020]

​@@danhammond8406 ...............

[@widescreennavel]

I hope everyone watches your excellent series on the unbelievably intense recovery from the attack on Pearl Harbor. I wish a) you could visit every middle and high school and give lectures and/or b) Social Studies and History teachers used your videos to light a fire in the imagination of kids. Great channel, thanks!

[@tonyvancampen-noaafederal2640]

All of the steel hulled ships that I have sailed on have had as part of the construction blue prints a Dry Docking Plan that lays out the positions for the keele blocks. As a side note, there are extra keel and side block positions which allows a different set to be used in each dry docking and allows for complete coverage of hull paint over a period of several dry dockings it is difficult to take the paint down to bare metal where the blocks are. Since the mid-1970's when Ingalls Shipbuilding constructed a new plant to built the Spruance class. The keel block plan is an integral part of construction. The ship is constructed on blocks riding on electric trucks as the hull moves through various phases and sections of the yard. Finally when it is ready for launch the electric trucks are replaced with dummy trucks and the ship is moved onto the yards floating drydock. The drydock is moved out into the harbor and ballasted down launching the ship, which is then moved by tugs to the fitting out pier.

[@ImpmanPDX]

My dad was a civ. contractor for the USN out of Hueneme/Mugu. He used to tow target hulks out to San Nicholas and provide radar support. During the summer I would go along seeing as being born on a ship [based lightly on the HMS Arrow BTW] by age 5 I was a competent deckhand/navigator. I would end up getting press ganged by the uniforms all the time. Mostly "hey kid coil this line" or "take my duffel", but sometimes things like "take the UHF/helm for a bit" or "keep an eye on this radar for me". I think they got a kick out of a grade schooler who was just powder monkeying around. Got to see a Seawolf up close (not on board though). Life at sea for a child is a mix of boring punctuated by some very interesting stories. At least they had an NES in the galley. Sometimes I regret not joining the Navy, but with a decade at sea already I picked the Forest Service instead haha

[@Thumpalumpacus]

Lived right off Hueneme, stepdad was QM on USS Norton Sound, did some pool-shooting at the Top Deck as well.

[@glennricafrente58]

The last time I was this early Drach was still apologizing for making 5-minute guides that went over by a couple of minutes.

[@jacobwerner274]

Ah the stone age

[@joelluedtke8680]

@@jacobwerner274 the good old days when we got a real quick skiming of the ship in question good times

[@ED-es2qv]

I tend to get more excited the longer the video is. I’m never in a hurry to quit listening to Drach.

[@ronniesebbit5695]

@@joelluedtke8680 ssð,🤔🤔🥴🥴🤔🤬

[@juliusraben3526]

Hahahahahaha

[@dancolley4208]

My Dad was an Aviation Machinist's Mate during WW2 on the USS Bear (AG-29). The ship was assigned to the Greenland/North Atlantic Patrol during the war. They had frequent contact with native Eskimos who were sealers and walrus hunters, from which they made warm, dry clothing. Sailors usually spent their small wage on that native clothing when on patrol in the Greenland area. Plenty dry and warm !!!

[@jonathan_60503]

Though she wasn't put back into service, the USN submarine S-51, sunk on Sept 25, 1925 in 132 feet of water off Rhode Island after being accidentally rammed, was finally raised on July 5, 1926 and towed back to port. However she was, as far as I recall, never really repaired and was sold for scrap in 1930. The tale of raiser her, as told by the commander of the USN salvage effort in his book 'On The Bottom' by Edward Ellsburg, is fascinating.

[@robg9236]

Ellsbergs naval career would make a good episode.

[@steveamsp]

"Yeah, the one the front fell off?" "Yeah" "Yeah, that's not very typical, I'd like to make that point."

[@Dave_Sisson]

The wonderful 2 minute sketch can be seen here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/aZ6YoquQosR9p68

[@Scoobydcs]

LOVE that sketch

[@kilianortmann9979]

Well, how is it untypical?

[@Scoobydcs]

@@kilianortmann9979 well the front doesnt fall off for a start

[@Jfk2Mr]

That sounds a bit like what happened when procuring "Occurrence border"

[@GaldirEonai]

Regarding the anti-air flamethrower: A rear-mounted flamethrower was tested on some bomber aircraft. It produced an impressive burst of flame, but more importantly a thick trail of black smoke and soot that served to _really_ mess with any fighter attacking from the rear. It was eventually decided that it was effective but definitely not effective enough to make up for the sheer madness of carrying a pressurized tank of flamethrower fuel in your already fire-vulnerable bomber.

[@benwilson6145]

Been behind trucks equipped like that

[@rosiehawtrey]

Just field a few B36s, get up in the air, and wait till something or several somethings catch fire (usually before you're shot at). Those things were a bloody menace as long as the engines were running.

[@josephdedrick9337]

my understanding was that at least one german ww2 plane carried one, but it was more an improvised weapon.

[@TomokosEnterprize]

oH, yES.

[@planegaper]

@@rosiehawtrey thing is the engines caught fire with such regularity, that carrying all that extra gear is redundant.. Just throttle up one of the eight that were running hot, and "poof" instant flame thrower... At least that rapid disassembly is scheduled, and you get something for your lost power plant.. lol

[@micahbrown3045]

Falls asleep listening to other videos. Wakes up listening to this guy. Anyone else?

[@yclepe]

Oh boy this is just the sort of pedantry we love. TEXAS is already plural. it is a Spanish Transliteration of a Cado Indian word meaning friends, In Spanish---- los tejas Thanks for another great post

[@yclepe]

@Charles DuBois I didn't either, must admit I just looked it up ;-)

[@rosiehawtrey]

Oh the irony - Texas means friendly

[@HEDGE1011]

This is one of my favorite “Drydock” episodes…the “Edmund Fitzgerald” and an anti-aircraft flamethrower! What an incredible assortment of topics…thank you Drach!

[@thatguynameddan2136]

Speaking of boilers in that early question, steam is crazy stuff. i have pictures where it ate away metal on heavy fittings after developing a pinhole leak or not being seated properly. That was on less than 200 lbs steam, i could only imagine how bad that could get on something 4-5 times that amount of pressure. Like guys i know that work in a power house, they test fittings with a broom (because they play with something close to 1-1.5k pounds) so if theres a leak it cuts off bristles instead of a finger. i have more stories, but ill just end the blogpost there. As always,very happy to use my time listening to Drach. Love learning about naval stuff.

[@WildBillCox13]

I worked on a 1200lb steam plant in the '70s. A pinhole leak could cut a man in two.

[@PNurmi]

@@WildBillCox13 I never understood why the US Navy decided that a one screw Knox class frigate with 1200 psi steam was such as good thing. 600 psi is the way to go if using steam. Less dangerous and easier to repair battle damage.

[@WildBillCox13]

@@PNurmi We were trained on the DD 692 (Sumner class) powerpland: 600lb steam.

[@WildBillCox13]

And the only good thing about a one screw ship is less chipping of paint in the shaft alleys. ;-)

[@rudolfudo13]

@@WildBillCox13 And very clean too, there would be no jagged edges.

[@FatRednecK79]

These long Drydocks are great. I learn stuff while I fall asleep.

[@danhaas9730]

“Nobody wants to be flogged” Some corners of the internet might disagree with that! :P

[@danhaas9730]

Yeah, I know. I was just trying to make a joke.

[@philvanderlaan5942]

Dan I am fairly certain that at least in the age of sail the royal navy didn't have a large number of leather clad high heel wareing boatswains mates. (Don't know about now, but I'm not judging. )

[@richardcutts196]

@@philvanderlaan5942 Sometimes wonder about a certain CC and his frequent mention of "surprise butt sex". Though to be fair I don't think he mentions it nearly as often lately.

[@Thirdbase9]

@Karl Dubhe you might be surprised. There's at least one out there that wants to end up a bloody unconscious mess.

[@Thirdbase9]

@Karl Dubhe I wasn't talking about the tops, but the bottoms. The floggee, not the flogger.

[@shaunprice3922]

Naval history is a great background while I am doing other things, and old Drydocks are great for this (after discovering Drach's channel I usually watch them new however late nights I love comfort food for the mind, and Naval History has always done that for me), but I was always struck by being impressed that Drach discussed the Edmund Fitzgerald as it's a PURELY civilian vessel. Having grown up in Michigan and sailing/boating the lakes, the Eddie Fitz is a huge history bit for us locally, but unless you are a fan of folk music will be widely unknown to the general populace. The lakes are indeed inland seas, even having tidal actions, though on a much lower scale than a real ocean, and can be VERY dangerous to sail upon. I've always held the Great Lakes merchant fleet sailors in VERY high regard.

[@gow1044]

Same

[@kennethdeanmiller7324]

I grew up in the deep south & my Dad was a Gordon Lightfoot fan. So by the age of 5 or 6 I knew about the fate of the Edmond Fitzgerald. I never doubted that it was a true story & a major tragedy for the men aboard and the family & friends that knew them. I would have never thought that it was because they reached water that was more shallow and therefore the waves were bigger is probably why she sank. But it makes sense, when you have these big waves coming in & all of sudden the sea bed rises a couple hundred feet. Then there is less room in the water, then the waves get a lot bigger and once you are already there,there is nothing you can do about it! It's a very sad story. And it is a good reason to equip these ships with sonar so they know when they are approaching water that's not as shallow. On a calm day, not a big deal. But in a massive storm such a place is going to have swells growing up 50 to 100 feet.

[@PNurmi]

Sorry if this comment is late but I could only listen to the Drydock on the drive home after moving my child back to college. So I hope this helps and does not repeat a prior comment. While George HW Bush was on the sub, as an officer, he would have likely been assigned admin duties supporting the XO or another officer (writing war reports, tracking message traffic, performing crew inspections, overseeing the wardroom mess, and the like). Officers on small ships like subs have more than one job and maybe a couple of collateral duties. There were likely a couple of collateral duties he could have taken over for a month to give other officers more down time. He would not be assigned duties that the enlisted crew were already doing.

[@commanderdan3511]

I concur with Donald. In WW II Navy, there would have been a lot of Officer Duties, Standing a JOOD watch, that is being available on the briidge or in the conning tower to assist the OOD would be useful (being on watch does not imply being a lookout); another task that is always in need is communications officer. Monitoring incoming messages from the RM's (Radiomen), decrypting messages, encrypting messages, drafting standard reports, etc. Again in WW II, even in the " 'Mericun' " Navy, one would not ask a Commissioned Officer to do low level items such as moving equiptment or menial physical labor. Importantly, any task that would relieve a ship's company officer would allow much needed sleep for the revileved officer. My experience is that sleep is one of the most luxuries in short supply while in a combat environment. Dan Davis, CDR, USN, Ret.

[@14bdubz]

Hey Drach! I live in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan near Lake Superior, thanks for answer the question on the Edmund Fitzgerald!

[@jonathan_60503]

I think it was Norman Friedman's Naval Anti-Aircraft Guns and Gunnery that said another reason navies starting looking hard for 3" around the end of WWII, in addition to being a lighter weapon and faster firing that a 4.5", 5", or 5.5", is that the lethal burst radius of the 3" shell better fit the effective trigger range of the newly developed proximity fuse. The bigger lethal burst size of the larger shells is largely wasted if they won't detonate at all unless they come close enough the 3" shell would have killed the target anyway.

[@alexcredle6457]

Tuuuyuu

[@vikkimcdonough6153]

How would you deal with the inherently-considerably-shorter range of a 3" gun as compared to a 5" or 5.25" or 6" gun, though (especially when you're dealing with fast-moving jets where you _need_ that range in order to be able to take it out before it closes the range and drops ordnance, or to reach out far enough in order to be able to hit it before it drops a Fritz X or other standoff weapon)?

[@jamesfisher4326]

I has been my understanding that much of the reason for replacing the 40mm Bofors with the 3" gun was that the 3" was the smallest shell that could use the proximity fuses of the time. It also provided more range than the 40mm which corresponds to more time to shoot down the plan and more time for the plane to crash before it hit the ship.

[@planenut767]

It's amazing I had to listen to someone half way around the world to find out what's going in my own backyard with regards to the USS New Jersey. Thank you for the info. I'll save you my opinions on my state's lockdown but I appreciate the info

[@jetdriver]

I've actually spent a fair amount of time looking at the loss of the Edmund Fitzgerald and I'm convinced that the NTSB has it right. First this isn't the first big lake freighter to be lost so we have that data to look at. Including ships that broke up on the surface. Second the modeled the various scenarios and only one really fit the evidence that is there. We know she was listing and taking on water. We know that her cargo hatches were not water tight and that she had water pretty much continuously on her deck. Thus we know water was getting into the holds without a way to detect it or remove it. We also know that her hatch covers were not strong enough to survive a very large boarding wave. So the most likely scenario is that she gets hit by a large wave which collapses her forward hatch cover. She is already very low in the water with minimal reserve buoyancy by this point. the sudden filling of her forward holds with tons of water drives her quickly down by the head leaving no time for any kind of crew action. She simply dives under. when the bow hits bottom the shock of the impact results in her hull failing. We can see evidence of how hard she hit in the bow damage. When the hull fails the stern rips off capsizing and vomiting its cargo. Its likely that the stern doesn't immediately fully sever from the bow section which is part of why the two sink together. I don't know how the current generation of lake freighters has been designed but its clear that ships of the Edmund's Generation were not despite their enormous size capable of being on the lakes in all conditions. the lack of subdivision in their cargo holds, low freeboard, and poor hatch design made them very dangerous in high seas.

[@benwilson6145]

Thank you, I agree with you.

[@RobinTheBot]

Me, who has seen one video about the fitz ever: That's the theory I believe in too

[@mikebrower8450]

A few things about lake freighters; Moving huge quantities of bulk freight is cheaper by water (salt or fresh) than by any other method. Even though some of the lakes are closed during the winter due to ice it is still cheaper than rail roads. Lake boats, carry staggering amounts of grain, iron ore, coal, limestone, gravel, salt from the states where they are harvested or mined to the states where these commodities are used. Their ability to move bulk commodities was essential to American industrial productivity during WW2 (no U-boats lurking off shore at Cleveland, Duluth, or Gary, Indiana). Although they can be over 1000 feet long, they are called lake boats. Lakers are structurally immortal! Because they spend their lives in fresh water they don't rust. Even along their sides were the paint is scraped and gouged by banging against piers for decades, no rust. 70 year old hulls were in service common until quite recently. The "new" Thousand Footers were all build in the 1970s with no replacements planned. Note: one trip into the (salty) St. Laurence can take decades off the life of a laker.

[@jetdriver]

@@mikebrower8450 sorry they aren’t immortal. First of all metal fatigue is a thing especially with how these ships are built. Second while salt water corrosion is undeniably worse metal dose corrode in fresh water as well. Just look at the USS Cod.

[@jamesharding3459]

@@mikebrower8450 Yea, no. Rust happens even in freshwater, just look at the Texas. Secondly, as the other guy said, metal fatigue. It’s a thing that simply cannot be prevented, just somewhat mitigated and dealt with by replacing damaged elements.

[@TokuTaisho]

For those wo wonder, Fliegerkorps X means 10th Air Corps so the pronunciation is Fliegerkorps Zehn, not x (Zehn means ten in german).

[@gumimalac]

this is great. I get an entire weeks wprth of drydock. I can only sit through 30 minutes in a sitting due to lack of time. therefore i have a weeks worth of new drydock to watch each night.

[@kylebrown2927]

I dont know about plurals of Texas, but I have a tangentially naval story about Texans. When I was at USN boot camp, at one point my division was gathered on bleachers awaiting our turn at the firing range. To pass the time the range training Cadre began asking all the recruits to raise their hands when he named their native state. As in "who's from California?" And all the kids from California calmy raise their right hand like civilized, well adjusted human beings living in a polite society. This went on through a half dozen or so states until one petty officer asked "who's from Texas?" From far flung points on the bleachers and thus obviously not planned, 4 recruits jumped to their feet thrusting their arms to the heavens and whooping loudly. The Cadre petty officer hung his head and pinched the bridge of his nose as if in physical pain from this performance before resignedly saying, but with building intensity of frustration, "Every time! Every damn time I ask that question, every other state raises their hand; and without fail some Texas shitkicker jumps up and yells like Yosemite fuckin Sam. Don't mess with Texas? Nobody fucking wants to! sit your dumb ass down!" I'll never forget that, and subsequent travels into that benighted state did nothing to alleviate my impression of texans gleaned from that experience.

[@sundiver137]

An online company "T-Shirt Hell (Where all the bad t-shirts go)" has a don't mess with Texas shirt. At the bottom it read "it's not nice to pick on retards".

[@billmason2785]

Well said....it's great to read a wonderful illustration, written by someone who has a grasp of English 😁

[@joshuawood1436]

So being melancholy, and indifferent is your idea of being "well adjusted" and "civilized"? I'm sure no Texan who was unfortunate enough to have to endure you during your "travels", was better off for the experience either. Your story sounds highly fabricated, and you sound like a depressed and miserable person.

[@robertstack2144]

So you probably liked the West Coast Navy clicks like Adm Richmond Kelley Turner and disliked inland people like Adm Chester Nimitz(TX) and Adm Ching Lee(KY), n'est pas?

[@whiskeytangosierra6]

The jealousy exhibited by those unfortunate enough to not be born in Texas is amusing to those of us who were so blessed. Judging by the massive influx of refugees from the various Communist States of America to Texas there are a lot of people who prefer our form of Freedom to the closed minded obedience demanded by those other, lesser places. In reference to California particularly, with reference inferred to numerous other states, Kalipornia is a lovely landscape, inhabited, unfortunately, by Kalipornians.

[@polygondwanaland8390]

Drach should be made an MBE for his unparalleled contribution to public historical literacy.

[@MaxwellAerialPhotography]

Maybe in a few decades, Drach is still a young man.

[@brianomalley7501]

​@@MaxwellAerialPhotography😊😊😊

[@thundercactus]

You should do a 30min video JUST on the subject of why boilers tend to rapidly, and very forcibly, disassemble themselves when subjected to seawater! Temperature differential cracking the boiler open, but also what seawater does to the STEAM PIPES in the boiler, sudden effects of water hammer, and how opening up the steam section inside a boiler affects it's desire to no longer be inside the vessel.

[@SWIFTY_WINS]

"Sir, what do we call this new class of ship?" "Hell if I know, it basically just looks like a slimmer Galeon to me... Frigg it, call it whatever the hell you want." "Frigate! That's it sir, you're a genius!"

[@Isolder74]

For the Edmund Fitzgerald, it's known that they were just passing over a shoals just before the wave hit, damaging the hatches and waves also tend to push ships downwards. It's a possibility that when the ship hit the trough of the wave it pushed it into the bottom just enough to add just an extra bit of leverage snapping the ship in half. If it did do that, the ship was already mostly on its way down and before anyone could react it would have gone under.

[@ROTTERDXM]

The channel "Ask a Mortician" has an interesting video on the Edmund Fitzgerald ('The Lake That Never Gives Up Her Dead').

[@BrickNewton]

@@ROTTERDXM I just watched that yesterday, very good explanation of the sinking and how it happened

[@whitefordpipeshandmadebymi7238]

Exactly what happened

[@lumberlikwidator8863]

Concerning building ships on a slipway versus in a dock, there is an excellent comparison in a book called "Battleship Musashi: the building and sinking of the world's biggest Battleship." Yamato was built in a dock and floated out, while Musashi was built on a slipway. At the time, the only heavier ship than Musashi launched from a slipway was the ocean liner Queen Mary. The complications of launching Musashi were nearly insurmountable given the narrow dimensions of the harbor where she was launched. The concrete floor of the slipway actually started to crack during the launch. That was only one of a host of obstacles that had to be dealt with. It seems that building Yamato was a piece of cake compared to Musashi. I can't recall the author's name, but the book was written by a Japanese man, from the Japanese point of view. All I can say is if you are interested in this aspect of construction, get this book!

[@fooo2241]

"The Wheezers and Dodgers: The Inside Story of Clandestine Weapon Development" sounds great, found and ordered a copy. TY for the mention.

[@PaulfromChicago]

The last time I was this early, the Patreon drydock was under 2 hours.

[@davidwright7193]

If the admiral was trying to get commanders to think for themselves then the following court martial was even more disastrous than I thought.

[@RedXlV]

With regard to the use of the term "frigate" in the modern era, there was also that brief period post-WW2 where the US Navy used frigate (with DL or DLG hull numbers) to mean a ship intermediate between a destroyer and a cruiser. Then there was a freak-out in Congress over the Soviets supposedly having more cruisers than the US, so the Navy "solved" that "problem" in 1975 by redesignating most of the frigates as cruisers. At the same time, destroyer escorts became frigates, which brought them in line with how the rest of NATO classified such ships. Incidentally, some of the Soviet "raketny kreyser" (missile cruisers) were actually smaller than American DLGs. It was literally just that they were *called* cruisers that resulted in the "cruiser gap" nonsense.

[@joshuanorthey2026]

I am pretty sure in situations like this the “freak out” in Congress is just a cover for the defense industry lobbying.

[@deathhog]

Surprised the navy didn't use that as an excuse to get funding for even more ships.

[@tobiaszimmer4678]

Oo

[@tonyvancampen-noaafederal2640]

Retired E-6 USN (2004) in my limited experience all of the Tiger cruises that I was part of were as noted the last leg of our Western Pacific cruises. We picked our Tigers up at Naval Station Pearl Harbor and spent about a week in transit. Depending on the CO the events for Tigers ranged from a full Tiger Personnel Qualification where they were assigned a PQS book which was signed off as they completed the tasks. Stuff like familiarization firing of various small arms and even firing the Browning M2 .50 cal machine gun. Observing a Pre-Action Calibration (PAC Fire) of the 5"/54 (127mm) guns etc. To a very laid back tigers hanging out with friends and coworkers of their crew member. My recollection is that the tigers didn't seem to have expectations one way or the other. That ship also did Family cruise days which were either a one day one way trip with coach return to the home port or one day cruise to nowhere, out and back to home port. The most memorable for me was one where we left in fog, returned in fog and the only break in the fog was where Point Loma cut the fog off and by the time we arrived at 32nd St the fog was back. I don't know why but we didn't do tiger cruises on my second ship, which was an east coast based destroyer out of Norfolk VA. Perhaps because there were fewer convenient places to embark tigers in the Mediterranean.

[@elfthreefiveseven1297]

I went on a "family cruise" on the USS Callaghan. My next door neighbour was the Damage Control Officer. We took a bus to Long Beach and the ship to San Diego. Did some whale watching along the way. A steel beach picnic and a 5" live fire demonstration as well as showing off the missile launchers and phalanx system. I later served in the navy for almost 6 years (as a CT, O-branch) and that family cruise was the only time I was on a navy ship.

[@anantr99]

In reference to ships reaching supposedly 'unreachable' areas, another example is a few Byzantine ships during the Siege of Nicaea during the First Crusade (1098). The Byzantines dragged a couple of ships overland using logs and landed them back into Lake Askania, and these ships then finished the city's blockade, which eventually led to its capture by the crusading armies.

[@NickPoeschek]

Can’t hear anything about the Edmund Fitzgerald without instantly hearing “The legend lives on from the Chippewa on down, of the big lake they called Gitche Gumee” in my head.

[@sthenzel]

Ah yes, Gordon Lightfoot´s masterpiece!

[@robert48044]

same thing happened to me

[@ABrit-bt6ce]

LA LA LA I CANT HEAR YOU....... :)

[@empath69]

Bienvenue au Canada! For myself, I always force myself to recall the Headstone's punk rock cover of that ballad - at least with a faster time sig, it's a minute shorter than Gordon's recording. B)

[@iansadler4309]

I think one of the most iconic exhibits at Yeovilton is "Winkle" Browns Vampire - first jet to land on a carrier.

[@DMarsh1394]

Texi sounds like it would annoy Texans the most, so I vote for that.

[@MS-gr2nv]

gaywad

[@gamingsentry6000]

You have been reported to the local B-29 your doom is coming dont run

[@mcguirecrsr]

Should be 'Texae'. Source: high school Latin, Amarillo, TX.

[@ABrit-bt6ce]

Don't google Tiny Texie. At least don't do it at work. :)

[@drakenred6908]

@@mcguirecrsr Actually According to Hanna Barbra its Texxas (Sorry a Jetsons(TV show) Reference, and yes it was also a stealth pun)

[@detritus23]

Plural of “Texas”: either “Texaratta” or “There can be only one!” Don’t mess with Texas. Pick up your litter.

[@LiveErrors]

i thought it was "all the texas"

[@douggosnell1465]

Why do we need a plural of Texas, there isn't that much room left for another... just ask them.

[@Thirdbase9]

Don't give them any ideas about having more than one Texas.

[@vonskyme9133]

I'm going with Texas is already a plural. North Texa, South Texa and West Texa make up the Texas, like the Carolinas.

[@seanmac1793]

@@Thirdbase9 Texas reserves the right to split into 5 states when every they feel like it.

[@alitlweird]

To me, having this playing, is better than music, while I’m cleaning the house. It makes my wife go crazy. 😆

[@Exkhaniber]

1:58:35 I don't know why, but Drac just using his standard background image sans his iconic overlay had me laughing. Just transition from question to answer via removing overlay just amuses me greatly.

[@pdunderhill]

Deep Joy a bumper 3 hour instalment! Thank You Drach, appreciated mate.

[@shooter2055]

The Fitzgerald's bell was recovered a while back. More recently ROVs discovered human remains. Those 29 fellows are still down there. More currently, about a dozen lake freighters are in the 1,000-feet/100,000 gross displacement tons class. They do have to fit in the locks at Sault Saint Marie.

[@bradfolster9232]

To answer one of the first questions about boiler explosions. Steam expands at 1600:1. So we have a pressure vessel at x temp above boiling (higher pressure units require higher temp). So as soon as that heated water is exposed to atmosphere pressure (direct hit or cracked pipes from cold sea water) it expands that 1600:1 instantly.

[@somerandomguy9942]

Hanging out with you guys at a Museum all day would be a Dream come true lol

[@lars7935]

It's Fliegercorps 10. In German you tend to read roman numerals as actual numerals and not letters.

[@vaclav_fejt]

"Arabic" is the name you're looking for. And it's not just German, roman numerals are always read as numbers...if they indeed are them.

[@bjorntorlarsson]

Another three hour Drydock. What are you doing, wasting my time like this with your irresistible histories?

[@jeffwaddell66]

Thank God he does it on the weekend 🙏.

[@ryanisaacs3967]

The tale of the Beaverford really speaks to me, well done

[@alganhar1]

Salvaging ships is going to depend on the depths the divers can withstand, though with new ROV's that is certainly changing. To put things into perspective, the deepest dive using scuba was down to 332 metres, likely using a rebreather and certainly using a non standard Trimix mix. It was done by an Egyption SF diver named Ahmed Gabr, and while it took 12 minutes for him to reach the 332 metre target depth it took him 15 HOURS to return to surface. The problem with SCUBA as you can see is not getting down there, but getting back up! Most of a deep SCUBA dive is spent decompressing on the return. There are only 30 - 40 people known to have dived below 240 metres using SCUBA, that is total, not those currently diving.... This is where we come to Saturation Dives. The Dive team essentially lives in a pressurised environment, usually a series of chambers on board either a Diving Support Vessel or a rig. These chambers are brought to the pressures the dive team will be operating at, and they will be constantly supplied with the Gas mix they will be diving with. To dive they are lowered to depth in a pressurised diving bell. The idea behind Saturation diving revolves around the simple fact that once the body has been subjected to the pressure and gas mix for a certain length of time the decompression period remains the same. Hence the name Saturation Diving, as the divers blood stream is Saturated. Downside of this method is that the decompression period is long.... very long. Hence why the divers live in an isolated chamber where the pressure and gas mix can be slowly brought back to surface levels in a controlled manner. Problem is this is a very specialised form of diving, of the registered Commercial Divers in the world only about 10% of them are Saturation Divers..... At extreme depths very exotic gas mixes are also required, well beyond the Trimix standard for SCUBA at extreme depth. Deepest Saturation Dives I am aware of were a series of tests literally to find out how deep divers could go by Duke University in North Carolina. They conducted on shore dives in a Hyperbaric chamber down to 686 metres. To my knowledge *no one* has ever gone that deep in the ocean. Even with Saturation Diving allowing greater time at depth however you still have a problem. Pressure. And there is only one way around that. ADS, Atmospheric Diving Suits. These are, essentially, man shaped mini Submersibles. A US Navy diver has reached 610 metres using an ADS in an actual dive (not an onshore 'dive' in a hyperbaric chamber), in theory an ADS can take you to 700 metres, but to my knowledge no one has gone that deep. ADS does not have decompression issues as the diver is kept at surface pressure. As you can see, while it is theoretically possible to get a diver down fairly deep, it is not an easy process, and the number of people qualified to dive at these kinds of depths are few. At the moment you still require divers to successfully salvage a ship in its entirety. Submersibles and ROV's are, at the moment too clumsy and limited to conduct many of the operations required This of course will change, especially with ROV's, but at the moment the real limitation is your divers.....

[@12jazion]

Look into the modification of the Edmund Fitzgarald to increase her cargo capacity. After her freeboard was reduced by three feet, the Captain commented several times that the ship started doing a "wiggling thing" that scared him. He described the ship as feeling like a tight trampoline when encountering heavy seas and it began making groaning noises. I believe the ship was overloaded beyond what it was designed to carry and encountered a powerful storm. She had no chance and broke apart on the surface and went down in minutes.

[@johnbellinger6524]

Very good questions asked.

[@garyspeed8961]

my older brother enlisted in the RAN at age 14.. in 1960... after training served on Destroyers... was on the Voyager when it was sunk by the Melbourne at age 17

[@jacoballen8616]

I would absolutely buy a model kit or poster of the USS Second Amendment Rights. It's the American thing to do!

[@jamesfee1966]

I want a five minute guide!

[@dnillik]

Boy sailors: google Claude Choules. Joined the Royal Navy in 1915 at 14. Joined HMS Revenge in 1917. Inter war emigrated to Australia and joined the RAN. During WW2 he was the demolition officer for Western Australia. Died at 110

[@rudolfudo13]

You forgot to mention that the RAN also named a vessel after him, which is still in active service.

[@harrykoppers209]

The U.S. had started a project in 1939, I think, to widen the capacity of the Panama Canal. I believe they were looking forward to Montana type ships. Excavations were made for larger locks, but the project was cancelled I believe at about the time the Montanas were cancelled. Panama eventually completed the larger locks just a few years ago.

[@strydyrhellzrydyr1345]

What project... You might wanna say which question your commenting on. For future reference... Thanx

[@predatorfe]

Thank you for featuring my video of the Trieste on your channel, it was a very emotional ship launch since this was the biggest ship ever to be launched from our shipyard. 2:06:29 I'm proud to say this is the shipyard that set to Sea the beautiful sailing vessel "Amerigo Vespucci", maybe if you have time you could feature that on one of your videos. >Thanks! P.S. and yes, the engineers were concerned about the ship gaining too much speed, but thankfully they did their calculations correctly :D P.P.S. Your pronounciation of Trieste was spot on

[@blueboats7530]

Also a slipway launch was USS California in 1919, into a narrow river, and the largest ship ever at that location. (Spoiler Alert) . . . so guess what, the dock on the other side of the river was substantially "redesigned"

[@wildough]

Or,"Sudden unscheduled disassembly" as that Irish tank guy likes to say.

[@cameronnewton7053]

@@wildough ahh yes the chieftain another one of his subscriber favorites is "oh bugger the tank is on fire"

[@thewaffleton]

I did a Tiger Cruise in 1994 on USS Puget Sound. We boarded in Bermuda and sailed to Norfolk, VA. Took 3 days.

[@lukedogwalker]

I suggest Admiral Tryon should be listed alongside King Cnut, Marie Antoinette and others whose intentions have been obscured by horrible over-simplification in the time since, to the detriment of their reputations.

[@bcoop1701]

Nobody tell Drach that none of the lead ships for the WW2 USN destroyer classes ( Fletcher DD-445, Allen M Summner DD-692 and Gearing DD-710 were the first laid down, launched or commissioned for their class). Those honors went to Nicholas DD-449, Barton DD-722 and Frank Knox DD-742 respectively. The first batch of contracts (and therefore the lowest hull numbers) were assigned to Federal Shipbuilding for all three classes but Bath Iron Works was farther ahead in completing their contracts for the previous Benson and Gleaves classes so they laid down their first ships of the new classes prior to Federal.

[@erniemark19621]

On the subject about the Edmund Fitzgerald, she had been ran rather hard over the years, and was due you have double bottom repaired that winter. The steel is still sitting in the shipyard waiting with her name on it. As for the waves that hit her they are thought to have been 30 + feet, and were three waves that hit her from the stern. One of the consensus is that she had gone a little farther east then she should have before she had made her turn to the southeast and had hit a Shoal a glancing blow. From that time on she was known to have been taking on water she had lost some deck railing and some vents at about the same time she was thought to have grounded. The three waves that hit her were at a wavelength far enough apart that they broke her back. They have found 2 bodies of the crew on the wreck site, and another one of a diver who died in a diving accident who wasn't recovered. Technical diving the wreck is prohibited. We will probably never know for sure if she grounded or not, but the captain of the SS Arthur M. Anderson that was following the Fitzgerald was trying to help track the Fitzgerald because the Fitzgerald had lost her radar. He was pretty sure that the Fitzgerald had ran farther east than she should have.

[@beverlychmelik5504]

I can imagine that the aviators aboard sub is some of the administrative duties and watch standing. While officers could help with the enlisted tasks I just don't see them doing so as Naval Aviators were supposed to be Officers first and had many official duties not related to flying. They were also trained navigators. I can see then providing relief for the officers in non combat situations.

[@surbon110]

Hey Drach, yours is one of the few well thought out explanations of the sinking of the Fitzgerald! The one thing I’ve got to bring up is these waves, as mentioned by the crew of the S/S Arthur M. Anderson, following Fitzgerald, wasn’t they were considered rogue waves by their direction as they were heading into the seas but their size, being estimated to be 25-35 foot waves in 15-20 foot seas. I’m of a similar to opinion to you otherwise, the ship encountered the first wave, buried its bow in the wave, hadn’t cleared the wave from its deck before the second one hit and the third one put the final nail in the coffin as it were. That being said, I don’t believe it split on the surface, as the water in that area was shallower than the ship was long and there are reports from the watchmen on the Anderson that they saw a flash in the direction of the Fitzgerald. This suggests to me the ship went down rapidly, impacted the bottom, sheared it’s hull in two, shorting out the electrical and causing the flash before the stern settled and was dragged down by the bow.

[@TheWareek]

on the bit about boy seamen i joined the RAN in 1974 at the ripe old age of 15 1/2 junior recruits only ended in 1984

[@WildBillCox13]

Re: GWB; untrained naval personnel are immediately put to peeling potatoes if they're enlisted, or shouting at potato peelers if they're officers. GWB was an ensign-an officer.

[@SkyraHope]

Another great drydock!♥️👍

[@tarab9081]

It's worth noting that after further, further, further review Teddy Sheean was recently awarded the VC.

[@SwitchBlade743]

WRT Naval Firing Ranges - The main one for the US Navy is actually on the Potomac River just south of Washington DC. The firing range is down a straight stretch of the river. There is a story that they once missed the river and a 12" (?) round landed in the backyard of a residence in Maryland. The owner won't let the navy have it back. Also, there is a piece of battleship armor just outside the main gate with two projectiles stuck in it. I don't remember the size, I was there in 1974. The base also had a couple barrels from the 18" gun the US Navy was developing during WWII.

[@taccovert4]

If only they would have fired some shells northward. Would have likely caused attacks of intelligence to occur in Mordor on the Potomac.

[@WALTERBROADDUS]

Naval Surface weapons Center Dahlgren, MD

[@DavidConnor]

Thanks for the shout out to Battleship New Jersey. Good KZbin content.

[@matthorn9209]

HMS Hermes is being sent to the breakers yard next week, a sad loss of a very important ship 😢

[@planegaper]

Drach, there's a lot of conjecture that she bottomed out, already overloaded steaming full power into Whitefish bay.. An Iron ore load will bring the ship to 26.5 feet with less than a full load, the max for the Seaway, so she may have been able to ship the extra water safely... Mind you , a Lake boat has less stringers than a Salty, as she's not really made to weather big Storms like on Atlantic crossings, but they are built pretty strong.. The action of the waves, hogging and sagging the hull, as she fought the troughs certainly weakened her, but finally perhaps half an hour steaming from safety, she crossed a shallow point on her way into Whitefish, most likely caught a Trough wrong, and her bow hit the bottom with immense force on a steep angle.. Cleve'd the hull where she was shipping all that extra water, and sunk her with all her crew... sort of the Titanic in reverse is the best way to visualize it. Happened in seconds, and in deep enough water that the crew had no chance.. When I was an AB on a lake boat, the skipper played Lightfoot's song every time we Sailed out of the Sioux, bound for Superior... a reminder that 15 min can make the difference between safety and all hands lost out here, always said a little prayer for the Families as we passed the spot, One long One Short blast on the Horn was the signal.. may the crew rest in peace..

[@Austin-cn8vh]

30 knot HNS Warspite sounds both glorious and downright terrifying.

[@benclark3621]

The captain of the nearby Arthur Anderson communicating with the Edmond Fitzgerald stated that the captain of the Fitzgerald reported the deck rails were slackened or down after the ship strayed into the shallows, and suspected that the Fitzgerald had dropped into a trough and bottomed out, essentially bending the ship in a 'U' shape where it hit. Would also plausibly explain damaged/missing cargo hatches and their clamps as the rigid hatches could have popped their clamps right off as the hull disfigured underneath. In any case it was a tragic event in Great Lakes history

[@leosypher9993]

My grandfather served on a great lakes iron ore freighter, he has stories of the storms they encounter on lake superior

[@patreidcocolditzcastle632]

im not into ships but this guys voice is great to sleep to

[@rob5944]

Wish I'd of known about your visit, would of been nice to see you!

[@Axel0204]

Please, please bring us a 1/350 or 1/700 HMS Thunderchild model!

[@norbertblackrain2379]

Its Flieger Korps 10. Roman numbers are traditional used to indicate the number of Corps level formations in the German military.

[@TheCsel]

While there are several "salties" that operate on the Lakes, another limiting factor are the locks and canals connecting the lakes. An additional note, several of the frieghters still operating on the Lakes were veterans of WW2. For example the Lee A Tregurtha was formerly the USS Chiwawa, it has had major reconstruction, but still carries its WW2 campaign ribbons and battle stars. A few other WW2 frieghters or merchants vessels are now cut down to be barges.

[@maxgleaves5454]

RE: ships that went down, but were recovered into service, the T class submarine mentioned was HMS Thetis; she sank on trials, killing all but five (iirc) crew. When reinstated to service, she became HMS thunderbolt, which was lost with all hands in the Mediterranean.

[@jonsouth1545]

And the reason she sank in the first place was a speck of enamel paint blocking its internal plumbing on torpedo tube 5 leading to the invention of the thetis clip to prevent it from happening again

[@CO27640B]

Excellent as ever. However I do think the seaplane tender answer was somewhat misleading. The Tangiers class tenders could and did all cary PBY Catalinas and Martin Mariners. These ships were not designed to launch aircraft in open water, but to establish forward operating bases to support patol squadrons at small Pacific Islands, Atolls and reefs ahead of the fleet to carry our maritime patrol. Both the Japanese and USN built large seaplane tenders for this purpose - in the age before radar. There were also smaller seaplane tenders based on converted WW1 four stackers. Again these were to support fights of smaller Vought Kingfishers at forward bases. In the Atlantic you correctly pointed out the Islands are not there for this task, although the USN did base seaplanes in the Carribean, on Ascension and the Azores as well as in Brazil and Iceland for ASW.

[@robert48044]

Wasn't expecting the Fitzgerald to make an appearance in the Drydock.

[@Skywatchers]

It’s amazing standing underneath an aircraft carrier in the dry dock.

[@thomasrotweiler]

Ships recovered after sinking -Ramb III Italian banana boat / armed mercahnt cruiser / minelayer / presidential yacht : en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_auxiliary_cruiser_Ramb_III . On 10 May 1941 Ramb III was torpedoed by the British submarine Triumph in Benghazi harbour. She was salvaged by the Italians and returned to Trieste. On 9 September 1943 Ramb III was seized by German troops at Trieste. Refitted as a minelayer and pressed into the service of the Kriegsmarine, Ramb III was renamed Kiebitz. As a minelayer she laid over 5,000 mines in the Adriatic Sea until she ran into one of her own mines off Ancona. Running astern, she reached Rijeka with no further damage, where Allied aircraft sank her in November 1944. After the war, Kiebitz was refloated by the Yugoslav Navy. She was converted at Pula into a training ship in 1952 and renamed Galeb ("seagull"). Ultimately the Galeb became the presidential yacht for President Josip Broz Tito. In this service, with her appearance greatly altered from her original incarnation as Ramb III, she served for 40 years. She is in display at the Port of Rijeka as a museum ship.

[@hollywood1340]

Look up the Pocatello Naval Ordnance Plant. They relined big guns there and fired them at various parts of the local scenery in the Arco Desert.

[@go2mikerenzi]

Battleship Cove is a nonprofit maritime museum and war memorial in Fall River, Massachusetts, United States. Featuring the world's largest collection of World War II naval vessels, it is home to the highly decorated battleship USS Massachusetts. It is located at the heart of the waterfront at the confluence of the Taunton River and Mount Hope Bay and lies partially beneath the Braga Bridge and adjacent to Fall River Heritage State Park. It is about an hour from Boston, where I am.

[@DardanellesBy108]

I visited there several years ago. I’ve been to several maritime museums and Battleship Cove, Fall River is still number one on my list. Hope to get there again someday.

[@go2mikerenzi]

@@DardanellesBy108 Boston is steeped in American history. I grew up in Quincy MA and the same is true there. In 6th grade we dug up the remains of the first glass works in America, right on the beach on the peninsular where I grew up!

[@go2mikerenzi]

The remains are across from the shipyard where the USS Salem is.

[@eknapp49]

My sarcastic answer to the question about the plural of Texas. Considering it is more than twice the size of the place, I would say the plural of Texas would be Alaska.

[@rudolfudo13]

It might even be "Victoria Downs" this was the name given to a cattle station in the Northern Territory of Australia. reason being that when I was in the service RAN during the 1970's this spread had more area than he entire state of Texas. This place was measured and mentioned in literature in the square miles range. Until some yank partioned it. (I don't think he was partial to having anything bigger than his state. Sort of negates the bragging potential

[@ztoob8898]

32:23 - Loch Ness Hamster is the funniest screen name ever.

[@jawadad802]

there was something very unsettling hearing Drachinifel ranting on about 'boy seamen'

[@Pervect1]

That is the best picture of the Ranger. She is a smart Ship.

[@napalmholocaust9093]

Once a chick turned a garden hose on my steel woodburner when I was gone. It ripped the heads of the bolts holding the firebrick support clean out and twisted the sides, splitting it nearly in half. What a mess. She did it became she was mad I necked the stove pipe down, said it was unsafe to go from 8 to 6". Like she ever cleaned the creosote out. Thanks for the space to put a rant in about water hitting hot steel.

[@jeremycrawford2238]

Love the Eddie Izard reference

[@pscwplb]

Another thing Airmen are probably well qualified for is navigation. If not the actual plotting of courses, then at least the taking of bearings and reading of charts.

[@kavemanthewoodbutcher]

I just woke my wife up to ask since she's a Texan. She very angrily informed me that Texas has no plural. Like moose the plural of Texas, is Texas.

[@charlessmart7640]

Amazing discussion!

[@Loweko1170]

I'd buy a model kit of the Thunderchild in 1/350 or 1/700, in plastic or resin. I imagine the catch is that to be economical, you need a MASSIVE production run. That's the reason Lego require 10,000 signatures before they start to consider a model for production. You could do a resin kit for less, although it wouldn't be cheap on a per-unit basis. You probably want to talk to the people who do short-run Star Trek kits, they have very high levels of detail these days and are just as obsessive as any naval grognard.

[@terjethornqvist4361]

Ignition is a wonderful book, highly recommend it.

[@disbeafakename167]

17:00 hey! I recognize that picture! I had that cut away book as a kid! It was one of my favorites!