The End of Group B

[@remusZR]

Big RESPECT for those drivers!!! R.I.P Henri Toivonen

[@barryotoole6990]

And his co-driver

[@remusZR]

@Skip König 35 this month. I was born in 1986 when group B was banned...

[@kiryonamikaze9627]

and Sergio Cresto

[@derrickstorm6976]

And a the others who died, even though you don't care about them. Only the famous guy In fact you wouldn't even be "respecting" him if he wasn't the last driver to die

[@remusZR]

@@derrickstorm6976 are you blind or you cant read??? I wrote: respect for those drivers! Not only for Toivonen...

[@SRAMEK]

"Thoughts are already too slow for that car." The craziest thing I've heard!!

[@SRAMEK]

@Skip König Too old

[@oskarlindstrom357]

@@SRAMEK we really want to know how old you are!

[@khaosleigon504]

That's some scary stuff but legendary

[@SagnolTheGangster]

They didnt do it for money.... It was their PASSION! those were the glory days!

[@barfuss2007]

or a drug... Walter Röhrl predicted the death of Toivonen...

[@davidw1634]

Or the death days The drivers eyes could not focus on the corners at that speed which caused tunnel vision

[@fatcat8776]

Even in 100 years from now Group B will still be seen as the golden years of rally. Not only will the horsepower never be exceeded, but it was the only time in the sports history where it truly challenged F1 as the most popular motorsport in the world. It was dangerous, yes, but everyone involved knew it and still took part.

[@0wly]

Nope in 100 years what wrc is now will been seen as the golden age as no one will remember group b me as a 2000 s kid i can confirm that people dont even know who is Henri Toivonen and no one really knows who are Markku alen and Juha Kankkunen it is really sad times to bee a finnish rally fan no one knows theyir past anymore. Weird boy born in 2005

[@oskariranta1122]

@@0wly voi vittu..

[@vintageman91]

So mutch happened in motorsport in general in the late 60s - mid/late 80s, poweroutput increased more and more, wings started to be used and manufacturers could make almost anything.

[@yco67]

i still cant understand how they were letting people to stand on upcoming rally car.. if they would take spectator safety a bit more serious probably there d be a still thing called Group B..

[@EleanorPeterson]

yco67 - Hi. There were just too many people, I'm afraid - tens of thousands of them - and no way to stop them getting onto the stages. Fanatical, determined, passionate - how do you stop them? They're on public roads. Barriers won't work. Riot gas? Machine guns? 250,000 police officers with dogs lining every yard of every stage? It couldn't physically be done. Crowd control wasn't possible. Sadly, the only solution was to take away the spectators' toys. It's exactly the same as the idiotic machismo you see at the Pamplona bull-run. People want to get close enough to actually slap the bulls as they pass. Again, stupid people - usually testosterone-fuelled men - get hurt. In rallying, stupid people - usually testosterone and beer-fuelled men, but also innocent drivers and co-drivers - get killed. Group B gets banned. It's very sad for everyone. I miss the glory days, but at least plenty of video footage survives to remind us of them.

[@blazcigale2762]

true. Group B should have never been banned. It was the biggest thing world rally ever had. The 90% of the fault is on spectators. the way they would tease and induce their own adrenalin by standing on the track and backing off at the last moments. I know it is evil to say, but they asked to get a car in their face... I can't see why cars would have anything to do with those kinds of accidents. it was a sloppy security of the track and not organised "safe spectator zone" that caused the deaths. Thats why Group B cars are back nowadays every year in San Marino, racing the classic rally of legends. Amen

[@broqui72jzbtches70]

They should bring back the group B, but with a different name with different restricctions, like the car cannot have more than 500hp and cannot be lighter than 2500 pounds.

[@Scoobydcs]

its not group b then

[@vikumwijekoon3166]

group b was dangerous for 80s. The technology wasnt good enough to make a 500 hp 1000kg car safe to drive during 80s. frankly current wrc cars are faster than group b cars. I think they should bring something like group b back since we have extremely advanced technology compared to 80s.

[@throwdown769]

They didn't give a shit about safety. And that's what made it great

[@ankushranga3916]

Yes it's true mate

[@itsnotmeitshim]

Brilliant video. This was the era of my true love for rallying and when I look back at the footage its inconceivable that spectators were that crazy and the governing body of motorsprt that irresponsible. It's really sad because those cars and drivers were awsome to be near..

[@tylerkilshaw3294]

I think that group b should have been suspended not banned so that the wrc could have made it safe by putting restricted area's for spectators and not as crazy cars.

[@Dave-ks9ig]

Then It's group A

[@vintageman91]

@@Dave-ks9ig No group A had a maximum output of around 300 bhp, had to be based on mainstream models and if they wanted any changes to the cars, they had to produce yet another big bunch of cars, i think its 5000 more.

[@Jeff-kz5kl]

I think it should be understood that if you choose to stand on the race track or in a dangerous area then you assume all risks. The shitty carpenter blames the tools.

[@tomlepski8306]

@@Jeff-kz5kl True,all those gonads standing in the path of the rally cars caused the ban of the most exciting cars in rallying ever.

[@zanravnikar7535]

nonono keep crayz cars put more barriers and spectatorts only on the inside of the corner not on the outside its more safe

[@danielecisotto4313]

Bei tempi,e ormai molto lontani, purtroppo anche grandi tragedie!.. 😢😢😢

[@overheadcam]

The crowd are the thickest group of people in the history of motorsport, they ruined the drivers ability to see the course or concentrate at all. The fact that they died is their own fault, they deserved what they got.

[@samgosling9363]

+PALMERZ27 comments like this make me ashamed to be a human being.

[@overheadcam]

Sam Gosling fuck these idiotic wastes of skin :)

[@TheThunderwars]

PALMERZ27 I won't say this. No one deserves to die. What's true is that it's stupid to stay outside of a corner when you know the cats are at their limits.

[@vanilla9122]

No one deserves to die. But when you play with death, then you deserve it. I mean, a 120 mph car runs in front of your face, are you really going to stand in the middle ? Come on.

[@NothingXemnas]

Sometimes I wish I was a Group B driver and painted strips on my car based on the number of people killed, like ace pilots did in the war, except I didn't kill because I wanted to.

[@Troylito]

AND ONE WOMAN! Mouton was a bad ass in Group B.

[@chocolateparsnip]

Great vid. It brings back super memories of going watching rallying with my dad as a kid. Real cars, Real drivers. It's sad to see what has become of rallying today!!

[@гришаосиев-ь9у]

Согласен с тобой!!!!👍

[@TheGilGS]

being from Portugal is sad that the tragedy ended (nearly), one of the best rally in the World, we got back into WRC few years ago and now (or next year) it will return to the roads of the north of the country where fans are more enthusiastic, i've seen several races (mainly small ones) and can't wait to see how it will be the returning... but can't Forget this group of cars the most powerful, insane and exciting but nearly impossible of controlling.

[@derrickstorm6976]

Imagine thinking only a single incident ended Group B

[@ROSMEN1982]

Era una manera diferente de entender los rallyes.Cada grito de aficionado se mezclaba con la furia de los caballos de los: delta S4,205 t16,sport quattro...etc.. Y producia una emocion que jamas volvera a repetirse. Fue una epoca inolvidable e irrepetible que para siempre sera recordada por todos. Grandisimo video...

[@meno0000]

there will never be anything like this again. the sound...the speed...

[@paulobarbosa3726]

My dad loved group B and we still does

[@marsvltor2]

I have to say that I was around in these days: to be able to get that close, not just to see, but to experience the smell, and feel the ground shake under 500+bhp, was an unique experience that I was, in hindsight, very privileged to have had.

[@9118693223]

these monsters deserveed respect. you do not play with them... the spectators were too careless ... maybe the organizers back on those years shoud have payed more attention for the safety of both , drivers and spectators...

[@vintageman91]

9118693223 Yes i agree, group b rally is my all time favourit motorsport and i love motorsport. I would pee my pants of excitement if i saw them in action, but im smart enough to know that you dont stand in the fucking way of cars traveling 90 mph who are by the way not that predictable as well.

[@diegoherrera0268]

it wasn’t something the organizers could control. these were all public roads and it was impossible for them to line up every single stage with cops or stuff, plus spectators were passionate as hell. nothing could’ve been done other than suspending gr b

[@fraserconnell21]

I so remember those times,just as a spectator..group S and then group b too!!!. We got blinded by headlights,then deafened by the exhaust and then the fire breathing monsters threw rocks and boulders at our heads. A thorough and visoroule experience....no more to be said.......☝

[@ThePuppe]

2:02 Henri Toivonen speaking, haven´t seen this before, thank you so much!

[@juanjodominguez18]

Una pena que se perdiera está maravillosa competición de pilotos, ingenieros y mecánicos...

[@vintageman91]

1970s and 80s where my favorite decades of motorsport, rally group 4, group b, group 5 silhuett, group S, formula 1 and Le mans prototypes.

[@endlosschleife]

Well done, thank you for sharing. A truly sad compilation.

[@doricdave]

Sad? 🤔

[@endlosschleife]

@@doricdave Probably because of how group b ended? Idk that was eleven years ago...

[@andyeve8]

What a fantastic yet frighning put together video. Thank you for uploading it.

[@McLarenMercedes]

Best motorracing eras ever: 5. Sportscar endurance racing 1970-1971. Porsche 917, say no more. 4. Grand Prix racing in 1936-1939(600hp supercharged monsters going 320kph) 3. The 1982-1988 turbo era in Formula 1. 2. Can-Am racing 1967-1973 (monster racecars with no displacement limit) 1. Group B rally. Insane amounts of power on narrow roads. The drivers were gods.

[@monogramtube]

There are things that are innate ... I do not know what moved me ... but those hours walking to see the passage of the rally cars of Portugal were magic to me. For a child ... a dream. It moves me when I look at these days. That sound, That smell, they are alive in me. I feel them, smell them, hear them. More than a passion ... is an everlasting love. Beautiful vision of this glorious era. For me, "the" ERA. thank you

[@oleskoollover]

@ CSIZI - Awesome editing and videos. You really help us understand the drama of the Group B era!

[@Spigot89]

Not just fans/lack of crowd control (Rally Portugal, in particular), but also the deaths of Henri Toivonen and Sergio Cresto.

[@BowlerTD]

Well made vid! Captures the demise of group B well. I think it was a combination of awesome, but to fast cars for those conditions and the lunatic spectators. To bad the group S never was started!

[@ludeta5272]

R.I.P. Henri Toivonen und Sergio Cresto

[@MrNickS2]

Great work Csizi. Watched this video maybe 50 times...still not boring. Good music choice. 5 +++++

[@ViveSemelBeneVivere]

The spectator marshalling, the sheer lack of it, was insane. They should have banned spectators from the outsides of curves, put the tape way further back, and hundreds of marshalling volunteers. That's done these days of course, but it's mindboggling they didn't do it back then. Henri Toivanen's crash happened on a remote part of the stage and was actually was not witnessed, but the plume of smoke afterward was.

[@wolfsburg7208]

Masterful job.Congratulations on a wonderful piece of work.

[@mattiasjohansson7718]

I have a question to you Csizi. I have always wanted to do a reel Group b "Tribute" video. But a problem with that dream is i was born 12 years after Group B started and 8 years after group B ended. = I have no WHS tape whit recorded Group b rally stages on. And a group b tribute whit only scale models of half of the "GroupB tribe", is maybe nothing i would "send to youtube".So my question is if you could send me some random clips with group B. Please. R.I.P. Toivonen,Criesto,Bettega,The 4 people who died during the accident in Portugal And that unknown Co driver who was burnt to death in a Rs200.

[@洪梓恩-p7z]

rip the legend of : lancia delta s4 lancia 037 Peugeot 205 git the MG opel manta and Audi Quattro s1

[@robertleahu]

no ford rs200 ?

[@hendraxxtop7949]

Renault 5 turbo🙄

[@abisommeren6151]

So eine tolle Zeit... Einfach unschlagbar heftigst super.. Super, toll, phenomenal...

[@MotorsportMadnessYT]

Bro this Is One of must Epic rally videos OMG

[@andreasandon5492]

1986, the end to the rally.

[@gurlsingerfan]

We knew at the time that it was way out of control, especially the crowd control or lack thereof, BUT we loved those cars, and still do....

[@MonstrMatt]

I love you for posting this

[@CorrPerformance]

Thanks for making this great video. I never got a chance to see one of these rallys in real person but I was a fan of them and respect them a lot.

[@Driftit]

Very interesting clip. What is said at the end of the video? Can someone please translate.

[@WhiteDwarfVR4]

I love this Channel, and I love this video. I don't watch it often though, for the same reason that the video is so great. It shows the writing on the wall, The Omen, and the final straw in an era of a sport that I love

[@RMcG109]

A superbly edited video that captured it perfectly. Unforgettable

[@alfmaumau]

Rally of Portugal + group B is the perfect combination, regardless of the enormous unhappiness, none will surpass the "Portugal Wine Rally"

[@FinlandForceTeam]

The portugal accident and a couple of months later the deaths of henri toivonen and sergio cresto really sealed the end of groub b rally

[@waty0usay1]

wish it would come back one day :(

[@DizGuys]

It will never happen again. The world is waaaay to sterile and analytical to allow raucous activities such as the crazy edginess of Group B.

[@icewolfers19]

F1 today - look at these - no words - just epic moments....

[@Spigot89]

Exactly, one of the main problems was the sheer lack of crowd control. FFS, people were leaping out in front of the cars' paths

[@bigthunder1499]

where did you got the footage at: 02:00?

[@haywoodbadman10]

this video really does sum up Group B, it was spectacular and for us watching it on TV it was unreal,the drivers were spectacular and so were the cars ,but the costs were for this entertainment were just to great!. was it really worth having many drivers and fans seriously injured over a sport which was purely to bring the best excitement in car sports!?. still i wish they brought it back allthough with the regulations now it wouldn't be the same

[@zzirSnipzz1]

what you dont understand is its ok to give someone the choice to stand out an get themselves killed but the driver has to live with it and its extra strain when your having to watch out for the crowd thats what got them spectators killed the guy swerved one way then over corrected careered into crowd then he gets all the blame by spectators They didnt have to come

[@MrSilverfish12]

Those spectators were stupid. They knew exactly what they were doing standing that close to the track. Bunch adrenaline junkie meatheads.

[@lelexoxo1286]

we should put spectators along path of f1. so f1 will banned. lol

[@EleanorPeterson]

mio muhammad - Ah, it'd never work, my friend! If the spectators were close to the track they'd be seen by the TV cameras every time a car went past. Just think of the sponsorship opportunities! Companies would pay BIG MONEY to have F1 spectators wearing their advertising material on TV; more spectators = more money = more coverage = more spectators = more money... I think your idea could make the problem worse! Also, Ferrari's 'tifosi' are crazy anyway, so they'd LOVE to be able to slap their beloved cars as they went past. They all wear red, so the blood wouldn't show... ;-)

[@dfa.18]

F1 do that back in 50s until early 80s lol

[@branchprediction9923]

@Jaski Kiiski learn English first mate, then you can cry on the internet. :)

[@diegoherrera0268]

@@branchprediction9923 idk man he kinda ratio’d u into the stratosphere

[@branchprediction9923]

@@diegoherrera0268 liking ur own comment? and yeah indeed u DONT know, so be quiet then boy

[@timothyboles6457]

I never was totally into rally. But did watch several events during the Group B era. The main issue was not "IF" something was going to happen. It was "WHEN" was it going to happen? And how bad was it going to be. The cars were getting faster and more powerful. The stages more difficult. And the crowds were always RIGHT there. Watching the crowd was like watching the Red Sea part. Then close behind each car as they roared by. There was no way that a catastrophe was not going to happen. Rally is as near to totally out of control a driver can get a car. Spectacular to watch. But a ticking clock before something went horribly wrong. And finally it did. And then it happened again. And it was all gone.

[@alanmea]

if u read the report a rs200 lost control while trying 2 avoid a spectator and ended up hitting a wall of people killing 3 and injuring over 30.

[@LogiForce86]

Looking at this footage i'm surprised that the drivers still see a road with so much people on the road like ants. More surprising is that the drivers had the guts to even do this kind of thing under these circumstances. If they had made a tiny driving error then things would go bad. The guys that drove these cars are really something else to be handling these beasts with such precision, under such pressure due to circumstances.

[@tomcruise1]

it was pure adrenaline for both the drivers and the spectators

[@loicalex]

So dangerous and so beautiful at the same time. Group B era was definitively the best impersonation of the duality of good and evil.

[@mrkarterhuh9830]

year they never should have stopped it, if your in the crowd and you see a car coming get the hell out the way or better yet the FIA should make it so the crowd has to be a certain distance from the road or better better yet lol death waivers for the drivers and the crowd. also i know these drivers are gods amongst us but maybe they could concentrate a bit better if they didn't have people in the middle of the road as there coming down a straight or out of a turn.

[@4.8Sam]

MrKarter HuH or if they didn’t have people standing on the apex of the turn

[@DaDe92WoRkInPrOgReSs]

r.i.p. henry....... uno di noi!!!!!!!!!!

[@svenlima]

A real cowboy wants to die on his horse. A real rally fan wants to die while standing on the rally track. Darwin Award for all of them!

[@TheAffenkotze]

Another stunning video by Csizi! Awesome work, dude!

[@EGReviews]

No, they're not, the normal rally cars used in 1980's rally were, but group B were the fastest rally cars ever

[@scp1904]

É pá nos anos 80 isto aqui em Sintra era só índios! Que loucura irresponsável! Outros tempos...

[@thecrazycrack2043]

damn...this video change my life

[@rafarallys]

espectacular, exelente video.

[@Spigot89]

As I said in an earlier comment, that (their deaths) was the tipping point of what ended Group B.

[@DizGuys]

Really appreciate your work, but the engine sound might've been preferable to pure music.

[@Jaska8000]

I believe that the Rally of Portugal was a starting point to ban the greatestest rallyclass of all times. Few weeks after Portugal tragedy Toivonen's and Cresto's Lancia fell down off the tarmac road in Rallye de Corso. At the time, Toivonen was second on the rally and was eager to catch the leader (name ??) Henry was always known to be a great competitor: Only 1st pole would satisfy him. Rest in Peace Henri.

[@3dsst]

R.I.P HENRY E SERGIO ........

[@Michinator3000]

You are right,sir!

[@fermillo65]

the stress of those drivers... sliding those beasts around, with hundreds of spectators virtually delimitating the track. I mean, it must've been horrid to go through there...

[@the13er]

The problem of B was not the speed but shortage of safety and bad steering. Speeds of the cars were pretty modest compared to F1 for example. But the cars were buildt lighter and lighter and constructions weaker. Steering was a problem both for Ford RS200 and Lancia Delta S4.

[@rbagel55]

The problem wasn't Group B rally cars, it was the lack of safety barriers for spectators.

[@abisommeren6151]

Walter Röhrl, legendär.... ❤️😘😘😘👍🤗

[@ervinomerdic652]

Povijesni kraljevi sve rjeci hvale nema sta

[@colinashby3775]

Music video?

[@Rainbowstunting]

If they would bring this back they should do something about the fans. Althought I don't see it coming back soon I would love to see these beasts in action!

[@KOSTAS22R]

I heard that the explosion in Toivonen's accident was caused by illegal modifications that Lancia had made to the fuel lines in the Delta S4. But also I think that both Toivonen and Cresto died on impact so It wouldnt have made much difference.

[@MrMARANGA7]

group b the best!

[@jp3d2k]

@willvillar777 I think the problem was the reverse: the cars had too much power for mere humans to manage... For the 2011 WRC shifting and differentials are now mechanical again (no more paddle shifters or electronic differential control)

[@Spigot89]

If anything, the tipping point for the end of Group B probably was the deaths of Henri Toivonen and Sergio Cresto. Probably also Rally Portugal before that as well.

[@Janno132]

R.I.P Colin R.I.P Henry R.I.P Legends

[@vaniljam5176]

I wish they brought back Group B but got better crowd control so the drivers could concentrate on their driving instead of worrying about killing someone.

[@fitomauro]

muy bueno..... gracias...

[@wanaiman4604]

watching group b rally car is like you are having a death wish really terrifying

[@Tehwilburforce93]

I'd heard that some fatal crashes led to the cancellation of this division of the WRC, but I didn't realize it was that intense. Someone oughta make a documentary about this. For all of those blaming it on the fans, I might not know much about the rally culture, but I it's clear to me that they shouldn't be torn down. They died, after all. Think about that for a second. Their families won't ever see them again and the WRC had to put up with a lot. Of course it was going to cancelled after that.

[@Driftit]

Thank you. Makes it very sad now I know what is being said.

[@DavidZanchetta]

Bravissimo Cisizi!!

[@srcm1979]

Alucinante video....

[@ShaneNayani]

True end of an Era... RIP henri

[@vogsphere2719]

Friend A: What's the difference between rally and regular racing? Friend B: Rally drivers have balls of steel.

[@coolraul5119]

Yo viví esa espectacular época y tengo que decir que la tragedia de toivonen y cresto fue un palo pero en honor a la verdad podía haber sido muchísimo peor por que lo de los espectadores era de juzgado de guardia.

[@vezzlan2]

Any idéa what´s he saying at: 4:45-5.03 ?

[@UBIQUEROL]

The Metro 6R4 had no chance against the turbo cars.

[@ontherun8]

@acroracing maybe it was one of the Martini (Lancia) team speaking... he said (communicating with someone of the team located at the special race base, i believe) : "send immediately the fireman team, Henri's car is burning... "

[@envoy3]

If they brought back group b regulations what kind of cars would be in? Would Subaru get back in the saddle and finally make a super car?

[@Hammerhead547]

If they brought it back they'd probably entice every major car manufacturer in the world into the sport but the regs would probably not be anywhere as loose as they were back then. I would imagine they would have strict limits on turbo size and boost pressure along with limits on aero kits and mandatory requirements that certain components be based on the road going variants of those models. I could see Subaru Ford Chrysler General Motors Honda Toyota Peugeot Lancia Hyundai and Nissan all getting involved immediately but it wouldn't be so much a question of who could build the best supercar (depending on how strict the rules are) but rather one of which teams can find the best drivers.

[@kubad8678]

Hammerhead547 Lancia not so much, today's cars are just crappy rebaged Fiats and Chryslers :(

[@GSXR-1000]

+Hammerhead547 ford and peugeot would built the best

[@GSXR-1000]

+Hammerhead547 ford and peugeot would built the best

[@GSXR-1000]

Captain Slow GT86 ford rs200 did 0-60 in like 1.6 seconds from a 2.0 i4 . Subaru will never beat that car

[@NoTrucksNoLife]

@McLarenMercedes Good choices. But my best eras : 5. Formula One in the fifties 54-58 ( With the Gladiator FANGIO, Amazing GP of Reims with the 250 F ) 4. WSC in the Eighties 84-90 ( Love the 956, 962, famous "SILK CUT" and alls others ) 3. Fromula One 85-94, just for SENNA.... 2. Group A 88-94, amazing amazing amazing battle BMW-MERCEDES !!! 1. Group B but you knew that already of course ;)

[@pano8]

4:50 goosebumps...

[@anthony17967]

Better to live one day as a lion than a lifetime as a lamb, sad but also glorious