The Ethernet Age: Intel Express with Doug Boom

[@dougermouse]

Thanks to Clab Retro for allowing me to share some stories from the trenches. I still don't think it was DACE that we bought, put a comment in if you know or remember what Danish company we bought. It was 1997 and I'm old so forgive me ;). Also, was that a Phineas and Ferb reference I spoke somewhere in there? Yes. Yes it was. [You have to grow old, you don't have to grow up :)] If you guys put in enough follow up questions, maybe Clab Retro will have me or others like me back on some day out in the future.

[@clabretro]

And a huge thanks to you, Doug! It was great to hear the stories around the Express line and get some of your thoughts on ethernet in general.

[@pauldunecat]

There was also the sister lines of express, my favorite was BackupExpress; DAT tape autoloader backups with a label printer! We were still running Xircom bricks over parallel ports during that time. Cheers!

[@questionlp]

Along with the venerable 3c905b, Intel NICs have always been a golden standard for the Windows, FreeBSD and Linux servers that I've deployed and managed. I remember getting and using some of the other Intel network products that were acquired and re-branded as Intel NetStructure.

[@damirkvajo]

I think I speak for all subscribers here when I say: Thanks, Doug and do come again :)

[@elesjuan]

Hey Doug, thanks a lot for not only taking the time to talk with Caleb but even reaching out about this. I really enjoyed the conversation you two had and was an incredible throwback to some of my days of yore in the network space. Had completely forgotten Novell even existed until you two brought that up LOL.

[@drgti16v]

Ha!!! We called it "Performance Testing" also while playing Quake as well. A company VP walked into our office during lunch time while we were playing said game, told him what we were doing, he said "well keep it up and the company online."

[@damirkvajo]

Even though I went through all the speeds from 2400bps to 500Mbps nowadays I never thought of how ethernet is one of the longest running standards that we still use today... this chat was too short!

[@elesjuan]

Isn't that crazy?! With all the advancements of networking hardware, insane speeds (I couldn't even fathom the possibility of 100gbps fiber ten years ago, yet currently work with 100g fiber routers) new protocols... It still just kinda boils down to the same old tcpip it's (almost) always been! Stop and think about this... 802.11 is not only old enough to drink, but be having multiple children!!

[@OurSpaceshipEarth]

I was amazed I could run it for 1km. compared to BNC coax media, highschool Token Ring Novell network at school was just problems.

[@explosivehotdogs]

Blast from the past ! I also really liked the design of Sun switches.

[@matthewwhitehead5505]

This channel has become a real favourite over the last few months, the interviews the past two weeks have really moved it up a notch... Thanks for all you do, Colby, looking forward to the next one 😊

[@clabretro]

thank you!

[@Duncan_Campbell]

thanks for the history lesson, I do have a intel express switch I would send it in, but shipping would be a bit much, as I am in Australia. I got it second hand in 2007/8. It unfortunately it doesn't have any cards installed, or I would have offered to send them to you. It was interesting finding out why they killed the product line, but the ethernet cards that intel produces are still reliable, and with better then average driver support and not just on windows.

[@clabretro]

Nice! Yeah shipping would be rough, don't worry I'm stocking up here though lol

[@Atarian1993]

Such a cool conversation! I enjoy hearing all of this enterprise history... Thank you for sharing it with us all.

[@basroos_snafu]

That was a delight! Thanks to both of you.

[@TomStorey96]

It's so awesome to hear the human story behind products and technology. It really adds a new level of appreciation. Intel NICs were my favourite back in the day, but I've always been largely a Cisco guy when it comes to networking, and Juniper since the early 2010s.

[@herzogsbuick]

so glad i found this channel earlier today. stuck at home with bronchitis, but i'm able to work on an electronics project and watch videos like yours, with a really interesting interview to boot (also enjoyed the one with your dad). thanks so much

[@clabretro]

thanks for watching!

[@TimHoppen]

Ethernet started out as a radio system; the name is suddenly starting to make sense to me.

[@Baulder13]

These interviews are so interesting. Your channel is an instant click for sure. You came out of nowhere on my feed and its been so interesting watching your content.

[@clabretro]

glad you're enjoying it!

[@lukasblenk3684]

i find it funny because all people i know that work or worked in Network equipment companies tell me they used doom and quacke to test the equipment. The best story was from a guy who worked at a company that made Telephone equipment and well it's wasn't a startup thing it was more serious like IBM or SIEMENS then they started with Sattelite and Network gear. They had a new product and they had random issues with the new Network product and they found out it had some thing to do with broadcasts. They searched for nearly a month what causes this Broadcasts. In the end they found out that an intern downloaded doom and every time he played the new product would crash. After that Doom was officialy part of the Testplan for all Network products.

[@ax14pz107]

We have thousands of branches and every single one of them has a half duplex 10 mbps connection to a fire alarm system. These are modern systems being built today, yet...

[@ricardobornman1698]

I enjoy the corporate war stories and how much work they put into the products. We really do take things for granted.

[@RealEngineer]

Great to get such insight. All this interviews must mean that RAM for the IBM server must be hard to find 😂

[@clabretro]

😂

[@pjaz6800]

clabretro uploaded night made

[@bhstone1]

I didn't realize how much of the networking chip was developed in Israel! So cool!

[@truckerallikatuk]

I don't have a cable, but I do have a 510T with the stack module. Condition is unknown, but I'm willing to ship the module to you. Shipping the whole switch internationally would be insane, but the module I can do. Edit: If you can throw a 510T across a decent sized room, A: Sign up for Olympic shotput right now, and B: Call a flooring contractor as that floor will need repair.

[@truckerallikatuk]

I have 3 products Intel made and killed recently, a 510T switch, a NUC and an Iron Pass server. I miss them, good products.

[@Maulzy23]

Loved the video, Great hearing the behind the scenes stuff. I also went from token ring to ethernet and hubs to switches (and lots of Quake) etc. Cool to hear the stories.

[@dougermouse]

The reason we had a raised floor in the lab was for the Token Ring MAUs! Intel had a line of Token adapters, and we had a friendly rivalry with them until that market pretty much ended with the 100M 82557 and the 82555 PHY.

[@udirt]

I never saw this management module up to now. if it's not in this one already - could you make a video showing the LCD options at some point? This is such a attractive addition to the switch, errr hub. the intel networking guys were really nice, one of their product directors took time at their booth at an industry fair to carefully explain me things when i was just a 19 year old apprentice who had like 1 intel nic and read about a few more. he cared that I was able to understand why the newer integrated ones made more sense than the older with IO-AT and all the bells and whistles. Later when i got some say at work, it helped me explain why we should kick out the cheap realtek nics and 3com and standardize on intel in the desktops. which saved SO! INCREDIBLY! MUCH! trouble. Most sales people back then would be disguested even talk to kiddies like me "since we weren't business". Only the ones who had pride in their products cared to share, and it was a really useful razor to find out what products had a future.

[@clabretro]

Oh yeah there will eventually be follow ups with that LCD module and figuring out how to get both the hubs and switches fully stacked.

[@ChrisJackson-js8rd]

i remember 3com betting the farm on a brand new state of the art manufacturing facility in the phillipines to serve the demand for add-in ethernet nics that came online just after intel started building networking support into all of it's consumer chipsets. when intel got into ethernet it changed the market dramatically at all levels.

[@RandomTechWZ]

youre killing it with these videos.

[@clabretro]

thanks!

[@TylerStartz]

I just rewatched the other video last night, so I was thrilled to end the work week off with this! Fantastic interview, and extremely interesting.

[@grumpymike6203]

Also enjoyed the comment about installing netware. No idea how many netware servers I stood up. good ol ipx/spx

[@user-fh2fm7vr4m]

Does anyone have a source for ethernet being developed to connect the Hawaiian islands? Edit: never mind, it’s on the wikipedia page with some sources about Ethernet being based off of it/inspired by it, but not directly built for it. The connection makes sense though, thank you for the awesome interview!

[@jasoncooper6320]

What a great video! Thanks to both for putting this together. Love hearing the backstory on this stuff.

[@grumpymike6203]

Had many of the Intel Express switches. They were great. If I recall correctly they replaced accton hubs which were acquired in the western digital star lan days. Also had several of the storage express backups. I miss those days and would absolutely go back in a heartbeat. I also remember fondly the Intel Anti virus I think it had to be one of the first that had a central management console. I think Intel sold that to Symantec. Thanks for bringing back the memories.

[@ToxicwasteProductions]

Absolutely love your videos! Please make more. I always learn something when I'm here.

[@LiLBitsDK]

fun to hear some of the tech history... many of those out there never get told... we need MOAR

[@hal263]

Great interview. Really insightful stuff. Slight correction however, the term "backbone" was used long before digital networking protocols (like Ethernet over 10BASE5 or "Thicknet"). "Backbone" refers simply to the core network, which can be wireless or wired, and the term was used for long-haul audio and voice trunks. It didn't have anything to do with the thickness of "thicknet" cable which was typically just under 1cm in diameter (much narrower than the human spine), although the thicknet cable run itself would be considered the core or backbone of a computer network.

[@ax14pz107]

One of my Cisco books claims Cisco created the CLOS architecture. Who knew Cisco was around in the 1930s?

[@colinstu]

yeah that rang an alarm bell too

[@dougermouse]

My first lesson in Ethernet was doing a vampire tap in 1992. IT head Dave called it the backbone, and our network didn't leave the office until I got a 2400 baud modem to get a mail relay ( from Intel ironically) two years later. He was probably using your trunk definition, but I took to mean the cable. Funny part is 10-BASE-5 was dead man walking as a technology by the time I joined Intel. We made "triple" cards (AUX, BNC and TPE) cards for a couple years, but 100-BASE-T ended that quick. It's also funny how the POTS world and the Ethernet world had nothing to do with each other then, but just about every cell tower runs Ethernet to the back haul.

[@ax14pz107]

@@dougermouse a ton of the terminology from POTS networks was adopted into computer networks. Where I work everyone still refers to any WAN link as a circuit, whether it's cellular, cable modem, fiber, etc. Edit: hell we still use the term RJ45 even though that's supposed to be specific to telephone networks.

[@xsgt_silverx]

Such a interesting conversation! Thanks for sharing!

[@LeeZhiWei8219]

Dudes becoming a documentary/interview channel. 😂 Very interesting video man! Keep up the good work!

[@LeeZhiWei8219]

Btw Dude! NCommander did do some videos on netware. Might wanna give it a watch!

[@LeeZhiWei8219]

Doug is such a fun man! I got the "whatcha doing." from P&F 😂. Very interesting and cool!

[@clabretro]

yeah I saw the NCommander Netware videos! those will come in handy when I try it myself 😂

[@questionablecommands9423]

/me creeps on Doug Boom's LinkedIn... I'm (almost literally) surrounded by Intel facilities. * mental note to say hi to Doug next time I see him when I'm grocery shopping or checking the mail boxes*

[@TimHoppen]

I don't even have to look on LinkedIn to guess that I live near the office where these switches were probably developed. Living here has proven to be fun as a tech enthusiast.

[@eriklindgren3848]

Great episode and interesting interview.

[@JMassengill]

Great video.

[@stellated]

It might be worth trying CX4 triax cables like used for 10GbaseCX4 for stacking. Looks like you need the clip style common for Ethernet, not the screw style used on Infiniband and Myri10G.

[@udirt]

I need that Storage Express now. Will find some NetWare 5 easily enough and then lets just run some backups with it

[@joeyabb1965]

Ethernet came from PARC via Bob Metcalfe. It was first used to connect Altos computers.

[@timramich]

I bought a couple of their 40 gigabit cards but never got them to work with my Brocade switch. I had to go with Mellanox adapters.

[@SeishukuS12]

Ah yes, I remember the days of using a hub and wishing I could afford a switch... Now I can just run to the nearest Goodwill and buy one for $10 if I'm hard up for a 1Gb switch! lol

[@DerinTheErkan]

I'm not sure where to get the cables themselves but TE Connectivity still makes those connectors, on Digikey they're called AMPLIMITE 0.050 series. The small one is 26 pin and the large one is 80 pin. For a custom application I bought these connectors (the 68 pin version, same as SCSI) in the IDC type and made my own cable using ribbon cables from Digikey, maybe you could do something similar.

[@clabretro]

thank you!

[@miked4377]

wow! some excellent content clab!first your dad's excellent interview and then this....very interesting 👍

[@thcoura]

0:39 Is just me or the manual cover picture looks the same as Boston Dynamics logo?

[@javajav3004]

great interview!

[@jn_gutierrez]

Excellent.

[@jessestrobel2]

Great interview

[@d3yuen]

44:36 isn't that an aaui/aui port? Sorta analogous to modern SFP ...

[@The_Electronic_Beard]

Clabretro podcast? 😁

[@clabretro]

😆

[@andresbravo2003]

God that’s too many!

[@feieralarm]

I really hope you won't turn the channel into an interview channel and next week will actually be about hardware again.

[@clabretro]

lol two in a row is just a coincidence. talking with people who were there is an amazing opportunity though, makes the hardware all the more interesting