The Fall of the House of Usher (2023) | A Deep Dive Spoiler Discussion

Here I take a deep dive into Mike Flanagan's final Netflix series, The Fall of the House of Usher (2023), based on Edgar Allan Poe's stories.
Original Review: • The Fall of the House ...
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[@dougsmith8104]

18:50 I'm not so sure Leo really killed the cat. My thought is that he hallucinated that he did. The last scene of the episode showed a black cat with the Gucci collar nuzzling up to Leo's body, so I think that when he said to his boyfriend that, 'maybe we accidentally let him out', I think that's exactly what happened and the cat actually lived. Remember, he never really brought home a replacement black cat, that was shown to be the rat, which was likely the rat he found under his pillow.

[@andreafrancis4823]

Agreed!

[@nancyjay790]

Mike Flanagan said as much on the site formerly known as Twitter.

[@Gchili]

I think the events leading up to most of the deaths of the Usher kids revolved around them hallucinating their biggest fears. They got progressively worse and I think it was in relation to what kind of a human being they were and from youngest to oldest as well. The younger ones still had some innocence left. Leo, Victorine, Tamerlane and Frederick all hallucinating, all suffering miserable deaths.

[@infinitiyash3440]

​@nancyjay790 god I love the Prince-ing of Twitter

[@summycannibal]

Ah, I came here to say this exact thing!

[@dianamora6238]

Carla Gugino was a standout performance and she pulled off EVERY wig and hairstyle thrown her way....amazing

[@DoloresJNurss]

1. Perry's rave is exactly as depraved as Poe described, in his discreet, Victorian way (many unspecific references to unspeakable perversions and every vice known to humankind, leaving the rest to the reader's imagination.) So for once Netflix didn't exaggerate that one, although they do seem to have a policy that every series has to have, somewhere, either an orgy, a bloodbath, or both. 2. Leo did not kill Pluto. He hallucinated finding Pluto's body and assumed that he had killed her. The Pluto look-alike cat has no collar (if she exists at all; a brief glimpse shows the animal shelter with Verna holding a cat to actually be a derelict building with Verna holding a giant rat.) Pluto wore a fancy Gucci collar, and in the last scene is shown returning home i that supposedly stolen collar, checking out Leo's corpse. 3. "Candy" shows to Tammy what her husband really wants, but like all the characters, Tammy doesn't take the escape route. (For every character Verna offers some way out of self-destruction, and none of them take it except for Lenore, who is granted a merciful death because she had no vices to exploit. Technically Roderick is also an exception, but Lenore already offered him a way out.) 4. The scene with Madeline and Griswold matters because Griswold insults the twins's mother and their illegitimacy. In Poe's stories, the drunk in a jester costume gets bricked up in a wall because of his frequent mockery of the narrator's family. 5. Tammy does not reveal her true self when she tells Bill that she's just been using him all along. She reveals her idea of herself, a myth so that she can always feel in control. This is why she avoids intimacy with Bill and instead hires escorts to act out her fantasies of what she would like if she could allow herself to love Bill. In the end she realizes that she does love Bill but can't bring herself to call him back. This echoes the poem on which she's based, "Tamerlane" (which is her full first name.) In the poem Tamerlane is a ruthless conqueror who tears himself away from his youthful love for a peasant woman for the sake of ambition. In the end he's surrounded by wealth and power, but dies with regret that he didn't trade it all for the true love that he could have known. 6. There's a saying: "Knowledge is knowing that Frankenstein is not the monster; Frankenstein is the creator of the monster. Wisdom is knowing that Dr. Frankenstein IS the monster." 7. Regarding Juno, she's Poe's character, Hop-Frog. No one knows Hop-Frog's original name; he was a crippled dwarf dragged from his own country and named Hop-Frog because of his comical (painful) gait, to be made the jester for a rich and powerful family, existing to be ridiculed. ("Hop-head" is also old-timey slang for an addict.) In the end he is forced into intoxication, much like Juno. But Juno is kinder than Hop-Frog, for he burns his tormenters alive and she merely burns the family legacy by giving it all away to charity.

[@manaash4316]

4. They weren't offered a way out of distraction. They were offered a way out of a gruesome death. "It could have been peaceful. At home, in your bed." She tells one character. Vera was always going to uphold her part of the pact, but they got to choose how awful it was- which is why Lenore's was so painless. She chose to be good.

[@DoloresJNurss]

@@manaash4316 Thank you for clarifying that. I did not communicate clearly. Every way that they died, except for Lenore, was their own fault, and the deaths that they gave themselves were much more horrible than dying naturally. That's what I meant by self-destruction, as opposed to fate-destruction.

[@manaash4316]

@@DoloresJNurss aah, I didn't pick up on that in your comment. Mia culpa ☺️

[@DoloresJNurss]

@@manaash4316 No problem. I was unclear.

[@kiwiskillerlooks2130]

Great line I loved was: "My name isn't Tina, you know it's Beth" "I don't give a shit BEEETH!" I FUCKING CACKLED! 😂

[@missraredoesstuff]

I LOVED that scene. Her behaviour was so childish it was funny

[@NeoDarkling]

I deadass did my ugly laugh! 😂 I have a co-worker named Beth and the temptation to say her name like this is getting stronger day by day.

[@salyx]

Mine was “Drippy Birkin bag full of monkey bits” 😂 Kate was on top of her game here!

[@sushmitaraodesaraju6330]

God I just loved every line of Kate's in this!! She's so phenomenal, wish we could've had more of her in the show.

[@mattcollins3591]

@@salyxyou can tell she had so much fun. I don’t think I’ve ever seen her in a “bitchy” role before but holy moly, she killed it

[@rachelmoses3059]

The actor who plays young Dupin , is Malcolm Goodwin who also starred in the series "Izombie" alongside Rahul Kolhi. When I saw him pop up I thought "ohhhhh reunion!!!"

[@Griffnix]

I was wondering why he looked familiar and when I looked it up I realized he was the detective on IZombie. I didn't even connect that Rahul and them both were on another show together till now. Maybe because they never really interacted here.

[@pamelalansbury94]

He was a really good voice match for the actor who played older Dupin.

[@squishycoveswena]

Me too!

[@sushmitaraodesaraju6330]

Yes!! And he was in Reacher with Willa Fitzgerald (young Madeline). I saw them together and thought it was a nice reunion.

[@mzjones6]

I saw him in Reacher season 1, he’s wonderful to watch, was glad to see him in this show.

[@futurereflectionsmedia8391]

I’m glad you mentioned how outstanding Mark Hamill was in this. I originally only gave this show a chance because of him. I am glad I did, as this show was great, but he really did an amazing job.

[@Cellipsis]

Pym to Verna: “I have no collateral” chilling and sad Like Verna didn’t already know that

[@aislynnmari]

Do you think the whole Pym backstory might be an Easter egg for a future Flanagan project?

[@petitwallaby]

I know I wouldn't mind seeing more of him!

[@kaycings9844]

Pym is another Poe character. So technically speaking, we do know his background.

[@aislynnmari]

@@kaycings9844 true... Even crazier is that Pym story actually came true- down to the very same eerie details- IN a REAL LIFE.

[@luciuswhite4502]

I think it was both a nod at his story of origin and a bit of Lovecraft as well. Due to how Poe influenced his writings.

[@summycannibal]

38:00 i think bill was there, she just... Fell asleep before the monologue. Cause the keys were there and there would be no other reason for him to leave like that if it wasnt for her falling asleep. Tbf, they do play it like a hallucination, but only real things leave an impact in the world, not even ghosts do that, as real or imagined as they may be. The keys being on the counter kinda suggest she fell asleep and he left, not during the monologue, but before. A blink of an eye can signify hours

[@Bullshotinbutt]

Griswold (Rufus) was a contemporary and severe critic of Poe.

[@Griffnix]

This was my first Mike Flanagan show and I loved it. I've been meaning to watch his other 'Haunting' shows but never got around to it. Watching Hill House now and I'm enjoying it but it slower paced and there is a question of, 'Is this real or not' that I enjoy. It's just not House of Usher. Halfway though though and I am looking forward to Bly Manor.

[@squamish4244]

Although both series are psychological horror, like all of Flanagan's work, Hill House leans much more heavily into it. Personally I like Hill House the best but that's a matter of taste. It's also more of a mystery.

[@thereisnocarolinHR]

Hill House is a lot more emotionally moving than house of usher. They are very different but hill house will always be my favorite. The family dynamics are far more relatable and I found it scarier. Hope you enjoy it!

[@AVspectre]

Have watched most of the other Mike Flanagan goodness (first was Midnight Mass) and am a big fan. Been delaying watching the two ‘haunting’ series as outright haunting are not usually my jam but I’ve heard how well received they are so I still have them to look forward to. :) I have loved this creation period with Netflix and hopes his future allows him to continue to make projects he’s excited and passionate about with the freedom and funding to facilitate it.

[@thealternativeaddamsfamily]

oof the heartbreak of watching hill house for the first time❤️‍🩹 Hill House: 10/10 Bly Manor:5/10 Midnight Mass: 7/10 Midnight Club: 5/10 Usher: 9/10 Geralds Game and Hush are also fantastic🖤

[@chelscara]

34:30 he does introduce that there because he asks where this is coming from and Tammy references him cheating with Candy, where he admits he never liked their situation

[@yaelkellman9686]

THANK YOU for being one of the few who says "chimps" instead of "monkeys"!

[@manaash4316]

Annabelle Lee was absolutely dead. They talk about how she unalived herself in passing in the show once or twice when the two eldest chose to live with their dad. Also, I LOVE that Madeline wrote about being small on the brick at eye level for Griswold. It shows how much Annabelle Lee's words struck her and stuck with her when she said the same to Mads.

[@joannesuzieburlison7128]

I love film student comments, I was never a film student, I missed out, so I'm happy to hear whatever you've seen.

[@BobBob73271]

I really liked it but the first two episodes were rough for me. I really didn’t like Perry as a character I didn’t think that part was a good addition to the show

[@KaylaMarie_]

Mark Hamil voiced Ozai from Avatar as well.

[@GeoffryGifari]

I'm impressed how the actress of young Madeline matched the mannerisms of old Madeline

[@CertifiedDyme]

My first thought when i clicked on this video: Beautiful hair 😍

[@KD-qc6st]

Great video!

[@aninhaqueridoca2]

god i looooved this show i love mike flanagan

[@manaash4316]

Also: i thibk Juno is based on the Gold Bug story and related to Jupiter, and updated (Juno being Jupiter's wife). Ibstead of being a slave incthe literal sense, shes a slave to addiction and then ligadone.

[@Xcyper33]

Such a unique "villain" concept.

[@brauckstar]

The date of Roderick’s confession to August is 11/10/23, which hasn’t happened yet. Anyone know the significance of this date?

[@sweet-mouth]

I don’t know but I’m here for the answer it’s a very good question, thanks for bringing it to mind

[@jaimelowe4246]

I was tried to google an association with Poe but all I found was that he’d written and received some letters which I imagine would be pretty standard for the 1800s.

[@lunacouer]

I wondered if it was originally meant to be released on November 10th but Netflix released it early.

[@erinclarke2606]

Or it could be the 11th of October. Most of the world outside of the US uses day/month/year format.

[@sweet-mouth]

This was set in the us and Poe was an American author, I thought that as well at first but I think that’s a red herring

[@LadyPenumbra]

This looks fun. I'm commenting before I've seen it because, the Algorithm like it like that.

[@dragen123ify]

I feel like pym wasn’t that important of a character because no matter what happened the ushers was gonna get away with it , he pretty much could’ve took the deal

[@lunacouer]

For him though, the most important thing was that no one ever had leverage over him. If he took the deal, she would've had leverage over him. For him, prison sounded better than that. Plus, when she said "Everyone has something they love", I believe that was his one thing - that no one could ever get one over on him. I'm reading into it, but I think that would've been his collateral, the thing he'd have to give up in the deal. Meaning, at some point, someone would have something to hold over him, something where he'd have no control or couldn't fight back. Given his age, I can imagine a thousand different ways that could be horrifying (falling in love for the 1st time and they die, becoming infirm, going to a nursing home, etc). It's kind of a "The devil you know versus the devil you don't" situation. He already is the devil and he'd rather keep that in prison (he'll survive just fine) than be free but vulnerable to someone or something else.

[@squamish4244]

@@lunacouer Pym has seen her before, standing on the ice. Now he knows she's not messing around. I felt he wanted to preserve whatever bits of his soul he had left, despite being the worst person of all of them by his own hands. Roderick of course killed millions, but indirectly.

[@in_vas_por8810]

They got away with a lot of it due to Pym. It wasn't a mistake that hes seen Verna before, and he ended up with the Ushers. Also "Pym Reaper" is not at all a mistake. Shes "outside of time and space", but most people haven't caught onto that yet.

[@squamish4244]

@@in_vas_por8810 She's karma. Cause and effect. Actions have consequences. Morality is a part of that, but only on the grandest scale.

[@BoudinSpicy]

@@in_vas_por8810remember she said his immunity was a reflection of the Ushers. It wouldn’t have mattered who was their attorney was. She promised immunity to the Ushers no matter what.

[@user-qe9jh4ff7c]

I keep forgetting that the guy who played Rodrick was in Doctor Sleep which also had the girl who played Laenor

[@GamingWithAlice186]

Subscribed & Shared to my Discord server. I just got done watching the series all the way through, going back through for a deeper dive, it's perfect for a October release. Thank you for the video for deeper dive with a chill atmosphere ❤❤❤❤❤❤

[@EwanReviews]

Thank you so much!

[@Effervescent1111]

Great breakdown but my goodness..you have beautiful hair ❤

[@argentfox7564]

They r assholes but like fleabag, u care about them or maybe even “like”. Love the show and the recasts

[@averystewart3117]

Watch mark hamill in “The machine”…YOULL LAUGH YO ASS OFF

[@thereisnocarolinHR]

Unrelated but you have beautiful hair!

[@thereisnocarolinHR]

Also 100% every time someone mentions Griswold I think of Christmas vacation. Every. Single. Time. Lmao

[@NormalWinterFox]

Dude you’re ok analyzing the show as a film student. I’m an alumni from film school myself. I definitely cannot watch shows and films without analyzing them 😂. Also this is my first time seeing a Mike Flanagan show. I’ve always seen the “the haunting of Hill House” on netflix as an option and was always curious about it, but at the same time never dared to click on it to watch it. Mostly because American shows tend to disappoint me seasons in, so I thought this would be another one. But you know what I’ll give it a try. Funny enough, I decided to watch the fall of the house of usher because my sister wanted to watch it. We watched during new years 😂😂 Also, yes the Pit and the Pendulum is an Edgar Allan Poe short story. There’s also a movie of it where Vincent Price appears. One of my fave actors from the late 1930s onwards❤

[@plaster.art.ho3]

i just finished this recently and i loveeddd it!! it was v gripping and kept me on the edge of my seat hahaha. The only other series that got me so hooked was haunting of hill house, fleabag, derry girls & end of the fucking world :)))

[@GeoffryGifari]

imo Leo isn't really as bad as the others... he's mostly just being self-destructive, not actively screwing over others. He also seems to care about his siblings the most

[@BoudinSpicy]

He was also planning on dumping Julius after thinking he killed his cat because he was rightfully concerned about his well being. I think he treated him like dirt.

[@NudeMatter-jk3cx]

why no pictures

[@jeliarra]

Do you "love" it?

[@yanamedina9338]

19:14 what is the C thing he referring to? cheating ?

[@EwanReviews]

Check the other comments!

[@joywalton9534]

i thought the illigitamate kids were wayy more entertaining

[@aimeem]

Perry was such an idiot. Aside from all the rest, he kept saying there would be "no consequences" but he was planning to blackmail all those rich, powerful people.

[@BoudinSpicy]

Remember he found out about his heritage the earliest and was the most hated, especially by Frederick. He felt like he would never be accepted, plus he was 16 and had no guidance to even cultivate character

[@criticalthot]

14:23 the term you’re looking for is ‘sex worker’ 💜

[@EwanReviews]

The term for Candy yes, but I need a different term for Tamberlane

[@criticalthot]

@@EwanReviews ‘Voyeur’

[@dickerliebhaber9000]

Love that heterosexual definition of ‚hypersexual‘ 😅 Also, did anyone really thought that the informant was real?

[@jacobmcbeth6922]

I don't understand the deal she offered to Pym Reaper.

[@lunacouer]

He could choose to spend the rest of his life in prison or not. But he didn't have any "collateral" that he was willing to offer up. For the Ushers, their collateral was their bloodline. Pym never had a spouse or children because he didn't want anyone to be able to have leverage over him. When she said "Everyone has something that they love", that's when he said "No, I have no collateral, because that means leverage, and in 70 years, no one's been able to have leverage over me". The way I took it, that _was_ the one thing he loved - that no one could ever get one over on him. He'd rather spend his last 10-20 years in prison than suddenly be vulnerable. So, he turned her down.

[@jacobmcbeth6922]

@@lunacouer thanks... I would have taken that deal tho... 😆. Cause what if they don't send him to a nice jail. He might be going to the booty bandit jail

[@freddyjafar1490]

​@@jacobmcbeth6922😂❤pym seems kinda open to that

[@SK-ut6tw]

Its certainly not a masterpiece like hill house. Or brilliant like bly manor. Even midnight mass was superb. This felt soulless likr americwn horror story.

[@mcbean1]

I'm at @1:11, I'm intrigued to see how 'heavy' this gets because I found it to be a pretty surface level show.

[@c.w.8200]

Yeah, I was a little disappointed that I didn't get nearly as emotional as when I watch Hill House, Bly Manor, Midnight Mass or Midnight Club. These are not so much Halloween but All Hallows sort of shows, a big "memento mori, family and love is what really matters" kind of affair. This one is an actual Halloween show. Still, there's the amazing quality Mike Flanagan delivers and the actors I know and love in some fantastically morbid scenarios but yeah, it does kind of lack the big emotional beats. Good for him that he tried something different though and I'm looking forward to a rewatch, the characters spout all this typical rich people bullsh*t and it's so obviously pathetic, which is just very funny. Also Carla Gugino and Kate Siegel are as magnetic as always, I can't be the only one crushing on them.

[@inabsolutedarkness13]

13:44 so, basically hypersexuality bad, promiscuity bad. I fear that this is the take that comes from the show. The show has elements that can be read in a unfortunate queerphobic light.

[@EwanReviews]

Most of the characters are gay? I feel like it’s like the complete opposite of being homophobic and Mike Flanagan has always been great with representation.

[@c.w.8200]

I think the show only points out that whatever you do has consequences, these people want to live without consequences, as rich people often do, and a part of that is consequence free cheating and sex. Rich people often exploit poorer and even underage people for their consequence free sexual gratification or they straight up demand sex from their employees as in the show. The character Prospero explicitly sells a "consequence free" orgy without actually paying much attention to possible consequences of his actions and only focuses on how much he can charge. The character Napoleon cheats on his bf and immediately plans to discard him once he voices concern about his drug use. People become consumables to the super rich that can be carelessly discarded and abused however they please.

[@user-we1fk4ul5o]

Homosexuality has nothing to do with promiscuity or hypersexuality. Some of us are; some of us aren’t. That aside-I see Flanagan’s depiction of sex in this show as something very different. Hypersexuality can be a trauma response; promiscuity can be an impulsive, avoidance behavior. Sex can be used to maintain denial as much as drugs or food. Flanagan is in addiction recovery; so am I. I see a lot of recovery in his work-I think every single work he’s produced in the last few years has had addiction & recovery in it. In recovery, we become aware of how we used anything & everything to avoid ourselves, our feelings, the world around us. We ate food when we weren’t hungry; we had sex we didn’t want; we gambled money we didn’t have. Anything to get relief. Sex, in that context, is not healthy. We didn’t do it for connection, nor intimacy. We used another person to disappear for a little while. Avoidance through sex is common, but it is absolutely a way we hurt ourselves. Given how overt addiction is in Flanagan’s work, I think his intention to highlight sex as a potential tool for self-harm is clear. Hopefully, after reading this, you can see it too.

[@jasomon2115]

I personally loved how the show didn't turn that topic sideways and ram it down your throat. To OP, if you think hypersexuality and promiscuity is a part of being gay, maybe it's time to look at the life you're living and make some changes.

[@akeelyaqub2538]

Almost every character in the show is gay or bi, what you talking about? Lol

[@silentflaw]

Nothing is more pretentious than remarking on how pretentious you are. Pauses in the review to fan girl are exhausting. We can tell you watched the show, though, that's good.

[@mcbean1]

Yea ok maybe its because you're young but I am glad you enjoyed the show, I would say try and aim higher when handing out 10/10's, I said already this show seemed like it was surface level and it would seems you consider that to be 'heavy'. Quite frankly if it shouldn't have taken more than 15mins to work out any of the plot 'twists', which is fine except Flannigan keeps trying to suggest there is some 'big twist' at the end, which he managed to pull off in Bly and Hill House, but not here. Its well shot and well acted, but mid at best.

[@EwanReviews]

To each their own

[@SandroDelNorte]

"mid at best" ?? Really? Well, I'm 58 yrs old, have read, amongst others, most of the work of EAP, and do not agree with you. I do agree The haunting of Hiil House & Bly Manor are better, but "...Usher" is still a more than average series. It;s well written, directed & acted. The whole ambiance is very well created. And I did like how Mike Flanagan updated the Usher family and more or less modeled it after the Sackler family. I would give The fall of the House of Usher 4 out of 5 stars: more than average.

[@mcbean1]

@@SandroDelNorte this was a well funded series with experienced actors, it should have been good from the acting and filming standpoint as a given. I'm not impressed when the standard is met. This would have been 10x better if it wasn't set up as a mystery, that was its major flaw because a mystery invites greater scrutiny of the writing and when you actually look into it there are holes everywhere. That's my main point.

[@loveIetter]

woah it’s almost like everyone can have different opinions

[@mcbean1]

@@loveIetter not really, plot holes and failings in writing are just objectively bad. You can say that you just ignore them, that's fine, but to not acknowledge them is plainly wrong