THE FALL OF THE HOUSE USHER made me sick in the best way | Explained

[@AmandaTheJedi]

Thanks for the patience on this one! I was out of town for family so this took a little longer than anticipated because of how long it ended up being. Hope you enjoy! I know there's a ton of stuff and references that got cut here so let me know your favorites that I missed! This wasn't supposed to be comprehensive Poe coverage but hopefully you learned something or get to teach me something!

[@joechapman8208]

Verna/Raven's driving license lists her last name as "Clemm". Poe's wife was Virginia Clemm. Tamerlane isn't anything like her namesake in the poem, but she has been given her husband's namesake's story instead, or at least an element of it. The original Bill T. Wilson is a man who slowly loses his mind in the belief that a student at his school, also named William Wilson, is intentionally turning into his doppelgänger via some demonic power, copying his gait, clothing style and eventually his face. Whether this is really happening or is just in Wilson's head is never clear, but of course this escalates until he is killed in a sword fight with his obsession. This is echoed in the show's Tamerlane instead where her sexual fetish with seeing her own doubles becomes self-destructive, and having her ultimately die from a fatal wound from a mirror is the same fate as William Wilson.

[@rachaeltompkins8924]

This show had me at “Gucci Caligula”.

[@AmandaTheJedi]

Ah! Not sure how I completely blanked on Bill, I just thought ‘Billt’ was so funny I didn’t even go looking for more

[@paintingthesouthwest]

I was looking forward to this and I enjoyed it sooooo much!

[@bellab2662]

Thank YOU for convincing me to watch!!

[@amandablii]

I love how we got to see that every "powerful" thing that Roderick said was previously said by someone who he saw as powerful

[@AmandaTheJedi]

'sir, yes sir'

[@attabooii]

Cause Ushers don't create anything 👀

[@Hippotigris99]

"The Ushers don't MAKE anything." I was really happy they included this line of thought. There are plenty of multi-millionaires out there who got rich by developing and creating something brilliant, but most of the billionaires exist because they are insanely ruthless about promoting anything and everything that can be branded to their benefit. And a lot of that promoted stuff can be useless fluff.

[@J-manli]

@@Hippotigris99 How many of the top executives of drug or tech companies actually develop the stuff they sell? There obviously are those that do. But there's no denying that the majority don't.

[@chisomo8088]

@@J-manliare you defending it like that makes it make sense?

[@thehappyrecluse]

I feel like Madeline choosing you are so small for the brick shows how much what Anabelle Lee said to her actually got to her. It was effective even if Madeline didn't really react to it when it was said to her.

[@PanicMerchant]

It felt like she was sealing those words away with him, a kind of symbolic ridding herself of everything in her way, including her self-doubt

[@emmmahezw]

I just watched haunting of hill house again after watching this and “you are so small” came up in that too. I was like 😮

[@Veryy_Victoriaa]

@@emmmahezwthe mention of walls and the owner scratching did too. I went back and rewatched it as well. Brick walls of some kind seem to resonate within this universe since there’s also one in Bly Manor I think

[@mariamoutinho154]

@@emmmahezw where did it come up?

[@rina37789]

@@Veryy_VictoriaaI wouldn’t be surprised if they were all nods to Edgar Allen Poe. The man loved his wall stories 😂

[@MahiMahi-yu5jo]

In the show, it's obvious how strong Lenore's will was. But nobody talks about poor Juno, perhaps the one victim of Roderick that did heal and got better. Poor woman was used as a pawn but her reply to Roderick, 'I'll take three years of hell over a lifetime with you' is a testament to her strength. After a season of being humiliated and objectified, I was glad to hear the end of the story where she wanted nothing to do with the Ushers and was doing well.

[@riakun]

100% agree with this. She seemed to by overshadowed by other story lines, but she came out stronger in the end (after being an addict, being treated as less than human by the family members, and standing up to Roderick, and overcoming her addiction, etc). She was truly an overlooked character but I’m glad to see that she was okay in the end

[@duckheadbob]

She also has some very funny lines in the goldbug launch scene

[@travelingnome87]

Loved Juno. Edit: just finished the series. I stand by my statement and will double down. She is a freaking boss and deserves everything good.

[@Eddypots]

I loooved Juno. I feel like her story could've been told a bit better. I would've liked to have seen more of her growth throughout the episodes, but most of her scenes felt a bit like comic reliefs. The actress is great too

[@jhasminesamoy7422]

WAIT, LAST?

[@jellokids]

Mark Hamill’s performance was perfection in this role! I loved how he turned down Verna and then she was there watching him as he walked into the police station.

[@Ashbrash1998]

I did too, his character was so intriguing and Mark delivered

[@squamish4244]

Even with the villains he's played in his voicework, they always had a campiness to them. This guy was straight-up evil, though not completely. It was really a shock.

[@anonymousmuse9092]

SERIOUSLY, the twist at the end where he doesn’t take the deal, despite being a man with literally nothing to lose, was incredibly well done imo

[@lucifferss]

@@anonymousmuse9092 what did she offer him cause that's the only part that i don't understand, what did she want from him in exchange

[@whiteshadow7584]

​​@@lucifferssshe wanted anything important to him. I find it sad that he has nothing to offer Verna in exchange. His life was devoted to the Ushers. He had no life outside taking care of every shady thing his employers are up to. In the end, it got him nowhere when they were gone. Edit: she offered that he walk away as an innocent man despite everything illegal he's done.

[@SpoookiePie]

In fairness to Vic 'getting the easy death' with the heart stabbing, I kinda figured her suffering was less the death itself, and more the looming guilt/madness in the form of the beating heart noise that she can't escape from, since The Telltale Heart's horror is more in the torment of a guilty conscience. Similarly with Leo, the death itself wasn't the horror like it was with, say, Perry. It was the tormenting madness that led up to it.

[@tierrabutler3577]

Yeah i agree especially when you think about how the only person who honestly cared about her and showed her real affection and she killed her

[@RamonaGelosi]

yeah but it could've been a couple more days of guilt and hearing the noise in my opinion. Like it was basically all in one day and for example Leo was dealing with the Black Cat for a few days before he lost it. Like even Tamerline was haunted with Verna appearing everywhere for several days and with no sleep. I still think it was really good tho, maybe the problem is my thirst for revenge hehe

[@ApequH]

Yeah, the going mad was more the punishmend than the dead itself

[@Scarshadow666]

@@RamonaGelosi Yeah, my guess is that writing constraints could only show Vic's torment for so long, when there's already a large cast of characters that get tormented before their demise too. Still, she got what she got, and better for there to be some torment than nothing at all. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ As someone that hasn't done anything as bad she has, but has struggled with mental health and guilt, it's definitely a fitting punishment.

[@Scarshadow666]

Very true!

[@charischannah]

Just that moment in the last episode where Dupin asks Roderick if he was sure Madeline was dead and Roderick pauses and says, "You know, our mother was the same way." That just got me.

[@Anynom]

What got me is how Verna isn't truly evil. She gives each one of them a chance to escape their fate but nope, they refuse and she has to bring them down. I loved when Pym turns down her offer and she smiles as if thinking "finally, someone smart."

[@598019001]

I think that is something that the show got across well. She may have provided the deal, but the deals didn't FORCE anyone to do evil things. At the end of the day, The deal she made with rodrick guaranteed that he was a king. He could have spent Years using that pharmaceutical company doing actual good, Could have done something about those pills years before. Every Evil thing he did was on his hands, and so he received an evil death. If he had taken over the company and used all that power in a way that changed for the better, There is a good chance his death would have been less horrifying, The raven spending less time actually tormenting him before taking him. Maybe not gone in his sleep, But better.

[@Singinghomealone]

@@598019001also, the way you worded that, “she just provided the deal” reminds me a lot of how roderick putting the blame on addicts for abusing his company’s drugs, along with his whole god complex, seems like another line of symmetry between him and the raven, but more of a superficial one? considering he wasn’t *actually* a god and his victims didn’t *actually* have control over whether or not they accept his deals (read: drugs).

[@polina_pr]

I don’t think she gave the children a chance “to escape the fate”, more so to have a quieter and easier death.

[@alexandredesbiens-brassard9109]

My one counterpoint is that when she made the deal, the Ushers had already betrayed a man and murdered another in order to amass power. So the odds thry would change their ways when shielded from consequences was pretty damn slim.

[@maca76]

@@alexandredesbiens-brassard9109 for me she is really a villain, she gave power to people who already commited murder and that she knew were awful people. The fact that she kills them later (after they commit all those horrible acts) doesnt make her clean. The fact everyone is ready to forget she gave them the power because at the end she brought them down makes me really effy, its excluding responsability from those who put awful people on powerful positions, bring it to real life and paralels to voting are too easy

[@rmounged]

It really hit me that the entire time Roderick is telling the story of his children’s brutal deaths, he’s entirely composed. But once he gets to what he did to Madeline, the madness starts to actually come through in his face and delivery. He starts to finally unravel and it felt like to me evidence that sure he maybe loved his kids in a way, it was always his sister that was most important to him from their “You and me against the world” upbringing

[@sweeety969]

Also telling that when all was said and done and they were buried, his grave was placed next to his sister's, with his children in a row below him. The only other person worthy enough to be buried next to him? Lenore. Oh and Annabelle Lee was buried nowhere near them. Honestly it pissed me off that she was buried with her father's family after the way he abused her mother. After the way the grandpa fucked everybody over.

[@juliawidmaier5334]

I love how Roderick was reveling in his own story and Dupin was just so unimpressed even at the end. He and Annabel Lee and Juno all saw the impoverished, pitiful, scrambling soul that he was.

[@Neytiri935]

Yes, he tried to pretend to be this great rags to riches story, and just ended up a hollow, bitter, vicious man

[@cainyourkids]

When Dupin was "I don't care what you want to say, Roderick. And the world doesn't want to hear it." and just left the recorder, that was one of my favorite scenes. Narcissists like Roderick want to be glorified, to become a story to be talked over and over by people - the way people nowadays almost become 'stans' for fucking serial killers, or have their stories turned into glorified TV (fuck Ryan Murphy) - but Dupin was like 'nope, you're shit, you'll always be shit and you don't get to turn yourself into a hero for a story, shitwad. Now stay in the shit like the shit you are."

[@Pagansong]

What Froderick did to his wife was from Poes short story Bernice. This series really shows how gory Poes stories were despite being poetic.

[@AmandaTheJedi]

Thank you! Yeah I knew the stuff got pretty dark but I definitely have some blind spots in his stories. I think the worst (in content not quality) one I'd read before this was Black Cat.

[@Nomoredrama2000]

That was probably the most disturbing aspect as it happens so much in real life. Even though the other deaths (chimp mauling, acid attack and dismemberments) were pretty brutal, that part really disturbed me and made me angry.

[@BekahFeltonMarquis]

I caught the Bernice reference! That story kinda traumatized me when I read it as a kid but I loved seeing references to some of his more obscure stories.

[@meganchambers8108]

I didn't know that! I did think it was just a very effective way of doing the Pit and the Pendulum - even before the actual pendulum/construction site part, the idea that he kept leaving and coming back (HE was her pendulum), and him putting the photos all over the walls to simulate the "walls closing in", and then she is pulled to safety at the last second by Lenore. Just amazing all around.

[@rat-xo7mj]

And I believe Tammy's husband's name is William Wilson, another Poe story hence the whole mimicking and doppelganger thing

[@AdmiralKomodo]

Juno actually does have a counterpoint - sort of. In the Gold-Bug mystery short story, there's a very badly stereotyped African American servant (possibly enslaved person?) named "Jupiter", who is portrayed as bumbling and not very smart. They likely flipped it to be "Juno" the wife of Jupiter in Roman mythology, and made her storyline of "slavery" being more related to addiction and breaking it. It's also why she's more related to the Goldbug storyline sort of

[@AmandaTheJedi]

Oh interesting I hadn't though about that!

[@suzygirl1843]

@@AmandaTheJedi Victorine is a candidate for Amanda Waller if they 're doing a full reboot. I am a fan now. And Flanagan should consider doing a DC Elseworld's story with Vampire Batman, Kirk Langstrom.

[@billhart3728]

I buy that

[@SamHatter]

Thanks ❤

[@jordinometry1589]

Oooh that’s actually really interesting

[@EyeKahnography]

Felt so bad for Julian. All he did was stay loyal, forgive his BF, lose a cat and wasn't even mad at Leo about it and watches his SO lose his mind and yeet himself at nothingness. While they don't really go back to Julian I do hope his situation improved after this. That's a lot to carry around for anyone.

[@mattlibra3139]

Besides Lenore, Morrie and Juno, Julian is the character I felt the worst for, he was being cheated on by Leo and we can likely assume this behavior wasn’t just spurred but likely happened before. And when expressing concern for his boyfriend doing WAY too many drugs, as he stated “enough to knock me out for two days”, he is met behind his back, with a breakup, being “dead” to him

[@kbrennan3836]

To be fair, though, he got the best outcome of any of the Significant Others, unless you count Camile's assistants.

[@kishwer]

Juno and Julian actually got away with the least damage compared to Alessandra Ruiz and Morella.

[@mjtopping4179]

Don't forget Bill

[@mattlibra3139]

@@mjtopping4179 yea Bill is like actually in terms of suffering next to Julian, COULDNT imagine being forced to be with escorts resembling your partner because your partner can’t form emotional connections

[@vadalia3860]

I like that the camera focusing on the Spider-man poster while Amanda describes the gore of the sex party deaths makes it seem like the camera itself is trying to dissociate as much as the viewer probably wants to.

[@likeatempestinateacup]

Oh 100%. Amanda over here talking about the melting flesh and the camera is having its own little “Hello darkness, my old friend” moment off to the side. “You’ll keep me safe, won’t you, Andrew Garfield?”

[@mirabelarmstrong433]

The actress who played Madeline was so captivating in her delivery of every single line, I must've rewatched the clip of the teaser trailer of her saying "neutralized... like dead" at least 20 times

[@aimeem]

And there's that part where she breaks Verna's neck. Granted it didn't do anything to Verna, but it seems like Madeleine's done that sort of thing before.

[@jdkilpatrick2000]

And I thought that Willa Fitzgerald being cast as the younger Madeline was perfect. She creeped me the the f-ck out with the portrayal of the character’s ruthless psychopathy. 😮😂

[@destro6971]

So say we all!

[@literalham]

​@@destro6971she gave madeline all the hyper-competence of President Roslin with none of the empathy or heart

[@cortneyrobinson1019]

You should see her in Battlestar Galactica. She goes from Secretary of Education (47th in the line of succession) to President after a nuclear apocalypse. Right from the get go of the miniseries, she has huge responsibility thrust on her, and she tackles it head on.

[@ziggystatdust6008]

I know Madeline seems the more sociopathic out of the twins, as she seemingly killed any iota of morality, humanity, and compassion a human can have (cause at least Roderick was grieve-stricken by Lenore’s death), but I think that Roderick is as sociopathic as her, he’s just more subtle at hiding it. When they made the deal with the Raven/Verna, she tells them that all they would have to do is sacrifice their bloodline. Roderick, who already had two living children, did not hesitate to throw them under the bus for wealth because he thought it was far better to die young and rich, than to live old and struggle. It’s along the lines of the reasoning some male narcissistic family annihilators commit their crimes; “It’s better to kill them so that they don’t suffer for my consequences”, instead of what it is, complete selfishness and willingness to sacrifice one’s own blood to achieve your desires. He also knowingly stripped Annabelle of their children, because he knew she was a far better human and parent than he was and he resented her for it, so he pulled them away and corrupted them with money until every essence of good their mother instilled in them was eroded by the greed of wealth. This show, much like Hill House and Bly Manor, show how trauma, generational trauma, can turn people into the absolute worst of mankind

[@santafe6943]

To add a layer of humanity/complexity to her, Madeline explicitly hesitates when she hears Verna's deal! She immediately looks to her brother wide eyed, and only drinks after she sees her brother condemn his own children. Near the end of the series, she also mentions that she got an IUD.

[@amandamarinovich6164]

Agree with both of these. I was thinking, since Rod had 2 kids he would need to be convinced, but nope. He barely even seems conflicted. Maybe he's not convinced it's real? But in the moment they both seem to believe it. Yeah, no excuse Roddy, wrap it up!!

[@J-manli]

@@santafe6943 And that also plays into her background obsession with her AI project.

[@no.6377]

That's why I found Rod so much worse, actually. Madeline made sure she didn't have kids by getting an IUD and didn't have it when they made the deal. Rod doesn't even hesitate to agree and continues on to have kids after. He sets up an actual bounty on one of his kid's heads. He intentionally pits them against each other. This man is textbook narcissist. And Madeline probably realizes this because she knows that the best way to encourage him to keep drinking poison is by calling him a "king".

[@stephengrigg5988]

Yeah, when they do away with the boss I thought they were showing his nice innocent side was a facade. I dont think she corrupted him, I think they always worked in tandem

[@r0bnva]

"I DON'T GIVE A SHIT BETHHHHHH" is comedic gold i love kate siegel so much 💀

[@Evija3000]

For such a dark show there was a lot of comedy there.

[@Sofia-airsignrights]

who else could deliver "dripping birkin bag full of monkey bits" as well as kate did

[@jdkilpatrick2000]

I literally laugh out loud every time I see that scene (I tend to rewatch things I love a crazy number of times), or even just think of it. 😂 💀 Brilliant delivery by Kate.

[@AW-xc1xc]

@@Sofia-airsignrightsThere's a tongue twister if I've ever seen one

[@salyx]

She was SO FUNNY.

[@toniviskari417]

There was something utterly brilliant in how badly the kids were screwed over by Roderick. They died because of a deal with the devil he made without hesitation while already being a father of two. But because that wasn't enough, they all died horrible deaths because of how deeply Roderick broke them.

[@aroseinwinter7719]

Why spoil it for us?

[@toniviskari417]

@@aroseinwinter7719 I'm pretty torn here. On one hand, I am genuinely sorry if spoiled things for you. Not the intent. On the other hand, this is the comment section for a video that discusses the plot of this show in detail. So I guess my counter-question would be why are you going through the comments here if you want to avoid spoilers for this show?

[@rayay248]

@@toniviskari417 some people just like being mad

[@notamberp]

⁠@@aroseinwinter7719it’s kinda common sense to expect spoilers in the comments, especially if there were spoilers in the video lol. but that aside, why would you read past “they died because” ??? like don’t blame someone for your own negligence

[@Obsidian_Enigma]

@@aroseinwinter7719the video has spoilers in it. If you didn’t want to be spoiled you shouldn’t have watched the video let alone checked the comments section

[@evanrachelhood]

The scene where Rodrick finds Ali’s body…omg. T’Nia Miller gave one of the most chilling performances I’ve ever seen. Every time I think i’ve grasped the scope of her talent, she finds new ways to surprise me.

[@cariwhyte]

yess omg

[@FairyBogFather]

She is incredible. The gravitas she possesses makes it impossible to focus on anyone besides her whenever she's onscreen!

[@SmartStart24]

She freaked me out through the screen 😬 such a good actor, they all are!

[@AW-uv3cb]

@@SmartStart24 True! I also loved seeing Rahul Kohli get a chance to play an unpleasant character, loved his characters in Bly Manor and Midnight Mass.

[@lacountess]

I agree. I kept thinking, oh my God, give this woman an Emmy right now.

[@emmittnervend2918]

I loved how every time Roderick tries to gas himself up give himself a pat on the back for leading a life of selfishness and causing harm to millions, his family, and to Auggie included. Verna came in and shut that shit down by constantly showing him images that fucked with his mind and conscience, and I absolutely loved it

[@tierrabutler3577]

I like to think that his children spirits who have spent their whole life trying to please and any hostility they had about their father it came out in self sabotaging and came out against each others it was so nice to see them finally hold him accountable after he literally fucked them over in every way possible

[@Mario_Angel_Medina]

My favorite is when Roderick says to Auguste "you can't see them but Freddy will appear all messed-up at any moment and try to scare me" but instead Fredderick appears as a child alongside Annabelle, they have a little tender moment *and then he falls apart in half* ... I mean, damn that was a low punch!

[@cheriremily9360]

@@Mario_Angel_Medina Roderick did that to Freddy at that age. His child was that age when he made the deal with Verna. He deserves to see what fate he created for his child. He could have handled the horror of adult Freddy showing up as a junkie corpse cut in half, but not to see his toddler fall apart in his arms. He deserved that horror.

[@plaster.art.ho3]

it was more impactful becuz children r innocent n he made a deal w the devil in exchange for his loved ones @@Mario_Angel_Medina

[@tearay1073]

I always thought the visions were random, I didn't know they happened when Roderick was gassing himself up

[@SVK91]

To me it was a heartwarming fairy tale about nasty rich people getting the fate they deserve. Loved it.

[@LordJen]

Besides Lenore lol. But even her story was heart warming

[@riakun]

@LordJen it goes to show that mistakes made by parents, grandparents, etc. really can have far reaching consequences for the later generations. But I completely agree. Her death was sad but very heartwarming

[@SVK91]

@@riakun Very true. Her grandpa didn't even have a thought for the countless victims of his magic pills... even less so for the later generations of his own immediate family. It's some really good character writing

[@mariatourino9545]

What a true fairytale should be

[@RamonaGelosi]

SAME

[@briancarter6953]

Something about "The Tell-Tale Heart" still sits with me. Like, horror that deals with forgetting past terrible actions, but the guilt appears in a haunting way leading to the shocking truth, just freaks me out. Al deserved so much better.

[@SingingSealRiana]

in the original story, the interesting thing is, that the murderer is not in any way conciously aware he did anything wrong, he can perfectly justify it to himself but it is his subconciousness that betrays him, that dissonance always stuck with me . . . and yes, al deserved so much better . . . . the reuse of actors flanagan practises really messes with me too . . . remembering dear hannah and then seeing vic

[@Boorosan]

Wouldn't Al be wrong too? She did do countless surgery on the chrimps.

[@angrynerdgirl]

​@@BoorosanTo a certain extent, yeah. I mean, she was at least a better scientist (refusing to falsify data, getting really upset when Vic messed with the variables, etc.). My partner is in genetics, though, and said they had no reason to test on chimps, apart from tying it to the Poe story. Apparently most heart treatment testing is done on pigs (which I still find very sad).

[@Shirafune161]

​@@angrynerdgirl and she seemed to genuinely try do good with her research, hence being way more chill with setbacks and not getting to human trials with a clearly unfinished product. Not saying Al was an angel, she didn't really question the shady shit the Ushers were involved in until they put her in danger, but she was a far cry from the greedy monsters that were the Ushers.

[@ZubatTheDubat]

@@Shirafune161 But Al was still knowingly using the nightshade on the chimps and willingly performing open heart surgery on conscious animals, and she never once expressed guilt over it. She seemed more bothered about damaging her name and her standing in the scientific community rather than what they did was objectively evil. Even with the human trials, she seemed more pissed off that Vic had forged her signature and not that they were endangering a woman's life with a product that didn't work.

[@Moriah.Jae__]

The fact that the show opens with the song “Another Brick in the Wall” gives me slight chills

[@justlive2809]

ooooh right i didn't even connect it that's good

[@Cobalt360Degrees]

I really, really, _really_ hope any of the Sackler family watches this show and knows that a not insignificant amount of people think they deserve similar fates.

[@squamish4244]

Those pieces of shit were also partly responsible for the benzodiazepine epidemic too, which has caused a similar amount of destruction. Including to myself. Horrifying people, especially the two founding brothers, who are unfortunately no longer with us to see this.

[@mwoods4608]

They seem obviously to anything outside of their own wealth. I think they should have watched Dopesick & Painkiller, but I have a feeling they barely watch TV if they do its probably old Westerns or Matlock episodes.

[@AW-xc1xc]

I have a feeling they would watch the show and cheer on for the Usher's deaths, not thinking it's really based on them

[@cheriremily9360]

The Musk family, the DeVos family, the Koch brothers - all of them.

[@LARA-sg4bt]

I hope that too but I really do hope that people also accept that it takes two to tango, madeleine was kind of right in that speech. Take Amazon for example, we all hate how they treat their employees and their business practices yet we all still buy from Amazon, directly giving them power. I really don’t want people to do the same mistake they’ve done since millennia, which is to put all the blame on someone else rather than take a look at themselves.

[@roystonng8642]

One of my favourite things about the way Madeline Usher died was that she was poisoned by Roderick with a glass of wine, just like how they poisoned Griswold. In the end, she also didn't know shit about wine. Madeline strutted about like she knew everything, like her power was earned by the merit of her own hard work and her knowledge of how the world worked, but in the end she didn't know shit. And that was her downfall, her fate held by a powerful man and killing him in frustration just like her mother had done.

[@llamabean529]

I think she made a powerful man but never actually realised it, she kinda fulfilled her worst nightmare.

[@PhDFl0pp]

I remember seeing Carla Gugino in Spy Kids and she hasn’t aged a day, she’s so gorgeous and talented

[@emmmahezw]

I just said that to my mom! She hates horror and literally never watched anything that scares her, but she got stuck on the gorgeous colors in the second episode of FotHoU and was hooked. We binged it and now she wants to watch all of his works! Probably won’t show her Oculus, though

[@Musicanimedork01]

YESSS she's so gorgeous

[@ItsQuinntessential]

She has aged since then, and it's not an insult or a bad thing for a human to age. She's absolutely stunning.

[@Evija3000]

@@ItsQuinntessential Yeah, she does look older, but not by much.

[@squamish4244]

@@ItsQuinntessential People throw that term around a lot just to mean someone is still very attractive. Literally hasn't aged would mean she's literally Verna lol.

[@nour.darling]

As a biiig Poe fan, and especially the Masque of the Red Death story, I love that they had every death be in one of the colors of Prospero’s masquerade rooms

[@Sishel]

Oh wow! Good catch!

[@overwhelmed_cactus6820]

Omg that’s awesome I didn’t catch that

[@cronchycatmom]

That's it!! Omg I was trying to figure out the colors, they were sooo close to a rainbow and it bothered me to heck. It's been ages since I've read masque and didn't consider the rooms of color

[@sugabud]

Flanagan is simply a genius. Everything he creates is so moving and magnificently done, it’s almost as if he’s made his own genre…horror with heart. The cast are brilliant too. Carla always brings it and gosh her performance is something else in this!

[@c.w.8200]

Can't agree more, he's unique, someone who makes great shows for the grown up horror fan in a sea of half baked trash. As a catholic from a country that doesn't celebrate Halloween I've started to call them All Hallows shows, we go to the graves and remember family members. With all the horror elements the Flanagan shows deliver something that completely fits this holiday for me, a reminder that life is fleeting and to keep loved ones close as long as we can.

[@eighthdoctor]

Carla was fantastic in this as always. I'm so glad she's getting such great roles in Mike Flanagan's series & films; she's so underrated. 💜💜💜

[@Jeffeffina]

Ah, Gothic horror is the genre 😉😁 it's always the horror is tied to the tragedy rather than just goop n gore.

[@vandanacasm]

Horror with heart ❤....wow

[@sarahj6995]

You are absolutely right. I wept at Lenore's death, pretty much the whole last episode. His dialogue is just poetry.

[@Shackbanshee]

I'm just so blown away by how the show was a contemporary anthology of Poe and was so respectful and delightful to the source materials.

[@emilybroderick2421]

I love Flanagan's entire catalog to absolute pieces. He is my favorite creative working in horror currently, and I'm honestly thrilled that he's not stuck to Netflix anymore. This was a great show to finish his contract on!

[@mikester4896]

I am starting to feel that he should be up there with Wes Craven and John Carpenter as a horror icon. Perhaps he needs that one genre defining film to cement that position.

[@nikoblack1272]

he's quickly become my favorite filmmaker; Hush is one of my favorite horror movies and one of the few that actually scares me -

[@juliawidmaier5334]

I think the Usher children were each so broken and so fascinating and their undoing was riveting and unique for each one. Victorine, Camille, and Tammy were my favorites. Vic was a dreadful person because of her work but she put on such an air of moral and intellectual superiority, you almost root for her, but her ending was richly deserved. Also the fact Camille hated her made so much sense, because Vic looks smart, sophisticated, and above all the grime, but she is up to her eyes in mud while Camille can't hide her shady nature and empty life.

[@sathrielsatanson666]

What was fasxinating about them being one note sinners who are just their to die for audience amusement? They were not charactera but mpnsyrous carricatures.

[@spatchmo6938]

@@sathrielsatanson666 I dunno, I didn't think they were mpnsyrous at all

[@calamitysangfroid2407]

@@spatchmo6938 i think they were mpnsyrous but very grounded and human mpnsyrs. mpnsyrs that we can recognise not in ourselves, but definitely in our current society. you'd have to live under a rock or be one of those mpnsyrous narssicysts similar to the ushers to deny that.

[@alicethemad1613]

This comment thread is killing me oh my god

[@CatChaos369]

It’s kinda fucked up but I found Tammys death quite beautiful if she’d just stopped and listened to Verna apologised to her husband and later down it would have been peaceful but she couldn’t let go of her anger she needed to lash out I thought she’d finally realised her own poor action when she says “I fucked it all up” but really she meant the launch poor Bill what she said and did was awful

[@bexthewerewolf1443]

I don't think Tammy actually showed her sex tape in Goldbug. No one else is reacting to the video only her, so I think it was another hallucination. That being said I loved the series and your video was well done and thought out. Who cares if Spider-Man stole the show for a minute!

[@UmbraMilla]

Having been an avid Poe reader back in high school, I was already spoiled on how some of the stories would end, but some of their endings completely blindsided me. Rue Morgue and the Black Cat especially threw me for a loop.

[@RedSpade37]

There's dozens of us!

[@kaladongstormguy]

Same! I was really worried for Napoleon's boyfriend since the narrator's wife is murdered in the Black Cat. I was so happy that he survived, haha.

[@c.w.8200]

For me it's a while ago that I read these stories so I was happy when I got the references and eventually realized what it's based on, a good opportunity to reread Poe and rewatch afterwards.

[@haroldwhite5761]

Didn't expect the main evil to be written out of the story. Was holding my breath the whole series waiting for the Big Reveal that never happened:(

[@ma_alva]

Same! I read The Black Cat for the first time when I was around 10, and I loved it and was traumatized by it at the same time. Add to that the fact that I now have a black cat with one creepy milky eye (snake bite years ago), I was nervous about that episode. Long live Pluto! 🐈

[@abbywolffe4114]

I don't know if the Raven explicitly says this but ravens also symbolize the bridge between life and death. I feel like she isn’t exactly Death, because Death doesn't bargain. She doesn't just show up when the Ushers die, she offers them choices or tells them what could have been different. I think she's more like Consequence itself, an embodiment of the choices you make on the brink of death that either steer you away from it or, in the case of the Ushers, right towards it. Yes, she kills Lenore, but she still talks about Lenore's choice and the impact it has, and her death is a consequence for Roderick's choices. Side note: Since there's a recurring theme of wives/girlfriends being collateral damage in this show, especially in contrast to Madeline's belief that to never be controlled by a man is to be immortal, I really wish they'd used the story of Ligeia and Rowena

[@kishwer]

Ligeia got turned to Ligodone instead.

[@riakun]

This is exactly what I thought she was as well; the embodiment of Consequence itself. My friend thought she was the embodiment of Inevitability, and a few people I’ve talked to thought she was death, or the devil, but Consequence is what felt most right to me.

[@32fps]

​@@riakun I personally went with fate. Not the (Greek?) version where you can't change your fate, but fate in the sense of "you create your own fate by the choices you make." Since she was constantly giving people choices and not directly killing them I never saw her as death, but rather the embodiment of the inevitable consequences of your actions. But by the end I honestly just thought of her as like an elder god or something, lol. She's basically a crossroads demon but the way she talks/is fascinated by humanity gives off a more omnipotent being vibe.

[@katherinealvarez9216]

On one hand, I want to know what Verna is but on the other hand, maybe I shouldn't? And let's appreciate that Dupin got to walk away and go home to his family? Juno managed to be free and started an organization dedicated to helping people struggling with addiction? And Morrie starting the Lenore Foundation?

[@AmandaTheJedi]

yes so many positives!

[@Amateracu1991DFFOO]

Verna was the personification of death. At the beginning I thought she was a "crossroads demon" but she wasn't actually evil, she was a neutral party, sort of. I'm pretty convinced she was death

[@katherinealvarez9216]

@@Amateracu1991DFFOO I was thinking that too, especially her "going topside" but there's more to it. Or maybe she's closer to Hades? He was the god of the underworld and riches, I think?

[@troycossar6671]

@@Amateracu1991DFFOO the actor who played her revealed in a KZbin vid she wasn’t death, that she was closer to “fate” or just plain and simple: the consequence of our own actions.

[@kartkaesque]

​@@troycossar6671I thought she was Karma with some magical powers until she killed Lenore She had to do it even tho she didn't want to So maybe she has to answer to someone above her

[@thereaIitsybitsyspider]

Tammy was killed by the bad feng shui of having mirrors pointed at her bed.

[@CreativeUsernameEh]

And now we know!!

[@itscthuwu5125]

She had so many mirrors, because she loved to watch.

[@bluecat3338]

This comment was brought to you by the Dear Modern channel and the feng shut guy.

[@monroeriddell5822]

Forget her smashing the ceiling mirror with the fire poker! I'm pretty sure she still would have died if an earthquake hit and it shattered while she was sleeping, which honestly, would be a bit more horrifying.

[@cainyourkids]

@@monroeriddell5822 100% exactly - everytime I see photos of those hotels with mirrors for ceilings (obviously to satiate some sexual kink of the guest), I keep on thinking about an earthquake hitting and me waking up to see a huge chunk of glass decapitating my head. It's literally a Final Destination-worthy room in the making.

[@AngelofGrace96]

I adore the fact that the raven gave the twins the pact all the way back at the beginning, and then gave all of the children choices before their deaths too. And then gave Lenore, the only innocent, the only gentle death. She feels like a real representation of Death, both cruel and kind.

[@theboringkaren]

I finally caught on in episode 9 that Roderick was talking about Lenore in the past tense so her death gutted me. I was naively hopeful that she'd get to live after saving her mother. I really loved this series and each one Mike Flanagan does is has its own uniqueness that I can't compare them.

[@kronk2.094]

Lenore deserved better. Lenore deserved SO much better. 😭

[@Evija3000]

@@kronk2.094 She was the true cost of the deal. Everyone else kind of deserved it. Everyone else were reflections of Roderick, inhibiting his negative attributes, making destructive choices, and paying the same price as he did. She was the one true innocent, more like Anabel than Roderick. Both suffering purely for his choices not their own. Plus she's the only one who didn't even reach adulthood.

[@kronk2.094]

@@Evija3000 I absolutely agree, it just... doesn't make me feel any better... 😭😭😭

[@SmartStart24]

Lenore was so sweet and darling, I nearly cried at her death scene 😭 both actresses did wonderfully in that scene.

[@ACinemafanatic]

And her death was the only one that made Roderick emotional. But I love how when Verna places the feather on Lenore’s tombstone she delicately placed it with such affection.

[@juliawidmaier5334]

Also, the orgy death scene was incredibly horrific and gosh I felt the pain of those poor guests. Honestly i cringed when Pym went in there because as an EHS professional there's NO WAY he'd be allowed in there without a full hazmat suit and without them knowing exactly what the fluid is and whether even inhaling the air in that room would be toxic to him, they'd need the okay from an industrial hygienist. So when he just waltzed in there and started touching everything i was like "oh no honey what is you doing?" 😅

[@shaycat13]

I thought it added to Pyms character since he didn't even flinch entering in. Like at first how it made us think Pym was just called the reaper because of lawyer related things. (But seriously no PPE besides the gloves 😭)

[@bluegreen5377]

I thought it made perfect sense that they'd let him in. Combine Ushers being powerful as fuck with part of the deal being Ushers were undefeatable until Rodrick's fall and it tracks that Arthur would be allowed to do whatever he wanted, especially when it came to cases concerning Ushers.

[@tobiasnotforge]

I always interpreted the chimp scene as being originally intended for Vic as the first thing Verna says to Camille is "you're not supposed to be here." Plus, you're right, that death scene is much more suited to Vic and what she was guilty of at that point and didn't really make sense for Camille at all

[@bapsbaby6441]

I had the same thought when I saw it on Netflix and saw the word Usher, I was like “oh Usher in this?”

[@bonniehite]

I was just not gonna watch it bc im not a big usher fan, but then i saw the trailer and i was SO CONFUSED. Show was great tho

[@aleisterlilywhite1109]

*crying in goth*

[@Aelffwynn]

When my friend told me about it, my first thought was, "What are his confessions this time?"

[@mattybrunolucaszeneresalas9072]

Interestingly, I never thought of that

[@rebeccablackburn9487]

Really?!! Am I the only person who has heard of the book "The fall of the house of usher"? SMH😮

[@toniviskari417]

As great of an actor Frank Langella, who was initially cast as Roderick, is, I just can't see this show working as well with him as it did with Bruce Greenwood. His take on Roderick was not only brilliant, but it made the character grounded and believable in a way that made everything work. Not only that, he also managed to convey all those traits that his children tried unsuccessfully emulate. Apologies on my praise here, but I just loved his performance so much as he never was lost within the show and was clearly the central character while also never overshadowing the other characters. I'll stop here before writing multiple more paragraphs of praise for him.

[@parisianham9251]

I thought this too, I think Bruce Greenwood was the perfect Roderick Usher for a modern setting like this, whereas Langella would have been a better choice had they kept the gothic 1800s vibe of Poe's work and ethos

[@mad8598]

It explains why young Roderick looks nothing like old Roderick when Flanagan shows are usually so good at this. I had to actually explain the recasting to someone when they complained about how they look NOTHING alike, lol.

[@kaliontherocks]

He's my 2nd favourite character of all Flanagan's filmography (Nellie & Luke Crain - indivisible for me - have no competition). Outstanding actor, outstanding performance. And what a voice.

[@ayannabranchcomb7535]

@@kaliontherocksomg yes his voice is soooo captivating, you can see how he’s been able to be such a great businessman with that voice alone

[@AmandaTheJedi]

Bruce was perfect in this role, he nailed every aspect of the character.

[@VeWatchesVideos]

What I found so fascinating is that The Fall of the House of Usher initially seems like a typical Deal with the Devil type of story. But this is actually one of the few stories of that kind where the person making the deal is arguably more evil than the supernatural entity offering it. Notably, Verna is not a demon, as she seems to be impressed to great acts of evil and of goodness. She seems to be more of a Chaotic Neutral force like The Outsider in Dishonored: fascinated with humanity and granting them power to see what they'll do with it. But at no point did she force the Usher siblings into the deal and at no point did she ever try to trick them. There were no loopholes, Exact Words or fine print. She offered them something and told them what the cost would be. Nor were they ever forced to use what they got for evil purposes. But they did anyway...and still balked when it was time to pay the piper.

[@unrulycrow6299]

Your comparison to the Outsider is so on point. Both him and Verna express disappointment when people don't follow through with decent choices - his disdain towards Daud is quite similar to Verna's chat with Fred as he is about to die, but he shows much more appreciation when Corvo is played in the no-kill style, just like Verna being so sorry about Lenore's fate when she was innocent and trying to make wrongs right again.

[@anarghyakattur73]

😮o 😮 o😊

[@gabby3036]

Your allusion to The Outsider and description reminds me of Death Note and Ryuk. He just tosses the Death Note out there and waits for someone to pick it up - he doesn't influence Light's decisions, he just tells him (most of) the rules and that he won't go to Heaven or Hell if he uses the book. (I actually can't remember if he tells Light that fact before or after he's already written a name in the book, though.) In Ryuk's case, he just wanted to see what would happen because he was bored; I'm not sure we can infer Verna's motivation for offering the deal to the twins in the first place - I haven't watched the show so maybe it's in there somewhere - but unlike Ryuk, she does seem to have some compassion and empathy, as we see with Lenore.

[@sinswept]

Absolutely loved this series. One of my favourite references in it was the “When life gives you lemons” bit which I think very cleverly referenced the manipulation of the value of diamonds. I also really liked the attention to detail with the Lenore AI not having perfect spelling. It repeats the word, in all caps, and sometimes misses out letters. I think it gives it a slightly frantic, panicked energy.

[@Fickji]

It would be absolutely hilarious to me if the reason the Ai was so messed up was because the 1000 questions Madeline gave to Lenore to answer for the program was just Lenore answering Nevermore to all the questions. And Madeline never bothered checking.

[@fernandarubio5343]

@@Fickjilol I know. But wasn’t “nevermore” the word that Madeleine kept repeating while suffocating Roderick?

[@sarasunshinemt4444]

He had my second favorite lemon rant; the first being the one from the Portal video game by J.K. Simmons

[@luiscalzoncit2820]

I loved the technical and creative aspect of the show. The score was incredible and the whole visuals. This is a weird thing to enjoy but I loved how each of the children had a signature color that dominated their surroundings and the lighting at the moment of their deaths. Perry- The red lights on the club while the acid dropped. Camille- The lab's bright white light before the chimpanzee attacked her. Leo- Yellow lights from the outside while destroying his apartment and before he fell Victorine- Orange lights all around when the reveal of the noise was made. Tammy- The green reflections on the mirrors and during that awesome Matrix-like sequence. Frederick- The blue light shiwing his face while the pendulum descended. It was so teathrical and visually satisfiying for me. Almost like a spotlight: Here, this is your moment. Your time has come. And the Lenore was so peaceful and subdued. Also, what happened to my man Bill-T? He was so nice and loving I wanted to know what became of him. But I'm sure he will be fine with his 10 million followers.

[@PanicMerchant]

Which might come back to the The Masque of the Red Death, the abbey they lock themselves away in has 7 coloured rooms. And all those people thought they could be indifferent to the suffering of the outside world because their wealth put them above it all, much like the Usher family.

[@kp7032]

The score is available to buy. It’s still hauntingly beautiful to listen to on its own

[@AW-xc1xc]

@@PanicMerchantEvery time I think the show can't be more detailed, it proves me wrong

[@1st_party]

Anyone else noticed that Madeline dressed as daisy during the new year party in 1979 , but she’s also dressed like Mimi from haunting of hill house. Which connects to the thing with the wall from both stories. And the addition of “you are so small” also connects both walls.

[@SmallMediumToebeans]

Poppy? Also played by the same actor as Annabelle Lee.

[@Zarsla]

Tamerlane death was referenced by Bill T Wilson, as he's named after William Willison where the main character sees he's doppelganger, and he dies when chaser after his double, and tries to attacking them, an technical hit a mirror, and he dies. Also Roderick & Madeline deaths more or less matched what happened in the short story.

[@kazzikame]

Add to that how the Raven is whispering to Tammy in the lead up to her death, just like the doppelganger whispers in the original story. :)

[@Sharpe1502]

It’s the second series where T’Nia Miller had the best episode. Can she PLEASE get more roles? She’s utterly amazing. I loved the scene between her and Bruce Greenwood. That reveal scene was so tense.

[@shelfraawoods1785]

😊 The back and forth. They way they interacted. The way she trailed off while his heart started to break. It was perfection.

[@robbiepluta1358]

If you’re never seen “Years and Years” it’s a show made by Russell T Davies (lead writer for Doctor Who and Its a Sin). She is fantastic in that too.

[@queenoffabulous2156]

If you're in the Flanaganverse I think you're basically booked and busy for as long as he creates movies and tv shows

[@juliawidmaier5334]

Just had to come here to talk about my feelings for this show. What a beautiful, funny, tragic tale. I think the sibling that made me the most sad was Tamerlane (Tammy). She seemed the most emotionally stunted in her relationships because of her upbringing, and the one most influenced by Madeline. The fact she needed a surrogate to act out a loving, intimate relationship because she couldn't bear the vulnerability of real love was so heartbreaking. When Bill asked her to take a break if not for herself then for him and she said "For you?" so incredulously really made me sad because she cannot tolerate a relationship where someone else's emotional needs matter as much as hers, because you can't control other people's emotionals, not truly, and an authentic relationship requires you to let go of control. Even during the roleplays it's always her determining the scenarios and making Bill act out asking her how shes doing, praising her, servicing her. Bill practically melts when Verna (roleplaying as Tammy) asks him how his day was. And when she finally admits she actually needs love and support, it's too late, she's already thrown it away for the appearance of control. What also made it sinister was the fact she knew her husband was uncomfortable with the sex workers (you can see her ask him to act more enthusiastic about it), and still insisted upon it. Very sad.

[@_Morri_]

I think you really nailed that description!

[@LRCh_]

Like the 5 kids in Hill House represented the 5 stages of grief, the 7 Usher descendants match the 7 deadly sins. Prospero = Lust, Camille = Envy (of Vic), Napoleon = Gluttony, Vic = Pride, Tamerlane = Sloth ("outsourcing intimacy"), Frederick = Wrath, Lenore = Greed (Roderick's, the ultimate cost)

[@c.w.8200]

Great observation!

[@audiochicky]

I would agree, except switch Camille and Tamerlane. I think Tamerlane was envious of Frederick being the eldest and first in line to inherit the helm of Fortunado. I think Camille was Sloth, in that her assistants did all of her work for her.

[@LRCh_]

@@audiochicky Tamerlane was hard, but Camille's obsession with Vic being the better liked when they're the same kind of internally toxic was what sparked the 7 sins idea for me. I also tie Tammy to sloth for the sleep issues; she's getting out of major situations by passing out.

[@caitlinkelly1791]

I think it's more like... Perry - Lust Camille - Envy Leo - Wrath Vic - Sloth Tammy - Pride Freddy - Gluttony Roderick - Greed Perry is obviously lust. His whole gimmick is sexual desires. His death was in his sex club. Camille was jealous of Vic. Which caused her to to go to Rue Morgue which caused her death. Leo had so much anger for the cat. He destroyed his apartment out of rage just to try and get the cat. And in the end. His anger would be his downfall. He let the wrath overcome him to the point that his common sense was gone and he charged at the cat on the terrace which lead to his downfall. (Figuratively and literally.) Vic was procrastinating telling her partner about the test subject. Yes, we all know why. It was because she KNEW how it would play out. She KNEW her partner would not be about it. But she STILL procrastinated in telling her. Procrastination can be seen as lazy. Because the outcome was always going to be the same. She also played music to avoid the sound of the heart machine. Avoiding certain aspects of your life can also be seen as lazy. Tammy was very prideful of her image. As well as her family name. I would say she falls under Vanity. Which isn't one of the sins. But vanity itself would fall under pride. And her house is covered in so many mirrors. She is a very vain person. And her downfall was shattering the mirrors (her pride) all around her. Freddy is gluttony. He consumed the family fortune his whole life. And then towards the end. He consumed too much of an illegal substance. And in the end, he was consuming the substance that made his body go numb. (I know it was the nightshade but he wasn't aware of that.) Which lead to his downfall. Roderick is absolutely greed. He was willing to sacrifice his literal family to achieve his power.

[@eniolaidris5533]

​@@caitlinkelly1791I Kinda disagree with Freddie being gluttony and Leo being wrath. Because For Leo he was the druggie of the family even before Verna and what says gluttony more than an addiction... also if you're going to use his final scene where he goes crazy trying kill the cat then what about Tamerlane seeing visions of Verna and it driving her insane and she smashes every mirror in her house or her freakout at Goldbug launch? Freddie on the hand I believe was shown to have anger issues prior to being manipulated by Verna like when he pushed Prospero against the wall to yell at him.. I think it's the drugs that just amplified that hidden anger in him... Unlike Leon who's addiction led him to that death for Freddie it was his anger towards his wife that made him die that way

[@Painocus]

A few notes: Tammy's story is mainly based on a third Poe source: William Wilson. The "clue" was in Bill-T's real name, mentioned at some point, Bill Wilson. To be fair to Perry; those were water tanks, Rodrick mentions later that they had secretly swapped the water out with the chemical waste to temporarily hide it. Still stupid to not check it first, but not that stupid. Leo did also care about and mourn Perry as well. I personally think Vic's, in her delirious state, immidiate response being to try to do the heart experiment on herself implies she did actually belive it would work and/or actually wanted to help people (tho in a "ends justifies the means" way). I don't think Verna made her stab herself since she mentioned later that Freddy was the most directly she had cause any of the kids' deaths so far. In addition to Toby probably being a referrence to Never Bet the Devil Your Head, I think him and Tina might be a lose referrence to Hop-Frog. A story about two jesters of an abusive king, who give them mocking names because he finds it funny, who then fall in love and get revenge on the king before escaping. Now they don't kill Camille, but them standing up to her is what makes her go to RUE herself, and both their deaths involved apes (tho in very different ways), and they were also instrumental in bringing down Fortunato after the fact. Tina's real name being Beth could also be a referrence to Elizabeth E. Ellet, who started a scandal around Poe that Hop-Frog is often interpreted as being based on.

[@AmandaTheJedi]

yeah but if Perry had paid attention like he was supposed to he'd know that those tanks didn't have water in them. yeah I meant to clarify that Leo cared about Perry, but overall no one was super affected by his death. Like he cared way more about Camille.

[@thesniler]

Yes thank you! William Wilson was always my favorite Poe story, but I guess it's one of the more obscure ones because no one seems to talk about it, even when discussing this show. Everybody go read William Wilson

[@tuckershuff1441]

Midnight Mass is still my favorite of Flanagan's, but I still really enjoyed this as his answer to the 'eat the rich' trend, even though it was a bit repetitive at times. Loved Willa and Zac as the young Ushers, and Henry Thomas made such a great creep.

[@larsawy9]

MM is my favorite as well… This is coming in close. I need to watch the Haunting’s again to really decide but I thought Usher was so satisfying for so many reasons!

[@robbiegeegee]

I think way too many people sleep on Midnight Mass. I've watched both haunting series twice, but MM I've watched through at least 4 times, maybe 5. For me Usher was the least favorite of the 4, but still a great series and worth giving another watch.

[@revinaque1342]

​@@robbiegeegeeSame! Though in terms of favorites, it's a toss up between Midnight Mass and The Haunting of Bly Manor for me. Both series just have so much heart to them

[@dramamole]

MM is my favorite but I've only managed to watch it through once because it REALLY messed with me. Hill House is a VERY close second I think it's a masterpiece. And Usher is now 3rd for me. I will say I think this was my favorite performance from Henry Thomas because it was such a different character for him, and he played it so well.

[@tuckershuff1441]

@@dramamole If you watch Gerald's Game you'll see him in a similar, but less fun evil role.

[@nortys7753]

One theory about Verna (not mine, I saw it under another video) : She is The Morrigan, a celtic goddess or war and fate. They are a lot of valid points to that theory : -She's a goddess of fate, influencing it for certain people, in a good or in a grimm way, and in this case, she would be present to actively bend fate itself - She would encourage men to do horrible things according to some myths, and sometimes on the contrary she would try to influence them to avoid wars. In fact, because she has so many different faces she is considered to be 3 goddesses, and in the show, Verna is making a fun commentary about Madeline, seing her 3 possibilities back to back. -The Morrigan symbol is a raven. -She alluding to be older than christianity I think, and not after souls, so I don't believe she's part of christian mythology (demon or devil). There. Like I said, it's not my theory, and I apologize for the bad english, and to any celtic mythology afficionados, as I'm not familiar with that mythology at all.

[@Ashbrash1998]

Honestly Verna can be SO many things, whether its abstract or a deity. In a weird way she can basically represent of all of them

[@angrynerdgirl]

Ohhh I really dig this theory!

[@yaelkellman9686]

My theory about Verna: Ep.6 Pym found an island at the top of the world called Ultima Thule - "the realm of beings who lived beneath us, out of time, and out of space".

[@spatchmo6938]

Of course this isn't the case, but it almost feels like it could be a sequel to Luca Guadagnino's Suspiria, with Verna being Mater Tenebrarum. In Argento's original Three Mothers trilogy, Mater Suspiriorum, Mater Lachrymarum, and Mater Tenebrarum are just three different aspects of the singular death

[@nikoblack1272]

if not THE Morrigan then something very similar, i agree ; she comes from some kind of underground type place and sometimes Irish fairies are described as living underground and/or far from human civilizations -

[@chamber4]

This was the Flanagan show that came close to eclipsing my love for The Haunting of Hill House. Every single reference in this show was so delightfully crafted, every fate coincides with their episode or namesake. The intertwining of each story is phenomenal as well as the translation of the themes of the ordinal works to each character was amazing. Mary McDonnell and Willa Fitzgerald really gave some of the most amazing performances, where the character of Madeline Usher stole the show from watching the entire arc play out. Kate Siegel needs to stop being so compelling, because even if she wasn't suppose to be Camille ended up being my favorite of the Usher kids. I really really recommend this show whether you are fan of Poe, or if you want to watch what would happen if Succession had punishments for its characters

[@sdrawkcabemdaer5]

I was sad that Camille's death came second because I wanted way more of Kate Siegel in this series! It almost felt like a waste to lose her so soon. And the actress who played the younger Madeline did such a fantastic job of mirroring Mary McDonnell's speech patterns, especially in the monologue when she's telling Roderick that he has to suck up to Gris to earn his trust. She has the same tone and cadence, it truly felt like the same person across time periods.

[@no.6377]

The heart stab did seem a little easy in comparison, but then when you think about it. This woman's mind has been eroding over, what, a week? She's convinced that her mangled corpse of a wife is just ignoring her -- that level of psychosis is so terrifying it's like a slow drawn out torture.

[@unrulycrow6299]

Agreed, Vic's fate is mostly psychological horror imo

[@otter.mayhem]

Edgar Allen Poe was the first horror to really disturb me. I was a sheltered homeschooler in high school when I took an american lit class at the community college for dual credit. I procrastinated the Poe assignment and was cramming the night before class and I read Fall of the House of Usher and The Premature Burial at like 2am. Didn't sleep the whole night and went into my class at 9am like a damn zombie. The class loved it haha. At the time I was a little traumatized from being so sheltered, but Poe (and later Stepehen King's short stories) helped me learn that I can engage with fear in a safe and even fun way. I'm still really sensitive though, definitely couldn't stomach the show lmfao I loved this video, thanks for covering this stuff for horror-curious squeamish people like me!!!

[@alexalytraa2714]

Mike Flanagan said something along the lines of “Horror is a small excercise in courage” very similar to what you said at the end of your comment 👍

[@otter.mayhem]

@@alexalytraa2714 I love that, I'd never heard it before! I have a nice little handful of anxiety disorders, and I legit started getting into the horror genre as a way to practice facing some of my irrational fears and being braver. I used to think if I watched scary things, it'd make me more scared, but it's actually the opposite. Of course I can't just jump into the deep end, and I'll never watch something like Saw, but I definitely think Mr. Flanagan is right!

[@Evija3000]

@@otter.mayhem I like certain horror, like the type that's related to mystery, but saw is just disgusting. I've seen a few scenes and I'm never watching that.

[@gloria7190]

@@otter.mayhem this topic interests me because I suffer from terrible nightmares and night terrors and I’m always scared if I watch horrors it will trigger my dreadful brain. But instead, I noticed that perhaps when I watch this type of horrors the nightmares tend to be a little more tamed and there’s never a correlation to the content of the movie inside the nightmare itself. It’s really interesting

[@LRCh_]

Holy hell, the visiting of past sins onto the innocent bystanders of the present!!! The forged signatures on important medical work, the "full service" assistants, the spousal back stabbing. Utterly poetic.

[@clarahesse3970]

I know you they didn’t actually show anything when the chimp ripped someone apart, but dear god the build up nearly made me hurt😭 Why spiders get such a bad rep when chimps are right there, i will never understand

[@WYIN98]

Because you don't find chimps in the corner of your room??

[@lulu7.765]

​I don't wanna imagine a chimp on the corner of my room

[@justafractionoftime1984]

Chimps absolutely terrify me, so I was squirming the entire time. If you haven’t seen Nope, THAT chimp scene will haunt you forever.

[@clarahesse3970]

@@justafractionoftime1984 I would love to see that movie, i just can’t get myself to do it, because of the damn chimp

[@WYIN98]

@@justafractionoftime1984 that scene is based off of a real cAse that happened and the 911 call and the victim are horrifying to look at

[@circecitrus97]

I also really like the end where Verna visits the graves, and places various items on their tombstones, mainly the ones associated with their deaths. But Lenore has no such item, instead she's given this beautiful gift made of a raven's feather, and I think a white flower? It really contrasts with the other offerings, and in a way I think it shows a bit of Verna's implied favoritism towards Lenore.

[@unrulycrow6299]

Verna was truly sorry about having to take Lenore's life tbh. She acknowledged her as the only one of the family who had a good heart the entire time, as well as an unfortunate collateral consequence.

[@marymartin2154]

Carla Gugino and Mark Hamil were two of the standouts here and when I got my wish that they'd interact, I was not disappointed.

[@theodorapreventa714]

I think the Raven was not Death or the Devil, but some version of the Fates. She pleads with all the characters- seemingly presenting a way out- but in truth, she only allows them to pick how they will die. The twins meet her right after they move from "morally grey" to downright "evil". Their conversation is not exactly a "choose your fate", it's more of "what would you say brought you here?". She even mentions that their conversation takes place outside the realm of time and space. She says she sees all three versions of them (three Fates in Greek mythos- Clotho spinning the thread of life- their mothers story is the first death-, Lachesis measures the thread- she tells them they'll live long lives, and Atropos-Death personified-, she who cuts the thread and choses the manner of death as well). The truth is that they see the three versions of the Raven. Ravens bring bad luck or great fortune, so do the Fates. Every single one of the children gets a taunting version of "this could've ended differently". With Froderick, she says that she just had to intervene. The dentist comment sounds so sad- he could have done some good in his life, but he chose to do something horrific instead WITH THE SAME TOOLS. She only expresses regret about having to cut Lenore's "thread", which will result in her mother naming the foundation that will save so many lives after her. I think that the whole series is a thesis on free will- Pym's meeting with her emphasizes the point. He'll take his chances, but Fate is inevitable. As the Raven says, we are consequences and in turn we are consequential. It's what we do with the time given to us, after all.

[@Kitty-f7v]

Yaaaay I’ve been waiting for your review of The House of Usher and I’m so excited, Amanda always delivers the best Flanagan’s reviews😃 I just have to say Juno is my favourite- they initially presented her as someone after Roderick’s money but she’s just a genuine and sweet girl and it’s Roderick who was taking advantage of her all along.

[@LRCh_]

The "Dr Frankenstein" moment is utterly haunting

[@elizabethtangora4353]

I blazed through the whole show while sick in bed, and am still just totally in awe of how many elements from Poe were just seemlessly integrated. I love how absolutely at the other end of the ‘ghost story’ spectrum it was from Hill House and Bly, but Lenore’s death makes me cry if I watch even a second of it.

[@itsgiobaby]

It’s the way Mike Flanagan just dropped a Succession meets Dopesick meets Ready Or Not show while still adding his own spice to it as a closing act… What an exit 🙌🏽

[@NathanielTavington]

For the "It's all Roderick's insanity as he tries to explain why everything went so bad all at once" angle, Lenore died of an aneurysm, indicated by the way Verna touched Lenore's forehead. Aneurysms burst due to ongoing stress, sudden high emotion such as anger, etc. Lenore's situation, her coked out father dead after mutilating her already terribly injured mother, would certainly count as ongoing stress, and an aneurysm can be a very gentle, and very sudden, death.

[@FearfulHeroine]

One of my favorite things about this was honestly the Anabelle Lee poem being used so strongly over time and then coming to a head like it did. That episode after her speech and him reciteing the last bit of it actually was more of a knife in the gut to me than Lenore's death. Seeing that in the end there was this small bit of this man who was still good in there that genuinely loved this woman and then seeing it die over time? Then watching it rear its head once more just enough to make him have that moment of pure regret hit him in his final moments? Somehow it was poetically beautiful to me. Anabelle is one of my favorite characters from this show and I genuinely hate how she was treated and died.

[@koiilauritsen1731]

Not knowing anything about Poe means that i didn't understand how brilliant the story crafting was. I already loved this show but now it leaves me in awe

[@josephine-rt6jw]

I think there's something especially clever about how beyond the deal he made with Verna, in a lot of ways Roderick was directly responsible for the deaths of each of his children. If he had demolished the abandoned warehouse and safely removed the toxic chemicals Perry wouldn't have been able to throw a rager (not to mention if he'd not been pressing him so hard about his first venture he might not have felt to the need to do so). Camille was in the wrong place at the wrong time because she was searching for the mole on behalf of her father, as a means of gaining his approval and "winning" in the neverending battle she had with her siblings. Leo is less than the others but I think you can probably trace a lot of his substance issues to his relationship with his family, as well as the fucked up dynamic Roderick created with the siblings. Victorine's sense of entitlement came from years of being in the family, and the pressure put on her by Roderick and Madeline made her snap. The importance of the Goldbug release exacerbated Tammys already declining mental health, and again, like half of her issues (husband kink thing) can be traced back to her upbrining with Roderick. Freddy was immobilized by an illegal Fortunato paralytic in a condemned fortunato building, and died because he was, in essence, a fucking entitled moron. fucking loved this show.

[@looney1023]

As much as I love all of his miniseries (I still think Midnight Mass is the best one overall), this is easily the most FUN I've had watching a Flanagan show. I devoured this show so quickly and was delighted by it

[@Sajirah]

For sure, this was his most fun series. His other work is great but tends to lean more gut-wrenching and emotional whereas this was just fun because nobody except a handful of characters were sympathetic so you just got to sit back and enjoy the downfalls of all of these horrible people.

[@afterdinnercreations936]

"And now the story of a wealthy family who lost everything, and the one bird who had no choice but to tear them all apart." It's Arrested Development

[@CheziahKatt]

"Bill T Wilson" is also William Wilson, which was a Poe storty about a doppleganger where a man is stalked by a doppleganger with the same name who looks just like him, and eventually tries to kill the doppleganger but then kills himself instead.

[@MK_1Ultra]

Carla Gugino SHINES as Verna!! Absolute talent and amazing acting. She needs to win more awards!!

[@tmamone83]

I just remembered a line near the end where Dupin visits the Ushers' graves and says he's going home to his husband, children, and grandchildren, and then he says he's the richest man in the world. Meaning, of course, that real wealth doesn't come from money, but family.

[@hammbon3367]

It always cracked my me up how they HATED Perry's night club thing when Leo is just funding video games being made 🤣

[@jadacampbell9331]

But ppl buy games 🎮

[@realafah]

Roderick and Madeline’s mother didn’t believe in medicine, no wonder they didn’t care if the drug actually worked or not. I love all the ironic things that happened with people. Madiline accuses Roderick of sleeping with Verna when they met, when she’s the one who had an intimate interaction with her, even if it was just a kiss. Lenore’s mom makes a comment about how doing the right and brave thing will get you written out of the will, but then is one of the only ones included in a will who gave all of it to do good in the word and brave enough to overcome the hardships she has gone through. Even going as far as to name a foundation after her daughter because she’s the only one who was brave enough to do it first. (That part makes me cry every time. To see Verna get so invested in Lenore and her mothers lives to the point she not only saves the mother personally, but to be so kind to Lenore in her final moment and let her know her good deeds were not in vein and will continue on through her mother. God I tear up.) Fredrick pulls out his wife’s teeth, which was enough to get Verna personally involved in his death and barely giving him a chance for an easy way out, then rubs it in his face that he would have been a dentist if he wasn’t the monster he became. Fredrick making powerful quotes that were really first said by people he saw as powerful in his life, thus being another example that the usher’s never make anything and just piggybacking off others and taking all the credit. God I love it all.

[@dean1543]

I met both Mike Flanagan and Kate Siegel at my local comic con. They were both really chill and cool people. Mike had signed a script for the midnight mass series finale for me. He said it was his favorite episode from the series.

[@Jeffbuckleygoated]

0:46 watching this now after the p diddy allegations made the usher comment so much funnier.that’s some good foreshadowing for you right there

[@Mirala0618]

I got a chance to see Mike and Kate at a local movie festival and they both seem like great people who deeply care about the stories they’re telling

[@andreasanjosehernandez6418]

Froderick‘s torture of his wife by pulling off the teeth comes from Berenice, which I was very scared to see in the series 😅😅😅

[@tattedupluv]

Some of the most imaginative deaths ever! Never want to hear the words Cuddle Puddle ever again! So sick! Loved the reimagining of these notorious Poe stories. Lenore having to fall too was super sad though.

[@ellebee4112]

Justice for Lenore! Also I loved all the Egyptian themes running through this show too. Not many videos on this series have commented on that.

[@kiraleigh18]

I LOVED this as a love letter to his fans, the shows he's created so far, the love of English literature and how it can translate into film, the way it portrayed consumerism, the opioid epidemic, some say the 7 deadly sins, the Easter eggs of Poe's stories, etc. It was chef's kiss! One of my favorite moments is Pym's conversation with the Raven, very matter of fact, businesslike, how it showcased that she is just a harbinger of death versus death itself, giving choice and freedom to the ones inflicting their own eventual pain and suffering. Carla Gugino stole the show, and I love her for it. I've loved her since Spy Kids and will continue to watch her work.

[@IrishBlendCoffe]

Something I love about Flanagan’s shows/movies is the visual storytelling without directly expositing to the camera. When Annabel Lee walked past Roderick in the church and you get the reveal of the back of her head- what the consequences for choosing greed and turning their children against her was- it absolutely broke me on my first watch. It’s honestly still hard to think about. Lenore’s fate is sad, but it has that hopefulness to it because of what her actions will put in motion- but Ana’s is purely tragedy. She believed the best in a man who completely destroyed her and their children.

[@fernandarubio5343]

This is so heartbreaking. Annabel was so pure and loving and the Ushers broke her soul… I didn’t understand how she died but seeing her wound right from the back as if the Ushers didn’t backstabbed her in every opportunity they had :( just heartbreaking

[@SingingSealRiana]

the reason I like flanagans brand of horror is, that he derives his from the human element, more then just from gore, jumpscares or anything . . . the supernatural aside, parts of this definitly happen all the time, it gives it a realness that makes it truely scary in my eyes. Bev and Paul from midnight mass are way scaryer, then the angel, peter is an absolut nightmare

[@GremlinAbsolute]

This is still my favorite video about The Fall of House Usher. Tammy's death is my absolute favorite because Flanagan used that death as an homage to Suspiria and one the first deaths of the movie. He also plays with the lighting the same way Dario Argento does in the movie. Edit: I'm high af and forgot to mention the movie

[@AmandaTheJedi]

Thank you! I even got some compliments from Flanagan himself on this one so I guess I did a decent job!

[@thefinalfrontear]

My dad named me Morella and I’ve always been thankful for it bc I love Poe and his work. When I heard this series was going to be using the names of Poe characters, I was so excited to see what kind of person was going to share my namesake. Needless to say, I cried so fucking many times. I’m so proud of Morrie and thankful for Lenore.

[@RjHerndon]

I'm honestly glad they made the cat look like a puppet. It's made it easier to watch 😢. Such a great show!

[@MiRuina69]

All the Egyptian references got me. The tie in of immortality that they thought they could achieve. And actually kinda did. Everyone has heard of Cleopatra. Great show. I have an old book of Poe poems and stories that I got at 10 from my Mom. I still have it. 😊

[@cami3739]

that one jester jumpscare in the car absolutely took me out like the others I was expecting but that one? got me good😅

[@reikun86]

That scene got me good too. 😱

[@KimandKamJam]

I have a bit of respect for Madeline's character. Till the very end that woman did not accept death. Tried to negotiate with death even tried to trick death bur NEVER accepted death. I also respect Pym. He didnt flee. He went out with his head held high. Even if wasnt an honorable man, he was an honest man

[@Meli-Meliai]

I wouldn’t say he’s HONEST… he’s a lawyer after all lol. But he was better than them to the very end.

[@megdelaney3677]

I LOVED the first 3 series, but this is a Masterpiece of weaving Poe's stories into a family empire story.

[@DavidGowers]

Although Midnight Mass will probably forever be my favourite Flanagan show for how powerful it is, this will likely always be the one I had the most fun watching. The way he incorporates so much of Poe's work into EVERYTHING, the way so many of The Flanagan Fam play 'against type' compared to their roles in his previous work, the way the lighting so beautifully sets so much of the tone...he's definitely outdone himself with this one

[@MREmusique]

I loved this series, but that scene out of his office window, in the rain, that REALLY triggered me. I spent most of that evening crying.

[@penelopedreadful]

As a major Poe fan, clearly I need to watch this. I've never watched any of Flanagan's work but I always enjoy your reviews of his stuff. Also I really like the background that you switch to! Very autumn cozy.

[@miskatonic6210]

Better read some good horror stories instead.

[@wormer104]

It is SO good!

[@AmandaTheJedi]

Aha yeah just a lil nook area at my parents! And I hope you like it! I'm already seeing references I missed with certain characters so I'm sure you'll have fun!

[@myheroaus1345]

I feel like Victorine's storyline wasn't really about furthering her own name, just making her father proud of her. I mean, this woman was straight up called a bastard by her siblings, she clearly had some issues with wanting approval. That's why she went so far off the deep end with the heart mesh. For once, Vic was the important one, the child her father cared about. Her mother was a surgeon, she went into medicine with the intent to help people. That's why her spiral into insanity is the most impactful (in my opinion). Sure, it's not as bad as having your skin burnt off or being ripped apart by a chimp, but that's not the horror of Victorine's story. It's the reasoning behind her actions. Of all the children, Vic's death was the closest to being directly Roderick's fault. All of them wanted his approval, but she died specifically for that approval. Sorry this is so long

[@StrapOnRobbie]

It’s interesting to me that most people who review this don’t mention the Annabel Lee reference. It was his last poem, and is about a man’s dedication to his dead love. I first read it in high school as part of a project about sexual perversion, as it was considered by some to be about necrophilia.

[@Sate12]

This might be a stretch, but Ravens are associated with the Celtic Triple Goddess The Morigan. Triple goddesses are often linked to Death, Doorways (choices) and deserved fate (justice) which is what Verna dishes out. In addition, she has strong ties to legends of the Fae (fairies/fairy), who love to make deals and bargains that humans can never truly win. As the name suggests, Triple Goddess have 3 forms Maiden (the bartender/the cautioner) Mother (the killer of Lenore, savior of Usher when he almost poisons himself) Crone (the white figure on the ship. The final form standing over the ruins of Usher)

[@nikoblack1272]

historically, Triple Goddesses actually tend to be of the same perceived age, not representing Maiden, Mother, and Crone ; plus, the Morrigan can be argued to be a four-aspect goddess - all that being said, i do still like the idea that she is the Morrigan or something similar ~

[@virtualgambit577]

16:34 I feel like it’s important to mention that the toxic waste sprinkler incident is parallel to a similar problem narrowly avoided in NY. The CityFox Experience (current owners of eZoo) tried to hold a pop up rave on a superfund site (Nuhart Plastic Manufacturing Plant in Brooklyn) back in 2015. It was shut down just 15 minutes prior to happening and would’ve hosted over the building’s capacity, + had flammable curtains to hide flammable materials on the other side. I’m not sure if this scene was a direct reference to what could’ve happened at that Halloween party, but considering the parallels to other real life events and people like the Sackler family, I wouldn’t doubt it.

[@mels1918]

ITS NOT ABOUT USHER!?!?

[@crazedfaeiry623]

I think that the scene in the Usher's original home with Pym and Verna gives a ton of helpful clues. Such as points against the Verna being karma or consequence. She was willing if not eager to protect Pym from his consequences/bad karma, merely out of curiosity. Because, of all the things that Verna did know about him. She was not able to find out what he really lived for. And was willing to make a deal just to find out. Or a least that was what a got from the conversation between them.

[@QManagerin]

Agree- I thought she was the manifestation of fate or destiny. Not something sinister or evil.