The First Sonic the Fighters Community Edition Tournament

[@RagnarokiaNG]

It turns out Eggman's machines are his limiters he uses to give Sonic a fair fight

[@adamwasp2717]

IDW confirms

[@commanderdemonno9819]

@@adamwasp2717 do not put starline in this game

[@panetoneninjacanal2692]

The moment that he outspeeds sonic is the moment we all realize he is the strongest

[@ItsCenrryTH]

Mechless Eggman getting transformed into a grappler is so funny

[@YourTypicalRemixer]

He’s out here slamming characters far before IDW.

[@nick-playercharacter8583]

Knuckles remains rougher than the rest of them.

[@lorenzo689]

Tougher than leather

[@DustyMusician]

The best of them, even

[@philiphunt-bull5817]

Unlike sonic, he does not chuckle.

He would rather flex his muscles

[@Moonyshoomy]

He’s hard as nails

[@abicto]

Seeing metal delete someone's health with 1 jab combo seems insane

[@wusstunes]

The third jab is really slow and very much can be beaten by pretty much anything but standing still and blocking, but a lot of people autopilot into block after getting hit by the first two jabs, and you can also use block to cancel the string and start it up again as a mixup, as his jab 1 is very fast, or mix in his broken grab. So yeah in theory it shouldn't hit this often, but it's still pretty insane.

[@mrhalfsaid1389]

​@wusstunes it'll likely be hitting so much because people aren't used to it. It's just how fighting games be

[@shaixiii]

leggman grabbing people is so funny looking 😭

[@VoltzYT]

Thanks for hosting! Was fun playing the villain >:)

[@flint9064]

Legman is one of the funniest characters in a fighting game hes so silly i love him

[@dogsinsuits]

Its like that one adventure time scene, "And the great question endures... who would win in a fight between Nietzsche's 'Metal Sonic' and Leggman? The answer is: KNUCKLES! IT'S ALWAYS KNUCKLES!"

[@Nougatbars]

Dan Voltz plays a mean Bean and in this tournament was Metal Sonic? So he was a Mean Bean Machine?

[@abram-green]

Leggman Gaming

[@DarkAura19]

When you said Matt played Makoto in Third Strike the Eggman pick immediately started clicking lol

[@mattguy1773]

Mechless eggman looks so funny to me

[@RednekGamurz]

That Metal Sonic change to his laser still seems kinda dumb to me. Either it should always consume a barrier when using it (even in hyper mode to avoid laser spam) or it shouldn't activate hyper mode at all, making Metal very good in general, but not having access to hyper mode like most of the cast. Even if he didn't win, the current playstyle of just spamming laser seems pretty braindead and not healthy for the game.

[@xkower8181]

the hyper mode activation was a bit of a mistake, because the devs tried to make laser spend a barrier but they couldn't detach it from activating hyper mode.

[@xkower8181]

basically this is still a subject to change.

[@wusstunes]

It's gonna get nerfed in the next patch, but it's funny so I'm glad it got a chance to exist.

[@RednekGamurz]

@@wusstunes That's good. Also true, it is funny.

[@pepearmstrong3239]

​@@wusstunesto be honest is it really that much worse than whatever fang is doing with hyper mode?

[@TheEssentialHughJazz]

This was a very cool video! I look forward to more like this, if you're planning on it. I find it interesting that Metal Sonic seems like a Sheik-type character - low barrier to entry, but with a good amount of counter-play at higher levels.

[@wusstunes]

Next project is likely another SSBM thing, but I might try something like this out again in the future. It was definitely quicker to make than some of my other videos and I like doing stupid editing stuff!

[@Markm8]

More proof eggman bodys every thing that doesn’t have plot armor

[@hedgethewedge]

Honestly was the most fun STF tournament I've ever been in, and I somehow sent Solar to losers with sheer mega luck

[@DevineCoder]

Competative Sonic The Fighters is wild to me

[@Eldoofus]

Competative is wild to me

[@philiphunt-bull5817]

Sonic is wild to me

[@Moonyshoomy]

Fighters is wild to me

[@El8oney]

The is wild to me

[@kora2691]

I would've preferred drill punch to have slower recovery instead of slower startup; that way it would be a high dmg punish tool but it wouldn't be overwhelming on block

[@Gabri_Lovecraft]

As a Metal player, he seems very OP on the surface, but the key is that all of his best moves are really easy to punish, and if you do something stupid once, that can cost you the match. I’ve compared him to K. Rool in Smash Ultimate in the past, a character that people think are OP at the start but as they’re learnt, they realize they aren’t as strong as most people think. The only real nerf I’d say is maybe the laser. It’s hard to beat and costs a barrier, but I can see how the laser spam might be too much. Either way, you can nerf Metal into the ground and I’ll play as him regardless. I just love that little sucker. Do whatever you need to let me play him in whatever tournament I want!!!!

[@illford]

That lazer alone is a war crime, an unblockable move should not be this stupid. Like Forebrand has an unblocksble bjt it actually requires it to be charged, that Metal laser is a soft machine gun that's fullscreen

[@DraphEnjoyer]

Broken character main with a wall of text why the character isn’t actually that good Name a more iconic duo

[@mouthwide0pen]

From what I've seen in other comment threads, Laser nerf is already a foregone conclusion.

[@mouthwide0pen]

​@@DraphEnjoyerTo be fair, from what I've seen people talking about, a lot of Metal Sonics busted moves like the guardbreak jab that does 8 gajillion damage are super easy to avoid due to long windup, and people just aren't used to it yet and are autopiloting against him. It makes sense that people suck at the counterplay for a character they've never had to go against in a real setting, after all! I've never played this game myself, so I can't speak on his power, ofc, and he's definitely still going to get nerfed, but it's not as cut and dry as just "op character main defends op character main".

[@KusogeMan]

classic OP char player downplaying his char lol

[@fireyocean8129]

Ok, can we all agree that Metal Sonic chaining lazers into themselves should not be allowed? Also, I love seeing Legman putting in work. He's so fun to watch and looks so fun to play as.

[@Bonniekid-pocho6252]

It might just be something players need to learn to beat, cuz early in the video with metal vs tails, and even I think once in legman vs metal, they sidestep the laser If anything the laser just needs to be unsafe on block/whiff with lots of recovery

[@illford]

​@@Bonniekid-pocho6252imo just don't make it unblockable and so fast it's reward is the problem it's exceptionally high reward on hit and if you sidestep it your not gonna get something crazy it seems since obviously you aren't doing beam point blank. I've never seen an unblockable move so weirdly designed

[@austinfletchermusic]

Is Legman-Bean like an 8-2 matchup? That seems rough

[@wusstunes]

Hard to say. I have managed to take a game or two off of Dan Voltz' Bean with him, but it certainly feels like his worst matchup right now.

[@backyarddad4198]

I wanna see them try to balance super sonic into the main roster, too. Have EVERYONE.

[@theorangeslice9678]

Leggman being the a counter to Metal is so fucking funny to me. Like of COURSE Metal's creator would best know how to take him down.

[@joeypickering5273]

12:47 sonic cd canon jumpscare

[@xkower8181]

Legman's the GOAT

[@kolby125]

leggman sweep 🗣🗣🗣

[@MikeDeeJackson]

Officially calling him LEGGMAN from now on 😂

[@Crazybark]

LEGMAN YEEEAAAAHHHH!

[@SonicSaturdayTelevision]

The G.O.A.T Knuckles never loses 🔥

[@jinxmybeloved6930]

wait is metal sonic a petshop situation or a vanilla ice situation

[@mrdeadmemes]

he's hol horse but top tier

[@mouthwide0pen]

Petshop is BS because he can do unblockables whenever he wants and gets to cheese the game with his flight and small size. He's just fundamentally getting to bypass a lot of the game. Metal Sonic isn't really comparable to that. This is more like if the boss version of Nagorituki in GGST was the only version of Nago, and the community was trying to figure out how to change him to actually be fair to play against. Because that's fundamentally what this is. Metal Sonic was deliberately designed to be unfair to fight against because he is a boss character.

[@veryrealperson3694]

all this really shows is that there's always a bigger fish

[@iheartbacon76]

Not my boy Bean!

[@ToastyRoyale]

Loving the Sonic the Fighters content, would love to see more!

[@successfulfailure1298]

Metal Sonic’s laser seems ridiculous. Is there some counter play I’m not seeing?

[@zachstarattack7320]

nice. always wanted to learn about metal sonic and psycho crusher

[@Galacticbraindentist]

I’d love to try and get into this but the scene seems heavily US dominant and I doubt the connections from Europe to the US are good. :(

[@wusstunes]

Dan Voltz is an EU player and there are quite a few more of them. The connections can still be decent depending on the internet. There was also an IRL event today in Ireland. I personally would love to see an EU-only region locked netplay event happen, but nobody has organized it so far.

[@xxrainbodkidxx5508]

Ive only ever watched this game but as a spectator the ketchup mechanic would make a comeback look all the more crazy

[@TehNoobiness]

"Because it's unfair...if you do more damage when you're behind and less damage when you're ahead." Devil's advocate here: The point of a catch-up mechanic is to encourage a player who's behind to get back in there. This is less important in fighting games, where characters generally stay at a similar power level throughout the match and have powerful defensive options to begin with, than it is in genres like MOBA, where an early mistake can cause the next 30 minutes to be a death march--but it's still important. You don't want every match to be a curbstomp, even at high level play. Like, people make memes where Potemkin grabs you once and you get sent to the pearly gates on the next frame, but...yeah. I'm not saying Sonic The Fighters is a perfectly designed game, or that removing catchup damage is sacrilege, but like--fairness in a game isn't just about being put on the same playing field, it's also about giving the loser enough opportunities to become the winner. Literally flipping a coin is perfectly fair, but when have you ever seen people get hype for the possibility of a comeback from calling heads and seeing the coin land on tails?

[@wusstunes]

I don't think every match is a curbstomp now. It takes three round wins to take a game and every round goes pretty fast with or without ketchup. We're certainly interested in fine tuning the damage mechanics, but as it worked before the game would often penalize winning neutral early in rounds in ways that didn't really feel fair, especially against certain characters like Tails or Knuckles. I'm not really as against combeback mechanics as some folks, but I do think having a life lead is something that should benefit me when I play a fighting game, not be a liability. A lot of strong players are saying they really don't feel much of a difference in the game either way, though, so I think we just want to take more time to feel out things regarding damage scaling. The biggest change really with no Ketchup is that multi-hit moves are way stronger now, since they used to scale down with each hit due to ketchup, and that might be something worth investigating.

[@TehNoobiness]

@@wusstunes That all makes sense, yeah. I point all this out 'cuz I often see people talk about comeback mechanics like they're a cardinal sin of game design, and the truth is more complex than that. It's good that the StF community is really digging into how these changes affect the game.

[@toastprobably9774]

I

[@segahatty]

#nerfmetalsonic I guess. By the way it always baffles me that Espio and Fang's throws deals a lot of damage, like, slamming into the ground should not take away 1/4 of your health bar.

[@wusstunes]

Sega AM2 fighters be like that

[@dazedheart9006]

I really shouldn’t have missed this one. Y’all PC players are COOKING 🔥🔥🔥

[@Mister.Scotty]

HELL YEAH SONIC BABY!

[@justinthehedgehog]

man, i wanna start playin this with yall

[@ItsNeonZz]

I wish I was there man

[@soggybread4583]

AYO LAYTON BROTHERS OST MUSIC?!

[@JustStop19]

Can you explain checkup thing in more details? I am new to Sonic Fighters.

[@SolarFarle]

Will Rocket Metal and that one Badnik in the opening cutscene will be added to that STF mod?

[@Zanedotmidi]

Huge video for someone who has bever played this game (me)

[@akkosinterludee]

New wusstunes video!!!!

[@Akiak7]

Catch up mechanics aren't inherently unfair

[@insertnamehere15]

Someone got a music list for this vid?

[@paz8723]

Maybe we should playtest more...

[@LukeVT]

I am just geting into the game and the community and after wacthing your videos. I been trying to figure out how to find the community edition but I can't find it could you help me?

[@wusstunes]

It's better to just ask in the troubleshooting channel of the discord.

[@LukeVT]

@@wusstunes ok thanks!

[@shahabbas2894]

whats the music during leggman segment at 4:30?

[@GreenEyedDazzler]

Hey man, great video just wanted to ask did you get your name from a movie called the Sasquatch gang? 😂

[@CopingContinuous]

What a joy!!

[@Tokomiii]

What about super sonic or same story?

[@wusstunes]

Super sonic is just sonic in hyper mode that can't take damage. They're gonna try to just make him a skin

[@Tokomiii]

@@wusstunesI hope they do something a little more interesting than a skin, like make it so super sonic auto loses after 50 seconds or less like in most sonic games due to his 50 rings, and make it so he can’t crouch or something similar due to him flying often

[@Tokomiii]

Like maybe adding end lag on his moves or making it so his movement acceleration and approach wise begins with him running and then he slows down to start flying at his opponent like in some sonic games

[@wusstunes]

​@@Tokomiiithat might be beyond what we're able to do right now. Modding is still pretty early along.

[@michaelthex2684]

Curious on others thoughts, but I think this version of Metal just needs damage nerfs and he would be fine.

[@mouthwide0pen]

Nah, damage or not the laser is insanely overbearing.

[@oathkeeperofoblivion972]

All hail knuckles

[@liftedspirit984]

Cool ass game

[@TJ-wc1cb]

Nerf knuckels

[@illford]

Is Leggman the Haggar of this game?

[@nomnom2407]

is EIZL still playing?

[@wusstunes]

Not really tbh, but people come and go

[@PeacockLover127]

rounds r very short in this game I think

[@PeacockLover127]

8:20

[@baer5137]

Thank god Nintendo doesn’t own this game, otherwise they would take it out back and kill it for no reason

[@myguy9320]

Hype?

[@Boyfriend_plays67]

Is this update real or a mod?

[@wusstunes]

it’s a real mod

[@eeveemaster243]

Bro they gotta nerd everything's damage by about 1/3, these matches fly by in the blink of an eye, how the heck are new players supposed to learn anything about the game like this

[@wusstunes]

Well, you gotta win three rounds to take a game and there aren't really true combos, so there's still a lot of chances for players to interact in any given game. That said we are looking at some options there. The old damage scaling system would reduce damage pretty dramatically against players who were on low health, so potentially by adding more health to every character we could keep the same length of rounds as pre-patch but without the game overtly favoring losing players.