The Frustrating World of FNaF Books...

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TimeStamps:
Opening/ Silver Eyes
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Frights:
3:18
Tales:
11:59
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[@siresquawks]

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[@bananamanjunior7575]

Glad to see you got a sponsor my man ❤

[@DjDeadpig]

Good to see you got a sponsor, but considering it’s raid, I can already see the meme comments coming.

[@yourfatboy5359]

My man is finally gonna get that bread💪💪

[@bigsharon7263]

love to see you getting sponsored like this! but i am not playing this fucking game❤

[@oneroushorse]

Congratulations on getting that bag. Although claiming the sponsorship isn’t recommended, the pop-ups get rather annoying during the night phase

[@thebreadbunny1863]

I absolutely agree, but I think it's less of the fault of the books and more of the fault of the games. The game, to be exact. With the mimic plot for example, both help wanted and AR were hinting at glitchtrap being a sort of mimicking monster, but security breach had its entire third act missing and now we have to bear the consequences

[@siresquawks]

It’s still a problem with the books that it isn’t clear what’s what until ~2 years after a game’s release and several short stories in. But yeah, it is also a problem with security breach as I briefly say in the video.

[@thebreadbunny1863]

@@siresquawks fair

[@gibsoff3450]

in fnaf world, if you go 4 layers deep you get a game crash if you go even further. that is scott's way of saying after the 4 games - you will only lose your mind

[@iconicweirdguy8678]

Scott should have just said a hard yes or no on if the books are canon. It's just annoying having to argue what books are canonical and which one is just a random story that means nothing

[@iconicweirdguy8678]

Imo they shouldn't be canon. The books should have just been fun horror stories that involve fnaf characters

[@finnguy1549]

But they are canon and allways have been

[@redpanda6497]

@@finnguy1549 Scott have never said that. I don't know where you got that.

[@j-j8984]

I don't see that happening, having the books being neither one or the other gives Scott (and by extension Steel wool) a safety net in a way

[@SallyGrim]

Thanks for explaining the importance of the mimic better than anyone else I've watched so far. Copycat-robot killer is a neat idea at least. My current view is, it would have been nice for the story of Security Breach to have been in the actual game.

[@vahahadziev]

This is actually brilliant and explains self-repeating of old games

[@fakeorchestra4260]

By this point, at least just write with bold letters in each of the books "THIS STORY IS CANON" "THIS STORY IS NOT CANON AND SIDE MATERIAL" "THIS STORY IS NOT CANON, BUT CONTAINS CLUES TO THE MAIN STORYLINE" And put more of the story in the goddamn games, by this point FNAF isn't an ARG horror game with the gameplay of a flash game, it's an actual game with some budget behind it, and characters. YOU CAN TELL THE STORY IN THE GAME ALREADY. We don't need to do all of this vague meta bullshit.

[@remicon73]

I think the thing that pisses me off the most that no one seems to ever talk about is this: the vast majority of people who play these games are either not going to know about the existence of, or care about the books at all. Which means that the majority of people are going to be running off of exclusively what the games are saying, which means that when they see all the imagery, the purple, the rabbits drawn over the endos in the basement, the fnaf 6 location with the burnt husk of springtrap exactly where we fucking left him in fnaf six, and the signs that someone tried the fix him up, they will come to the simple conclusion that it's afton again. No one in their right mind would go "oh actually it's NOT afton despite all the imagery saying it is, it's some random robot that has no lead up that is PRETENDING to be afton for some reason." It just wouldn't make any sense at all without the knowledge of the books, and even though I now know that the mimic is explained in the book (which i think is a stupid decision because we NEED to know about this thing now for some reason), nothing in sb really points in the direction of the mimic explicitly. It's not "oh i have this new piece of knowledge that makes that make sense" it's "oh I have to square peg/round hole the imagery in the game to come to that conclusion." And even if it didn't seem like you had to beat the game imagery into a slot it doesn't fit in naturally, it's STILL BAD. Because, like I said, the vast majority of people aren't going to read the books, if they know they exist at all, so that information in those books might as well not exist at all (a fact that a lot of very smug "people hate reading" fans seem to not think about. again, most people don't know or care about the books) If it isn't explained explicitly in the game, then it shouldn't really be considered, because the last time I checked, the books are based on the game, not the other way around. No one should have to spend god knows how much on several books and slog through them to understand what we should have been able to figure out from the games. The books should enhance the story if they're gonna be tied directly to the games as like, fun little anthologies, not be 10-15 dollar homework a piece on top of the 60 dollar game people already bought.

[@theognistyheros]

Exactly, game should give all information needed to enjoy story and theorize, and put all pieces together. I first thought that books are just goosebumps stories, not the key to story :/

[@sociallyineptsnapper]

Tbf (not really, it still sucks), we’ve always been doing this, far before these. Either with other types of books, or things on other sites, or things in the actual code… by a certain point it just makes you feel like you’re unable to participate in the lore unless you’re ready to dedicate your whole attention span to only that. It doesn’t feel like an enjoyable puzzle, it feels like a stressful job where people will call you stupid for getting it wrong or disagreeing with the most agreed group _opinion._

[@flamboyant1994]

Atleast the websites are free u shouldn't have to buy 10 other books to understand the story ​@@sociallyineptsnapper

[@StarKay9837]

In a lot of ways, the current state of FNAF (maybe the general state of its story?) reminds me of Kingdom Hearts. For YEARS Kingdom Hearts was pretty inaccessible to lots of people, in that the story was spread out over a range of consoles/platforms. The remixes it got a few years ago helped alleviate the problem, and they added in flashback and story things to make it easier to follow for newer players, but even then without at least a little understanding going into 3, you were going to be confused. “Why would you play 3 without the others?” Idk, but you know people did it. The story of KH isn’t even too complicated if you pay attention to the games, although newer stuff is… doing its best to prove me wrong. But that’s not the point. FNAF is largely like Kingdom Hearts in that the story is kind of everywhere, media-wise. I think there are still things that have only been confirmed/talked about in the books, a prime example being Charlotte and Henry. Most stuff about them, even their names, is from supplementary material. Neither effectively exists in the games until Pizzeria Sim. This is a problem, yes, but mainly because… how does a newbie get into this story? Most people who like FNAF have for a while. Security Breach is a great way to get new people hooked, including Ruin. But like, if the books and other material is all connected and necessary… How does FNAF grow when its essentially gatekeeping itself? Even if all of it was canon to one timeline (which I think it isn’t) we shouldn’t WANT it to be, because there’s a fine line between complex and frustrating, and a lot of “piecemeal media” (for lack of a better term) tends to the latter. (But that’s just my opinion.)

[@syweb2]

9:00 Glitchtrap/Malhare's costume appears in Pizza Party, the in-universe intended ending for the game, which could mean either A) Afton or the Fredbear's brand used to use hand-sewn suits and that is one of them, recreated in VR, or B) Fazbear Entertainment made up the fabric suit for some reason. 21:05 Blame The Fourth Closet for giving Mat his obsession with robot kids. That's ground zero, that's where it all started, and the future books only made it worse.

[@spookyscaryskeleton3513]

It's true that HW was supposed to make fun of all the horrific that happened at Freddy's, so them not using a Springlock suit for the main ending of the game makes sense as they're even making fun of that.

[@halfaxle]

As usual Sire Squawks is one of the most grounded FNAF theorists out there I don't get why people think the books being canon makes sense, much less being a good storytelling idea

[@jraff2735]

Matpat actually gets this one right on the money, with elements of the books being canon, but not in the same timeline. aka, fnaf multiverse theory.

[@DoomSlayer6858]

We know Tales from the Pizzaplex is canon to the games because of the original description for the series, but The Silver Eyes trilogy and Fazbear Frights aren’t (unless Scott said otherwise somewhere and I just missed it)

[@leowulf5280]

I imagine it's just because the books being, well books, have to give more concrete information than the games to. Going off of the games alone so much of the popular and accepted lore is just speculation piled on speculation because almost nothing ever gets confirmed.

[@erickamakeeaina1649]

Aside from the relationship with the games, I kind of feel like Tales and Frights would sort of undermine eachother if they were canon to one another. Like, the whole appeal of the Mimic or some version of Mimic being canon is that the ending of Pizza Sim is now not tainted. Now it really was the ending of the original saga, Afton did die and Henry won. Glitchtrap and such is just a new villain. But if it's both canon AND connected to Stichline? Then that means Afton did still come back again and other characters still had to be the ones to take him down. If anything it just further takes away from Pizza Sim's ending then Help Wanted because in Stitchline Charlie's soul was still around in the Puppet mask. And while I haven't read those specific stories, I've heard that Eleanor comes back in some stories of Tales. I am going off second hand info there, but if that's true that would undo Jake defeating her at the end of Frights.

[@Lemon_Push]

Eleanor's pendent came back, one of her victims has her pendent and uses it to heal people. Eleanor never came back, it's most likely she stayed dead.

[@kamiwriterleonardo6345]

The FNaF Games to Books relationship is, in my opinion, similar to the relationship between Warhammer Fantasy/AoS and Warhammer 40k. Sure, certain elements like the Chaos Gods and several archetypes carry over, but the two are intrinsically different, with different themes, characters, mechanics and plots. There can be some mirror characters (examples being Karl Franz and Roboute Guilleman), but besides that, nothing is really exactly the same.

[@klaykid117]

You can also look at it like marvel/ DC where there are alternate universes that are very similar but also different. A good way to sum it up would be to say that the stories aren't the same but they're similar

[@TheHaddonfieldRegistry]

I was still shocked to find out they were not the same universe.

[@benwelsh5265]

I might get some flak for this but the idea of combining the continuity of book and game has caused nothing but more hardship. It doesn't solve anything and creates a million more problems. The books having shared elements with the games is fine but they literally do not fit together.

[@ch4rliegaming]

The books lore just ruined everything. Its just some stupid chaotic edgy madness.

[@the_Collectors_Domain]

@Sire Squawks First off, I TOTALLY agree with you on the fact that Matty Patty’s obsession with the Robot Kids ideas is for a fact, truly frustrating. Also Second off, I’m sooo glad you went over the whole “is the Novels Canon?” subject, i truly believe they’re not, and I’ve been trying to explain this to everyone! Thank you so much for going over that, and I really enjoyed your videos, you’re one of several FNAF KZbinrs that are really good at their job. Anyway, thanks so much and have a blessed rest of your day… or night wherever you are 🙂🙏

[@TheWizardMus]

I don't actually mind that the books are necessary in principle, it's the fact that even if you're using the books there's no way to actually predict the plot because massive drops happen with no hinting from the games OR the previous stories. The mimic was at least dropped bit by bit in a way you could predict Mimic was Burntrap. BUT GGY suddenly dropped Gregory is 46 when that was impossible to figure out from the game because Gregory is basically the exact opposite of 46 besides being a child.

[@jeremymorris345]

I like how the community is like the og Silver Eyes trilogy must be canon and have lore. Scott sees this and makes books with lore probably. The community: the books suck! I do agree though they are frustrating. I kinda wish they were like the Silver Eyes. Stand-alone stories.

[@bartoszhallay6576]

The books should be just straight up a seperate canon, just a bunch of standalone spooky campfire stories that don't mean anything. But no, that would make sense! And the last thing you want to have your decade old franchise with cohesive lore and iconic ending do is to make FUCKING SENSE

[@ZirconiaGacha]

Honestly my views on the books are to ONLY use them for answers/concepts unless they end up being nearly completely unreliable (eg. the Character Encyclopedia). I'm not against robot kids in the game, but we've already made Gregory Patient 46 so we don't have a reason to make him a robot anymore. Heck, I draw Crying Child with blue eyes partially because I relate to him in a few ways and I have blue eyes, but also because of the whole Sister Location baby heads thing: William might have been trying, but I feel like he never succeeded, while Henry just decided that maybe playing God isn't the right decision here and didn't try to make any robot replacements for Charlie unlike in the Silver Eyes trilogy. I have biases and I'm not afraid to let them show, but often they're around specific characters rather than concepts. If they introduced an all-new character who's a robot kid and has an actual good reveal, then I'll accept it. I didn't want Gregory being a robot kid because he literally was the first and only named kid so far in the game series who isn't currently dead and/or possessing an animatronic. But the books throw ALL SORTS of wrenches into that. Obviously there's some more things I accept like Crying Child's name being Evan and GoldenDuo stemming off from the Stitchwraith, but I think that Stitchline Games is not a good theory. I even like to say that, while those concepts are canon in the game universe, the stories themselves are in the games AS the Fazbear Frights books (and yes, under that logic Bunny Call was reprinted with one of the Felix the Shark stories instead because In the Flesh made parents uncomfortable with their kids reading the books). I like finding clever ways to fit the other stuff in, but it's more of a nod to it rather than it being a canon thing. But Tales from the Pizzaplex is where shit really hit the fan. I mostly write it off as noncanon, minus the two ideas of EXTREMELY cracked-up remnant and Gregory46 (both of which fit into the timeline I'm making for myself). It's just so confusing that it could all be canon somehow. The Mimic could be used to confirm Glitchtrap being a mimic of William Afton, but I'm going to see how it plays out before I fully accept that. Now, I'm all for accepting any and all theories: even the people who believe MikeVictim have good arguments for their theory and I'm not going to deny it because it's the less likely one. But there are just some I don't like, popular or not. FNaF lore is confusing but the books are making it worse, especially since the games are starting to lean into them. Scott (or anyone who knows the full, undeniable lore) should just tell us that the stories themselves are noncanon but the concepts are, like he did with the Silver Eyes trilogy.

[@wolfietronic356]

I think the stitchwraith stingers are more of a "what if?" carrying on after ffps

[@legogenius22]

I'm totally on board for the mimic-afton connection, but do believe even the pizzaplex books are not events surrounding the games, but events that mirror events, and characters in the games to "help" better define things we don't understand, sometimes too vaguely and sometimes to much with the confirmation that Gregory is patient 46. Also wanted to note I understand that the Gregory bot theory that Mat is pushing feels out of place, but he has mentioned that he doesn't like it, but feels it's the best fit with strong evidence from previous games, John's (fuhnaf) puppet in post it room theory and at least a metaphorical parallel with things like the Freddy popsicle in the princess quest ending. So I personally won't dissmiss Greg bot until some serious definitive evidence crushes, it which I personally haven't seen.

[@YellowSkarmory]

The biggest current problem I have with the Mimic's behavior is: How does it know how to corrupt/infect people, like Vanessa and Gregory? That is not a skill it would have mimicked from William, or anyone else for that matter. Maybe we'll get some insight based on how it corrupts the animatronics in the books, but infecting a human has to be different than infecting an animatronic, and it certainly seems that way given the actions of Glitchtrap in Help Wanted (I doubt the fusion thing Glitchtrap does is how an animatronic gets infected).

[@Wizardjones69]

Its fnaf, springtrap baby and faz goo exist, logic is not more a thing

[@grimace9670]

Golden Freddy having two spirits always confused me until I realized it’s the bite victim and one of the kids from the missing childrens incident being stuffed inside golden Freddy like we see in fnaf 2

[@SubZero-hs9xc]

Personally i think the faz bear frights will Be Good as an alternate universe that many needs for parallelo, that are the kind of answers they provide Make them in the same continuity is bad

[@iranfire9355]

the first tales from the pizzaplex related to the game is "help wanted" int he second book, and they were written in 2019, they were the plan all along. the problem is just the security breach sould have told more. and in defense of the books, most stories are actually good, even if unrelevant to the lore, tales like lally's game, and b-7 are some of the best tales while being completely unrelevant to the lore

[@Jedi-ge6lr]

Too bad B-7 got misinterpreted.

[@iranfire9355]

@@Jedi-ge6lr i actually think b-7 could refer to body dysmorphia, just not gender dysmorphia precisely, there are some other book stories that talk about it like "to be beautiful", just becouse it might be about body dysmorphia it doesn't mean it has to be transphobe, there are many young people not happy with their body nowdays, b-7 is just an exagerration of that concept, and it's a really good story

[@dtimetyp7062]

the way i see it is this: the books are teasing what will happen in ruin and onwards. this is not something ever implied or something, but if eel like it is what will happen. if not, i totally agree with this video. needing the books to solve the games is dumb. but if ruin will show the past of burny boi and blob and georgy and stuff, then the books were just an early mention for that. if you bought them you could get early sneak-peeks at what is coming to the series. so as far as i can see the books do like 4 things: -further explain stuff from the past (e.g.: the date of the mci, what ucn is, who patient 46 is) -expand the world (e.g.: remnant, agony, different pizzerias) -be their own stories (e.g.: the stitchwraith stingers, lallys game, somniphobia) -being early mentions of events that will appear in the games (e.g.: mimic, mimic and more mimic) again, if no future games will ever elaborate on what burny boi is, than this video is totally valid. but for now i believe we just got early appearances of what will be in ruin and onward.

[@Supergoat420]

Does anybody else worry that with the all the cumulative Security Breach delays- that the book releases have gone past where we should be knowledge wise going into Ruin?

[@siresquawks]

Maybe? It’s hard to say.

[@tennessee426]

Wow this makes Vanny even more underutilized. Instead of making her a copycat killer she's just barley in the game. You don't need the mimic if Vanny can be that role. It feels like they keep backtracking the story to the point where there's no vision. Mimic should of been in the game instead of a book cuz now the only character that just feels out of place is the blob unless the blob was made by the mimic or whatever. Post fnaf help wanted just feels like there's a mess. Why even tease Vanny in help wanted as the new big bad when the big bad is the only character we can't see or hear or hinted at? If the big bad not shown or hinted at than technically he doesn't exist cuz the next game can backtrack and say something else.

[@DalekOfChaos666]

I am not a fan of the whole Glitchtrap/Burntrap being Mimic1. What is the point if it's not William? What was the point of Vanny if Glitchtrap isn't even William's subconscious? What's the point of Glitchtrap's true form in Princess Quest if it's not William? What is the point if Vanny isn't helping finish what William started and it's not even about rebuilding the Afton family in William's twisted way? I get everyone wanted William to stay dead, but isn't it established that Henry's plan utterly failed in Fazbear Frights? The whole thing feels like one giant fuck you to the fandom. Just keep things SIMPLE. Fazbear Entertainment was cutting costs and scanning the circuit boards of Scraptrap and the remains of the animatronics from FFPS and that's how Glitchtrap was made.(or you know fully intended to create Glitchtrap because someone in Fazbear wanted William to return) Glitchtrap wants a follower that will help make him whole and help him fulfill his plans. Which is restore his family in his twisted image. Glitchtrap wants full control of the Pizzaplex, Vanny is completing his instructions, retrieving his body and uses Glamrock Bonnie's remains to repair his suit and Burntrap wants to kill Gregory for his remnant.(and mostly because he escaped from his grasp) That's what I thought the story was going, going in a complete contradictory direction was honestly a slap in the face. Not everything needs to be overly complicated, Scott

[@grenouillesupreme]

Burntrap being the mimick was probably planned from the start, when burntrap is in the recharge station, his right arm looks like it's holding something and in the mimic story we learn the mimic used to mimic david, edwin's son who was always holding a tiger plush with his right arm

[@SubZero-hs9xc]

It makes Afton presence without wrecking him

[@jack_5670]

Coming from someone who's very hardline Stitchline, yeah a lot of this is my same issues even as someone who believes it's canon. There's some issues I disagree with but tbh this was a pretty good video

[@hanakoisbestgirl4752]

Screw the mimic, it's stupid. I'd rather afton return 100 times over it being some dumb robot pretending to be afton

[@monerb7185]

YES the mimic is the dumbest thing in fnaf right now why replace william with just a worse and hollow version of him

[@mylam658]

the fnaf theory community without books: 🌈🎶☀🐦

[@achedail0389]

I agree that these books are frustrating even tho I didn’t finish the video yet

[@1Tombb]

😭

[@bluestrangler0447]

Wait...what if we play as Gregory in FNAF VR? Our perspective in the game is always as a small child, which would make sense if a child was playing the game. Additionally, we hear Vanessa's voice talking to Afton with the Halloween DLC (I know it's not her VA but iirc it's supposed to be the Reluctant Follower), so how would we be Vanessa if we can hear her voice from the mask and plushie? It's a stretch but the last bit of the video had me thinking so I thought I'd throw the idea out there and just kinda see what other people have to say about it.

[@siresquawks]

Not a terrible one. I do think the idea at the time was we were Vanessa, but it is interesting.

[@lieeeleeee]

I’m so glad to have you say that it makes no narrative sense to replace Cassidy with Andrew because it doesnt actually effect the story at all. Jake and Andrew are so clearly just stand ins for Cassidy and the bite victim, they’re analogous characters the genders seriously doesn’t matter. Plus if you wanted to say Cassidy is actually andrew because the vengeful spirit image is of a boy, then okay Cassidy in the games is a boy it’s not like Cassidy can’t be a boys name. Why replace two known characters with two characters that are the same!

[@TrifectShow]

The way I see it, the books are like avenues of experimental storytelling. They are just adapting new meaning into FNaF's canon. They aren't changing it or retconning the game. We've seen the games sample from the books. But its nothing that the games can't explain for itself

[@smashers6971]

17:39 I just assume Gregory got the glitched copy by Vanny sending it to him in the mail (I mean the secret Vanny dialogue in help wanted implies she has something to do with Gregory’s possession), and Gregory is a 12 year old kid so he’ll be like “a New free game that isn’t released, sign me up!” As for the Books, I do like how they do give us answers.. but they’re answers that should’ve been in the games in the first place, like establish the basics of GGY and Mimic, (Gregory remembering him getting a game in the mail and soon ending up here, or commenting on the high scores being his in the pizza plex despite him never entering the place beforehand. And staff notes talking about how during the VR project this mimicking Ai is going haywire and they have to shut it down.) idk something to establish these ideas and then having the books expand on them. I shouldn’t have to wait 2 years to get basic plot information.

[@smt64productions40]

8:44 Explaining parts of my feelings for KidnapMM basically :/

[@1Tombb]

StitchlineGames might be canon, even if I slightly disagree, Fazber Frights definitely helps into solving specific parts of the games, and a good majority of Tales is canon, a 7th victim came along later in the series and I'd say it's Andrew, and I believe UCNDUO and GoldenShare because I find it to fit better, and it makes no sense for cash standby fixing to be in ultimate custom night because bite victim doesn't have anything to do towards William. That's why I believe UCNDUO because it makes more sense for he to be Andrew and Cassidy to just also be there because she got stuffed in Golden Freddy, Andrew could be in the games without SLG being canon, Cassidy being a boy is highly unlikely as of recently

[@Wizardjones69]

Can be that golden freddy has 3 souls

[@Wizardjones69]

Bite victim is free in fnaf word: after fnaf 3 events, and cassidy is free in old man consequences lake, but andrew wants to torture willian FOREVER

[@1Tombb]

Cassidy isn't free, and I don't care of Andrew wants to torture William FOREVER. If he's freed then who else will go after him? GoldenShare is Cassidy and Andrew possessing Golden Freddy. So if Andrew is freed then Cassidy is the only one to end William, lol

[@SCP-469]

Simple answer: Andrew is not a game character and was never meant to be

[@1Tombb]

@@SCP-469 Sure🤣 how very open minded of you 🤓

[@WaimeaMonster24]

Honestly bottom line, if you treat the books as canon, logic for the series goes so far out the window, my motivation becomes very very slim to take it seriously Witch is probably the most concerning thing in a series based in the little intricate details of Lore

[@vbbrothers]

So....couldnt the mimic just be used to replicate the glitchtrapvirus as mentioned in the retro cd's? Cuz that seems like a simple enough explination without getting too much in the books, maybe we see a note or some blueprints in Ruin of the mimic. I know that you then still have to read the books to still understand the concept of the mimic but if they can explain it well enough in the game then it shouldnt really be a problem......right??? It would be funny if the mimic is just a book thing and were stressing for nothing.

[@Sillygooberperson]

This might be slightly unrelated but about the post it room: There is a note in there that has the name "Kacy" written backward that I don't see anyone talk about (Its located on a pillar left of the Afton family and closest to the stairs, the note itself is light yellow and above it should be a pale green binary note and below a pink scribble note.) I'd love to here some thoughts about it because i haven't see anyone talk about it

[@bellmister6943]

i think the stitchwraith is a parrel to golden freddy and its scotts way of confirming that golden freddy is possessed by two spirits (cassidy and bv) and also comfirming that cassidy is the one you shouldn't have killed whitch were both speculation at the time of release. so instead of stitchwraith disproving cassidy is the one you shouldn't have killed and proving its andrew a character we have never met is the kid in ucn i think its evidence that cassidy is definitely the one you shouldn't have killed and Andrew is just a parrel

[@ginnyevilshadow1458]

THANK YOU I hate people trying to say that Andrew is the vengeful spirit because to me, it's super obvious that most if not all the characters in the books are parallels to characters in games, and that Andrew is just Cassidy from the books, and Cassidy is Andrew from the games. I will forever stand by this

[@Wizardjones69]

Can be jist that golden freddy has 3 spirits, and you shoundt killed is different from vengeful spirit

[@bellmister6943]

@@Wizardjones69 yea but all the evidence points to two spirits. in the log book u have Michael writing in red, fadded text is cassidy (her name was revealed in the book) and the crying child altering the text in the book. so in the book there is the two spirit in golden freddy communicating with Micheal. the other piece of evidence is in the stitchwraith stinger were we learn it possible for more then one spirit to possess an animatronic and the two spirit that possess the stitchwraith parallel the two spirits in golden freddy one is Andrew who keep the man in room 1480 alive and the other parallel the crying child and have the same traits. while in the game we have two spirits possessing the same animatronic cassidy who is keeping william alive and the crying child therfore the stitchwraith parallel golden freddy and Andrew parallel cassidy these book are there to help us figure out the games the stitchwraith is there to help us figure out that two spirits can possess one animatronic (golden freddy) and help us figure out who is keeping william afton alive (cassidy)

[@Fredfazbear1983]

I feel like I’m the only one that has a strong dislike of the mimic stuff, I find it extremely contrived to say “it’s not William, it’s just a robot that behaves exactly like William and looks exactly like him”. Just bring back William at that point instead of having us argue about if it’s canon or not.

[@unnamed9482]

Even if it's contrived, I'd rather have the mimic, who we could've seen throughout so many games, be burntrap then william being back, once again.

[@Fredfazbear1983]

@@unnamed9482 disagree, I could literally claim mimic is any animatronic and I’ll be correct because you can’t disprove it. It’s to much of a cop out for me to accept

[@rojczan1399]

I look on it like this. Why in THIS SERIES, FNAF, why do i need to read the books NOW to understand the story.

[@kyleturner7309]

15:35 I’m sorry but you really lost me here. I’m fine with everything else, but just saying this room is a fun little EE doesn’t cut it. A fun EE would be having butter and a label under it saying it’s exotic. But putting THAT room, in a secret room that is obviously important to figuring out what’s going on, doesn’t work for me. I get you just don’t have an explanation for that room yet, but just writing it off is disingenuous.

[@siresquawks]

Yet that’s what it comes off as now. Best case scenario Mimic made that room based on what he knew about the Aftons. It doesn’t seem to have anything to do with Mike personally.

[@Jedi-ge6lr]

I'm pretty sure remnant was named dropped in the games. In the insanity ending of FFPS, remnant is mentioned in the blueprints for the Scooper and Molten Freddy.

[@siresquawks]

It was. It’s was dropped first in the books, we just don’t know how much overlap it has with the books.

[@Jedi-ge6lr]

@@siresquawks Now I'm confused, because I don't think remnant was ever mentioned by name in the books up until the last few Stitchwraith epilogues.

[@friskycalibri2293]

​@@Jedi-ge6lr It was mentioned in the silver eyes trilogy.

[@Jedi-ge6lr]

@@friskycalibri2293 I know that, but never by name. It was a crucial part of the plot in The Fourth Closet, where William referred to it as "a spark"

[@siresquawks]

@@Jedi-ge6lr it was a core plot point in silver eyes

[@porcelainchips6061]

Character Encyclopedia (pg. 146) says "this mascot only exists digitally". The way CE lists characters in the book is not Alphabetical; they are grouped by how they are related together; Freddy Fazbears are all listed together, Bonnet and BonBon are side-by-side... Glitchtrap is the first in the "traps" (Springtrap, Dark Springtrap and the AR skins) which are all grouped together EXCEPT "Spring Bonnie" is grouped with the Bonnies (as the last Bonnie). There is no entry for Scraptrap, however, but Away from all of that is William Afton (using Scraptrap art) and Burntrap next to each other. So Scott categorizes Spring Bonnie as being like the other Bonnies up until it springlocks Afton, at which point it is now a "trap" in it's own "trap" grouping along with Glitchtrap, but Afton himself isn't grouped with Spring Bonnie or the "traps" and Burntrap is not a "trap". I know the CE was not well received, but I really think it has information in it that may be useful in the way the logbook was useful and that it could contain information more accurate to the games then we might realize; it gives at least five location names; Fredbear's Family Diner (mentioned as the FNAF4 on-screen location where Fredbear and Spring Bonnie operate), Freddy Frazbear's Pizza (listed as the "core" location AND the location in FNAF1, but also says it was open during 1983), Freddy Fazbear's Pizzeria (this name is dropped more then once, but no associations or games are mentioned... But also it refuses to name the FNAF2 location), Fazbear's Fright: The Horror Attraction(FNAF3), Freddy Fazbear's Pizza Place (FFPS, but it says "hopefully no lawsuits" / suggest some kind of risk of brand confusion) along with the rental service in SL. Several times it just makes flat statements like the one about Glitchtrap not existing in real life. Sorry to go on a rant, but I just really agree with you that the novels are over-blown when there is printed media that literally just says stuff we could use directly to built theories just with game-related information.

[@Waltar100]

The sponsorship segment made me really depressed

[@son5094]

I'm so happy you finnally got a sponsorship, just goes to show the amazing content and work, keep it up!!

[@Axos_Abode]

WHAT THE HELL EVEN IS A "THE MIMIC" Edit: I hav watched the part where they explain the mimic now. Sense still isn't made!

[@irladovelasquez975]

The mimic is a endoskeleton that was created by Edwin in 1980s Edwin design mimic to help Edwin's kid since Edwin doesn't have enough time to spend time with his own son so Edwin created a AI program to help his kid

[@LiMe251]

3:37 It's actually called StitchlineGames, Stitchline is basically, iirc, shorthand for Stitchwraith Storyline.

[@TheCollector2401]

I was hoping you would go over all the inconsistencies on why the PizzaPlex books can’t fit into the game lore oh well maybe in another video

[@boxcar9407]

That role parallel connection for The Mimic is a very well made connection. Much more convincing then robo Gregory.

[@majorghoul9017]

If Fazbear Frights is canon, then so is FazGoo. I rest my case

[@siresquawks]

To play devils advocate, Scott said “some are connected” implying some stories aren’t. Which is why in the video I phrase it as “the stingers and all stories connected to it”. Fazgoo would be exempt.

[@majorghoul9017]

​@@siresquawks I suppose that's much more fair, if you take the epilogues in the books as canon but not the goosebumps-style vignettes themselves. Stitchwraith is still weird as much as I love them though, and while I hated the mimic at first I prefer it to William just *STILL* not being dead

[@mediakira6621]

I’m not really a fan of expected to read the books to understand the game. If I wanted to play a game and witness it’s story , I’d play a game and witness it’s story

[@jeremymorris345]

Why is the bye sound effect so satisfying

[@Wizardjones69]

10:10 The image is from a boy BRUH, but i think thats the alter ego of andrew in the new kid "kelsey", that just my opinion I think andrew is more cool than cassidy

[@Wizardjones69]

Or can be that golden freddy has 3 souls Crying child/ " garret " Andrew: vengeful spirit Cassidy: the inocent girl you shoundt killed

[@siresquawks]

Andrew is only “more cool” because He’s had so many more books of time to be fleshed out as the main character. Game Cassidy hasn’t been explored yet. It’d be Biased to claim Andrew is more genuine just because you like him more or don’t consider what Cassidy could be.

[@Wizardjones69]

Cassidy can be a good character, but the most problem of scott is make cool concepts but pick this concepts and trows in the trash for other characters for be new roles with more personality but "no canon" Cassidy NEEDS a chance to shine, or maybe never will..............

[@ransack_knight]

something That I never understood are the sound discs, we never seen them in game so why do we assume its in the games?

[@siresquawks]

Eh some people argue things are or aren't the disks.

[@ransack_knight]

@@siresquawks oh and also just wanted to say, Love how you make your own art work for charactes, the andrew and cassidly 8bit art work you made where amazing! shows your hard work

[@shawnbay2211]

Every fnaf book series has been a killer to the franchise. It’s an endless stream of, “oh, so this is the franchise’s narrative direction...” . I come for the games and the movie hype then leave when the books are the only things on offer.

[@cenobittten]

Interesting points raised. You argued them well. I am still yet to read the original books so I have only a loose concept of how it impacts the timeline but I can see how confusing they might be from a timing perspective. Personally, I think the books are actually designed to do more worldbuilding than giving timeline solving information. Though my headcanon is they are actually fiction written in-world about the Freddy's world, just as the original games were fiction based on a true story. We just don't know what that true story is because it's never been shown - we only have Fazbear fiction to go off. The books tell stories about real people -some in the games- via heavy fictionalisation so well that only someone from the real Afton family could tell you the real story that inspired them. The books and games are parallel worlds - the games telling a self-contained story around the Afton family's lives via fiction, the other telling you the stories of individuals involved in creating that in-game universe/fandom for the games. Its loosely inspired by the same real life events but are different fictional interpretations - much like how a book might have different adaptations that deviate from the source material. Basically It's very meta. I believe that Help Wanted game onwards is all about merging those universes together. It's why stories repeat but dont quite line up. The real mystery is what Fazbear entertainment - at large - is doing imho. Because an evil franchise/corporations are not just run by one person - there are countless people involved. Great video! Thankyou.

[@FTZPLTC]

Man, thank you. I know people are bored waiting for the DLC but that's no reason to go back to the books for clues. Especially the ones that kill off a character (Henry) who is 100% definitely still alive in the games. That detail alone should be enough to make it obvious that they don't fit together. With Fazbear Frights, imo, the obvious issue is that the series was extended before the original intent (sound familiar?), so if someone wants to square it with the story, they should probably ignore books after 5 or 7 (which ever one was originally supposed to be the last one). Because if they *had* been meant to fit together, that would've been the end. And tbh, a lot of the stuff that makes the Fazbear Frights/FNAF overlap worse is stuff that comes later.

[@Wizardjones69]

They make more because scholatic WANTS money

[@insertenombreramdom1150]

I really agree wvit you The fazbear fright and even more so the tales from the pizza plex have 2 very important problems in my opinion. The first is obviously that now it seems that all the lore of the latest games falls completely on them and it's not even like they have definitive answers only They are parallels that we have to conceive and that once we can advance history, we always have to start over, taking the case of mimic, that is, now all of our willaim theories from 2019 to now are could be wrong because are we just assume that these characyers have alwats veen there which brings me to my next point because why are we supposed to have books that have parts that look like canon and parts that don't but then those canon parts are canon in the non-canon but the non-canon obviously didn't happen in the games but they are still canon, it only complicates things unnecessarily. I also don't think anyone would want springtap to drink or the world with cancer to be canon in games. We really need to start complaining to Scott about this, it's just making the saga more frustrating and difficult to follow

[@princeofalltoasters8813]

Just wanna say, your video is what sold me in the idea of Mimic as an antagonist. I dipped after UCN, and only heard vaugely about how the new villain was some random robot named Mimic was the new villain and I hated it until hearing it explained this way

[@randomrhino4371]

THANK YOU! This perfectly encapsulates all my frustrations with StitchlineGames. It doesn't solve anything that the stories being parralels can't solve, and otherwise does nothing but create even more needless confusion.

[@grimace9670]

I could have sworn there was a past theory that burn trap was actually the glitch trap ai given the real aftons body and isn’t that pretty much the same as mimic

[@siresquawks]

There was but it now seems like the other way around. Glitchtrap is just the digital form of Mimic1's ai, and burntrap is it's original physical endo (I think).

[@storywriters5566]

600th LIKE! That's not what I wanted to comment but thank you for clearing things for me. Between matpat and impulseevan, I've been confused about the story (I joined the community between the fnaf 2 and fnaf 3 era so I was already behind to begin with). Again, thank you.

[@FTZPLTC]

I do love clues that look like mistakes - they're my favourite. But they have to be used sparingly, and everything around them has to be PERFECT.

[@do3807]

Actually, fuck it. I want that 7:50 theory to be true, where William is literally running around back and forth, between locations, then slowing down to lure, then gassing it again to fulfill the next plot point.

[@user-rv8yv4yh9n]

I always figured the suit we saw in help wanted was just the glitchtrap version, we only ever see the springlock suit throughout the series until fazbear entertainment steps in with their game

[@BustyCatbot]

Trying to find canon answers in the FNaF books is like trying to find historical events in the bible, you have no idea what's real or what's just a metaphor or parallel.

[@kaitospycher2386]

Screw that theory, the mimic is possessed by Afton straight up.

[@irladovelasquez975]

I really hope Scott cawthon/steel wool studios confirmed that the tales from pizzaplex books Is canon to security breach cuz the ggy story' and mimic is my favorite tales from the pizzaplex books

[@skrappothemonster1436]

After the books came out, I basically gave up on FNaF lore and moved on to theorizing about other games like Little Nightmares.

[@sergiorodriguez6719]

Ok so I have a directo question, why do you think that having an endoskeleton copycat fulfill the role of William is better than William returning Himself? Because for me it seems like one of the stupiest ideas they could come with. Like I know everyone was pissed when he returned once again, but do you really think is better changing him for someone that does the act same but without any personality or goals and just midlessly following a program. For that I will just ignore the books for know, at least until Ruin comes out, if it contains evidence for the Mimic then I will believe it and I will be completely disapointed, but if the evidence continues being only in the books then I will keep ignoring it.

[@siresquawks]

I disagree. This keeps 6's fire important and Mimic1 isn't just something mindlessly copying things.

[@Thundrfox]

Best raid add I’ve ever seen tbh. Unfortunately I’ve played the game before :(

[@paolorossi868]

Can i ask you who is for you the The One You shouldn't have killed? Because if he is cassidy, i don't understand why specified that he is a male and we know that cassidy is a girl. Now i agree that the one you shouldn't have killed is not andrew, it just that i don't know how to make sense to the cassidy =vengeful spirit? Thank you for your videos.

[@siresquawks]

I have a semi-scraped video on the matter because it's tricky as all hell. Scott plays VERY fast and loose with genders, and ontop of that Cassidy is a somewhat gender-neutral name, however Cassidy in the novels is a girl, yet nothing like the role we assume Game Cassidy to have. The simplest answer for UCN is that Cassidy is tormenting William. However, you have the gender problem, the question is, is that actually important? Andrew being the one would be the simplest fix to that critique, but there isn't much evidence without the books that he exists, and so you have to argue those books are important, and the problems continue to spiral from there.

[@paolorossi868]

@@siresquawks ok i totally understand. I agree with the fact that cassidy being the vengful spirit is a much better story, but i don't know. Honestly i don't even know if the fnaf lore will ever come out if we don't have a direct help from Scott Cawthon. Thank you for your answer.

[@NakanoMiku-chan-z2m]

Can I just say I am so sick of X character from the games ( mainly looking at the Gregory is a robot theory ) being a robot

[@THGMR-ox7sd]

Does Matpat even know this channel exists?

[@siresquawks]

No, that’s honestly half the fun of the gags.

[@UltraCenterHQ]

9:27 My man William is on a mission

[@akramirez]

Okay but why would Afton turn orange

[@siresquawks]

Thematically it's the difference between "Shady man who killed me in the back room" and "William Afton". In all prior minigames you're looking at him in horror, while in this you're playing as him.

[@dredgengam4610]

Hmmm.... I'm not sure if I'm sold on Glitchtrap being the Mimic.... I "Need More Proof".

[@ChimeratAlpha]

And Sire Squawks joins the growing line of people on my blacklist for selling their soul for RAID. Hope the money is worth any loss in respect from your previous viewers.

[@siresquawks]

Ok

[@davidfghcycfh2719]

Man can't you find something important to whine about like a little bitch

[@bartoszhallay6576]

What if the Springtrap we see in Special Delivery is, well, the Mimic, but made of the crushed and mangled corpse of Tape Girl? The Malhare's lines are already reversed lines of Tape Girl, so it's clear that MIMIC1 is somewhat joined with her. Mangle, crush and mutilate her, steal a Spring Binnie suit, appropriately destroy it, upload yourself into it and BOOM, instant Springtrap.

[@TeamTheme]

I’m genuinely shocked that you managed to bag a sponsor, considering how small your channel is. Fair enough mate

[@The12thCrashmaster]

Overall, this video was definitely a passive aggressive statement that I agree with alot. Although, out of the whole video, this is my favorite part! 17:22

[@Takejiro24]

Honestly, starting to feel as though playing the games is just......"why?" There's the thrill of a mystery for a potential story in the games. But, it just remains "potential" for the most part. Like, the games throws out the ideas of a good story but NEVER fully follows up on those ideas. Why even play the games for the story when you can just read the books which have actual plots, characters, sequences of events you could neatly fit into a timeline, character arcs that can go somewhere depending on the story, etc. The Silver Eyes trilogies even fleshes out William (the games' main antagonist and overarching villain hinted at from at least the very first game) and his story far more than the games do. So, like, what's the point of the games anymore?

[@CINEMATHEPUMPKIN]

I agree with the whole Mimic idea but why didn’t Scott say if the books were canon to help solve the lore of the main games? I get this is a horror mystery story but like does he have to make it confusing as already as it is

[@legend-qr5qm]

Love how everyone just assumes there were only ever three Afton kids for all we know there could have been more in the rest were taken away in the divorce

[@siresquawks]

Afton has never intentionally tried to personally kill his own kid. Closest thing was sending Mike to the bunker, but he has reason to hate Mike and even then it technically wasn’t certain death. Andrew is never implied to be an Afton. This absurdly essential story beat is never brought up or even suggested.

[@rustyvull-i68]

There are poeple worst than matpat, there is this guy who says that GGY story ONLY can work with Gregg bot, not that he is forscing it like mat, no, he literally says that Gregg bot is the ONLY way that can make GGY work

[@Mizuuri609]

Skip between 1:37 and 3:19 to skip a very boring and unnecessarily long sponsorship segment.

[@Sleeper_6875]

Damn this new lore both being extremely scifi (even more than SL) and being completely reliant on the books to be understood is kind of awful

[@marcuseleazer3058]

Fnaf story are like sandbox and games are walls or foundations of . Ps fnaf storyline from 2014 to today changed a lot .

[@ic0nic707]

9:28 That’s why he’s yellow in midnight motorist.

[@eldritch-tailedfeydeer7320]

TL;DW: We shouldn’t have to rely on tertiary/side media in order to solve mainline game lore.

[@tomkubus]

I do agree with alot of the points if it being nonsense, and although I believe it, one if the main point that wouldn't make sense is that there are 6 mci kids, but most things every sicne fnaf 4 apart from sl, fnaf AR and fnaf 6 imply in someway/directly show 6 kids dying togather in one incident and being the ones who die after Charlotte, so while I do agree with other points if it having no reason to be canon, that isn't the best point against itb

[@SubZero-hs9xc]

For the first trilogy

[@rockstarherospirit]

The mimic is such a stupid idea, and it being told through books is even stupider. I liked the Fazbear Frights because they were NOT connected, you didn't have to read them to know what was going on in the games, they were just fun and set in the FNAF setting. They did get a bit weak in the last several epilogues and some stories were honestly bad, but it didn't matter since it was another timeline and many of the short stories were not even connected. A random AI deciding to copy William should stay in it's own alternate-timeline "what if" story just like Eleanor and Faz Goo.

[@titan7789]

I can't believe you compared Faz-goo with mimic, lol. Honestly,I recommend reading the thing, if you haven't already, maybe you'll like it after all.

[@rockstarherospirit]

@@titan7789 I didn't mean literally, but maybe it is A.I Faz Goo, just copying things it sees, replicating and impersonating. Hm. But no, I'm joking, mostly. I am a fan of the books, I love them for presenting alternate or deeper stories in the FNAF setting and scenarios that cannot be explored in the games, but I would find Eleanor or robot Charlie suddenly being in the games as frustrating as I find this. It feels like a cheap retcon after everyone complained that Afton was back, and like they had their original big plot figured out by the theorists and now they are crafting something out of left field that can flexibly cover up everything already released.

[@titan7789]

@@rockstarherospirit well, it is not a cheap retcon though,xd.

[@rockstarherospirit]

@@titan7789 Well, it feels like one.

[@titan7789]

@@rockstarherospirit I don't know, it felt really cool to me. Original Afton is dead...but his killings continue trough somebody else...

[@aiiv7839]

...At this rate, we're gonna have grey hair. Steel Wool, please release Ruin already to distract us!

[@shyguymike]

Personally I don't have much of a problem with it, mainly because I read all of them and the casuals will learn this stuff from the games sooner or later (I'm sure RUIN and FNaF10 will include explenations, or at least mentions of what happened to Greg) but I fully agree with the StitchLineGames part. As much as I am a fan of them it just hurts both timelines to coexist. (Also personally hard disagree on Mimic being Glitchtrap, since he references UCN so much, etc., but that's neither here nor there I suppose.)