The Haughs O' Cromdale Is Fake News

[@mjr_schneider]

Interestingly, there's a similar sort of ballad (in French) about a battle in my home province of Manitoba called "La Chanson de la Grenouillere". The "battle" in question was the Battle of Seven Oaks, which was fought between the Metis and the Hudson's Bay Company. It was really more of a massacre than a battle, with the Metis ambushing and killing 21 people (including the Hudson's Bay Company governor) and losing only one. However, in the song (which was obviously written by a Metis person) the "English" are the ones who shoot first and the Metis fight back gloriously in self-defence and win the battle fair and square.

[@macgillean1590]

This is my favorite kind of video you do Hilbert- do more like it. This is the kindof music I love and when you do these types of videos it makes me happy knowing someone out there might become interested in folk because of what you're doing

[@ConriDubhghail]

3/10 not enough dead Englishmen. Just kidding, great video as usual Hilbert.

[@Maniac3124]

ScottishCraftyMan the more the better

[@williamcooke5627]

A good, entertaining video as usual, Hilbert. One small point: James II made no secret of his Catholic faith even before he became king. That was why the English Parliament tried several times to pass acts excluding him from the throne, but his brother Charles II always throttled such attempts.

[@bskorupk]

Given how: 1, Auldern is fairly close to Cromdale, 2, the song is reasonably accurate in respect to Auldern, 3, Auldern has the same number of Sylables as Cromdale, 4, The song was written within living memory of both battles, 5, The context you described involving the "getting back at them" spirit of things. Is it possible/probable that the song "The Haughs O' Cromdale" started life as a similar song "The Haughs of Auldern" and was merely altered to suit the times in a manner similar to how "Yankee Doodle Dandy" has an older musical tune, and who's Lyrics were originally an Loyalist/Anti-Rebel Song from the American Revolutionary War, that got altered and used by the Rebels themselves in an Patriotically Ironic manner? Sincerely, Ben Skorupka P.S. Good self-referential joke within the first 30 seconds! It gave me a good laugh! :)

[@williamcooke5627]

i should think that's quite possible, even likely.

[@bskorupk]

Indeed, but on the "Scottish Music in general is full of ****" Question, I wonder if "The News Frae Moidart" is fake news as well? I'd say it at least applies the concept of Journalism (either contemporary or retrospective) as it at least asks the question (not declares) "Wha'll be King but Charlie?" ;) kzbin.info/www/bejne/bmWskpWcic2tipY

[@bskorupk]

@Gavin MacNeish Thank You! Indeed, I had forgotten the second letter (a) in Auldearn, and the main point of my original comment was a driveling yarn about a hypothetical earlier version of a spirited, yet badly written song. I was thus asking a question of Musical History, more than I was of Military History. The rest of your reply would be pertinent if the focus of that question were reversed, excepting the issue of experience in the subject, which is a welcome sight to see! Happy New Year! :)

[@bskorupk]

@Gavin MacNeish Interesting to hear, I've actually been learning the fiddle for a couple of years now, any songbooks or singers you'd recommend? :)

[@Nethan2000]

From what I've read and seen, there was an earlier song with the same melody, but it described a Scottish defeat, not victory. Instead of Montrose, it featured English general Livingstone saying how he's gonna teach the Jacobites a lesson. I think the Jacobites simply hijacked that song and reversed the meaning.

[@TheEudaemonicPlague]

I left my hard drive with music on it upstairs, so I started listening to music on YT...starting with Rare Air (originally Na Caberfeidh), who my wife and I saw in the late 80s (when their only album was Mad Plaid), which led to Andy M. Stewart. It's his version of The Haughs of Cromdale that I know and love. That brought me here...largely, because I love this channel, and having these two things in one video is something I wouldn't have passed up for anything. That I've been listening to this song for many years, yet never bothered looking it up, says something about how lazy I can be. But--you've filled me in, and the only work I had to do, was to sit and watch.

[@polandballofspace4226]

*WILHELMUS VAN NASSOUWE INTENSIFIES*

[@Jakromha]

*van

[@steyn1775]

@ v e r b i e d k o k o s n o t e n

[@danielcheslett9417]

Very enjoyable video, I think further videos on the highland clans would be very interesting. Maybe you could do a video about the Mackenzie clan's fall from providence?

[@ellenbroomfield388]

Where is the face reveal?

[@connorcurry1965]

Hes too handsome for us

[@drillsargentadog]

Also known as: what everyone who's ever listened to the Corries has known for years. They were clear about this whenever they introduced the song. Then there's the fact that Jacobite history is a bit of an obsession in the Scots folk circle, so this isn't news to anyone who sings the song (including myself). Finally, the song as written is accurate if you simply change "Cromdale" to "Auldearn", where the Jacobites were victorious. An anonymous bard mixed them up, and changed the original song about a defeat into a song about a victory. You have a lot to learn if you want to break into the trad Scots community, my lad. BTW: here is a beautiful performance of the ORIGINAL, historically accurate song: kzbin.info/www/bejne/hJ_Ho5-BZ9-efJY

[@mikethejacobite1025]

Long live the Jacobites

[@kylemcl20]

Didn't live very long

[@criffermaclennan]

We're a fractious bunch up here in the highlands and the animosity still prevails

[@tisFrancesfault]

You Scots sure are a contentious bunch.

[@criffermaclennan]

@@tisFrancesfault we could start a fight in an empty room given ten minutes or so

[@cycklist]

@@tisFrancesfault Well I caught the Simpsons reference at least!

[@teethgrinder83]

tisFrancesfault but we throw a great Hogmanay party lol

[@completely_blank9265]

*laughs in desmond rebellions*

[@captaintyrrell6428]

Gerald did nothing wrong. It was a Moriarity clansman that claimed his 'head money'.

[@user-bf2mp5vr2v]

The Corries

[@woodlandcreature8857]

Amazing video mate, will you be doing videos on Montrose campaign? Truly amazing stuff to read into A wee pronounciation tip, MacKay is pronounced Mac-eye

[@cam553]

Funny part is, he knew that as he pronounced it correctly the first time, then went on to blunder it two or three times straight after.. go figure.

[@steyn1775]

0:09 YES THERE IT IS!

[@jeffgraham2990]

This is awesome!!! Love reading about James Graham of Montrose

[@calamusgladiofortior2814]

If you can’t trust Scottish folk songs, who can you trust? Next you’ll tell me that you take the high road and I take the low road you’ll still end up in Scotland before me.

[@DavidHoodEdinburgh]

Well, as a Jacobite, I have always known that the song was the conflation of two or more battles....

[@abagpiperyoumetinmexico211]

for me haughs of Cromdale was just another pipe tune

[@inregionecaecorum]

Oh and while I am about it here is some more for you. "James Hogg, the Ettrick shepherd, later wrote a song about the defeat, which became very popular. Sometime later, an unknown bard added an exaggerated description of Montrose’s earlier victory over the Covenanters, at Auldearn, in 1645. This was despite the fact that Montrose had been dead for forty years before Cromdale. Who said that history is always written by the victor?" from iainthepict.blogspot.com/2011/05/battle-of-cromdale.html never mind that the pipe tune for the song sounds suspiciously similar to an Irish tune the Battle of Aughrim.

[@AlexeiRamotar]

James Graham the Marquis of Montrose was a great Scotsman. D

[@trumpsleftnipple9595]

So true!

[@Lord.Kiltridge]

MacLean joined the Jacobite side to oppose the Campbells.

[@andreascovano7742]

Where was hilbert, when the Lombard flag request was sent? (38th attempt pls hilly boi, what can a Lombard do against such relentless hate?)

[@robertmackay690]

Clan disputes pretty much seperated the clans. If all the clans hadve stood together as one against the government forces Scotland would've won. The government forces won the battle because of those clan's who fought for them

[@jamacinnes3140]

Alasdair Mac Colla and the battle of Lochaber and preceding march next surely?

[@charlesgrimmer6486]

Ah, Wilhelmus. Excellent.

[@dregonzo2012]

Quick correction: James II was never a closeted Catholic. In fact, he lost the throne because he was openly Catholic. Had he outwardly professed an Anglican faith (as his brother Charles II did) until his death, he probably could have kept the throne. It was his public conversion to Catholicism during the reign of his brother that forever turned public sentiment against him.

[@Gh0stClown]

As a side note, the Marquis of Montrose is a very interesting character in the story of the Wars of the Three Kingdoms. Essentially a man who prized loyalty very highly, but unfortunately his loyalty was to a succession of men who turned out to be utter dickheads.

[@petergray2712]

So he was the prototype for every person that ever worked for Donald Trump?

[@mcbunson]

What are the tunes you use for the backing tacks?

[@RoberttheFox0001]

Some of those songs really stretch the truth. This is a shame. Civil wars require much soul searching and hard decisions on both sides. Regarding the garbage song about Glencoe, I know of a story in which a certain McGregor singer was told something to the tune of,"If you play that lying -blank, blank-song again you will find your mole cut off and sewed to your tongue." Did the threat ever happen? I would have been a wee lad and unable to say, but it makes a colorful story. I certainly don't tolerate anyone playing it in my presence.

[@ricardoguanipa8275]

Can you make a video like a this about the Song "Lady Greensleeves"

[@beinnnabhfadhla6457]

Haugh is pronounce ho' btw and it would be Stewart not Stuart. .

[@Kierkergaarder]

Macken-YEE, no? The "z" is simply a holdover for a letter now non-existent I thought? Sorry that's nit-picking I know

[@Kierkergaarder]

Wait no my bad confused with Menzies/"Mengeis"

[@kieranfitz]

Also known as William the bastard in Ireland.

[@user-gw5df2br5k]

William the bastard was william the conqueror before he conquered

[@danboland3775]

And James was known as James the shit after he fled to France

[@captaintyrrell6428]

@Blah b- It was exactly that blind malignant factionism that the Williamites exploited to conquer Ireland and enact the penal code. The Irish always suffered loss in rebellion because they were so fractured by internal politics.

[@n.bastians8633]

There's a video on the Corries singing this song with a very short explanation of the situation beforehand. kzbin.info/www/bejne/npCZpoebmbyekJY

[@ganjafi59]

Ahh so Jacob is Latin for James. No wonder Harry Potter's father is translated as Jacob in Norwegian :p

[@RossGrahamFunston]

What the Covenanters did then reflect on where where are now as a great country, it’s just a shame you’ve still got these Jacobites that’ve watched brave heart too many times wanting to break away from a union that bears us a great allegiance.

[@OldStag72]

Your picture of the Cromdale Hills from 1.59 to 2.05 is NOT the Cromdale Hills. FAKE NEWS.

[@djstalin6962]

The Virgin William vs the Chad Olde Pretender

[@blackorder7561]

History is super intresting btw hilbert i need more info about 1400 to 1758 , + about the 1600 is almost nothing known/ i dont know much about, #dontletmoderneradestroyhistory #welovehistory #doyouknowhowigotthesescars

[@JohnDoe-vv5bz]

Did he just pronounce Mackay as Makay.....?

[@andrewobrien8325]

Oh come on! It's just a fun song! Is it really worth picking apart a fun song with bands like the corries admitting it's pure artistic license gone mad! If we called out all songs based on battles there wouldn't be any! Name me one that is accurate! There ain't one! Some songs even sing about events that never happened at all in any context of time! This song is harmless...I thought fake news was the sort of news that was fake and did some harm! What harm does this song do!?

[@drillsargentadog]

Thank you. I wrote a comment to the same point. It's actually a mix up of two different events (Cromdale and Auldearn), and the ORIGINAL song about Cromdale is accurate. Overall however, folk music and folk history is surprisingly accurate. Taking the usual lyric to Haughs of Cromdale as representative of folk song accuracy is unreasonable, since the song itself has such an intricate history.

[@andrewobrien8325]

Okay fair enough! Sounds like a fun tune.

[@lewisbenzie845]

But it's a fucking banging tune.

[@johnd2058]

*SIXTEENTH* Plz upload an edit without the background music -- it bleeds into your speech range, and I can't decipher your connected speech with anything in the way. Oh, and if you've run yourself through a space deletion filter, well, don't.

[@Theboyhoodbard]

THIS IS PERFECT

[@-XTD-]

Black dinner and the massacre at glencoe

[@iMertin90]

Stewarts****

[@thomassugg3422]

Nice video very interesting.

[@TheJazzax]

Don't ever face reveal Hilbert, it gets more viewers.

[@degenerate3288]

2/10 *FAKE NEWS*

[@jardon8636]

James II, stuart-stewart(from the stewards to the scottish crown,later kings of scotland), also having the title(dukes of rothesay,lords of the isles etc, right up too the present royals**) your right hillbert, james was a secret catholic, probably as his brother: charles II was too...both of them married foreign catholic royalty from modena in italia, and the braganza dynasty rulers of portugal.. as he was also king of ireland...over 89% of ireland was catholic, but only some 25% or less in scotland,49% in wales and cornwall*, and maybe less than 20% in england, according to the records,taken when charles II was the king of england,ireland and scotland.., history is often merely intepreted, in media,songs,historic fiction etc, its complicated.... william III (orange-oranje)was a distant relative of Charles I, through the elector of the platinate-stuarts....no suprise,that Queen Mary Stuart, would marry a foreign but protestant relative.... James II was closely related to Louis XVI the sun king, most royals...even in 2018 are either closely or distantly related, same goes for Elizabeth II and Princess Beatrix; King Wilem alexander & Prince Philip of oldenburg-gluttenberg(denmark-greece-belgium etc**)

[@iangoodnow6500]

Hilbert could you do you like top five Clan feuds in Scotland. 1.MacLeods vs McDonald's 2. MacGregor's vs Campbell's 3. Gunns vs I forget 4. Somebody else fill in the blank 5. Somebody else fill in the blank

[@louiswilliamson1540]

Clan Campbell vs Clan Lamont much better '-'

[@iangoodnow6500]

@@louiswilliamson1540 I didn't know the Campbell's got into a Donnybrook with those guys.

[@cam553]

Is that the one where clan Campbell hangs the Lamonts, including women and children? Perhaps I'm wrong, hopefully.

[@davidfindlay134]

Its pronounced haw

[@alandrome7886]

12806th

[@martinan22]

Why does evil always win?

[@maximumfun1078]

Because evil is live, it is in the name itself. It's an unholy pact that was made with santa ... I mean satan.

[@daveraves4206]

Yeh especially ww2

[@vasiledinciocanestiidejos9684]

:)

[@robvoncken2565]

We love WILHELMUS

[@irishengineering6472]

Not king of Ireland (my opinion)

[@netanyelrucker]

It's a good thing that everyone is entitled to their own opinion and not their own facts.

[@tisFrancesfault]

*tut tut tut* Hilbert, Hilbert, Hilbert, how can a have faith in your video when you can't pronounce marquis correctly? ;p

[@blacktemplar9499]

How cute, a English monarch thinks he can possibly defeat the GLORIOUS SUPERIOUR DUTCH EMPIRE

[@parisan9985]

And....Which one has a larger empire??

[@peder6909]

Dunmahglass