The Highs and Lows of Tears of the Kingdom ft.

[@jefferblue]

I like that Zeldamaster is green (courage), Zeltik is blue (wisdom) and HMK is red (power). Actual triforce heroes!

[@JaisonLJ]

Zeldamaster should have wore a green shirt to combine even more. Although this probably would clash against the green chroma key.

[@taniafontanez9792]

Literally thought the same thing!!!!

[@justaman3817]

I love how ZM just kept wanting to smile…JUST SMILE BRO! Haha nice dynamic here. Enjoying it.

[@sparktaylor8489]

I loved this podcast so much, it did get off topic a bit, but It never felt wrong, it really did just feel like a bunch of Zelda fans talking for 2 hours straight. I loved this group it felt super balanced, it felt very much so like a rock paper scissors thing for the most part. The energy was great, the discussions were on point. Do gotta point out the odd editing errors that would happen at around halfway with the little subject title things at the bottom, they seemed to overlap from the previous ones, and were a bit unreadable but it's a small thing so it's not to big of a worry. I do gotta say after hearing all the conversations in both fandom and this podcast, I feel like 80% of the problems with this game could be fixed if when we got the tear memories, if they transported us in the past to play very small portions of the game as Zelda, we can explore that more, we get more Zelda, we can get more Ganon, more interaction with the sages, you can even make it so you get more traditional gameplay where things are more limited and linear like classic games and dungeons. And this feels like a way where we can have the cake and eat it too, And a decent chunk of this can be handled with dlc, as you mentioned how botw gave us champions ballad we can get something similar for Totk but who knows.

[@Rustyhound-Cartoons]

Great idea. Tbh with 6 years of development that wouldn't be an unreasonable thing to expect in this game. Also DLC could easily correct the issue of the sky and underground feeling barren and underdeveloped. This game has so much potential but nintendo is stubborn as usual and refuses to listen to what long-time Zelda fans have to say. Even if 80-85% of player would happily pay for it. They decided the game reached it's potential upon releasing the game.

[@Zeldudes]

Thanks so much! And yeah, apologies for the editing errors in this one. You wouldn't believe the struggle to get this video to render out!

[@katayudeanonymous2909]

Revisiting that same hyrule for a third time would be a death sentence.

[@MedalionDS9]

I am not willing to die on a hill for this but I prefer TOTK over BOTW, it means something to me in a way that BOTW did not at the time of its release. While I was still very happy for the Zelda franchise to get more love and recognition and accolades then. TOTK speaks to me more overall as a package but understand if people didn't click with it... so to speak.

[@taker601]

I feel the same. BOTW had greater impact and hit harder as the first of its kind... but as a video game it isn't nearly as fun for me as TOTK. And even if TOTK lacks that impact, it improves on sooo many of the last game's biggest problems that I overall had a better time.

[@bilsuart]

The Wild Era’s Hyrule was designed FOR BotW and for me TotK moved a lot of things around and added stuff for the sake of change. It felt very disingenuous to me. I also feel like not playing in the past version of Hyrule or making the depths and the sky islands larger or the primary focus was a big mistake. I think for 6 years of development time it was a lackluster experience coming off the back of BoTW vs BoTW coming off the back of Skyward Sword. The Zelda series though, deserves a lot of praise for being one of the few gaming franchises to heavily change their art style and game feel with almost every iteration and I’m insanely excited to see what comes next and I hope Zelda changes ALOT. I feel like the Wild era was just a taste of Zelda’s potential!

[@speedude0164]

I was in the middle of a final Breath of the Wild playthrough by the time of Tears of the Kingdom's release and therefore didn't play it for a while, so when people were telling me about how crazy bigger the map is, I was sure the big addition would be a new world in the past. It just makes perfect sense as a way to keep Hyrule fresh, since this was 20 000+ years ago and we see in the cutscenes how different it looked. I can kinda see however how an open world where the events are already set in stone leading to another open world can easily lead to a whole lot of plot inconsistencies. Although I loved the Light vs Dark theme the Sky and Depths brought to this world, everything in those areas just feels the same. The Sky could've used more unique islands like the Zonaite Forge and Lightcast Island as opposed to 15 Archipelagos, and the Depths could've used more area theme variety.

[@lethallohn]

I've realized that the devs just let the fans figure out how stories/details could connect so they get more ideas for games.

[@thebluerodriguez4085]

Idk bro, I kinda would be satisfied if that was the case since a lot of theories were cool, but they went all for "and then all just disappear for fucksake", or "This massive piece of lore you got here, ha, means nothing to the game" 😮

[@lethallohn]

I fought Ganondorf normally the first time in TOTK. However, I realized you can just arrow him to death with rocket shield and bow flurry rush. You also don't lose your resourses so you might as well use everything.

[@MayDayEXE]

When you guys were talking about finding the balance between the old style of item progression and the new style of open world, that's why i love playing Zelda randomizers so much! They seem to strike that balance pretty well! I can start OoT with the ability to explore everywhere but have no items, i find the items randomly during my exploration, and that dictates where i can go next which leads to more discovery and exploration!

[@darvida719]

1:38:31 Man THANK YOU ! HMK finally speaking the truth about Zelda's way of handling things regarding Ganondorf's name and everything.

[@speedude0164]

I have a theory for Zelda's draconification reversal that I'm surprised not to have seen anyone bring up (though it did kinda take me a while to be fair). After waking up, Zelda says she understands how her draconification was reversed, stating that she was woken up by the feeling of a warm, loving embrace. Putting extra emphasis on the word "loving", does this not sound exactly like how Zelda's Light power was awakened in Breath of the Wild? It's essentially the opposite that happened here, where instead of Zelda's Light power being awakened from within her by her love for Link, her spirit is being reawakened from within a dragon born from her Light power by the love of the people close to her. The involvment of Rauru and Sonia's Light and Time powers would just be to increase the resonance with Zelda's spirit as she possesses matching powers. This theory is still far from perfect as the "love awakens" explanation is very easy to miss in Breath of the Wild and will still end up feeling a bit cheap without that context, and it's a bit difficult to believe that the 3 individuals shown could awaken Zelda in the same way Zelda awakened her power as we see very little of her relationship with Rauru and Sonia and the game is very hesitant to give Link any personal feelings, but it's by far the explanation I'm the most satisfied with as it brings everything full circle and seems to make sense within the dialogue. On a side note, those sky debris do actually seem to work the exact same way with Recall as other objects. The game only seems to remember the object's most recent movements, because if you drop any item and wait a while before using Recall, it will immediately reverse through those same movements. If the object moves a second time a little bit after the first movement, it overwrites that movement and causes Recall only to reverse the second. I've bumped into sky debris with vehicles causing them to move, and then when I try Recalling them to the sky, nothing happens.

[@iluvphillip13]

I thoroughly enjoyed your discussion of Ganon. As a writer, I'm keenly aware that story+characters is crucial, and it's hard to get interested in one-dimensional characters who never really develop. I think in the early years, Nintendo got a hit with Zelda games, and developed more just to keep selling games, without taking depth into consideration. The smarter developers eventually took the story, motivations, & lore more seriously as this became important to most faithful players and adds more fulfilling dimensions to the experience. I'd love to see a very Ganon-centric game, even if it's a spinoff, to expand & explore his character.

[@orikku]

OoT is truly timeless. I played it for the first time only a few years ago, and it’s one of my favourite games of all time.

[@ediblenebulas1164]

Been slowly working my way through this over the last couple days and the bit around 1:20:00 discussing final bosses is absolutely great. It's hilarious hearing everyone express their opinions with only the *slightest* amounts of bias 😁 I just love how it's kept lighthearted and fun, I personally love when podcasts go off the rails a bit

[@silentpoem]

i love seeing people talk abt zelda with this much enthusiasm it warms my hylian heart 🥰

[@shelinkzelda]

Before it was filled in, there was - even in Wild - a clear entrance point and stairs/path from Hyrule field to the Temple of Time, and everyone can enter the temple and pray at the statue. That's not the case in the Tears Sky Temple of Time. It's actually something that bothers me about a lot of temples - like if it's purpose is a testing/training ground, then okay, but if it's official original purpose is for prayer and a home for the acolytes, then why is it impossible for so much to be accessed? Without the Recall ability, you can't get to the goddess statue. How is the temple supposed to function when no one can use it? I get it's a game and puzzle for the players to solve, but unless a building is broken, it makes absolutely no sense for it to be so inaccessible.

[@ediblenebulas1164]

51:16 I've found this discussion point to be of particular interest with regards to future zelda games. Personally, I would love to see a combination of the two approaches: Imagine having a similar set of 4 main abilities, but instead of receiving them from small shrines at the start of the game, each ability is gained from a separate dungeon. These dungeons could be completed in any order. This would form the first 'half' of the game. Then, for the second 'half', you would complete dungeons that contain puzzles that require ALL four abilities to solve. Perhaps entry into the dungeons uses these mechanics, or they are simply progression-locked. This way, Nintendo can maintain the incredible and expansive open-air worlds from BOTW and TOTK whilst reintroducing a feeling of genuine progression that is arguably missing from the newer titles. In the best case, this approach would solve the traditional vs. open-world debate; in the worst case, it means more dungeons 😁 P.S. I also think this would improve replayability, as you could complete the first four dungeons in a different order to access their respective abilities in a different order, completely changing how the player experiences the world. On a repeat playthrough, you might decide that "Ability #3" is the highest priority for you, and hence would complete that dungeon first. P.P.S I had a thought about how one would solve puzzles within the first four dungeons - perhaps the player gains the ability within the dungeon, like in previous games (with items). However, they can only use that ability WITHIN the dungeon until it is completed, at which point they gain that ability as a permanent part of their arsenal. This would allow for two specific things to happen: 1. The dungeon's puzzles can have a coherent theme, and 2. The player can be introduced to the mechanic before they are left to freely use it in the world. In turn, these would 'train' the player before they go and use it how they please. Nintendo could even work their magic and, as in previous games, make each of the four boss fights revolve around the ability. For anyone who made it this far, I hope you enjoyed reading my thoughts. I would love to hear what you think about this talking point. Cheers!

[@amandaslough125]

Yup. This approach has the right mentality.

[@ediblenebulas1164]

@@amandaslough125 Appreciate it! 😁Thank you for taking the time 🙌

[@Ppilldd]

I got to agree with literally EVERYTHING that HMK says. The dude is a genius.

[@teina123]

Always a treat for me to watch and listen to you both😊

[@teina123]

Oh and HMK🎉

[@Ophmar4]

My thoughts on item and linear progression is that it just feels good. The items themselves are a nice surprise, and the world opens up as you find them. It also gives chests a bit more value, and I wasn't really too excited about finding a chest in BotW and TotK. The approach where you get all your powers at the start diminishes the anticipation of rewards, and can lessen the rewards found in the game as a whole. It also opens everything up to an extreme. Personally, I'd rather grow into a god than start as one.

[@pablojoel3217]

Love the 3 legendaries sannin of Zelda collabing together. I remember solving most of the shrines puzzle doing Ultrahand than Recall 😅 Keep up the great content guys.

[@soulboss9555]

I'm so glad y'all are back! I was worried you had quit.

[@HaruVibes_]

HMK was the first Zeldatuber I came across which he then showed me a whole new space I had no idea about back in the day. Will always be grateful because without him I would have never found people like Zektik and ZM.

[@litfilms_7]

Thank you for another great episode! This was so much fun! I’d love to see Bandit Games on a future episode!

[@DanHallow]

We can all agree that there is no better feeling than when you first got off the great plateau and realized how big of a world botw was

[@AtlasBear_007]

The conversation where it appeared that Ganondorf recognized Link and Zelda was one of the GREATEST moments in Zelda history... until the rug was ripped out from underneath it, haha! How the heck didn't the developers not see how incredible of an opportunity they had?! Still a fun game though, haha!

[@GeneralOlde]

How is it a missed opportunity?

[@amandaslough125]

​@@GeneralOldeInstead of an underwhelming time loop of the protagonists basically letting Ganondorf win early, we could've had the chance to properly connect the Switch games to the entire history of the franchise while making him even more menacing and in depth a villain in the process.

[@GeneralOlde]

​@@amandaslough125 Hyrule Historia is like Elon Musk: it says a lot of silly things. The whole concept of the Timeline (and by extension Demise's curse) is such a tired and unimaginative approach to storytelling when it's more practical for the various games to be different takes on the same overall story, hence why it's called "The LEGEND of Zelda." It's not supposed to make chronological sense.

[@themastersword1621]

Love TOTK and BOTW, they're my second and third favorite Zelda and all-time games (OOT still number 1 for both), but both still have their shortcomings/things they could have done better. Just makes me hopeful for the next game.

[@baileetraver2730]

I think Link never recovered his full hearts/stamina because he hadn’t recovered his arm- we didn’t get to see those after the ending. I think Nintendo was maybe trying to tell us that Link was never the same despite his powers from the Zonai arm

[@speedude0164]

He does gain more Heart Containers throughout the game on top of his own that he regains. I haven't counted, but I have to assume the amount of Heart Containers you find is the difference between this game's max hearts and Breath of the Wild's. By adding more Hearts, it gives them the opportunity to tease us again (I'm pretty sure they do it so you can switch Hearts and Stamina with the Horned Statue at any time, but it still hurts lol).

[@ShadowWizard224]

Breath of the Wild was more impactful and Tears of the Kingdom feels like a pale shadow in comparison. The fact that we had to wait 6 years just for it to come out and it ended up being just more Breath of the Wild was a little bit of a let down. The sky islands and the depths didn’t really add too much to the experience because it just felt tedious and repetitive. Sure there’s some resources to collect and enemies to fight but it didn’t really add up to the whole experience. My first time playing Breath of the Wild was one of the greatest experiences and journeys I have ever had and I didn’t have that same feeling playing Tears of the Kingdom. However, Tears of the Kingdom soundtrack is absolutely amazing and it’s honestly my favorite Zelda soundtrack along with Skyward Sword. The music is absolutely amazing.

[@azer86x]

"Wisdom is not Intelligence!" Love that line and so so true

[@linkle123]

I realise that I’m like 7 months late in commenting this, but I absolutely love how these three are the perfect triforce.

[@JoshyG]

If we were to get a third game w/ this Zelda and Link I think it would have to take place out of this hyrule, in some neighboring area. Otherwise, I feel this map would be overstaying its welcome

[@andrushively5266]

Why doesn't the pod update on Spotify? Only realizing now that I'm here that a 4th had come out lol

[@RetroGoosen-ux8ty]

I don’t agree but I do agree because it is that way u know what I mean and that’s why it’s the greatest Zelda game ever and the other one isn’t u get what I’m saiyan? Yeah that game that one it’s just got this vibe to it.

[@masteraustin11]

I love Tears of the Kingdom as a Zelda game, I consider it better than breath of the wild, but only by a little. Breath of the Wild changed how I looked at the Zelda series, and it made so many memories for me. Personally, when you guys asked HMK what got him into doing youtube, I would have the same reasoning. I have my own channel which was literally inspired by yours guy's separate content on both your channels.

[@speedude0164]

I love how although Tears of the Kingdom's game mechanics make Breath of the Wild seem like a tech demo, it still doesn't render Breath of the Wild obsolete. The game still has its own identity with different themes and a different atmosphere. The transition to Tears of the Kingdom was a bit awkward in some areas, namely with the Sheikah technology, but where Breath of the Wild's Hyrule felt like it was barely managing to survive against the threat of the Calamity, Tears of the Kingdom's feels much more alive, as if the world is growing into a fully functional nation again.

[@alysupersmashshow]

I would love another final wild era game to end of the trilogy. I was thinking the game should either be called, The Legend of Zelda: Realms of the Universe, or the The Legend of Zelda: The Lands Beyond, where its the same link and zelda, but its like wind waker style, where you are sealing the seas, undercover 48 new islands the size of hyrule, new bosses, return of dungeons, new enemies, a companion, and just the final ending of this wild story which i think would be awesome.

[@ABAUTOAMG]

Loving the podcast guys. Have been following you all since the early days when Zelda U was announced which of course became breath of the wild! Keep it up.

[@brycelundstrom4248]

I think putting like two blockades in the way but all items available is a good marriage, like you can "rent" one item at a time like in Link between Worlds, but a later story or dungeon requires 2 of said items and you cant get there until you can "rent" or you own both items to move on. Which you gain the ability through a more linear story progression

[@bubphasmolarek4228]

Great podcast, love that you bring other Zelda fans to talk it out with them. What I would like to hear is someone who share a sort of mine perspective and joined Zelda Fandom within last 2 games ( BOTW and TOTK ) and is trying to figure out, what the heck is so special about Dungeons and why all of you missed them so much :) Seriously I am half way through Zelda Skyward played 3 of those dungeons and so far I got much more fun with for example exploring beneath Hyrule Castle in TOTK and wandering what is down there and finding parts of soldier armor, some info about Hyrule past and tunnel to Landing. I hope I will see what is so special about dungeons by the time I finish Sky Ward sword, but so far, random tunnels, caves, islands, half of Divines beasts and most of temples in TOTK are better then those dungeons (3rd one with time switching crystals was very good I have to admit).

[@michaeldelloro3148]

Space train with portals. Let's go Zelda team.

[@vianabdullah2837]

I think if there was a BOTW 3 it would have to be drastically different because they've already done everything possible with this iteration of Hyrule. Either Link and Zelda have an adventure in another land and the story is really unique like Link's Awakening or Majora's Mask. Or set it in the same continuity of Breath of the Wild but in the far future when Hyrule is an industrial society.

[@Snorlink]

Awesome! Another podcast!!

[@warpio]

HMK really brings a great balance to this group, with his more positive biases on TotK to balance out ZM's more negative biases. It was really fun listening to them hash out where they disagreed. Zeltik I think is kinda in between the two of them, with a decent amount of both criticisms and praises. ZM is kinda overly negative though, which Zeltik alone doesn't quite balance out and it makes the podcast overall feel quite negative when it's just the two of them, so this was a pretty good breath of fresh air.

[@speedude0164]

I agree with most of what HMK said and I've gotten really annoyed at how overly negative Tears of the Kingdom discourse has been these days, but he did get on my nerves a bit with how much he talked over people and tried dominating the conversation. Still this was a great discussion overall, and this balance of positive and negative is really refreshing to see.

[@benjj.]

ZM is DEFINITELY not over hating. Many real Zelda fans such as myself, who played the games before BOTW, were dissapointed with how Nintendo treated the story and writing in TOTK. Alot of it sucks. However, it's juxtaposed by easily the greatest gameplay in any of the Zelda games, and ZM would agree with that. It's tough because there's sooo much to love and sooooo much to be dissapointed by if you are a big Zelda fan. But maybe that's a matter of opinion.

[@Evan-cf3ot]

@@benjj. how do I join this group of "real" zelda fans?

[@EchosOfWhiterun_5555DocOfStyle]

​@@speedude0164he was indeed trying to dominate the conversation and it was hard to watch at times...

[@EchosOfWhiterun_5555DocOfStyle]

I enjoy the *Dudes* being the way they are and having someone new come in is okay. When they try to *dominate* the conversation though, that's kind of a problem. *Luke* and *Ed* do just *FINE* on their own, but I enjoyed having someone *NEW* coming in to give their fresh opinion. I just wish that he didn't *dominate* the conversation all the time and would allow the others to get more of a word in though. You could see and almost feel how *Uncomfortable* the *Dudes* were during some of the conversations!!! ~ JonseyG 👲

[@TheZebbga]

Really want more of these podcasts

[@mljh11]

1:24:00 Sorry HMK, OoT has lots of flaws. I don't have any nostalgia bias for the game since I played it for the first time a few years ago when I was already an adult, and from a game mechnics perspective I never want to play it again. I will say that as an emotional experience though, it's probably the best in the series.

[@legomaster2538]

My biggest low about TotK was how the Sages were handled during the fight with Ganondorf and the Demon Dragon. Before TotK was released, my biggest hope for the game was that Link and his would fight Ganondorf as a team. So when the ancient sages task the new sages to fight the Demon King alongside Link, you can imagine how hyped I was to have this prediction come true. While I was grateful for the time I had with Link and the Sages fighting Ganondorf 6 on 1, I *was* disappointed however when they got knocked out halfway through the only phase where they fight Ganondorf directly. I would have preferred having the Sages continue to fight Ganondorf in the next part of his Demon King phase even if the phantoms are dealt with. If they're defeated, just have Ganondorf restore his health. Even with the sages, the third portion of the fight would still be challenging. Additionally, after Ganondorf's health is restored and the sages are knocked out, have that part of the be about survival until the sages get back up. Bassically the same as Zelda during the final battle of Wind Waker. Adding insult to injury is the fact that the Sages were left in the Depths during the Demon Dragon fight. As amazing as the ending was with Ganondorf's death, Zelda turning back into a hylian, and finally catching her was, the Sages being stuck in the Depths during all of that was too distracting and sadly soured the ending for me. The developers could have handled that so much better by having the Sages cheer Link on during the fight with the Demon Dragon, congratulating him as Ganondorf nears his end, and then (if you've awakened all five of them) rejoin with Link as he and Zelda gaze upon Hyrule Castle.

[@speedude0164]

I get what you're saying. I also wished for more interaction between the Sages and Ganondorf himself, but I get that they wanted to make them more useful by distracting enemies you'd otherwise have to fight. For the 3rd part it's really a matter of preference. I liked how Ganondorf ended the fight by challenging Link to a fair 1v1 after regaining respect for him, but the 5 Sages teaming up with him to finish Ganondorf for good would've been great too, especially with them getting back up like you said and maybe hitting him with their own special attack throughout the fight. In the case of the Demon Dragon though, I like how it has zero dialogue between Ganondorf swallowing the stone and Zelda waking up, and it just lets you take in the amazing setpiece depicting Light and Dark's final battle. I will admit though it is a bit comical going back to that ending with Zelda knowing the Sages are still hanging above the pit of hell. They're lucky Gloom's Origin didn't completely disintegrate after Ganondorf's death.

[@vianabdullah2837]

You could combine the new set abilities and traditional items in one game. Because even if you already have the ability to climb things, getting a hookshot would make traversing the world a whole lot easier.

[@MaxSvensson-p9z]

One thing i've noticed with Ganondorf in the final battle is that he copies Link. You know how Link have the whole weapon variety like Spears, 2 Handed and 1 Handed weapons? Well so does Ganondorf which he keeps switching between. He also has a Bow. Just like Link, Ganondorf have everything except a Shield.

[@travisfrench4708]

I’m surprised you guys didn’t really go into detail about the Depths and the Sky Islands and how they were pretty underwhelming because of how a vast majority of them were copy paste. Especially since the Sky Islands were the main advertisement of the game, and there was so little to do up there.

[@ShadowWizard224]

Exactly. The sky islands and depths were underwhelming and very repetitive and it seems like the game overall was going for quantity over quality.

[@iluvphillip13]

I think they talked about that before, in an earlier podcast episode.

[@mylittlehyrule]

i love the idea of hyrule being properly built up and having a thriving civilisation but i know it wont happen 💔

[@EchosOfWhiterun_5555DocOfStyle]

@ZelDudes: I really enjoy listening to the commentary because it's nice and fresh. You guys really put in a lot to make sure that we understand what's going on and I appreciate your patience and yet love for the series. It's good to have criticism, but it's also good to have admiration for it as well. I never find myself getting frustrated with you guys because you make good points!!! When will we be getting Episode #20 of *Skyward?* ~ JonseyG 👲💖

[@majorblazer8808]

I like thinking the Zonai battery cells as a magic meter.. it IS green and the technology IS pretty wild, one may say magical, even 58:22

[@MelissaP.]

Botw 3: The Return of Kass!

[@silverbemyname]

I like the new opening!

[@ShepherdsCreek]

Zelda has had aspects of sci-fi almost forever (majoras mask Romani ranch, anyone?) So I feel like it isn't a stretch to make that a bigger aspect going forward. I don't want zelda to become exclusively sci-fi but I'm totally fine with it becoming a bigger aspect in some future games.

[@Aktedya1-jt7vw]

To be fair, Majora's Mask treated that whole situation as very not normal. It didn't even give "them" names. But yeah, I don't mind a but more ficus on sci-fi

[@ShepherdsCreek]

@Aktedya1-jt7vw majora's mask is still only one example. Skyward sword and twilight princess both had ancient tech and aspects of sci-fi too. I'm sure you can think of other examples throughout the series too though.

[@dekulinkgamer2789]

i love both Zelda and kingdom hearts i just love going on a magic filed journey to fight evil and wield magic swords

[@ainsleymcke]

I personally feel like the Breath of the Wild soundtrack does not lack in comparison to how great Tears of the Kingdom's soundtrack is. If you think about how the game is literally called "breath" of the "wild", it is also about nature. Some of the most magical moments in the game are when it's quiet and you're just listening to nature. So, I think there was a perfect mix of music and nature sounds throughout the game. I also think the sound of the game was really important when you look at it in that ~wild~ perspective. You were in nature nearly the entire game. My favourite song in breath of the wild has to be the Dark Beast Ganon battle music. It is just so perfect in every single way.

[@1996Stein]

Hearing a mummified Ganondorf name drop "Link, Zelda, and Rauru" in the first cut scene made me SO HYPED Until I learned who the "first King of Hyrule" was and that the game had cyclical time travel (still cool, but not as cool as having THE Imprisoning War and the original 7 sages getting their due)

[@munohlow]

I don’t mind sci-fi elements as long as they do a better job of visually dressing them as fantasy. It feels less special when outfits and items look like I could buy them at any sporting goods or home renovation store

[@brycelundstrom4248]

I agree with Zeltik that things look kinda goofy, i would really love to see ( assuming that fuse would not be coming back in the future, which i think is reasonable), a crafting item or something that functions similarly to fuse, that instead of sticking it on the end, its like a blacksmith went at it and made it seem like a cohesive weapon instead of a mushroom glued to a stick. I think it worked for this game but future would make the weapons look better. Also would fit a more mature zelda to have the weapons look like a blacksmith took the two parts and built them into one, with less childish bulky or funny looking weapons. Although i think a few small funny looking weapons is fine and appropriate, but significantly less than the sleek killing machine weapons.

[@angryasian7654]

Honestly. If they made a botw 3, they should make a plot point where the entire map is mirrored. At leasts it’ll feel somewhat new again

[@shelinkzelda]

The soundtrack is magnificent

[@DarknessGuard]

I didn't like any dlc BotW had so I can do without similar stuff in TotK but I REALLY wanted to know more about Dinraal, Naydra and Farosh since they as well should have been Hylians or part of any of the other races way before the game or even the founding of this Hyrule. I was already curious about those three in BotW (and during AoC hoped maybe that dlc will shed more light on them) but with the Dragonification introduced I wanted to know about them even more. Now, the thing with progression and difficulty... I guess I would sum it up as: "The price for the freedom in solving puzzles and exploration was a coherent narration and a better progression in what shrines and temples/dungeons could do."

[@hyrulewarrior]

THANK YOU HMK for being here and let them know how WRONG they are 😂😂 jk everyone has their own opinion, but i do agree with ZM I would love a more fleshed out game where they go deeper of in between, great episode guys!

[@shelinkzelda]

I only just defeated a Lynel after about eight tries, away and chase yourself with your golden enemies! 🥺

[@Joe-ik1ph]

A BotW 3 would be nice to have, but my thoughts were a bit simpler. It would basically be about Master Kohga deciding to become the big bad instead of keep serving the big bad. We would also play as Zelda instead of Link to mix things up a bit. Also, personally, BotW 3 would need to end with an obvious Zelink ship. Possible with them getting married. I'm still a little bummed that we won't get any DLC for TotK. Like ZM said, we only really need Master Mode, and it would be great if Nintendo just gave it to us. If there were to be additional DLC, I don't want it to be super similar to the DLC in BotW. Instead of having a gauntlet challenge like Trial of the Sword to increase the Master Sword to it's full strength, I would rather have a set of main quests like Champion's Ballad. The Master Sword has a bigger role in TotK, so I feel the upgrade method should reflect that. Maybe it could involve the other three dragons, and maybe another large sky island could appear. I'm not sure. I just don't want it to be, the Zonai created a bunch of trials that will increase the Master Sword to it's full power. If there would be a gauntlet challenge like Trial of the Sword, then it could be applied to the sages.

[@speedude0164]

I really don't want a BotW 3 since we've already seen that people are sick of this world and this game's ending was the perfect conclusion to the era of the wild. If they can make it work however, I'd love a game that's solely focused on rebuilding Hyrule without having to worry about any monsters or Demon Kings, basically a post-game extended into a full game. I can see why Nintendo wouldn't wanna do that though, and moving on to the next era is probably the correct decision at this point. I'd also really love a Master Sword upgrade like in Breath of the Wild, but from what I understand the sword doesn't actually lose durability when at full power in this game. That sounds more overpowered than what Nintendo would be willing to give us, especially with weapon decay boosting the Master Sword's base damage much higher above the average.

[@iluvphillip13]

Shout-out to Luke for sticking to his guns over Twilight Princess!! heeheehee

[@EchosOfWhiterun_5555DocOfStyle]

I think that was awesome of him and I agree with his statements about that game. I love *TP* just as much as he does, maybe... ~ JonseyG 👲💖

[@themastersword1621]

I think the Wind Waker Ganondorf is still the best due to being a more complex and nuanced character. But as of now Tears of the Kingdom Ganondorf is my favorite. He's never felt more threatening and more powerful, whether as a decrepit mummy or fully revitalized. I also agree with HMK's assessment that this version of Ganondorf is more in line with what the character has historically been: a power-hungry tyrant who wants to rule. I also don't really agree with the assessment that he wasn't as involved as he should have been. I would have gladly taken more Ganondorf scenes, but compared to previous games, this is the most he's ever been shown.

[@speedude0164]

That's pretty much exactly how I feel. He definitely surpasses Ocarina and Twilight's versions for me due to retaining his manipulative and cunning nature and his sheer badassery being cranked up to 11, but Wind Waker's is the only one I'm not sure on due to how fascinating his writing was in that game. The way I see it though, that writing was more of an exception for him due to Wind Waker's story as a whole. He built his whole identity on seeking to conquer Hyrule, and Wind Waker explores his reaction to a world where there no longer is a Hyrule to conquer. Tears of the Kingdom had a more traditional Zelda narrative and therefore a more traditional Ganondorf, and I think they did that about as well as they could've. The only problem I have is that it isn't really clear what he actually wants, whether he wants to rule Hyrule or destroy it, but the Ancient Gerudo Sage does say his obsession with power turned him into a monster, and that's kinda always what his character has been.

[@c9ja456]

Have to agree with Luke about TP final battle… although I do Do like TOTK final battle also…. Just wish Nintendo could allow some of the team to do some DLC work for TOTK and get the rest to focus on the next thing

[@shelinkzelda]

I love Tears, but there are disappointments and frustrations. The greatest of these for me is that the Master Sword is still so weak. It's not the strongest weapon in hit points and it still runs out of energy after millenia of empowerment? That's hinky.

[@lumotorilla]

Are you guys gonna discuss your thoughts and hopes for the next zelda game? It would be interesting to hear your thoughts!

[@Evan-cf3ot]

I think that difficulty does not matter because they are all easy

[@shelinkzelda]

There should be more in the sky - the empty underworld makes sense to me though

[@LinktheCommunistWaifu]

I really like this podcast.

[@created3612]

TotK’s greatest issues to me is that it’s too similar to BotW so it doesn’t feel as impactful, and it’s also too open. Zonai devices, skies, and Depths didn’t really reinvent the world or gameplay enough as they feel sorta half-baked. Its openness also sort of strips tons of immersion and progression out since a lot of challenges and puzzles can easily be cheesed, the open story format also ruins how it’s delivered. I still love the game, but BotW is just closer to my heart because everything was completely new.

[@BruceBoyde]

HMK mentioning message boards makes me wonder if we ever ran across each other back on the Nintendo NSider forums. Crazy thinking that those original ones closed 17 years ago now.

[@bazwert]

I'm so down for a full on scifi space zelda if its done well. Star Wars has a lot of medieval aspects to it. They could even go the route of steam tech and airships.

[@bazwert]

Would love if the next Zelda was linear with more freedom than classic Zelda and had Majora's mask side quests. Linear gameplay like Jedi Survivor

[@gaara_of_the_desert1118]

I love how every time they bring up major story issues HMK always has some bs excuse ready to defend the game. It's honestly kind of impressive the levels of copium on display. To be clear, no hate, I do this all the time with my favorite games/shows.

[@DemetePapi-hq6zj]

My man ur reaction HMK to the Ganondorf mentioning rauru, I was also wired ash, that was so raw and I was all for the connections but whatever, I still love Zelda its not like it got worse for making more zonai context. Adore ur guys' content 👍.

[@kujo64-tv1dj]

Is this episode going to come to Spotify?

[@Pixelguy9]

Man, I wish TotK turned Master Mode into a New Game + sort of thing; all they'd need to do is upgrade every enemy two levels instead of one and add gold versions. Easy! (And they should have added Kass too, I'll never forgive them for cutting him out of the game completely...)

[@brycelundstrom4248]

HMK you are crazy. But so crazy sometimes it makes sense.

[@Zerolink30]

Personally, i think Nintendo missed their chance to reintroduce the Triforce on this Hyrule. Let me explain, imagine instead of Rauru and Sonia appearing to save Zelda at the end, they appear one at a time just to tell Link, R "I'm sorry, there is nothing we can do for her, Link" S "our power may not be enough Link, but not all hope is lost. Back when i was young, there were stories/legends of an all-powerful relic created by the Gods. The legends said this relic could grant any wish as long as the person making the wish was pure and had a balanced heart." R "that could be worth looking into. Link tell the others to search the ruins high (Sky) and low (Depths) for any clues left by ancient settlements." Yeah, there is the possibility that Zelda has the Triforce as we saw the insignia on her right hand a few times during BotW, but that has never been explained nor completely proven that Zelda has it for some reason. But that new ending could explain that we would have either found the Triforce somewhere in the world or enough evidence that Zelda's bloodline at some point in time found a way to fuse the Triforce unto themselves. Passing on from mother to daughter for generations.

[@Awells549]

I love the intro. Very cool edit

[@k.b.7718]

After some time, HMK has to start being obnoxious again it seems. Also keeping the sunglasses on can be seen as rude. Looking forward to different guests, maybe Liam Triforce?

[@AidanRatnage]

1:56:00 my 6th shrine in BotW was a major test of strength. I did it with 3 hearts. It's very possible.

[@neogotham2k39]

Tears Of The Kingdom is a good game but it has no ice themed dungeon just like Skyward Sword

[@jiographic]

it’s missing a forest one too sadly:/

[@camerontrue]

Yes!!!!!!

[@wert556]

See if they had blacksmith, it would be so damn generic. I love the Fuse ability and besides the break point does so much satisfying damage

[@amandaslough125]

The series has lots of blacksmiths though.

[@crankylink13]

Is it weird I like botw better

[@Bashchannel13]

Nope.

[@travisfrench4708]

Nah bc so do I

[@DooodOfLife]

I've seen plenty of people who feel this way. I'm not in that camp, but I understand people who are. Both games are borderline masterpieces for me.

[@daveyboygenius]

It has a better feel

[@grindkagethefirst5975]

I like both equally , totk now much more cuz it’s new but in a year or 2 I’m sure I’ll like both equally cuz they are similar and also very different in their own ways , lovely games

[@willian1917]

do we really know what are those weird voices in the background? Are they zonai? I haven't seen anything about that in game

[@strangerimage400]

It’s like y’all were born for this podcast thanks for the A1 content

[@wert556]

Tears of the Kingdom is a Masterpiece

[@bradhedgehog12]

Hey dudes

[@Diogo_7237]

As crazy as this sounds I don't doubt the make a third BoTW.

[@louloukas8821]

Good morning zeldudes I have a question have you guys ever listened to DragonForce the power of the triforce and if you did could you name all the Zelda games that they sing about

[@duke7037]

What happened to age of calamity

[@RainbowLove487]

I mean.. SpongeBob lives in bikini bottom.. 🤣 there are a lot of adult themes in that show...

[@ainsleymcke]

I think Zeltik is so cute i cant help it

[@jebebebebebeb]

mfw he has a gf

[@GeneralOlde]

Not sure what was unsatisfying about Zelda's sacrifice being undone by the people who had the strongest connection to her. It was entirely within the realm of possibility as established by the Gerudo memory, and draconification was only "permanent" as far as the characters knew. All Rauru and Sonia did was amplify the time powers Zelda gave Link early on in the game to rewind Zelda back to her original form. It's a beautiful ending.

[@amandaslough125]

As far as they knew, it was irreversible. And both Rauru and Sonia were supposed to be dead dead, but their spirits came back just to save the day. But Sonia didn't even talk to Link prior to this moment. And there was no indication the time powers can go back _thousands_ of years when previously the time powers were just used to reverse when an object has fallen or something simple. Not undo a magical chemical reaction. Not to mention, Zelda holds no memories of the incident, so she literally sacrificed nothing during this endeavor. So overall, it's a victory we didn't earn without any consequences.

[@GeneralOlde]

@@amandaslough125 Sonia spoke of wanting to meet Link in the memory where she explains to Zelda how time power works (coax out an object's memory and return it to its original state, which is basically what Link et al do to the Light Dragon). Zelda having no memory ties back to the fact that she lost herself while she was a dragon, so it makes sense she would have no memory of that time. The bellyaching over the mechanics of the ending are quite silly. It wouldn't make any narrative sense for them to build up Zelda's character in BOTW only to kill her off in TOTK. Both games are essentially her story and hero's journey. The ending was just Rauru and Sonia's way of fulfilling their promise to Zelda, and they could only do it then by amplifying Link's time power which Zelda had given to him.