The ILLEGAL game mechanic

[@sillydumdummy6976]

Both copyright laws and patent laws are fucking insane sometimes. They're easily exploitable, especially by big companies, and they're super fucking vague and unclear sometimes too.

[@dustinm2717]

Both copyright and patents needs to be scaled back quite a lot They were created with good intentions (encouraging creators to be rewarded for their creation by providing protections against getting ripped off) but they've become worse than the problem they tried to fix At the very least Software patents need to just be eliminated entirely, and copyright needs to be vastly shortened

[@spootymaniacs]

@@dustinm2717 meant for small creators but behold, corporations are abusing them just like they do with everything. anyways yeah they need an update to stop these stupidly unnecessary cases.

[@anon_y_mousse]

@@dustinm2717 We need to take copyright law back to 1791. 14 years, 28 if you went through the effort of renewing it and *done*. They also need to revise the law so that patents and copyrights can't be sold, that is a seriously scummy tactic.

[@cheema8649]

Patents and copyright are a massive mistake. Not only they put on hold all market competition possible in that specific field but they also are a complete joke in the way they work (the biggest example is insulin in the USA, they just make a new patent with another molecule so similar that using the old one also counts as plagiarising the new one). And is better if we don't talk about copyright, until your death **PLUS 70 YEARS**

[@ziggyzoggin]

I think the bigger problem is that sometimes they are reasonable but damaging to the community like Nintendo inventing the dpad. Sure, it was unique and they invented it but Nintendo should've given everyone the opportunity to make it so that we as a game making community could grow. Human greed is the worst.

[@bjornnilden260]

there was a game called "cleanup service" in the 80's that had a loading screen mini-game. I truly cannot understand how they could have patented an idea that was already used by another company.

[@SomeBlokeOrWhatever]

Because the bureaucrats who grant the patents are all 5.0000 year old ancient men who have no idea what a video game is. So as long as the company filing the patent is sufficiently dishonest and doesn't TELL THEM about existing stuff using their "new invention", they can get away with patent squatting.

[@important9836]

It's very much a "first past the post" system. As long as they could patent a mechanic that was *slightly* different from anything else at the time, they could then expand the patent definition to affect anything even remotely similar created later. Copyright and Trademark law is similar. In Canada, there was a case a while ago in which a company called "The Brick" secured the rights to their name, and then sued another company called "The Brick" (who had been operation for more than 10 years prior to the first company) out of existence for infringement.

[@Dowlphin]

Through the magical power of capitalism.

[@SnakebitSTI]

While prior examples of something are _supposed_ to prevent later patents on the same thing, that's up to the patent office to figure out. If the USPTO doesn't do their homework and grants the patent, then it becomes a matter to settle in a court of law. And as mentioned in the video, actually going to court over patents is so expensive that there's a whole industry centered around getting settlement payments for infringement of dubious patents because the victims know it's cheaper than going to court. The patent system doesn't exist to protect innovation, it exists to protect wealth. Having lots of money to hire lawyers is more important than having a good patent or a good argument for why a patent is invalid.

[@Umkarz]

I wish someone in America put a patent on movie scenes where The Hero lets the dying Villain live but The Villain still tries to shoot him, so the hero HAS NO CHOICE but to shoot to finish him off, therefore killing Big Bad with minimal moral liability.

[@sagehanson190]

I wish someone in America put a patent on fakeout deaths. Like seriously oh my fucking god it's become so overly fucking cliche that when a character ACTUALLY dies and DOESN'T COME BACK it's genuinely surprising.

[@zackattack9228]

Moral liability? If someone's shooting me, I am not going to sit there and debate about morals with myself 😭😭

[@ralfian0234]

@@zackattack9228 It's a work of fiction, they wrote it that way. 😭😭😭😭😭😭😭

[@ZILtoid1991]

And the licensing fee should be helping to reform the US patent system.

[@anamaaes9218]

Like Goku Vs Freeza

[@StereoBucket]

Recently I encountered a patent for, get this, finding an average of two whole numbers. It's so stretched out to fill as much paper as possible that I couldn't be bothered to understand it. Thankfully it expired. So yeah, if you're wondering how far companies will go in patenting the most basic shit, it's down to elementary school maths level. But they threw in some bullshit words to sound more complex so it's fine. Patent Granted.

[@metroboominauditorybellow563]

Man, that's seriously mean.

[@williamvargas2981]

If you don't understand it, how can you know it's "bullshit"?

[@bigboysdotcom745]

​@williamvargas2981 you're asking why a patent for basic math is absurd.

[@SnakebitSTI]

The basic principle behind patents is that they only protect methods of solving problems, not the idea of solving a problem, and only novel methods. Patents require complete descriptions of mechanisms, which are publicly published, so that others can benefit from the inventors work once the patent protection expires. That way inventors can get legal protection for their inventions, say for example a mechanism for a vacuum cleaner, and the public gets the benefit of clear documentation of the solution in exchange for the government protecting the invention for a limited time, but no one can say "I am patenting the idea of cleaning dirt off the floor with moving air" and then own the entire vacuum cleaner market for 20 years. And then there are software patents, which allow companies to lock down the _idea_ of a solution to a problem without even needing present a specific mechanism to solve it. Yeah. You can see how far the patent system in practice has diverged from the ideas which it uses as justification for its existence.

[@leonardoreyes1697]

Some game mechanics patents are really draconian, the excellent "Nemesis system" is one of the best examples of scummy behavior from publishers.

[@shimmysham8725]

Nice pfp my guy 👀🐝

[@DreddLypso]

Nemesis system?

[@FerreTrip]

@@DreddLypso Did you watch the video?

[@BlackBloodCombatClub]

Wait, no other series can use that feature? Damn, that sucks. Would've liked to see something done in a similar vein outside of the LoTR games.

[@polocatfan]

to be fair if I was the Judge in the Road Rage case, I'd probably have sided with SEGA too.

[@D0Samp]

Midtown Madness 1 and 2 (released in 1999 and 2000) fulfill all three components of the Sega patent: An arrow that points to the next checkpoint, freeroam rather than a closed circuit and pedestrians that run away if you get close.

[@AeRiaL_]

those are the games I was thinking when I saw the thumbnail because MM2 was my childhood

[@SpringySpring04]

Wow. As a programmer myself, I find it absolutely disgusting that software patents exist. It inhibits the creative freedom of programmers, because they might create a system similar to something patented and get sued for making something they thought was original! This limits the educational purposes involved with programming as well... that's so scummy...

[@ETXAlienRobot201]

patents actually do this to everyone. they're not a necessary evil, they're just evil. software patents are indeed one of the worst, though. hopefully EFF one day can completely abolish them.

[@nullvoid3545]

@@ETXAlienRobot201 agreed.

[@nullvoid3545]

This is why we cant have nice FOSS image editing programs competitive with tools from Adobe. They patented A bunch of intuitive interfaces and tools from Photoshop.

[@CLove511]

Found the Linux user! .... Seriously though, all my homies hate intellectual property.

[@Wylie288]

@@ETXAlienRobot201 Patents are important in some places. The medical field especially. Developing half the shit people literally survive on costs BILLIONS in research. NO ONE will bother if they can't profit. Without a patent, someone will copy it right away, and then anyone making an advance in the medical field won't even break even. Patent length should scale based on R&D costs.

[@xxedgelord420xx4]

It's time for someone to make a game that's just all these mechanics combined. Call it "The Illegal Game" or something like that.

[@willysuna]

And make every single asset including code CC0-licensed

[@purmello]

This presentation style is genuinely fantastic. I seriously can't believe you don't have more attention on your stuff.

[@Yveldi]

As much as I agree, I think her accent is part of the reason. I mean, I think she'll still succeed with this quality as people can get used to any accent... However, as a non-native speaker of English, at least the first few minutes of listening this video had my brain work pretty hard to get used to her accent. This makes it unpleasant to listen to the video in the background, which for me is the perfect way of consuming these documentary-type videos. I know this will immediately be regarded as "racism" by many, but I hope I'll get a free pass because I'm not a native English speaker myself, and I genuinely believe putting some work on her accent would help her get to where she deserves faster. But, what do I know? Maybe she isn't interested in that and I wouldn't want to demotivate her from moving forward (which I doubt I can do anyway, since her last video got over 100k views lol)

[@ClosestNearUtopia]

@@Yveldi you listen to videos!? I watch video and hear audio like normal people🫣🫠 and fo with your rasicm excuse, dont even throw it up, its noway racist you cant understand someone because they kept speaking their native language and now talk english in a heavy accent, choice-> result, i want to see some english speakers speak my language, I bet I will not understand a word what they try to tell me, and does that make me a racist?😲 dont feed the rasicm train, there is not much reason to feel 1: being attacked or 2: being attacked and reflect that at rasicm some things are just how they are, like this woman talking with a heavy asian accent. Makes me not a racist if I cant understand her, not wanting to understand he due to her asian accent, is rasicm tough.. realize people, stop excuse for rasicm because 99% of al white boiis arent. Stop feeding the rasicm train, or people approve excuses for for feeling in their case being negativly affected by rasism, but any other person would by affected by to..

[@Niosai]

+1 to this. Fantastic and thorough content.

[@minimik75]

@@Yveldi just turn on captions bro

[@Yveldi]

​@@minimik75 men( I know there are solutions, and paying more attention is one of them. However, for me, gaming documentaries are very valuable background-content. I listen to them when I play less-intensive games to make up for my short attention span. I reckon I'm not the only one who does that, but I hope I am a small minority for the sake of f4mi.

[@K-off]

But wasn't EA using pointy arrow above car to show directions in NFS Underground 2 and Most Wanted back in 2004-2005? Did they pay SEGA for that or got sued? Or did SEGA use their patent only against obvious clones of their games? I'm asking cause I very much remember this dumb arrow mechanic that never worked right.

[@ianism3]

not to mention the Midnight Club games, which not only had an arrow telling you where to go, but also the pedestrians behave _exactly_ like the ones in crazy taxi, _and_ the races were from checkpoint to checkpoint through open cities, instead of being walled-off courses within them.

[@wKraw]

легенда в комментах чееееее

[@K-off]

@ привет друг

[@wKraw]

@@K-off делаешь реальный пик спасибо за контент 🙏

[@nickwallette6201]

That minigame patent .. man, I forgot about that. That makes me so mad because, not only would it have made tons of games more fun, but _it wasn't that clever an idea._ I mean, * I * thought of that back in the early-mid 90s, well before I knew what a Bandai Namco was (and while I own Ridge Racer now, I still haven't played it.) A group of us nerds were talking on IRC about making our own RPG. I suggested having a game to play while it was installing. So installing vs. loading, but same concept. If *I* came up with it, so did other people. This was not a novel idea. C'mon, patent system. DO BETTER.

[@anon_y_mousse]

Indeed, patents used to be granted only when it was a novel and non-obvious invention. Now it's whoever submits their application first.

[@MirrorHall_Clay]

Yeah, doesn't help that by the time it ended the concept couldn't really work thanks to loading being much faster

[@BagOfMagicFood]

I heard it was first done in a Commodore 64 game!

[@creativebeetle]

@@MirrorHall_Clay Still applies for multilayer lobby queues.

[@redking36]

I didn’t even know that was a thing. Dragon Ball Z Budokai Tenkaichi 3 had minigames more or less, but it was just spamming a button to make Goku eat faster or Vegeta do more push-ups. Still, it made the loading more fun and even turned it into a competition.

[@HighTher3]

Patent laws stifled innovation in aviation in it's infancy. The Wright brothers held back Glenn Curtis from making progress for years. I grew up thinking the Wright brothers were the best, then I learned the horrible truth...

[@ETXAlienRobot201]

yay, more stuff to learn about... i'm already anti-IP tho :P

[@rumekfuria6037]

_I didn't even knew software patents exist and do so in such a way where just the idea is "protected", not the specific code_ and also the nemesis system being on the list... bloody hell

[@WindLighter]

specific code can be a subject of copyright laws

[@muizzsiddique]

Code is expression, the idea is usually the innovation they're trying to protect. It still sucks that they get 20 whole years.

[@masterhound5093]

@@muizzsiddique should be at max 2-3 years of protection take it or leave it..

[@MINIMAN10000]

@@xaracen7207 I mean get reading the actual patent because the patent was rejected for being overly broad multiple times until they finally accepted one with a specific set of features which was what was actually granted to patent.

[@SuperDicq]

The Midtown Madness games by Microsoft also used this arrrow but never got in trouble with Sega for some reason.

[@MurakDurak]

Holy shit this is underrated, definitely sticking around! i work for a patent firm in germany and went to a patent course in uni, and i learned that in germany, you cant just patent an algorithm or a procedure or something that just works with data or displays information; the software has to solve a technical problem to some degree (im not 100% sure what counts as a technical solution in terms of software). so if my problem is to give the player an arrow, thats just solving a math equation and showing the data on the screen, nothing to do with the underlying hardware. further more, there is a requirement for patents that they have to be innovative, meaning that you cant patent something that someone else of the same profession could have come up with after a bit of thinking. so solving a math equation to point the arrow in the right direction depending on the camera orientation isnt very innovative. and on top of that, the thing youre patenting needs to be new, so what you want to patent could not have been shown at presentations or published somewhere else before you file your patent application. i cant tell if there have been instances of on-screen arrows pointing in a direction in other games before crazy taxi, but if there have been then this isnt new either. theres lots of hurdles in germany and europe that try to make sure a patent is actually solving a real technical problem in a new and innovative way. so hearing that sega essentially patented a math equation and how to display the results is kind of hillarious and im not surprised that the patent completely failed here. however, patent trolls do exist here as well. theres also what i like to call patent wars, where to big companies sue each other for the patents they infringed on the other company. with companies like BMW and mercedes and their hundreds of patents, theres a point where there is no point in going to court anymore. so with the amount of patents they infringe they kind of let it slip, allowing each other to mutually infringe, which is also hillarious. patents are a wild wild world man.

[@anon_y_mousse]

What's really funny is that's basically the law in the US, but with regulators not doing their job, and generally not being able to due to being inundated with tens of thousands of applications, we have the system we have. Although, it sounds like you guys have developed the same methodology given your statement on BMW and Mercedes.

[@andrewvirtue5048]

Germany is just so much better in every way possible.

[@Starfloofle]

well, as someone who works for a patent firm, can you tell us if there's any reason why just destroying the idea of patents entirely wouldn't be beneficial for humanity in the long run because the entire system (which I believe was designed to protect innovators from having their work stolen by the very same megacorps) feels like it has pretty much been hijacked by bigwigs who want to use it for control instead of for anything remotely humanitarian anymore...

[@MurakDurak]

@@Starfloofle Yeah youre sadly right. But this isn't the fault of the patent, is it? In essence, science and innovation is driven by competition. The one who invents it first, patents it first. For inventors this means trying to get something new and innovative to be patented and then sold and used before any other inventor does it. This isnt far off from the free market of today-- and there we have the problem. Its the system behind it that allows it to be exploited, shit like patent trolls and these patent wars I mentioned. Money makes it easy to manipulate the system by either buying patents, marks, designs what have you from smaller corporations, or forcing inventors and smaller companies into law suits they cant possibly afford. Probably more reasons why the system is flawed but you get the idea. I dont think patents should be completely abolished - imagine you invent something and someone else claims your fame. We actually have several cases in our firm where an inventor goes to court because someone else literally just stole their idea, and this isnt uncommon by any means. But obviously if this someone else sits on millions of dollars to pressure you in some way, good luck with that.

[@bruhdabones]

Illegal is the wrong word. Violating copyright law is a tort, so it’s a civil violation and not criminal.

[@GlennDavidson]

It's patent law in this case, but you're right it's still a tort 🤷‍♂️

[@arkeus5246]

It's clear a lot of work went into this video and you managed to keep my attention all the way. Great job!

[@personperson8199]

sus pfp

[@AleK0451]

@@personperson8199 what

[@personperson8199]

@@AleK0451 if you know you know

[@AleK0451]

@@personperson8199 i dont

[@personperson8199]

@@AleK0451 do some research i guess

[@Scott...]

In Super Mario Odyssey, the overhead pointer only appears when you stand still. This is because Sega’s vision is based on movement.

[@poupdujour]

Very informative and stuff like patented game mechanics can be really frustrating but it needs to be talked about so other people don’t get screwed. Thanks for the content, well done

[@iidoyila]

i will use patented game mechanics with no fear , they are unfair

[@gircakes]

I’m making a fortnite racing map, and I quickly learned that there is an option to have a green arrow at the top of the screen point you to the next checkpoint in the race. I can’t imagine that being patented. Imagine how many games had to have unintuitive ways of leading the player to the next waypoint, just because the obvious solution was patented.

[@fabiosonhandogrande1697]

So yeah, software patents should be abandoned as a concept. Got it

[@marceloalmeida7355]

All patents should be abandoned. There is no such thing as intellectual property. That is an abomination. It is simply a way to create a monopoly.

[@WindLighter]

@@marceloalmeida7355 there are some instances when patents and copyright are actually useful. But that kind of laws clearly need to be reconsidered. Like protection duration must be based on how much work is done by IP owner, only protect the elements that are actually tested by the owner, and lots of other restrictions

[@JGHFunRun]

@@marceloalmeida7355 No. They exist to stop someone from stealing your idea, say you invent something that will revolutionize society, then some massive company just comes in right as you get the last details to literal perfection and steals your exact design. Patents allow for not having that without secrets, which are also bad. So it's secrets or patents which do you prefer? I prefer patents since they actually allow for verifiability. Claiming patents are always bad because the current system is F'd up is throwing the baby out with the bathwater

[@marceloalmeida7355]

@@JGHFunRun First of all, patents do not prevent anyone from copying your ideas; they only allow you to sue someone. So you are wrong. Secondly, you are committing a false dichotomy. Prove to me that there are only 2 options, because I can easily show that there are other ways, like open source projects, that do make a profit, and they are neither secret nor patents. I think patents are bad inherently. It is an ethical thing, not a utilitarian one. What you are saying is that I cannot build a house on my land, with my materials, in a specific way just because you thought of a design and you scribbled it on a piece of paper and claimed that no one else could copy it.

[@marceloalmeida7355]

@@WindLighter There is not a single instance where patents make sense, because it is not an ethical thing to do. You are basically preventing someone from using their own property because you have had an idea.

[@emagtresni]

Capitalism in theory: "It encourages innovation!" Capitalism in practice: "I legally own the rights to concept of shapes, I'll see you in court"

[@ETXAlienRobot201]

ironically, the concept of IP is actually 100% against free market capitalism. not that free market worked, anyways

[@Niuskayz]

Aight, screw it, I'm making a game where you play as a blind person.

[@YWNBAW69]

communism wont even let gaming exist

[@lynxf]

@@ETXAlienRobot201 "..not that there ever was a free market.."

[@ETXAlienRobot201]

@@lynxf yeh, it pretty much can't exist. to have anything resembling it, you ironically need to have regulation to prevent scenarios like the gigacorporations existing and copyreich eternal, because they in every way are the antithesis to the free market. in fact, IP is, period. no matter how you slice it. you're restricting the potential of others to compete in a fair and open market by locking-down a specific part of it. [and ofc, combine that with the corporations, you get disney that slowly approaches owning every relevant media company under the sun, exactly opposite of what copyright was intended to do]

[@SparksV]

The editing and pacing of this is great. Also the mario-prototype bit got me real bad. Great job on the video !

[@B-Roll_Gaming]

Wasn't expecting a time travel paradox halfway through this video essay

[@Henkibojj]

This is the sort of overly produced videos my brain thought would be easy to do and interesting to watch when I made videos in 2006. It turned out to be very difficult and as for interesting, it was so much cringe that I made my most terrible creations private even after tens of thousands of views for something as dumb as just filming a PSP update itself. You, however, have managed to keep it corny and interesting and entertaining at the same time. I am impressed and have now subscribed!

[@sonyviva308]

Midtown Madness developed by Angel Studios published by Microsoft has this kind of arrow as well for the entire series. Never heard any lawsuits issues from them.

[@RosalinaSama]

they also had the npc "aura" thing too

[@Sovic91]

7:25 "Remember! If a future you tries to warn you about this t̶e̶s̶t̶ patent, don't listen." But on the topic of the video, the 2000's Need for speed games used the arrow mechanic to show you your destination. I wonder what's up with that.

[@Peter97ptr]

Same here The only difference I can see is that the arrow in Taxi Driver points to the exact destination, and the ones in NFS show the way, changing their direction only at the turns. Although there is still the problem of barriers ... maybe Sega ignored the topic because they are racing games, not anything similar to their products?

[@BrandonHawkinRacing]

@@Peter97ptr The old Rainbow Studios and Angel Studios/Rockstar San Diego games used a similar method to NFS where the arrow would point to the next checkpoint in the race, although Midnight Club is interesting as it also pointed an arrow straight to the destination when racing someone to the start line of an event.

[@eddieru]

@@BrandonHawkinRacing i was looking through the comments to see if anyone else also remembered that the midnight club games had a 3d arrow to help you navigate the map too

[@shad386]

Haha yeah, I was thinking of NFS underground 2, I wonder if they made a deal or something, EA was a big enough company

[@DragRedSim]

I suspect there might have been a loophole abused here; the first game in the NFS series with an open world was Underground 2, and in that game, the arrow pointing to a destination never appeared automatically as far as I can recall. You had to manually select a target location, then the arrow would help you drive to it. By contrast, in Crazy Taxi, the arrow would automatically point to the next target as determined by the game, based on the passenger the player chose to pick up.

[@trstmeimadctr]

I have a patent for talking about patents with an accent on the internet. You'll be hearing from my lawyer

[@shrimpypyeah]

I'm glad I found your channel today, your contents are gems can't wait to watch your channel grow!

[@nonymouswisp8176]

Someone should patent jumping in a video game so that people would get pissed enough to change the law

[@vaporwavevocap]

Patents and copyrights aren't a necessary evil, it's just a skill issue from a producer that they demand the state protect their asses from an inability to produce products people will prefer over the competition.

[@fiona9891]

they would be helpful if they stopped companies from stealing ideas from individuals who do not have the resources to benefit from their ideas, but current legal systems are structured to favor people who already have more power

[@vaporwavevocap]

@@fiona9891 Just violate the law. Forget the legal system. Private property owners have a right to do what they want with their labor.

[@ProtogenPilled]

@@vaporwavevocap If only it were that easy...

[@vaporwavevocap]

@@ProtogenPilled It can be, if you make it that easy.

[@Cybersomnia]

Exactly, it's just a regular evil Most people are pretty respectful of this, fan games aren't ripoffs, they're projects to show the fans' love and appreciation Games that copy complex or iconic battle systems get called out or compared immediately Games will cel shading can't even get by without being called Breath of the Wild clones despite cel shading being around way before BotW did it

[@chillbizz74]

So these assholes are the reasons why so many cool features never appear in other games? This is just, DIRTY!

[@Caeleb1234563]

Midnight Club 3 had all of the things protected by that patent. I wonder how they got away with that. Also, The Simpsons: Hit & Run is not a Grand Theft Auto clone, it's a clone of the Driver series. The main distinction is that Driver has (usually) no guns and has all of those "chase the car and bump into it" missions.

[@TomokoxKuroki]

i guess sega couldnt be bothered to sue over it since unlike road rage it wasnt a literal clone? lots of other racing games, in the 2000s especially, also had both a "pointer" arrow and "guide wall" arrows and were set in a free-roaming city, most prominently need for speed. midnight club 3 is the only one i can think of that had all three, though... mc2 actually just let you run the pedestrians over and mcla changed up the arrow

[@antjeeismann4684]

@@TomokoxKuroki what does mc2 Feature of running over pedestrians have to do with a navigation system?

[@TomokoxKuroki]

@@antjeeismann4684 because if you actually watched the video, part of the patent was a system for pedestrian npcs to move out of the way when you drive near them so you cant run them over. midnight club 3 had this which is notable because it means that it "violated" all three elements of the patent and yet rockstar did not face legal action. this also separates it from the other games in the series, including the first game which didnt have pedestrians, and yes, midnight club 2 just let you run over them instead of them moving out of the way. meaning they still violated most of the patent but are not as flagrantly legally egregious because they did not violate every part of it. youre welcome for assisting you with your comprehension!

[@Zestyclose-Big3127]

I was thinking the same throughout the video, Midnight club had it and Midtown Madness had also had it before -(before Crazy taxi, even).- actually MM1 was released after Crazy Taxi. I really don't know how they got away with it. Edit: Like someone else commented maybe it's because the arrows only ever pointed to checkpoints.

[@Zestyclose-Big3127]

@@TomokoxKuroki I think Midtown Madness 2 had pedestrians jumping out of the way too, it always felt like an achievement to hit a pedestrian there. It had Microsoft's name on it so I don't think the jurisdiction would've been an issue either. No guide walls though (at least not for the most part).

[@matthewlloyd3255]

I've been a hobbyist solo game dev for about 40 years working in my 'cave' and I've probably infringed on a tonne of such patents without knowing it just by doing whatever seemed the most intuitive answer to various user experience problems that you need to solve when developing games from scratch each time.

[@-cj-]

Disagree, I believe patents are an unnecessary evil. Which helps society more? A single company holding onto a concept, barely using it. Or everyone competing to and being able to use the best concepts. Copyrights I get, it is your specific work. A patent I cannot.

[@silverdamascus2023]

Some patented things cost millions to make and years to develop, inventors and scientists don't work for free, sure, it would be a bummer if someone patented the cure for cancer, but at least it only lasts 20 years, however invents the cure for cancer, deserves to earn billions. Copyrights are important, but they last 95 years, not only it's too long, but it affects works that no one is using for anything while protecting the few works made more than 50 years ago that are still profitable.

[@kuberootwastaken]

The reason it's necessary is, without patents, companies don't have an incentive to innovate. Why put lots of money into figuring out a better way to do something, if the result is just that somebody else will take the idea you came up with?

[@Ferrochrome12]

@@kuberootwastaken corporate bootlicker

[@stevesether]

Patents work for something like a new miracle drug that costs billions of dollars to do the R&D, testing, clinical trials, etc... but producing the drug itself costs pennies. Without patent protection, most of those miracle pharmaceuticals wouldn't have been produced because someone else could just come along and make the same drug. It doesn't work for software, because there's almost zero innovation and research that goes into what's considered patent-able, and the main IP is already covered by what amounts to infinite protection of copyright. In reality though, patents often are treated like munitions. Large companies just stock up on them as if they were guns, bombs, and missiles, in case there's ever a "war" with another company. Then if threatened, they can counter-sue. There's also been cases where someone does invent something innovative, but if you don't have a large corporation backing you, it's hard to get anything. One example of this was Robert Kearns, who invented the interval windshield wiper. He tried to license his invention to the auto makers, but they ignored him. Later they created wipers with the same mechanism. He sued, and it took decades for him to win.

[@-cj-]

@@kuberootwastaken In the context of the video, I am specifically refering to software patents. I am a software developer and have no experience with physical patents. Open source software proves companies can innovate with equal competition. And by having it open, other developers can contribute to make a better product. Sure someone could make billions of dollars selling an idea, but I think a lot of people would way rather have better designs then a few billionares having a monopoly. I believe execution is far more important then an idea. Anyone can have a good idea, but it takes good execution to set that idea apart from others with the same idea.

[@flesh7330]

Actually, Donkey Kong was the first game to have jumping in it. Shigero Miyamoto was considering patenting jumping in video games, but he decided against it because he didn’t want to hinder so many other game developers in the future since it’s such a fundamental game mechanic

[@dexster8618228]

I always thought these patents applied to specific code segments not fucking basic concepts. Teaches me to give the American legal system any credit I guess. Great vid! Subbed!

[@ETXAlienRobot201]

the founders mostly had good intents and a noble vision. they made the mistake of leaving the law too open-ended and corpos exploited this. and ofc, got some good old fashion bigots making rounds, now.

[@satibel]

Iirc lawyers voted to allow lawyers to send letters for advertising their services after you get a fine or something like that.

[@ETXAlienRobot201]

@@satibel huh??? how's this relate to the topic at hand?

[@satibel]

@@ETXAlienRobot201 American legal system being totally functional and not corrupt/s

[@ETXAlienRobot201]

@@satibel well, yeh... but in the case of IP, you need to be insanely rich to be in court, period. if you don't have multiple millions, your case is lost. if you don't have more than the other person, your case is lost. generally speaking. the EFF is quite effective at leveling the playing field. but, that said, i doubt they're hurting for money to be able to challenge the individuals/entities they do. so, how this really relates here specifically, can't say i get... no IP lawyer worth having will be available to the people who actually need one, why bother advertising their services to anyone besides the ultra rich? someone sues you, bend-over and take it. [unless the EFF decides to defend you, or the claims are TOTAL bs that'd never fly] someone infringes you, take the loss. unless you happen to be disney, nintendo, umg, sony, so on, you generally lose by default, no matter whose legal services you acquire.

[@Vlad2319]

'Mini game? Naw it's a tutorial." Capcom probably

[@6sdeimos]

miyamoto actually considered patenting jumping, but thought itd be too cruel

[@FrozenKnight21]

I remember the courts ruling that software patents were invalid, but the patent office kept issuing them anyway.

[@MizManFryingP]

I do not understand how more companies haven't further abused this patent system yet. How did someone not patent the crosshair? Or the minimap?

[@adamofblastworks1517]

Patents don't always turn out the way the patenter wants them to. I'm guessing that nobody thought of patenting those until it had already been used by many games for years, and they couldn't even attempt to try to claim it was their invention. Actually that might have more to do with a lack of evidence that they thought of it first, including documents from way back whenever. Actually, I don't remember what I learned about the patenting process when I looked into it a while ago... The second explanation might just be me mixing up parts of intellectual property protection and patents.

[@spogob2228]

Oh.. good idea!

[@adamofblastworks1517]

@@spogob2228 good luck with that lmao

[@KiraSlith]

Because the first person shooter genre as we know it today was literally founded by 4 dudes in a basement. They weren't looking to be absolute ba****ds, and couldn't afford to file the pile of patents required to do so anyways. Gods bless the true innovators of videogame and software design, bored broke teenagers.

[@ETXAlienRobot201]

actually, they have... same with copyrights. it's much easier to find solid evidence the IP system has been abused than infringing IP has caused actual damages to a single rightsholder. as for trademarks, they have their purpose. the way they are primarily used now constitutes a complete misuse.

[@kyleistrying]

No grand thoughts, I just fucking love your channel and presentation Just, yeah, amazing job 🔥

[@LEXXPortPatrol]

The editing in this is phenomenal!! Such a great video, I was laughing all the way through :D

[@bengermin3104]

It's stuff like these that makes new invention and innovation hard. Imagine if they didn't patent them, the nemesis system is such a good system itself it could've make other games that were just as great and fun to play

[@BurritoPanda]

Truthfully I came into this video expecting to watch something mediocre at best just to kill some time, but that was well edited and genuinely entertaining and funny. Earned a new sub, looking forward to future content.

[@felipeferreira00]

Omg the Gran Turismo sound effects adds a lot of personality to the examples

[@malfattio2894]

Let's not forget the time that Sega patented one of the camera angles used in Virtua Racing. Absolutely mental.

[@waycnf7229]

They were only able to patent the zoom transition between angles... which lead to racing games improving because it made transitions instant

[@nrXic]

They sorta had to. I'm only 1/3 through the video so I don't know if it will cover why it was important.

[@early2000skid]

I mean video essays on games aren't that unique but this had a really original feel thanks to your presentation, Idk why there aren't more people watching this stuff

[@SAZERU]

is comment is written backhanded as hyell

[@SAZERU]

is comment is written backhanded as hyell

[@early2000skid]

@@SAZERU wasn't intended to be haha, mb

[@SAZERU]

@@early2000skid my bad was reading it wrong

[@zavalanovakidue]

EA: gets sued by Sega because of an arrow used in the Simpsons game Also EA: *has a series of games that use arrows throughout the whole life of the arrow patent*

[@antiloser-NFS]

Exactly what I was thinking. They used it in several Need for Speed games

[@Quesoowoo]

Reject copyright and patents embrace public domain

[@UltimateAzumanger]

8:48 This is a consequence of KZbin's MakingAnythingIsIllegal system.

[@fablearchitect7645]

project wingman used this arrow

[@larsbearxbox5784]

Disney Infinity used that arrow.

[@boogaboom]

Thank you so much for leaving at least the first YAYAs from the crazy taxi, you avoided copyright infringement without depriving us of our due serotonin release Besides how can you still have less than 3000 subs holy shit this is top quality content please never stop doing this

[@lavaos]

nintendo is trying to sue palworld for pantent infringement for adding capturable creatures or something

[@johnclark926]

Thank you for spreading the knowledge that the Mario is Missing developers are the same studio that made Prototype, I’ve been cursed with this fact along with the fact that the Bubsy 3D developers went on to create Syphon Filter immediately after

[@lmcgregoruk]

Hey, at the time Bubsy 3D was well received, it didn't get ridiculed until AFTER Super Mario 64 and Crash Bandicoot were shown off. (And the thing about Crash Bandicoot that annoyed me, was that it wasn't fully 3D, as in you went along a path either forwards or towards the camera, where you could move side to side to the edges of said path). Anyway back to Bubsy 3D, PSExteme 93% and an editorial Gold X Award!

[@inkphoenix5446]

ahh those GT sound effects make me go back years

[@SteveBrandon]

Microsoft's Midtown Madness series also had the floating arrow. I'm not sure whether Angel Studios (later Rockstar San Diego), the developers of the first two Midtown Madness games on PC, licensed the arrow from Sega or whether they were able to get away with using a floating arrow because the first Midtown Madness game was already in development before Crazy Taxi hit arcades (both games came out in the first half of 1999).

[@PURENT]

Throw in Midnight Club 1 in there as well considering it's mostly an MM2 reskin, it had a 3D arrow at the top. In Midnight Club 2 & 3 they moved the arrow off to the left side, but it was still a floating 3D arrow nonetheless. And then there's Microsoft/DICE's Midtown Madness 3 which also had it and had taxi jobs. I think the lawsuit over Simpsons Road Rage was mainly because the gameplay was an outright clone of Crazy Taxi. The patent just helped Sega win the case. Sega didn't bother to go after other studios, mostly because they'd probably lose to Microsoft and Take-Two's lawyers and end up losing the patent altogether.

[@eddieru]

@@PURENT we need to ask a higher up from sega at the time on why they didn’t sue them. i really want to know the answer for some reason

[@TomokoxKuroki]

@@PURENT there was a setting in mc3 to put the arrow at the top

[@psycho0815]

I can understand the direction arrow patent, at least to some degree. But that nemesis system is just simulating real life events and it is basically the same as claiming a day-night cycle in games as your intellectual property. That's nuts and they should not be able to get a patent for something like that.

[@TNinja0]

Thanks for convincing me that patents are NOT necessary evils I guess.

[@Wylie288]

Patents are important in some places. The medical field especially. Developing half the shit people literally survive on costs BILLIONS in research. NO ONE will bother if they can't profit. Without a patent, someone will copy it right away, and then anyone making an advance in the medical field won't even break even. Patent length should scale based on R&D costs.

[@Okand2]

I want to patent math. Multiplication and division in particular.

[@Phimic.]

I'm in, but I want a piece of the pi.

[@tccraig]

Another note: Sega could have sued Nintendo over Super Mario 64 for having camera control as Sega owned that at the time.

[@sweetreamer5101]

Nintendo probably got around it by having you control "Lakitu" instead of the "Camera"

[@Skenjin]

Wait, is that why it took so long for there to be a joystick for camera controls on Playstation?

[@rg975]

There’s a game series called Dead Rising that uses an arrow for directions in the exact same way. I wonder why they were able to use it in multiple games from 2006-2013?

[@JB-fh1bb]

You should also do a video on these two illegal things: 1. Changing the volume for multiple speakers at once (this hit Nest users a couple months ago and is frustrating daily) 2. Someone (still?) owns a patent that covers two devices communicating directly over the internet. This has been a friction point for every single video call application, and Apple even had to roll out an entire layer of proxy servers to work around the patent. My facetimes with people 5km away went from buttery and instant (direct phone to phone) to error-prone and delayed (relayed through a proxy server hundreds of km away)

[@gavril3698]

i love the grand turismo sound effects at the beggining of the video

[@hemangchauhan2864]

Excellent stuff. IIRC Nemesis system isn't exactly patented as is, so their can be plenty work arounds. Plus, few games have also been doing it prior

[@ETXAlienRobot201]

i know the government likes to ignore the law when it doesn't benefit a corpo a lot, but don't prior works invalidate patents entirely? they're SUPPOSED to for obvious reasons...

[@protox4]

@@ETXAlienRobot201 The old patents laws worked that way. New patent laws are stupid and typically grant the patent to the first entity to file the patent claim, regardless of whether they were the first to create it.

[@ETXAlienRobot201]

@@protox4 sounds like a violation of the copyright clause, then. not that they care. infinite extensions are, too.

[@RayOfSunlight984]

4:38 "My attention span is three seconds, i see funny monke gif and i laugh" honestly i think you're pretty cute 7:01 funny part here, i like this woman xD

[@bailey125]

In 2001 a game called Matchbox: Emergency Patrol was released by Sandbox Studios, Inc. (a Canadian company), which is basically that taxi game except the theme is different (Instead of delivering passengers to certain places, you need to go to an emergency at certain places). It uses an almost identical arrow to Crazy Taxi.

[@tonilafountain636]

This is a great commentary on how ideas are being held essentially for ransom by big companies in an attempt to keep monopolies on one thing or another, this is killing innovations, and creating stagnation.

[@Zanderhawk11]

So, did the patent only apply to driving games? Because Bioshock had a spinning 3d arrow to help guide the player to the objective. Did they get sued?

[@exyzt9877]

The patent was composed of three sections. The "Aura System", The "Arrow System" and the City Free Roam Driving. The patent is only applicable if all three elements are present, so... in other words... yeah. It was built with driving games in mind, and last I checked, Bioshock was an Immersive Sim/First Person Shooter and spiritual succesor to the System Shock Series.

[@Zanderhawk11]

@@exyzt9877Yeah, alright. I had thought that there was something up. It was just a bit of an oversimplification.

[@muizzsiddique]

Even if it wasn't a driving game, they could have actually just bought a licence for the patent to use in Bioshock.

[@jonas8588]

I was thinking about that too because BioShock is my favourite videogame. At first I thought that the reason was that one of the studios that made BioShock was 2K Australia where the patent laws might work differently. But it was still published by 2K, an American company... Maybe they didn't get sued because it wasn't a driving game...

[@NerfMaster000]

@@exyzt9877 Now I’m wondering how did Rockstar manage to get away with this in the Midnight Club games which has all 3 sections in the patent.

[@TheRealZyconis]

The Nemesis System being locked behind a patent is so heartbreaking. Art is iterative by nature and games are art.

[@SuperNuketown2025]

I’m curious if you do everything yourself or not (especially the editing), bc this is some seriously top notch stuff. I haven’t seen a channel with this high of production quality have this small of a following since Quackity. I like how this is also kind of in the style of Internet Historian where it’s just a really long rabbit hole about a specific topic but it’s edited and presented in an interesting way, which always rings home for me bc I find myself going down these 20-30 open tabs rabbit holes all the time

[@f4micom]

Yeah I’m a one woman team

[@scarecrow5848]

I miss when quackity did his raids...

[@Ringtail]

10:09 I guess that would explain why Lego Racers 2 (developed in the UK) had the crazy taxi arrow too, even had a crazy taxi-esque minigame in it. I've heard that patent brought up before but grew up with that game so I wondered how that would work.

[@ninevolt]

I was very surprised to find out that Shadow of Mordor is a video game, thank you Wikipedia and by extension f4mi for relaying this information. (Great video btw)

[@Velossitee]

This is like greedily keeping a patent for the wheel and not sharing it with your cave friends...We wouldn't have cars if he didn't share their invention.

[@EthanCGamer]

So I worked in an arcade for about 7 years now, and you just triggered a memory deep in my brain. We used to have a bunch of those "job" games, like 18 wheeler and airline pilots. We got rid of them right after I started, but wow those were some "games" alright. The Naomi units were super cool though, really neat hardware.

[@Yahboykatra]

First video of yours I’m watching and damn, loved it so much!

[@perpetualcollapse]

Understandable, have a nice day.

[@tuppot]

3:25 Ok, a pretty basic Portal 2 reference. 7:24 NOW WE'RE TALKING

[@yoymate6316]

i cannot believe you bought that domain name just for this joke oh my god lmfao. instantly subbed edit: …and the other domain name as well just for a split second joke. i love it here already

[@ShopiStar]

I love how the "I see funny monke gif and i laugh" part is the most replayed lmao

[@Rainbow-wd6sc]

This is seriously underrated, extremely well edited, informative, AND funny

[@KiemPlant]

Awesome video. Man I love your voice, it really fits with your content and the characters you're playing. That ending was fkn hilarious to me

[@0hate9]

ahh yes, patents: a "necessary" evil

[@LeoLaforestIII]

I don't know how this got in my KZbin recommended page, but Im glad I watched this. Great hook and you somehow kept my short attention span on topic to the end.

[@Banex01gosha]

Nice video! Dude, the whole pattent system is broken (just as the copyright one), I know there has to be some sort of a way to protect any invention from a basic stealing, but I think the whole pattent and copyright systems should be remade and reworked

[@abrahampadilla7191]

When I was a little kid the arcade machines in Mexico actually had the arrow on the game. The arcade machines in Mexico were bootleg arcade machine loaded with thousands of games, that was the best part of my childhood.

[@barrupa]

Didn't Need for Speed Underground 2 also have a gigantic 3D arrow pointing towards your destination minimap and/or outrun opponents? Was that also part of the settlement between EA and Sega?

[@eskeletor]

Now that's interesting, but I remember that the arrow didn't point straight at goal and more at the road you were supposed to follow, also arrow disappeared when you went wrong way or were in tunnel. So maybe it was different enough to not infringe on patent. Or maybe you are right and they got license from sega.

[@feder28]

@@eskeletor In Crazy Taxi the arrow points at the most convenient roads and not directly at the destination, too.

[@electraelpindrai1964]

Yeah was wondering that too, after searching on Google for awhile still no answers

[@suzynekochan5534]

How did Microsoft get away with using directional arrows and an open world in Midtown Madness?

[@Moister356]

I remember back in the day when cheap PC games came in cereal boxes. I bought one that had a racing game inside, very similar to Big Rigs in terms of graphics but with cars and races actually worked. That particular game had a 3D arrow poiting the way to go, of course nobody noticed since it was just shovelware.

[@Hambo325]

This got reccomended to me randomly and I'm so glad it was. I'm in love with your editing style and humor, ez sub

[@allingby]

Banger gosh darnit, the time travel, the ending, certified First Of The Year moment

[@PaintsAreOp]

I know this is a two years old video, but there's more eurojank with the forbidden arrow mechanic! In the year 1999, a Swedish developer Unique Development Studios released their smash hit Mall Maniacs, known as Mall Mania in the US and Mega Game 1 in Finland. A game that was given freely as a promotional thing in supermarkets. In this game you do shopping in a supermarket and it has a lot of product placements. Next year they released another smash hit Pickup Express, released as Mega Game 2 in Finland. This time it's a crazy taxi style driving game and it's full of product placements. The game was later released in Brazil in 2002, it became a cult classic and apparently had even a championship tournament with prices including a trip to Sweden to meet the game's developer :D

[@este_marco]

0:15 gran turismo sound!

[@PathosBedlam]

Patents and Copyright laws only succeed in slowing down progress of humanity, just like religion. Look at how fast 3D printing has evolved since the patents for FDM and SLA printing ran out. Imaging how much faster we could evolve as a species if all knowledge was just shared instead of hoarded. Maybe we could created a world of plenty for all, instead of this world of way too much for the very few and bugger all for the rest of us that we seem to have right now. There's a reason the Borg in Star Trek can adapt so quickly, they share info from every drone with the consciousness of the whole, allowing them to adapt to new issues very quickly. Imagine how quickly humans could get off this rock if we all worked together like they do? Without all the assimilation nonsense one would hope.

[@lauratiso]

She lost everything to make a nice video for us, #PrayForF4mi. F.

[@Nielk1]

The D-Pad patent was actually the system working as intended. The rest is insane though. For an example of a hardware patent being misapplied look no further than Scuff's back paddle patent which somehow applied to the battery tray of the Steam Controller.

[@SpartaYoshi]

this was so cool to watch :0 also i always hated that arrow mechanic

[@minidavid-devdave]

I kinda hate the arrow mechanic too. I use itin 2d sometimes, but only while I'm level designing quickly and trying not not confuse people.

[@deforged]

you just blew my mind with that whole time traveling paradox thing. you should patent that idea before someone else dares to come up with it.

[@Nullref_Arcana]

I think another case of software patent being used and abused is Adobe. From what I've read, Adobe patents pretty much every new feature in Photoshop, and I assume every other product, preventing free software (or simply any other software, paid or not) from copying the feature. This is why GIMP will never be as good as it can be, it legally can't. And Adobe can fill its pockets by being the best program feature wise; but the absolute worst in support, stability, and monetization model (annually subscribe to all programs, at exorbitant prices, even if you only need one of the 12 programs).

[@BagOfMagicFood]

Let's boycott Adobe! Drive it out of business!

[@watekostile]

Repeat after me It is morally and ethically acceptable to pirate adobe products

[@zackattack9228]

@@watekostile it's acceptable to pirate any software Also use open source alternatives for everything

[@Wylie288]

Well yeah. You can't literally copy the code. Using your own algorithm however is allowed. And GIMP can and does copy everything Photoshop does. And improves on it. Just look at the extension.

[@Cow-Moth-With-A-CRT-Head]

Hearing the Wii called a retro system dealt massive psychic damage