The Immense Criticism of SMG4 (Documentary)

[@TheAwsumMegario]

BEEG DISCALIMER: when I said “smg4 is starting not out less care into smg4” and that kind of stuff, that was my misinterpretation. What I meant to say is “smg4 puts full effort into the smg4 channel and glitch but because glitch productions needs so much hard work and care, it’s really difficult for smg4 to work on both channels at the same time” Also, this is a documentary, not a rant. The only thing I’m doing here is making an objective view on how criticism has arisen in smg4

[@christianramirez6578]

And now the controversy that they fire Tari's Voice actor

[@mrbarit529]

yo it just got worst

[@TheAwsumMegario]

@@nevaehhamilton3493 that is different

[@mrbarit529]

you are makeing baseless claims that can now bee disproven by an testamony by a glitch enpoyees @@nevaehhamilton3493.

[@AlienAboeba]

weres your sors

[@MMaximmachinegun]

I feel like the main SMG4 channel is just a cash grab to fund Glitch Productions. Which I mean, to be fair, there shows are terribly expensive. So I can understand.

[@Webwalkerz]

We catch their drift

[@TerryVide0z]

I feel like the better the animation gets, the more hate he gets and that’s a shame because the animation of modern smg4 looks really good and I definitely agree that Kevin isn’t the best show writer and doesn’t always satisfy everyone because he’s really busy with glitch productions

[@firestriker3580]

they aren’t good nope

[@Dilmi.AOUKLI]

And because of that and the numerous oc's that keep appearing, SMG4's videos fell more like a saturday morning cartoon rather than a parody sketch

[@gdassspar6nar]

It's not good.This "animation" ruins jokes

[@MrPetpet111]

@@gdassspar6nar I kind of felt like that with a few parts on the REMASTERED64: Freddy's Spaghetteria compared to the original.

[@DeanRocks-kr7wv]

As a classic fan, I will concede that the new episodes look really freaking impressive. BUT Pretty animation alone can not salvage a poorly written show.

[@The_Marvelist]

People back then said the 2017-2019 era was not as good, but I miss the hell out of that era. It was a perfect blend of comedy that was actually funny and character drama that fit within it's respective universe. Nowadays, like the latter half of this past year, post Western Spaghetti, feels so bland now. It's more of a company filling release slots with shit they just slap together, but somethings missing, unlike before where it felt like there was soul and heart put into their productions. I'm not completely over SMG4, there's still hope to rise back up from it's more recent mediocrity with the continuation of the story that's been developing all year with the mysterious TV entity. As of now though I'll pass on boring lifeless, pumped out " comedy " videos from what feels more like a company focused brand than a creator's vision for insanity induced wackiness and emotional depth that worked as duality.

[@kaden-sd6vb]

Try doctor lalve, eltorro64rus and crazyscoutfin. The tf2 community still harbors some of that Old Internet chaos. It's not a replacement for old smg4, but it's the next best thing in terms of dumb gmod humor

[@elliotsturtplus340]

I agree that era was quite good I think a lot of people overrated the the first era because it’s more parody and funny without acknowledging how aged some of the jokes are don’t get me wrong first era was good but it’s not the best

[@UltraByte09Official]

The video was so well researched ! In fact, it's not SMG4's fault, it's the fandom who puts more and more pressure so too much hate on them. Even their biggest use of Meggy or something else like that, it doesn't explain that they're screwing up their show. GLITCH is their priority. I don't wanna add more but that's too much lmao 😅

[@firestriker3580]

It IS SMG4’s fault and it is NOT the fandom with their justified hate. It does explain that they are screwing up the show. Glitch shouldn’t be their priority

[@carmacattack3712]

​@firestriker3580 Why shouldn't GLITCH be their priority? They seem to enjoy making it, not to mention how successful it is with TADC alone making 100 million views.

[@tsle805]

​@@firestriker3580No it's Not SMG4's fault and why glitch shouldn't be their priority? SMG4 himself said in one of his video that he wants to improve his animation skills, he even went to the college for animation at some point.

[@Leo_G_Cady]

U echoed my exact thoughts✌️GLITCH is absolutely their priority. SMG4 is able to provide stable funding for GLITCH’s projects :) If u want me to be frank, people say SMG4 “changed” but like, no? XD It’s always been meme-y and random, and still is💙Just with better design and animation✨ Regardless, I think SMG4’s future looks exciting ^^

[@Youcican]

​@@firestriker3580 it's making them bank tho

[@MoonlarkSpirits]

As someone in the SMG4 fandom, I did start as a classic, watching his videos (which first came out on my birthday) all the way up until the famous chomp video which is when I left. I came back to the Revelations movie (watched it without realizing there was two whole arc that I was supposed to watch, plus other arcs... lmao.) Overall, while there are things I don't like about SMG4, or wish he did differently at times, especially with characters (no, not the MEGGY SHOULD HAVE STAYED AS AN INKLING, as I didn't even know she was an inkling until I watched anime arc), but kind of with forgotten plot points or not letting them have character growth for more than one episode (this isn't always the case). However, I won't tell SMG4 what to do, and even I do express my disappointments, I do try to also look at the positives (something I usually don't do) As I've said (not here, but other places)... Luke was eleven when he started this channel, he's obviously grown since the past 12 - 13 years. He's no longer a kid, he's a grown man. And people change as they get older. We should be thankful he's still doing this. My biggest issue is the fandom... for one reason Anything you say, people are going to attack you. They're not going to be respectful, they're gonna tell you to f*ck off, which is why I find it hard to say what I think. But quite honestly, even if SMG4's quality has decreased over the years, I still love to watch him, it brings joy to me to see an upload (and he's the only channel I can watch that can make sexual and inappropriate jokes that makes me laugh, as I'm someone who doesn't like that stuff) Also, I like the darker stories

[@sebatsionEEE]

facts, smg4 is pretty good, but there are issues, yes the fandom sucks ass, they get annoyed over small things. the darker stories are great, he is very funny, but smg4 has totally not decreased in quality, if anything his content increased in quality

[@ludwigtails]

Okay but. What was SMG4 originally suppose to be like? The more so downfall of SMG4 is that it’s just not funny anymore. Everything is lore lore lore lore lore lore lore, everything don’t need god damn lores Jesus Christ, it’s originally funny and chill, you don’t need to care much about previous videos to watch the next one. But now this is the case.

[@mr.krabsxreturns34]

@@ludwigtails I agree because smg4 before was suppose like comedic skits nothing above seriousness. But as soon the arcs and lores comes in than we see the flaws appear. Episode after Episode is mostly lore hinted and that stuff. Soon after that it tried to lore and comedy which sucked now the smg4 franchise doesn't even know what's it purpose anymore since it tryed SO HARD and I mean TOO HARD to be at least entertaining by uses tropes at once but still isn't mix properly in the show.

[@ludwigtails]

​@@mr.krabsxreturns34i honestly couldnt tell is this becasue they need to keep the wirting consistency with gltich so they had no choice but to keep the lore. or they just want to serve that terrible fan boys that likes "ITS A GAME THEORY". and i hate it i just find it way too annoying. I dont want to care about the lore i just want to laugh. Because of this i hate independent animations cuz they are nothing but utter lore with crap story thats it. I still stand by that og fandom that the funny era of SMG4 is better. The toxic side fandom for SMG4 are all lore people.

[@benbarnett5743]

Same. I loved the genesis arc and Revelations saga because they were the first arcs to have actual high stakes for the series (The anime arc honestly wasn't even that dark aside from Desti's Death). I agree 100% with you about the fandom. They will hate on SMG4 is he even does a small change to the series and attack anyone who disagrees with them. People need to accept that change is natural and not always a bad thing. Luke is wanting to make the series feel more original which is why he did those redesigns. It's indeed amazing how Luke has grown these years starting with simple Mario 64 bloopers and now creating these amazing storylines with tons of unique characters. I agree that we shouldn't dictate what Luke should and shouldn't do. We should just let him do what he wants and not act as the fun police for him. Season 13 has been the series biggest one yet and I can't wait to see how the gang will deal with the TV salesman

[@amogusguy2004]

Thank you for making this video. It really brings Glitch's influence to attention, which isn't discussed often on Reddit. Also, you saved me from having to write a similar essay post for r/SMG4.

[@TheAwsumMegario]

No problem. I also am familiar with your username, as I probably know you from reddit, and your critiques you give. Right now, I am starting a criticism podcast on the 27th of December 2pm PST, and it is not too late to join. So i think having you on this podcast would make it better. How to join? Right on my discord server ( discord.gg/f5Fs3WJtF9 ), and then i will take you from there. If you are still confused, this podcast will be like the other SMG4 criticism podcast by CiblesYT in 2022. Also, the podcast will be 2 hours long.

[@amogusguy2004]

@@TheAwsumMegario Thanks for the offer, but I'm trying to stay away from SMG4 and the fanbase in general due to how messed up they are, so I'm sorry that I won't join your podcast.

[@Lincfish10894TS]

@@amogusguy2004 as of now, same is I am doing. Red plumber now in hands, watching from the distance. Knowing their fate in my creations

[@tjrex9458]

@@amogusguy2004 I agree , but the community itself is being reflected on the videos. Like, i started watching the videos pre-fishyboopkins , like, when the characters were the models from Mario 64 and all of that, and ever since then theres a majority of people that wants them to go back, while the small minority of "omg very good video keep doing this style" is the one being listened to. SMG4 is mostly been a money printing machine for the past 4 or 5 years because instead of taking criticism in the right way, they simply decide that "new viewers equals more subs which makes more money" and thats the community they have been growing ever since. New viewer finds channel, new viewer likes it, new viewer looks at old videos and prefers them, tries to criticize in a good way, gets shut down by new viewer claiming "this one is better", gives up, and the cycle repeats

[@Monhamd1000]

​@@amogusguy2004 Not even true, it because it doesn't work well if it gets overused in SMG4, Also that username makes me want to rip my eyes out.

[@Smg15-r3b]

I just don’t like how people are just hitting on Luke and Kevin because Luke and Kevin changed just because murder drones is doing well. There’s one person I found on KZbin saying murder drones sucks

[@MoonlarkSpirits]

I can't judge MD as I haven't watched it yet

[@mr.krabsxreturns34]

Well mostly mid at best because like animation is good and all but the story is confusing and hard catch unless u rematch it again to understand it. Plus the ships oh mighty the ships 💀not saying its bad fr but sometimes I feel they did them the wrong place and time.

[@Sterling-cn1fq]

@@mr.krabsxreturns34Not my cup of tea because of the intense amounts of hidden lore but the episodes are fun to watch and I love N

[@DAGGR]

Murder Drones does suck and it's fanbase is worse

[@kyperactive]

? You say this like Murder Drones hate is a bad thing. Yes fun fact, people dont like things sometimes, and thats okay. Its more about finding the usefulness rather than the nothingness if that makes sense.

[@Nobis-san]

Probably the biggest reason would be lacks of communication and respond to critism. Which is why mediexcalibur2012 was the Goat in the community for actually brave enough to respond to critism pretty much

[@tsle805]

Saw your video being shared by someone on the r/SMG4 subreddit, and all I have to say is this: Im taking my cap away. You did this video very well. You explained the problems of SMG4 very detailed and well. Your editing skills are also great for a youtuber with only 2k subscribers. (I said the same thing on the post from r/SMG4 becuase I thought you shared this to the subreddit) (Btw, verified youtuber here lol)

[@Neo095botxplayz]

Honestly I made be the only one who likes the more serious tone and high quality animation

[@Neo095botxplayz]

There's a war going on in the comments please don't try and read it if your and old smg4 fan.

[@TheSlideCell]

Nah I like it too

[@phantom557]

It’s honestly so bizarre how the fans don’t want the guy to improve and stay stuck in a state of stagnation. Keep in mind that SMG4 didn’t want to be a stupid Mario parody channel, he wanted to work in the animation industry.

[@Portersona69420]

Finally someone said it. Not saying it could still be better but its not as black and white as the nostalgic fans say it is. (As someone who was around in classic SMG4 I can legally say this)

[@benbarnett5743]

Yeah. People need to understand Luke is trying to show that not every creator needs to rely on existing IPs to be successful

[@CarrCarr2421]

While you’re definitely not wrong, you also need to realize that the fans subscribed to his channel because it was fun stupid mario parodies, NOT because of its “complex stories” and overarching lore. Look at his most popular videos, they’re the stupid absurd ones, because that’s exactly what fans signed up for. You can’t expect your fans to be happy about you changing your content to something completely different. The biggest problem are the stories themselves, they’re not good. The serious, dark and emotional moments just don’t work in channel that’s just memes and a fat Italian humping spaghetti, it’s jarring as hell. These videos don’t need to be taken so seriously. Even if they could work, which they admittedly did with Mario Saw, although the video did realize that it still was a parody unlike the newer videos, they’re pretty much most of the time badly written, most notably the Anime arc with Desti’s death, and the awful KZbin Arc, I stopped watching SMG4 in late 2020 so I’m not going into his newer videos. So, it’s hard to enjoy them as comedies because of how goddamn seriously they take it that it sucks the fun out of it, but it’s also hard to enjoy them as actual stories because of the bad writing. Obviously it’s Luke and Kevin’s channel, we can’t tell them how to run it, but we can give criticism, because if people keep praising every single thing they do the content won’t get any better. I also want to touch on another thing, Luke said that he wanted to do animation, he fell in love with it when started to learn it in college. That’s what they did with Meta Runner, so why did SMG4 need to he affected? They started Glitch and now can make the stories they want to make, why does SMG4 also need to have these deep stories, judging from what I’ve seen on Hobo Bros, Luke is still very much into the stupid and absurd humor. So why couldn’t SMG4 stay the way it was?

[@Lincfish10894TS]

@@CarrCarr2421 it’s what I’m thinking, in clean form. The old days is where I reside, not the lore, not the edge, but better days of light, rather than the dark future I now perceive this place as

[@TheAbsol7448]

I'd be fine with him leaving SMG4 behind. I think that would've been for the better, he's pretty much just dragging a corpse now. I kinda wish he'd get back into gaming content, I really liked Hobo Bros. It sucks that he axed that.

[@sebatsionEEE]

5:00. Luke & Kevin are clearly giving both channels the attention they deserve, SMG4 has significantly grown in quality & budget, the only reason Glitch is so much more polished is because Glitch actually makes shows & is a company, as such it is held to a higher standard that SMG4. Shows are held to higher standards than YT channels

[@turbobist2889]

How about you stop bootlicking it as a perfect series. Bootlick sml. I despise the smg4 fanbase, and fans like you are one of the reasons why.

[@SirSteve9999]

My Takes on the New SMG4: Arcs: While they are more of a hit or miss, I feel they are extremely predictable especially with the likes of lawsuit. The Waluigi Arc was an Amazing arc mainly because it was something new and ended with a faithful WOTFI. The Darker Arcs Like the Anime and Genesis are Interesting, but I feel it should focus more on the atmosphere rather than the emotion. Overall I think Arcs were good, but It started to follow a formula were it ends with a WOTFI, making it predictable. The Arcs absolutely ruined the fun out of WOTFI but 2023 did resolve it. OCS: Now introducing new Characters are never a bad Idea, but I feel the creators are adding too much OCs. The problem here is that someones favorite OC (Mine is Tari), may not get enough screentime and may be overshadowed by the main characters like SMG4, SMG3, Mario, and Meggy. Thankfully it is not as problematic as 2022 and with the likes of Marios Death Row, it Focuses more on Melony, Mr Monitor and More. So I think the creators should stop overdosing the OCs and should add one every couple months. My Biggest Issue SCREENTIME BALANCE: This is the most missed potential in SMG4 period. A lot of characters are underutilized despite it being better in 2023. Lets Take Wario for example. Wario had a fantastic role if he is the main focus, but Im not saying to replace the main characters with Wario(I wish they did tho), but should utilize Wario more often. Steve is an Amazing Comic relief and while he is still used, but as a main character, he is an absolute blast to watch. A lot of the Main characters too also have this Issue, so many episodes from 2017-2021 use a mix of Characters which makes SMG4 fun to watch. The Second Half of 2022 made SMG4 look annoying and boring mainly because SMG4 just used Mario,SMG4 and Meggy with some use of Luigi and SMG3. Sonic is only being kept alive in SMG4 because of Swag and I want to see episodes were sonic is not with Swag. Tari can be amazing if she is the main focus (like in the Waluigi arc, and Western Spagetti) as she is shown to be quite a hero. I really think since 2023 ended, 2024 should provide a mix of character screentime, I think 2023 was a vast improvement in comparison to 2022. If there is one thing you should take away is that SMG4 should focus more on character variety and they are doing a good job of it so far. Movies: Movies resolving the conflict are getting old, especially we had 4 of them already. I like the 10 year anniversary as it starts the conflict, while they are great movies, but it might get old soon. And Lastly Writing: My only issue here is that some of the execution can be done poorly here especially with the likes of Meggy. I do feel Kevins writings are hit or miss as it sometimes it wants us to believe that one is in the right but they were in the wrong. Conclusion: I think the new SMG4 is good (Except 2022), mainly because it does a good job of providing new Ideas and thats what Makes the new SMG4 unique. But you have your own opinions and I have my own. Feel free to comment your thoughts down on what you think of the new SMG4, old SMG4 or what not.

[@TheAwsumMegario]

After reading your entire comment of critiques, I am quite impressed by how good of a critic you are, In return, I offer you to join in a podcast which I am hosting on my discord server, where we talk about talk critiques of smg4 (it is a criticism broadcast). To join, just join my discord server and I'll take you from there discord.com/invite/xDadQQJazQ Btw, the podcast starts on 27th Dec, 2pm PST

[@SirSteve9999]

@@TheAwsumMegario I don't have discord sorry :(

[@GameristicForce]

SMG4 is still amazing, but PEOPLE JUST ARE TROLLING HIM. “Didn’t ask, UTTP is better” is over 99% assured if you respond on his newest video.

[@sebatsionEEE]

facts, uttp needs to stop

[@scottvgamer1163]

Didn’t ask, UTTP is better Sorry, couldn’t help myself (it’s a joke)😅

[@Lost_Man_2023-YTKP]

Uttp is the stupidest community on the entire earth.

[@SuperAgentAB]

​@RylishZaliou12little did y'all know that they're OBVIOUS TROLL BAIT. Wake up.

[@SuperAgentAB]

Ragebaiting is an common type of troll baiting which people can easily fall for it.

[@NintendoGirl49]

SMG4 seriously does not deserve the hate. While I like the old episodes, the modern episodes are not bad either.

[@Leo_G_Cady]

I too love both✨Both are great. The hate’s undeserved💙

[@__Timmerman__]

he does the show has become absolutely horrible

[@NintendoGirl49]

@timsebastiaan01 Shut up you disrespectful guy

[@hexaphone9417]

@@__Timmerman__calm down man it’s not like SMG4 killed your grandma

[@__Timmerman__]

What a weird statement. I just said that the show has become absolutely horrible, which it has.@@hexaphone9417

[@LardManAnimation]

SMG4 to me was a show I often took for granted. It was always the Wacky Mario channel I was subscribed to but never really paid attention to. I'd keep tabs every so often. It wouldn't be until 2022 when I decided to watch again, permanently this time. My discovery of the fandom was a traumatic one. If we look at the Sonic fandom, I was actually WARNED about them via the movie trailer. So I went into r/SMG4 not knowing what to expect...My mood towards SMG4 was a different one after that and it felt awful. Then came The Perfect Arc, It not only got me back into SMG4 but it gave me a balanced view on it (Pretty much the way I view CGI Thomas. Rough around the edges but enjoyable). I also slowly walked back into the SMG4 fandom and I made a few friends. Sure, there WERE a few overly critical fellas but I tolerated them. Then there were the type where If you mentioned a part of the show you liked, They had SOME bone to pick with it. To the point where conversations about SMG4 became less fun. I see this as the result of keeping expectations too high.

[@scottvgamer1163]

For someone to be truly disappointed with how something turns out, you had to have had certain expectations to begin with. The bare minimum I expect from something I actively WANT to experience is that I’ll be entertained. I suppose it might be a result of SMG4 becoming more serious and story driven, leading many people to take it more seriously.

[@nathanchoe5445]

Ok, maybe I should make a more elaborate explanation on why I don't feel the same with smg4 as I used to, instead of a half-baked rant. Back in the 2010's, he used to be one of my favorite youtuber since he had that charm to his videos. It speaked as if it was a parody, which in many ways it was. It was a way to enjoy my time with a funny show, even if some of them weren't all that good. The thing was for me, it's jokes weren't forced into my face, it was just like an everyday occurrence. When his focus began to take a turn, I slowly lost interest over time, due to a difference in approach in terms of jokes. Noe he feels more like your typical saturdays cartoon rather than a parody, which I highly have a thing for. Appearance was another thing for me. The fact that he used to be a mario recolor was such a charm for me, and to be fair, recolors were common back then. His character has always been iconic, even in the sm64 machinia community. Speaking of which, he actively collaborated and got ideas from them back then. They even appeared in his videos as cameos. Though this has changed once he went solo, adding more of his oc's and making it less like a parody. Back on track, you can kinda see why I didn't like it when he changed his characted. For me, that was the last straw, no going back. But what can I do, complain? The majority of his fans at that point were newer kids that never grew up with the old era. I found that the best option was to cut my losses and just leave for other machinimists. Back then, I despised smg4 for these changes, but after a while, I realized this is what he wanted, what he chose. I can't just force him to go back to his old ways. Besides, he does make some great shows and stories admittedly. Yes I'm kind of biased here, but I know my limits. I apologize for not watching the video before posting this, but I want to show my opinion of smg4 in a civil manner and not with the childish manner of the other "classic era smg4 fans". I've since moved on, albeit not entirely, on other sm64 machinimists, but I won't deny your opinion on smg4. Edit: and yes I've known that smg4 is still working hard to support his fans. Not saying he abandoned us, just saying it's just not the same anymore.

[@maddoxreddish4352]

Tbh for me focusing more on the lore than actual funny videos ruined it

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

Smg4 is still funny though, otherwise he wouldn’t have 8.4M subs. I honestly don’t understand why people don’t think modern Smg4 is funny, I simply see no reason why they would think that.

[@maddoxreddish4352]

@BlueMonkey_YT eh imo it isnt funny anymore but thats just me

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

@@maddoxreddish4352 I still find it funny though…

[@maddoxreddish4352]

@@BlueMonkey_YT cool

[@guyferrari8124]

I feel like smg4 and sml underwent the same change, but instead of smg4 becoming a cashgrab content farm to line Kevin and Luke’s pockets, It became that to fund glitch, which I understand.

[@poggieking_.3]

i just hope luke doesn't abandon smg4, its kinda what makes me like it more knowing its all by the same person and stuff

[@Non-ymous]

It’s called being mature, I mean rlly he is still the funny guy but also gonna have to be more serious for life because of viewers. He would also make major changes to his channel and characters so that new things can interest us, especially GLITCH.

[@jrloulanza6534]

Meme Games 2023

[@NostalgiaEgg]

While I agree with the overall premise of this video, I do not think it represents the critical discourse on the series as well as it could've. And what I mean by that is it paints the Pre-Waluigi Arc episodes as being free from scrutiny when that was far from reality. SMG4 criticism originally began all the way back in early 2014 after the series shifted from being about its creative ideas and Mario recolor cast of characters, To the randomness comedy. And while the switch did bring in a larger pool of mainstream audiences who wouldn't have seen his content before otherwise, It also alienated old school fans who didn't like how random and GMOD centric the series had become. In fact, The most viewed Modern SMG4 rant video: Dafawfulizer's Top 10 Things We HATE About Modern SMG4, Is specifically about this era. These days the period has sort of gone through a semi-revaluation due in part to the people who grew up with it being able to make their own content now, But it is still very polarizing among the fanbase for a lot of the same reasons that 2014 era SML is. And speaking of SML, While I'd argue that neither of the two have anything in common these days. The initial formation of their critically reception is very much one to one, As the original critics including Dafawfulizer and even dabhdude, SML Reviewer, ect. made SML and SMG4 review content. All of which expressing the same sentiments. (That both channels were going downhill) Now there was a brief period where the criticism started to die down for both channels, But SML's introduction of Jeffy in 2016 and SMG4's introduction of Bob that same year is where things were taken to the next level. Particularly, The episode Mario Joins The Circus was heavily panned among fans and is still considered one of the worst SMG4 episodes that rivals Jeffy's Bad Word in infamy. The 2017-2019 era is similar to the Late 2013-Early 2015 era in the sense that it was also heavily scrutinized by fans at the time, But has also faired better overall since the episodes haven't aged poorly in comparison. Though make no mistake, People hated this period and thought it was when things were becoming overly complicated/sanitized. The point being, SMG4's quality has always been a topic of conversation. It's only really the classic era (2011-2013) that was able to exist without scrutiny whereas everything else since has been highly debatable. Not to say that criticisms of the classic era don't exist, But they're all in retrospect as opposed to during the time like with everything else. I mean really, Everything from Late 2013 onwards is just a cycle that repeats every few or so years. People grow up watching the polarizing episodes and eventually go on to make content appreciating them for what they are. We saw this with the Randomness Era (Late 2013-Early 2017) curtesy of critics such as Viclis, We saw this with the Post-Randomness Era (Early 2017-Early 2020) that makes up a majority of the fanbase these days, We even see this with the Early Modern era (Early 2020-Early 2022) now that channels discussing the arcs have popped up. And it's a cycle that'll keep repeating until the series finally ends. So this is all to really say that there is no definitive good or bad era of SMG4, It all just depends on the time period you first started watching.

[@Smg15-r3b]

Yeah, the only thing I had problems with SMG four was in 2014. There are some videos I like, but there is too much G mod and another problem with the dark humor before the your youtube Are you to start demonetizing other videos because they were too much and too far like that actually happened to starman3 speaking of Starman 3 we all know he was a pedophile and he was removed from the SMG four and we don’t talk about him at all what he just did

[@TheAwsumMegario]

Hi Nostalgia Egg! I read your comment and have a few things to say, so i think what you said is kinda off topic for this video, as it isnt fully what the video talks about. This video talks about how glitch productions has affected smg4, as it made it harder for smg4 to work on both shows. Thus, criticism for smg4 arose, as there are some plot problems in smg4, which wouldnt have happened if glitch was made (not saying glitch is bad or anything). But i still agree with most of your point in which you said. But most of that is just subjective. Saying "randomness = bad" doesnt make sense by itself, as smg4 back then really didnt have any plot to criticise. It was more so fan preferences which existed back then. Take "gmod=bad" as an example. In an objective point of view, neither gmod or n64 design look better than each other, but yet the fanbase back then didnt like that. Like you said, it was the old school fans who didnt like gmod. *Criticism back then was more so subjective, and there was not a lot of criticism which criticised actually plot problems in smg4* cause there was once again, not a lot of plot back then in smg4. This leads back to this video thing. When smg4 introduced arcs, there was actually plot to criticise, and especially in the anime arc, there was a lot of criticism. And once again, glitch productions made it hard for smg4 to work on both shows at the same time, also resulting in more criticism. TL;DR (just in case): This video's main point is that glitch productions (and partially arcs) is a sensible reason for why smg4 is recieving more constructive criticism than it was pre-waluigi arc. I'm not very sure if i explained it 100% correctly, but hopefully my reply makes sense. Hopefully some time in the future i can cover more of what your comment specified in a video: Why smg4 recieved criticism back in the randomness era

[@NostalgiaEgg]

​@@TheAwsumMegario A few things. 1. I'm not going to pretend like the episodes from the classic era are anywhere near as plot driven as Modern SMG4 tends to be, But I do not think they should be downplayed either. Classic SMG4 had plenty of plot driven episodes that, While not as serious in tone, Still have a ton of thought put into them when compared to the early randomness era. And in that sense I do think the criticisms for 2014 SMG4 were just as valid as what we see now, Not all of them of course, But the ones retaining to the lack of plot, Rehashed ideas, And noticeable character flanderization were things that definitely needed to be pointed out. 2. Glitch Productions only really effects SMG4 in the sense that Luke himself doesn't work on the episodes anymore, The series still receives the same level of priority as it always had. But it isn't being put together by Luke, He hasn't been the primary leader of it since Mario Does The Chores, Instead the editing work is done by a whole team of people including James Bailey, MediExcalibur, InvertedShadow, X, ect. Preferences on who's editing styles are better is ultimately subjective, But the general consensus seems to be that Luke by himself was best suit for the position. And not having him in charge is where most people's gripes with the humor and lack of SM64 is coming from. The holes in the writing could be overlooked if the humor and characters still delivered, But they do the opposite. 3. The Arc criticisms really aren't anymore valid than the GMOD criticisms, And can often times be just as nonsensical. Now sure, I can recognize that the story driven format definitely opens the door for even more arguments, But if the Modern SML and Modern Spongebob debates have taught me anything, It's that episodic series' can receive just as much constructive feedback as those whom are more story driven. I mean really, If the arcs were the primary issue they only make up 40% of the content and would not deter people from watching the more comedic episodes. So it's really a thing of the entire series being full of glaring issues that haven't gone away. Stuff like inconsistent characterization, Overabundance of sound effects, Pacing that is too quick for its own good, A decrease in SM64, Weak utilization of the cast, Overreliance on dead memes, ect. These are massive contributing factors in SMG4 criticism becoming the way that it is now. And they are just as valid as any critique of The Anime Arc would be. 4. While I understand what you're getting at, The title doesn't really make your message clear since "Undeserved Hate" would imply that the criticisms are undeserved when they aren't.

[@trapmaster20]

I say this, as someone who did watch his old videos when they aired. "Times change, and so do people. If you aren't able to accept the changes that SMG4 has made, and the time that he's put in to not just making videos, but for everything else he does, can you really call yourself a fan of his work?"

[@TheAwsumMegario]

while that is true, people still have to keep in mind that there are still obvious problems with the show, which in critical terms, could and should be fixed. That's why smg4 critics exist: to find those problems and try to fix them. Still saying tho, i agree with what you say; they are just haters: people who think their opinion is right and brag about smg4 being bad in THEIR opinion

[@CarrCarr2421]

People were a fan of his older work. You can’t expect people to be happy when you completely change the tone of your channel, the content, the very reason they stayed and watched it in the first place.

[@Sterling-cn1fq]

@@CarrCarr2421And you can’t expect your favorite KZbinr to continue doing their same kind of content until the heat death of the universe because that’s what you like.

[@CarrCarr2421]

@@Sterling-cn1fq Sure, but my point still stands. SMG4 became popular because of the absurd mario videos, not because of the “complex” stories. Changing your content like that is gonna make your fans feel betrayed, especially if they make it clear that they don’t like the direction the content is going.

[@TheAbsol7448]

​@@CarrCarr2421I can get behind SMG4 changing things up. Plenty of my favorite KZbinrs changed their content and I still watch some of them. I can respect a KZbinr moving in a direction I'm not interested in, but SMG4 is just outright trash now, and has been for many years now. It almost seems like he just doesn't want to do it anymore and only continues it out of obligation. I think the best thing for SMG4 moving forward is hiring some writers and animators who know the fanbase better and could maybe bring back older fans like myself who haven't watched SMG4 in years, or just leave SMG4 entirely and focus on his other stuff. Maybe even revive Hobo Bros. and get back into gaming content.

[@BajiKrby]

It will sound weird for the majority, but my favourite arc so far was the anime arc, because unlike the recent arcs it had an original story, especially when they mixed the anime gets banned and the training for the splatfest. Also they have met Axol; a main character that had a big impact for the events, unlike the youtube arc that had a lot of side characters. That’s my point about SMG4, besides all of that I like his content and the way how they try to develop the characters.

[@DarkH10]

I liked the anime arc but I think it has badly aged in certain aspects, especially in how inconsistent the tone can be at times, especially in the end. If you want to know, my favorite story arc in SMG4 is the Cosmology lore saga, as it is pretty much the anime arc, but done better in every ways, and it made some great lore around the SMG4 universe.

[@kyperactive]

Waluigi arc was better honestly. Anime Arc kinda broke the established canon of no characters dying, which basically ruined the consistency, and the logic (what little was there anyways) the show had. Now death is a confusing mess where someone just dies whenever the writers feel they arent useful no more.

[@Lincfish10894TS]

…

[@I_Forgorlolol.]

@@kyperactivethe waluigi arc is goated

[@123emilymason]

I really do feel bad for SMG4..

[@sebatsionEEE]

yea, he should get the amount of views he used to in 2019 & 2020, he IS making content of high (if not higher) quality than before

[@mr.krabsxreturns34]

You shouldn't feel bad for Smg4, you should feel bad for Luke for wasting his time on the og channel.

[@123emilymason]

@@mr.krabsxreturns34 smg4 and luke are the same

[@mr.krabsxreturns34]

@@123emilymason mate I'm well aware of that u don't have to remind me

[@123emilymason]

@@mr.krabsxreturns34 sorry

[@Inaption]

I think my biggest problem with smg4 is how much more kid friendly they keep on getting, I honestly liked the more hardcore memes and jokes from the start. But hey, that’s just my opinion.

[@SMCwasTaken]

Now his fan base is so bad Like it's BFDI fandom levels of bad

[@CarrCarr2421]

@@SMCwasTakenThe fanbase has always been terrible.

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

Smg4 ain’t kid friendly lol

[@gerarditogm2181]

The one thing that crossed the line for me was the WOTFI of 2023, because there, Mario is arrested, and I thought, well, there is the change, no more mario, but then in the next video, mario is fine and it’s like nothing happened, and then I wonder, what was the point of the whole arc? Then, I said, ENOUGH, and I stopped whatching smg4 for good

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

That’s the dumbest thing I’ve heard, did you not even watch Smg4? Characters get arrested all the time, so this comment makes you look like an idiot.

[@Snt1_]

One of the main problems is that Smg4 is trying to balamce the old formula but also a more ambitious formula but is doing it horribly wrong. The stories like this years western spaghetti and WOTFI were great, they are clearly trying to push the show in a new direction, but SMG4 at its core is the saturday morning cartoons, the weekly episodes, and now that they have focused more on story than on silly mario shenanigans, they forgot how to make them funny, and the core of smg4 is overall not really funny now.

[@rodrickgoldberg2324]

EXACTLY! Finally, someone put it into words!

[@rodrickgoldberg2324]

@Shyontheinternet99 Don’t forget how they threw out all the live action videos where the characters climbed out of SMG4’s computer…

[@CarrCarr2421]

Yes, the biggest problem is that SMG4 was never meant to work as an actual series with an overarching story. Luke and Kevin founded Glitch so they can make the stories that they very clearly want to make, and that’s why I still keep asking the same question, why the hell did SMG4 need to become another dark and serious series? SMG4’s comedy has never and will never work with a serious story or tone, like I don’t understand how someone can watch these videos and think “yeah, that’s good storytelling”, I don’t know how someone can find the storytelling on this meme channel to be on the same level of actually good stories. SMG4 lost all of its charm when it became another overly dark, soap opera level dramatic series with the writing being worse than your average Marvel film.

[@AzureRoseMarshal]

@@CarrCarr2421another point: they over polished everything. All the redesigns, complete animation, complete voice acting, sometimes crappy AI voices, tons of out of nowhere OCs, it all gets so tiring and “sloppy” to watch. Can’t forget the complete censoring of everything minus, “ass.” The sentence mixing, gmod ragdolls, N64 green screen, it all gave the show its charm that they forgot to have.

[@CarrCarr2421]

@@AzureRoseMarshal Oh yeah, I definitely agree. Pretty much every original character Luke and Kevin introduced has been either terrible or just forgettable. It’s weird how SMG4 started as a SM64 parody, but now, from what I’ve seen, it seems like Mario and Luigi are the only Nintendo stuff left. I understand that they want everything to be of higher quality, but the exaggerated animations do not work. I remember watching a clip of the third Splatoon video, and when SMG4 was showing Mario memes, it’s hard times explain, but the filters, the exaggerated movements of the characters, it’s so overwhelming and terrible, I remember watching “The KZbin Arc” while it was airing, which was terrible, and like I said, all the exaggerated animations were just tiring to watch. It feels like since they’ve gotten better at animation they want to show off what they can do and they exaggerate the hell out of the movements of these characters to make “comedic” moments, but it’s not funny at all. The rag-doll physics and the SM64 green screen, like you said, it all had a charm to them. This is the most obvious in the remakes of the old classics, I only watched the “Freddy’s Spaghetteria” and “Who Let The Chomp Out?” one. The voice acting is jarring and really does not fit whatsoever. The amateurish editing is gone and it’s now all fast paced. Everything is extremely rapid and it all feels like the current editing we see nowadays, like they’re constantly making sure they keep audience retention by having something stimulating going on all the time. As for the censoring, I can’t really blame them, KZbin’s rules have gotten stricter than when Luke started back in 2011.

[@higbeeproductions2340]

I mean, I don’t really think the channel has really hit it downfall.. but at the end of the day to give all credit is due he’s just moving onto more bigger and better projects with a studio fantastic anime shows… I don’t what I’m gonna say is controversial but smg4 ending might not be a bad thing… sometimes you just gotta move onto more bigger and better projects

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

How could it have had a downfall? It’s literally a more successful channel now. A channel’s success is measured by the sub count, not by the number of karens in the fanbase lol.

[@Euroneurogreece3097]

I haven't watched smg4 since the lawsuit arc... and this came out on my recommended.

[@DMLB108]

Same here

[@chrisbarone515]

Don't forget the Mario abuse. I even uploaded a community post about it.

[@Monhamd1000]

Let's face it, SMG4 feels dead to the meme community.

[@allen_the_king40848]

The SMG4 fandom is arguably one of the most laughably toxic fandoms I’ve seen. While it is totally fine to like the older episodes because you grew up with them (and I do agree with that to an extent), the biggest problem with the fandom is that so many have this jaded expectation that SMG4 shouldnt change or that “SMG4 is always about randomness and edgy humor”. I’ve seen many videos criticizing modern SMG4, and so many of them fundamentally just boil down to “SMG4 shouldnt have their own identity and shouldnt tell serious stories”. Fans are more focusing on forcing the past to back instead of hoping for improvements on what SMG4 has now, and that’s why their expectations are almost never met. Because they are unrealistic.

[@THGMR-ox7sd]

At this point every toxic fandom is the most toxic.

[@HOI4player3334]

The issue is that they aren't improvements. I miss videos like Mario Smash or Pass.

[@sharkmon7330]

guys, the animations that SMG4 makes are really funny and entertaining nowadays too.i know i watched him a year ago but i think there is a thing called "nostalgia" that hits in your memory .like sometimes we grow up too, maybe past was really a good time for you when you were a child in a happy environment. overall, you guys are just overreacting, I think the channel is growing really great, and can't wait for the future of the channel the western spaghetti movie and the new wotfi 2023 looks pretty solid and prove me wrong,smg4,the creator himself is just trying to entertain and make good memories and to make you laugh.it's really a shame when you guys say things like "omg smg4 sucks now" or"downfall of smg4 cause of whatever reasons that doesn't even make sense" is really not cool just have a fun time, make new memories, and just have fun watching the show and not criticize everything.smg4 still makes quality content in my opinion..

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

W comment

[@simonesalcini4555]

I think the real problem is that the fans are so nostalgic that everything modern they see is considered trash. If you don't like modern SMG4 then move on, stop critic his change. I'm a fan of SMG4 since 2015 and I still love his channel, with stunning storyline, colorful characters and amazing animation. ❤

[@benbarnett5743]

Same. I don't mind the changes made to the series. Case in point, I love the TV adware storyline which might top off the anime and cosmology saga arcs as the best story in the series. I also really love the redesigns too (Tari looks more adorable and fits in with the rest of the redesigned characters, 4 and 3 finally have their own identities, Boopkins now has an actual fish look, and Meggy looks more up to date). Sad how people just can't accept change because I love the direction the new SMG4 episodes are going in.

[@DeathByPipebomb]

As a new fan of the show who only joined the community 3 months ago it makes me really happy to see people like you guys. I just stumbled into this community like “oh! What fun characters and plot! This is really more than just memes and I like it! I wonder what the fandom is like?” And suddenly I see MILLIONS of old fans saying the new lore sucks making me feel like I’m a loser for simply liking the new lore.

[@benbarnett5743]

@@DeathByPipebomb The Genesis Arc was good and this season is good too (arguably I'd say season 13 is showing how Luke and Kevin are doing their best to avoid repeating certain problems)

[@benbarnett5743]

@@DeathByPipebomb Yeah. I don't think the new lore is that bad at all. It even helps to build upon the SMG4 world. I think people need to actually watch the new episodes and give them a chance rather than hating on them for not using the old designs. It's kinda sad too because Luke has improved as the years went on and people are somehow treating it as though his writing has gotten worse.

[@Sterling-cn1fq]

@@DeathByPipebombOh my god sameeeee! Can we be friends? I actually first watched SMG4’s Rapper Bob arc with one of my friends in like 2017-19, and we had a lot of fun. I recall looking through the other SMG4 videos and thinking “Oh but where story?” And “God this insanity is a bit too hard for me to stomach” and just not continuing. Found a guy who posts SMG4 videos on Spotify so people without KZbin can watch them, and, after watching all the Nintendo memes videos for N cameos, I watched the Modern SMG4 episodes and thought “Oooooooh everything looks so pretty and the show’s entertaining- wait who’s SMG3 and why does he have a bomb cafe?” AND INTO THE LORE HOLE I WENT WOOOOOOOOOOO I also attempted the Waluigi Arc Movie Spotify Guy compiled and couldn’t stomach that well either :/ I also also just like SMG4 and 3’s characters and designs and dynamic :) Also also also Bob reminds me of Magolor if you stuffed him into a burlap sac and introduced him to casinos, and boy do I love Magolor. Also also also also some parts do bother me (like the tear graphics) but production value will production value and weekly uploads will weekly upload and Western Spaghetti still made me laugh so uhhhhh friendship?

[@bloemkoolendestreetgang450]

Modern SMG4 doesn’t have the same charm even when SMG4 does a more “classic” style video. Compare the remake of Freddys Spaghetteria he did with the original; even with basically the same plot and jokes, a lot of things feel too professional and overanimated, i feel the gmod models constantly crouching and holding crowbars for example was so unprofessionally charming and comical. Like for instance in the scene where Chica said “would you like to see a magic trick” the new video has a full model with a synced mouth and it just looks… yikes. Made me click off the video

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

“Made me click off the video” buddy you CHOSE to click off, you can’t use that as a valid argument.

[@DaBaseBallZ]

While I get the issues with the storytelling,smg4 is still and always will be funny and being a smile to our faces

[@__Timmerman__]

nope not anymore

[@DaBaseBallZ]

At least to me he is (ngl,weegiepie and awesomario revamped make me laugh much more)

[@BTWECrew]

​@@DaBaseBallZsame

[@CharlieMagneAwesomeness101]

At least modern sml brought the adult humor Back, Modern smg4 didn’t Even try to bring it back, I miss old smg4, and I also still miss old sml

[@IamZombot1000]

Let's also blame KZbin because of that

[@tjlnintendo]

It makes sense why they would focus on Glitch Productions. Im actually surprised that SMG4 still makes money out of SM64 videos since Nintendo is known for being very protective of their brands. However there is a possibility that Nintendo could get involved legally in the future which can lead to complications. So why not focus on the original works that actually own.

[@Bendy_cutout]

I think fanart and animations are okay If it's a fangame however...

[@lunacraft5895]

Some people has the most absurd opinion about why they fall off, such as "the old man has a 3D model now, it's bad!", i'm sorry but a show won't rely on that stuff, i completly respect opinions of others about the show, however people need to keep in mind that SMG4 is evolving and quality (atleast visual) is too, you can't ask SMG4 to go back to 2017 styled video just like that, sure i can agree that the comedy has really lowered and they are just puting annoying loud sound effects half of the time and that they really should imrpove that part, but people can't blame them on wanting to create sometime some short movies or arc, or improving the visual quality.

[@TheAwsumMegario]

im not really sure if you're talking about this video or the fanbase, but i can saym overall, smg4 has increased a lot in quality (im talking about animation and high quality movies). However, we still have to know that along with that, there are still problems with the show which drag down the enjoyably and consistency of the show. It's just that, aving two production shows (glitch and smg4) to work on at the same time can be really hard work

[@lunacraft5895]

@@TheAwsumMegario i'm talking about the show quality (visual) and how a part of the fan base is just draging them down for absurd reasons most of the time. However i agree with you on that point that the show has a lot of flaws that will probably need to be resolve if they want to improve the show more..

[@Theshininggem]

To me: You can dislike the direction all you want, but pushing that opinion in a manner which destroys a person’s mental state such as harassment is not ok. SMG4 isn’t gonna stay the same forever, and in fact there’s fans and other creators who make the same videos he used to make. If you hate SMG4 (the show), that’s fine, if you like it, good for you. But if you harass another person about it, you’re just being an Ass.

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

I think everyone on the internet needs to see this, words of wisdom right here.

[@Brolylomaniac]

The thing is, even if you think SMG4 fell off, that on no ways mean luke and Kevin are horrible people and deserve hate

[@kyperactive]

Who the hell is saying they're horrible people? The hate I get, its mostly not being the biggest fan of effectively feeling like a content farm at points, but to the point where they are treated as horrible? Sounds bs to me, and I hate SMG4's modern content.

[@Lincfish10894TS]

@@kyperactive I don’t perceive the creators as bad, as nothing has surfaced in time of typings, but the laughs have cut short. Chaos is gone, lore is now

[@_-Lx-_]

The whole situation is one of the most severe cases of rose tinted nostalgia bias, people despise this man because his career is evolving and he's actually making real shows. They are furious that his content has changed at all and claim he doesn't have any effort nowdays and his career is dead and etc, they want to pretend that 2014 lol random crude GMod meme skits of Mario swearing in FNAF is objectively higher qualiy than actual shows with high effort. Haters of him don't realize that the OG SMG4 channel was never exactly high class writing either, the modern OG channel isn't well written but has far more effort into it, and it is a lower maintance way to get in a lil extra funding to support the main channel he has now of making actual profesional large scale shows. I've legit seen people claiming his career is over and he will never amount to anything and is completely irrelevent- while refusing to even aknowledge the fact that TADC's pilot broke records across the board and he's infinitely higher effort/talent/popularity/relevent/discussed than ever before. It's one of the most biased/antagonistic case of former fans I've seen in my life. Dude is a profesional now and hated for not being a low value crude gag channel by these people.

[@benbarnett5743]

Yeah it's sad how many people are hating on him just because he's changing the series a bit. I will miss some old stuff from the first seasons, but I'm not gonna let nostalgia get in the way of my judgement. Luke has shown how much he has evolved and that he doesn't have to rely on randomness to be successful

[@justasimplemanworkinghiswa1569]

smg4 went downhill doing arcs imo

[@CarrCarr2421]

The Waluigi Arc was pretty good and overall a great start, but The Bob Arc was pretty underwhelming. The Anime Arc was solid from the beginning but was ruined with those awful final episodes, and The KZbin Arc is the worst thing I’ve ever seen on the channel.

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

Stop saying Smg4 got worse/declined/went downhill/fell off. It doesn’t matter what you think of the channel, he has more subs now than he ever did. This means that you can’t say modern Smg4 is worse because “worse” means “less subscribers.” So no, he didn’t go downhill.

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

⁠​⁠@@CarrCarr2421”The Waluigi arc was the only good arc” -Literally every single classic Smg4 fan

[@CarrCarr2421]

@@BlueMonkey_YT Dude, we’ve already discussed this, I gave you detailed criticism for most of the arcs, you haven’t provided anything to disprove my points. I thought we came to an agreement.

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

@@CarrCarr2421 That was you? Oh.

[@raymondmercado3347]

I think the release of Remastered64 to celebrate the video that put SMG4's name on that (even tho "Who let the Chomp's out" was a bit more superior if you ask me :P), might signal a potential series that can help bring back old fans like me who missed the nostalgia of his older entry videos whilst still catering to the new generation with modern day meme culture. (YEEting two birbs with one magic rock)

[@mollylarsen9812]

I think it's perfectly fine to work more on indi animation, but I think the Smg4 video duration should be toned down by maybe 2-3 weeks so the videos can be better

[@allendegante]

People hate him because well because of memes and they are jealous that their animation both in SMG4 and GLITCH are amazing and improving ng😢😢

[@schoolboyartist7926]

It feels like smg4 is kinda trying to balance between friendly enough for youtube, but still absurdly funny. The combination just doesnt feel like it works. I dont mind the story, but its being mixed with too many elements of absurdity, and vice versa on the normal videos. I feel like the channel could do with less animation for more comical effect on regular videos, which might cut down on time and still preserve the funny parts

[@kaden-sd6vb]

And the attempts at absurdity are ruined by the new style and sanitized family friendliness, making it just a mix of bad with worse.

[@TheAbsol7448]

I first started watching SMG4 back when he only had about 7 videos total on his channel and when he was broadly unknown on KZbin. I stopped watching after the anime arc, but I thought overall quality started to dip back when he added characters like Bob and Fishy Boopkins and put them in the spotlight while almost completely ditching the other side characters. Toad, Peach, Yoshi, and Bowser went _completely_ unused for a long time. I didn't mind the newer chargers, I even kind of liked Meggy, but they were mostly a pretty big step down. And then he tried to start writing "super serious" stories and I completely stopped watching.

[@memeworld-he1p]

ok ok everyone ill be a bit controversial smg4 is smg4 stop criticizing him he is doing his best everyone CHILL like c'mon he has 3 shows he has to make like that's hard they all get equal love from him but lets agree that swag and Chris need a re design whose with me?

[@TheAwsumMegario]

Few things, I agree with you when you say smg4 has 3 shows he had to work on, and how hard it is to work on all 3 shows, However, I think because of things like glitch X, and especially how insanely high quality glitch productions shows are, smg4 has to put way more work into glitch than smg4, and in result, slightly dragging smg4 down Also, the word "criticising" doesn't necessarily mean hate. It's giving helpful feedback to a show to make it better. It's what people who truely care for smg4 to make it better. I can see what you are thinking of. When speech on the show seems bias, it is not criticism; it is hate And idk about a swag and Chris redesign, but other than that, that's what I have to say

[@SparklingWithNiGHTS-yv5fe]

Well I wouldn't say that the channel+videos is bad nowadays,but I can't lie and have to say that the new videos aren't for me.Like when I put on SMG4 I expect to see something that gives me a lot of big belly laughs with simple humor and Honestly,i have to say the channel nowadays doesn't offer me any of that,especially in those *trillions* of videos of Mario doing something.

[@unauthorized_thing]

smg4's development really reminds me of Red v.s Blue, with it starting on an old game engine, then getting more and more complicated until eventually it's a completely different series.

[@Deth_Ryder]

The Amazing Digital Circus and Murder Drones are not appealing for me at all. They suck. Classic SMG4 is not appealing. It sucked and had cringe. Modern SMG4 is the fucking bomb! I love everything that this decade so far had to offer!

[@DeathByPipebomb]

This is the first time I’ve ever seen someone hate classic smg4 and loved modern smg4

[@Deth_Ryder]

@@DeathByPipebomb so I am a rare type of SMG4 fan

[@DeathByPipebomb]

@@Deth_Ryder I guess you could say that

[@Deth_Ryder]

@@DeathByPipebomb am I a fake fan for my personal preference?

[@DeathByPipebomb]

@@Deth_Ryder No you’re not! You’re just a fan with a rare opinion.

[@dannyequihua2154]

SMG4 became a business with people that needed to be paid

[@JoeyCannoli]

So basically they had a “wE’rE a ReAl CoMpAnY nOw!” moment.

[@AzureRoseMarshal]

The real problem behind it all. If only cursing and slapstick violence still paid the bills

[@mrklusek]

that is sad true, i was watching him since 2014. that's 10 Years

[@Lincfish10894TS]

Well, it looks like another corner of my childhood has just ended. Permanently it seems. … I’ll be taking Mario into my hands now. He’s nothing but a punching bag now anyways. All other characters have been ruined to me. They’ll pay, the whole crew will.

[@Lincfish10894TS]

Let’s fix it

[@恩陶梁]

Oh god someone get therapy for this man

[@Doingyourmom82]

💀

[@sebatsionEEE]

I honestly think SMG4 is better now than in 2017-2018 ngl. its more polished & have a sense of continuency now

[@scottvgamer1163]

I like to think that the chaos from the older “era” is still here, it’s just more controlled nowadays.

[@turbobist2889]

K, guy who hates when people criticize his "perfect" series

[@CyanCreate]

@@turbobist2889 oh my god, LET PEPOLE HAVE OPINONS, HE NEVER DID ANY OF THAT AHGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

[@turbobist2889]

@@CyanCreate sorry. It was they acted like smg4 is perfect

[@CyanCreate]

@@turbobist2889 he didn't act like it was "perfect" all he said was that it was better (in his opinionnnnnnnnn)

[@zotekthepikarz9806]

I think he just wanted to show off his full potential when he made glitch channel and wanted to be recognized for making good animation, not some wacky weird stupid stuff but i think the problem is that he was making it for 5 years before changing it a but which means now whatever he will do he would be hated for not doing concent he was doing for such a long time

[@kootunesscrewy]

Even though I may not like the newer content, I'll admit that there are some good ones like the Content Farms video.

[@ryanconover2814]

TBH I'm starting to see the change on smg4 as they're on an arc rn and from watching the videos, It's very easy to understand what the arc is and things are easily predictable from the current Arc.

[@Acertifiedgigachad]

"Legends never die"-Koofy

[@BTWECrew]

Facts

[@minipz9thebastfiiter509]

I think the tv adware is representing the classic fans that "oh smg4 needs to be perfect for everyone" and then after that become cemented as a classic elitist!

[@TheAwsumMegario]

i heavily doubt that. it's gotta be perfect seems to go along the "we are fine the way we are" message, but not the tv adware. He's just there to keep plot moving.

[@thesonichero2619]

I almost want to believe he's a manifestation of what old SMG4 used to be, the character

[@JM57-99]

All things should end eventually, and it's not like we expect the man to be around and making Mario videos forever It looks like the bros have changed and want to move on to other stuff, and we gotta accept that Old SMG4 is already gone and it's not coming back, at least I hope the new episodes found their audience

[@MXProductions2024]

I guess we can all agree that most of this is under Kevin's influence. Notice how "corporate" his actions are and how he is slowly getting Luke out of the main director role of the SMG4 Channel? For example, putting MediExcalibur as the main editor and producer of his videos?

[@ishaqedrees5849]

One problem i have is the amount of sponsors he does LIKE BRO LET US WATCH THE VIDEO

[@mk4-matt6290]

One thing I think changed is... well... the audience in of itself, as you age, your tastes shift around, I began losing interest in the show and just decided to move on, it was no longer my cup of tea.

[@GlasgoviumHDR]

I think luke and kevin moving away from smg4 is a good idea, they two are very talented individuals and their writing is just not suitable for non-serious content like smg4 and they'd have better success with their stuff on glitch productions.

[@thesonichero2619]

I almost somewhat agree with that

[@kousarpatel9449]

We need the rightfully deserved rise up of smg4

[@kousarpatel9449]

If you know what talkin' about 😉

[@TheAwsumMegario]

@@kousarpatel9449 i was actually considering calling this video the "controversial rise of smg4", but i felt it didnt make sense towards the thumbnail of this video

[@kousarpatel9449]

@@TheAwsumMegario huh guess thats okay

[@Roxz39839]

Nah bro Smg4 is not bad

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

Thank you, nice to see I’m not alone.

[@theenderkirby]

Let's get to the point I feel the show gonna officially discontinue in the next year or so, let me explain. First the view count make less as time goes on the mario do stuff get view but even than is minimal compare to previous two years to the point not even half of his subs watching him anymore and second the series is old and not really get anywhere at this point just continue the same jank and mistakes they done consistently, and shows like digital circus and murder drones get the real intrest while the SMG4 show left to bite the dust really

[@Johnnyb167]

SMG4 the channel has existed to make Glitch prod money since day one of Glitch's existence and there's nothing wrong with using his own popular channel to help fund the animation studio he's passionate about.

[@xanander4693]

I’m a fan of his old content, but I appreciate the passion and effort smg4 still puts in each of his videos. Sure it’s different and not my cup of tea, but it’s still impressive. The overall quality of the animation now vs back then is mind blowing, and even as an older fan I would slowly watch smg4 get better at animations with each new video. Enhancing facial expressions, improving sound quality, interpreting new backgrounds and settings. The videos are more story based now which is why I lost interest in is content. I couldn’t keep up with all the videos and I would often miss key plot points in the story. Regardless, his storytelling capabilities are stellar and I see how passionate and creative his ideas are. He’s improved so much and I couldn’t be happier, even if his content isn’t for me anymore. I will always cherish smg4 since his content always brought a smile to my face. I’m glad that he’s still doing what he loves and puts the effort in with his own series plus w/ Glitch. It’s just so dang impressive with what smg4 has accomplished. How could anyone hate what’s he the good he’s brought for internet animation! 🥰

[@guerrillaradio4943]

Preach brother ✋

[@aidendreamsyt]

I Still Like "SMG4", I Love "Who Let The Chomp Out" It's The First Video I Saw On His Channel

[@matheusfirmino1091]

I have a really harsh opinion on what SMG4 should do nowadays and I've been thinking about this idea for a quite a while, remove Mario and Luigi completely from his series, make a complete reboot of it and make less episodes per month. First things first, about the "remove Mario and Luigi" ideia, for me SMG4 is trying to get away from Nintendo main IPs ever since 2019, starting with the death of Desti and changing Meggy into a human, nowadays not only Meggy has a human voice actor, but Luke completely remade his OC, SMG3, Bob and Boopkins. However, there are two characters that he is still using that are the main representations not only for Nintendo, but the old days as well, the Mario Bros. Mario is the character that started everything, with the episode "The Cake is a Lie" in 2011, if he removes completly the Bros, not only he will get rid permanently of the Nintendo situation, he will remove one of the main criticisms that the fanbase has: the inconsistency on Mario's character. Secondly, the reboot ideia, I noticed that Luke and Kevin are good writers when they want too, for example Meta Runner and most of the movies that they made for the SMG4 channel, but there is a problem, the main purpose of the SMG4 series is being a Saturday Afternoon type of show, and thats the issue, because the tone of the movies and the tone of the episodes are completly distant from each other. If Luke and Kevin do a complete reboot, they will be able to do the series from scratch, without the wheight of being the "Saturday Afternoon Show", and not only that, they can do less episodes, with the main objective of them is being a series like Amphibia or The Owl House, a series that develops each character and world each episode, not the same way as the examples that I gave of course, but it's better than nothing. And lastly, I know that these options are really harsh and would change a lot of things in the series, but honestly, I would prefer a series with the story being developed each episode than a lot of filler episodes every Saturday (and I apologize for my rusty English, because it isn't my main language).

[@DeathByPipebomb]

I actually like your ideas! The problem is if they do all this the internet will whine like the babies they are.

[@Lincfish10894TS]

Mario was the first and the last

[@Manstam]

one of the things i really wish smg4 would bring back was the garrys mod ragdolling. when ever a character gets hit or something else funny and their model flies across the screen and hits a wall was so golden lol

[@tyty334351]

Still happens

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

Mario uses gmod 90% of the time now

[@goldenyoshistar1]

The Lawsuit Arc was the part that made me stop watching SMG4. When they redesigned some of their characters. (Especially SMG3, SMG4, Fishy Boopkins, etc...) It was fine before that, and even when I stoppped watching before that arc (and before the "SMG0" arc) looking at some of their older episodes were solid enough and entertaining. But they made some terrible mistakes, that honestly... I wouldn't be surprised if SMG4 can barely last around the end of 2025 or 2026 at the latest.

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

Are you kidding me? How many times do I have to say this: SMG4 ISN’T DECLINING! He currently has more subs than he ever had and continues to get more every day, so saying the channel is gonna collapse anytime soon is just stupid. In complete contrast to your prediction, I predict that Smg4 will reach 10M subscribers in 2026.

[@ranceprime7466]

And this is why i refuse to watch SMG4's Modern and GLITCH's Videos, and then unsubcribe from him.

[@AdamMakesMemes]

1:20 IS THAT A MOTHERFOKING GEOMETRY DASH REFRENCE?!?

[@marsh5636]

He didn't really fall off just the people who used to watch matured and are watching other stuff now

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

Yeah I don’t know why people don’t understand that “fell off” means “lost subscribers.” They think they have to say he fell off just because they want to whine about how they personally don’t like him anymore.

[@TheMindofRa]

Honestly.... It seems like you had someone doing a decent passion project which lead to experience and the guy cutting his teeth on animation. Then other projects came around where he could refresh his creative juices and produce the absolutely crazy good shows he's putting out now similar to VivziePop and Zooptopia.

[@SuperAngryBirds64-yeah]

SMG4 didn't fell off. SMG4 is SMG4. His content may have changed but he'll always be funny

[@TheAwsumMegario]

I can see why you say that, but if you watch the video, i explain using sensicle explanation of why smg4 is being criticised so heavily

[@ChristineDixonduffersdiary]

@@TheAwsumMegariobecause of people who think they better than smg4.

[@TheAwsumMegario]

@@ChristineDixonduffersdiary no not those type of people those are just annoying trolls bots in the yt comments, im talking about why smg4 gets so much criticism and rants, that kind of stuff

[@ChristineDixonduffersdiary]

@@TheAwsumMegario that's a good point

[@sebatsionEEE]

@@TheAwsumMegario yo, you though of rechanging the title to "the deserved hate of smg4" cuz the video is clearly hating on nowadays smg4

[@Sonic-VA-]

I'm not sure why people hate on him, because I love all of his videos! It feels like he's evolving and making more better and the animations was improving everyday.

[@DavisOfTheVoid]

How to make the best show ever Put Tari and N into a room >Profit

[@Scout71]

Am I the only one waiting for a mariotube 4

[@flick-animation]

I think people are blinded by nostalgia, I feel the writing is to the same level as old smg4, even if the plotholes are bad the plot is quite intresting

[@kaden-sd6vb]

It's not. I can go back to old smg4 vids and still laugh, while the modern shit is nothing more than irritating.

[@Lincfish10894TS]

Classic made me laugh to death, modern frustrates my being to no end

[@penguinh4z3]

Honestly I don't get the hate and criticism about SMG4. I watched his old videos and new videos and nothing really felt like it "changed for the worse". It's just SMG4 and his silly little goofy videos. I don't know why a lot of older fans keep arguing about old SMG4 is better like SMG4 is gonna bring back the golden days someday. People seriously need to grow up and accept this new reality. All they can do is relive their past memories. For me, I accept everything that SMG4 changes and I don't even complain about it. Like human Meggy, Desti death, axol death, arcs, change in humor and all that stuff. Honestly I watch SMG4 for entertainment. I don't get why people would argue over something this stupid. Anyway, I love both Modern SMG4 and Old SMG4. It's just SMG4. I accept whatever SMG4 changes in his videos. I dont care if you are a hater of SMG4. If you hate him then unsubscribe to him then. If you can't accept things then deal with it, boomer. That ends my long essay. One advice for you is... Just enjoy it. SMG4 is SMG4 and he is always pure entertainment. Argue about this comment all you want in the replies section I don't care I'm not gonna even bother replying to these comments. Seriously, grow up stop whining about old SMG4. I get it, old SMG4 is gold. Goodbye.

[@TheAwsumMegario]

I do not wish for any argument here, like you said. My words here are just to settle things down, Although it may look like it, I am not a hater. I love SMG4. In fact I bet all those people criticising smg4 love smg4 too. Because they want smg4 to be better. There is a fine line between destructive and constructive criticism, one being hateful, and one being because there are actual problems with the show. Sorry, I do not mean to anger you but I have to tell you the truth, there are actual problems in the show that need to be fixed. If you don’t see them, that is perfectly fine. People have their thoughts. But others have other views, and find those problems with the show to be affecting their enjoyment, thus, they criticise. Just letting you know, criticism is good for a show, and is what makes it better. Like sonic, I’m pretty sure the franchise got better because of criticism. I do not expect your reply to this, and certainly not an argument. I just hope you understand what I’m trying to say. Thank you.

[@penguinh4z3]

@@TheAwsumMegario Sorry Megario I was actually trying to point out to those people out there who criticize SMG4 heavily and I didn't actually mean to point it to you. I'm so sorry but I respect your reply and I also understand. Thank you.

[@luciehaberzettlova7240]

All chapters of the undesreved downfall of smg4 chapter 1 the classic days 2011 _ 2017 chapter 2 chapter 2 the beginning of arcs 2018 _ early 2019 chapter 3 the arc that changed everything 2019 _ early 2020 chapter 4 the introduction of glitch productions 2020 _ 2021 chapter 5 the aftermath 2022 _ present day

[@liotheeeveetrainer4305]

2022 was a dissaster for SMG4 But 2023 was acually amazing

[@BTWECrew]

Honestly, I agree, but that's just my opinion.

[@HarrowwInk]

smg4 was never good to begin with

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

Get lost then the hell you doing here lol

[@Sonicfan2592]

My issue with SMG4 arcs is that they likely end in wotfi's which now arent even wars, yea sure wotfi 2023 was pretty good but wotfi's are meant to be light harded and yet he put a wotfi at the end of the genesis arc (one of the darkest arc ever) and at this point the wotfi's are predictable, challenges, rap battles (which wotfi 2023s rap battle was ass, it wasnt even a rap) and something story related happens, imagine they started an arc with a wotfi that would be something.

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

Um no, you can’t call fully-fledged songs bad just because they’re not rap battles. The way you said “IT SUCKS BECAUSE ITS NOT EXACTLY HOW I LIKE IT!” makes you sound like a karen or a spoiled brat.

[@Mike-xq1cq]

We all gotta admit tho, meggy is so overused, like REAAALLY overused

[@Santagmk0]

Smg4s new content is genuinely good, he hasn’t fallen off, he has gotten better

[@kaden-sd6vb]

Sounds like something a Gen alpha who didn't grow up with the free & uncensored internet would say.

[@Lincfish10894TS]

The unhinged of the past gave me expectations to Pluto, didn’t give a smile for new

[@SMCwasTaken]

Ok 8 year old

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

Yeah I don’t know why people don’t understand that “fell off” means “lost subscribers.” They think they have to say he fell off just because they want to whine about how they personally don’t like him anymore.

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

@@SMCwasTaken That’s the best you could come up with lol how pathetic

[@scottvgamer1163]

I really don’t see any legitimately objective problems with “modern” SMG4. I’ve never noticed a drop in quality at all. Also, what “plot holes” are there exactly (genuinely curious)?? And yes, I did watch the video.

[@TheAwsumMegario]

hohoho, if you step into things like, r/smg4, you'd find that there are a lot of plot holes and stuff. Here's a plot hole: Take melony as an example. There are so many things in smg4 melony could solve yet she barely appears in the show. Why even have her in the show when they're not going to use her? And those very few times where smg4 used her in 2023, that's good. *Character dont just exist for the sake of a singular arc* A way to solve this melony problem with her godlike powers is to give her a flaw with her powers, so there isnt the plot hole that melnoy can solve pretty much anything. That is just one of the plot holes i know with smg4 and im sure you'd find much more on r/smg4. Not just r/smg4. Ciblesyt too (he left smg4). His video saying that he was leaving smg4, he makes a pretty thorough rant on smg4 so i recomend you go and watch that. Sorry if this was too long

[@scottvgamer1163]

@@TheAwsumMegario no worries. But in regards to something like that, I’d chalk it up to them either not wanting to rely on her for everything, she doesn’t want to be relied on for everything, or she’s still just asleep. There were at least a couple time if I recall where they DID try to call her for help but she was asleep. I’m not saying this isn’t a plot hole, but something like this doesn’t ruin anything for me. Even though SMG4 has been going for a more story driven route over the years with the arcs, it sounds as though people are taking it more seriously than we’re supposed to.

[@yolojocolo5523]

While I get he wants to focus more on the indie animations, at this point I’d rather he just made a big send off video in 2017 before smg4 started to really fall off. The channel deserves to end in a fantastic bang not a pathetic whimper.

[@BlueMonkey_YT]

Smg4 didn’t fall off. I don’t care if people think he’s gotten worse, the sub count is what determines whether or not he’s declined. If Smg4 was better 10 years ago, he would’ve had more subs. That’s how it works.

[@boxhowtalks]

This was soo good your soo good at editing

[@jorgeuri4569]

I always was right...

[@Realjeffthong12]

dude i agree with most points given but the recent wofi make us the audience engaged with a interactive poll Imo smg4 should do more of these live streams poll for wofi and after this video i deserve the hate claming that you title this as tho you hate smg4

[@MorkerBob]

SMG4 became basically those disney sitcon series intended for teens but without the funny part of the sitcon and only the part of when they try to have drama etc

[@CarrCarr2421]

That’s actually a pretty accurate comparison.

[@aar0n5teen]

Yeah i call smg characters suc3 and suc4