The Lord of the Rings Expert Reacts to The Rings of Power

[@taniasantiago991]

"No Man nor Elf has ever seen a beardless Dwarf - unless he were shaven in mockery, and would then be more like to die of shame... For the Naugrim have beards from the beginning of their lives, males and females alike." - Tolkien

[@CainAbaddon]

Unless they were shaven. So maybe they shaved? What a concept.

[@HyakuJuu01300]

@@CainAbaddon "shaven in mockery". Can't even read properly, huh?

[@gogoarcade]

@@CainAbaddon meaning it's embarrassing to go with out the beard

[@taniasantiago991]

@@CainAbaddon ....read it again.

[@14DANESSJ]

Which book was this taken from?

[@noelcastillo3829]

Ask yourself, why did Peter Jackson build his sets with Alan Lee, the guy who first made paintings based on Tolkien's work. Why not scrap that, and just say "Well technically Tolkien never wrote this, and focus groups certainly think its important." Perhaps the fact that this is visual story telling, and thus respecting visual language creates a sense of fidelity which reaches a for a wider audience. Then ask yourself, how is it that the one of the most successful companies in the world, that could literally burn money, make a teaser that looks less cinematic than Peter Jackson did with a budget of 30 mil per movie, 20 years ago.

[@alantaylor6691]

Are you concerned this series won't have that 'real history' look to it that the films had? In the films they used miniatures and real sets where they could. However this series looks highly processed and not like 'real history".

[@dgenxali]

Imagine hating peter jackson movies because Aragorn had a beard. Some Tolkien fans have become literal babies.

[@futbolman15]

@@dgenxali Imagine someone pretending that the lack of beards on dwarf women is the only issue that has fans angry about this show.

[@mardigrasw]

@@futbolman15 BOOM 💥 DROP THE 🎤 😆

[@B1g_Salad]

@@dgenxali if that’s the only reason you think fans are upset don’t even bother sharing your opinion, let alone having an opinion on anything lotr related.

[@svagglaorde4387]

I'm surprised they didn't turn off the comments for this one.

[@GetLostGames1]

😂. This show is doa

[@KroVey]

Agreed, surprisingly democratic for Amazon's mouthpieces

[@Arizto7828]

They eventually will

[@Gruntled2001]

what remains to be seen is what they will do about the comments on Amazon's site when the show finally comes out.

[@Rayenhniel]

If only there was a way to figure out what's actually written in the books without the opinions of an expert. Like...I dunno...reading the books?

[@sullivanlaramie2901]

Like reading an early draft? Want to talk any sort of 'canon,' you're kind of stuck with the Hobbit and the Lord of the Rings, which don't really talk about the Second Age. Tolkien was still revising the Silmarillion when he passed away. As published may be the last coherent version written down, but it's certainly not how he saw Middle-earth by the end of his life. Some of the stories in the Silmarillion were written as far back as 1917, but he was revising until 1972. Imagine writing seven drafts of a book but people only accept what's in the third.

[@paulalbertstern]

@@sullivanlaramie2901 Okay, so we should just throw the Silmarillion and the appendices away and makeup whatever we want. Heard

[@torkilddenhje20]

@@sullivanlaramie2901 the Silmarillion was written as a helping guide line for the Lord of the Rings books, Tolkien wanted to have a series of stories from the old world of middle earth in which support the three books. The Silmarillion was never intended to be a book on itself.

[@mhagain]

That's wrong. The Silmarillion was written and submitted for publication in 1937, before LotR was even started. It's well-known that Tolkien wanted to publish the two together, and it's well-known that revising the Silmarillion was a main reason for the delay in LotR being published and for disputes with his publisher,.

[@hikaruvortex]

@@torkilddenhje20 You are wrong. Silmarilion was always a book that Tolkien intended to release. You can find this info easy. He even declared this in letters to LOTR editor.

[@dohjoe5747]

"You know, I'm something of an expert myself." - meme

[@aesir1ases64]

lol exactly

[@VienPeaaace]

He probably think he's super special for reading all of the series lol.

[@Pedrocas84]

@@VienPeaaace he teaches Tolkien at university level.

[@danhalstead705]

Actually, he is. You are not.

[@Pedrocas84]

@@danhalstead705 he probably never made fan art or watched the movies more than 15 times. So according to this fake quote army he is a meme expert.

[@npc_445]

"BUT TOLKIEN NEVER SAID..." Well, he never said anything about hobbits using miniguns. Lets get them ones!

[@ayoheynns1327]

exactly

[@unitron2005]

Except he did. But he NEVER said. Specially not when he DID.

[@mhagain]

He never said Aragorn went to the toilet either. But we can reasonably assume he did. See how this works?

[@js1817]

Ones? Are you trying to make the word "one" plural? "Some"; the word is "some".

[@vincenzoberetta1085]

Considering how Tolkien hated the progress of technology, Nazgûls on F-22s would be as cool as f**k.

[@infoscrolls]

As it turned out, Amazon fired Thomas Alan Shippey. English professor of literature, philology and writer. He worked and taught at Oxford, Leeds and St. Louis Universities, where he studied medieval literature, science fiction and fantasy. He is one of the most authoritative researchers of Tolkien's work on the planet. Mariana Rios Maldonado was chosen to take his place as Tolkien's "chief consultant". Not at all a specialist in Tolkien's work, but a student at the University of Glasgow where she writes a doctoral thesis on "Ethics, Femininity and other issues in the stories of J.R.R. Middle-earth". Tolkien". She also serves as overseer of the Diversity and Equality student committee. She publicly states that she considers Tolkien's works "problematic", that they glorify racial inequality, sexism and chauvinism. And his works are loved by people adhering to neo-fascist views. She considers herself morally and intellectually superior to Tolkien, and therefore works tirelessly to turn the Myths of Arda into a modern, adapted and corrected version that will appeal to everyone.

[@Belerez]

Show me your source bro . Maybe he finished his part? And its not like there are not other tolkien-experts in the team

[@scuttlefish4667]

Shipley was fired for breaking his NDA. Where’s your source on Ronaldo being hired as chief consultant?

[@Belerez]

@@scuttlefish4667 Source: trust me bro

[@Cyberplayer1337]

Source: it came to me in a dream

[@aesir1ases64]

@@Belerez he was fired for breaking a contract and giving an interview when he should not, or some stuff like that, they have other experts there but none with the authority of Shippey.

[@Hello_there_obi]

You know who's an actual "expert"? Tom Shippey. Tell me, where is he?

[@VoiceofGeekdom]

You know Shippey and Olsen are friends and colleagues, right? Tom Shippey has taught courses at Corey's university, in the past.

[@Hello_there_obi]

@@VoiceofGeekdom apparently olsen wasn't listening very well

[@theogiannop5961]

@@Hello_there_obi because you don't like what he says?

[@Warren_Peace]

@@theogiannop5961 Because Olsen is demonstrably wrong.

[@rburk854]

fired for violating his NDA

[@purplekrakenyut]

Hot damn, the damage control for a billion dollars is absolutely amazing

[@luccasmacedo6524]

This man is a puppet from amazon

[@TheFlashPillager]

@@luccasmacedo6524 Yes, sent forth to try and convince the masses that a turd will taste like a doughnut.

[@indiecomicsjones]

So far the 'Damage Control' has done more damage! It's shite!

[@sald142]

Racists tripping lmao

[@jakecal6802]

😬 💰

[@LandStrider23]

Thranduil and Legolas are NOT Silvan elves. They're Sindar.

[@aleksejsmiscuks4138]

Tbh Legolas calls himself Sylvan elf at least on one occasion when they arrive in ERegion in the fellowship book.

[@Luzbelito772]

@@aleksejsmiscuks4138 At best, Legolas is half Sylvan (and the so-called "expert" does not explain it), although, using the logic of Amazon and his army of dunces, he can also be half Transformer or half Ninja Turtle, since Tolkien did not specify anything about his mother .

[@blenderguy3250]

Ecssperttt

[@sald142]

Racists tripping lmaooooo

[@tefazDK]

Well, they both come from the Teleri part of the elves and the only difference is that the Sindar travelled to Beleriand to dwell in Doriath. So theres not really a difference between them in genes. So it's just a matter of coming from a more royal group of elves that had Thingol as their leader in ancient times. But being a leader of Silvan elves, could be argued to make you a Silvan elf also.

[@ionvash]

It would be interesting if IGN made a part two answering disputed claims from the comment section.

[@dgenxali]

So now rando nobodies in comments know more Tolkien than actual professors who teach Tolkien? That's hilarious!

[@johnathonhealey4406]

@@dgenxali its literally in the books....... Anyone can fact check

[@thomasbardoux1692]

@@dgenxali Well, this "teacher" is demonstably wrong. Credentials means nothing when you're wrong in every sentence

[@RLKmedic0315]

@@dgenxali it is not hard. Just read the books and the associated appendices. Hell, plenty of people in this comment section have listed Tolkien's writings that directly oppose the things this professor is saying. Just because someone claims to be a professor of something does not automatically make him an expert. The proof is in the pudding, and this professor's pudding is rancid.

[@Jan_ne]

@@thomasbardoux1692 Tolkien changed his mind on a lot of things multiple times, so it is easy to find something contradictory, but that does not mean it what Tolkien actually intended.

[@twicegod9160]

So THIS is why they took away dislikes, so companies can’t be held responsible!

[@VaGuS343]

Yes. Exactly.... Scared of the truth. Lol

[@gastonalvarez9140]

Right now this video has 2400 likes and 9700 DISLIKES

[@loredelamore]

Death ears can not keep companies from going under when no one buys their products. They can keep the dislikes off, makes it more hilarious when it all comes crashing down for them!

[@aleisterbroley900]

@@loredelamore they can't even keep the dislikes off, there's extensions to show them, and even sites that track the deleted dislikes and reset likes, view counts, etc

[@hannibalb8276]

More like so forever alone, always online far right brigaders and propagandists can't underhandedly manipulate online spaces like you kids LOVE to do

[@joshuas1744]

Fact Check: Dwarf Women had beards according to Tolkien: In The War of the Jewels ("The Later Quenta Silmarillion: Of the Naugrim and the Edain", written ~1951), Tolkien wrote that: "no Man nor Elf has ever seen a beardless Dwarf - unless he were shaven in mockery, and would then be more like to die of shame... For the Naugrim have beards from the beginning of their lives, male and female alike..." Literally 10 seconds into this and he's already demonstrably wrong...

[@GundamReviver]

Aaaand tolkien prof BTFO. Well done.

[@MrDwarfBangityBang]

Well said

[@sgfwalterodimmm824]

YES history of ME vol. 11 ! "Expert"... oof

[@breadordecide]

“No man or elf has ever seen.” This could be a shamed or excommunicated dwarf. Also, maybe this is one that no man or elf ever saw.

[@user-hw6zp7wh3e]

@@breadordecide "the Naugrim have beards from the beginning of their lives, male and female alike" (Naugrim=Dwarf) And this is no excommunicated or unknown dwarf, she is playing the princess of Moria and is a main character of the show.

[@gandalftehdank6052]

To anyone wondering, this "LOTR Expert" is the Tolkien Professor, Dr. Corey Olsen, who is renowned for his KZbin Series 'Exploring the Lord of the Rings' where he analyses the text paragraph by paragraph. The fact that he contradicted Tolkien in the first 10 seconds of this video is alarming, for he is undoubtedly very learned in the lore. It is sad to witness his fall to the Dark Lord Bezos. Our list of allies grows thin...

[@nerthus4685]

Against the power of Amazon there can be no victory.”

[@gandalftehdank6052]

@@nerthus4685 There never was much hope... Just a fool's hope.

[@Mortenhendriksen]

The Guy is 100% either a fraud or a sell out xD

[@gandalftehdank6052]

@@Mortenhendriksen He has made Tolkien content far before you were even born, my friend.

[@freddycv1174]

@@gandalftehdank6052 and He betrayed all these years just in one fake vídeo.

[@GEORGEGEORGEIII]

Yes, Tolkien wrote that all Dwarves have beards. Check your sources dude.

[@braddl9442]

He knows that. That is why he is a LIAR. He sold out to amazon.

[@JS-hc4ok]

Tolkien changed his mind later in life, read Nature of Middle Earth.

[@algumnick]

That reminds me of the community episode when abed explains "Who's the Boss"

[@BradTrapp]

@@JS-hc4ok you mean the book that was published 5 months ago? Yeah, sounds like someone took a bunch of Tolkien's notes and is now trying to cash in on them. I'll take the work the author actually published over a cash grab.

[@JS-hc4ok]

​@@BradTrapp Where in the books that Tolkien published himself does it explicitly say dwarven women have beards? The Silmarillion was published 4 years after he died by his family so according to you it is just a cash grab and shouldn't be trusted.

[@koxacbka]

his excitement is great...til you learn that they've fired Tom Shippey (one of world experts on Tolkien) and hired Mariana Ríos on his place (she is not an expert in any way). after that it's hard to be excited about upcoming thing.

[@WinXitheP00h]

She sounds more “diverse” though

[@AS-ri1mb]

She literally hates Tolkien though. She’s been on record saying that he and his works are “problematic”. NOT the right person to employ in a LOTR show 🤦‍♂️

[@JemRau]

@@WinXitheP00h and “Different”.

[@HarryMoho]

They fired him because he broke a NDA

[@connorp8408]

@@HarryMoho and they hired the second most acclaimed Tolkien expert after that? Or did they just say f it?

[@jbshbsskskhbs6713]

Also, at 13:41 calling Legolas and Thranduil Silvan, when they are in fact Sindar who rule mostly Silvan elves... this is no expert, just a media tool to rubber stamp show changes from the lore

[@Garl_Vinland]

He’s only a sindar in the Jackson films

[@privatebaldric8767]

@@Garl_Vinland No he's not. They are Sindar. Thranduil was a prince of Doriath

[@thatbodymechanic]

Yup. Sindarin

[@thatbodymechanic]

From calaquendi lineage if memory serves.

[@shawnac9289]

@@thatbodymechanic correct

[@jacobvannatta4381]

“Evil cannot create anything new, they can only corrupt” - J.R.R Tolkien

[@azariyelvarro6271]

Fun fact: This isn't a real Tolkien quote. It's a reworked paraphrase of the general lore around evil and creation in Tolkien's work. One could even call this quote..a corruption... of what he actually said.

[@DrCruel]

There's nothing wrong about this show that Mr Frog couldn't fix in a few animation frames.

[@celem12]

If Dwarven Women are textually often mistaken for Dwarven Men and all Dwarven Men have beard....

[@breadordecide]

Thats just an assumption. Could be because they are all short and wide.

[@Tadamichi666]

@@breadordecide No, all Dwarves had beards at the start of their lives it is confirmed. It is also confirmed that if their beards were shaven they would die of shame, if Tolkien says they are similar in appearance and are often mistaken for Dwarven men then they have beards.

[@BoroMirraCz]

@@Tadamichi666 and it is also confirmed that only all dwarf males had beards.

[@danhalstead705]

@@Tadamichi666 Confirmed on scraps of paper that Tolkien jotted thoughts on, which he often changed his mind about, is not the same as canonical. All they have to go on is what he actually chose to publish in the Appendices. Give them a little leeway, it's not the end of the world either way. This reminds me of the debates before the Jackson movies on whether elves had pointy ears and whether Balrogs had wings. In the end, that stuff matters far less than the plot and spirit intended by the production. The plot and spirit is what we still know the least about, and dwarven beards have very little relationship to it.

[@Warren_Peace]

@@BoroMirraCz It is not. It is mentioned that male dwarves have Beards not that it is only them that has them, especially if other corroborating materials are taken into account.

[@mikepriestey2547]

This guy - "Tolkien never says Dwarven women have beards." Tolkien - "For the Naugrim have beards from the beginning of their lives, male and female alike; nor indeed can their womenkind be discerned by those of other race, be it in feature or in gait or in voice" When you get your LOTR 'expert' from Walmart.

[@EdsonPonzani]

They called Amazon and asked where they found Mariana Rios Maldonado

[@turbobutton1]

Thank you, also the appendices of Return of the King, say that the fale dwarves were indistinguishable from the males in the eyes and ears of other races.

[@HarryMoho]

So why did Tolkien, in a footnote of one of his writings from the year of his death, deem it fit to group all Hobbits, all Eldar together in clarifying that they did not have beards, but when it came to Dwarves, he did not. He wrote explicitly: "All male Dwarves had them" and emphasized male in italics. If all Dwarves had beards, why would he have been so careful to specify "male", when he had just grouped all Hobbits together, and all Eldar together previously in that same footnote?

[@mikepriestey2547]

@@HarryMoho So your argument is that he stated all male dwarves have beards and put male in italics vs him factually writing the above passage that states the females all have beards? Are you ok? Let's not forget this quote as well: "They are in voice and appearance, and in garb if they must go on a journey, so like to the dwarf-men that the eyes and ears of other peoples cannot tell them apart." If they're the same in appearance and other races can't tell the dwarf men and women apart and all dwarf men have beards as you stated, what would that suggest? 🤔 It would be pretty easy to tell them apart if the men had beards and the women didn't. You're wrong.

[@TheWtikaiser]

@@mikepriestey2547 Just a bit of typical sophistry to try to confuse a pretty clear issue.

[@kudixns]

So the expert says that Numenor lies near the equator, so Numenorians living there won't look like Vikings. OK, sounds logical. But on the other side we have a dark skinned dwarf woman, that lives underground in the north and dwarf women leave their homes only in days of great need. So his expertise is quite contradictory.

[@anonymousbosch9265]

If the planet started out round it might make sense

[@fotzegamingandmedia1840]

One problem with that; Middle-Earth started out flat and became round after the Fall of Numenor

[@karlopopovic810]

So by his logic there shouldn't be any darker toned folk in north Africa?

[@-TheUnkownUser]

Tolkien expert forgots that arda was flat until *Numenor* fell...

[@mattburns617]

The original interview was 3 longs, IGN edited it down to 27 minutes. IGN took great liberties in creatively editing the interview in order to side with Amazon. Go watch his response to their edit in "Other Minds and Hands, Episode 1" on the Signum University channel.

[@rio20d]

The Elves couldn't defeated Morgoth, dont know why he even call himself Professor Tolkien. It was the Valar who defeated Morgoth and they are not elves. The elves were not able to defeat Morgoth, that's why so many had to retreat back to Valinor. It's said in the story that Eärendil went to Valinor to beg for the help of the Valar on behalf of both Elves and Men that the War of Wrath was unleashed and Morgoth defeated. So Elves could not do it, not by themselves. They tried, for centuries. Mandos warned them it was hopeless, but the rebellious Noldor tried anyway.

[@braddl9442]

Cause he has to lie for amazon cause that was what he sold his credibility for.

[@anarionelendili8961]

Most people in the army of Valinor who fought in the War of Wrath were the Elves who had stayed in Valinor. They were led by Eonwe, Manwe's Herald. None of the Valar set a foot in Beleriand in the War of Wrath. There are criticisms that can be laid on Corey Olsen's answers in the interview (such as the dwarf beards), but this is nitpicking.

[@nerthus4685]

@@braddl9442 The real ring of power is money. He couldn't resist.

[@Stephen64138]

@@anarionelendili8961 > _At the end of the War of Wrath, Tulkas entered Angband and descending to the lowest pits found Melkor cowering. Tulkas wrestled with him, again casting Melkor down, dragging him out and binding him with the chain Angainor._ That might have been in an early version but at some point, the valars were crearly involed.

[@anarionelendili8961]

@@Stephen64138 Yeah, looks like Christopher edited Tulkas out in the published Silmarillion: "Then the sun rose, and the host of the Valar prevailed, and well-nigh all the dragons were destroyed; and all the pits of Morgoth were broken and unroofed, and the might of the Valar descended into the deeps of the earth. There Morgoth stood at last at bay, and yet unvaliant. He fled into the deepest of his mines, and sued for peace and pardon; but his feet were hewn from under him, and he was hurled upon his face. Then he was bound with the chain Angainor which he had worn aforetime, and his iron crown they beat into a collar for his neck, and his head was bowed upon his knees. And the two Silmarils which remained to Morgoth were taken from his crown, and they shone unsullied beneath the sky; and Eönwë took them, and guarded them."

[@_Thorondor]

“The canons of narrative in any medium cannot be wholly different; and the failure of poor films is often precisely in exaggeration, and in the intrusion of unwarranted matter owing to not perceiving where the core of the original lies.” ~ JRR Tolkien

[@Double_T]

Not wholly different, but different due to the requirements of varying mediums.

[@Realhater1352]

Where do you think the core of the original lies? In having all white elves and Viking numenoreans and bearded white dwarf women? Jesus read the damn books. There’s enough to criticize about the tv show that has nothing to do with the diversity of its cast. Tolkein would’ve hated the Peter Jackson films too

[@_Thorondor]

@@Realhater1352 Jesus read the books when?

[@shinobi-no-bueno]

@@_Thorondor during the sky zombie days

[@_Thorondor]

@@shinobi-no-bueno Ah yes

[@tranilator]

This so-called Tolkien expert doesn’t want to upset the potential Amazon gravy train. My question to this 'expert': How long has it been since Amazon bought you? What was the promised price Corey Olsen? When all of Tolkien's work are profaned beyond measure you would take your share of the treasure?

[@braddl9442]

its like we are seeing the one ring corrupt a man in real time.

[@intelligentmeditations8378]

@@braddl9442 Its like a reflection too of all the corruption even at the highest levels that the world has seen lately

[@professorbutters5201]

You're kidding, right? The only evidence you have that Amazon must have "bought" him is that he is saying things you don't like. So is the Tolkien Society. So is The One Ring net. So is Nerd of the Rings. It's possible that these respected people and organizations have come to their conclusions authentically, because no one wants to throw away decades of credibility for a small payout.

[@fenixiliusstrife1253]

@@professorbutters5201 Wanna quote Toleins writings then? None of these people do.

[@FragLord]

@@professorbutters5201 "No Man nor Elf has ever seen a beardless Dwarf - unless he were shaven in mockery, and would then be more like to die of shame... For the Naugrim have beards from the beginning of their lives, males and females alike." - Tolkien Book of Jewels

[@papalazzzaru]

War Of the Jewels - Concerning the Dwarves: "§5 The Naugrim were ever, as they still remain, short and squat in stature; they were deep-breasted, strong in the arm, and stout in the leg, and their beards were long. Indeed this strangeness they have that no Man nor Elf has ever seen a beardless Dwarf - unless he were shaven in mockery, and would then be more like to die of shame than of many other hurts that to us would seem more deadly. For the Naugrim have beards from the beginning of their lives, male and female alike; nor indeed can their womenkind be discerned by those of other race, be it in feature or in gait or in voice, nor in any wise save this: that they go not to war, and seldom save at direst need issue from their deep bowers and halls. It is said, also, that their womenkind are few, and that save their kings and chieftains few Dwarves ever wed; wherefore their race multiplied slowly, and now is dwindling."

[@dododimitrov9657]

Thank you

[@luigigregorio3981]

Naugrim = Dwarves

[@nothankyoutube]

But who cares?

[@Ariastes707]

@@nothankyoutube if the first thing the video clips is blatantly wrong it makes the expert tag line hilarious for one.

[@nickpalazzo6585]

War of the Jewels is not something to which Amazon has the rights. And Dr. Olsen is explicitly talking about the text of the Lord of the Rings itself.

[@jamjar4804]

Such a shame... He really IS a Tolkien expert, and he knows what he's saying is wrong. Seems like IGN told him he had to come up with justifications for all of amazon's lore-breaking changes, and he sold out. Shame on you Mr. Olsen.

[@Real_Iron_Smith]

Well also they interviewed him for hours and then chopped up and condensed it down to the length of this video, in the process making it sound like he was defending the show far more than he likely was.

[@conelord1984]

@@Real_Iron_Smith Probably, but there is no context that can save him from the obvious lies he told here.

[@Real_Iron_Smith]

@@conelord1984 Eh, Fair.

[@jayponetwothree7154]

The algorithm is simple enough: Amazon sends money to IGN to find some “expert” to send money to in order for them to subvert their knowledge to that of Amazon’s perception changing algorithm (ie. expert + $$$ = established lore - things we want changed * subscriptions we need to sell).

[@connoisseurofcookies2047]

The amount of 'cope articles' I've seen popping up justifying Amazons mutilations after this backlash is astounding. Titles such as 'did Aragorn have a beard' or '10 things the LoTR movies did better than the books' just to strawman and throw sand into fans' eyes.

[@unitron2005]

One of the most common theme in Tolkien's lore is that greed is one of the worst evils and it corrupts even the best people and overcomming it is one of the greatest virtues. And here we have a deformation of Tolkien's work, created by superfan Jeff Bozo, 2nd richest person in the world, who somehow still can't help but work his employees to death for pocket change. As well as the Tolkien "expert", dr. "Tolkien Never-Said" who suddenly doesn't seem to know much at all about things he somehow knew before the show... Peak irony.

[@Palendrome]

He could barely even give ONE criticism, except that he was slightly concerned with the meteor.

[@nerthus4685]

It is literally the Scouring of the Shire.

[@michaelhejja]

Bezos is Sauromon.

[@Overlich]

For the Naugrim have beards from the beginning of their lives, male and female alike; nor indeed can their womenkind be discerned by those of other race... The War of the Jewels - (Part Two) The Later Quenta Silmarillion: XIII Concerning the Dwarves BY CHRISTOPHER TOLKIEN ... so wtf is he talking about?

[@kanishkaperera7704]

He’s a Tolkien expert. He knows about middle earth than Tolkien himself. So shut up and listen 😌😂

[@JoaoMariaNunes]

he is a Tolkien professor as iam the POPE

[@sawcondiznuts1422]

U know that war if the jewels is something Amazon does have rights to 🥴

[@kanishkaperera7704]

@Keelan Jonathan If he has the audacity to call himself a Tolkien expert he should at least do some research before sitting in front of the camera. Otherwise he’ll get “kisses” from the fandom 😌😂

[@NightTimeDay]

He's less "Tolkien" and more "professor", it seems. And we all know what professors are hired and fired for these days. Starts with pol and ends with itics. All he is doing here is doing what professors do; hold up prescribed political ideas and push very specific cultural narratives at the expense of facts. He can't admit that the criticisms are valid because doing so would be to admit that the ideology can be criticized as well.

[@nilocblue]

What Saruman was to Sauron, IGN is to Amazon now.

[@TheNSKaneda]

For an expert he doesn't seem to know much of what Tolkien had actually written. Luckily it's not only written down, it's out there for all to read and call out lies and misinformation.

[@guiramos3733]

I’m sure the time you’ve spent on Reddit, Wikipedia and movie watching is far more valuable than a life time studying someone’s work. Keep telling yourself that on your basement.

[@lordofstone3989]

Besides the dwarf beards, which he obviously is mistaken on, what parts of Tolkien's works was he wrong about?

[@sionwright3570]

the part about the dwarf beards, Quite a huge oversight, especially how he impresses how this was just a joke made by PJ.

[@JS-hc4ok]

@@lordofstone3989 hes not wrong about the beards. Tolkien changed his mind about it. Read Nature of Middle Earth

[@Palendrome]

@@JS-hc4ok He said literally "No textual basis, something movie fans came up with" and that is just incorrect, even if Tolkien did put differing opinions in different pieces.

[@audriuskasperavicius7270]

Tolkein speaks about how characters look: E.G. 'There is one of my people yonder across the stream,' he said, 'though you may not see him.' He gave a call like the low whistle of a bird, and out of a thicket of young trees an Elf stepped, clad in grey, but with his hood thrown back; his hair glinted like gold in the morning sun.' So it means that elfs can have yellow (like gold) hair. OR 'Her hair was long, her limbs were white, And fair she was and free; ' Poem about Nimrodel, also elf. Long hair are mentioned. And at least libs are white. Of course its only details, but the are about how they look.

[@unpopularopinion5022]

yeah thats why by lore legolas should not have blonde hair , but ofcourse that would not recive backlash

[@aesir1ases64]

@@unpopularopinion5022 the color of a hair is a minor change unless its explicitly said the given color is important, like for example making galadriel a brunette would receive immense backlash.

[@juliaj7939]

Tolkien also wrote that the Easterlings described the Elves as "white-fiends:.

[@_brunolima]

@@unpopularopinion5022 That's not true. First: yes, it receive alot of backlash back in the day. Second: his father, Thranduil, had blonde hair. So it make sense, at least.

[@torkilddenhje20]

@2freeIvX and your point exactly is?? The elves who came for another continent where the same elves who awaken in beleriand, they are three different groups, Vanyar, Noldor and Teleri, minor physical differences but as a whole must the same. Legolas is a Sindar elf, who are part of the Teleri who chose to remain and not go to Valinor.

[@jamescotter]

“Whom do you serve?” “Bezosmaaannn”

[@zbigniewp1810]

Imagine making Tolkien lore your profession and then failing so hard at it that someone like me still remembers it better after 20 years since reading Silmarilion. Nice "Tolkien expert" here.

[@vittorio74]

Give some examples come on. Back up your claims at least instead of just pretending to sound smart

[@St4rTr3v1Ut10n]

@@vittorio74 the very first point he makes is debunked by a passage that states every dwarf has a beard lest they shaved it off in shame, male and female alike.

[@JF-xm6tu]

@@vittorio74 a subterranean civilization would not be black

[@brokentv1855]

@@JF-xm6tu aren’t orcs and goblins subterranean?

[@JF-xm6tu]

@@brokentv1855 yeah and they aren't black skinned. They turned green

[@magusi9029]

Crazy Idea, if you want to tell a story that reflects current politics and issues? Create something new! “Improving” greatness is folly.

[@edwardrichtofen8530]

Hell, just look at how Disney tried to “improve” Mulan

[@aesir1ases64]

One does not simply create new IPs that no one will watch because its full of pointless souless garbage political correctness

[@edwardrichtofen8530]

@@aesir1ases64 that’s exactly why they have to take over old IPs. Amazon knows if they just made a generic fantasy and had all their representation in it people just won’t really watch it. That is why it has to be forced into something people liked.

[@hardromeo436]

They can't create something new because they don't know how to create. All they can do is take beloved properties and wear them like skin suits

[@WarlockLov3]

Some random pages that support the fact that dwarf women have beards: The Hobbit pg 20-22, or 42, pg 159. The Fellowship of the Ring pg 240. The Return of the King pg 148, pg 153, pg 360. The Tolkien FAQ by William D.B. Loos is quite helpful as well.

[@churchofclaus]

bUt pEtEr JaCkSoN mAdE tHaT uP aS a JoKe!!

[@OllieScambaiter]

So why did Tolkien, in a footnote of one of his writings from the year of his death, deem it fit to group all Hobbits, all Eldar together in clarifying that they did not have beards, but when it came to Dwarves, he did not. He wrote explicitly: "All male Dwarves had them" and emphasized male in italics. If all Dwarves had beards, why would he have been so careful to specify "male", when he had just grouped all Hobbits together, and all Eldar together previously in that same footnote?

[@irenb9232]

you do realize that people have different editions of the books, so unless you quote exact passages - those are just a bunch of random page numbers :D

[@WarlockLov3]

@@irenb9232 no need for you to be facetious, but if you really care then the chapters are: The Hobbit chapter 1, 2, 7, 10, and 11. The Fellowship of the Ring chapter 2. The Return of the King chapters chapters 5 and at the end of the book in appendix A.

[@Pedrocas84]

This is a lie.

[@jujuberrie]

"Tolkien never said dwarven women had beards." Are you... Serious? It's stated and alluded to countless times in the Lord Of the Rings alone. Where do they find these people who'll happily agree with whatever narrative they're trying to push, just to lie for money and attention? Smh. Nobody has any honor nowadays

[@LuisGonzalez-gj8el]

He's clearly no expert

[@Heat3YT2]

Citations please. Just because no man or elf have seen a beardless dwarf does not mean there are none. Tolkien was a philologist. He used his words carefully. What do the words say, not what do you think they say.

[@bryandedon7459]

@@Heat3YT2 are you asking where it says women had beards? There's been about 400 people who have posted the exact quote. Theres no way you didn't see it. Yes he says no elf has seen it but then further down he says for the naugrim have beards from the beginning of their lives, male and female alike.

[@MustardSkaven]

@@Heat3YT2 it means none without beards can be in the show cause they would have been seen without a beard. Which would contradict tolkien. So even if there is some female dwarf without a beard somewhere, she may never be seen by an elf or man so never appear in the show.

[@metaforeva3744]

@@Heat3YT2 There is a quote that states that the Naugrim all have bears, both males and females alike. This was from the "War of Jewels" Book which was edited by Christopher Tolkien, the son of JRR Tolkien. The book that our dear professor here references is a book that came out extremely recently and was one that was not edited by a Tolkien, but by somebody else entirely. The book Christopher edited included many things that Tolkien had never mentioned in his previous but were ideas of his.

[@LiuGondor]

Everything was OK until he said Thranduil and Legolas were Silvan, which they are not. They are Sindar, ruling silvans

[@bigjess7406]

"Professional"

[@kristallgold3615]

Everything? He just protect the new show , he will hate lord of the rings for this new show. He will protect with his life . He is not a expert. He is a hater. 💩

[@hernethehunted7130]

"Everything was OK", literally the first thing he says on the video is a lie!!

[@k--music]

@@kristallgold3615 how'd you get that idea lmao he even said he wasn't a fan of the meteor stuff at least, he's cautiously optimistic

[@kristallgold3615]

@@k--music he is fake, if you mean that’s optimistic than you are just a stup|d human with no brain bro 💡🧠😌 go learn the original or 🤐

[@seangannon6081]

It’s a shame they stopped showing the dislikes.

[@Whoazers01]

If you have Chrome, google "Return youtube dislikes" extension. It works pretty accurately and has made this whole LOTR debacle pretty satisfying lmao

[@Masimich]

765 dislikes 😉

[@jasonpittman7183]

1.3K dislikes at the moment

[@epicturtules]

Get the app KZbin vanced for android

[@xddxddovitz3284]

725 Likes 1.4K dislikes :D

[@1capatter]

Sad watching a multi-billion $$ company take such a beautiful story and destroy it

[@deltaraider87]

But there were some who resisted

[@loredelamore]

Come now, our entertainment is in watching Amazon lose a hell of a lot of money on something no real fan will ever buy.

[@shuangyuezhao8953]

@@loredelamore Absolutely

[@vulcov7430]

@@loredelamore sad thing is they wont lose that much. we already subscribe to their services. They already made their money back.

[@cesarflores2405]

All to the service of those who want to see politic correction and racial themes EVERYWHERE!

[@AMcGrath82]

10:12 Galadriel was still unmistakably elven. In her youth she still held the light of Valinor in her eyes. A man wouldn't need to pull back her hair to see her ears. Her nature would have been obvious by her bearing alone.

[@Navblol]

Thank you

[@unpopularopinion5022]

Its done a a dramatic effect , its called artistic licesnse , Peter Jackson tooks tones of liberties to twist the lore to suit the needs of the film , and amazon writers are doing the same.

[@frogonthebikeheh]

@@unpopularopinion5022 But he kept the magical atmosphere, Amazon just took what he wanted and glued it together, just some stuff that doesn't make sense, just stuff, no magic

[@aesir1ases64]

and this notion that galadriel was the equivalent of a 21 year old human when she was thousand of years old doesnt make any sense, if thats the case, what was the age equivalent of Gil Galad when he became the high king of the noldor under the age of 100 years of elves years??

[@privatebaldric8767]

@@unpopularopinion5022 The problem isn't that the got one or things wrong. They seemed to go out of their way to change everything they portrayed thus far. The worst part is that it's not even original. It just emulates the inferior, derivative, current-day stuff Tolkien inspired in the first place.

[@mrmercury9286]

A prime example of destroying your reputation in under 30 minutes

[@tobiusgregory2805]

"Whereas Melkor spent his energy in envy and hate, until at last he could make nothing save in mockery of the thought of others; and all their works he destroyed if he could." - Excerpt from "Valaquenta" by J.R.R. Tolkien. Which you'd know if you were a REAL Tolkien Professor.

[@Palendrome]

He can't even give it ONE single criticism

[@theoaure3774]

That's a perfect description of these new adaptations of old classics, like LOTR and Star Wars. These people, and their propaganda, are so incapable of creating anything of value. They can only alter to fit their narrative, oftentimes destroying the heart and soul of the very thing they were in charge of.

[@blessanabey8386]

Is this a Damage control from Amazon...They must be panicking.

[@EdsonPonzani]

Dude, this thing has over 1 billion USD riding on it 5 seasons locked, the plan to produce this thing for 10y + They dont need for this series to be big, if is not bigger then any series ever made by a huge marge is a fail If they are not panicking, they should

[@blessanabey8386]

@@EdsonPonzani I'm pretty sure every so called haters gonna atleast watch Season 1 so Amazon wins either way since it's a subscription based.

[@animelytical8354]

@@EdsonPonzani they... clearly didn't want it enough if they allowed such free reign to the people behind it

[@HoangNguyen-hv1qy]

@@blessanabey8386 Ever heard of torrents?

[@conelord1984]

@@EdsonPonzani Sure, there is a lot of money in this, but their return perspectives are not going well. Otherwise they wouldn't be that desperate to gaslight the fans.

[@TrevorH89]

No one is saying there wasn’t Hobbits in the 2nd age. They are saying that did not do anything significant which is why they were unlikely hero’s in the Lord of the Rings.

[@rezyabdurahman]

lol they were just fishing and the other one is smoking southfarthing grass back then

[@TrevorH89]

@@rezyabdurahman sounds like my life but Amazon isn’t putting me in a show 🤣

[@JesusIzAPunkRocker]

They didn't do anything significant *that was chronicled*. Important thing to emphasize.

[@edwardrichtofen8530]

@@JesusIzAPunkRocker ah. Can’t wait for that bag of worms to be open. Wonder what can be done under the guise of “it wasn’t chronicled”.

[@fukuokainternationaldemocr1974]

Cos they were having a quiet life in the Shires, hiding away from the chaos outside... Which is why they NEVER concerned themselves with the doings of "the big folk". This "expert" is nothing but a wormtongue.

[@vinoirma8225]

"Evil cannot create anything new, they can only corrupt" - J.R.R Tolkien

[@bluewizard_wheels]

If your going to use this quote at least use the correct one from return of the king, you just look a little silly :)

[@ЮрийМеньшиков-г7и]

@@bluewizard_wheels boohoo

[@byronrocher7346]

Unless that evil is Amazon

[@vinoirma8225]

@@byronrocher7346 don't critique amazon, that's antisemitic. Teehee.

[@vinoirma8225]

Ok, Gollum.

[@sadmonkey2529]

“... For the Naugrim have beards from the beginning of their lives, male and female alike…” J.R.R Tolkien

[@testtube173]

Give the guy a break he’s only been covering lotr content for over 10 years!

[@davidllamas2192]

@@testtube173 Loosing 10 years of his life

[@Belerez]

Tolkien says that they look just like dwarf men. He also clarifies later, concerning beards (Nature of Middle-earth, p 187, footnote), that "All _male_ dwarves had them." Tolkien (later in life) explicitly did NOT imagine dwarf women as bearded.

[@audriellaaudrentia3598]

he's really destroying his own images in 30 minutes

[@Gloronthor]

​@@Belerez​ He didn't denied the bearded dwarf women. You are just coping too hard.

[@HeloIV]

Ah yes, summoning the Mouth of Sauron as the Tolkien "expert" to promote the Dark Lord's work. Deviously clever!

[@dyinggaul8365]

Mad burn

[@randalljones8708]

Seriously? Do you know who this is?? He is by far a Tolkien expert.

[@Warren_Peace]

@@randalljones8708 And yet a few seconds into the video he got one of the most well-known trivia about the Dwarves wrong...

[@Belerez]

Show me where bezos touched you boi

[@Belerez]

@@Warren_Peace Read the book The Nature of Middle-earth , page 187.

[@skatersirian]

So basically anything can be made-up and it would be canon to the Tolkien lore just as long as Tolkien doesn't explicitly say that it wasn't canon. Guys, Tolkien didn't explicitly say Sauron wasn't a pedophile, therefore Sauron can be a pedophile. Grade A logic.

[@TheFlyingDutchie_]

"In The War of the Jewels: The Later Quenta Silmarillion: Of the Naugrim and the Edain" No Man nor Elf has ever seen a beardless Dwarf - unless he were shaven in mockery, and would then be more like to die of shame... For the Naugrim have beards from the beginning of their lives, male and female alike" "The Shadow that bred them can only mock, it cannot make: not real new things of its own" - Return of the king

[@Belerez]

Tolkien says that they look just like dwarf men. He also clarifies later, concerning beards (Nature of Middle-earth, p 187, footnote), that "All _male_ dwarves had them." Tolkien (later in life) explicitly did NOT imagine dwarf women as bearded.

[@Tar-Elenion]

@@Belerez So dwarf-women do not look just like dwarf-men (so much so that non-dwarves can't tell them apart)?

[@deidrereaystudiosindepende6459]

There is actually more to this quote.. Read another paragraph. States they truly do have beards ..... But who cares really.

[@dunsaniandreams9]

Please use a British professor. American’s cannot do anything but fanboy. Thank you

[@ragnardanneskjold7259]

It would be impossible for dwarven women to be mistaken for dwarven men without the beards.

[@chillguy9971]

If you look carefully you can see the shadow of the gun pointed at his face

[@tnndll4294]

LOL!

[@Salty.Peasants]

Funny how the wiki was recently updated to include Black Númenóreans 😂😂 They were only like two ever directly mentioned in the novels, and one of them is the Mouth of Sauron. Black Númenóreans were those who followed the lies of Sauron and worshipped Morgoth and obeyed the commands of Sauron. Black did not refer to skin color, but rather the darkness of evil, versus the white light of enlightenment. 🤦‍♂🤦‍♂

[@L0WEdog]

Amazon had to hire an "Expert" to help them cope of the backlash to save whatever audience can watch the show. Pathetic.

[@Bindi342]

Nah, all of the butthurt whingers are doing more for the show than they realise. No publicity is bad publicity!

[@Bindi342]

@Túrin Turambar I'm coping quite well, thank you. None of this is new, it's all happened before with PJ's trilogy; arguments about hair, beards, wings, corruption of the source, PJ being an unknown hack, etc. You name it, it happened. The only difference seems to be that in the past most people were capable of having an actual discussion rather than just crying and stamping their feet like spoilt toddlers which some are doing today. It would seem that these days there are a number of 'true fans' who have yet to learn that the universe owes them nothing, and that they are only the centre of their own world, nobody else's. This has all been quite nostalgic really, overall.

[@jonaorange2251]

@@Bindi342 yeah like the BP oil spill. I'm sure they loved that publicity and SeaWorld must have been over the moon when Blackfish came out. When that lady tried to poison people at sizzlers they were so happy about it.

[@jamesonline8530]

If anyone is wondering , this video has 700 likes to 1,400 dislikes with 12% engagement. . . haha

[@punch180]

1053 likes and 1750 dislikes right now

[@choostopher5018]

1.1k up to 2.7k down now.

[@garyandsorina]

Let's keep the conversation kind and respectful! Tolkien cared more about civility, love, comradeship, and kindness than he did about these details of his legendarium. We honor his legacy when we treat each other with dignity and respect.

[@TheMountainBeyondTheWoods]

1.9k to 6k now.

[@dariusalexandru9536]

thank you

[@victormelendez1074]

the show exists because of greed, Tolkein is opposed to greed because of how it corrupts.

[@cybersphere]

Calculated greed. There's clearly a massive audience for more content. Tolkien fans like this guy are basically wetting the bed with excitement.

[@dwaynekeenum1916]

So does the hobbit

[@ElevenEvilExes]

so-called "Tolkien expert" in the first 10 seconds: "Tolkien never says Dwarven women have beards." J.R.R. Tolkien: "No Man nor Elf has ever seen a beardless Dwarf - unless he were shaven in mockery, and would then be more like to die of shame... For the Naugrim have beards from the beginning of their lives, male and female alike." (The Silmarillion) wow... just wow....

[@danhalstead705]

This comes from posthumously published scraps of paper where he jotted his thoughts, which he often changed his mind about. It's not the same as being canonical. Later still, Tolkien wrote that "All male dwarves have them", implying females did not. All they have to go on is what he actually chose to publish in the Appendices. Give them a little leeway, it's not the end of the world either way. This reminds me of the debates before the Jackson movies on whether elves had pointy ears and whether Balrogs had wings. In the end, that stuff matters far less than the plot and spirit intended by the production. The plot and spirit is what we still know the least about, and dwarven beards have very little relationship to it.

[@ElevenEvilExes]

@@danhalstead705 the claim that "Tolkien never said it" is still incorrect. and if you think those details don't matter, then you're simply someone that they don't matter to. but you fail to understand that there are millions of people whom these details do matter to. you're a casual fan, they are the real fans. so if you were capable of taking a step back from your own personal point of view and to look at the bigger pictre of the whole situation, you'd be able to see that Amazon failed to make a show for the real LOTR fans. and that is simply failure.

[@ElevenEvilExes]

@@danhalstead705 also, please learn logic. "All male dwarves have beards" does not imply that female dwarves don't have beards.

[@danhalstead705]

@@ElevenEvilExes If you're talking about the logic of predicate calculus, you're correct. If you're talking about literature, where the author (who happens to be very deliberate in his word choices) added the extra word "male" when he could have simply said "All dwarves have beards", that DOES imply (as in it "suggests", not mathematically entails) that females don't have them.

[@ElevenEvilExes]

@@danhalstead705 the same author, who happens to be very deliberate in his word choices, wrote that all dwarves, male and female, are born with beards. stop being intellectually dishonest.

[@sorryforwhat1528]

Tolkien Expert: *contradicts Tolkien in the first 10 seconds*

[@direwolf3972]

some expert ^..^

[@ikochomi3070]

He is an expert man... come on... Expert in bullshitting

[@Belerez]

Read the book The Nature of Middle-earth ,page 187

[@brooksboy78]

Tolkien contradicts HIMSELF on this matter. In the most recently published "Nature of Middle-earth", and in his final writings on the matter, Tolkien states definitively that ALL male Dwarves have beards and that SOME female Dwarves have beards (source: "Nature of Middle-earth, chapter: "Beards"). He also says that Aragorn, Faramir, and Boromir DON'T have beards since they have Númenórean blood (and are thereby all distantly related to Elves). Are the PJ movies now cancelled too?

[@sorryforwhat1528]

@@brooksboy78 amazon only has rights to use the appendices of the hobbit, the fellowship, the two towers and the king, therefore they couldn't use any other of Tolkien's writings legally

[@cajunxn17]

His point about geography and skin tone makes sense. So let’s apply it to the dwarves. If a race of subterranean beings has been living underground for thousands upon thousands of years, out of the reach of the sun, why would Dis have such dark skin?

[@bigbro6446]

Goblins don’t have lighter skin than other orc so there’s no indication that dwarves would absolutely have to be very pale

[@Bdrbs]

Who said its a dark skin? Its probably just a black face.

[@Blah3210]

Not to mention the existence of the Haradrim doesn't somehow justify black elves or multiracial Numenoreans. If anything it demonstrates that Tolkien *did* have a place in his world for a handful of nonwhite characters to have come from, yet Amazon chose to ignore that and make what is supposed to be prehistoric Europe look like 21st century London.

[@braddl9442]

You weren't supposed to do that. You were not supposed to point out how inconsistent he is.

[@dracotias]

@@bigbro6446 Goblins "are" orcs, they're not a separate sub-species, just a bunch that decided to move underground they didn't evolve there separately. Hell Orc's didn't evolve at all, they were artificially created

[@thelreadtheunready4051]

His equator argument is not convincing given that while Númenor still was around earth was still flat. It's only after the fall of Númenor that the earth is made round. And you cant apply the physics of a round earth regarding equators on a flat earth.

[@eph2794]

He was pertaining to the similarity between Equator being equally distant from two poles and Numenor being at the center between Valinor and Middle Earth.

[@Blah3210]

​@@eph2794 No, he was using it to justify Amazon's decision to cast characters with darker skin tones. Apparently we should be expecting literal black Numenoreans in addition to the Black Numenoreans described in the text. This just adds to the alarming trend Amazon has already demonstrated of misinterpreting Tolkien's descriptions of characters to justify diversity in their adaptation. Hobbit sect with darker skin than the others? Must mean there were black hobbits. Elves with darker features? Black elves. Galadriel looked at men with the eyes of a commander? Make her an actual commander.

[@Distorcionbeto]

"Tolkien never said.... Well maybe there are dinosaurs in middle earth too

[@breadordecide]

Tolkien never said anyone uses the bathroom. So its canon that no one moves a bowel in middle earth. Also, he never says they breath air. Maybe they don’t do that either.

[@thomasbardoux1692]

@@breadordecide Both latrines and people breathing are mentionned in his books. Try again troll

[@aesir1ases64]

@@thomasbardoux1692 what about aliens huh? he never mentions that, try that know

[@tnndll4294]

But Tolkien did mention Black "Wakandan Elves"? right? And he did mention Hispanic Hobbits right? And he did mention time-travel and men walking on the moon as well did he not? :)

[@AeneasGemini]

@@thomasbardoux1692 They're breathing, but how do you know they breathe air? It could be some other gasses? Tolkien also never explicitly said that there weren't any giant corgies wandering around

[@priyesh12tiwary51]

27 minutes of self appointed 'expert' being factually wrong about important details, blaming fans and the Peter Jackson trilogy for the loopholes in this series adaptation.

[@peterbedford449]

Thousands of comments of LOTR fans being so toxic it is not funny

[@ryancruz1876]

Self appointed? 🤨

[@JuanJohn-Raytheon]

@@peterbedford449 Pointing out this "experts" inaccuracies = toxic. Poor Peter is so thin skinned.

[@iidentifyaspureblood943]

"IGN "Expert" *"I'm something of an expert myself."

[@bloodangel9403]

21:24 That's a lie To quote Tolkien himself in The War of the Jewels "no Man nor Elf has ever seen a beardless Dwarf - unless he were shaven in mockery, and would then be more like to die of shame... For the Naugrim have beards from the beginning of their lives, male and female alike..."

[@Belerez]

Read the book The Nature of Middle-earth , page 187 , my dear incel

[@unpopularopinion5022]

read the book history of middle earth

[@tnndll4294]

Ignore some of the people on this thread. Instead of presenting their evidence, they will instead tell you to read whole books for days, which gives them the time they need to gaslight and cast doubt; then hopefully you will have moved on. they do this all over the internet.

[@bloodangel9403]

@@Belerez History of Middle Earth - Volume 11 - Part 2 - Chapter 13 - Concerning the Dwarves Nowhere does it get clearer than that, my dear incel

[@metaforeva3744]

@@Belerez That book was edited by someone who was not a Tolkien. War of Jewels was edited by Christopher Tolkien (JRR's son). Most of the stuff in Nature of Middle-Earth is interpretations. Also, don't name call.

[@AelfwineGaming]

At 11:45 this guy really affirmed that since "almost 20 years" are not been published books about Middle Earth, forgetting The Children of Hurin...

[@hyrumhendrickson9499]

History of middle earth volume 11, war of the jewels clearly states that dwarf men and women both have beards

[@jj48]

And History of Middle-earth Book 6, The Return of the Shadow clearly states that Bilbo killed one of Farmer Maggot's dogs, and they both then threatened to kill each other if they crossed paths again.

[@ryancruz1876]

In the Book of Lost Tales it’s says that Dairon is Tinuviel’s brother. The History of Middle of Earth volumes are not canon.

[@RosieSquall]

@@ryancruz1876 how about the original trilogy? Because Gimli states as much in one of the books.

[@simonpimpernel]

Tolkien never said there WEREN’T robots in Middle Earth sooo can we see some robots in this please? 🤔

[@music8419]

And Make sure the robot has TV or monitor to watch lotr: ring of power !

[@jonaorange2251]

@-- hell yeah, he also never said there wasn't a war between hobbits and Ewoks.

[@edwardwong3947]

Dwarf-women were few among the Dwarves, kept in secret, and were seldom seen by other races. dwarves wanted their women to be protected from other races and they usually kept them concealed inside their mountain halls. They seldom traveled in the outside world, only in great need, and when they did, they were dressed as men; with similar voice and appearance as male dwarves, even when they are rarely seen they are usually mistaken for a male. All Dwarves had beards from the beginning of their lives

[@breadordecide]

Nothing there says dwarf women had beards.

[@breadordecide]

And you know, beards cAn be cut, shaved, trimmed. Being born with something does not mean you have it your whole life. Like foreskin.

[@MrLecti]

@@breadordecide "All Dwarves had beards from the beginning of their lives"

[@ha-kh7ef]

@@breadordecide ummmmm the person literally said it. Lol. You literally had to ignore the last sentence to not see it lmao

[@nikorex32]

@@breadordecide Razors are not in the LoRe. ResPecT teh LoRE🤣

[@tradewalker8187]

For the Naugrim have beards from the beginning of their lives, male and female alike; nor indeed can their womenkind be discerned by those of other race.

[@ethanblack6407]

Could it be about one particular race of dwarves ? because it really sounds like so. What if other races of dwarves were introduced ?

[@jonaorange2251]

@@ethanblack6407 naugrim just means dwarves in elven.

[@kalliatakis2000]

Man this guy 'loves' everything

[@sinusar2504]

Money to rule them all...

[@GRGCompletionist]

@@sinusar2504 one check to rule them all

[@jayliniti2555]

@@VentureHolly Please explain how the "triggered fans" are promoting this show? This show is already DEAD ON ARRIVAL!

[@Indeterminite]

@@VentureHolly this show will be dead on arrival darling. But don't worry there will be a mountain of free content about it on KZbin 🤣

[@alphshift7857]

@@jayliniti2555 non tolkien fans will want to know what the buzz is about therefore they'll check out the show hence it'll crank up the viewership

[@QualityQuad]

“It felt only natural to us that an adaptation of Tolkien’s work would reflect what the world actually looks like.” - Lindsey Weber, E.P. Amazon's LOTR Series, Vanity Fair (Feb. 2022) "There are certainly themes Tolkien felt were important. We made a promise to ourselves at the beginning of the process that we weren't going to put any of our own politics, our own messages or our own themes into these movies. What we were trying to do was to analyse what was important to Tolkien and to try to honour that. In a way, were trying to make these films for him, not for ourselves." - Peter Jackson, Interview with GreenCine (Dec. 2002)

[@breadordecide]

Also peter jackson: make the enemy soldiers middle eastern and south asian.

[@bjarke7886]

@@breadordecide The easterlings in the lore where not neccesarily evil but a more corruptable bread of men, which is why they where swayed to saurons side. They where also depicted accurately to be middle-easter / north african looking.

[@anonymouscrow5849]

@@bjarke7886 They were not more corruptable, they just happened to be the men who had fallen under Saurons corruption.

[@randalthekidd7006]

@@breadordecide 😂 because they were in the lore middle eastern and south Asian. Like that’s called following the source material

[@randalthekidd7006]

@ he hated any possible adaptation ever. His other son literally cameos in the movie. This is a dead argument, they literally waited for Christopher to die because he would have shat all over this

[@dawn2891]

I’ll have more confidence in a show trying to stay faithful to Tolkien’s world then one where the writers boast about the changes they made. I’m not interested in someone else’s fanfic interpretation of how Middle earth and its races should look. Especially when their motive to make changes are political.

[@nerthus4685]

The irony if they had stayed loyal to canon and pleased fans, the Rings of Power could be an artistic contribution to humanity valued for decades to come. Imagine a Silmarillion production on Amazon's budget, made my actual loyal Tolkien fans, as was Peter Jackson's Trilogy. Instead they have to go full Star Wars, ignore all common sense and ram their political ideology down everyone's throats while bastardizing and exploiting the source material.

[@markgbeards]

Tolkien did state very specifically that Dwarven women had beards, from birth: "For the Naugrim [Dwarven race] have beards from the beginning of their lives, male and female alike; nor indeed can their womenkind be discerned by those of other race, be it in feature or in gait or in voice, nor in any wise save this: that they go not to war, and seldom save at direst need issue from their deep bowers and halls." J.R.R.Tolkien HoME XI, p.205

[@firefoxriouyh6541]

From what book or letter? So we can have proof.

[@JesusIzAPunkRocker]

@@firefoxriouyh6541 For the Naugrim have beards from the beginning of their lives, male and female alike; nor indeed can their womenkind be discerned by those of other race, be it in feature or in gait or in voice, nor in any wise save this: that they go not to war, and seldom save at direst need issue from their deep bowers and halls." - HoME XI, p. 205

[@Belerez]

@@JesusIzAPunkRocker The Legendarium is not a scientific text. It is both contradictory and incomplete. There isn't just one single correct answer in the "lore". At various points in time Tolkien had different visions of how things would be. People need to stop quoting a couple of lines and trying to make out that it's the definitive take either for or against something.

[@jj48]

@@firefoxriouyh6541 It's from The War of the Jewels. Specifically, it's from a draft of the Quenta Silmarillion, and that particular line was not included in later drafts.

[@AndreRodrigues-hd8ty]

To quote “Just Some Guy”: “The normies won’t know what you are doing but Tolkien fans will. The moment you deviate we will know just like Gil Galad, Cirdan and Galadriel knew when Sauron created the One Ring. We will cast your Show aside less we be corrupted. “

[@jonathanhamilton2504]

A great quote from a great video, far better than this drivel.

[@dusan.prvacki]

This dude has a very sneaky kind of narrative. He talks about actual lore where it's safe to talk about it, and talks about his ecstasy towards the show whenever it's not safe to compare the actual lore of the show to Tolkien's work.

[@Gruntled2001]

Well said. Money talks, and loudly at that.

[@Henbot]

He skipped that plenty of battles with Morgoth before the elves from Valinor turn up, and he was even captured and kept in Valinor and escapes it after killing the trees. First Age isn't the First Age, a whole load of time before.

[@Sam-ve4tx]

It might be part of the two and a half hours of interview footage IGN edited out. Apparently, the full interview was 3 hours and his answers to questions were more detailed and nuanced than what we're being shown.

[@danhalstead705]

Dude, he's already summarizing 5000 years. Did he skip some stuff? Yeah.

[@braddl9442]

@@danhalstead705 He skipped a lot so he could lie more effectively to justify the amazon bullcrap.

[@classyname42]

Legolas' father and grandfather were not Silven Elves they were Sindarin... They were raised in Doriath in Thingol's kingdom. After the destruction of Doriath and eventually Beleriand as a whole they would travel far to the east and Oropher would claim Kingship over the Silven Elves who had been living there and he would be the first King of the Silven tho himself not being one. I'm really confused why this guy is called the Tolkien professor when he's getting this kind of simple thing wrong.

[@AKASlaphappy]

Yeah, he has actually talked about this in video, you very smart person. He was summarizing, do you know what summarizing means?

[@Meitti]

@@AKASlaphappy Its a shitty summary if it gets basic facts wrong.

[@shawnfinnegan64]

@@AKASlaphappy summarizing? He literally said thranduil and legolas are Silvan elves when they are not. Lmfao

[@mr.2083]

​@@AKASlaphappy Summerize: give a brief statement of the main points of (something). It's literally reiterating in a shorter version but staying true to what's been said/presented. Not getting things blatantly wrong from the original longer version. There's other terms for that: being wrong, lying etc.

[@GeorgeTelop]

@@AKASlaphappy do you?

[@sassymonkey6929]

love how this guy says "Tolken never says dwarven women has beards" when there are multiple sources that state that he does. Even goes as far as state its a made up "fan fascination". He really thought he could get away with that lie. At least he admitted it was stated in Tolkens work on his twitter and then asks "why does it matter so much". Embarrassing.

[@JayTraversJT]

Nothing says quality control like quality control.

[@michaelhejja]

More like damage control? Lol

[@dohjoe5747]

“There is no curse in Elvish, Entish, or the tongues of Men for this treachery.”

[@marcofdelos]

👏👏👏👏👏👏👏

[@Tadamichi666]

"The Mouth of Amazon bids thee welcome" pretty much the intro of this.

[@dustdonkey1222]

Blink twice if you’re being held hostage

[@usernotfound7481]

😂💀

[@annarien4333]

Haha, yeah. I've been listening to Corey's classes and podcasts for years and I'm seriously wondering what is up with him now. He's roasted the Hobbit movies quite a bit but can endorse Amazon's crap? Something doesn't click.

[@Blencathra1]

@@annarien4333 Same here. I've listened to a few as well. It's all very strange. Perhaps Amazon have his children held hostage or something. 😄

[@dgenxali]

@@annarien4333 can you show us on the doll where the tv adaptation hurt you?

[@annarien4333]

@@dgenxali 🤣🤣🤣 yah, but that might be NSFW

[@jamesgravil9162]

"Young, extremely displeased-looking Elrond..." I'm trying to think of a scene in the Rings movies where Elrond looks anything other than displeased. Arwen's wedding at the end of RotK may be the only one.

[@TheMonkeygoneape]

Meanwhile book Elrond "Aragorn you're like a son to me, but you're not marrying my daughter until you become king"

[@NobleBruv]

You're forgetting Legolas then.

[@randalthekidd7006]

He’s pretty chill in the hobbit movies

[@unitron2005]

@@randalthekidd7006 He's chill, just don't look at his daughter. :)

[@Jinkypigs]

and his hair is the least controversial .. fancy IGN bringing it up as a talking point.

[@thejakel11225]

Sure...diverse elves. Up next: Tom Cruise as Blade and Dave Chapelle as Gandalf!

[@sulacoqueen3483]

In the same movie….

[@oscarng3089]

A day may come when the courage of man fails,when we forsake our frinds and break the bonds of fellowship and today is that day

[@jodychilds6619]

So....this guy works for Amazon to do damage control?

[@kingoffire9373]

Imagine calling yourself the "Tolkien professor" and yet spending half an hour explaining how little you know about Tolkiens work lol

[@callnight1441]

* lying

[@Simlan12345]

It was an edited three hour interview that took out things where he explained his reasonings.

[@ragnardanneskjold7259]

Elves don't age. Life and experience leave an imprint on their physical body, which changes their physicality and features over time. But they do not get old, nor die from old age. And if they're killed, they're reborn as themselves, though when this happens is different for every elf. Their nature is fundamentally different than that of man.

[@Pedrocas84]

Read Nature of Middle Earth

[@danhalstead705]

They do not die of old age, it's true. However they do age, and if they stay too long in mortal lands they will eventually fade, wandering as spirits forever invisible to mortal eyes.

[@ragnardanneskjold7259]

@@danhalstead705 That's due to the changes, i.e. corruption, to the world caused by Melkore, which was only staved off by the power of the three rings, and the One. This is why they cannot longer. They were granted a grace period to wrap things up, but eventually would feel or hear the call to return home. Hence "the long defeat."

[@ragnardanneskjold7259]

@ Tolkien didn't write or publish that volume. It most just discarded material, and cannot be considered canon.

[@rburk854]

@@ragnardanneskjold7259 and yet people are spamming quotes from HoME as "proof" that all Dwarven women had beards. People need to understand that there is no such thing as canon outside of LotR and the Hobbit and that everything else is just varying levels of pseuso-canon

[@hernethehunted7130]

The fact that he loves "action" Galadriel says it all, really. 🙄

[@Pfizenmaier]

Arwen was also portrayed to be a fighter in the movie. People didn't seem to care all to much for the fact that in the books in fact, she wasn't a warrior.

[@Pfizenmaier]

@Cesar Sanchez and who is to say that she will be fighting the entire time?

[@Belerez]

This is how it is in the books

[@Tar-Elenion]

@@Pfizenmaier Uh, yes people did. There was a huge stink made about XenArwen. That may have been a reason she was removed from the Battle of Helms Deep.

[@ryancruz1876]

Galadriel is a warrior in Tolkien’s writings.

[@itsasecrettoeverybody]

Better title: "Amazon pays professor, to throw his credibility in the mud defending their atrocity series."

[@r.d.nibblets9133]

I’m a fan, Corey, but you’re wrong concerning bearded dwarf women. It’s in “The War of the Jewels” book 11 of The History of Middle Earth. “For the Naugrim have beards from the beginning of their lives, male and female alike…”

[@james9872]

You’re wrong. Tolkien later on wrote to single out that *male* dwarves have beards.

[@jj48]

He qualified that Tolkien never wrote it in "the text", which seems to mean the published Lord of the Rings.

[@generaltnt2790]

@@james9872 where?

[@generaltnt2790]

@@james9872 Also this “expert” was even wrong on why the elves returned to middle earth :facepalm:

[@james9872]

@@generaltnt2790 nature of middle earth p. 187 Of course you could argue that Tolkien contradicted himself on this in earlier texts. But that’s precisely Tolkienesq- he leaves a lot up in the air and often revised his own writing. This is why folks pulling a single quote and trying to gotcha are either exposing their own lack of understanding of the lore or being dishonest.

[@instantpain6645]

no Man nor Elf has ever seen a beardless Dwarf-unless he were shaven in mockery, and would then be more like to die of shame than of many other hurts that to us would seem more deadly. For the Naugrim have beards from the beginning of their lives, male and female alike; nor indeed can their womenkind be discerned by those of other race, be it in feature or in gait or in voice, nor in any wise save this: that they go not to war, and seldom save at direst need issue from their deep bowers and halls." - J.R.R Tolkien

[@Ithilienranger345]

as Bilbo sets out on his adventure in The Hobbit, we read that "His only comfort was that he couldn't be mistaken for a dwarf, as he had no beard." Given that, the quote above must imply that Dwarf women were bearded as well. However, we do not need to rely on such implications: Tolkien answered this question explicitly in other texts. In The War of the Jewels ("The Later Quenta Silmarillion: Of the Naugrim and the Edain", written ~1951), Tolkien wrote that no Man nor Elf has ever seen a beardless Dwarf - unless he were shaven in mockery, and would then be more like to die of shame... For the Naugrim have beards from the beginning of their lives, male and female alike...

[@mithrandir3417]

Titles like “expert” may not carry the weight they once did.

[@thomasbardoux1692]

@ Factually, we do. Legolas is no sylvan, dwarves women are born with beards and that's just the tip of it. It's no interpretation, it's sttaight from the sylmarion.

[@thomasbardoux1692]

@ And that specific mistake would have been understable. Not the other ones which sound like mere damage control for the amazon's series

[@inhumanmusic1411]

@@thomasbardoux1692 - *Silmarillion. Guess we should consider you a expert then?

[@thomasbardoux1692]

@@inhumanmusic1411 You have a pretty alarming obsession with the notion of "experts". If anything, the last decades should have told you that it is a meaningless concept

[@crabinthetophat490]

So let me get this straight essentially all the hundreds thousands of fans completely misunderstood Tolkien's work and Amazon truely understood the source material.Because if what you are saying is true than the Peter Jackson's films are more departed from the source material than the Amazon one?

[@duaijalqallaf]

Yes

[@breadordecide]

Peter made hundreds of changes.

[@johnathonhealey4406]

@@breadordecide not political though? And if so well then amazon made millions of changes lmao

[@Feanor97]

The Amazon show isn’t even out yet. There’s only a 1 minute teaser out so far. And regarding Peter Jackson, yes he deviated A LOT from the Lord Of The Rings and The Hobbit books, especially in themes and lore. So much so that Tolkien’s own son, who took over his fathers work is almost as revered as Tolkien himself, actively hated them. I’m not saying that this Amazon show won’t be a deviation either, but the Peter Jackson movies were already not in the spirit of Tolkien, so fans of his movies shouldn’t hold accuracy to Tolkien against this show.

[@unclejoey32]

He states that dwarf women might not have beards all the way back in 2014, people believed him then when the Hobbit was coming out

[@jasonb5030]

"JUST SOME GUY " probably has some of the best videos on this subject. If you actually care about the truth, check out his channel.

[@nebick27]

I'll take him being wrong on basic things at face value, thanks

[@edwardrichtofen8530]

@@nebick27 he not but not to surprising you would assume that.

[@nebick27]

@@edwardrichtofen8530 cool story bro, your wrong though.

[@mardigrasw]

THIS GUY BENDS THE KNEE TO AMAZON

[@natashaperreault9425]

But we the fans will bend to no one.

[@TheOriginalCFA1979]

“…and the hair of Lord Celeborn was of silver long and bright….” The Fellowship of the Ring, Page 465, chapter “ The Mirror of Galadriel” Harper Collins paperback edition 1999

[@88franko]

This video has 5 thousand views and 168 likes. That means everyone loved it right? No dislikes whatsoever

[@Tadamichi666]

Surely there's no dislikes, not ratioed at all. lmfao

[@gabriellockhart]

"If we hides it, they can't sees it, can they precious." Gollum probably.

[@cguptabhaya12]

280 dislikes as of now

[@Masimich]

525 dislikes

[@TheMonkeygoneape]

@@cguptabhaya12 875 now

[@dimitrijleitenberger2668]

What a load of crap. Hpw about some balance discussion instead of getting one guy that supports your own view and the view of a cash grabbin multimilliondollar company.

[@NovRen19]

Now Corey Olsen has gone on record and maintained his error, his heresy. He is the Sauruman and Nazgul of our time, and embraced rings of power. And has been well, wrong on everything of substance and true Tolkien Orthodoxy. Let him answer our debate challenge.

[@notmyrealname8071]

15:45 Major geography fail here. Umbar/Carthage would be on the same lattitude as Tunis. Dol Amroth is considerably closer to Minas Tirith (Florence) than it is to Umba and would therefore probably somewhere between rome and naples and definitely not in northern Morocco. Numenor's climate was also nearly exclusively temperate despite being closer the equator The Shadow [...] cannot make: not real new things of its own.

[@TheMonkeygoneape]

ya wasn't Numenor a paradise?

[@TheMonkeygoneape]

also Umbar isn't where the Southrons come from what is this guy talking about lol

[@Earendil_1510]

Reeks of a sponsored advert 😂

[@TheMonkeygoneape]

@Nathan Izdepski ya but the distance between harad and umbar is like saying subsaharan Africa, and Egypt are the same thing

[@rburk854]

@@TheMonkeygoneape Umbar is IN Harad. Harad is a huge geographical region.