The Mark II era -- How long is your new gear break-in period in the age of endless updates??

[@BigCore-]

I needed this talk. My wife busted me. UPS dropped off boxes two days in a row. My wife sees the pieces and says "You have that already"... lol.

[@eddieleonard6925]

ha! I've been there, bro!

[@BigCore-]

@@eddieleonard6925 😂

[@beatbuildersstudio]

I think it’s definitely easier for people who started making music pre KZbin era to question what things they actually need. I usually have my gear for years or until it breaks. I research heavily so that helps me stay locked in my decision. I actually thought I had wasted money getting the Maschine but I realized I didn’t take the time to learn it. I challenged myself to make sample based music for the first time. After that my mind changed about the gear. As music makers I think we get caught in the trap of thinking something new will make us “ sound better”

[@eddieleonard6925]

Great points. I know lots of people who cycle through gear so much that I wonder when they find time to actually make music. But every once in a while I get lured into an impulse purchase that I end up getting rid of if I can't see it improving my workflow.

[@glizzyhendrix]

It took me 5 years to wrap my head around the og sp404, I’ve found the limitations are what makes it great

[@eddieleonard6925]

tbh, it took me a few years to fully understand the og 404, too....but i also remember knowing that it was a keeper as soon as i started messing with it.

[@aaronroche3967]

This is great! It’s like learning an entirely new instrument half the time with these updates. Imagine if every year they made new guitars that had a different layout. Not only that but the old guitars also weren’t compatible with the new amps

[@eddieleonard6925]

That's a perfect analogy. So true.

[@djofortunato5799]

Couldn’t have said it better myself lol It would be like if new drums could t be played by your old drumsticks lol 😆

[@Bashanvibe]

I’ve been preaching this for years now!!! It’s not about the gear but your knowledge and musician level!!! In my case I need new gear because it’s dated and no good!!!

[@eddieleonard6925]

Agreed. There does come a point where certain musicians/producers can seriously benefit from new gear, but usually after fully exhausting the creative capabilities of their old gear. Happy music making..

[@pygmyhippomusic]

I mainly use the MPC X, but the 2000XL keeps bringing me back to it, and I think what intrigues me is the way it's limited yet powerful. Great video, man.

[@eddieleonard6925]

The 2000xl was my first mpc, and while the X is waaay more powerful, the xl has way more personality imo. You can make heat with both, tho

[@dillipphunbar7924]

Good points. Yes, agree with the message. I had a load of gear several years back and had to sell almost all of it when I was completely broke. Sometimes I miss it, but it opened up the possibility of eventually getting a fresh start and having my first sampler (MPC One). I don't have the most expensive system but I do have all the tools I need and never get bored with it. Planned obsolescence has been a business model for many decades, and the GAS is a distraction from creativity.

[@eddieleonard6925]

Sucks that you had to let all that equipment go, but glad you were able to rebuild and realize the value of it, seeing what you absolutely need versus what's fluff, smoke and mirrors.

[@alexovercast3359]

One thing i like about the Push 3 coming out.... it makes the used price on the push 2 drop. I usually never grab the latest thing. Buying used at a steep discount allows u to sell if you don't gel with it with not alot of depreciation risk.

[@eddieleonard6925]

Man, that's smart. I need to try that.

[@Vernk1980]

It’s very easy to get addicted to buying new gear. Like a kid with too many toys. The more you buy, the less you use. I agree 100% that actually USING what you have (regardless of what it is) will produce better results than CHASING what you don’t have. Unfortunately this can be an expensive lesson to learn 😂. I also believe that creativity is driven by limitation. This is often why I get less done on modern gear with near endless options. Creative time is often traded for figuring things out. When I go back to the gear I know I’m instantly creating and enjoying what I’m doing. Great video as always!

[@eddieleonard6925]

Isn't it ironic that limitations are what drive creativity, but most new products offer the opposite in the form of endless options? You bring up some great points.

[@TheGilbane]

Great topic and great discussion. I get that feeling a lot as I'm learning the MPC workflow coming from a DAW. I see something from elektron or polyend and think "man, that would be helpful for xyz" but then I remember i should double down and try and figure out how to do it with what I have. Plug-ins, external effects, synths, these are things I shouldn't be thinking about until I actually get down how to chop and stretch samples the way I want in the first place. 6 months is a good benchmark, I agree with you there. Peace❤

[@eddieleonard6925]

I hear that. I also get very distracted by (and jealous of) elektron and other grooveboxes, but mastering what you have yields better results than focusing on what you don't.

[@bizon33obroty]

Wise words as always Eddie. When I started making beats, I wanted just "all in one" and I bought MPC 5000 and it was good until I realised that all gear doesn't sound the same and I started chasing my favourite sound. I have gear I used once or twice, but I keep it anyway because having a lot of gear and a lot of records is just soo inspiring.

[@eddieleonard6925]

I dig that. Like different tools in a shed. You always have the right tool for any job. The key is knowing how to use each one, and knowing exactly what each excels at. Cheers, and thanks for the thought

[@uriel-heavensguardian8949]

Exactly 💯💯🎯💯🎯💯🎯💯🎯💯🎯💯🎯 And most of the Time new people are taking over these companies and cheapening out in the internal components making it not even worth buying. The old stuff usually is built like tanks or just has that fatness. That signature sound that sometimes is lost in the new gear. Sound cheap and thin at times. New is not always better.

[@eddieleonard6925]

You nailed it -- new is not always better. Much respect.

[@ceciliafbrown373]

Yo Eddie! Some great gems there for the GEAR heads.I bought my mpc X just after the plandemic. Like an instrument a lot of learning to be had with new gear. My hope is to incorporate my mpc x with Ableton & Push 2 with some outboard gear. In my man's eye know what I want to achieve and will continue to seek that out and enjoy the journey. Like the analogy of learning an instrument and becoming a virtuoso. I get inspired to try new things after watching your videos. Thanks!

[@eddieleonard6925]

I'm glad this gave some ideas. It's really important to know how you intend to incorporate pieces into your system, so that you don't waste time buying things "they" say you need, and instead focus on what you'll actually use.

[@unknownarchitecture7996]

i was deadass looking at MPC 3000s to buy when this popped up on my feed lol. i need to just go ahead and master my Isla S2400 like i’m supposed to instead of searching for a magic box to make sound great.

[@eddieleonard6925]

haha..great timing. I used an s2400 for a few months. Love that machine. Had to sell it, but I'm sure I'll buy it again one day. It's more than capable and has a great sound. Future classic, for sure.

[@thejoshuathomas]

I totally relate to this discussion. I just recently had a Polyend Tracker Mini on pre-order, then Polyend began running a flash sale on their original Tracker. So, after a few days of contemplation and making a list of the features I'm looking for, I cancelled the Mini pre-order and have the original on the way tomorrow. Kind of a reverse of your friend's experience, but interesting how these things play out.

[@eddieleonard6925]

Right? It's nice to see past the cycles and focus on getting what you actually need and making sure you get the most out of it. I know lots of folks who are more focused on the updates than on mastering the current features.

[@thejoshuathomas]

@@eddieleonard6925 So true, I try to maintain awareness of my preferred minimalist workflow, and not allow the sophisticated marketing speak to render decisions that should be made by me as an individual.

[@lostinjazz]

Good points made! I still make beats on the SP1200/S950 which in my book is still the best equipment combination for the kind of music i do. The thing with these new groove boxes is they offer you great convenience and ease of use but run into problems quickly as they are (as you correctly stated) planned obsolete. With the older machines you don‘t have to worry about software compatibility as the product was build to last and have all the functions it was intended to have. The problem is that these planned obsolete groove boxes force you to update in a certain way as you won‘t be able to use certain function you need as soon as the compatibility isn‘t there anymore. This is far from beeing sustainable in my book and i‘m pretty sure that we‘ll see proper regulations happen within the near future. It shouldn‘t be allowed to force people to buy a new groove box only to get a tiny bit more of ram to function correctly.

[@eddieleonard6925]

Very interesting point about creating some type of regulation to protect the consumer. They should do that. At least a warranty that lets you trade in. I hate when you buy something only for it to be basically useless (and value-less) in a few years once the updates come out. Never have that problem with my S950 or my MPC3000. Let the world keep running in circles, while you stay grounded and steady, rocking with that SP1200...peace.

[@MS7.7]

I don't have huge collection but technology has advanced light years in span of 40 years. This is something that everyone should keep in mind. Alot of products are literally first time ever and alot of software is involved and people demands updates. Yes planned obscene is a thing but its not as bad as people think. Equipment are so cheap I don't even dare to complain. Also are we talking standalone or controllers? I have MPC renaissance which is now not supported on M1 MacBook and its running perfectly fine on windows 10 just like intended. I blamed akai at first but then I took time to think that Apple made the move to change their chips so this is a flaw due to technology advancement not planned obscenely. My machine mk3 is 6 years old and running perfectly fine. The arturia microfreak got a huge update after years of release. same with many controllers. Its not as bad as people think but I guess people are so entitled nowadays and cry for anything they don't like or understand. Making music on a computer can get extremely complicated so if that's something disliked there is always the standalone option or even old hardware but afaik tech is moving forward. I know there are messed up things and painful when device is not working as intended but again this is the cost of fast paced updated era. For the ram problem i assume you are referring to MPC live/x/one if its that then yes they should've added more but I think they can be lazy and greedy however they are completely useable and in term of capability older hardware bites dust I still 100% agree but wanted to say my opinion.

[@eddieleonard6925]

@@MS7.7 Thanks for providing this counter-argument. It's an interesting perspective. I see it almost like smart phones -- when you buy a new smart phone, I think it's assumed that it will be need to be upgraded in about 3-4 years. If not, then you will not be able to take advantage of whatever new technology comes out. This isn't planned obsolescence with a specific device, but within an entire industry. We all have to upgrade to take advantage of modern features. For people concerned with making music, this endless updating can be exhausting. I love old machines because i don't have to worry about drivers, operating systems or compatibility. This saves time and headache, but comes with limitations. The reason I never bought the MPC Renaissance was the very reason you had problems with yours-- if it's reliant on a computer, there's no way it can stay relevant unless they continually support the product and update it with new firmware. That's why used Renaissances are so cheap, even though it's a very well-built machine. Your points are valid, and it's important for people to realize that one of the requirements of newer technology is continually updating it, and the benefit of this is endless access to every new technological advancement, which hopefully benefits your music.

[@krazywabbit]

Wisdom was imparted. We need more of this message. Well done sir.

[@eddieleonard6925]

Glad this resonates.

[@Tomorrowomari]

I really like the message in this video. You have a new supporter in me.

[@eddieleonard6925]

Glad this sparked some thought. It's what's been on my mind...still is.

[@benruppel9651]

Cool video, I’m definitely glad to have found it. To answer your prompt, I generally keep things a long time, but am unsure how long it takes to break in, so to speak. If I sell something usually it’s because I’m flat broke. I see you’ve got more vintage stuff. I find this stuff has a lot of upside for some people. I’m more of a new instrument/gear guy but feel like the vintage stuff has more of a sonic sweet spot, and by that I mean it can create more music for a longer period of time than my new stuff. New stuff, it seems, tends to create sounds fast, but is limited by the length of time before it loops(ie volcas) or similar “limitations.” Also, new stuff tends to exist for recording purposes only, not live environments, ie the Roland Mc 101 I have .. I’d be interested in hearing your thoughts on this, based on this video. Cool stuff though✌🏼

[@eddieleonard6925]

Thanks for the thoughts. In an ideal world, we have a realistic expectation of the lifespan of a piece of gear when we purchase it. So, if it's a cheaply made, software-based device, I'd buy it knowing that it may be obsolete in a few years or need major updates to stay functional. On the other hand, a handmade synth or piece of outboard equipment made in smaller batches should be built to last, and priced accordingly. The focus of my music lately has been on sound, which is why i gravitate towards older, or more tried and true pieces. Great for recording and for live because of the durability. It's all about knowing what you want.

[@devondetroit2529]

Its crazy, I was thinking about this the other day.. Imagine buying a Akai Force on day 1.. But this is what happens now when software is 90% of of a product (in most of music tech anyway)

[@eddieleonard6925]

Great point. Software has not proven to have serious lasting power, as it's reliant on constant updates. Worst case scenario is when the company deems a product as not worthy of being updated/supported anymore. If I'm buying something new that relies on software, I try my best to get something that at least looks like it's built to last a product cycles.

[@retrohale_]

I started making beats in 2021. And it was kinda difficult to make the first decision when i wanted to get a drummachine and get my music journey started. The only thing i knew was i wanted to use a drummachine for making beats instead of just sitting in front of a screen and using a daw. Still i went for Maschine mk3 which comes with a daw. After that i got the new sp404mk2 and i absolutely love it. Then i sold my maschine mk3 and bought the mpc2000xl instead. The limitations thought me a lot, but i also miss what the mk3 could do and now i appreciate its abilities a lot more and think its a little unfortunate that i didnt spend "enough" time with it. But i think its an excuse because its still a joy to me to make music dawless and with a little bit of effort the combination between the 2000xl and the sp404mk2 just give me crazy options. I don't really need anything else. I just have to remind myself of that at times.

[@eddieleonard6925]

Honestly, your journey is a great one. You've experienced what it's like to have endless options, but you also know what it's like to have serious limitations. Prepares you to take full advantage of both worlds, without taking either approach for granted. Thanks for sharing this

[@peleuno]

One year. Love your channel

[@eddieleonard6925]

Appreciate the support!

[@djReason19]

Love that you made this PSA. Thanks for bringing me into the discussion, fam. This is such a vital question that's not being asked. If there was ever a topic the gear heads of today needed to hear, this is it. The only thing I would add is... We are making music. Are you making music? Or are you just building the most sophisticated and capable studio you can dream up? I don't say that with arrogance, I love gear. But I love making music more.

[@eddieleonard6925]

Well put. It comes down to knowing what you want. It's okay to just want the latest gadgets. It's a different thing to want to make music. Thanks again for sparking the discussion.

[@gigamaxmusic]

I'm really happy the MPC one plus only has 2 gigs of RAM. Let me enjoy my original one even more.

[@eddieleonard6925]

True. When a new version drops, it's a great time to grab the old one that works fine.

[@deanivan3951]

Wise Words!

[@eddieleonard6925]

Thanks. I'm still seduced by new gear, almost daily. I have to remind myself that it's about the music...not all these distractions.

[@piynubbunyip]

Constant flipping of gear is a dangerous habit, even a fear of menu diving can be gotten over. It takes a bit of time to learn a device inside out and the fact that you cannot use it immediately is not the fault of the device in most situations. Ergonomics is another thing that stops people using something. Make sure you can reach it from where you sit or stand and make it comfortable.

[@eddieleonard6925]

Great point about the ergonomics and that it's not the device's fault that you don't know how to use it. I hated my first drum machine, simply because i had no idea how to navigate it. Once I got past the learning curve, I was hooked. Patience is key when getting a new piece of kit.

[@piynubbunyip]

@@eddieleonard6925 Exactly - one feature at a time!

[@traitortotheliving]

Great points man. Everything I have now I try to look at as a lifelong pursuit of learning and mastering. I don’t put a time frame on it necessarily as time is my greatest challenge when it comes to my creativity. Responsibilities take precedence unfortunately for me right now. I do usually know within 4 to 6 months if a particular piece of gear is a fit for my workflow. The guitar analogy you make is really on point. Learning new ways and tricks for gear you’ve had for years is a great way to fight gas and that looking at the next new thing. Really enjoy your videos man keep it up!

[@eddieleonard6925]

I dig your mentality. If you approach new purchases from a longer-term view, I think it'll yield different results, and a more productive output. Most are thinking much more short term, which might work for where they're at..but could also lead to an unproductive cycle of buying, selling, buying selling....

[@michaelfitzsimmons6273]

Still on Push 1 and rocking it hard :)

[@eddieleonard6925]

Love that! If it ain't broke....keep rockin.

[@stormie909]

I'm just like your friend, I'm really satisfied with the Push 2, and when I saw the Push 3 I didn't want it because there was nothing I needed. Peace!

[@eddieleonard6925]

Props to you for not falling for the hype. If it ain't broke...

[@TouchToneDSG]

Hey man great video I agree with all the points there

[@eddieleonard6925]

Thanks for joining the discussion. Peace.

[@LeoXonix]

Right on point. We live in an age where except for the computer (and an interface), you need to spend zero dollars to make great music. These kids nowadays are lucky lol.

[@eddieleonard6925]

lol...facts.

[@Quimmoo]

yeah, I got so caught up in boutique pedals world, and recently I've put a great chunk of what I have on a marketplace and just got myself a nice tape delay and a tried and tested MXR Carbon Copy. I've started with Carbon Copy and drifted in search of "better things". Nah, nah, nah... I'm going low, slow and small. My go-to synth is plain simple subtractive analog mono synth. Pair it with some nice analog/tape style delay and that's more than enough. I'm still regretting selling some gear for "better" and "bigger" after 12-18 months. And now I'm just randomly see YT videos with other producers doing crazy stuff with those synths, which I'd never thought are possible.

[@eddieleonard6925]

I hear you. Sometimes I want to get rid of a piece of gear the day after I get it, but I always need to remind myself to give it at least a month to find it's sweet spot...it's ideal use...and it's quirks. Having less things that you're forced to sit with and really learn always yields better results. I've always wanted a real analog tape-delay. They sound so beautiful and lush. I have cheap 90s digital delays, which are fine. But it'd be great to have the real thing and pair it with a solid synth like you've got.

[@Quimmoo]

@@eddieleonard6925 oh, T-Rex did a "reissue" of Benson Echorec drum delay. Real thing, without an obvious drawbacks of outdated tape engineering. Those vintage machines are amazing, but only if properly maintained, and maintaining something like a Space Echo is a huge, huge pain.

[@MrUrg-vq4yb]

Great video man! What we’re the names of those other producers you mentioned around 4:40?

[@eddieleonard6925]

wala.bandcamp.com

[@obscuresoundz]

the shorter the break in period the better fit that equipment is for ur workflow; typically but there exceptions

[@eddieleonard6925]

I agree. With some pieces, you know almost immediately. Love those moments.

[@SiincereARC]

I had to digest your video a bit to give a concise opinion. I think a major part of the problem is that artists/musicians aren't encouraged to actually be artists. The point of being an artist is to express your thoughts, emotions creativity and share it with the world. A lot of us perceive ourselves as artists but the outside world speaks to us like we're entertainers. Entertainers have the explicit job/purpose of entertaining. They adjust based on if their talent is able to entertain you or not. As an artist, you're purpose is to display your art, with YOUR being the operative word. The caveat being that, as an artist, you might not be able to entertain or bring in fans but you have the ability to share something intimate and personal. The other aspect to your video is that once electronic music became a bigger aspect to the music industry (in the 80s) and Japan became a huge part of that market of selling equipment, the shift went from buying what you needed as an artist to create your art to purchasing items based on if they are currently being supported/promoted or not. RZA tried every new equipment that came his way from the early 90s onto the late 90s with the Roland MV9900 (I could be wrong on the model) being a notable device he used. Meanwhile Premo was primarily using an MPC 2000XL throughout the entirety of the 90s. Both were able to create great art but the point was, clearly buying new equipment regardless if you needed it or not shouldn't be near the top of your list of priorities as an artist. If you genuinely feel limited by your current equipment/instrument of choice, no one should stop you from exploring other options. If your art is based heavily on experimentation, which may include other devices, by all means, go nuts. BUT, you know it's bad when non-musicians tell you which items to purchase based on what's being touted on TV/Radio/Internet (like when every studio had beats by dre without actually taking a second to ask why that might not be such a great purchase).

[@eddieleonard6925]

Great points. Technology always will play a huge role in the sound of music. From the invention of the synthesizer to the introduction of the very first drum machines. It allows artists to expand their sound and their capabilities. The problem became when the technology caught up and the possibilities became literally limitless. It makes sense for the RZA or DJ Premier to want more than 12 seconds of sample time and upgrade to machines that give you 3 minutes of sample time. What doesn't make sense is for a young producer who hasn't mastered his/her sound yet to keep updating to newer and newer versions of completely capable machines, under the idea that they don't have enough. There's a delicate balance between trying new things and keeping it simple that leads to productivity while also innovating. Artists like Bjork or Herbie Hancock are great examples of artists who always embrace new technology to elevate their sound, but don't let new gadgets get in the way of music making.

[@ivangonekrazy]

Shout-out to all the manufacturers that release major free firmware updates years after the product release.

[@eddieleonard6925]

They the real ones. Those are usually companies owned/operated by music makers...not business people.

[@BigCore-]

What I'm going to say may be sacrilegious because I love vintage gear. But if I cleaned out what I currently have at home and what's in storage, I'd probably just keep an ipad, a controller, and a ton of plugins.

[@eddieleonard6925]

Honestly...you gotta do what works for you. That's more than enough to make great sounding music. I tend to keep gear I have an emotional connection to..that feels good to use. My DAW and computer are the most powerful units in my system, but I have no connection to them, and they stress me out more than make me happy. But I love your approach of keeping it simple. Then, it's all about the music.

[@BigCore-]

@@eddieleonard6925 It’s super portable too. Any place/any time with the ipad. 🤷🏾‍♂️. The controller makes it physical.

[@l.a.beltranmusic4554]

Also, if the current firmware works for you, don't update it. It's common knowledge these companies purposefully slow down or completely brick a piece of equipment to force you to buy the next thing. I won't update my MPC one especially after the MPC one + release.

[@eddieleonard6925]

Great point!

[@MS7.7]

I'm curious what music equipment has been intentionally bricked by the company 😊because I haven't seen any. This is genuine questions not mockery.

[@stephenfrancis303]

Damn homie an akai s9xx 3000 and all that rack. Still got my 2000xl and 2 technics 1200 and shit loads of vinyl. I just want a ssl six to allow me to record live drums

[@stephenfrancis303]

Also i can sell my 500 rack which got like bae mic pres etc. Compressors etc. I would love to not have to get have daw but its too much to be on 2 inch tape im a old tape hold out

[@eddieleonard6925]

I'd love to eventually record onto 2" tape. Eliminates the need for a lot of compressors, plug-ins, etc. I've always wanted to try BAE mic pres.

[@eddieleonard6925]

that's all you need. ssl big six will be a nice addition. I've heard great things about that mixers headroom. i imagine it's great for hip-hop.

[@itsgoldn931]

Tbh it usually takes me less than a week. I got a kid man 😅. I do hella research before i make any BIG purchases. So I mostly get exactly what i wanted.

[@eddieleonard6925]

I need to be more like you. Especially when you need to watch your time like that. Cheers,

[@WesWookBeats]

Shout out to manuals 🤙

[@eddieleonard6925]

Hell yea! :)

[@djjimmskeedjjimmskee1231]

I’m done buying gear. It’s about the music man. These companies will always make new products with a couple of new features.

[@eddieleonard6925]

Took me a while to learn this, but it's the truth. Once you understand this...you're creativity can get to work, undistracted by unnecessary updates.