The Missing Suspension Links - KTM 1290 Super Duke R - Gen 3

[@horstginseng]

Very interesting indeed! But I'm not sure that I'm getting it for my configuration. I own a SuperDuke 1290 RR (2023) with WP Apex Pro suspension. Would your kit still make sense here or can I adjust the Apex Pro shock w/o changing the link resulting in the same geometry? Thanks in advance for your kind help.

[@adriizer4153]

Hi Eric, What is the best suspensions settings to have with these parts ? I'm currently in sport setting and closed the front and rear trigger 2 clicks more to get less bounce. Do you find it good ? Will it be ok with you parts ? Thanks

[@superduked33]

Will be fine with our links. These pieces are more about geometry than valving. And depending on what link kit you buy, the +10, the +20, or the race kit, my answers might vary. What shock do you have?

[@adriizer4153]

@@superduked33 I've the OEM shock

[@superduked33]

@@adriizer4153 either the +10 or +20 will work for you. Depends on your preference and feel, and sprocket choice. Some sizes lose rear ride height, others raise it. What sprockets are you running?

[@adriizer4153]

I use the original gearbox ratio on my gen 3. I had a 16 gearbox output sprocket on my gen 2, not sure if I'll put it on my gen 3. Do you recommend the 16 sprocket for road/track use ? The +20mm is maybe the best in an original configuration and in 16 sprocket ?

[@superduked33]

@@adriizer4153 The +20 VS +10 choice does depend on two main things in my opinion. Rider feel and sensitivity, and sprocket choice. Rider feel is up to you, I can't predict that. But sprocket choice I can help you with. If you change your front sprocket only, from a 17 to a 16, once your chain is adjusted properly you will have lost 1.2mm of rear ride height. If you also went up to a 39 in the rear your ride height would end up back at stock. But if you went one more tooth in the back you would suddenly lose 7 or 9mm depending on how many links you went with (in this configuration 112 and 114 are possible). But lets say you kept the front sprocket at 17, and only changed the rear sprocket from a 38 to a 39. This small change, depending again on how many links you chose, you would either gain 2.9mm of rear ride height (112 links) or you would LOSE 12mm! (114 links). So in this case of losing 12mm, I would definitely suggest you go with the +20. But in the case of your already adding 2.9mm, I might suggest you go with the +10. Either way you go, they are not cost prohibitive and they are very easy to install. If it were me I would buy both. But I do also have a problem with commitment my wife tells me... :)

[@markbentlay4043]

I cant get enough of this I love the way you get into the details and explanation thanks Man !! So Educational

[@JOEBOWERY]

Super Cool Eric! I don't have a Duke yet, (I am currently Kawasaki SX1000 rider), However I love your passion, expertise and dedication! Very cool Product! It looks gorgeous.

[@superduked33]

"I don't have a Duke, yet....." :)

[@robertmacforesman3523]

Love the Knowledge give me address , where I can purchase ASAP thanks Eric, Bob Foresman

[@superduked33]

superduked.com/

[@kmfiz]

Eric, if I put on the 20mm on my stock SDR, that will raise the seat height correct? I’m 5’8 and already on tippy toes.

[@superduked33]

Think of it like this my friend. Our SDRs have a shock-to-axle ratio of 1 to 2. That means for every 1mm the shock moves, the axle moves 2mm. So when you consider links, a +20mm Sport Link would mean the shock is 10mm longer than stock. Since your seat is above and forward of your shock, a +20 Sport Link raises your seat a little less than 3/8", or 9.5mm. A +15 raises your seat about 1/4" or 6.4mm. A +10 raises your seat about 1/8" or 3.2mm.

[@kmfiz]

@@superduked33 Thanks for the explanation! So the 20 mm link would give a better turn-in than the 10 mm, hence a sportier ride?

[@superduked33]

@@kmfiz short answer is yes. But since the SDR uses an eccentric to position the axle, depending on your sprocket choice you might prefer different Sport Links for different gearing. If you download the free charts that I made, from Superduked.com, you can see what gearing and chain combinations put your axle where - which in turns also means your ride heights, which I also plotted. So for a gearing and chain length combination that increases your ride height a lot, you might only want a +10mm Sport Link, because your gearing change already increased your ride height 7mm (for example). It’s actually pretty cool making these changes to your bike. As you will see, changing this simple link will change your bikes feel and performance, quite a lot. It’s pretty exciting, and fun, to make changes that tailor your bike to your persona preferences. I do it often in racing. Like every day, multiple times per day. And for reference, I raced this past weekend at +30mm and with the axle waaaay back (longer than stock), and with 16/43/116 sprockets and chain

[@kmfiz]

@@superduked33 Ok Eric, I’ll checkout that chart. I’m pretty happy with the stock gearing. Really appreciate you knowledge and info you put out. Have a great racing season!

[@kmfiz]

@@superduked33 Just bought the 20mm for my Gen3, looking forward to better turns and a sportier ride. Thanks for the great content and ingenuity GoGo.

[@Matt-hs9rj]

Hi buddy Unrelated question I have a 2015 SDR and with it a common problem. It is very hard to get the beast into neutral. Any idea how to fix that shortcoming Otherwise love that bike Tks in advance

[@superduked33]

Is your clutch fully bled? Sometimes a little air gets trapped in the clutch master which limits how far apart the clutch plates pull away from each other when you pull the lever all the way in. That causes slight drag, which can make it nearly impossible to find neutral. Start there. Maybe pull the clutch lever all the way in, hold it it, crack that tiny bleeder open and immediately closed, then let go of the lever. I do that regularly on my gen3 and it makes all the difference

[@nickewarmboe8807]

Ive got everything OEM, just bought the 10mm got it home yesterday. So what Sprockets & chain shall i get to get a increase height and swingarm angle?

[@superduked33]

The +10 Sportlink will add height and swingarm angle and also reduce progression a bit - all on its own just by bolting it on. If you want to understand sprocket combinations better go ahead and download the charts I made on Superduked.com, they are free and super helpful when figuring out which way to go and why. You made a good choice starting with the +10. If you want more performance later, try the +20. It's a big jump though, changes the bike a LOT. And some who leave stock gearing while using the +20 report rubbing on the chain-guide just before the front sprocket. You can avoid this by adding some teeth to your rear sprocket, which will also wake the bike up more. I for one find the OEM gearing way too tall for that transmission, especially in the higher gears. So, fix two issues at once.

[@superduked33]

This is also a fantastic resource to help you figure your next gearing move: sprocketcalculator.com/

[@nickewarmboe8807]

@@superduked33 Thank you, im gonna start with small changes, so 17/40 - 114 i'll try out. kinda excited to actually be able to drive out of corner with some throttle !

[@superduked33]

@@nickewarmboe8807 agreed. Like a whole new bike. Let me know how you make out please.

[@nickewarmboe8807]

@@superduked33 first track session of the year is in May here in sweden ,but i Will let you know if its puts a smile on my face 🙂

[@scottwilliams6749]

Excellent work. One question tho. Is there a difference in rake/trail measurements between the KTM factory triple clamps and the oem clamps. If so what would be the advantage /disadvantage between your suspension links and the clamps.

[@superduked33]

That's a great question Scott, with an unfortunate answer. The KTM Power Parts triple clamps are the exact same offset as stock. Unfortunately. And the top clamp is the same height. So there is no difference in chassis setup or attitude between the two clamps. The only difference between them are (this is copied directly off the KTM site): "Made of high-strength aluminum Elegant anodized surface Perfect for use on the race track Visual highlight CNC milled aluminum triple clamp Stiffer than the standard triple clamp Lighter than the standard triple clamp More precise handling during hard braking maneuvers Better pressure distribution in the clamping area of the fork"

[@nicoceboci7354]

is the 10mm Link enough for the EVO Version with stock gearing and mostly for road use? best greetings from Germany

[@superduked33]

I think the +10 link is the most appropriate place to start. Especially with the EVO since you can dial more spring to gain a little more rear ride height. Be careful adding too much rear height that way though, because the more preload you put into a spring, the less compliant it is in its initial range. Meaning you will feel subtle bumps more harshly withe more preload so don't go too far. If you like the +10, then add a little preload with the EVO and you like it, I would get the +20 and then back off the spring again to get that compliance back.

[@MajorDrama1]

Have been surprised and perhaps disappointed to find that my new Gen III understeers just a little more than I am happy with... Still corners well enough, but find that I need to use peg pressure to assist to create a more neutral feel.. Yes peg pressure is good riding practice but shouldn't be required imo - My initial thought to tighten up this steering was to drop the height of fork in triple clamp.. Wouldn't this way of sharpening up the steering geometry be a simpler way of achieving a similar effect?

[@superduked33]

Thats what I thought too. Try it. I did several times. But I was surprised and disappointed at how little this changed the feel. Likely due to squat, this bike's Achilles Heel in my opinion. Fingers crossed your experience is better.

[@jakestebbins944]

Eric I'm so glad your into this bike!!! I have a 2021 1290 SDR I'm 6ft 215lbs an ride the shit out of it!!! I did the BT-MOTO flash AMAZING!!!! DNA filter an AUSTIN RACING GP1RR slip on. I only ride on the street an twistys but only cause I have no track here on kauai...I know poor me😂 what linkage should I get an also what about a better shock for the bike? Where ya get that carbon belly pan? Looks great!!! I just got a fiberglass one from the UK. Appreciate all the content keep it up🤙🏼

[@superduked33]

Same. Big, tall, ride the shit out of bikes. OK first, I made that bellypan. Not the best shape but it was during the pandemic and I needed something NOW. The next year I swapped it out for the S2Concepts fiberglass one. Better shape I think. Mine was pretty basic. Second, I sell three solutions for the Gen3. Low dollar solution is the Sportlinks. +10, +15, +20 links. Low money big improvements. I sell a Superlink for race shocks that are height adjustable. More linear rate of the spring, lets you extend to the full length of the Maxton shock, the Ohlins, the MUPO (all of which are longer than the Apex Pro - so they hit the control arm at 3/4 length. Not with the Superlink though, because of it's special "S" shape). The Sportlinks add rear ride height which increases swingarm angle, creates more antisquat for better drives, and decreases trail (by lifting the rear). The final solution is the big one, just came out with it. Adjustable offset triple clamps - called the "Superclamp". Now we can adjust trail without jacking up the rear of the bike.. You still want more rear ride height via the Sportlinks or Superlink, but no longer do we need to go so much higher than that to cut back on the miles of trail that the Gen3 comes with. Now we can adjust trail separate of any other aspect of the bike. Pretty badass. Go to Superduked.com and read about them all. Email me directly from there if you like.

[@jakestebbins944]

@superduked33 Thanks for getting back to me, and yes, I'll email you directly to go over some things that I need better explanation on. I wanna get my bike set up, right the 1st time. Thanks Jake🤙🏼🤙🏼

[@user-hb4nl3bl6c]

Which design software do you refer too? 😊

[@superduked33]

AIM data acquisition to record data. Race Studio 4 to analyze. And MotoSpec for chassis changes and development

[@markbentlay4043]

Hi Eric Very cool 3D video at Laguna the footage is got amazing depth are you rotating the camera as your ride or is that part of the editing? Thank you for creating these unique problem solving parts! Really excited to try out the Super-link 20mm but behold they are out of stock, any new on the next shipment arrival thanks Marko.

[@superduked33]

Hi Mark. Thanks on the 3D props. All editing. Took me forever but I'm brand new at editing 360 footage. New +20 links going to anodizer Monday. Should be back in stock this Friday!

[@markbentlay4043]

Thats great news thanks Eric.

[@TotteSDuke]

Hi Eric, thanks for all the insights and advice. I ordered the +15. When mounting I‘d really like to change to Titanium bolts and nuts too. Could you please post the link on your source or any hint where to buy? Thanks in advance.

[@taureanbennett]

I just got my gen 3 back from the dealer after having the motor replaced after it failed me 1300 miles in. Clutch slave Cylinder went while riding the rear wheel locked up, then the oil pressure light came on and the motor wouldn't start again. 4 months waiting on it and lots of back and forth with the dealer and ktm. I've got my bike back. Ktm is avoiding answering what they'll warrantee the new motor for. I'm debating do I keep it. I've ordered the new m1000r competition while at my strongest point of frustration during the warranty ordeal. If i keep the Duke I'm definitely ordering the +20.

[@chriseastburn3551]

Excellent work!

[@juanrapido]

Thanks Eric!

[@bryansuperduke1290r]

Have a standard bike for street use, stock gearing, with the standard shock what the better option, the 20mm? 10mm better for shock with adjustable length? Do you plan to produce the ride height measuring tool on your bike? Also, are you going to have to adjust you chain length a bit when you fit them?

[@superduked33]

Hi Bryan. Excellent question on the ride height tool. Very observant and forward thinking of you. Yes I am asking around now tring to get someone to laser cut a run of them, but they have to be perfect to fit the frame and with plastic inserts so they don't scratch the frame like my old Ferracci ones did on the Ducatis. No chain adjustment necessary on either of the 3 link kits. As far as adjustable shocks go on the Gen 3, this is the main reason I started this project a year ago. You cannot extend extendable shocks much farther than OEM length due to the straight control arm. The shock hits the control arm when the swingarm goes fully extended under braking, etc. There's just not enough room. Thats' why the race kit comes with it's own control arm and related links. The links meant for the OEM shocks do not work with the links for the race shocks. Totally different dimensions

[@bryansuperduke1290r]

@@superduked33 What did you do with position of concentric adjuster on Gen 3, have you fitted longer chain to rotate hub further to the rear to increase wheelbase like your Gen 2? Did you also go 15-40 on gearing too? Obviously your set up is for track use where mine is a road bike so not needing the set up you have.

[@superduked33]

@@bryansuperduke1290r my Gen 3 gearing is currently 16/41. As far as eccentric positioning, there are only a five gearing combinations that you can use two different chain length options (links). 17/39, 17/43, 16/36, 16/40, 16/44 All of those are either 112 or 114 links, except the 16/44. That combination is 114 or 116 links. So really your eccentric position on all other sprocket choices is what it is.

[@jakubbenes3792]

Thanks!

[@AMPJ08]

Almost got convinced but I don't buy the argument. Yes one does track days and yes on my level I could notice what you said but I drove around it having a different style yes amateur and also use the evo suspension preload to compensate. Not that it was to me a big problem honestly. The bike is awesome and like many rider also adapts to it. Then if one day I go racing well, I use a superbike though..... thanks

[@superduked33]

You would understand if you rode with the links

[@superduked33]

Additionally, preload is the worst way to adjust chassis attitude. Better done mechanically. Leave preload to put your spring travel where it best suits your suspension travel

[@AMPJ08]

@@superduked33 What you explain is very much good. I understand what I will get no doubt. I just tracked several bikes in the past and just did the SD for fun and had a blast. I just say that if I wanted to really do more track days I would choose a SBK as is made for the purpose. Depending on what one chooses then there is a ton of parts and improvements to be made. Your work is awesome and you riding incredible, you help many riders to enjoy the beast I thank you for that. :)

[@mrmojosrisen7514]

Been waiting for these for a while! just put my order in, UK bound, keep up the good work and I look forward to trying these out thanks again old chap.

[@superduked33]

Thank you my friend. :)

[@bryansuperduke1290r]

What length did you go for?

[@mrmojosrisen7514]

@@superduked33 Hi Eric the bank just been intouch and they cancelled the transaction because they thought it was a scam but told me they won't stop a second transaction so will purchase again in the next 20 mins.

[@mrmojosrisen7514]

Sorted used paypal this time. cheers.

[@mrmojosrisen7514]

@@bryansuperduke1290r 20mm and I'm have 16 40 sprockets fitted.

[@james5553]

This is super interesting, I am 100kgs and really struggle with speed weave on my superduke. I think I need a higher rate spring and more ride height. I dropped the forks a little which helped.

[@superduked33]

Can you explain more about your speed wave James? Like when does it happen and what its like?

[@james5553]

@@superduked33 It happens accelerating hard in a straight line. When I dial up the preload it helps a bit, but not enough. It also happens regardless of anti wheelie. I would guess it starts at 80 ish mph and then gets worse to the point I cannot really accelerate past 110mph without being totally sketched out. My other bike (Aprillia rsv1000 factory) does not have this issue and is rock solid at speed.

[@james5553]

I love the engine and the slow speed cornering of the superduke, but the high speed stability is bad - no front end feel at all. I am trying to loose weight to help at the track as I guess I might be 110kg with kit.

[@superduked33]

@@james5553 Go to 6:51 in this video and tell me if your "Speed weave" is like this. If so I'll share how I fixed mine: kzbin.info/www/bejne/oJbRe2WYha-NpqM

[@james5553]

@@superduked33 Yes looks similar !

[@gixermick1]

Awesome work, where can I get these from?

[@superduked33]

superduked.com/

[@gixermick1]

Thank you Eric, loving the info on the duke keep it up 🤙

[@elvulch]

Placing an order this morning!

[@jimjim753]

What tire do u race with? I been running dunlop slicks 200/60 very happy with them

[@superduked33]

Michelin Power Performance, mainly soft compound. 200 on back. They just came out with a new medium/hard which wears very well but mainly in higher temps

[@motoken]

Hey Eric, off topic...which brembo RCS would you recommend for the Brembo Stylema calipers on the Gen 3? I can't see which one you have on your bike currently. would like to know your take on it.

[@revvaddictz]

Sorry to butt in but i changed to the RCS 17 brake master and RCS 16 clutch master on my Gen 3…. Plus i got the Oberon Clutch Slave master cylinder… My whole brakes and clutch are sooooo confidence inspiring now!!! And everything is wayyyy better Especially with the Motul Brake Fluid. Hope that helps… disclaimer…. Im not a pro lol i just like pro things 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@motoken]

@@revvaddictz thank you for the Input!

[@superduked33]

This will be yours and my least favorite "trik your bike out" answer but it's the truth. I use the stock caliper. I use the stock lines. I use the ABS and I love it. BUT, I do use BrakeTech full floating rotors which DO roll effortlessly. And I do use Vesrah RJL XX pads, which are exceptional. Full disclosure - I am not sponsored by either. I get excellent feel and routinely enjoy the advantage our bikes have in out-braking others.

[@jonmercer8390]

Hi Eric, any idea when the 20mm will be available again?

[@superduked33]

They're working on them now. Less than 2 weeks is my hope. Thanks for checking Jon

[@ryegoryshev]

Hi Eric, do you have info how 16/40 gearing changes rider height? I’m using OEM chain 112 links. Thank you

[@superduked33]

My data says 16/40 is -6.8mm shorter with 112 links, or -9.1mm shorter with 114 links. BUT... there are many variables you have to get perfect to get these numbers right and my buddy earlier today suggested he needs to double check one thing that he might have screwed up when we made this chart. So... This is the best answer I can give you right now, but I will confirm in a day or so if it needs to change at all

[@ryegoryshev]

@@superduked33 thank you for the quick response, I’ll highly appreciate it if you can drop a line with what your friend discovers.

[@ryegoryshev]

@@superduked33 Hi Eric, just checking if there are any updates on the rider height with 16/40-112 sprockets-chain setup.

[@superduked33]

@@ryegoryshev We worked on this last night. Found one row of very bad data - the 16/40 row. It's not -9.1 at all. WTF!! Anyway new numbers are 16/40 - 112 links = +3.4mm ride height, and - 4.6mm of swingarm length. OEM swingarm length is 600.5mm, 16/40 112link swingarm length is 595.9mm. Sorry for the confusion. One of the parameters was put in wrong by mistake

[@ryegoryshev]

@@superduked33 Thanks a lot for the clarification. Considering the above, would you still suggest giving a try to the 10mm link?

[@blacksonic1005]

Hallo, great video, one question, which dampers do you recommend for the Super Duke ,or is it easy to use Wo apex Pro! I buy the 20mm for the Original Suspension, but i want Chance for the track !

[@superduked33]

I have used WP Apex Pro, and MUPO, on the 1290 Super Duke R. I prefer MUPO. But I have learned recently that they are not available anymore.. Thankfully I have also become aware of another company with a good reputation - Maxton. Apparently Maxton makes a GP10 model shock that is height adjustable. They ask you for lots of specific data on your riding style, your weight, your intended use, even your tire brand! I think that is very excellent news, but I cannot say I have tried the Maxton myself because I haven't. Not yet...

[@blacksonic1005]

@@superduked33 thank you very much for the answer then I will order the superlink Suspension from you !

[@blacksonic1005]

Hello GoGO, I ordered your link for the original spring strut for the KTM 12 90 Superduke R in 20mm! one question can I send it back directly when it has arrived and exchange it for the superlink, yesterday I bought the new WP Apex Pro suspension, and then only the superlink would fit! Kind regards Philipp Schöfecker ! I have send you a E-Mail!