The Most Forgettable Lawn Application Of The Year ~ Winter Weed Pre-Emergent

In the Fall from around mid-September through late October most lawns across the country see their soil temps drop from their summer highs past 70 degrees to the downside. As soil temps drop below 70 degrees many of the winter weed seeds begin to germinate even if you don't see them in the lawn.
Most of these weeds, including Poa annua (annual bluegrass) and many others are so small in the Fall that they go unnoticed and through the coldest parts of the winter they go dormant just like your turf grasses; the problem is that they wake up from winter very early and salt & pepper an otherwise dormant winter lawn with unwanted grasses and weeds that are simply going to die in late Spring leaving dead spots in the lawn by summer.
I don't recommend every lawn owner to apply a winter weed pre-emergent in the Fall but they can be very useful for certain people with particularly bad problems including crabgrass however the application for crabgrass typically comes mid-winter and in early Spring.
►► This fall pre-emergent will work for most everybody in stopping the vast majority of winter weeds including poa annua because it has mild post-emergent capabilities as well - if you apply a little late then it will still work and not negatively affect anything else: shrsl.com/46w9o ◄◄
Personally, I don't apply a fall pre-emergent, but not because I forget to like so many other lawn owners, but because I choose not to apply.
You also should make a conscious choice to apply or not apply; don't skip this application due to neglect; skip it purposefully or apply with passion. :)
► You can see my work-in-progress written guide to weed pre-emergents including these two types of products and others here: turfmechanic.c...
► The video I produced explaining all your options for pre-emergents is here: • How To Prevent Weeds I...
► The pre-emergent I currently use in the Spring (and would use today) if I felt the need to stop winter weeds in my yard this season is the Anderson's Barricade DG. It uses Prodiamine and I use it because I can apply a half rate application and still get 4 months of lasting coverage out of it.
Here's an affiliate link to it for those that are in a shopping mood: www.amazon.com...
► There are also many other products and blended products that use the Prodiamine active ingredient. Use your judgement as to which is best for you.
For basic Scotts Halts products I recommend you just go head over to your local big box store and shop the isles. Most places locally will have it or something similar. These products frequently use Pendimethalin which doesn't last as long so full strength apps will be needed for winter coverage.
► The "fancy" fall pre-emergent that I'm tempted to try out in future years is the YM 0-0-7 Fertilizer with Prodimaine mostly because I'm always looking to add extra Potassium to the lawn in the fall to help the lawn hold up over winter. Here's an affiliate link to the product if you are interested in pricing it out or checking label specs. - shrsl.com/3733d
Anderson's makes a similar product too which you can price compare through this affiliate link: shrsl.com/3733g
► For checking your own soil temps I use a long stemmed analog compost thermometer that I reviewed in this video: • How I Check Soil Temps...
For ball park soil temp estimates in your area just use this free Greencast online tool which I mentioned in the video: www.greencasto...
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[@TurfMechanic]

►►► Want to fix your lawn for the long haul but don't know where to start? I can help! Click here right now and get started today: turfmech.link/dont-know-where-to-start ◄◄◄

[@Moondoggy1941]

Thanks for the email reminder, I will be throwing down my pre emergent Barricade 0.48 tomorrow our soil temps have dropped from 87 degrees two weeks ago to 65 today.

[@kcw131]

Of all the lawncare guys (and I watch a lot), you do the best job of explaining the *why* along with your advice. I always appreciate it.

[@TurfMechanic]

Hey Kevin; I always appreciate comments with feedback like that - I always want to present the why as much as possible. Thanks for watching and I'll always try to keep presenting the why, hopefully my delivery will continue to improve too :)

[@eyeswideopen627]

For 10 years I plugged and seeded in fall. Looked good in spring but quickly faded. Seemed I never made any progress. Then I learned what poa anna was. That explained a lot. And I have a ton. My first attempt at prodiamine. We will see. Thank you for all your help..

[@TurfMechanic]

Ohh man, that's a little funny, a long time back I thought the same thing about parts of my extended property where the grasses and plants would all die off during the summer. I thought it was due to a lack of water but many of those field grasses and plants are annuals too. Good luck with the new strategy, time when your Fall app wears off and consider doing a spring overseed instead of a fall overseed to help fill in the gas where the Poa would have been...unless of course you apply pre-emergent in the spring as well to stop the summer weeds. Always something to consider! :D

[@gary4738]

Well presented, thank you sir

[@TurfMechanic]

Thanks for the comment and the watch to you too Gary! Glad this ended up being worth your time 😄

[@lilflexlewis5802]

U r awesome, I seed in the fall. I'm going to start to use per emergent in the spring

[@TurfMechanic]

Sounds like sound strategy to me! Thanks for watching and also for your comments!

[@michaellitscher9456]

Thank you for producing this video. I've been applying fertilizer with Dimension (Dithiopyr) every spring for the last 10 years, and it has worked well at keeping crabgrass out of my lawn. This spring/summer I finally got tired of seeing the spots of poa annua in my lawn that I've seen for years and decided to up my turf game and applied that same fertilizer with Dimension (quick and easy) a few weeks ago, immediately followed with 1/2 inch of water (far more effort and time). The lawn looks great! I'm looking forward to seeing if the same spots where I've always seen poa are poa-free next year. If so, I'll overseed. If not, I'll apply Dimension weeks earlier.

[@TurfMechanic]

That's awesome to hear Michael - I hope it gives you more poa control next season! Depending on where you live your fall Dimension ap may have been a bit early but not necessarily so. Had I applied it to my lawn it would have gone down somewhere in mid Sept as our soil cools off quick in the fall; your soil may do the same as ours.

[@michaellitscher9456]

@@TurfMechanic I live north of Milwaukee. The weather slowly went from the 80's to 70's but then dropped into the low 60's, so I took that as a sign. Better a couple weeks early than a couple weeks late. Would have loved to time it with rain but none was in the forecast.

[@TurfMechanic]

@@michaellitscher9456 aha, yeah you probably git the timing pretty good then! 👏

[@quickplaya]

Looking for advice from all. Here is timeline. Complete glyphosate renovation August 1st. Tenacity application then planted 60PRG/30KBG/10Fescue seed September 15th. Lawn grew in 80% thick October 4th, approximately 2 weeks after first planting. Overseeded bare spots Oct 8th. Did first mow yesterday. My question..... Should I focus on thickening lawn for next 3 weeks while soil temps stay around 50degrees or is it better to throw down pre emergent and pick up with overseeding next spring? Wondering if I will have a easier time next spring not having to fight weeds. Thanks in advanced!

[@AromaFrank]

Hi. I bought the Yard Mastery 0-0-7 Prodiamine .38%. Before applying to the yard. I would like to understand; should I do regular fertilizer before and after a week or so I should apple this or this is like a fertilizer as well, and that I should not anymore till after the winter?

[@thurstonr9929]

Hello Brian, Thanks for this video. As always good info. You answered my question regarding Andersons Barricade. I do have a bag in my shed. I see it should not be applied til my cool season temps are 50 or below as you indicated in the comments. I overseeded on September 6 so will wait about week or two.

[@TurfMechanic]

Hey Thurston, Under 50 with prodimaine as I said in the vid is all about preventing the earliest season crabrass in the spring, the stuff that comes up earlier than anticipated, under 70 is about controlling the winter weeds that germinate now, in the fall. So long as you get that distinction then you should be good!

[@thurstonr9929]

@@TurfMechanic Hey Brian, I’m hearing a lot about applying fall fertilizer now. I did a Milo app two weeks ago. Should I be applying a fall fertilizer now? Do plan on winterizer app later in season.

[@joeljohnson4064]

I'm in southeast Texas and I see a lot of Bermuda and St Augustine does that change this for me?

[@TurfMechanic]

Shouldn't change anything substantially. Pre-emergent should be applied in mid fall for any lawn (Bermuda and St Aug included) if you want to prevent the winter weeds. They tend to start germinating at various intervals as soil temps drop below 70 and march down towards 50.

[@marcl9232]

I used up my recommended application rate of prodiamine in the spring... what about dithiopyr?

[@TurfMechanic]

Yeah, that's an alternative for sure, its not my preference though. I explain why in my video on weed prevention here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/qmmVo4B9nbd7grs

[@MorsSmores]

How does tenacity and poa do for those of us that use it with overseeding

[@TurfMechanic]

Hmm, that's honestly one I need to research a bit. Poa annua and poa triv are grasses, just not desirable grasses so im not sure tenacity would do anything to them. If anyone knows I hope you'll chime in. For me I'll do some research to broaden my knowledge.

[@azamamer]

Thank you for the video. I applied prodiamine for crabgrass and Isoxaben for broad leaf weeds when the soil temp were aroung 65. Was it too early or I should be good?

[@TurfMechanic]

If you did that this fall to prevent growth in the Spring it may have been too early as that stuff germinates anywhere from March to May depending on where you live. Andersons recommends the fall app of prodiamine for crabgrass control when soil temps drop below 50 which would be closer to the end of fall for most places.

[@gagehindle210]

Could I use certainty to get rid of overseeded perennial rye on a Bermuda lawn in the spring?

[@TurfMechanic]

Absolutely, ive never done it but it's very possible from all the literature I've read. If I were doing this I'd start early in spring and plan on repeat application about 25 days apart. Point is to ensure all rye dies off before summer, once it gets too hot then the rye resists dieing off as heat dormancy or heat defenses start kicking in.

[@gagehindle210]

@@TurfMechanic I like a green winter lawn, even though I’m in socal. Thx.

[@aquienpuedainteresar4188]

Great tips. I applied mine earlier on September because I plan to do dormant seeding. Hopefully by the time temps are high up for germination the effectiveness has gone.

[@joehuff1110]

Always a huge loss of seed by dormant seeding. Especially if Temps are up and down. One thaw and dry will kill em. Be weary of that choice.

[@aquienpuedainteresar4188]

@@joehuff1110 Yes you are absolutely right, however, this area have many trees and is shaded in late spring, summer and early fall. Then the leaves are falling. I believe that my chances for best success is spring when there're no leaves on the trees allowing more sun and I have to walk less on the lawn.

[@aquienpuedainteresar4188]

@@joehuff1110 But yes its still going to be challenging.

[@joehuff1110]

If you're sewing cool season then I had major success in early spring. Right when Temps began the climb. I sew the seed and covered with sphagnum peat moss. It was so thick a lush people wanted and laid in my lawn. Had cars driving by. You should see it today. I just overseeded.

[@TurfMechanic]

Don't under estimate the ability to seed fine fescue and P rye in the spring. Both can germinate quick and really early in cooler tems if you cover the seed with crop cover. fine fesue will thrive in shade and p rye will help thicken the turf up and give it some versatility.

[@Jeff-ik3hn]

I’m a month past overseeing. Do you suggest dithiopyr dimension or prodiamine barricade

[@sambutera3898]

Yes I am in the same boat .I would think the answer is don’t use but I would like to hear exactly why .

[@TurfMechanic]

Hey Jeff I recommend Prodiamine because you can use it after only a couple mowings after seed germination and because I think it's generally cheaper. Also, you can use a low rate app for Prodimaine and still stop the germination of winter weeds because you don't need 6-8 months of coverage that the high rate offers. You are right though that dithiopyr is another option. It too can be applied after only a couple mowings on top of baby grass but you will likely need to do apply a full app to get coverage through late fall to mid-winter because the efficacy for the product drops off considerably faster than prodiamine. I think it's a bit more expensive on average but you do get a small bit of post-emergent coverage out of it...however I don't think that's important in this case because when applying at or around 70 degree soil temps means you shouldn't have the need for post-emergent control.

[@TurfMechanic]

Hey Sam, check my response to Jeff above

[@Jeff-ik3hn]

@@TurfMechanic awesome thank you very much. I think I will apply prodiamine after one more mowing!

[@sambutera3898]

@@TurfMechanic thank you and kept the videos coming

[@michaelperry4398]

Poa Annua anuall blue grass or poe triv?

[@TurfMechanic]

Poa annua is the annual that we can control with pre-emergents, trivialis is the perennial version that can't be controlled by pre-emergent...because it's a perennial

[@michaelperry4398]

Actually please let's get a complete list of the Winter weeds a pre-emergent will control with a fall pre emergent application. I thought it wasn't many? I would like to know each and every weed that's a winter weed for the northeast cool season grass or a cool season grass in general

[@TurfMechanic]

Michael I'm sorry I'm not able to provide a complete list, doing basic googling you can find lots of helpful lists of winter weeds for north American states like this www.missouribotanicalgarden.org/gardens-gardening/your-garden/help-for-the-home-gardener/advice-tips-resources/pests-and-problems/weeds/winter-annual.aspx and this www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=cropwatch.unl.edu/2020-CW-News/documents/ID-of-Winter-Weeds-EC-304.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjhvKH89MLzAhUXpp4KHdyWDN4QFnoECDAQAQ&usg=AOvVaw0F1uI3iCO9aBJTUGoTGimF and then compare to the label of products you want to use. Those labels usually list the weeds they provide protection against if you really want to know precisely. Most people only have a subset of weeds possible and even pros have a hard time identifying them all when they are mature let alone tiny sprouts. Product labels are easily downloaded for deep reading on just about any herbicide you are researching.

[@azimmey]

Wish I could but I have to heavily reseed.

[@TurfMechanic]

Mesotrione can also be applied at time of seeding too! I used it in my spring perennial rye seeding video this year and it worked soooo well. This fall I didn't and I'll try not to skip it again