The most polite Brexit debate ever? With Michael Morpurgo and Robert Tombs

[@daoirsemcdaid4797]

These men are whats missing. Both have a love for their country and can agree it isn't a us versus them, unlike the charlatans at the forefront of the debate.

[@veggie42]

Because Brexit was a result but people were kept out

[@aaronmiller3038]

I do not hate the EU, I do have a great deal of love for all the countries and people of Europe and I especially do not feel any hatred towards my fellow Brits, which ever way they voted. What I do have a great deal of dislike for though is the people who are running the political systems both in the EU and our own Parliament and how disconnected they are from the people they are meant to serve. This god like attitude of those who think they are elite of looking down on us all as silly little children who should be seen but not heard is echoing all across the countries of Europe

[@tonyclay8364]

I agree but wait it could get worse...Macrom would dearly like to run the whole of Europe.

[@kayzphotography3678]

Unfortunately, politicians are mirror reflection of the population. Just read through the vast majority of "Brexiteers" & "Remainers" from other Brexit related discussions, you will see really obnoxious and rude people making highly illogical comments/statements. It is rare to see sane, logical, calm and polite people like these 2 gentlemen.

[@andrisparalax1752]

@@tonyclay8364 It's still a game of empires but in a modern way. The empires are no longer defined by people or borders though but by influence. Europe is still going through the transition of becoming a common ideology but this goal is still not in reach. I do believe Europe is on the right path, but patience is needed.

[@Kanelbullah]

@@tonyclay8364 ofcourse Macron would like to rule, thats the main thing with politicians, to fight for your cause. And to reach to influence by usinng the EU, you will increase your chance of great influance. the will of a politicans throught a mandate of the people...

[@worththewatch1517]

Then by definition you have hate the WTO, UN and more international institutions! But you re talking emotionally and uneducated

[@user-fi2fd8ok6n]

this is a pure example of people at their finest, two men saying "I see where your coming from but we disagree about the details" not "here is why your wrong" this should always have been how we debated this

[@luismanuel2612]

Wise words Mr. Morpurgo. I'm afraid the bitterness in the public debate will continue for many years, unfortunately. They blame Europe for mistakes made by national governments ...

[@Detector1977]

This is exactly it. The national governments in all around the EU has done a poor job over decades and instead of citizens blaming themselves for their ignorance of voting those politicians to power, it's much easier to blame the EU.

[@leeenglish4363]

You make a very good point. One of the biggest reasons I voted to leave the European Union was for that reason. It has been used as a scapegoat. It may be no fault of the EU that allot of the problems in this nation have arisen but I do need to emphasise my use of the word allot, as some are. But by my voting to leave, I was hoping to take away any excuse from these useless, self-interested politicians we call our representatives. Putting their actions directly in the spotlight so we can see exactly how their interests sit with the people whom elected them and the electorate can act accordingly. I believe my vote and many others has very clearly shown this and I personally feel that this is the very reason that quite a few politicians would like us to remain.

[@markwtal9453]

@@leeenglish4363 I don't know if that was a good idea on your side. However this debacle ends, half of Britain will blame the EU for all problems which will arise. And more so the politicians of Britain.

[@mrjones1696]

The UK government has since the Lisbon Treaty controlled roughly around 40% of domestic law compared to the 60% controlled by the EU. With this clear and glaring fact how can a National government be responsible for failures in legislation when the majority of said legislation is out of its jurisdiction? As stated in this debate many countries within the EU are suffering from the same ailments, is it that all of the National Governments are failing or that the EU is failing the National governments?

[@markwtal9453]

@@mrjones1696 I don't know if it's 60 %, but it doesn't matter. Gb has decided on the EU legislation. It had a veto Right. Gb came up with most of the legislation to begin with. there are no laws made, the UK doesn't want. It's a nice talking point, but in reality, it's without substance.

[@patricka.crawley6572]

You can love Europe and detest the government.

[@borderlands6606]

The insidious blurring of the line between Europe and the EU is no accident. A Swede is as different from a Southern Italian culturally, linguistically and in terms of cuisine as it is possible to imagine. European-ness is an artificial construct, which is fine in trade terms but not ideologically.

[@KingScorpio84]

@WhyOWhy the EU is europe attempt to be efficient governed commonly protected and integrated.

[@KingScorpio84]

@WhyOWhy thats not true, the Eu is cooperative body,

[@patricka.crawley6572]

@WhyOWhy I can only think of three since Germany became a country.

[@patricka.crawley6572]

@@KingScorpio84 Complete failure.

[@348paul]

I was waiting for Jon Snow to say "Quite extraordinary - I have never seen so many calm people in one place " ;)

[@radicalrodriguez5912]

lol

[@geniusofmozart]

Robert Tombs is wrong here. He says that he opposes hyperglobalisation, yet one of the aims of the Brexiters is to go around the world doing free trade deals-Global Britain. Except these free trade deals would have fewer animal welfare protections and protections for consumers and the environment. Being in the EU does not make us more or less exposed to globalisation-either way, globalisation is happening and it has, on balance, been good for our country and for our economy. It creates winners and losers, though, and it’s up to our national government to compensate the losers (although the European Union, with its regional development funds, does a lot more than our national government would do).

[@veggie42]

The free trade deals don't work what do we have to actually sell? Why don't we have a circular economy which benefits each other?

[@geniusofmozart]

Collette Post We do export goods and services, first of all. Secondly, it’s not about how much we sell: even if we imported everything, free trade would be best because it means lower prices for consumers and greater efficiency in the world economy. Ultimately, we want the best businesses making our products-regardless of where they are located.

[@ParawhoreLoL]

While there are people that are blowing up concerts and marching on streets you cannot say globalism has worked

[@erickoop5442]

That was nearly a bar fight by Canadian standards

[@gagrin1565]

Steady now.

[@ZygimantasA]

This is how people should talk to each other!!!

[@complicatedmike]

I don't even know how to process that much calm. That was absolutely amazing!

[@sbxb8279]

Is it not very British, instead of finding solution, to look on whom the blame can be assigned? But I hope that there will be more discussion and attention on this kind of elite debates, rather than political nonsense talk. Where subject like devaluation of existing political scene in democratic word, will be address more often and the Brexit will catalyse this discussion, or rather need for revision of the political system which is not functioning at all in 21st century. Intellectuals, get down from yours Ivory Towers, the people, nations, the Europe need you. Channel 4 News; more please!

[@PhilipAlexanderHassialis]

Intellectuals can't do nothing when a mega globalised world is carved to glorify the hyper rich, the super succesfull (and on what axis of success?) and everyone tries to steal (not to gain!) a piece of the pie of attention, glory, wealth.

[@ktkee7161]

More intellectual debate, less Toby Young versus Owen Jones. I think we can all agree on that..

[@sbxb8279]

@@PhilipAlexanderHassialis current system is imploding, intellectuals do, is to bring new ideas, visions of future and most importantly true vision of present.

[@Huaimek861]

I would say to Michael Morpurgo , The EU is not Europe , neither is Europe the EU . I have opposed British EEC/EU membership since the beginning . I did a cultural exchange with a young Italian in 1959 that became a lifelong friendship with his family and many other Italian friends . In the 1960s I traveled extensively in Europe , was a fine art student at the academia Florence . I speak , read and write Italian fluently . I have lived in Italy a number of years and have friends from nearly every European country . My daughter is married to a German . I have never change my view that Britain does not belong in the EU . Some of my Italian friends say the EU has become Germany winning WWII 70 years later by peaceful means . Maastricht was the turning point , the EEC free market place of sovereign states was OK , but the politicizing of the EU has caused problems and frictions that will never go away . The once flourishing market is diminished by austerity because so many countries are in debt .

[@HungarianParagon]

He keeps referring to 'ordinary people', such a tired and futile trope is it not? Who was the million marchers in London not too long ago? The 'out of-touch elite'?

[@polashisu4641]

You realise there was a leave march on a similar scale?

[@valentintapata2268]

@@polashisu4641 similar scale? hahahahhahahha

[@roberthill7885]

And of course there was the biggest democratic exercise in British history. Wealthy Londoners do not an election majority make..

[@evilcucumber5933]

Yes... people who could take time off and afford to travel to London (or who already live there). Remainers should be honest and admit that their support is strongest among the upper middle class. It's not exactly a movement built upon voters with calloused hands.

[@boptah7489]

It was not a million it was between 350 - 400, 000. Get your facts straight remainer.

[@kayzphotography3678]

RESPECT! This is by far the most sane, logical and polite discussion on Brexit ... learned more from this short video than all the illogical 100s of hours of rants by the fear-mongering, so-called "Brexiteers" and "Remainers".

[@danielmcerlean6001]

I wish parliament displayed this behaviour!

[@staffankarinpappila3975]

Howcome the Nordic countries doing do well? It’s all up to each individual country

[@Spenner56]

Both charming gentlemen, though a pity that Michael Morpurgo confuses a continent (Europe) with a political project (the European Union).

[@emm_arr]

He doesn't. Don't post silly stuff!

[@Happyheretic2308]

@@emm_arr most certainly, he does.

[@emm_arr]

@@Happyheretic2308 He doesn't. Don't post silly stuff!

[@Happyheretic2308]

@@emm_arr he did, throughout the entire discussion. At least you could try to listen properly.

[@emm_arr]

@@Happyheretic2308 Nope. You are trying to legitimise a false claim about what 'Europe' means. 'At least you could try to listen properly.' I did.

[@danielross6956]

I really enjoyed this, and i would of liked the house of commons to adopt this kind of atmosphere.. but even if they did, i honestly don't believe they would of come to a solution

[@ChocoLater1]

Even House of Lords is more childish than this.

[@fabienmerteuil6226]

@Daniel Ross did these two come to a solution?

[@danielross6956]

@@fabienmerteuil6226 That is basically my point. They didn't. And i'm not convinced that if they had 2 years, they suddenly would. Compromise happens when two sides can find similarities in what they want. If there was a couple, and one person wanted to move out of an area because (insert reason). and the other person wanted to stay in because of (insert reason). There is no answer that leaves both sides happy. Then add the fact that the person who wants to leave the area has multiple personality disorder and cannot decide if they want to leave completely or live on the outskirts.. Welcome to BREXIT.

[@boptah7489]

there is no solution that the HoC's can come to. We demanded the vote to leave. not for the Hoc's to screw it up. Leaving on WTO terms is fine for starters.

[@rodrigoromero2166]

and why getting of the EU is going to solve current problems? perhaps because UK politicians won't have anymore a scapegoat for their failures?

[@Spenner56]

Another strong reason for leaving a political project whose poorly concieved single currency has led to massive youth unemployment and the decemation of old people's pensions. Why not have elected politicians who can be held to account for their failings?

[@robertcatesby4800]

This must be decided with a football match: Leave vs Remain, ref from Brasil. Wembley 30 April, kick-off 7pm.

[@bobrail733]

No ! Ask Howard Webbs agent sir purple nose can we use him 😂😂👺👺

[@ianc7866]

It would go down to penalties and then the losing side would request a rematch.

[@tonyclay8364]

Who would play centre forward ? ... no one wants to be centre anything in Parliament they all want to be in or out side left or right ... maybe Rugby or Cricket would be better .. Theresa May could be the hooker, Ooops sorry I didn't mean it to sound like that ... I was talking about her position ...Oooops done it again.

[@propagandalf877]

...and then there's a Wembley goal :-p

[@iamreg1965]

Lineker up front for remain sounds good.

[@weedote1]

A pleasure to watch. That behaviour both gentleman show towards each other is exactly, I learnt in school about, what was typically Britsh. Obviously times have changed over the years.

[@DannyWonder]

Michael Morpurgo thinks the EU is Europe, what a dope.

[@emm_arr]

"Michael Morpurgo thinks the EU is Europe" Not at all. That's a silly claim. ", what a dope." That's a silly claim in bad English. Come on. What you did there was a cheap and nasty smear attempt.

[@DannyWonder]

He literally conflates the 2 throughout the video.

[@emm_arr]

@@DannyWonder No, but you literally accuse him of that.

[@mikebarrett691]

Wonder if Tombs now reflects on his view that us leaving the EU will not effect much of the UK financially or Politically..

[@chelseapoet3664]

We're still European, just as we were before we joined the EEC. It's a continent, we're not about to float away.

[@JiminhoMrC]

It really does come down to wether you see the EU, or the individual countries themselves as the emobodyment of Europe

[@becomingfr33]

I voted leave by I hate the ugliness this debate has unleased. Almost all of my friends, family and connections voted remain and I would love to be able to just have a discussion about it without feeling I'm going to be boxed in and insulted in all kinds of ways.

[@emm_arr]

@me hee No. Those people are not "shill" people at all. You claiming they are is you being emotive and telling yourself lies - and *believing your own lies*. Tony Blair believed his own lies too. Dangerous.

[@downwiththatsortofthing624]

Seems the reason they get on, is because Michael is a bit wet... The Robert guy blames food banks on the EU, rather than failed domestic policies mainly implemented by the Tories (though New Labour was guilty of that too), when food banks and taxation and social security policy are matters delegated to individual member states, and nothing to do with the EU... We see how wet Robert is when Cathy advocates that remain is an 'elite' and Robert doesn't challenge that misnomer either... Its easy to get along if no one objects to falsehoods and irresponsible and misdirected blame games...

[@petertraudes106]

I totally agree, social politics are within the realm of national competence. The Netherlands has quite a different attitude towards this subject and its poverty problems dwarf by what you see in the United Kingdom.

[@ChocoLater1]

Anyone that does not suffer from confirmation bias knows that EU is not there to blame. Brexit is happening for wrong reasons and this is not the time to quit on EU. There may be right time to leave in the future but it is definitely not now.

[@greeneyeswideopen774]

Wealth distribution is a GLOBAL problem.. not just UK or Europe

[@Sr68720]

These conversations are lovely but they never get down the the real substance, so it pointless.

[@dcnd87]

The people voted to leave, I trust the people to get it right in the long run they have in the past. God bless the UK

[@emm_arr]

Mmm. But most people - especially the under 40s - want to be in the EU.

[@sociobiologist5141]

I bet Channel 4 was disappointed. Surprised Jon Snow didn't think the discussion was 'too white'.

[@Tsass0]

It is not Europe that is the problem, it is the economic system we are all under, which is Neoliberalizem, this is what makes poverty

[@frankschneider6156]

Tsass0 Sure, because the people in Venezuela are so much happier. Seriously, compare your standard of living with those of people 45 years ago, before the UK entered the EU or 100 years ago. Yeah you are surely living in deepest poverty and can't even afford a computer ... poor you. Hint: Just because time passed does not necessarily mean people are going to better of by default.

[@mrjones1696]

Ahhh so the problem is not whether or not remainers wish to stay within the EU, the problem is that remainers cannot differentiate between the EU and Europe. Going by the rhetoric put out by remainers that makes perfect sense and shows the frailties behind their thought process. This point is put to Michael clearly but still he cannot refrain from constantly referring to the EU as Europe incorrectly. He also seems to have a very odd view of what it means to lose a vote along with Channel 4 I must say, the "half" of society that should be disappointed should logically be the side that lost.

[@MrDragon1968]

You have fundamentally missed the point of this discussion. Slow hand clap.

[@ninob5155]

You hit the nail on the head with the "differentiation" part.

[@mrjones1696]

@@MrDragon1968 I got the point, I just didn't fall for it is all.

[@jamescullen6973]

Put the two polite men in a city centre for a year , and see what they say then ,

[@Avidcomp]

Michael Morpurgo may not have given up hope, but he would if he understood economics. (I'm more of an Austrian economist myself). The EU (not Europe) is about control/regulations. These are measures that stifle the one thing that I voted Brexit for which I have not heard a single person ever say. I voted to leave because I want a "sound currency". But 99% of people have no idea what that means, and how to achieve it. But staying in the EU will guarantee there will be no sound currency. Steve Baker is one of the few politicians that does understand what a sound currency is and what would be required to achieve it. Farage doesn't. Boris doesn't. Daniel Hanan possibly does.

[@Avidcomp]

@Khaleesi DrogoIn essence it would be a unit of trade that is determined through free markets, which we don't have politically, but we do have endless daily examples through history too the present day. A free market is voluntary trade... but can you spot what is voluntary? This is a big subject although simple in essence. My recommendation as a starting point is to the look at the history of money by working your way through Nail Ferguson's The Ascent of Money Here: (at the moment) kzbin.info/www/bejne/gHLFh5-qpt6GqKM Happy for you to write back when you've made it through. In my opinion it's very informative and entertaining, so if you're interested you won't find it hard work - in fact I hope you enjoy it as I did. Best premises Khaleesi

[@emm_arr]

Almost all of us are "ordinary" people.

[@helloweener2007]

They still let the Brexiters, yes maybe an ugly word but this are ugly people, let talk their nonsens. The prices for food went down in the last 50 years. In fact relatively to the income Germany belongs to the countries with the lowest food prices on the world, as a member of the EU. Yes, the EU is not doing enough for the common and poor people and industrial lobbies have still to much influence. But believing that the people were better of with a system that is campaigned by multi millionaires and billionaires is insane. Oh he wrotes a book about Brexit. Yes, there are people writing books about aliens and healing stones. That means nothing, only that he is very interested in this topic because he can sell more books. But at least it was a polite discussion, pointless but polite.

[@roberthill7885]

Quick question: did the mega banks fund the leave campaign or the Remain campaign?

[@leeenglish4363]

@@roberthill7885 please don't bother to confuse the situation these people can't think for themselves. I'm guessing that as I type this the original poster is now coming up with all the ways to call you a racist for making a very good point.

[@Jack-fs2im]

Halloweener Soros bankrolled fanatical remain Open Society with £14 thousand million pounds.why are you backing the rich City,The Lanliords,The CBI bosses and Cameron Osborne Heselfine and all the barons in the House of Lords,Shame on you

[@helloweener2007]

@@Jack-fs2im At least is Soros someone who supports civil rights movements in general and NGOs like Reporter Without Borders and he criticises the deregulation of the financial since the financial crisis. When got Arron Banks a philanthrope? With Brexit? ^^ People like him and other super rich are against the EU because they want the deregulation of the financial sector. The same kind of people that caused the financial crisis campaigned for Brexit.

[@Serfdomftw]

Citing Germany as to why the EU is a success? How inane. Manufacturing powers tend to create colonies and area of external influence, from which they can obtain markets for their excess production. This is seen with USA and China and their economic spheres, and at one point in the past the millitary/economic sphere of Russia. Germany's economic sphere is the evergrowing Europe, and this is why Europe is growing at a rate that is not befitting of it, and which does not benefit it. It is why Germany is pushing for ever closer union to the Turkish market, because of the size and potential of the Turkish market for German goods. The influenced markets do not benefit as they have their national industries burnt to the ground by the much larger state backed players. And if you think Germany is following the state aid rules to the letter and that those rules are fair competition for all members, well, then you haven't heard the news or the many German car manufacturers that always follow carbon emission regulations to the letter.

[@goharikjones7387]

UK likes Europe, Italy, France, Portugal, Spain, and Eastern Europe, Poland and so on, we DON'T want to stay in EU club, we want to be independent country, obey by our Laws, Not being told by EU Union.

[@emm_arr]

We? There is no way you are British with English like that! You're paid?

[@emm_arr]

@Reckoning Accept? Don't post such silly stuff!

[@chelseapoet3664]

No, we didn't commit to a family of nations. We voted to join an economic community, which became political union.

[@RoScFan]

Was this filmed in2016?

[@pinchermartyn3959]

Why isn't there someone shouting stop Brexit. That's usual for C4 News.

[@postscript67]

Michael Morpurgo doesn't look like he grew up with the EU. Was he born after 1973 (when Britain joined the EEC)? or whenever in the 1990s it started calling itself the EU?

[@iamreg1965]

Morpurgo was born in 1943, he was 30 when the UK joined the Common Market.

[@chadrips]

Admittedly a calm discussion, yet what was not taken onboard by the author Michael Morpurgo is that no matter what is his opinion he wants to stay in the EU, and the discussion moved on by the host was that one side will be bitterly disappointed. When will people realise that we had a referendum, we voted to leave. The remainers have had 3 years to deal with their disappointment, instead of trying to usurp the winning vote. Any discussion by a remainer looking to stay in the EU is simply undemocratic. The only discussion that should be available is what do we do to deal with our nations issues after we have left.

[@emm_arr]

"When will people realise that we had a referendum, we voted to leave." Everyone in that segment knew that full well. When will you stop pretending otherwise? Do you think it makes you sound savvy or silly?

[@emm_arr]

"Any discussion by a remainer looking to stay in the EU is simply undemocratic." No. That's not how democracies work, and you should know that. Do you think that makes you sound savvy or silly?

[@emm_arr]

"The only discussion that should be available is what do we do to deal with our nations issues after we have left." No. That;s ridiculous. I need to discuss all manner of things with all manner of people. So do you. So why even post what you posted? How can that possibly make sense?

[@fabienmerteuil6226]

This isn’t even a debate..where are the facts?..it’s all perception and very unconvincing.

[@augustosasso3455]

This is not a debate when all participants generally agree

[@claireb9127]

We will all still be European, but the Country will not be in the EU.

[@peterhoughton3770]

The earlier referendum was not to join the EU. It was to join a common market. That's a free trade agreement essentially. The European Union is another thing altogether, it's a political project. The British people never voted to hand over their legal rights to an unelected body in Brussels. That process occurred not by consent but my mission creep. Brexit at least pulls the handbrake on that process and reclaims the right of Britons to be tried in their own courts, be subject to their own laws, to have their taxes spent on their own services and to have the right to remove any authority above them... except perhaps the monarchy. Though if a majority of Britons wanted that, it would no doubt occur.

[@salvandorum]

"There be many Caesars, 'ere such another Julius. Britain is a world by itself, and we will nothing pay for wearing our own noses" - Shakespeare.

[@BedsitBob]

For an author, Michael Morpurgo isn't very smart. Either that, or he is intentionally conflating European with European Union.

[@chelseapoet3664]

My theory is that referring to the whole debate as being about 'Brexit' was a masterstroke, because exit was in the name. Likewise, Brexiteer sounds romantic, like buccaneer. I honestly think those two things together might have given the leave vote that extra 2% that led to the win.

[@ganderson87]

It's a shame that the manner of this discussion is a novelty within the broadcast debate for Brexit. I dare say there have been similar discussions in pubs, cafes and sitting rooms around the country, but the media have decided to promote sensational bickering in order to gain clicks and views. I feel it's divided the audience and made them numb to subtle complexities of the issue.

[@sofiashums7327]

An identity crisis ? Or crises --- simultaneously, at the personal, at the national/ UK, and European levels ?

[@moow950]

The U.K. is a European country. We all are Europeans. So strange to hear British people talk like they are outside of Europe.

[@emm_arr]

@me hee And nor does it mean posting abject silliness either. I came across you on a watch page the otrher day posting inacuracy like it was gospel. Why do you do this? It's silly.

[@renzhi1732]

It’s necessary to agree in order to disagree. Otherwise the discussion is empty.

[@tidbit1877]

Just wanted to point out that while 'Leave' has many different meanings and variations/levels; the Remain side is very clear and means only one thing, to Remain in the EU. Therefore, if you had a vote on what the British people wanted the Remain vote would be the largest voting block with 48% of the vote. And the Leave voters would be broken down into several tiny voting blocks each with their own idea of what kind of Brexit they would like. As evidenced by what has in fact happened in Parliament over the last few weeks. There is no majority of MPs that can agree a Brexit option, meanwhile the largest voting block is Remain and has 48% support; just a few MPs short of an outright majority.

[@hanskuijsten2380]

"... don't want to leave our European friend...". Problem is, after the last 3 years there aren't many European friend left to leave. Most are sick and tired of the whole "proces" and the constant blame-the-EU game.

[@pellythirteen5654]

Can't think of many europeans starting to hate the Brits for leaving the EU . In fact , some of us envy your bravery.

[@williammurray6921]

The finger of blame is clear. The people voted to leave plain and simple according to a referendum. The MPs promptly introduced all manner of exit “ deals” not mentioned before and these same people are now following their own agenda and ignoring the democratic vote. They will pay the price for this in due course and those calling for a second referendum is not on, when the result of the first one is being ignored. When there is a general election and manifestos set out , the people vote, when a government is then formed and the promises made in the manifesto are not kept, we cannot have another one the following week to vote in others till we are satisfied.

[@emm_arr]

WHy are you posting lies? We knew about exit arrangements before the vote. And if you didn't, that's your fault for being ignorant. Pay the price? You pay the price for being ignorant. Blame yourself and not others.

[@truthseeka2503]

Thank you Robert Tombs for pointing out the facts and reality so eloquently. Hopefully the other gentleman and other remainers will acknowledge the facts and accept that Britain needs to leave the EU with no dodgy deals.

[@iamreg1965]

No dodgy deals? Like the dodgy deals that flooded the Leave campaigns coffers with dirty foreign money?

[@MonkFishTV]

The eu and Europe are separate things.

[@dellahynes4565]

It is mistakenly emotive to persistently refer to the EU as Europe, it is not. We will always be part of Europe, as we have been for over a thousand years. The Brexit issue is about democracy, the British Constitution and people's right to self-determination by Rule of Law. The EU is not, and never has been the creator of European peace- NATO is. The EU no longer resembles the co-operative trading group that Britain joined in the 1970's (under false pretences by the incumbent Heath government, I would add). It is now about political power, which even the disgraced Blair has admitted. His lackey, Mandelson famously gloated, “We are now entering the post democratic age.” Politicians of course, absolutely love this -power and tax payers' money with no accountability. What's not for them to like?

[@samain11]

Nice guys, but Morpurgo comes across as naïve. Tombs is right, the EU is not Europe, it is a political project intentionally structured to get it's own way without troubling the electorates unduly.

[@mongolmcphee7791]

What absolute gents! Role models for us all.

[@bosoerjadi2838]

The way these two guests define the debatable question is mostly, I must say I observed it to be forcefully, detached from emotion. But for that they also moved it away to a completely other question: is the EU good for Europe or not? While the original question was: is the EU good for the UK (and should the UK thus leave the EU)? Detaching the emotions, thus not dealing with them, will imho yield no sustainable solutions, because the interpretation of the facts is based on emotions. E.g. A family with every member a serious alcoholic, except the daughter. She is seriously addicted to heroin. The family is trying to help her kick off her habit. She is trying to help them staying sober. But they also cause each other serious grief. The family gets violent when drunk, the daughter lies and robs them at night. They argue all the time what's worse: alcohol or heroin. Is the family good to the daughter? Is the daughter good to the family? Should they split up? If they were just a random group, the rational answer is that the family and the daughter should solve their addiction problems separate from each other. But that ignores that they are a family that loves each other, despite disapproving each others' flaws. Addict-friends of the daughter say: "They are not really your family. You do not belong with them. If they truly loved you, they would accept you as you are. They wouldn't force you to kick off by locking you up in the house. Besides, they're all alcoholics themselves and they hurt you when they're drunk. Leave them and live your own life." The drinking friends of the family say: "She's not your family anymore, she lies all the time, she robs your wallets when you sleep, she sells your valuable stuff when you're not paying attention, she destroys every bottle in the house. If she really loved you, she would accept that you like to drink. She's an addict herself, let her destroy herself if she wants to.." The family and the daughter silently think: "But we're still family.." The toxic divisiveness of the current brexit debate is the denial, at least the continuous attempts of undermining of the fact that the UK is a European country with emotional ties to Europe and of the fact that remainers and leavers are all citizens of the same country, equally patriotic in their own way, with equal rights.

[@joeybarnes01]

Yes, all very civilised and platonic but the issue of legitimacy was not raised. The question is about whether or not voting matters otherwise why bother? Whenever people vote someone loses up till now that was a an accepted fact and losers accepted this as a trade-off of living in a democracy. What we are witnessing is an over ruling of a democratic vote by a political elite which should have outraged everybody but instead we see that many of the 'losers' are complicit with this outrage and it is this outrage which has caused the division in our country and not Brexit.

[@AyebeeMk2]

all the books I have by morpurgo will now go in the bin. Brexit Forever.

[@ziechfred1693]

Balkans 90-91. Thanx Steve Bennon

[@viktorianas]

Schwarzenegger looks old and lost some muscle...

[@Enigmatized13]

Europe, Asia, America, Africa, Middle East, the concept of countries is silly anyway. People wave a flag and sing an "anthem" just because they live on a piece of a land on this floating sphere in the middle of the solar system.

[@Nezekeh]

..so you’re saying.....

[@socratease1432]

Brexit is an ugly word. A wealthy person coined it to a newspaper.

[@BedsitBob]

"This thing was created, was it not, for peace and prosperity?" It didn't do too well on the peace front, did it? As for prosperity, I imagine Greece, Portugal, Ireland, Spain and Cyprus, would have something to say about it.

[@BedsitBob]

Why does he object to being called a Remainer? That's exactly what he is:- Remainer - noun BRITISH a person in favour of the United Kingdom remaining in the European Union. Likewise, the other man is a Brexiteer:- Brexiteer - noun INFORMAL a person who is in favour of the United Kingdom withdrawing from the European Union.

[@glyntutt1586]

I wish people who are culturally European and Europhiles (as I am) stop confusing being a European with being a European Unionist. They are very different, I am the former NOT the latter.

[@nizviz]

Why is this even a discussion, we are European, nothing has changed there but we have left a political failing Union. The vote was cast and the decision was made. Some people just can't accept it.

[@brainlessoaf]

Clickbait much? THIS is "very British"? Come on, there's nowhere near enough pent-up frustration, irrational anger/fear and a desire to find a scapegoat to take all this out on! Ugh, so biased as always. /s

[@geertdecoster5301]

I'm proud Michael is proud to be one quarter Belgian

[@anupjani]

I wish wisdom of these 2 gentlemen prevail everywhere. Now I know what a gentleman looks like. These 2 lovely debaters. Regards from India.

[@dimitrisgikas8039]

He thought that food banks would be anywhere else but Britain.Tells you everything of British arrogance...At least some people's.

[@MatchesMalone1183]

Not that I'd ever praise Channel 4 as unbiased. You only have to look at Newman's interview with Jordan Peterson to see that's not the case. One thing I will say is that it's a shame Question Time didn't get more people on of Robert Tombs' calibre for the brexit side, as opposed to people like the bloke who owns Wetherspoons. Then again when QT is literally getting caught out for having woke plants in the crowd, balance is always going to be a pipe dream.

[@mutantdog.]

This basically reflects my own considerations on which "side" to take both at the time of the referendum and in the 3 years since. If only more of the public dialogue could have been as reasonable as this we might have come to find a better solution than the shambolic state we find ourselves in now.

[@adrianlloyd6403]

Yes ,it was a very civilised discussion, but you have to ask how do you reconcile their very different attitudes and opinions about the EU? One wants in,one wants out,can you be half in and half out?

[@janicedavid-rice5837]

If the increase in food banks in Europe was due to the EU I would have been for Brexit but it’s a worldwide problem. Please don’t blame the EU for everything.

[@casteretpollux]

The UK when in the EU was considerably more economically unequal than any Eurozone country. The poorest households in the UK are 20% poorer than in France or Germany but UK rich are richer. Can you explain that?

[@didierlemoine6771]

UK must end to free England&Wales inside its border !

[@mikedutch6113]

The EU does not work for ordinary people? 😂😂 you will find out give it 6 months to 2 years.

[@imdbist]

Somebody please tell that Michael fella that Britain is not leaving Europe, we are leaving the EU. The British Isles is not lifting anchor and sailing off to another continent.

[@gagrin1565]

Delightful.

[@maciejmanna9246]

Well said. Speaking from the other side, I think, UK will be missed in EU, as the last bastion of balanced politics (not counting last 2-3 years) among so-called old members of EU. Without UK, we are in danger of becoming Franco-Germanic "der Reich magnifique"...

[@lunes-1]

EU given a good spank to UK? Although is very British be polite

[@ireallydontthinkso]

When I clicked on and saw who the interviewer was....sorry can I even stomach the interview? The most unprofessional so called "journalist" on TV and there are a few.

[@ireallydontthinkso]

@HMQ your reply is nonsense.....grow a brain

[@stephenchappell7512]

This takes me back to the informed political debates of the 70's and 80's. In more recent years tabloid populism seems to have taken over and reason has taken a back seat.

[@chrisculpt57]

We did indeed join a family of nations, a trading block. But that is no longer the stated aim of the EU, where continued integration, and unification, is. That is what leaving was about, for better, or not.

[@sooneatyOrchids]

Why are these persons confusing personal love of Europe with European politics? Two completely different things.

[@Siegberg91]

They are interconnected without EU we would not be able to easly access the culture of each. Instead there would be the hate from old times people never have meet fighting over Ideologies. Some will say the nato created peace but the EU got us talking with each other not only through our head of staates and miltary but through people.

[@rogerlandin52]

most people in europe want you to leave i think.you think you better

[@adrianbaev5277]

So you’re saying we should arrange Brexit like the Lobsters?

[@AaronJCassidy]

6:20 For Britain, these things may be true, but what of Northern Ireland? What of the Good Friday Agreement? It seems as though this impasse has just been dropped entirely. How quick people are to try and convince others that Brexit will be a success, despite the serious damage to peace in Northern Ireland it will cause. The British colony in Ireland has been relatively stable since 1998, yet this decision taken by Britain, against the wishes of the people of Northern Ireland, will destroy that stability. The backstop was a good compromise, backed by every party in NI barring the DUP, as well as having the support of the people. The best of both worlds; within the UK _and_ the EU. But no, empire must have its day in the sun one last time, right? The foul stench of contempt is rife in these discussions.

[@emm_arr]

@me hee No. That's a myth doing the rounds amongst nationalists and white power types.

[@vampireducks1622]

The rise in use of food banks and general poverty and desperation has infinitely more to do with Tory austerity than it does the EU (and I say that as someone fairly sceptical about the EU). I found it a bit puzzling why Morpugo didn't point that out; it wouldn't have been impolite to offer a decent counterargument or rebuttal (and in this case a rather obvious one).

[@TheFelltimber]

They demonstrated an ability to see the others point of view rather than trenching themselves in to win at all costs. That is true communication. If its about winning, then it becomes a fight. They also didn't use any facts or figures as this was more about the human condition and not about economics which is a different conversation. Very interesting !

[@sasalijoon3506]

I travelled the world , i see Europe truly is the best place to live , then I see these so call Brexiteers are talking about Europe like such a bad place!! Which continent is richer or safer than Europe???!!!

[@fatfat1877]

The USA is greater.

[@hankthetank3065]

Australia! 👍

[@sasalijoon3506]

@@fatfat1877 USA is NOT A continent mate , also are you joking , USA is safe ? , have you ever travel USA ! , poor people everywhere, living in slums, no health protection . I personally hate to live in such a unbalanced country

[@sasalijoon3506]

@@hankthetank3065 is NOT A continent mate Australia is a very low population country, also if you travelled there you would know property prices suddenly rocket up 50% lately and also health care protection is a huge problem dispute of being relatively rich society!

[@fatfat1877]

@@sasalijoon3506 No it isnt but its still greater than the EU which I thought you were talking about since you mentioned brexiteers,. No health protection is fine because private business does it better anyway. As for poverty your comment seems to be vastly exaggerating it and the US is richer than the EU as well. Plus if you look at immigration statistics you will find more Europeans going to USA than the other way round(which is how its been for a long time)