The Mystery of the "Mums"

Anyone who owns even one Japanese war rifle has likely heard of "mums" or "chrysanthemums" and the fact that many or most of them were damaged or destroyed at the end of the war but the debate has long been who did the work -- was it the American occupation forces or the Japanese? The Redneck Preppy delves into the history of these little imperial symbols and who the likely culprits were.
The Redneck Preppy can also be found on Odysee: odysee.com/@Th...
#arisaka #type38 #mums

[@camdentrosclair2360]

I recently bought my Type 99 in perfect condition with original everything. I am so lucky to have found one.

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

I am very envious. I have been on a search for one like that for years. Congratulations!

[@davidr2975]

Steinel makes excellent 7.5 Japanese ammo, loaded good, very accurate, at least in my rifle.

[@PoppaC44]

These take 7.7

[@SLG-jt1rd]

I really love how interest in these guns has gone up so much in recent years. Researching them is always super fun.

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

Yeah, I don't know if its the "Band of Brothers Effect" or what, but I am happy appreciation for them has grown.

[@heyitsme2455]

No American would partake in removing enemy mums. Imagine the outcry being ordered to do so

[@finscreenname]

My farther in law brought one back in 1946. The mum looks to have a bit of a scuff but nothing like shown in the video. To be honest the gun dont look like it was ever fired. Has the bayonet and everything.

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

Nice, that would definitely be a heck of a prize.

[@g.alistar7798]

My father was on Mindinao, Philippines in August 1945, he returned with an model38 which I have today. The crisanthmum symbol has three filed lines, in parallel across the symbol, not and X. Dad was certain that the rifles he saw in the P.I., were defaced by the Japanese, not any Americans. He told me years ago, he looked at a couple hundred to find a non-defaced rifle….no joy. He took what he thought was a good one. I think Norma still provides ammo for the model 38. Great video!

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

Thanks mate and cool story about your father! Perhaps one day we'll have a more complete story about these defacings.

[@jason200912]

norma does not.

[@purpleguy5226]

i was fortunate to come across two rifles a type 38 and a type 99 both with their mums intact now the bad news some genius along the way thought it would be pretty hilarious to remove the entire magazine assembly out of both of them then take it a step further and remove the safety knob and firing pin out of the 99 (depression) fortunately parts for the 99 were readily available so i have them not so much for the 38 it still shoots mind you but it's limited to one shot i guess u can say i got the California compliant version lmao but still i love them and that led me to ur vid to learn more about these rifles

[@purpleguy5226]

UPDATE: in case anyone cared I managed to source parts for the 38 and 99 off Ebay and got them restored (no more California compliance) just a warning to any prospective fellow out their parts for these rifles are costly ive seen the floorplate for the 38 alone list for $105 USD and firing pins list for about $138 if u have these guns be sure to take care of them unless u want to spend the $ on fixing them

[@jason200912]

@@purpleguy5226 you should have just a sporterized junk one and transferred the parts over

[@kawashimaarisaka2682]

The small circles around MUM were not done by surrendered Japanese soldiers or GI. They belonged to Thai Contract that sold to Thailand, Only happened to some specific T38 rifles, These were done in the factory before they rolled out.

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

Interesting, given what I had read I was under the impression that they were rifles that were in service at one point, and then sold out of service and the marks applied at that point. Thanks for the info!

[@kawashimaarisaka2682]

@@TheRedneckPreppy the rifles you mentioned were with 1-3 larger circles in the center of the MUM. That indicates rifles once used in the military then issued as training rifles. These Thai contract rifles have total number around 10k and sold around 1940 when Japan tried to make Thailand as their allied. Most happened to Nagoya 26th and 27th series. Most of these rifles never went into wars and have good conditions. My first arisaka was a Nagoya 27th Thai contract, overall very good condition even with the matching dust cover. They used to be much cheaper than those rare found full mum and matching t38, but they are harder to find on the market nowadays.

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

@@kawashimaarisaka2682 Awesome, thanks for the information!

[@georgebanana314]

Great video on the history of the "Mums" of the Japanese rifle. I have two type 99 rifles, one with the Mum not defaced and one where it is grinded off. Thanks

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

Thank you very much, both for the kind words and for watching!

[@daredevil355]

I know this is a year old, but thanks for the video. I bought a 99 a couple weeks ago and hopefully get to pick it up tomorrow (WA laws suck). My 99 is in rough shape and the "mum" is ground off. I originally walked away from it, but it was at a price I could not refuse. Cant wait to decipher everything about the rifle.

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

It can be a very deep well to down, these Japanese rifles :-)

[@camdentrosclair2360]

Nice man, I recently bought one too, as a 19 year old I had to wait three weeks. My type 99 is in perfect condition with everything and the original sling. Got it off some old dude who was looking for a collector to give it a good home.

[@OldGrayCzechWolf]

Got lucky at my local gun shop about 10 years ago. Picked up a type 99 short rifle with intact "mum" and everything but the monopod. It even had the original sling attached. Cost me only $300 back then, the dealer did not understand what he had.

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

I doubt I could be more envious of anyone today than I am of you, ha ha

[@camdentrosclair2360]

I recently got one exactly like that but I had the monopod and aircraft sights. I got really lucky to get such a rare rifle

[@ScottyMac71]

I have one in my lap right now.. lol the "mum" is perfect.. but.. this one has a really really short barrel. No sling.. no place to attach a bayonet.. also, only the left side of the sight will move outward, and thats only for about a half an inch. I'm not familiar with these rifles. How can i tell what style it is? Or what caliber? It does NOT say on the rifle anywhere.

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

Sounds to me like you have a sporterized Arisaka...someone turned it into a hunting rifle at some point after it was brought back.

[@camdentrosclair2360]

Yeah sounds like someone messed with it.

[@jwhiskey242]

If the Japanese characters on top of the receiver are intact, that will tell you what the original caliber was. Jap rifles were often sporterized post war as they were dirt cheap. Some 6.5 rifles were converted to .257 Roberts. 7.7 rifles were often changed to 300 savage or barreled to 30-06. Japanese ammunition dried up rather quickly in the Post War US.

[@jwhiskey242]

This sacred stuff - a bunch of BS. All the mum meant was that it belonged to the Japanese Army. Rifles manufactured by the navy for navy use did not have the mum,, rifles taken out of army stocks for use in schools had the mum removed, rifles d-qued and rifles transferred or sold to foreign allies had no mum. The mum was almost universally defaced by de-mobbed Japanese soldiers working for the American occupation authorities. The mum was defaced to show that it was removed from army stocks, and more importantly, it had been TURNED IN TO OCCUPATION AUTHORITIES. Even though it is not commonly referenced, there were die-hards that resisted the American occupation, and lets face it, there were Japanese that were afraid they would be treated like their army treated the Chinese. So, in other words, if a defaced mum rifle showed up in civilian possession, the Americans would sure as hell want to know how that happened. My father served in the 112th RCT. When they arrived in Japan part of their duties was to oversee demobilization of a large number of Japanese units. When his outfit was sent back to Texas, he was transferred to an ordinance outfit , whose sole job was to see that Japanese weapons were turned in, and either demilled or destroyed outright. No Japanese was allowed to possess a firearm. If a GI wanted a firearm, all he had to do was go to a pile and take one away - no paperwork was needed until he wanted to take it home. My father sent home one 6.5 rifle, and two swords. When he came home, he brought home one t-14 pistol and one 7.7 rifle which he cut to fit in his duffle bag. There was no rule about taking home a rifle that had an intact mum.

[@jipsvlogandgaming380]

Whats the song in the intro Edit: found it, its the battle of tsushima march

[@saltydog4556]

Random find. Type 38 numbered in the 110k"s took the butt plate off and stamped 1905....its rough. But for a few hundy 😂

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

Nice, I never thought to take the butt plate off mine to nail down the date. And nice score!

[@BingoBangoBongo12345]

I have a type 2 paratrooper rifle with a mum as well as a type 38 long and a type 99 short with full mum's

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

That is an awesome little collection mate, I've never even seen paratroopers in person.

[@BingoBangoBongo12345]

@@TheRedneckPreppy sadly bubba polished off the bluing but its all matching and I got it for a steal

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

@@BingoBangoBongo12345 Bubbas ensure that only God and my mother are perfect :-)

[@bigmikeh5827]

Thanks for sharing. Have two 99s. Mid war and towards end but not a last ditch. Both mums defaced mine are small grind in middle. Not completely obliterated

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

Thanks for watching!

[@DonaldRussell-g9t]

My 7.7 type 99 still has it on it.

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

Nice, lucky you!

[@carlolgren3135]

Love the hat

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

If I ever get an Egyptian rifle, then you'll see something :-)

[@forbidden.shadow545]

got a type 38 “school rifle” with the arsenal mark stamped over the mum, and two zeros added before the serial number, and the “school mark” above the type 38 designation. know any of the story behind those maybe?

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

Can't say that I've heard anything about that. I'll do some digging and see if I can find anything.

[@forbidden.shadow545]

@@TheRedneckPreppy thanks, much appreciated! i have heard that a lot of them have dark and dirty bores, but this one has an actually pretty nice bore

[@jason200912]

same i also have a school rifle. Or it was a Japanese foreign legion rifle since it had 3 zeros or something like that. School rifles are known for being very clean and cared for since they would be used at universities

[@forbidden.shadow545]

@@jason200912 indeed, they were usually reblued at the factory before they were sent off to the universities

[@jwhiskey242]

@@jason200912 "Foreign Legion"? Where are you getting this information?

[@williamvaughn9870]

I have a 99 with mum in perfect condition but someone changed the wood stock.

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

Reproduction stock or bubba'ed? It *may* be possible to find an original stock -- places like Numrich sometimes has some crazy stuff occasionally. Wouldn't be cheap though.

[@camdentrosclair2360]

Having the mum itself is rare, as I have one as well, but someone messing with the stock is devious work. I was lucky enough to find one in perfect condition with everything that would be on it. I plan to shoot and hunt with it, but to never ruin its remarkable condition.

[@ぷらぐ]

Where’d you get your hat

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

I got that one so many years ago that I'm not quite sure, but I'd bet it was on eBay.

[@jackie5698]

My type 99 looks as if there never was one there at all there is no sign of wear or anything it literally looks as if it were made without one i wish it were still there and intact

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

And they aren't getting any easier to find!

[@Burningwhisky96]

I got a type 38 Thai contract rifle, it got the rings like 6:15 :)

[@TheRedneckPreppy]

Yeah, I've to the conclusion (or belief) that those rings are probably mostly on Thai contract rifles.

[@jason200912]

some say the japanese soldier would deface them. Another theory says it was japanese civillians that defaced them. one final theory was that the American postal army services defaced any remainders due to misunderstood MacArthur orders meant for the Japanese, one anecdote says he shipped 3 unissued factory new arisakas to himself in a crate and when he got home he found that 1 rifle was stolen and 2 had defaced mums.

[@jwhiskey242]

Postal authorities? Thats a complete BS story.