The Plutonic Themed Relationship - Parts #1 and #2 issues of control and fear

What the themes and issues associated with heavy negative Pluto contacts are in synastry and in the composite chart.

[@dnabart]

unless you have experienced a relationship like this, it won't make sense. But, if you have, it's a very good general overview of the dynamics at play. Thanks for breaking it down.

[@pradgadagkar8557]

Very good

[@pradgadagkar8557]

Pluto person is insecure for sure

[@felixbrantley577]

InstaBlaster...

[@edwinasabater6642]

Exactly what a plutonian relationship is My husband Pluto 2 degrees, sun 14 degrees, Mars 21 degrees in leo against my Venus 1 degree, sun 4 degrees in Aquarius, and square to my Ascendant 2 degrees scorpio. My husband 3 degrees cancer and Ascendant 8 degrees cancer with mercury in cancer/ mutual reception with moon in Virgo, he has my coruler Mars in cancer with my Saturn in his ascendant, the coruler of my ascendant is Pluto in Leo 10 degrees with his Pluto sun and Mars in Leo. Strong platonic relationship, but after going through he'll and facing my demons, being an Aquarian with Scorpio ascendant coruler is Pluto in Leo in the 10th house with my husband's planet he became my teacher in life as well as my own Mars coruler of my ascendant in cancer with Saturn in the same sign, his cancer ascendant with Venus and mercury in cancer mutual reception moon in Virgo, philosophical lesson in till death do as part relationship. While my Pluto in Leo fall in his 2nd house where his pluto, sun and Mars in leo, he learned his self worth. All kinds of challenges , the marriage vows required richer, poorer, illness and in health till death do us part, he retired in the Philippines since 2006, only comes back to the states 4 months out of a year until 2014, then once a year after that until 2020 when he got sick with bladder cancer, I asked him to come and be treated here in the states since 8/2020. We fought it together for a year, by 9/2021 he was given another lease in life, it was only stage 1, no radiation, nor chemotherapy, just surgical procedure. When he came back he told me that I'm showing a different girl he married before, he didn't think I will be happy without him, I told him I cannot stop living my life revolving around him. I also told him this marriage is one of our greatest challenge and accomplishment in our life. We were strong on our own but stronger together. Betrayal is one of our challenge, but by facing our own demons separately we were able to survived and transformed our relationship to what a soul mate should be. 52 years of it, we renewed our marriage vows on his birthday 8/7/2021 in the Sacred Heart Catholic church. I told my husband when you finish grade school, high school, and college degree, we always celebrate it by graduating ceremony, so is a marriage. After that we will be able to face the last chapter together which is death. So a Plutonian relationship is not bad at all if you both are willing to go through hell and be transformed into unconditional love, accepting the flaws and virtues of each other, you cannot find perfection on earth, but with love forgiveness and acceptance, you will find your soulmate. What had God joined together let no man put asunder. Thank the Lord.

[@vanessatx5819]

@@pradgadagkar8557 i had pluto conjunct persephone in my synastry with someone. i saw how it played it for me and what it transformed but from the beginning he was the more deceptive one. he was the pluto person. i was completely and totally forward and honest and talked about forming relationships from a good head on my shoulders. i had insecurities too but i handled them a lot differently because i have been purposely working on myself to where i can now openly say certain truths freely and it doesnt bother me. or if it does bother me i know its better to say it and face it he's not there yet spiritually or emotionally. his pluto is in his own 12th house and also mine. i could see where he was unsure and insecure about some things. he started to open up and told me "i can feel myself opening up to you" and eventually made excuses for why he had to close down the connection. he was insecure and so he partially blamed me. not a great experience but i know i deserve better

[@ziggystardust6418]

So one of them is like "I don't want you to grow up. I know you will abandon me." While the other is like "I will break your legs so you can't walk out" Perfectly describes our relationship

[@JewelMayberry]

+leon jo that was very wise. You are on to something there.

[@ziggystardust6418]

Truth In Aspect Astrology/ Jewel Mayberry 😊 A ❤ for Jewel. But seriously that man REALLY disturbs me. He has some issues. Both of us are quite plutonic but I have a Scorpio Mars so I am more used to it. I am concerned, it truly is going to be quite a ride.

[@joybott9024]

There's so much focus on the lower expression of Pluto here. Higher expression Pluto is all about transformation and growth. There's strong attachment, yes, but it fuels the struggle that leads to figurative death and rebirth. Depth psychology, recognizing core wounds, revealing our shadow, learning to love the dark, hurting parts of ourselves and others so they can be unburdened, and holding space for intense pain are all higher expression Pluto themes. It's not all possessiveness and control.

[@JewelMayberry]

Conflict is the essence of drama. Seeking intensity and the resulting drama is seeking conflict and mistaking it for love.

[@joybott9024]

@@JewelMayberry Sometimes life just IS intense and dramatic though. That's not necessarily a bad thing. I was in a very mutually Plutonian relationship that ruined my life and totally destroyed my concept of who I am and how the world works. But you know what? It needed to happen in order to release my old paradigms and heal core wounds. It wasthe most painful experience of my life, but it was also the most rewarding. Their relationship was as supportive as it was excruciating. I'm relieved to have it behind me, but I'm not demonizing myself nor him. Change hurts, but there's a time and place for it, and we wouldn't have been drawn to each other if we didn't both need it. We both changed into totally different people though our relationship. The relationship was the chrysalis that allowed us both to transform from caterpillars into butterflies. We're both much better off for it. And neither of us was "the bad guy". In short, there are higher and lower expressions of every placement. This video describes a low to moderately low expression of Pluto's expression. Higher expressions are also possible. :)

[@joybott9024]

And neither of us were controlling or possessive. There were most certainly some unhealthy behaviors in the relationship, but we addressed them and moved forward. And then new issues would come up, and we'd address them and move forward. It was on and off, and each time we came together, it was a new version of each of us. We healed so many layers of fear based conditioning by triggering each other's core wounds. And once something was addressed, it was behind us. We were finally able to move on when we learned everything we needed to learn from each other. I became a new person at least a dozen times through the process. It *was* meant to be. And now it's done. We leveled each other up beyond what either of us could have done on our own. I don't even know who I am anymore, but I'm free on a level and never dreamed possible. I've developed inner safety and security to move forward in life. I'm so grateful for the experience!

[@desertwaters_808]

@@joybott9024 yes, this is what I've experienced almost identically...! I think Jewel's video gets the point across well and honestly it's probably rare for the higher expression scenario to occur. Pluto does not play! But I'm grateful bc as you said, total transformative process.

[@sterling1386]

@@joybott9024 Plz don't make excuses for the abuses/intensity of a plutonian relationship. I'm an Astrologer/psychic of 50+ yrs, plus much personal experience re: this topic...eighth house pluto as well.

[@ayeshawindsong990]

Passing Pluto's Passion~ You taught me well under your spell how not to dwell in the underworld nothing there guilt and despair illusion and tricks done with it. Goodbye Pluto

[@redpiper9836]

Ayesha Windsong That is a good poem

[@sziami09]

Wow so true!!

[@astralpurpose1344]

Beautiful!

[@Sonic_sorceress]

yees girl yes! self power

[@Laptopbabe]

Fantastic❤

[@vivx266]

You saved a lot of lives with this video, and you are better than many psychologists

[@Riya-ct5zk]

I have a lot of Pluto in my chart (Scorpio ascendent, mars Scorpio, Pluto & Lilith in Scorpio with Pluto conj. my asc). I find myself as the Pluto person in a lot of relationships and it's been a long road to learning not to dismiss someone just because they need some freedom and space for growth on their own. So it's just about finding the right Pluto person who will be mature enough and willing to look inward at themselves! We're not all crazy!! :)

[@yingjiang952]

Is it true? Or what she described has no good results for sure for this Dynamic?

[@Ang.143]

That is the mission but it’s so hard because of fear of loss. I’m maturing and getting better with this aspect of myself

[@MareRS357]

Lessons we are here to learn.

[@carlinetorweihe4246]

Pluto doesn't dismiss once the claws are in there. They are paused and waiting for the next attack. "Until death do us part".

[@paparudaruda656]

Riya can I just say that Scorpio Mars (and Scorpio moon but this is not as bad as Mars) is so bad for others that I just want to shout “.run”! Way too controling, manipulative, unscrupulous, biggest cheaters and good liars ...can transform a lie into a truth and sell it! By the way, Harvey Weinstein has a Scorpio Mars...

[@animalames78]

The Pluto-themed relationships are very hard to end! They are exhausting, exhaustion sets in and it has to end...but the two people never really forget it each other....they keep coming back into each others lives...and the pull is strong....but the relationship never works. I had a moon square Pluto synastry relationship...I was the moon. My ex (Pluto) still tries to come back into my life all the time, it is hard because I really loved him but he was so controlling, suffocating, dominate, putting me down etc. And sometimes I get sucked back into message conversations with him...but it's never about me, it is always about what he wants in the end....but I fall for his charms all the time...and it hurts me everytime...it destroys me...like Pluto does...even messaging hurts me. I have to cut him off....but it's like a limpet clinging to a rock (him the limpet). It's been 10 years since we were together...we haven always been in contact, we didn't talk for 6 years. I now why I attracted him...because I have natal Pluto in my 12th house...so I tend to attract dominate and aggressive people, I deny my own power like Persephonie, I'm a loner and quite lonely so this Pluto person (ex) came into my life, charmed me, swept me off my feet and now it's hard to get rid of him because part of me loves the attention from him...but then after a very short while it becomes too much. I've become very aggressive myself as a result of being pushed over by him so much, my boundaries are too high and I'm mistrustful and angry...I'm finding my own Pluto.

[@nicoledesmond1506]

Amelia. I have had 2 relationships like this. The pull is so magnetic. I also have natal Pluto in the 12. Many contacts from their Pluto to my planets. My spiritual awakening happened during exiting one and hopping into the other shortly thereafter. Relationships like these are beyond intense. I had to hit rock bottom to build myself back up, tons of working on self and shadow work. Looking into astrology, tarot, intuitive classes all in an effort to figure out what the hell was happening. Everyone seems to deem it as narcissist / empath... but now we know it’s Plutonian in nature. Self love, learning, understanding your worth is not handed out from someone outside yourself... ever. I rarely comment, but our stories are so similar, I felt compelled❤️

[@bestforyouall]

I have a weird situation with someone I can’t walk away from. His sun falls in my 8th house, his moon is conjunct my pluto, his moon is conjunct my mercury, his pluto is conjunct my mercury, his mercury falls in my 8th house, his venus falls in my 8th house but my venus sextile his pluto and my pluto trines his venus. Even jupiter and neptune is involved in the 8th house though I don’t remember which one has it, him or me. I don’t want to let him go and I don’t even function with anyone else, like sexual disfunction. I hear his voice and that’s enough to turn me on but I can’t work with anyone else if I want. It is very complex and watching this video made me aware of the energies. We both end up looking for each other but I want him more that he wants me. I can totally see myself trying to be his source of everything and when he chooses other ppl it drives me nuts. I have seen videos of this aspect before but I never really understood them until now. Swear I love him and all I want to do is protect him. I get defensive towards ppl that harm him. This is so confusing for me. I swear I don’t want to harm him in anyway and I do have fear of abandonment. Each time we take a break is very damaging for me. Not sure for him. Thanks for sharing your story.

[@desertwaters_808]

Thank you all for sharing these stories, I relate to them...! My Pluto is on top of his sun, his Pluto is opposite my sun, his Pluto near my ascendant AND our composite has Venus square Pluto 😭 We're BOTH the Pluto person but I feel it's safe to say he is the dominant one. I'm getting to the end of the story (Persephone remembers who she is and finds her power again) and it's definitely getting to the point where I feel we may not be able to work it out this lifetime. I will never forget him, as he has acted as my spiritual catalyst. I'm grateful but I have to move on. I have been told "he is the truth but he is not happiness" and I'm ready to choose happiness for myself, despite how much I love the truth of what we've created. Best to all 🖤

[@gigiemma3192]

Pf I have a similar one to this one. He is pluto and I am moon but it's an opposition, orb 4.40. I felt high whenever I was with him. Like nothing else mattered but us. But my pluto squares his ascendant in tight orb so we probably switch in this pluto roll. My Mars and Mercury both fall in his 8th house so that adds to the intensity. We're both pretty plutonic I'd say eventhough we don't have plutonic sun's or risings. I'm Aries he's a Capricorn. But he has his pluto conj his Venus natally and I have my Pluto opposite my Moon natally, so we're both used to Pluto's intensity. Anyway, we tried to end it maturely, as the prideful Cardinal Signs we are, but ofcourse that couldn't happen. He started dating this girl 2 weeks after we ended it and it was eating me up inside. He didn't know this since we we're in no contact, but then months after, he cheated on her with me. He asked me if I wanted to be in a relationship with him again but I refused. We got in a fight because everything came out and nothing is fine to say the least. I have never felt so strongly about staying away from a person yet I've never felt like I wanted to be with someone so badly. I fucking hate this.

[@aquariusstar7248]

I had a pluto square moon relationship and this sounds like my story. I was fortunate enough to hv enough data on previous relationships and observed "friendly" dynamics with another in between to see an unhealthy pattern that was off. This led me to studying codependency addiction and narcissism relationship dynamics. After my research and thorough overview of all of the pieces, i basically called him out as a sociopath and blocked him. This may not be the case, but i knew something wasnt right. He has pluto square sun with pluto in 5th house. And i hv pluto opp venus. So we both prob played both parts. As enticing the connection was, i chose to "die" alone rather than him be the Death of me. Pluto square moon is a very dangerous connect. Yr moon is yr emotional security and stability. Dont let anyone f* with that. Protect yrself.

[@dunyazade]

It feels like you know this, yourself, deeply, like you lived it. I loved the vid. Thank you.

[@mcbrion1951]

Or she has a psychology background, and synthesizes the two. That's how I do it, and Dr. Liz Greene, the Jungian analyst who is also an astrologer, does something similar.

[@Mandy3141]

@@mcbrion1951 The best method to approach such disciplines.

[@Bunny4Sitting]

The point of these relationships is like the Phoenix, who must burn to ashes and experience rebirth as the Firebird. So it's not really about leaving, it's about becoming something better than you used to be.

[@JewelMayberry]

+Ta If you are choosing struggle and pain then you are not rising above anything. You are plunging head first into a chosen mess and asking to experience more of the same. Rising above something is to distance yourself from it. Often we can remain in a difficult relationship but only after we have done our personal work and this will require that both people join in. This willingness is often not the case in Plutonic relationships. It’s possible to fix something that is a struggle but you have to ask yourself if it’s worth it and if it’s realistic.

[@monsieurchris1154]

I literally died, and came back more humble, more loving, more on the healing part of the Scorpio than the controlling part, but deep down I wish I could get my ex back

[@spiritofmatter1881]

Very true. You don't leave them, you marry yourself

[@Sonic_sorceress]

arent you the genius? so fuckin true! u made the point, i think and feel the same

[@edwinasabater6642]

The Pluto person Sun, Mars, Pluto in Leo is in my 10th house. He was the one who taught me how to gain the Pluto strength by going through the test and betrayal, hurting, and determination to make myself stronger, resourceful and a whole person and when I confronted him after distancing myself from the relationship, he came back I am a different woman. I could stand toe to toe with him now, and he was so surprised. And the best part of it is I did everything myself, no one can nor tough challenges in the world can defeat me for I learned the truth about myself, the weakness and the strength, they are all part of me. I can be myself and not lose my identity. It was productive, positive, and I can deal with anybody even my enemy equally. I learned to face any challenges head on, for I know I will able to succeed.

[@paulocampos9341]

Anyone who lived this know that this is like hell at the same time that is big oppotunity to make amends with your demons.

[@LegendaryMel]

You described toxic relationships so well, it’s insane!

[@reemalqasem.3462]

Thank alot jewel ! I love it 👍🏼

[@Ineverwantedahandle]

This is basically describing a narcissistic co/dependent relationship. Sam Vankins has videos that describe the mechanics behind the plutonic relationship. I've found his work to be instrumental towards recovery. Neptune played a huge role in my Plutonic relationships, I feel they go in tandem. The illusions (hook/bait) fade, you realize you are stuck in a power play dynamic, you don't even particularly enjoy Pluto as a person. Then eventually you earn your power back, as you are learning to integrate the shadow elements that Pluto drudged out.

[@custommade4463]

Yes!

[@lotusphoenix8]

Well said!

[@chelseamiracle128]

I actually discovered Sam Vaknin first and discovered I was in a narcissistic relationship. Then - I discovered astrology. I realized the two matched. It was absolutely mind-blowing. I'm still mind-blown by it. It has made me spiritual beyond belief.

[@ladynottingham89]

The worst part about these is that you are so addicted to each other it's hard to quit, even if it's self destructive. The sex is amazing, the emotional connection is insane, but the same way this person will take you to depths of suffering and pain just as deep as the ecstasy you will feel.

[@daffy0383]

Wow I was listening to every single word of that video and now, I feel so sad. Persephone can feel so ashamed if she played along not knowing that she is persephone. I mean what an eye opener. thank you, I know now what I must do next and mentally prepare myself to do what must be done and run from my current situation.

[@1Skorpia]

this struck close to home. I was in a horrible platonic relationship. this guy tried making up lies so other guys don't want me, threats,stalking,extreme verbal abuse. I knew he was crazy lol! I had to get a ppo on him to get my point across. I still can't believe I survived that trauma without being on some kind of pill to cope😐 but I grew stronger and my self esteem skyrocketed when I knew I can handle it. great vid👍💗

[@1Skorpia]

plutonic- not platonic ..

[@aimforlifenow]

Are you the Pluto or planet person?

[@Ineverwantedahandle]

Wow, both of us could either be Persephone or Pluto at any given time. How totally confusing. I see myself in both, as the provocateur and as the subject of the power play.

[@JewelMayberry]

+M L You have some very impressive objectivity here. I suspect you have a lot of self awareness as a result of this Aspect.

[@bestforyouall]

Same here. Does the aspect is mutual or not? Mine is.

[@gladiatorinsweats]

don't miss the point of these relationships. if you experienced one, there should be a lesson you needed to learn. ♡

[@lotusphoenix8]

Absolutely! Else, you WILL attract another one to you!

[@vanessatx5819]

idk that there was so much a lesson with me and this guy as it was motivation. his pluto was on top of my mars in the 12th house. i became motivated to do certain things and at some point i realized one of pluto's insecurity's. he was scared i'd surpass him and thats exactly what i did. he talked so much stuff about betterment this and spiritual that and all these aquarian themes but it was all talk. i was the one that was much more honest with myself and he knew one day i'd abandon him for the "Betterment" he kept talking about

[@felixthecatIII]

very very informative video. i have plutonic relationships. i am drawn to people who has the tendency to kill me (metaphorically). but each time i come out like a phoenix from the ashes. i end up becoming a better person than i was prior to meeting them. i have pluto conjunct saturn and southnode in my 7th house. and yes i have a hard time letting go. very jealous too. and i have been purging and clearing fears and insecurities for years now. and i am now aware of my covert and overt manipulations too. its a constant surrender and letting go to be honest.

[@missyschuerman]

felixthecatIII be careful. they say, if you keep knocking on the devils door one day someone will answer.

[@carlinetorweihe4246]

The buck stops somewhere. Once the money, job, everything is gone it gets harder to make another "re-start".

[@krinka1458]

@@missyschuerman she literally can't not deal with this, it's natal in her chart. What exactly do you expect

[@Kingsdaughter10.4]

This is so on point. Happy that I’m no longer wanted for his hell.

[@introrizing4539]

My every relationship. Its hard to be pluto person. Ive also been Persephony, but for pluto its harder because he wants to love, but he really cant. The relationship is all about setting bounderies and fighting our demons. Persephony realizes that they loved but havent been truly loved by Pluto. Very hurtfull dynamic.

[@MsLaBajo]

Tara Djokic I am the Venus person in a Pluto square Venus synastry aspect. I feel very much like the silly bend over backwards for your love Persephone with zero self-control and who cannot have her needs met at all... but yet I'm the stalker... as far as I know... I'm the one with the endless texting looking for crumbs of love and affection and wanting to casually drop by his work... etc. I feel totally desperate and at the mercy of this Pluto. Ugh. He never demonstrated any jealousy or stalker behavior, quite the opposite. It's as if he couldn't care less about my existence. 🙄 Games.

[@stelasenna9927]

That is so true!! When you are the Pluto person you can get so hurt but when that obsession with that one person vanishes it really does and the other person starts to miss all the things Pluto would do for her.

[@annaanna8079]

What do you mean? You as the Pluto person didnt feel love at all? What aspect was this? To moon or Venus? My Venus is opposite his Pluto (0,5 orb) his moon is squaring my Pluto (4 orbs) I feel strongly Pulled to HIM. I hate this. More so bc a relationship is not possible for Some other reasons.

[@introrizing4539]

@@annaanna8079 They felt love, however they would dry out the planet person and then they would hate them when the whole pain period is over. Then it seems that they feel disgust of some kind. I have uranus square venus so I would love my partner to give me space and to accept me as I am. My ex has pluto and mars square hit sun and he was going through venus square pluto transit. Later, I had a bf that has venus opp pluto natal. I must say that it is hard to be with these people even as a friend since they are hot and cold at the same time but you know that they would coldly hate and cut you off if you even think about something stupid. This is how I perceive this dynamic.

[@introrizing4539]

@@stelasenna9927 omg yes

[@karimeayoub4957]

This series helped me so much during the plutonic relationships I've experienced, I'm grateful from the bottom of my soul to you Jewel

[@loismatthews6222]

This sounds like EVERY relationship I have ever had! Great stuff thanks.

[@luvtocmoon]

You are an amazing. Astrologer!!!!!

[@hannahdga]

I can relate to this video so much. It’s very hard to heal after this type of relationship. It’s like you’ve exhausted everything you had and given all the love you had to the Pluto person as some type of offering or sacrifice. After breaking up with a person with whom I had this type of relationship with, I feel like I need time alone to recognize myself, because I was so out of touch with myself, everything was about ~him, everything revolving around him. And I changed SO MUCH because of the abusive scenarios (and matured from them) but I didn’t even realize it. And now I need to heal through falling in love with the « new » person I am now...

[@aaya77]

OMG, you are telling my 20 years long "love" story, which I describe as pure hell. Thank you for your videos. Much love

[@zombieDRAGONsunset]

Wow i wish i watched this sooner. You just described my whole 6 year relationship with my ex. Hes a scorpio sun and moon with pluto conjunct both. Im a leo cancer moon with uranus and neptune opposite my moon and venus square pluto. I literally would go through periods of sadness because i knew it wasnt what i wanted but yet i would go right back. I eventually like you said, snapped and started acting like my old self. He got mad and that just affirmed stuff. I eventually had to lie and say we were just going on a break, so we could each move away from eachother. He went nuts started drinking and calling me saying hes going to kill himself, if i didnt do what he said. I never gave in no matter what he said. I finally brokeup with him and he snapped said he didnt care anymore so i stopped talking to him. Less than 2 weeks later he has a new chic who is doing *everything* for him and whos never met me and thinks im a horrible person. I had kids with him and it got abusive so more so reason to leave. His new gf is pregnant and they haven't even been together a year. Im sooo happy i left, im doing everything he hated :p thank you for this video, i thought i was crazy!

[@georginaceri]

This is so empowering! Thank you, Jewel! When a seed is buried underground, she can't help but grow, when her season comes.

[@andromeda1903]

so basically it's just an abusive relationship!!!! as you described this i kept remembering an old abusive relationship and it's all the same thing!!! persephone doesn't leave because of stockholm syndrome!! thank you for your amazing videos!!!!

[@Elwen-xs7gr]

Actually, Persephone loves Hades, but Hades are loyal to him. He even allow her to visit her every 6 months. Well, compared to other Greek Gods, Hades is the one loyal.

[@suzdwyer4577]

I have had several relationships like this and most of my relationships have had pluto themes. Its taken a very long time to learn to let go and to not obsess in relationships, nor use sexual and seductive powers rather than true friendship and intimacy. 7th house ruled by scorpio, with moon there. I just ended a relationship that had patterns of high intensity and his fears of abandonment (and two years ago I dated a scorpio and was very infatuated and led to a very big spiritual awakening, the best and hardest thing I ever went through.) I'm finally ready for a smooth, harmonious, slow, steady love based on friendship rather than this type of intensity which doesn't support growth and free expression

[@fivedee5D]

Lady - you have described soooooooooooooooooo accurately the long history relationship I just left for good. Especially @ 32:14 with Pluto and his accusatory "ah-Ha! I knew it" followed by accusations of inattention, disloyalty, neglect and whatever other negative personality adjective you can think of. Ugh damn - a lot of those "AhHa!" accusatory moments I lived. This was the exact dynamic of a relationship I just removed myself from everything with the guilt trip manipulation. The relationship spanned long through our 20's, took hiatus until now our 40's when he found me on Facebook, and now its gone again. Of course, all my fault. He was a Sagittarius with Venus, Mars & Jupiter all in Scorpio in his natal chart and a friend once told me in synastry we also shared a Moon Conjunct Pluto. Now in our 40's, I honestly didn't imagine the pattern to continue and I was more seasoned then I was in our 20's when every guilt trip worked and would just make me break down and cry and the pattern of a silent remorseful waltz we'd do to try and be "forgiven" for my offenses. This time 'round, I believed in our mature ages, that my loyalty and dedication would speak for itself. I did recognize the manipulative guilt trip tactics faster at this age during our years spent apart during repetitious introspective self-analysis) that I'd finally recognized how I was almost pre-conditioned to be easily manipulated by guilt trips when I'd spend time with my Mother. A Scorpio. During the time we'd spent apart, I had a son, eventually I became a single mother. Its hard enough to overcompensate in that role. And to feel the instinctive tug of obligation to make your child happy. My son? But of course, a Scorpio. So I've had a lot of lessons that have served me. Each relationship significant in my life. Each pulled out a different shape of love from me. But each felt/feels (because my son is only a teenager) very heavy in guilt-trip manipulative tactics. Doesn't make it any easier than I am Sun/Moon Virgo - the sign of 'service' so yes, I definitely have examined my hair-trigger instinct to jump into action in every direction. He always returns after some distance of time has passed. This time, I'm hoping my words have cut the cord because I feel nothing but disdain for the betrayal. That Aquarius Full Moon of endings the other day fell into my 7th House of Relationships. He reached out by text, I sent some cutting words back and reaping what he'd sewn. And of course, then its in my imagination because he said he didn't send me any text. Hopefully my last text has severed the cord - I'm envisioning that scene where Dorothy throws water on the witch at the end, and all her guards are stunned as they watch her melt. One bends down to poke at her deflated cloak with smoke coming out of it. "Hail to Me, the wicked witch is dead!" - Love, Persephone.

[@mariboquita32]

OMG!!!! I'm listening to this and I'm in tears. I'm heartbroken!!!! I've been in this hell for over 30 years & I manage to climb out to then be snatched back in!!!! Me Taurus / him Scorpio.... His Pluto opposing my Venus & His Pluto Sextil my Ascendant, his moon square my Pluto & his Jupiter opposing my Pluto. I've left him so many times but my heart has betrayed my better judgement & allowed him back. Currently It's been about a year since I last left him but my heart still aches for him... I've even have dreams of losing him forever and wake up heartbroken, scared of losing him and crying uncontrollably. We have two boys who I feel he has also punished because he can't fully control me.

[@user-trrwvfk]

mariboquita32 In my case is the opposite, his Venus oposite my Pluto and his Pluto square my Moon. Wow that seems to be so intense, I better run away while I can

[@mcbrion1951]

Excellent video, using the analogy of Pluto and Persephone being kidnapped and contained/controlled as a way of explaining how Pluto manifests in psychological ways.

[@souldreams333]

this is the dynamic of my marriage. my husband is Pluto. very obsessive, jealous, controlling. I'm always walking on eggshells concerning him. OMG this is so he and I!

[@IsraelTorrellas]

my first love, I ''knew'' he hurt me for so long and so many years... I stood there by him while he dated basically everyone else, and me in between or even while... lol... but then while taking ayahuasca, I had this strange thought that I had hurt him first... way before he could ever hurt me... and to myself I knew this to be true, but explaning it to others, they told me my mind had somehow tricked me into thinking I hurt him instead of him hurting me... but now I know... not that I didn't before, but this confirms to me that I indeed, hurt him before he could ever hurt me... and I realized this sometime back that I thought I was the more spiritually evolved of the two, but after sometime I realized that, that was wrong...(twittles thumbs)

[@aynos629]

sometimes the hurt is not even done by us, but by our ancestors, and we pay the consequences for love to our family, misunderstood love. I may be mistaken but the real beef of Puto was with Persephone's mother, Persephone was just the unknowing victim. anyway, I am still in process, so take my opinions with a pinch of salt, but it goes along those lines, the main trouble being to resolve this, is the fact that we can fall in victim blaming, self-blame, and that is very damaging and not constructive for anybody

[@desertwaters_808]

In mine, we're both the Pluto person and I've dealt with the "is it him or is it me?" thing and that shit will switch right up on you...! I've had those similar realizations too 🖤

[@kelphiuspolluxeldanimus6426]

This always made sense to the "Runner" "Chaser" bullshit being thrown around. It's simply Plutonian issues. The Chaser is Pluto. The runner is the one freaked out being transformed by the other. Simple.

[@rausandraiuliana7718]

All your videos are awesome but this one was sooo eye opening. Thanks, I really admire the way you pass this info to us, u re making so much sense and explain it in a way that makes me wait excited for whatever u re going to post next.

[@PeachyKins]

what a great video! This is by far some of the most helpful info I have ever learned! THANK YOU SO MUCH!!! ☺

[@AbbyZera]

I’m glad I saw this video before pursuing a Plutonic relationship. I have a Composite 8th house stellium in Taurus opposite Pluto with a guy I’ve been thinking about a lot. I’m not sure if the obsession is mutual, but I’m ready to cut the attachment cord and continue with solitude.

[@lexlondino4096]

Sounds exactly like a narcissistic relationship. My “Pluto person” is also a grandiose/malignant narcissist. Their Pluto is 2 degrees away from my Ascendant in Scorpio. Fun times. Our relationship ended in chaos and destruction. I’m slowly emerging from the fog of grief and confusion and discovering this as an opportunity for transformation. But it is the most painful thing I have ever gone through!!!!

[@whatam_i]

You deserve an award for this presentation. Brilliant. Thank you 🏆

[@Drell90]

Very transforming video. The video helped me realize why my past relationship ended badly. I'm glad I watched this video. Now I know how to deal with a current relationship that I'm in that has the Pluto synastry aspects. Much blessings, you're awesome!

[@Digizella]

I can never get enough of Jewel's videos. Her interpretations, vision is so appealing, i have to keep watching her over and over again. A very Plutonic person overe here ;-)

[@Elmirjaful]

Most fantastic astrology video ever, with great insights what actually plays out in this dynamic! Thank you!

[@No.ThatPrettyGirl]

OMG. I think u just SAVED MY LIFE! I was soooo considering going back to my ex - after analyzing our natal charts for the past few days - we literally mirror one another - I mean literally down to I’d say 95% Fifteen on/off years of narcissistic abuse - I finally WOKE UP a few months ago. I’m FLABBERGASTED. SPEECHLESS. Really - and that’s unusual for me ♐️♐️♊️ WOW 😳 THANK YOU 🙏

[@JewelMayberry]

+Euphoric Concepts Stay strong!! 💓

[@nikibrowne]

This was uploaded on your birthday that year! :) how wonderful! It really proves how much of a gift you have. I don't think I'd ever find this answer to my question anywhere else on KZbin & yet here it is! I feel so 🥹 blessed to know this about pluto & persephone

[@RM-ti8nf]

Amazingly accurate and devastating. Even saying Persephone can breathe again- that's exactly what it's like. I'm astounded by the accuracy of this description of Plutonic relationships, speaking as someone who's Venus is inconjunct my man's Pluto.

[@JewelMayberry]

+Robyn Moody I just did a video on that one. That's a toughie.

[@AirFire18]

I feel these are toxic Pluto relationships. But, if both people are mature or loving....they don’t feed these dark desires. And only express these feelings in love making. They can transform together and if too people have Pluto qualities, they can grow.

[@PenelopeRyder]

This is so beautifully expressed thank you so much.

[@aquariusstar7248]

I followed this storyline from beginning to the end and wrote out each part and compared to the parts of my personal stories. This was very therapeutic! Thank you so much!🙏🏽❤❤❤

[@allisawright7042]

Thank you. You just shed light on my previous relationship in such an empowering way. Cosmic Hugs

[@michellewelsh3898]

Jewel, this is good. thank you. I am often the plutonic person. Sometimes I am the persephone person. I'm gonna review your video to see how I can rise above feeling "entitled" etc. Truly this is a great video & you have helped me to see myself and my relationships. wow. excellent.

[@willemhendrikvangreunen5276]

Well... This changes things abit... Best I let go of my fairytale and get with life

[@Angelica-go3qn]

can't wait for you to talk about Nessus and Dejanira ;) in synastry and in the natal love your videos like always!

[@nicole9387]

You've told such a beautiful intricate story. Pluto helps develope the mind mature. Be aware it's quite an addictive charm.

[@scruzb]

Our relationship went from 500 km per hour all the way down until it sinks in a place of stagnation. We had sex pretty quickly; it was intense. But since we met, I felt that dark aura and blockage. It's like my intuition was telling me not to engage in this relationship. I didn't hear myself, and drama started to happen immediately. We started to realize we're both very Neptunian and tend to idealize others. We moved together pretty quickly and then realized we are not very compatible in some lifestyle aspects. Our apartment literally flooded, we had a crazy neighbor, a lot of confusion, and small problems that tend to scale to big issues. We got so distracted by the amount of problems that, at some point, we stopped having sex. We lost that connection, and it feels awkward to have sex again. The attraction is gone; it has been a year since the last time. Frustrations build up every day, and resentment grows. We are currently in a Visa process, so we still remain together. It's strange because we care for each other, we love each other in some way. It hurts so much to be aware that we have to let go. I don't think we're meant to be. I want both to be happy and heal. I feel my partner has codependence issues. I was unconsciously jumping from one relationship to another one my whole life, but this is the last time I do that. I would take as much time as necessary and hear myself to move in the right direction. I also need time for myself. This relationship feels like a prison for both of us. We definitely have incredible communication, and we have worked on several dark issues from our past. It has been like a long psychology session you can't escape. I fantasize about the moment this ends. I wish it would be easier just to cut everything; feelings are so intense. I am glad we met at a moment in life when we were both already working on our inner evolution, so we have handled everything in the best way we can. No violence or anything, but we definitely had some psychological deep transformation. I believe in destiny, and this relationship feels meant to exist, feels like a soul contract, very karmic. I'll leave placements down if someone is interested. In the Composite: Sun, Mercury, Venus, Mars and Chiron in the 8th house of Cancer, Pluto conjunct ascendent In Scorpio, Pluto Inconjunct Moon, Saturn conjunct North node exact. In Synastry: My Mercury, Venus, Mars and Jupiter are in her 8th, her Venus is in my 8th. Both Saturns conjunct both nodes. In Natal: She has the Moon in the 8th squaring Pluto, I have Pluto square mars, we both plutonian by nature.

[@TurpuiTozay_health]

My first relationship was like this I was the Pluto person and I didn’t know what came over me but they relationship taught me so much about myself

[@jessicadurkin6652]

Excellent excellent video - many thanks!

[@arkieologist]

Thanks you for making these specific themed relationship videos... So very helpful. 💎🙌💗 Appreciate you, Jewel!! All time FAVE aspects expert! 😃

[@MyCosmicFlow]

You hit the nail on the head!! LOVE IT!!

[@nilanjanag34343]

Wow wow wow i was in a plutonic relationship for 3 years and i resonated with your interpretation in each and every moment. I had pluto square sun, moon, venus, ascendent, saturn in the 1st house in composite chart. While watching this video i relived those moments. It was hard to watch but i still did it. Now i know why those things happened. Thank u

[@paulapaulo8178]

my last relationship was like this. I have Pluto conj Moon in scorpio and he had Venus in scorpio. Our composite had Pluto moon as well. Was so magnetic, he left his job and moved country do live with me and ended in destruction of both of us.... one crazy year of relationship. I learned so much watching this now. thanks

[@Elwen-xs7gr]

I never knew Pluto effect would be crazy, to the point someone quit job just to be with his love=_=

[@LifeinGlow]

Thank you Jewel! 🌿 Always helpful to hear your stories about dynamics of archetypal dance.

[@sziami09]

"The avoidance of blame becomes her motivator in the relationship." Bingo

[@luvtocmoon]

This was absolutely awesome !!!!!'

[@chobochobobulo893]

Wonderful as always, thx you Jewel 💚

[@afroblaster1899]

Amazing stuff here.

[@bestforyouall]

This is a great video. Remembered me of my relationship with the father of my sun. I wish I knew this before.

[@annamagdalenalindeque8396]

This is the truly the most accurate description of my past. It took me 25 years to discover and turn

[@alnsubuga]

40:13-40:25 perfectly sums up the lesson I needed to learn. Thank you! P.S. Jess Chaos Witch recommended your channel. So glad that she did.

[@farmgirl8310]

Wow! Incredible information.

[@Moonchild-xc4qx]

I have been struggling to understand & define what I have been experiencing for the past 5yrs of my life. And you just described everything to a T. Thank you

[@aynos629]

Hi, I think you are dead on, on abusive relationships, pluto style. And I admire you totally for empowering yourself and other people, including myself. I am very interested in looking at what make people fall for this kind of relationship, which you do mention and I think is important to reflect on, because at the end of the day we cant change others and we can only change ourselves. Another important point for me in the ladder of healing ourselves is to, after FULLY expressing ourselves and our pain and grief, to let go of blame, at the end of the day a game cannot be played if one of the participants leave. I think, one of the keys is in being ourselves, warts and all and to avoid projecting an idealized image, so we know what we are getting into and see with clarity, although admittedly, one of the people involved, usually falls unwittingly into the game and is prey to the "expertise" of the other person. The only good thing I can say about this kind of relationship is that what doesnt kill us makes us stronger, unfortunately some people do get killed. And maybe accept that our love for the Pluto person was real and so was theirs, tainted in both cases, but real. I have been both, and meanwhile the Persephone person copes with the most damage, the Pluto person copes with the most guilt (if they can accept it), and their only way to recovery is a really honest appreciation of the damage they have done and the consequences of their actions for both of them, because a negative pluto is self-destructing, and to repair the damage, if not with the hurt person with the world, and just to say that the Persephone person usually falls into manipulation, and that is important to have awareness of, because, although it is a survival method, is equally damaging. Responsibility for our own wellbeing , acceptance of the past, and gratitude for the lessons learnt are for me the way out into the next, more healing and powerful ring of the spiral, and possibly mourning for the sadness and tragedy that these relationships in their negative face are, and to celebrate the lessons learnt, accepting that we are all human and we came into this earth at the mercy of bigger forces, that sometimes are bigger than us, and this is not excuse to avoid personal responsibility

[@loismatthews6222]

This was a difficult concept to communicate. You did a beautiful job. My pea brain had to watch it a couple times but I got it. Thanks

[@spiritofmatter1881]

That was beautiful. I experienced something of some similar qualities with my therapist. When he saw he can't get me to be reactive he was gone. Still working on that energetic separation thought. I have plutonic stuff myself (which was why I came to therapy).

[@peterklein4349]

I had my pluto in synastry conjunct her northnode, uranus, venus, lilith but I never recognised me being the tyrant. It was more the other way round. And after I left her, I had the stockholmsyndrome... I've learned a lot since then, most of all selflove and mindfullness. And today I hear you analyzing the plutonic relationship, and at once I realized: her pluto was square my sun! . And now I can totally understand what went on. Thank you!

[@lisavansant961]

Thank you honey this was an excellent video and it helped me enormously I mean you're out of a platonic relationship and your reasoning makes sense to me thank you again you are a blessing.

[@aw157454]

Would a plutonic relationship kind of relate to the empath/narcissist relationship?

[@NamiBurger]

similarly yes xD

[@sziami09]

Yes

[@empress_highpriestess3307]

No no no God no. Can we please pick new buzz words to feel superior when we wish to contrast ourselves further ?

[@bestforyouall]

Yes, very much

[@JJ-bw6sq]

NO, IT IS COMPLETLY DIFFRENT

[@user-to6ik3ui6c]

The way she makes her entrances in beginning of the video are classic. lol Love Jewel!

[@catherineo2134]

Pluto & Persephone with Parallels to CINDERELLA and The Sisti-Uglers. So accurate down to the last detail. All those Scorpio Pluto influenced MUST Watch as well as any possible future Persephone influenced types too - both influences can gain much from this video. Thank you. Share!

[@haywoodjablomi2526]

In an EXTREMELY plutonic situationship at the moment Me: Sagittarius with sun conjunct Pluto, Pluto in the 8th house Scorpio, and Pluto trine ascendant Her: Scorpio with Mars and Pluto in the 8th house, and Mars conjunct Pluto Synastry aspects My Pluto conjunct her Mars My Pluto conjunct her Neptune My Pluto conjunct her Venus She has her Mars and Pluto in my 8th house. Honestly this is the most intense relationship I have ever had with anyone! So much tension between the two of us that it’s crazy. Our interactions are always deep and have so much depth. Honestly we’re obsessed with each other 😆 and not in a good way, but it’s that plutonic magnetism that just makes you so damn obsessive and attracted. There definitely are power struggles, sometimes I have the upper hand, sometimes she has the upper hand. I would say it’s 50/50. Either she’s in control or I am, but it fluctuates. I’ve told her multiple times that she scares me 😆 (which is kinda true not gonna lie) but holy cow is this attraction between us so consistently intense, interesting, obsessive and mutual. We’re both heavily heavily plutonic, so this relationship is one that none of us will probably ever just “get over” without time. Oh well, I’m definitely here for the ride 😆

[@Fleabag-vf3mi]

Wonder if y’all still are cool lol

[@mrbatdance]

Great video and interpretation.Looks like i am hanging on the bandwagon of yet another Venus square Pluto relationship.Let's see where the waters take me this time.~Pisces Sun,Moon,Venus,Mercury.

[@lavinder11]

Idk... I've had plutonian relationships and actually prefer them. Whenever I see the comments regarding Pluto, I wonder if they're real because this has never been my experience.

[@bkwes]

Thank you Jewel. Totally accurate. Just got out of a Plutonic relationship -- I believe I was the Pluto, although our composite had Pluto contacts on every level. Brought up my issues with attachment style and fear, insecurity, etc -- learned a big lesson here. Hurts like hell that they are gone, but I don't know how I could have learned this lesson otherwise. I feel like I ruined a special relationship but such is life. We can't always know until we go through it.

[@SabrinaDacosta]

OMG!! This is so creepy..I am the pluto person!!!! I need help!!!

[@JewelMayberry]

+Sabrina Dacosta Good thing you are the female in the relationship or it could get really nasty. You probably have heavy Pluto in your own birth chart. You may get a lot out of joining my Facebook astrology teaching group called "Astrology Education for Intuitives by Seth, Jewel and Samantha." We are a teaching group as well as a support group. Good luck to you.

[@SabrinaDacosta]

.

[@SabrinaDacosta]

Jewel Mayberry Yes I have Pluto in the 8th House. I also have my Sun and Mars in the 8th house. I also have a Scorpio Moon in the midheaven

[@SabrinaDacosta]

Jewel Mayberry I just requested to join your group

[@JewelMayberry]

+Sabrina Dacosta Oh my. That is a ton of intensity! Be careful with that laser focus of your's, my friend.

[@nightingale8336]

👏 👏 👏 You have described my 20yr relationship so eloquently !! Thank You.. this helps alot!! 4 years free now .. rediscovering myself. 😅

[@nightingale8336]

I have spent 60% of the last 4yrs sleeping and recovering .. the exhaustion & energy drain for 20 years was MASSIVE !!!

[@elenacartagena1224]

So right, great video!

[@miriamevans5200]

Thank you. That explains a lot.

[@goldenaura949]

I love your videos!

[@monsieurchris1154]

I realized I was Scorpio rising after my first relationship break up, I was the Pluto person, I'm very plutonian with a lot of Moon and Saturn too. Obsessive, suspicious and controlling, I feel like a piece of shit lol, but I have so much compassion for pluto persons at the same time, this whole thing comes from deep insecurities and abandonnement issues. Hades was the least favored son of his mother

[@IDontHaveTheAnswers]

Try to be kind to yourself. Pluto in this situation has just as much rising from the ashes to do as the other. You've already leaped passed the first hurdle of realizing these are characteristics of yours and now you can actively work to grow and improve. I've been both and let me tell you the ride was no fun, but I came out alive, more self aware, compassionate and stronger than ever. I had no choice, but to tackle my abandonment issues, they spiral into really unhealthy behavior ☹️ anyway, don't feel like shit about yourself! Just continue to be super conscious of the effects you have on your partner and also the motivation/intention behind your actions, the manipulation can be unconsciously strong 😩Blessings to you on your journey

[@jillianbrown8667]

@@IDontHaveTheAnswers excellent Thats maturity 👌

[@SJH2024]

Wow... I found all that fascinating and at the same time and very close to the truth for me. I was with a man whose Pluto and Venus was conjunct to my Ascendant (Libra). That was a long time ago, almost 20 years... although the memories are still very vivid. Anyway - its on-wards and upwards for me. Love all the videos. :) I love the you have many different looks.

[@marwagenaar]

We are both pluto and persephone, it's not as clear

[@monsieurchris1154]

trueeeee but not consciously

[@JJ-bw6sq]

YESSS!

[@misterthales6301]

Maybe the best explanation I have seen for Pluto in my 8th house

[@michellesera5249]

Thanks this is my exact 15 years relationship. And the Plutonian till today reject and never dare to look into his own darkness, all blames are place onto me. Well, today I am way done with this hell person. What this plutonic relationship has let me learnt: 1) Humans could have a messed up mind to define Fear (attachement, possessiveness, insecure, etc) as Love. 2) I am not able to forgive myself for being so dumb and naive to think that People here are as loving.

[@sid7547]

Awesome explanation!

[@bcupcake]

I confess I have been both in different relationships :S the persephone and the pluto. I think when you're the pluto person it's easier to transform the relationship into something that can be really good. But it takes pluto balls to want to do it... and all the love in the universe.

[@jillianbrown8667]

Excellent mature

[@ravenbelote1801]

Thank you!

[@sziami09]

You are a genius Jewel. Been there with a plutonic guy. His pluto conj my sun and squared my mars + he was scorpio. I cannot tell you the control and guilt he could cause....it is unbeliavable how precisely you describe it. I was very afraid of him by the end..gradually more and more. He was very jealous and possessive, i couldnt even say 'hello' to a male colleague on the street cos he went nuts. I believed i would never able to finish it. It started like a fairy tale and became a literal hell. Watch out every one cos there are signs in the beginning but we prefer not to see them. The most dangerous relationships. Now if i see someone whose pluto heavily attacks my planets i stop seeing the guy. Thanks pluto it was enough for a life!

[@Therealnushat]

This was so so good

[@user-js1gw1sx9i]

So proud of all of those who were under illusion,delusion I went thru this with my mom And dad! I took care of both of Them before they died! Jessica I understand how you Feel! I feel freedom now! I had To unlearn every dam lie they told me,I see all those control Issues! Thank God I didn't do It to my daughters!

[@drkc740]

Wow...her Pluto was 7degrees from my moon....you explain everything that I went thru ... astrology is amazing.