The Poppy War - Historical & VERY Grimdark Fantasy

Welcome to Discovery December! We're looking at fantasy books NOT set in the common European setting. This is the Poppy War, set in a fantasy China!
This is a brilliant, award winning trilogy with strong ties to real history. Though it can be pretty grimdark at times too
We look at the story outline, morally grey characters, and the big magic in these books. And we do a deep dive into the real history behind these events.
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[@ina7238]

God, I thank the universe that people like you exist because you have no idea how much you help people mentally every day. I know this comment has little to do with the video and the topic at hand, but you have no idea how much it HELPS me seeing you comment on women's work and treat it like something serious, not to be mocked. I have seen this in your other videos too, even if you don't like the book itself (which is perfectly fine, I don't like every book I read) you're never misogynistic, never attribute the bad writing/plot/etc to the author simply being female. THANK YOU. Thank you so much, because you'll never know how much this means to me, how much it helps me.

[@cronkthebookguy]

Thank you for saying this! This means a lot to me. ❤ I hate seeing youtubers, particularly males, bashing on female authors and books for women. I despise it so much. Books are for everyone! Your comment is genuinely inspiring. It means my message is getting across and I'm being a influence for good. That's just what I need to hear.

[@marconieadventures5734]

I have a college degree in history, a minor in ancient civilization specifically China and Egypt and none of my courses went into detail about China’s war with Japan and Americas horrible decision at the end of it (as you’ve mentioned). I learned about this event from my in laws who are Chinese and from Hong Kong. I am floored that America and most countries do not teach the full depth of events. Especially if they have made questionable choices in those historical events. As always I loved your video and your historical deep dive. 💛

[@AmandaInEly]

Thank you for the historical context, that makes all tbe difference. Its generals and politicians who invent atrocities, not authors so much.

[@JesseRad]

What a wonderfully thorough review of this series. I haven't read it yet, but it just went WAY UP on the reading list. I love your positivity on your channel.

[@Callyth]

Poppy War has finally started moving up my to-read list, so this was a very timely video! Might have actually bumped it up even further. Anyway, super stoked to see you covering The Daevabad Trilogy next as it's one of my favourite fantasy series! Can't wait :)

[@NateReadsDiversely]

Thank you for explaining the history behind the series!!

[@sydneyomo7382]

I’ve read R.F Kuang’s Babel book and I absolutely loved it. I’ve been thinking about this series but I wasn’t sure till now. Thank you!

[@pimvanerven881]

I found this series last year, I had never heard of it and thought it was gonna be YA for the first part. When it removed its cloak and became grimdark I was shocked but also loved it. I then finished the series in a matter of weeks. Great story!!!

[@thankscovey]

definitely adding this to my 'series-to-read' list. i really appreciate these videos!

[@hectatereads105]

So excited to see another of your videos! I’m a little nervous about Poppy War, but will at least try it. Thanks for the historical background

[@Paulovlyra]

This channel is my favourite source of entertainment currently. Thank you

[@paulafox9482]

I'm so excited to try this! Thanks for the recommendation-sounds right up my street ☺️

[@williams7031]

Thank you for this. I appreciate your work here.

[@user-lv5zd5yx5y]

What an amazing review, thank you!

[@Erinn_Nicole]

Thank you! very excited to read this one. I have all of them on my shelf and have almost started them for months. and YAY Daveabad Trilogy! my favorite series that I read this year!!!

[@margarethaines9310]

Your perspective and research adds much to my reading experience. The first book swept me away with its world and its characters. Your review here encourages me to un-click the "pause" button and continue the series - thanks!

[@Brp220]

Yay I enjoyed this video and your analysis (especially because I have been procrastinating book 3 of this series for months). Maybe this will get me to pick it up.

[@kylebuonomo2557]

I found your channel yesterday while I was procrastinating for my finals, love your in depth thoughts and I have the poppy war trilogy just chillin on my shelf, I’ve heard amazing things and I just finished the 6th book of Red Rising on Tuesday and I’ve been eager for some more pain and violence 😈🦦

[@cronkthebookguy]

'Eager for pain and violence'! Love that! 😁 and yes, you've come to the right place. Poppy war has similar vibes and themes to red rising. Though...possibly more violence?? 🫢

[@cronkthebookguy]

Oh and good luck on your finals, my friend! Kick their butts! 👏

[@kylebuonomo2557]

@@cronkthebookguy thank you :D I finished my last one of the semester a couple of hours ago and FINALLY got to start reading The Sword of Kaigen which I chose to read after lightbringer but poppy war and the First Law series were both a few of the other options I was choosing between on my shelf 🙃 probably going to go into the poppy war when I’m done after watching this :)

[@kylebuonomo2557]

@@cronkthebookguy I used to read when I was a kid but once I got to like real school age and was told to read things, I just lost interest in reading for the last like 10 years. But now I’m in college and wanted to have something to do inbetween classes other than my phone and that’s when I discovered Red Rising, I read the first book in like 4 days and was immediately back into the idea of reading :) Since then I’ve read all 6 red rising books that are out, the first mistborn book, bought quite a few other series, and am now like 70 pages further into Sword of Kaigen than I was this morning :D Also I appreciate the effort and care you clearly put into your videos it’s refreshing and it feels very honest which I find very helpful for book reviews 👍🦦

[@sn00k3_9]

im curious. what did you think of kaigen. I just finished it and Its good but I dont get all the hype

[@stickclan6415]

I had no intention of reading this book until I watched this video. Your explanation settled my concerns. Thank you for such a well researched review on this series.

[@jacobswift]

I was watching your discworld video and thought, “dang this guy should get a microphone,” Good shit my man, I love the production quality growth

[@cronkthebookguy]

Haha!!! Thanks buddy! 😊 yeah my first couple of videos are a bit scary, but figured it out as I went along. Still more to learn though!

[@agentswarley]

Your videos are fantastic! I enjoy them so much. As for the series - I still think about *that* chapter in book 1, it was so horrific, even more so when you look up the real event and realise it was even worse. For me, the series was too dark, depressing and violent, I actually preferred everything up until we left the school setting. I also thought that the plot and the writing weren’t that strong, I gave all three books three stars. However, I do find that the books are pretty consistent, are interesting in themes and concept and the ending to me was consistent and well done.

[@Alkemisti]

_The Poppy War_ is the first novel (not the first book though) I have listened to as an audiobook. I generally do not like audiobooks because my ADD throws my mind into other spheres too easily, and with an audiobook it is bothersome to always try to find the 'page' where my attention dropped. But because of its simple prose, _The Poppy War_ was easy to understand, and with audio I require that, for I am a non-Anglophone. (When reading text, the prose may be as purple as you can paint it. I love English poetry.) I have not read the sequals. It was too grim and dark for me at the time. I might reconsider reading them. The first book is still clear in my mind. PS. There's a good video on Japanese war crimes on the _Hello Future Me_ channel. I recommend that.

[@epicanime009]

Finding it hilarious you suggest pushing through the magic " school" part cause that was ironically the part of the video that sold me. Love magic training/ camps/ school sections of stories, cool way to introduce characters and world in a safeish enviroment before shit gets real.

[@rafaelsousa2633]

Thanks for another great video. A friend read this series and he was very put off by how unlikeable the main character is. He also said he didn't like the dialogues. It was not the best of lights, but your video put in another perspective. Have you read the Dandelion Dynasty? I've heard only good things about it and it might do an interesting video.

[@WillJMeakin]

If you want a good semi-fictitious sci-fi story based on Unit 731 I'd recommend the short story "The Man Who Ended History: A Documentary" by Ken Liu, in the compilation of his short stories The Paper Menagerie.

[@mattbarker1840]

I loved this series so much. That’s all I wanted to say.

[@ashtingreene8725]

I picked up The Rape of Nanking by Iris Chang because of this series. Both, i think, are so important. I loved seeing a female villain arc that was actually believable. That is so rare and this was done so well. Worth the read if you have the stomach for it

[@RubALamp]

8:40 would you say this is similar to what happened in Red Rising? Because the books that follow (Golden Son and so on) are much more than what the first book suggests.

[@cronkthebookguy]

Yes, to an extent. Its not as extreme a difference as in red rising. But definitely a shift in tone and style.

[@RubALamp]

@@cronkthebookguy Awesome. I've been wanting to check out these books for a while. Thank you for your videos!

[@thepacksurvives71]

I avoided the Poppy War for years because I thought it was YA. Imagine my surprise when I finally picked up the books myself.

[@Nijenor]

This channel keeps weirdly matching up with my reading. Have been reading Burning God for the last month. Love the book and the series, this book takes me a bit longer than I'd expected but think that's mostly related to timing on my part. I remember having to take a few months break after the first before I felt the urge to read the second book but I was reading it during Russia's invasion so that will probably have played a role in that too.

[@cronkthebookguy]

Oh wow! Didn't mean to predict what you're reading. That is pretty cool though. :) Also that is fair! I hit pause on a book recently cause it talked about police violence against people of colour. It was overwhelming and depressing! It's good to read that stuff and be aware of what's going on, but it can be painful too. Sometimes, you gotta go slow.

[@arinad2]

Yet again my tbr grows longer due to your recs😂

[@BooksRebound]

You gotta tackle Dandelion Dynasty!

[@cronkthebookguy]

Thanks for the suggestion! I just looked it up, and it seems really interesting! I've added it to my list.

[@BooksRebound]

@@cronkthebookguy It's a super compelling series but it took me 2 tries to get into book 1. However plenty of my favorite books are ones that took me multiple attempts. Like Fifth Season, Baru Cormorant, Gnomon, etc The series is based on Chinese history as well and covers some very well known events. Ive heard the series described as the first of a nee Silkpunk genre. Book one doesn't have much tech, however the later books come up with a lot of very interesting mechanical devices that are really ingenious. The first book is about the fall of the corrupt awful emperor Mapidere and the riss of two best friends who fight to change the country before eventually diverging as they have different vision of the future. There's a conflict between our MC Kuni Garu's Dandelion Dynasty and his frenemy Mata Xindu's Chrysanthemum Throne. The first book got some criticism for its women, however he steps things up in subsequent books and the women become my fav characters. Especially Thera! Hope you enjoy it. Also have you read the Sun Eater books? They're incredible. Daniel Green is FINALLY covering them and they're so worth picking up. The quick pitch is The Name of the Wind + Dune + Red Rising. Hadrian Marlowe is a hero to some, villain to others. He's the man who burned every last alien Cielcin out of the dark sea between stars. He extinguished a sun, killing the Cielcin while also instantly snuffing out the lives of billions of humans living in the process. Great series

[@albertorozco3652]

Could you make a review of The name of the wing? Please

[@sweney7103]

I thought everything was great but it needed more. I think some details were left out that really dragged it down for me. Also the pacing at times is jumpy tying into the story missing things. Notably, Chaghan's arc leaves out a ton of things I think should have been said. The trifecta's ending also felt extremely underwhelming and rushed. I loved everything else about this series, however. Definitely a worthwhile read if you like grimdark historical(ish) fantasy.

[@Paulovlyra]

17:43 I laughed so hard here 😂😂😂😂

[@MsAdaCat]

Thank you for the historical context. I didn't know any of that 😲 So horrible 😭

[@cronkthebookguy]

I know. :( I researched so much, and had to censor most of it for the video. 😭

[@CodyMitchell-sr6lp]

What camera do you use to film videos?

[@cronkthebookguy]

Don't laugh, but I use my phone. 😅 Samsung Galaxy S21 FE 5G You actually don't need a super powerful camera for youtube. The videos only get uploaded in 1080p anyway. So a 4K or 8K camera is overkill! You have to lower the graphics of the video anyway, so why pay more? If you want to film something more visually involved, by all means get a better camera. But for talking? A HD camera will do fine.

[@telescopicfish]

you should make a video called dark fantasy vs grim dark fantasy

[@shawnnbits]

I didn't know fantasy was allowed to be outside of Europe. Tv has had me fooled the last...80 years

[@cronkthebookguy]

That's interesting, cause I was literally just watching Kung Fu Panda. 😁 But you're right. The hard majority of fantasy is European, and that's limiting. There's so many more stories to tell.

[@SaduranYT]

If anyone speaks spanish, the podcast "La Tortulia" has some excellent episodes about the historical poppy wars in China

[@SkaterErik333]

I trust you The Book Guy 👍

[@a.l.reedsbooks]

Dad jokes on point! 😅

[@Sevoran117]

I very much enjoyed the trilogy. I did want more lore on the gods and a little more fights with SHAMAN POWERS, but I get that wasn't really her focus. Probably going to reread soon.

[@turtleanton6539]

🎉🎉🎉🎉😊

[@Fabulist]

It’s interesting to me that the people who are praising this book are almost universally white, while readers who are of Chinese descent and/or actually are familiar with Chinese culture think this book is, to use a British term, a load of bollocks. I mean, the name of the country is “Nikan”, which in Manchurian literally means “Chinese People”. Right from the jump that’s just weird. Imagine King Arthur living in a country named “British People”. Then there are the random names Kuang used for her characters - some are real, some are fictional, some are deities. It’s a bizarre mish-mash of random characters. Imagine that your main character teams up with people named Thomas Jefferson, Jesus Christ, Mickey Mouse and John Wick. That’s how actually bizarre this book is. Then there are the place names, specifically that she names various locations and groups of people after the Chinese zodiac. I did a deep dive into various zodiacal systems some years ago, focusing primarily on the Western, Chinese and Indian ones (but there are several others), and I have a hard time imagining that many people would cheerfully serve the “Rat King”. (The only gendered animal in the Chinese zodiac is the Dragon; everything else is the gender neutral word. Westerners call it the Year of the Rooster, for example, but in Chinese it’s the Year of the Chicken. Yay, go Team Chicken People!) The ignorance of Chinese history also plays into the horrific massacres described, because we don’t have any political or religious opinions about them. Plus the main character seems to get over these monstrous events pretty quickly despite taking outsized revenge for them. Imagine instead of the massacres depicted in the book that Kuang described 9/11 and the subsequent American retaliation against two countries that had nothing to do with it. That would inspire some ire, I think. Except she does it even worse. Suppose in retaliation for Ruby Ridge she nuked Washington DC. *That* is the sort of behavior we see in this book. It’s like every hundred pages Kuang got bored with her tale and throws in a genocide to perk things up again. And still the characters are like, “Oh yeah, I guess that happened. Rin totes when Dark Phoenix on those folks, murdering all those innocent children, but it’s not as bad as when she served me tea out of order! The disrespect!” Leaving aside personal opinions about the actual writing, one has to admit this is a weird mix-and-match of random stuff topped off by the problematic dismissal of real-world tragedies.

[@turtleanton6539]

Hmmm

[@BertzTriscut]

"Names that aren't too hard to pronounce." (Says nez-hah instead of nuh-jhuh) I joke in good faith, Mandarin is fucking impossible. I've given up on learning it like 13 times.

[@cronkthebookguy]

Oh NOOO! I dramatically undercut my own point! 🤣

[@nichellecox4846]

I will admit I am reluctant to pick up these books because of Yellowface and I had such an awful time reading it, with its overt racism and such and unlikeable MC that I got so angry with that I got halfway through and yeeted it across the room. Which is very disappointing because every book has something to tell but I do feel that liking the MC (or something about them) should be a given in the book.

[@michaeljdauben]

I don't think my experience is by any means universal but by the end of Poppy Wars I really hated the MC and would have been happy if the author just killed her off and switched to a new MC.

[@Adelynoir]

I didnt like this story because it also completely ignores Chinese Imperialism over Taiwan, Korea, and Manchuria! Native Manchurians were pushed out by the Han Chinese decades before. Then the Russians took Manchuria, and Japan took Manchuria from the Russians. The Taiwan allegory( Taiwan was taken by the Japnese duting the first Sino-Japanese war) has no mention of the native people being eliminated, and their culture and language erased by the Chinese. Oh, and lets not forget that Nanjing was the capital of the Heavenly Kingdom durint the Taiping rebellion against the Qing Dynasty their wnlisted military R*** AND M**** 200,000-300,000 people died. Not 100 years later during the second Sino Japanese war, Nanjing was the capital for the Nationalist Kuomintang party which is why it was attacked. The party fled to Taiwan. An estimated 40,000-300,000 people died.Just undern100 years between these two atrocities. But this wasnt the end. Nanjing had to endure battle once again just 10 years later when the PLA captured it from the KMT. And soon after, the PRC was born. All of this, again, taking place after the destruction of the QING dynasty. Why would she not just make up a dynasty? Or, better yet, have the original war that killed the charecter's family be the one that abolished the monarchy? This book claims to be about history but spits in the face of the actual complex and compelling hostprybof China