The real issue in the OCG

[@LS-qs9ju]

When you look at the OCG history, it's kinda hilarious how they switch into locks when the power level becomes lower. Like, in tier zero or strong tier one situation, they didn't do this as those strong deck was strong enough to make the lock doesn't happen.

[@hoshi314]

From a Ryzeal player : 1. 7th tachyon's issue from the get go is the target range is too large, from the reveal alone it was known that xyz decks is going to play this as a mandatory searcher and Stun decks will also search it not to mention the stun janky tech cards. 2. Ultimate Slayer vs ryzeal is normally done to kick Deadnader off the field. apparently the endboard is Duodrive, Deadnader, and 1 extra according to the needs and normally it is Dugares and they rely on HT and set cards along with Deadnader to disrupt opponents

[@mochammadimanfahri7112]

fr, seventh tachyon is the main cause why ryzeal is so consistent and sometimes be annoying. Also i think that either limiting seventh or ex ryzeal can balance ryzeal power in the meta

[@hoshi314]

@@mochammadimanfahri7112 the question back then was what about the C numbers, now that the C numbers are legal cost to reveal that opened up a lot of unpleasant targets. Hell the normal numbers alone already opens up targets for Stun players primarily : Giant Hand for fossil dyna Masquerade/Star Seraph for Boarder And let's not forget the barrier statues

[@prime3389]

the main thing to note with slayer is that it only handles the endboard if you send the cyberse xyz that negates a card upon being sent to the grave

[@hoshi314]

@@prime3389 which is aggregator, even in mirror too

[@thechachabinx3098]

If tachyon is a problem then so is Small World

[@bballhunter2988]

Scythe is such a toxic card, I don't care how it was not used before, card should have been banned a long time ago simply to avoid scenarios like this.

[@MarioLopez-xs3vc]

Bystials getting free material from both popping it and the setup for it is why that combo lost traction. But that's also why people are setting up Sanctum directly instead now with either Thrust or 4 Mat Alembertian.

[@Elystal]

I guess the logic is that it gets stopped by too many cards that the OCG were main decking already but, no one will complain if they ban it in the next banlist

[@seph2686]

Exactly both scythe and lancea are as bad as each other always added into mid range or combo decks on top of a board just toxic af

[@Od9189]

Nah sycthe is cool

[@BlackBeartic229]

@@Od9189 Found the turn skip player

[@DAdem]

Why is the music so menacing bro like wtf it feels like we are waiting for the arrival of the end but at the same time you SAY "it looks like a fine moment "

[@IAngelofFuryI]

It's Resident Evil safe room music.

[@MasterDecoy1W]

In the context of the tense atmosphere of the videogame, it is a nice respite. Out of context, it just sounds creepy.

[@traplover6357]

Resident Evil safe room music is creepy outside the game but it's calming within. 😂

[@RoyaltonDrummer922]

It’s insane how much of an OCG deck is devoted to the Maxx C/Fuwaross/Ash mini game

[@Elystal]

If the good decks in OCG/MD are more or less the same ones that perform well in the TCG, Maxx C didn’t “keep the meta in check” like a lot of Maxx C defenders claimed But also to think the other way around, banning Maxx C won’t make the OCG/MD meta any “healthier” than what it is now imo

[@mmlaughing6458]

@@Elystal Well, to your statements unhit Unchained and maybe Infernoble with Isolde available should have been on top meta in MD and OCG but no it did not, all bcs it can not play through Maxx C. So Maxx C does stop some meta decks and warps the format.

[@Darkmagecurt]

@@mmlaughing6458 right more accurate to say the deck that top ocg are good at playing around max c

[@donjulio1033]

​@@mmlaughing6458I think Infernobles have more than just maxx c stopping them imo. Theyre pretty ass going second and going first you usually either end up with 10 interactions or brick/get handtrapped and end on a subpar board or nothing then yeah no Maxx C lines really.

[@NeostormXLMAX]

@@Elystalthats because maxx c never resolves idiot, ash called by and all cards that negate maxx c gets banned and you will see the difference

[@rei_lyy]

Remember when Sythe, IO, and Mystic Mine were all legal in the same format and everyone hated it ? I love that one of these cards is still not banned because it didn't "win enough" we complain a lot in the TCG for good reasons a lot of the time but jesus idk how OCG players put up with this shit.

[@dudeman209]

Fuwalos is $10 in the OCG and $150 in the TCG. That's why they put up with it.

[@verbalengine95]

Oh well you see, because it didn't win enough 🙂 Now that it's winning yeah go ahead and hit it, but if a card with toxic implications doesn't see play or doesn't see success; it's exactly as much of a problem as an LOB vanilla The playerbase isn't really capable of coming up with a criteria for what makes a card banworthy based on design alone, so going by results is the best way to do it

[@hurrdurrmurrgurr]

@@verbalengine95 Well you see you only occasionally auto lose to harpie's feather storm, ghost meets girl, or kali yuga so it's completely fine to turn up for a game only to have your time wasted. Now if your time was being wasted a lot more often for several months straight in tournaments then it would be a problem. Wait, why are our player numbers dropping? I swear yugioh players are incapable of empathy, hopefully with the falling tcg numbers and rise of one piece in the ocg, Konami will be forced to course correct from this, "it only deserves banning once it gets to ruin at least one format, as a treat" mindset.

[@four-en-tee]

@@verbalengine95 Ideally, Konami would just have an idea of what cards are considered "unhealthy" for the game and would just ban those if the player base had too much of an issue with it. I can understand trying to sell a card and waiting to ban it if its too new, but something like Scythe in this context has been out for a while. And in the case of the TCG: something like Sanctifire or Jowgen has been out for a while (and i guess we can throw Thunder King Rai-Oh into this discussion now too because of Bao, though a more realistic problem card would probably be something like Chaos Hunter). But that's not what Konami does. They just want to make the game only more and more crazy, and its just not a sustainable strategy. I started in 2021, but from what I understand, this game has regularly been on the verge of breaking ever since Firewall Dragon. That all being said: Ryzeal seems like a fairly healthy deck.

[@jayoodyang747]

Ryzael feels very similar to when Unchained was the top/most piloted deck. And it feels like that was the last format that was healthy

[@glrbrasil]

If you look at the decklists it’s very simple to spot the problem cards: lancea, scythe, maxx c, barrier, shifter, etc. People are so used to be turn skipped they’re starting to defend these things. For instance we don’t even complain about Bagooska, even though it literally skips a turn.

[@Elystal]

Bagooska is fine if Winda is fine you can say they’re both not fine, I won’t defend them

[@matija5748]

​@@Elystalneither is fine winda should have been banned years ago idk why it's still legal.

[@babrad]

​@@Elystalyou can add Dweller to this party as well

[@glrbrasil]

Dweller, Winda and Bagooska could all be banned and the game would only improve

[@stinkyboy101]

Bagooska is fine. Someone called it the modern day swords of revealing light and that seems like a fair comparison

[@vampireguy92ryan81]

Its wild how the ocg has so many cards for turn skips... they said maxx c was a deterrent and yet they made 3 more and still kept maxx c in game. Too many decks also play like 15+ non engine which is like smh..

[@trippersigs2248]

This is so funny after the last video on the main channel.

[@namelessanonymous2913]

7th Tachyon definitely is a problem. Its target pool is absurdly large. Every lv4-5 water, fire, light, earth, aqua, rock, warrior, fairy, and spellcaster now has a ROTA.

[@ShiroiKiba]

ROTA #2,3, & 4? Yikes

[@emilianoflcn]

​@@ShiroiKiba better. Rota is the 4th copy of tachyon lol

[@greg0998]

the ost of a funeral hits again

[@esrohm6460]

it realy is crazy to me how we are in a world where people are turn skipping turbo and plan b is often plan a for the best deck that lab isn't doing better. you would assume the deck that can play all these cards while being either not all all or limited affected

[@Avermra]

Big Welcome is at 2 over there so there might be some limitation, but how well does Lab play into Ryzeal going second? It feels like getting your backrow popped by Deadnader as soon as you breathe on them doesn't feel so good.

[@Killerrrb]

Artifact Lancea is perfectly fine. You can’t have cards to counter everything except the grave yard lol

[@chaotixthefox]

Lancea doesn't counter the GY.

[@Killerrrb]

Not specifically I guess but it can hurt decks that send from GY to banish

[@justmega9569]

If Shifter goes i think Lancea should. Lancea obviously isn't as strong generally but can do the same thing to specifc decks. Both just unhealthy

[@Killerrrb]

@@justmega9569 droll is also the same to a lot of decks. Unhealthy cards for an unhealthy game. Cant get rid of them without reworking how busted the game is

[@matthewbrady1562]

​@@Killerrrb Droll is needed otherwise some decks draw and search like crazy. The opponent would have no chance as they would have 6 cards Vs 16

[@ImJordan]

Fuck the Yugioh stuff, RE2 save room music is goated.

[@galaxydragon8326]

it seems circular wasnt the problem, JOSH HATES TERAHERTZ AND CIRCULAR TOOK THE SHOT

[@Gilgamesh-em6ru]

OCG most likely doesn't play Circular in the Maliss deck since the extra deck is really tight. this is one of the only Cyberse decks in a long time that actually has their own good extra deck monsters so they use that instead of relying on the generic cyberse ones. only problem it still has to overcome is Cyberse still has no way to negate nibiru.

[@johnnywilson3071]

@@Gilgamesh-em6ru I really hope cyberse never gets anti-nibiru support, one of the few decks that needs that specific weakness to not be a huge "pita".

[@wardy4903]

Lol of course the ocg let a turn skip stick around and printed a spell card that searches it and now its killing their meta. Search sycthe, search lancea, shifter and a billion maxx Cs. What a fun game where players take turns not playing.

[@silvermushroom-gamifyevery6430]

Still an improvement over compare hands format

[@Avermra]

Those are not mutually exclusive. You are also comparing hands to see if you have turn skip to match turnskip The whole "compare hands" argument is way overblown. To competent players that consistently top big events playing each other, perhaps. For people not even close to that level that is not the case when people misplay 10 times a match

[@obskewerd3992]

I use Melffy Tearlaments to summon Grapha. Melffy searches Neko Mane King. Turn skip. I did this like 50 times in the most recent duelest cup. Why is that not talked about more? I cant be the first person to realise how easy that is to pull off

[@MrAlexjmercer]

Can I have a decklist?

[@Moximav]

What do you do going 2nd though ?

[@obskewerd3992]

@@Moximav The same as you do with almost any tear build? Its not without its own disruptions. Super Poly, Water Kaiju, Maxx C And the standard hand trap line all fit into this deck easy as. I played the Duelist cup variant at 42 cards. Just depends how YOU want to play it man. As long as you run Melffy catty and wally you will most likely pull it off. Running melffy Donkey means if you mill it you can get back any level 2 or lower beast. Melffy Hide and Seek spell card gives you a recursion engine.

[@felipemendes5336]

​@@obskewerd3992So you lose got it 👍

[@lbesavant]

Never would I think that frickin Chaos Number 102 Archfiend Seraph would see play in a modern competitive deck.

[@FakeHeroFang]

Scythe is also still legal in MD, but nobody is playing it for whatever reason. It's just hanging out in the shadows until the new thing that can abuse it comes around.

[@Test-mq8ih]

Same thing with Skill Drain

[@林承緒-p2e]

You need a way to pop scythe to use it , not many meta decks have that in the extra deck.

[@Elystal]

@@林承緒-p2e you can always make verte DPE since we’re talking about master duel tho

[@林承緒-p2e]

@@Elystal That's too many garnets for some people, it's easier to just make a good board normally than try to scythe lock.

[@Elystal]

@@林承緒-p2e true

[@ExceedSC2]

The thing about Fuwalos in the OCG is that it synergizes with Maxx C so well, since either one draws you into the other. It's far more oppressive. They need to ban Maxx C, then Fuwalos is fine and works as intended.

[@mickjaegar2379]

4:33 Is there some reason why OCG is still playing Donner as a generic link 2?

[@saulzambrano6408]

For Ex Ryzeal, they're running it for the same reason Kashtira ran it, to clear their field.

[@Confiant.Twitch]

If someone shifter’s you turn 1 and you chain Artifact Lancea, what happens? Does Lancea protect cards for a turn or no? Alternatively, if someone shifter’s you and you chain Belle, what happens? Shifter is negated or am I wrong?

[@carloscano2003]

Shifter itself is not banishing anything so belle don't a have anything to do against shifter Lancea on the other hand, DON'T always beat Do, so for that turn that Lancea was used, cards will not be banished

[@SolarFlareWings]

Lancea will effectively turn off Shifter for the turn. Shifter's effect tries to banish cards, but cannot due to Lancea's effect. You also can't chain Belle to Shifter. Shifter doesn't banish cards from the GY.

[@askashirayuki6765]

You can only use Lancea during your opponents turn.

[@MarioLopez-xs3vc]

Lancea is only usable on the Player's Turn, so you'd have to Lancea during the opponents' first turn in that scenario. Lancea only needs to tribute to activate its effect(and can do so from the hand or field so you can pop it from back row if Shifter isn't already up), so it can shut off banishes even after Shifter's effect is up, only Lancea will get banished in that case as its effect is a lingering restriction to shut off all forms of Banishment for the turn, but it has to tribute itself for cost first. Ghost Belle negates card activations, so it can't be used against a lingering replacement effect that's already active. Shifter also doesn't directly interact with the GY so I don't think it can be chained to the activation either.

[@mochammadimanfahri7112]

-On Turn 1, cards are sent to the GY. on Turn 2, cards goes banished instead. Turn 3 shifter lingering is gone (just note that lancea can not be used on your turn) -Belle can not negate Shifter, since Shifter does not have interaction w/ the GY

[@whiteshadow2535]

Josh should try maliss salamangreat. It seems more fun to me and could be up his alley

[@arrownoir]

Turn skips are always great* Maxx C, rollback, puppet etc… Isn’t yugioh grand?

[@ASoldierify]

Didn't know rollback said skip your opponent turn on its card text.

[@arrownoir]

@@ASoldierify It might as well. It’s a huge middle finger either way. Who needs floodgates on the board when you can just trigger them from the GY for free?

[@WolfPackAlpha-sn2sw]

@@arrownoirall the trap floodgates are continuous, which makes them invalid targets for Rollback.

[@guillermoandresramirezvera2899]

​@@WolfPackAlpha-sn2sw D Barrier?

[@arrownoir]

@@WolfPackAlpha-sn2sw Not all floodgates are continuous traps. The Shiranui trap being the main example.

[@xmangle5382]

We arguably have the same stuff here in TCG, you might want to try to convince me why shifter and fuwaross are not turn skippers

[@Avermra]

Shifter is a turn skip against most decks because it flat out prohibits certain actions, Fuwa is not against many decks unless you int into ignoring it. Most competent decks can make a decent board while giving up minimum number of draws. There are decks that can't really do that well (Yubel, Salad, RB, to name a few decks with different levels of power and meta relevance), but many players already figured out how to do it. I would say that Fuwa served its intended purposes of 1. mostly only usable for player going second so there is a risk for main decking it and 2. Having a hand trap that is medium-high impact so it's not just trading one for one while the player going first can just convert the used body into more meaningful plays.

[@silvermushroom-gamifyevery6430]

Tinfoil take: floodgates and turn skips are Konami's version of the 4 turn rule

[@Alex-Omega]

I wonder if Ryzeal would be so dominant without the Scythe Lock. Could be a completly different format in the TCG as theres no Scythe here

[@Elystal]

Ryzeal will still be great without scythe

[@FujisakiChihiro55]

They were already a top meta before their synergy with Scythe is discovered and Scythe is just their plan B to begin with.

[@easyygo3008]

We won't have the same issue in tcg as we are not s t u p i d enough to kill old meta decks to death. Ryzeal wilk be tier 1 in a much more diverse format than ocg

[@Goldenfire49]

Christ. I'll give you Scythe. Boy only got better with age. But come on. Lancea? Lancea? That boy does practically nothing. "Prevents banishing." Such wow. Really crippling effect to work around.

[@bouldergeist2501]

Do someone have the superhevy samurai snake eye T.G. list?

[@mariorovira3639]

Ocg really hates backrow decks since they have harpys plus heavy and red reboot legal

[@RayquaSr.]

Fing love fibrax scythe format. Gotta be my favorite gender.

[@izum4831]

1 card combo exist make deck able to run like 20 non engine like this ,they should slowly remove 1 card combo in future deck design

[@l.apastore4208]

They abusing my mizael tachyon cards. Ffs. Ish gonna be banned before it even arrives in md

[@tarikfretes7562]

Will you continue the recap series?

[@dementiawavin1587]

Yugioh is a very balanced game. Eventually you'll win the coinflip, get a good hand and be able to completely prevent your opponent from playing the game, just like he did in the game before.

[@RtGem]

I would argue that summon limit is a bigger problem tbh. The thing is so cancerous and is a lot easier to pull off mostly. But ye scythe is a Bad card design, who tf thought a searchable floodgate would be good for anything?

[@Elystal]

summon limit, like most other trap floodgates, is hardly searchable, whereas scythe is not

[@RtGem]

@@Elystal brother, first of all trap decks exist. Second of all idc about that its searchable, i care that all you need to do is activate the card and win. Whereas with scythe you need to pop it aswell. Both are shitty and should be banned

[@babrad]

​@@RtGemthe bigger issue of Summon Limit etc is the fact modern decks have been able to turn it on/off on demand, never getting punished for having their board broken then being forced to play under their own floodgate

[@Elystal]

@@RtGem to be fair both should be banned bc who likes floodgates, I’m just saying summon limit is not “a bigger problem” than scythe

[@Elystal]

@@RtGem also the best splashable and viable way to search any continuous trap that i can think of is LotHP or four mat Alembertian, which are both not very good

[@tariqmcmaster8668]

Maliss is much weaker in the ocg without apollousa. The deck doesn’t have a way to play around nib. So it’s end board is the same as the salad end board. Nib token.

[@ryuuohdeltaplus7936]

Wdym Apollousa is legal in the OCG

[@Ghostavrrr]

Apolo is legal in OCG

[@seph2686]

Exactly ^ it's only tcg that has banned Apollo usa

[@tariqmcmaster8668]

@@Ghostavrrr typo, I meant TCG :p

[@tariqmcmaster8668]

@@ryuuohdeltaplus7936 typo. Meant TCG :p

[@nickspurlock585]

My opinion on this is - and has always been - that side decking is the issue here. You should not be able to get these ridiculous turnskip cards only in games where you know you're going first. You should be forced to accept the inconsistency of having them in your main deck in order to use them. Siding has been around forever and isn't going anywhere but if you actually step back and think about it, it is very very very stupid. every single card that lives in the side deck only is toxic bullshit.

[@tommasopenati9635]

I agree with Josh, no idea why the deck is almost T0 because its end board is nothing crazy and one ultimate slayer or flying c stops the deck completely

[@truekingofallgeneraiders]

They pass through Flying C and Contact C by negating it's effects with aggregator or by sending it with node.

[@FujisakiChihiro55]

You know people talking out of their a*s when they think Flying C can stop Ryzeal. Ultimate Slayer does counter it hard tho but that's where the 20+ non-engine and/or floodgates in their deck is for.

[@Elystal]

Ryzeal is good because they can cram in a lot of hand traps

[@UncleJrueForTue]

You'd agree with Josh if he had released a video saying the opposite about the OCG.

[@Wanderer-th4tt]

What's the bgm 😭

[@FGj-xj7rd]

That line in the article is pure comedy for the wrong reasons. OCG is the mother lode of misery.

[@Someone-lg6di]

Master duel going through this right now people cheering for protos to beat tempai

[@katzuma7641]

Please react to the new arcana force cards joshie

[@RoseDragon112]

He did already in one of the vods on his vod channel. It's the most recent wheel vod I think.

[@katzuma7641]

@@RoseDragon112 ooo gotcha thanks

[@heulg.darian2536]

I mean yes that sucks, but I think MD won't care about it as much. I can see people main decking scythe, cause we are insane. But the lack of side deck makes me think that we won't have the D-barrier issue unless it's in the form of something like thrust. Even lancea might not see play considering that there have been plenty of formats where decks wanted to banish, but that might be because they weren't completely turn skipped by a lancea. The traps are also partially because of fuwaloss and co, I assume purillia isn't doing much to either deck since it's not side decked. Will see how it goes, we still have a fiendschmidt format to go through. And in 2 days we will learn how boned we are, cause closed moon is ominous but there are 13 more URs in that pack that can dictate the power level of the format.

[@Someone-lg6di]

Labrumth

[@heulg.darian2536]

@@Someone-lg6di labrynth plays d barrier rn. Because they can search it and recover it. Ryzeal and maliss aren't playing d barrier because they can do the same but because of maxxc and fuwaloss and it isn't even main decked it is side decked. Something that in MD we don't have for better or worse.

[@GlacierMoonDragon]

If one card combos exist, they should probably add more locks/gates to ED monsters, so something like a ED lock isn't as toxic and not a instant scoop.

[@comettcg8830]

ocg player here and I think ocg will hit the floodgates on next list. imho OCG would not hit a deck to make it not able to perform its intended play, hence they do consistency hit a lot, so that the deck might function but just less frequently. While slotting floodgates that doesn't really intended to be the plan, they might hit it, like calamity on centurion as recent example. Hopefully that's the case bcs aside than that at least it's a fresh air after long period of snake eyes

[@Elystal]

i mean they did ban catapult turtle rather quickly, so they are aware of the toxic things seventh tachyon is capable of, i think they will get rid of scythe the next list especially after that new Link4 in SUDA

[@comettcg8830]

@@Elystal yeah that too. nice catch. While the beatrice fiendsmith stuff is strong but not non-game like ftk and floodgate hence they a bit slower on that personally I think seventh tachyon itself is fine, not all deck want to ron ut and even if you do it still require some extra deck slot commitment

[@quassar4618]

damn this ocg videos with this scary ass music are something else

[@P4brotagonist]

Editor, can we please stop using the safe room for Resident Evil? I hear it and get anxiety every time lol

[@alexcallender]

I like it

[@Dylligraphy]

The OCG has issues? I thought it was terrific because Sunny said so anyway Maxx C, response?

[@CorporateGreebo]

If we are accepting one cards as the new standard going forward, can we get Circular back? It doesnt do nearly what the recent ones do now

[@porgeporgeporge]

no

[@arrownoir]

Hell no. That card needs to be banned forever.

[@ZEDEX252]

Okay i'm kinda late to the party. What the hell did circular DO anyway?

[@arrownoir]

@@ZEDEX252 A card that tells you you need 3 handtraps to stop a deck before they even use their normal summon is nonsense.

[@braddcyr6071]

No lol circular makes both maliss and ryzael stronger lol

[@lordofcrows]

Wait, Scythe is still legal in OCG?

[@verbalengine95]

Isn't Fuwaros basically just a scythe lock?

[@dannycristen7505]

Depends on who you ask

[@ThurzagLP]

Silhouhatte rabbit looks more like an "alice in wonderland" card than the whole malice archetype, so dissapointing Edit: He is also Illusion type, they failed on so many levels with malice

[@cbpprophet]

Yugioh needs a new rule. Everyone needs 2 separate decks. One for going first and one deck for going 2nd.

[@Senshi00]

Leave our floodgates alone

[@Elystal]

I hate how some TCG players without playing OCG at all love to shit on OCG for I don’t know why, like just stop whining about a game that you’re not even playing

[@Elystal]

To be more clear there’s nothing wrong about analyzing an OCG meta report, but when people saying stuff like OCG is unplayable or OCG’s current list is trash is too much

[@vitortakara7090]

they complain a lot bcz they will have to play that format in a couple of months, not only that, the bigger problem is when they have really strong cards and instead of banning then they design around them while those cards are banned on tcg making decks that were okish there completely broken on tcg, though i only play md it's not like i don't feel the ocg seep into the format really hard

[@Elystal]

@@vitortakara7090 they are now complaining on OCG player’s behalf about Scythe and Maxx C, cards that will never be a problem for them in the foreseeable future

[@theermac6024]

Until you play Master Duel, and realize those cards are legal there, and considering people that play TCG do, in fact, play Master Duel from time to time, it's not that far to see how they're complaining WITH a background to it.

[@bluedemontr-whisperofwind-2296]

​@@ElystalOCG format being bad affects the TCG too because it means the card design will be made to solve problems that TCG doesn't have, leading to shit like the adamancipator format

[@janehrahan5116]

The real issue is not enough Raye support.

[@CrisRullz]

but but yu-gi-oh is healed with churmy's release and snake eyes dead i thought 🤡🤡