The reality of being a Pro Player™

[@VersusVortex]

Thanks GOAT for the shoutout. Love your work. Also is that a fly on your wall

[@IfYouWantBlood1]

Either a big ass fly or a spider

[@JustCagna]

Flykido. It spawned as one of Tokido's spies after Akuma Gameplay showed.

[@GuyWithAnAmazingHat]

Even UMA is doing content now, early this week he made an "exam paper" in pdf for SF6 where you have to look at screen shots and answer questions on what is the optimal punish, how to escape this situation, why did certain things happen etc. Chat answers all the questions in notepad and he goes through all their answers and marking them. Chat calls him Teacher or Brother Ka, as he's known as Kagami in Taiwan, so now he is doing teaching/coaching content on stream all the time.

[@ΚρανίΩ]

thats such a cool concept

[@LethalAscend]

You got a link?

[@GuyWithAnAmazingHat]

@@LethalAscend The twitch stream vod already expired, but if you're interested in his streams, he is uma_kagami, he has been streaming all sorts of stuff including Elden Ring.

[@dimmadeluxe6278]

I actually had a conversation with one of the old owners of CLG about competitive gaming, and he was talking about how getting older doesn’t actually usually make it so the players can’t keep up with younger players. The reason why older people tend to fall off is they start families and just don’t have time to keep playing video games all the time

[@Brian_F]

People vastler over attribute the physical effects of aging to doing worse in esports. It's like you mentioned, less free time to dedicate to practice, and different priorities like actually making a secure living lol. Our aging street fighter pros in scenes that support them (Japan) are doing fine, with new talent rising up as well. There's no magical age where people fall off a cliff.

[@greensky5328]

From what I've heard talking to people outside the FGC, making a successful living in most activities considered hobbies (art, sports or in our case videogames) without branching out (freelance art, fitness training, content creation.) is hard as hell. Even if you do branch out it's a gamble, you still have to be very knowledgable on what you're doing, lucky and flexible.

[@Saixjacket]

Basically, you have to be a BS’er. It’s why a lot of people don’t get taken seriously 😂. Like I don’t want anything to do with TRT gamer bros.

[@wisemage0]

I am very disappointed that this wasn't a video of you flipping burgers.

[@B_Ahmed1234]

Yeah, we got click baited

[@wisemage0]

@@B_Ahmed1234 He owes us a cooking video. 😤

[@Berry_Beyblade]

The comparison to UFC is so accurate, and it's such a damn shame. I really think though Capcom should be taking that Million and spreading it out more evenly throughout the season. It would allow more people to actually make this a commitment and really push the boundaries of the competition. Uma living in LA for two weeks off of $300 and complementary meals isn't a heroic story, it's a damn nightmare and our pro players shouldn't have to live like that. (No one should, but you get the point)

[@Edz519]

It's the primitive days of UFC. Think of all the fighters that had to go out and fight multiple times in a night and live off barely any money.

[@lolozo214]

Hopefully things are a bit better this year for Capcom cup at least, as Capcom did say that they're keeping the million and that the split would be more in line with previous Capcom cups

[@themur880]

To be fair the UFC brings in far more money off of one fight now than Capcom cucumber likely does off of the back of an entire circuit

[@beam5655]

​@@lolozo214it got even worse lol

[@EditorSebas]

This is how I felt about speedrunners after I keep seeing that the people who make documentals about speedrunning have millions and millions of views, but now speedrunners streams their own runs and make videos about them.

[@cltmck]

Speedrunning is perfectly set up for someone like Summoning Salt to get vastly more views than any individual runner simply because watching someone do thousands of attempts is boring, but watching the best 25 or so runs ever over 10+ years is really interesting.

[@ADreamingTraveler]

@@cltmck Well put. People forget just how many days and months of nonstop boring grinding some of these runs take to get that record breaking run to happen.

[@Latino_Burrito]

i'm not gonna lie brian you definitely gave me a reality check with this. I'm 21 and ever since I found out about the pro fgc scene I thought to myself "that's gonna be me!! I'm gonna grind the game, win my locals, then slowly save up to travel to majors and soon enough I'll win thousands. menard here I come!! I'll make so much money I'll be able to travel the world every week just like the top players" once I realized just how delusional I sound I'm like man... I really shouldn't bank everything on this. I really am just better off doing it as a hobby on the side while I work a legitimate job. I also just really liked how you presented your message. You clearly have a lot of wisdom after doing this for so long, and you almost sounded like a dad lmao, and I mean that in a good way. like a dad who's like "hey I don't want to crush your dreams, but you should have a plan b and be smart about pursuing something so risky" and you're right! I won't bank on trying to become a high-level player. I'll just save up and get money the consistent, smart way and do fgc stuff as a hobby, and if it does become an extra avenue of income for me whether that's winning from time to time or streaming then I'm obviously very fortunate and lucky. Great message and an amazing video thank you.

[@ADreamingTraveler]

Doing it for the love of the game first is always the most important instead of acting like it's your job. Any money you make off of it should just be a happy coincidence.

[@RICHUNCLEPENNYBAGS77]

I'm glad this video did it for you but like... looking at Liquepedia or whatever shoulda given you the idea

[@FGCombo]

Add to that the catch 22 that once it becomes your job, gaming is less fun

[@gg.no.re.]

I quit playing Rainbow Six professionally because the cost of competing and traveling = less money and time to myself than a basic part time job and playing as a hobby. If you don’t place first you are in the red, even if you win you basically just break even… it’s just not worth it and never has been. eSports is a myth and I promise you that if anyone tells you it’s glamorous, they are lying. The real reward of winning a tournament is the ability to shill your content creation.

[@DjGaiden]

A topic related to this. Who were some of the best tourney players that were sponsor-less + fully employed throughout SF4 to SF6? In Tekken there was Qudans. Though he had to take extended time off multiple years through T7’s lifespan, he was always a high caliber player.

[@joshthefunkdoc]

i can't say for more recent SF (esp since i mostly checked out during SF5), but for SF4 it would definitely be a ton of Japanese players who never got that opportunity. The real eye-popping one atm is JDCR not having a sponsor, since he's been doing really well in Korea's weekly tournaments and is even a great streamer to boot!

[@beam5655]

iDom won Capcom cup when he was unsponsored, and then was probably the best player for the rest of SFV's lifespan. Although he did get sponsored sometime after his Capcom Cup win.

[@TheGooGaming]

Its unfortunate of course but olympians even don't do that full time, they have regular jobs. Monetized sports have messed with our perspective.

[@cltmck]

Almost everyone that has a job that makes you think "I didn't even know you could do that for living" started as a side hustle or just a hobby and paid for their life with a regular job. Even some title contenders in the UFC held regular jobs not even that long ago (Chael Sonnen and Al Iaquinta were a real estate agents, tons of guys run gyms where they make most of their money teaching soccer moms and children jiujitsu). While it would be nice if the FGC paid a livable wage for guys outside the tip top, that's not really a thing for the vast majority of sports and it wasn't even a thing in major sports in America until the 70s or 80s. Most guys either held down offseason jobs or fully expected to go to work like a normal person after retiring.

[@ADreamingTraveler]

It's so strange to me that he's complaining about not winning enough money due to the time investment not being worth it. I thought he was playing this game because he loved it, not because it was his job.

[@doublevendetta]

​@@ADreamingTravelerYou... Do understand that these two aren't mutually exclusive statements, right?

[@mdqp2]

The problem here (if we want to call it that) is simply that there isn't a big enough audience around any individual fighting game, thus tournaments can't get good deals with big sponsors, which means the cost of running an event also cut deeper into the prize pool. Capcom can throw some money into this because they can generate some buzz for their own game, but other companies simply won't see enough of a return to justify supporting the FGC. The Saudi money is just an anomaly, and it's unlikely it will go on for long. You'd need a game that is an order of magnitude larger than SF6 to get anywhere near generating enough money for pros to live just by being pros. It would also need to have more staying power than the average fighting game, which is unlikely to happen because games get updated often and then they get replaced by the next entry in the series (which may or may not be good).

[@TalicZealot]

There are very few scenes that achieved this. During the kEspa days 2002-2010 of Starcraft: Brood War players were played salaries by their teams, which were sponsored by large Korean corporations. That said unless you were a top player you weren't really making that much in addition to living with a very strict schedule and not having much control over your career. Eventually that whole system collapsed and now Brood War players use streaming as a means to make playing sustainable. If one huge matchfixing scandal had not happened maybe it would still be going to this day, but there were also a lot of other issues.

[@joshthefunkdoc]

The impression i had as an outsider is that BW was always going to be sidelined eventually just by virtue of being too old. From what i hear that scene is healthier than it has any right to be these days, when you compare to the doomposting around so many other esports as of late.

[@TalicZealot]

@@joshthefunkdoc the doomposting is not a new thing. Any time the new hot game stops being the main focus and the money hose slows down people freak out. If the game is good though it will keep on. SC2 came out in 2010 and people were saying dead game in 2011. Scene is still going.

[@itz_yoboi_tree]

As someone who works a regular job 9-5 i envy the people brave enough to go thru the grind . Find thst balance cause this shit aint it either

[@vergils.lawnchair]

Feel this. Working 40 hours a week then coming home and trying to have the drive to play and improve is brutal. Especially when you got family and other responsibilities.

[@albertko1]

Considering that Chris Wong still works on a cruise ship and UMA isn't really living large after his big win is telling. Meanwhile, Max is a lot more comfortable financially as a pure content creator. Punk may "joke" about being a "content creator" and Justin is right there... it's much more financially sustainable to be a creator.

[@QGfk1]

I think punk is only half trolling when he says that. I think he understands the reality too, and like xian pointed out growing his brand is something he can work on and see the returns, while no matter how much time and self-worth he invests in competition it doesn't guarantee wins let alone money

[@ΚρανίΩ]

i mean uma could be living better but uhhhh vtuber

[@SeniterYT]

Has he actually received the money yet?

[@kevinchea1680]

My favorite quote from Kris Wong I am just a average salaryman not a pro gamer

[@CF565]

One thing i think would be really beneficial to the scene would be for payouts to be less top-heavy for the major tournaments. Capcom Cup finals dropping off to just 10k and 5k while top 1-4 got six figures is super rough. There needs to be a more generous gradient to support the field. Look at golf and tennis, the major open-tourney individual sports- the prize pools are much more evenly distributed through the placements. Also, Evo being such a low prize, for all placements, is an embarrassment.

[@beam5655]

It's even worse this year. 1 mil for first and 100k for second, then it falls off hard. The people in charge of the CPT are idiotic. Well at least we can thank the Saudis for a more reasonable and humane payout distribution at the EWC lol. Can't believe Capcom is being outdone by them.

[@beam5655]

Oh yeah, and the Evo prizepools are a joke. Totally agree with you there. $13k for first for a 5k entrant tournament lmao, plus 200k+ people watching on streams with loads of ads, and the whole thing is run by Sony.

[@JUNKAI_PC]

Was waiting for your reaction to this. Im a fellow singaporean who wants to make it into the pro scene for sf6 but as a 18 year old who is about to go into army I start thinking about the future for me when it comes to esports and I used to have the mindset of just obsessively practicing everyday sacrificing my personal time in order to pursue this. After watching xian's perspective I feel even more pressured in a sense as I did not realise this was happening until he explained it in the video. Thanks for covering this brian and one day I hope I can have the ability to be able to have a match with u as well!!

[@RompecuelloPR]

You should watch the video of the guy that play esport nrs games young man

[@JUNKAI_PC]

@@RompecuelloPR oh thanks for the reply!! Yea I actually did managed to watch it today thanks for the recommendation. It gave me more perspective from other people in general when it comes to this subject. Thanks a lot!!

[@RompecuelloPR]

@@JUNKAI_PC it was a really good video too, glad it helped you blessings hope everything work out in your favor

[@JUNKAI_PC]

@@RompecuelloPR Thank uu!! U too man

[@JoystickNY]

Excellent Video 👍 Brian not only in fighting game tournament, also as content creators, Streamers, or anything related fighting game, it is no comparison compared to other genres

[@A_K1ra_x]

In the Smash community (not really FGC but similar payout issue), Japan outclasses America by a long shot, and one thing that we learned was that they have no payouts for their tournaments while Americans run to streaming because American tournaments don’t have great payouts. Maybe tournaments are too expensive and should scale down on the luxury, and large amount of side events. Probably put more of the entrants money toward the prize pool rather than venue fees like a boxing ring and over the top lighting. Not saying these are bad things, but if the complaint is there isn’t enough money, then I’d strike that first.

[@Gadlight]

Top player in GBVS:Rising who won evo japan 2024 despite having a sponsorship, still works a salaryman job and has a child. I think Japan is a bit more advanced in this regard, but only on certain big titles, like SF6 or T8.

[@QGfk1]

I think you're right, it's more comparable to the competitive ecosystem of other esports there just bc sf is so huge. daigo is famous enough to have written a book, you can't say that about anybody in the american fgc.

[@ΚρανίΩ]

at the same time its grandb'ue way more niche than an sf or tekken

[@joshthefunkdoc]

SF6 is right up there with stuff like Apex & Valorant when it comes to streaming numbers in Japan - it's an outlier for fighting games at the moment. And Tekken has been THE biggest fighter in Japanese arcades ever since they adopted the player card/character-customization system from Virtua Fighter, so there's a lot of history.

[@SUPERJESSE9]

What color your bugatti

[@Carlos-ln8fd]

We deserve to know

[@wavesofbabies]

I'm pretty sure he just has Bulgogi

[@halimalnami1560]

Transparent

[@Zachary_Sweis]

The thing I appreciate the most about this discussion recently is being able to really express these views without throwing TOs under the bus and saying tournaments are scams and that TOs are eating from venue fees and refuse to contribute extra money to the prize pool. We all know that's not what's happening. But certain people are making these claims and it detracts from the actual reasons why there isn't a lot of money in competing.

[@tommybayer2351]

Versus vortex got some good stuff

[@TheJackOfFools]

I really wish we could see more legacy players staying as competitors into their 40s or even older. I really feel like the overall state of fighting games (and really any e-sport) would be improved by having a mix of young and old players. And I think that until esports is something you can do as a Real Job its going to be stuck as a niche thing for kids. If you cant build a family on esports money, or just live like a grown adult and retire from a career loke everyone else, its not gonna truly grow.

[@usernameassistance9891]

Reaction time dies down as you get older. If your 30 or older in league of legends for example, no team will hire you because of your “grandpa reflexes”.

[@bookimatt]

At some point, you gotta weigh your options and do what’s best for you and your loved ones. If you have a spouse and a kid, it’s (probably) unrealistic to put in the time to compete at the highest level for a *chance* to come out of it with scraps. At that point, you’re just doing it for the love of the game.

[@usernameassistance9891]

@zoran6850 You could be right, I don’t know. I don’t know anything about guns. If gun slinging deals with high apm, then there could be a correlation between the two. Diago from street fighter is like almost 40, and he’s still probably a super top tier player. What I’m saying is that in order to “make a living” off of video games, you need to go pro / get sponsored. You can be sponsored and create a bunch of content (streaming, KZbin videos), but that’s entirely different from being a pro player. Sponsors / esports organizations want the young guys, 16-26 years old with good reaction time and reflexes. After 30 your retirement age, at least in league of legends, a very big esport.

[@usernameassistance9891]

@zoran6850 Everything you said is correct, except “reactions will hardly slow down”. 30-35 years of age and onward is when reaction time starts to dip. Whether that matters in gunslinging, I don’t know, but it matters a lot in esports.

[@usernameassistance9891]

@zoran6850 That’s is true. If you practice everyday you still may be able to keep up. Esports is in an infancy stage, so who knows what the future holds in regards too it. I’ll still be playing these competitive games when I’m older, (and hopefully my apm stills stays high as I age lol, I’m only 26). Yeah, league definitely does look slow. I promise you though it is a very high apm game similar to StarCraft. FPS games might be “faster” though. I play FGC games too ((Guilty Gear, street fighter)), and the reason why I can excel is from high apm and knowledge from League of Legends, Overwatch, ect.

[@jameshopkins4460]

That $68,922/year for Mena doesn't account for taxes and expenses. That probably ends up looking more like 45k per year, which at 2080 hours per year (Full Time 40 hrs per week) = around $22 per hour. It is decent money but it is not the kind of revenue that someone who is top 1-3 in their sport (that is participated in world-wide by a large audience) would hope to earn. I would imagine that Punk, you, Rob, Snake Eyes, etc - all make significantly more that that by streaming.

[@cyrus6236]

Thats why I love channels like Nephew, Punk and Nemos. Theres always more space for FGC content creators

[@RexusK76]

I have seen your past videos about this topic, and due to those i did try to learn how yt and content creation works, i came to realize that i kinda enjoy making videos. Might be unrelated, but why isnt there a world cup like competition in country teams or something close to that battle it out for a prize ? They could do it similarly to how they have been doing the qualifiers. I think that would be a lot of fun to watch.

[@JadeJackal4]

I used to wonder why Snake eyez hardly ever left his house lately but after watching his streams where he averages no less than 2k viewers a stream I understood why

[@gamersparadise743]

and he barely plays the game either. which is cool i suppose. just pointing out that he doesn't have to play much to get those views. but he's also built a brand for what, 10 years? so he's worked to get there and deserves it.

[@JadeJackal4]

@@gamersparadise743 I think Snake plays just about every night

[@joshthefunkdoc]

Yeah, that's a higher average than a good amount of vtubers working for big companies (which take at least a decent cut of their earnings, mind you). Not really a one-to-one comparison since those companies can give their talent other kinds of opportunities, but it goes to show how well this works out financially!

[@gamersparadise743]

@@JadeJackal4 he plays every night but not the whole stream. a lot of it is him sitting in training mode and chatting. which is cool. he can do that because of what he built over the years.

[@MarcConcepcion1313]

I had the dream of being a professional fighting gamer way back in the late 90s and early 00s. Now, imagine trying to be a content creator in an era where KZbin and/or Twitch did not exist. I have since been a salaryman in the web developer space, but there is still a fire in me to be a part of the FGC, but I can't dedicate the time to keep the edge. Hell, when I think of gitting gud again, I have very negative thoughts about it because of how un-viable being a professional fighting gamer can be if you're not top 100 in a given region. As being also a hobbyist in illustration, I'm very jaded on how being passionate about your interests just doesn't pay the bills. It's so frickin' saddening.

[@snarkygoblin7894]

Why don't they just win Capcom cup? Are they stupid?

[@Harroga]

Ermmm what the flip

[@pedroscoponi4905]

You just _know_ there's at least one guy somewhere in here saying this unironically tho lol

[@masontem7526]

The aslume inmates got free again

[@66coldnight]

let not forget about Saudi Arabia tournament because that is just as significant

[@ismaeljrp1]

Game publishers don’t want to pay. They want people to be content creators of the game because that is free advertising for them.

[@AngryNord]

The people who get the million will make more from their dividends annually than almost all other players, even if they never play again. That disparity is massive.

[@Aggrofool]

Singapore is a brutal darwinian jungle. It has no room for alternative career paths.

[@spiralflame88]

There is more money in being a content creator than being a pro player. Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if LTG is making more than the majority of pros.

[@machoortv]

Great video, this makes me feel good about being a content creator and not a pro player it means I chose the right path for now at least

[@misterkeebler]

I feel that the road will always be hard on the player side because FGs are always too niche to drive massive game sales, and equipment wise we arent very lucrative to invest in either. Just maybe a gamer chair or headset. Even with controls, tons of people are either sticking to 1st party pads or open-source mom & pop flatboxes. The marketing opportunity toward a LoL or CoD player is just far higher. I only see things improving if spectating keeps increasing and merch opportunities multiply.

[@Pelimatic]

I wonder if there isn't a better way for events to monetize eyeballs. Right now I don't think having high online viewer counts matters at all because no one is paying to watch, and rarely is there a way for those viewers to even spend money on anything relating to the event or their favorite players. I think there's a statistic that average fan of traditional sports spends 50 bucks a year, while the average esports fan spends five bucks a year. I think that needs to change in the future if any of this is to be sustainable.

[@2Sor2Fig]

I never knew Xian had a channel. Watching his Ibuki and Jayce's C. Viper were what made me buy SF4, my first one since playing SF2.

[@akathesk]

Having to learn the quirks of multiple characters, the reactions and observation needed, the discipline to not be messed up by mental stack or your personal issues (which have a reputation to flare up in fighting games for people I've noticed), all while with the knowledge fighting games will never be mainstream again and only the top 5% can make a living out of just playing the game? I might love fighting games but I totally understand why people would say no to ALL of that. It's like the street fighter 6 world tour intro says: we're all a bunch of fools. I don't know a solution, but I have some limited experience of local tournaments, I can tell you it's not a good feeling sometimes to know you're a jobber in someone else's story, ESPECIALLY when they turn up to the event late with a cockyness knowing they're leaving the event with SOMETHING. Hate that shit disqualify the guy I say

[@youtubedennis5223]

i sponsor myself with my job!

[@SpectralStar]

Yes! It's not easy but respect. I do as well.

[@JaySee3]

I dont think this is specific to fighting games at all, I was a semi pro rocket league player for a few years and 99% of people trying to become "pro" end up making nothing or even losing money over time. In rocket league there weren't really many offline local tournaments like in fighting games where the level of competition is lower which gives a unique opportunity to make at least a little bit of money.

[@terable3536]

great vid brian

[@LogLineX]

Gr8 vid like always. Chears!

[@Suspinded]

This is a lot of competitive gaming as a whole. There was a point where I was super try hard in Magic the Gathering, until I realized that winning good money was such a statistical impossibility, and the money was less than I could make at my job in a year. FGs are more and less statistically jacked in varying aspects to cash out, but the money at the very top is significantly better. Making Pro Play a valid occupation would require much more capital and deeper prizing than anyone is willing to offer currently. Until that comes around, it's fine to think about, but not realistic to think competitive gaming as a sustainable occupation.

[@magisterki3568]

As much as fighting games depend on tourney players and high ends. They really should pay more. If no FGC, most games would be dead. Or the games wouldn't "shape themselves" around being 'tourney legal' and shifting balances after x character wins x tournaments.. idk I'm just an outsider

[@hbpencil490]

There should be a Casino for the FGC that makes daily or weekly Tournaments like Poker does.

[@Farside-sd8tj]

Japan has always embraced fighting games more than the West, but I feel like we're slowly getting there. I've only been playing fighting games for about five years but even in that time it seems like growth has really started accelerating.

[@misplaydave]

Tennis is the 1v1 sport that the FGC should model their infrastructure after

[@mordeau7402]

fgc's top 3 best thumbnails

[@frangeek90]

Brian continuing to put out some of the most important content in the FGC

[@ymalklk]

We need to start paying to see these guys play each other ; I’ll pay . Set it up Brain

[@munchkin8465]

Are you talking to Brian or your own brain

[@_Snowflame]

​@@munchkin8465 Inspector Gadget if he didn't have robot parts

[@NumeroGaijin]

Whats SonicFox making? And Wong making?

[@CrazyLikeChris]

FGC needs a Dana white to come and make this lucrative

[@youtubedennis5223]

LOL!

[@Saixjacket]

Yeah, that won’t happen because nobody in that industry has the balls to say no like Dana.

[@Nisriel]

The timing of this video is insane lol, lately i've been grinding fighting games because i would like to earn money in tournaments, at least local, and it's something quite important to me as i really feel that it's like one of my only options to make a living (i'm someone quite anxious and inept with a lot of the "normal" day to day stuff, but i have a lot of passion for fighting games and games in general), so yeah, it would be a dream for me to earn money from fighting games. Sorry for the yapping lol, thank you so much for this video🫶🏻

[@w.h.8047]

It feels like sports in general take extreme value out of athlete's and players without giving much back historically :/

[@DelasVC]

I don‘t know. As far as I can tell gaming is an industry that lives off of entertainment after all. Since the individual events are not _that_ well populated as they might were at some point back in time, there is just not enough money to have everybody paid so they can make a living off of it. That just means that you either have to rely on sponsors - or you will just have to find other sources of income utilizing the element of entertainment, which is just streaming..

[@duxnihilo]

Somebody clip Brian_F doing a "Yo, yo, yo" and make it a drop.

[@Maver1ck101]

I understand Xian's perspective, and yet I see a lot of pros emerging in fighting games all the time. The Pakistani Tekken pro scene is going strong, with quite a few having bagged sponsorships recently. So, how are they sustaining themselves if the prize money is too small? Are they working 9-5 and playing Tekken only on the side?

[@dre3k78]

Japan is doing it right with the leagues/teams but they also have the biggest SF community in the world so they get the views and engagement to support it. I personally don't see that working here in the US. I MIGHT of worked if everything was in place when the game launched last year but i think that ship has sailed. If you don't strike when the iron is hot and convince investors/advertisers that there is a real ROI to be made then nothing goes forward. Not to mention E Sports teams in most of the US have all but dried up for the most part and the economy in much of the world is suffering from inflation/recession.

[@QGfk1]

and the fact of the matter is, even for the biggest competitive games in the world, esports has proven to be a great way to lose money for those bankrolling it. it doesn't even matter if the audiences keep getting bigger, bc it just doesn't scale. as Brian said, the ways that sports actually make money are nonexistent in esports

[@dre3k78]

@@QGfk1 Esports will never be anything like real sports. Real sports are static in nature and the games never change. While with video games there are always new titles or versions of games constantly changing. You can't invest in something that volatile. The leagues in Japan are the closest thing but still miles away....and simply aren't viable in other parts of the world.

[@chronocrosser]

Xian is awesome. I'm sure he could make some decent money if he keeps making content with Mike Ross. I know that this is the entire point of his statement, but Xian specifically does have a good route to make money by playing Street Fighter, to balance between making money, and playing competitively.

[@lukasblur3500]

Still waiting for the burger recipe my man

We need highschool and college leagues just like sports

[@matthewmoser1591]

I think content creators should fund from donos showmatches between pro players, or players and themselves or whatever

[@morlandi5]

If the situation is already critical in the US, imagine in less economically prosperous places like Africa, LATAM or Southeast Asia.

[@Sunsuperman]

For the hype it brings, EVO prize money is disgustingly bad.

[@Pasuhdina]

We need a competitive league that has show. The NBA is the NBA because of viewership deals with major networks. Like if there was an FGC league show on Netflix/Amazon or something. The community would have to support with views. Idk. Just my opinion.

[@Kawi31]

thats the thing too, even 50 k a year is so much less than any other sport, even the backup linebacker for the worst team in the nfl makes more than that, and doesnt even have to try as much, doesnt have to win 1 consistently

[@graaaaaaaaat]

while the nfl minimum salary is few hundred thousand dollars a year, nothing guarantees a player will be employed for a full year and practice squad players don't even get the minimum. the average nfl career length is only a few years, so that backup linebacker will likely make a million or so over his lifetime in exchange for serious, expensive, and long-lasting mental and physical health problems. when you add up the costs to the player and his family, the financial leftovers aren't enough to support a family or retire on in most places in the united states. he's working his butt off in a modern-day gladitorial bloodsport and playing injured and giving up huge amounts of family time because he knows he has to win personally every day or he'll be the first to be replaced by someone in the yearly influx of younger and cheaper players. after the league chews him up and spits him out, he'll have to beat the odds to avoid being in the 80% of players who go bankrupt after playing. but the full story is actually much worse because the nfl backup linebacker is one of the "lucky" ones in that he made it to the nfl, which has only a few thousand players. this number is a tiny fraction of the huge numbers of college, high school, and youth players who will never be good enough to make it to the nfl. the college ranks and below get all the same injuries as the professionals but none of the money. the nfl and american football in general is just another entertainment business where only a few lottery winners at the top get paid while the rest of the players get nothing and like it until they're forced into the real world only to find out they're years behind everyone else. make no mistake: the nfl is a brutal business, financially and physically, and nothing to direct children into or for the fgc to aspire to.

[@ΚρανίΩ]

thats like saying even the worst brain surgeon makes more money than a lifeguard, as if its comparable

[@Kawi31]

@@graaaaaaaaat Thanks for the extremely in depth comment, its rare to see that in youtube comments. but I do agree NFL still has a insanely high standard and risks of the job, but you get what i mean right? Even the 0-16 team gets to live extremely well-off, meanwhile the best fighting game player of the most popular and well funded game only gets to live at like twice the rate of minimum wage. Im not saying that the NFL is easy or that the players that are there arent really good, but theres a much wider net to get in, imagine being 32nd at an fgc tournament and getting hundreds of thousands of dollars

[@graaaaaaaaat]

@@Kawi31 you're welcome and thanks for your thoughtful and polite response, also a rarity in youtube comments. i appreciate your effort to find a common understanding. i do agree that every nfl player who actually gets to take home the league minimum salary makes more raw dollars in a year than virtually all fgc players over their career, even the very best gamers. i also agree that some of the nfl player earnings aren't immediately tied to performance.

[@maxowy9039]

Do you think Riot Games arrival will change a bit the situation? Idk if it will happen but if someone can make it happen its them.

[@joshthefunkdoc]

The issue is that League has been going downhill as an esport in more recent years - as another comment here mentioned, their most recent world championship prize was lower than Capcom Cup's! i was one of those people who was saying back in 2009 that esports felt like it was built on nothing - i just didn't understand what companies like Intel had to gain from their logos appearing on a player's shirt for maybe a second at a time on an internet stream. Seems like i had the right idea, just that people were able to be sold on the idea that there COULD be money in this for a fairly long time.

[@axeoseilez3207]

Pro wrestling has the same issue. Like before wwe became big like corporate big wrestlers would sleep in their cars and go to the next show

[@PomadaGaming]

0:32 oh. Well what’s the serious stuff with then

[@PomadaGaming]

3:57 oh yeah i think i saw that one 4:06 lmfao

[@donniedarko1234]

we love brine

[@CallMeKap_]

Since I started following the FGC in 2020 ive always felt this about the tournament scene/circuit... There needs to be levels to this shit. What I mean is instead of having a single tournament like "Combo Breaker", these events should start hosting tournament series. The "Combo Breaker FG Tournament Series". They can have tournaments with different entry fees. A $10 event where every Tom, Dick and Harry can enter. A $100 event where semiserious ppl can take their shot. And then have a "Pro" or a "Main" event at the end, where it's still open to everyone, but the buyin is high, in order to generate a prize-pool worth fighting for. I personally think it would be sick to have a idk a 1k buyin where it gets say 100 entrants. Now we got a 100k pot, 25-30k for 1st and like 10-15th getting like 2k. Now just think if the 1k gets 200 entrants... 300, etc. Always pay top like 12-15% (so like a 300 person event would pay like 35-45 players), but some serious cash could end up top for grabs. Imagine if every major did a series like this. Maybe it's not realistic. I understand there are a lot of logistics. Not to mention some stops hosting like eleventeen games. But I think a series with big money tourneys at the end would draw not only good participation but a large live crowd to watch. Def would generate big streaming numbers, which draw sponsors ($$$). PPL LOVE TO WATCH WHEN THE STAKES ARE HIGH!

[@thesecondtolastmimzy]

Not to be preachy but it's always the people who love to point out how the strong stumble that would never have the guts to get in the arena themselves

[@evriXO]

2XKO is going to change this.

[@pezyg]

Well yeah no shit, I wish people were able to live off playing tournaments but thats not feasible

[@SethKaiba25]

Esports needs to start charging people to view. I don't know if it should be like 5 dollars a month to watch Capcom Events or something but it just doesn't generate revenue right now, sponsorship and basic ad revenue isn't enough. It sucks but that's how all major sports do it and the FGC needs to find a way to follow suit (It's more complex than this but at least a start)

[@Saixjacket]

Yo they’d better get something for that 5 besides sweaty dudes on a screen 😂

[@underpressure4852]

Isn't it the most Street fighter thing though? Like most SF characters aren't just full time fighters, they almost all do something to support themselves economically; even Akuma sells fruit to get himself by. Ryu does construction IIRC, Blanka has his business and so on. That doesn't excuse pro players not getting adequate payouts but i feel like its part of the equation as a whole.

[@NotTheWheel]

I mean the guy is wearing a jersey with sponsors on it yes? I'm assuming he's getting a cut or part of a org right?

[@bbyowll]

Fighting games have come along way in terms of earning potential even if it still doesnt seem all that impressive. The reason is the growth of the scene. If the scene does grow enough, more money will be out there. That's the "job" of those that want more money to go around- grow the scene. It's up to each individual, the way in which they want to participate as far as competing/entertaining/consuming, but just because high level players aren't making good money across the board doesn't take away from the fact that there are some who can and do, or that there isn't room for fighting games to keep growing.

[@ThisDude4]

The F stands for fly

[@fatalradius]

That 1 mil that Kawano made went to him?

[@gaberosado1901]

i think venues need to be smaller and prize pools more focused on the players. Keep tournaments more focused on being streamed and don’t worry about having a huge live audience.

[@Hurricaneroad3111]

America in general doesn’t value playing games as a sport. Even when that kid won 1 mil in Fortnite got scrutinized on live tv. Even though he’s now richer than that person will ever be. If they attacks kids for this being an adult would be worse.

[@misplaydave]

This is why I call the FGC a hobby, and for me it’s fine because this is not how I make my money. I do feel bad for the players that do try to make this there main source of income.

[@rabblerouser8195]

so I should become a TO and be the one selling shovels

[@ΚρανίΩ]

W mindset

[@erheetrherh2659]

So in order to make 65k a year you have to be like top 5 player in the world, damn that's bad.

[@MegaJackolope]

Dota 2 has already had this longstanding problem where The International up until last year held this giant purse that by and large dwarfed the other tournaments throughout the year. The top ten teams were the only ones making 95% of the money in the scene. Maybe that number's hyperbolic, but it can't be far off from the truth. A single win would erase 8 years of struggle for many of these players. The solution is to spread some of that prize money down thru the rankings so the scene's can exist. People need money to survive and still pursue things at a high level uninterrupted for an extended period of time.

[@Extra_Onions]

the "below minimal wage" applies to the USA- for many countries that's above avg salary

[@marcorodriguez8792]

Yummy thumbnail 😋

[@User-pu3lc]

The esport isn’t popular enough to support the number of “pro players” trying to make it. Sponsors come with increased number of people, ad revenue goes up with more hours watched. To my knowledge, betting is no where to be found from an official business perspective (massive for UFC/boxing etc). On top of this, there are a huge number of titles splitting up the space further. Esports where pros can make a decent wage are in genres with like 1-2 REALLY big games everyone gets condensed into.

[@TaxEvader420]

In Evos case it just seems like greed, they are sponsored out the ass

[@570-q1y]

Hi brine

[@sanjivinsmoke2719]

Yep. It aint worth to be professional at a eSports.. just stream and content creation is the way... Sucks for the pro but hey thats on you

[@Boom_OH]

Ohh hi mark

[@evilme73]

I don't understand where people get the idea that they SHOULD be able to make a living purely by competing? There's very few sports (or esports) where that is a possibility, and ALL of those have such large audiences that if you were to inflate the SF6 base to the same size, then most of the current "pros" would be overtaken anyway.

[@Ash0512]

Then you look at League that has like $100,000,000 tournaments compared to SF6 with $1,000,000

[@lupapupa1963]

League has a huge player base tho. I hope fgc reaches to that level at some point.

[@killroycantkill]

League is literally top 3 largest games in the world though. If anything the $100mil prize pool for league is small when taking into consideration the profits riot and tencent make.

[@themur880]

League has a substantially larger player base and takes massively more money The viewership differences might as well be completely different realities. That 2M circuit was Capcom practically giving money away. Comparing that to league or DOTA which outright print money? Very different

[@junioredge9674]

Punk says hes a content creator ijs.... Y'all know that's where the money is

[@hybridevil]

Bottom line is Fighting Games are not big enough to justify esports; 1MIL capcom cup is kind of charity from Capcom and OK in year 1 of a new game...not year 3-4 down the line.