The Reality Of Playing Off Meta - Important Lessons I Had To Learn

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Possibly a mini series
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#Splatoon2 #Splatoon3 #ProChara

[@TGCPhilip]

If Brella were to actually receive a damage buff somehow, would you attempt it? Or is literally everything about Regular Brella just ass (like the kit possibly) Basically I want to know if you still love the basic idea of the Regular Brella or not (I understand that mobility and ink efficiency are also ass)

[@softy5447]

What sucks for 3 specifically with how slow kits are coming is there's a good chance you have no clue if your weapon is just being held back by an awful/weak kit or if you've reached the skill ceiling already.

[@ItzMiKeKirbY]

Unfortunately, that’ll always be the realization in *any* game at top level. Splatoon is a team based game vs single player PvP like fighting games so things could be a bit different but, at the end of the day, at top level, on equal skill, it’ll come down to how strong your weapon of choice is. “Any good can beat anyone”, is just a pipe dream many people spew out naively. As Sanford Kelly once said, “Just pick a top tier. You wanna win? Just pick a top tier.” Now, low tier heroes exist but you gotta ask yourself what your goal is.

[@juniperrodley9843]

But it's also naive to assume that top level necessarily means equal skill. Using another competitive Nintendo game as an example, MKLeo was the undisputed #1 player in Smash Ultimate for the longest time, even while he was mainly playing much less viable characters than a lot of his competition. Byleth and Corrin aren't bad, but they're not top tiers, and they're certainly not DLC top tiers. He won with worse characters just by being that much better than everyone else. Peanut's also a good example from Ultimate; even if he doesn't win big tournaments, he still absolutely trashes most players with Little Mac, arguably the worst character in the whole game.

[@ItzMiKeKirbY]

@@juniperrodley9843 Yes, you’re right. Skill is an anomaly and isn’t a 1 to 1 since it isn’t an exact science that can be measured. (Which is what causes PR disagreements, but, I digress.) But at the very top level the skill gap between you and your opponent will barely be that much of a difference that the character you choose will make the difference. To say at top level play your understanding and own player skill alone will give you the W is a bit overzealous. In fact, to even get in that position you’re going to need more than just skill. MKLeo played those character because, mind you, in the earlier days players were still figuring out the game. He was just that ahead of the curve in his understanding of said game. Once people understood the game better you saw the old characters that MKLeo played fall off. This is why you never see him play Ike, Corrin or Byleth anymore. In fact when he did play Corrin or Byleth he saw success but his tournament wins eventually started to tank. There is a reason why he is just now playing Pyra/Mythra, a character at the top of the tiers who is also better than another character he barely ever plays, Joker. Conversely, same reason applies why you saw so many “rising stars” during the inclusion of Steve, much like Smash 4 which had it’s own fair share of “rising stars” after Bayonetta’s launch. Tiers played a huge factor in all that regardless of where your skill level was and, you could argue, was a patch for lack of skill. Peanut is one of my most respected players because, much like him,I was a low tier hero too. Peanut wins off of his own skill and some gimmicks. He’s a brilliant player. But, he also succumbs to the tier list or at least just flat out loses at the character select screen. At the end of the day Peanut’s goal is to be respected for his own skill and individuality. Meanwhile, MKLeo wants to be the one that wins tournaments. Their character choices based on the tier list reflects that. Chara wants to be the best. Does he want to be *just* the best S-Blast? That’s up to him, but, front what he has pointed out. He wants to be on the top stage.

[@ahmbetr3254]

Keep your spirits up chara. In spite of the fact that you didnt have enough time to learn the comp you still did well in the tournament.

[@atbricks5723]

Sprinkler splat at 3:02 :0

[@galagatorgames1317]

This topic, in my opinion, deserves to be more well known

[@roobie_not_ruby]

My problem is not knowing the actual power of weapons that are not obvious top tiers or horrible low tiers. There is the gray area of weapons that aren’t bad but they definitely aren’t the best and I don’t know where in the gray area they stand. I currently use Vblaster and Luna Neo and they feel like high tier weapons but I have zero clue if they actually are or not. I just know that I can perform well with them and I don’t struggle much when fighting clearly better weapons. Does this make them high tiers? No, but I can’t be certain.

[@salsalsalsalsalsal3094]

Hard agree, I don't think people should avoid off-meta picks, but if you're picking something that people consider to be not the best, you gotta be prepared to put in the time and work to overcome the hurdles that the wider player base sees in the weapon that turns them away from it. I'm trying to become a top Dapples player and I understand why teams I play with might not want me to run them. I need to guarantee that my performance with this weapon will be AT LEAST just as good, if not better than with standard meta weapons.

[@ShortcakeAngle]

just commenting to say that i really enjoyed this and would like to see it become a mini series

[@dienik512]

keep in mind that this really only applies to competitive play with teams, not soloq where it's often full of charity cases. ProChara himself once said that anything works in soloq

[@DePariah]

Interesting topic, and I like your take. For me personally, I try to find a balance between fun and usable. I did something similar in splatoon 2 and only used meta weapons for most of it, but I just didn’t enjoy it as much. Now I tend to play weapons with interesting mechanics (eg Tri-stringer and s-blast) that are more fun to me but that I can also win fairly consistently with (keeping in mind that I am not on a team and just kick around s rank)

[@antsjohnson9379]

Most people talking about viability have 2 factors unspoken, or vague at best: 1. Goal (most humans don't understand themselves, this is a universal issue throughout life) 2. Cost to achieve goal (everything is theoretically possible, but very real details define what actually will happen) The usual culprits: -"My goal is to X" when it's actually "My goal is to X in the exact way I want to do it" Godspeed, but PLEASE, realize and acknowledge it. -"It's possible" on repeat, with a very poor understanding/acknowledgement of the cost -Just not actually understanding yourself, and also we change to make things even tougher. Again, normal, life is a journey

[@darrinfix199]

as a solo que only player, occasionally go through this but in reverse. I've never cared about the meta instead using works for me. was an N'zap(in 1 & 2) who is currently a splattershot because it has a better kit to me than any of zaps right now. as a fringe s+/bottom x player, am competitive in s+ but then switch to just holding my own in x. sometimes will think what got me there is no longer good enough and try switching to a "better" weapon I'm pretty good with and find it doesn't make much of a difference and go back. what I found mostly works is focusing more on my role as a jack player- spraying ink, assisting, attacking-whatever helps get the win...even if a good amount of the time my stats are now embarrassing in the reveal.

[@polandsprinq]

this is honestly smthn i needed to hear! ive been a bloblobber main for 3 years and it is my forever weapon.. i took pride in being good at a non-meta weapon since i used it in x rank in 2. i also work well with it in series but in 3's x rank... ive been getting destroyed. im always either blaming the maps or my skills bc i refused to blame the weapon itself. but it really sucks entering a match, looking at the comps, and just knowing which team is (most likely) going to win. its hard but im going to start accepting that blobblober truly has its limits that i cant make up for :')

[@softy5447]

It is such a damn shame sblast got nerfed with its vanilla kit so hard with it having the makings of a ridiculously rewarding high skill floor weapon. Placing this high while being held back by the chains of a dog kit that does almost nothing to synergize with your team makes me confident you'll be sweeping with this once it gets a good kit

[@ashy3604]

3:01 SPRINKLER KILL

[@Terotrous]

I was watching a recent Smash tournament where Game and Watch was doing really well, and one of the commentators mentioned that one of the G&W players had said that he believes G&W is top 5 (which is not yet a common opinion). The other commentator replied "well, if you don't think your character is top 5, why are you playing it?". That was the first thing that came to mind when watching this video. I think if you reach a point where you believe S-Blast is holding you back, it's time to switch, but if you think it's good, it's fine. Of course, Smash is a solo game and Splatoon is a team game, which does mix up the dynamic to some degree, but I will say that from watching your matches I didn't generally get the impression that you were "the problem".

[@Nebb_]

This was very interesting to listen to, would love to see more of these types of these kind of videos

[@joshuawan1031]

What’s the forge pro outclassed by???

[@preyingshark4878]

Machine. Though post-patch that might not be the case anymore tbh

[@beamed7770]

i played splat brella for like 4 years without changing my main only to discover nintendo put the weapon in the ground in splatoon 3. getting used to not having a shield was so hard

[@luigipie5402]

Feels like I’m watching squid school with how you talkin 😂

[@Lt31337Luca]

At the end of the day, I still go back to ttek after several losses in Series because I get tired of drowning in current rank and the thing kills quick and comes with a Splat Bomb

[@000-j7p9m]

This is kind of where I'm at with tri-stringer. I really like using it and believe in its potential, but it's been frustrating as the only weapon class without a new kit. I think toxic mist is the worst sub in the game and is holding the weapon back.

[@remix7345]

this is why ill probably never get into comp. all the weapons i fancy tend to be widely considered C tier or niche picks at best. if health issues or time constraints werent already an issue, this would definitely be the final nail in the coffin. its too much of an uphill battle.

[@solalala8602]

really good video, i think a lot of people in this community need to hear something like this. its fine to be off meta but you have to accept that you wont be able to win. something else people need to understand is that it does not make you a better person for playing off meta (not that theres anything wrong with playing off meta either, its just a difference of playstyle at the end of the day) hope to see more stuff like this in the future about mentalities and the like

[@Goggy.96]

its crazy hearing chara say winning a low ink with lower tier weapons if difficult because about half a year ago i was and still am the only v96 one trick to get to LI finals (in S3) crazy also great video talking about mentality of off meta picks and there is defiantly more than enough proof out there that if you full commit to a weapon even if it is off meta you can sometimes see success with it

[@supershadow125]

I'm like this with painbrush at the moment. I can see potential in this weapon being strong. Not the best, but a very strong respectful weapon that can contest with some shooters. Now its about me getting better as a player and growing with the weapon and having fun with it

[@NozeKnows]

I'm a brella main and uuuuuuhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, at least I also main slosher 😅

[@regisdavi2137]

Wait, what happened with that last reefslider?

[@snivyboy168]

Algorithm boosting time

[@isaaclewis8572]

0:50 man said NO im not going to d-

[@preyingshark4878]

Chocopero used Forge in that tournament because he had been grinding X Battles with the Forge at the time and decided to roll with it. That's all. But people act like Forge is a lot worse than it actually is yeah. With the latest Machine nerf we're probably one Forge buff away from people picking Forge unironically tbh

[@Rageball28]

That’s a good point. Aside from machine, Forge and gloogas are the next best booyah weapons but gloogas are almost completely outclassed by .52 and .96 deco. If the Forge gets a meaningful fire rate/painting/points per special buff, it might see more use.

[@MidX4]

I love these type of videos for the second channel hope there will be more videos like this

[@UwUNekoni]

When I think of off meta I think of... SPLAT BRELLA! (One of my favorite weapons but I like undercover more)

[@Multigameguy35]

I remember DUDE having his vid about dropping weapon-based pride and playing what's good. That didn't sit with me as splatoon's brought out ALL of me pride and pettiness, but maybe I'll finally quit screwing around and play a splattershot/dualie. ...I just really wish I had my dual squelcher

[@Onyxs]

I’d love for bow to be a high tier weapon, (hopefully if another kit ever comes out that can change it), but for now I just play it casually and when I play seriously I play Tetras because I know they’re good weapons and I can perform better with them. Not a tournament player, but that’s what I would probably end up using if I did play.

[@roomismoor]

it’s not just the weapons YOU choose, because sometimes the enemy team uses meta that outclass you even if you have a top tier weapon as well, and I use off meta weapons a lot, and can pull off wins, about 70-30, some days only 50-50, but i can normally do good as long as I am not outclassed, and my teamates have string options to use for support

[@tomou_]

Im a tent player, and I also play some kind of 1-shot direct slow fire rate weapons (squiffer/range). These weapons even when I play in a coordinated environment are so tough for me to make progress with as you gotta position well even at casual levels (S+ open). I might not do tournaments or competition on splatoon, but know that even from a casual perspective, choosing a weapon is also a matter of is it good or not, I try to play what I like hence I do not play shooters. I think the game is more challenging but also more fun like this and it’s sad the competitive scene has such a restricted “requirement” of weapon if you want to win. Hopefully game balance will improve allowing more and more options to be part of the competitive scene. (Also smash bros does have that same problem tough it’s not 4v4 your character choice is completely up to you)

[@softy5447]

9:43 wait holy shit I didn't know you could do that jump on sturgeon, I have a new spot to sneak in and do squiffer things

[@tynamozapokemando2089]

I feel like you picked S blast because its more fun for you to play even tho you’re playing competitively its still a video game at the end of the day and in the wise words of a retired man “If its not fun why bother?”

[@cammy7804]

i feel like i'm in a weird spot because of my weapon choices my team in general tends to value weapons we enjoy over what strictly might be optimal. my primary weapon pool shakes out to dynamo, range, and sploosh. we also have big swig and aerospray players despite the overall vibe of the team, i'm the only person who doesn't have a really "good" weapon to enable other people to play their weapons. i still do enable them, but it feels more like a skill/knowledge diff thing since we are a low/mid level team i am committed to my weapons still. i pretty much play what makes sense to me. they are mediums through which i play the game, so the more natural it feels, the better i play. i can always tell when or where i'm held back (i'm good a playing off range's kit since the other 2 weapons are lackluster in that department, i'm decent at support/anchoring since dynamo sucks and i'm good at sharking and keeping up paint, skirmishing, and choosing what fights to take because of sploosh) by my weapons, but it doesn't make me want to play them less at the same time, i feel like i genuinely wouldn't be able to do as well without playing these weapons. at some point it was my opinion that i understood my own weapons so much more than "better" weapons, or was so mechanically better in comparison that i should stick to what i liked. that's not true anymore, i could probably pick something like charger (a weapon i have little experience with and personally think is quite bad) and still play it effectively (in regards to what the weapon wannts to do) in a comp i guess it only comes down to this being how i enjoy the game, and my team being okay to bite the bullet on my behalf in return weird 5am brain thoughts in a random youtube comment section lol i guess i'm unsure if: 1) i'm holding myself back as a player with my weapon pool 2) if i'm (currently, since we're talking like top of low ink level or so) holding back my teammates from improving at the game 3) getting the most out of comp splatoon this way

[@TheBoodercg]

To be fair ChocoPero is a squeezer enthusiast. With that weapon in a tough spot Im sure he went forge pro is for the bombs. I try to push both weapons and find no difference.

[@hokome42]

I would definitely be interested in the "other things you learned to improve your mental game" you mentionned at the beginning of the video! Also very helpful vid.

[@EclipseAtDusk]

Makin me consider taking Silver Aerospray into competitive, on the odd map-mode,,, Regardless of the weaknesses of the weapon, I’ve learned to play around them, and I’m confident that as long as I eventually learn the right modes for it, I can make it work

[@petea1918]

Stop talking please

[@chrisdray5325]

you see that little x at the top of your screen? you can press that at any time

[@Ashsams]

Just don't watch? Wth 💀

[@Ashsams]

@@petea1918 oh get over yourself and find a hobby that isn't pointless hating 😂💀