The Risky Business of Storm Camping

[@RaspberryWhy]

Also, don't forget that if you are prepared to put yourself at risk you may need to be rescued by people who put themselves at risk to help you. Don't be stupid. Don't be selfish. Know your limits

[@Neohurricane]

Edale Mountain Rescue were out rescuing some campers in Storm Bert, not very considerate....

[@davidalderson7761]

Totally correct. I always carry a tracker but my golden rule is if the weather is ever so bad I would wait out till it cleared before I ever pressed the SOS. If at all possible.

[@Golf4Driver]

​@@davidalderson7761Leave that decision to the rescue crews. They are professional, and have the best gear for the job. If they think the weather is too severe for a rescue mission, they will call it off. A lot of people have died because they waited too long to ask for help.

[@jameshudson8514]

I learnt my lesson a few years ago….went winter camping in a snow storm with some very expensive 4 season gear thinking it would take anything,i was very wrong and nearly got blown of the mountain on the col between catstye cam and helvellyn,lying in a tent getting blasted by storm force winds when all the poles snapped hanging on for dear life was not a very pleasant experience…..wise words Paul

[@paullydon8577]

Excellent video! I remember years ago Vango had a very robust but very heavy tent called a Hurricane. One night camping in a very windy Llanberis Pass my Hurricane was the only tent standing in the morning. Some people came back from the pub and found their tent had actually blown away! My mate's Hurricane pitched next to mine had a snapped pole (they were two pole tunnel tents so with one pole gone that was it...) so he had to get into my tent as well. When someone complained to Vango about their Hurricane tent hadn't survived a storm, they replied that if buildings and large trees were suffering damage, how did they expect a temporary shelter such as a tent to survive such conditions. When it was pointed out in a magazine article that Vango's tent was called a "Hurricane" (a new tent introduced after their famous and very robust Force 10 tents) which was misleading after tents hadn't survived fierce storms, the reply in the magazine was: "It's just a name. Mars bars don't come from mars!".

[@cyrilhaessig27]

Weather unpredictability is the rule of thumb, this is why understanding the terrain, where to pitch, your equipment and its limits, when to bail out etc. is so important. Getting caught in bad weather is one thing, it happens ... Chasing bad weather for clicks is another, and is completely pointless.

[@IanPalmer-nv6pg]

The most bomb proof tent I have owned was the old Ultimate Equipment Tramp 2 with metal "A" poles at the front and a single small pole at the back it stood up to some really savage winds and was really light. A superb tent.

[@mow-zr6ni]

In my opinion the best shelter when bad weather is forecast is a bothy or your home so you’re not at risk or no one isn’t potentially at risk rescuing you. The adventure will still be there.If you must go out pitch in a sheltered location

[@OnlyVansGuru]

Love that walk Paul . So ..... After coffee with Jo and you I've finally started my vanlife channel - thank you . 5 days in and growing .

[@PaulMessner]

Just subscribed Martin. Will catch up with the videos tomorrow

[@vinnydawson7565]

I can not go wild camping because health reasons, but I have got back into camping on sites. I must admit listening to yourself is like your mate talking to you, your videos are so informative. Thanks

[@PaulMessner]

@@vinnydawson7565 I like to think that I’m talking to my mate. Glad you like the videos.

[@greyhikes5236]

I was on the Pennine Way two weeks ago and the weather forecast was 50/50 if the storm was going to hit. I was only 3 days in and decided that I wasn't going to get myself into trouble or anyone coming to looking for me into trouble and walked off the trail. Next day it was -10 and all my equipment would not see me comfortably through that.

[@oscardodd4223]

I must admit - I’ve never seen the point of going out specifically because the weather is crap - and then it seems even more bonkers to camp at the top of a hill or in an exposed location. You can almost always find a sheltered pitch which is largely out of the wind (this is easier in Scotland tbf where legalities of wild camping aren’t an issue) and with a bit of replanning and still be up high on the tops all day - or better - go to a bothy! I’ve been caught out on a windy night enough times to say a buffeting tent does not make for a nice sleep!

[@azclaimjumper]

I especially liked that you mentioned Hilleberg tents come with samples of materials used, along with tear strength. I don't know of any other tent manufacturer that tells "tear Strength" of inner, outer, footprint materials & includes samples of those fabrics so you can try to tear 'em yourself. "Shelter" requires strong tear strength materials, strong poles, strong guy line material & someone who pitches their tent properly. BIG heavy rocks atop tent pegs is my go-to methods to insure pegs stay in the ground all night, regardless of how strong/gusty winds are all night. Warm Regards from Reno, Nevada, U.S.A.

[@StewartJordan]

Another informative video with some sage advice. I love the way you don't preach but present facts based on your experience and others. Thank you. I have to say the jury's out on the tent peg advice, but I'll definitely give it a try.

[@MG-bs5mr]

Tbf even those relatively tall clumps of reedy grass you can see at 6:05 can break the wind up enough to provide surprisingly good shelter.

[@simontyrrell8866]

Love your vids Paul,but I cannot agree that storm camping is to be avoided, if you've got the right kit and pitch in the right place it can be exhilarating!

[@PaulMessner]

I agree it can be exciting and I do say at the end of the video that you need to hike your own hike. If you have the suitable gear and skillset then it’s personal choice. Not everyone understands all the risks though unfortunately

[@_Mountain_Dave]

The issue here Paul is people going out for their fun - then things going wrong, as they tend to with the inexperienced and then the call comes in. People have to leave their loved ones, jobs, home to get kitted up and get up the hill to come and search/rescue you risking their own lives and livelyhood. Only a few years back one of the lads down In the Patterdale team fell 500feet in winter conditions, never walked again and passed the year after or so. The only people going camping in bad storms willingly on the top of the hills are those that have never been in true survival situations (my initial point), the completely stupid, or the selfish (and stupid) for monetary utube reasons. The only other people are some parts of the military, but note they have the training, and equipment to get through it. I find it a bit sad to be honest people feel the need to go for making youtube video's i've seen countless all because they have a hilleberg (great tents yes and used them for 20+ years) think that it will save them, any tent can fail, especially if used by people that don't know what they are doing and know how to setup for a storm. Lastly Paul, you mention 50-60mph gusts, its common to see 100mph+ gusts in storms on the tops, wont be that in the valley. I've been in scotland and known 130mph. To put that into perspective at 100, your deep into the only safe option is to crawl if you have to move. People forget the top of the UK is less than 150 miles from Greenland in latitude. One last advice for winter, always carry a closed cell form matt, aribeds can and do fail, and a waterproof bivy bag. Also i would add even when day hiking, you never know when an accident can occur, and if your on frozen ground, and its freezing its about buying time until people can get to you. Airbeds fail and are useless when flat, also you may not be able to inflate one due to injury but can roll onto a matt and get in a bivy if solo. If going as a two person, alwasy carry an emergency shelter, they happen also to be rather pleasant to have some food and a brew, or read a map and the temp difference is astounding. One final point, if going remote, always leave a route with a loved one, and plan to be out of phone network, consider strongly a garmin inreach mini, complete lifesaver especially if solo and ensure you have a whistle for attracting attention/torch.

[@johncolquhoun6416]

Been caught out in so called summer. Gale force winds and rain. Wash out. Forget winter.

[@jeanwatson189]

Great vid thanks. One of the most important things is knowing when to cancel a trip, or when to turn back because conditions have turned really bad. It drives me nuts seeing idiots on some channels pressing on really dangerous conditions when there is absolutely no need to, eg they are in a sheltered valley where they could safely camp, or they haven't gone that far and they could easily bail, and yet they hike on to a very exposed location, or make risky river crossings. Nothing surer to get me shouting at my computer screen, lol.

[@tonyhall395]

This is why I follow you on here Paul, all good and common sense advice, I’ve wild camped for over 40 years and didn’t know that about the pegs 😊😊 you learn something new every day 😎😎🍺🍺 atb mate. Tony

[@Sir_Chuckmyster]

I love the adrenalin rush of bad weather camping

[@PaulMessner]

I agree it's certainly exciting and as long as you have the gear and the skills then all is okay I guess. But there are a lot of people that are ill prepared haven't assessed the risks 👍

[@anonymousinternetuser7519]

With the right gear and in the right spot we've camped in some pretty scary conditions. It's a nice challenge, but I can totally see why people would avoid it.

[@IvanDP1967]

Cold, yes. Wet, yes. Wind, yes. But all in moderation, if any of the above look even the slightest bit too bad then we stay home. No point in risking yourself or your gear just to be miserable. There'll always be another opportunity.

[@mountain_del1863]

If you are relatively proficient and experienced in mountaincraft, you can select your hills accordinngly. In Scotland, in winter, you are playing with fire on a lot of the big ranges however if you want the thrills but less of the spills, you can pick lower hills with better bail out options. As you correctly said, ive always found pegs are an vastlyimportant, but oft overlooked consideration.. lightning is utter hell.......I feel your pain.

[@bugoutbrad8395]

Great walk and talk Paul. I tend to add extra loops. On long vestibules. I also make short bungee hitches. To add to tent parts, that can flap. In high winds. Cheers 🍻 mate.

[@SmithandWesson22A]

Only time I have been moved on was when the hills 20km away were on fire. A rural fire service volunteer ( I am in Australia) was going to all the camping areas in the state forest ( free camping permitted) and giving the pack up and get out order. The winds were not felt where I was, but there was no phone signal and they knew the weather and the fire was coming my way. This was not even during Australia's fierce summer fire season and there were no bans on fires. I was actually cooking my dinner on the fire when told to extinguish it and go.

[@davehumpleby3440]

A friend and I spent 3 nights wild camping in the Lake District during this storm. We chose our pitches carefully and used cliffs, boulders etc. to shelter our tents from the worst of the wind. We also used 4-season tents (Terra Nova Southern Cross 2 for me) and used every guyline and peg. Like yourself, I had everything I wasn't using overnight packed in my bag, and I slept in my clothes so, should we need to bail, it would be as fast and easy as possible. There's no substitute for knowledge, experience and good kit.

[@grantgrow]

Good time camping, I hope

[@darenfox4882]

Everyone has different limits great video just look our selves that's the best way love to watch wild camping in not bad conditions

[@BikepackingAdventures]

I had a recent scare on a bikepacking trip in the Netherlands. Setup beside a canal, hidden behind some reeds (obviously not hidden enough) forecast was for heavy rain followed by strong winds. Couldn't seem to find my earplugs and my brain went into overdrive and by 3am I opted to abandoned, got out the tent and started to pack away in the pitch black, in the rain and winds and rode into the nearest city where the heavens open. Finding refuge under a subway I got naked out of my, by now ,wet through sleeping puffy pants and clothes. Rain eventually stopped, but the winds just got stronger and stronger as I just continued riding into the next day which was a mix of walking and cycling lol

[@chrishomer]

Great closing statement mate.

[@Mark-pk1fm]

I’d choose a bivvy bag, there’s less to go wrong being so low profile. If you can use the landscape around you for added protection all the better. Always consider the worst case scenario and if you’re not comfortable with it stay at home in front of the fire, there’s always another day.

[@littlegrandadoutdoors]

I go out in most conditions!. I have some of the best equipment, that I paid a lot of money for... I got that equipment, so I could go out in extreme conditions. However you have to draw the line somewhere. Your life and the life of the people who come to save you, are more important than the thrill of storm camping. Take care out there.

[@PaulMessner]

Couldn't agree more

[@littlegrandadoutdoors]

@@PaulMessner I was up kinder Thursday night in the snow storm.. everyone thought I was nuts, but it was not very windy , my kit has a comfort rating of -25 -30 ish.. so I was warm, comfortable and drinking lots of hot chocolate... experience's like that, make it all worth while.. just before sun up the clouds cleared, the moon was huge , the views down to Edale and over to the great ridge would probably turn some people religious... " does it get any better than that "????...

[@shabingly]

I think the best thing advice I can give (and this really applies for all weather conditions and for all gear tbh) is that you plan for your gear to fail and you need to bail. You need to be able to scarper in the dark from where you pitch, on your own. That means some form of prior knowledge.

[@papajeff5486]

We can camp with any cheap gear in good weather. It’s absolutely true that, in extreme weather, you get what you pay for. There is safety in good gear, better quality. I had a cheap poncho, literally, rip to shreds off me in a hard, windy, wet snow blizzard…not good. I was so poor and then poorly equipped. Should’ve stayed home. Thank you for this excellent demonstration and lecture…from an old vet, retired in the US foothills of the Smoky Mountains.

[@PaulMessner]

@@papajeff5486 you do tend to get what you pay for. Not always though. Thanks for tuning in again.

[@browsman2328]

Greetings from Northern California. We’ve been getting lots of rain lately, the useless weathermen call them “Bomb Cylones.” I bought an umbrella at Costco Wholesale that was advertised as wind proof up to 75 mph. Tried it out in 25 mph, worked fine but the wind blew up under the umbrella and I got soaked anyway. Dave Canterbury is the real deal, well know in the states. ex Green Beret snake eater. Great vid Paul, wrap up and stay dry.

[@davidalderson7761]

While in the North Cape of Norway the other year in summer. We had a force 8 to 10 gale. I got into a concrete shelter nearby and a guy I spotted pitched his Hilleberg Allak in the camping area. Got me thinking about tents. Next day was my last in the race and a guy and I had to take refuge in storm drains near road we were close to so we could breathe and the wind was so strong. We finished but it took hours and hours to do the last few KM.

[@bigsmoke5219]

Haven’t watched for a few weeks, but I like the moustache mate - consider keeping it 👍🏼

[@dmytrochan7402]

To be honest, when I first saw your videos, I was surprised that you set up a tent on the tops of mountains. Because all the books on tourism that I read recommend choosing a place for a camp protected from the wind, as well as from possible lightning strikes. As low as possible. Therefore, the issue of choosing a tent is in second place after choosing a camp site. And regarding stormy conditions, I learned some good words: "The main skill of a climber is the ability to turn back in time."

[@ferrettkitt]

Always be prepared to hoof it we were out in a bell tent on a campsite during storm Bert and it was being blown about but we decided to bale and head for a hotel, we didn't want the tent destroyed but for using a bit of common sense. Experience good or bad only comes from being out and about.

[@Roam.Outdoors]

Proper advice here. Investing in the correct gear is a long term investment and when you’re in horrendous conditions on the edge of a mountain you’ll be thankful you got some proper gear🤣🙌🏻

[@jonbartlett9438]

I think bailing would be a last resort, hunkering down seems like the best option in all but the most extreme situation, discuss.

[@Life-Outdoors-UK]

Great video. People just look at kit and don't seem to consider experience and knowledge. In light rain, I've seen a cavern the size of a large church fill to the roof in 20 minutes. If gone to the aid of a party of around 10 people who were blown around 100'. Some were able to walk and some airlifted off. I've seen tents flooded because of where they pitched. I go out every Friday and was out in deep snow when Storm Bert arrived. I chose where I would be sheltered best from the LD, YD, Bowland and PD. In the 50mph forecast winds, mins was between around 8 - 16mph. So long as the wind direction forecast was correct, it was a stone waller that I'd be fine. If it was wrong I could always bail and be fine just using a map and compass. If I'm out in strong winds, I won't sleep well, I'm not keen on that. I've over 40 years of experience and still learning lots.

[@feel.the.need.]

I've never been lucky enough to go camping during a storm, but it sounds amazing!

[@PaulMessner]

It’s exciting but I never get any sleep.

[@tequeena]

That was a wet walk! Important things to think about though, thanks 👍🙌

[@AndyWragg]

Generally I don't go storm chasing as I like to enjoy my camps, but there have been occasions where I've gone out expecting bad conditions and I've carried enough of the right kind of gear to get through those situations. That said, I do like a snow camp and have been out in a blizzard, luckily we were not on the tops but in the valley. It was still bad but not scarily bad.

[@Bam123412]

I think the tache may be worse than baby face Paul!!😮😮😂 I like the look of the backpack. Is that new?

[@samhill3496]

Good vid. Good points. 60 mph is 88 feet per second. Can be tough. It's always a test every time you go out. Some much more than others. Be safe. Know your limits of exposure, fear and knowledge. Be very observant. Be SMART. Many get in trouble fast. That can and does expose others to maybe a worse situation trying to save you. So think about what you are doing and adjust if necessary. Nobody wants to be a statistic. Have a good time. Nomad Mountain Man. Next time.

[@jmedia5547]

Loving the stache Paul

[@PaulMessner]

Only a few days more of Movember 😂🥸

[@jmedia5547]

@@PaulMessner 😂

[@adrianh9375]

Another great video Paul, all useful and interesting comments.👍👍 Would love to know where you were, it must be fairly local to me but I don't recognise it?!

[@wraithofsolidarity]

Some weird terrain. Looks like hummocky terrain.

[@oldirtybeuner]

Very recently a young youtuber @stormoutdoorsy died during a storm camp in Scandinavia. May he rest in peace and may it be a lesson for those seeking danger. Danger can be fatal to everybody, specially those who think they are invincible. I'm not a fan of storm camping. I don't know why people would go to the stress all just for making a video. I can't find another reason because it doesn't sound like fun to me. It is even dangerous!

[@scottplumer3668]

Isn't lightning ever an issue on those peaks?

[@shaunhutchison4049]

Mi Grandad used to take me walking up on those little hills, which I believe was a quarry?

[@tomhamer7838]

Which Buffalo Jacket is that you've got in Paul ? Obviously a change from Rab

[@GrizzlyGaz]

It's a me, Messario 😜

[@BonkersAboutAlice]

What's your view on KZbinrs going out in very bad weather to "test" kit when they are really just after clicks and views?

[@boblobster]

That's some tash your rocking, thought Charles Bromson was on your channel!

[@ryanjones-v4o]

great vid

[@grumpybob]

Nice tache! I bet your other half is delighted LOL!

[@rocketiain84]

The risky business of shaving and growing a tache, youve pulled it off mind, cant see a 50mph gust whipping that bad boy off 😂

[@cuprajake1]

its great for the tumbnail clickeyty bait tho haha

[@tubulzr]

I've been unlucky enough to got cought in really bad (almost storm) weather, almost wrecking my 1,1KG tent mono-pole structure. Won't have that issue with my Soulo RL and I love to be able to sleep on a hill/mountain top somewhere, hoping for a clear sky/no clag morning but knowing that bad weather won't be an issue. But storm camping is something different and a costly hobby indeed; just plain silly without the required expensive quality gear. And dangerous for novices, it can indeed go very wrong, very fast without proper knowledge and gear. No use ending up endangering Mountain Rescue folks, just because you refuse to be not stupid and be not prepared. Most KZbin storm afficionados will double pole, double peg, put rocks on pegs etc. And are prepared to buy a new 800-1200€/$ tent if stuff goes wrong. I like the pro videos but not my personal outdoor preference. Mountain top, sunrise and cloud inversions...? Yes, please.

[@andrew-ij1or]

They are old climbers, bold climbers, but not old bold climbers.

[@jim-bob-outdoors]

Glad I am not the only one that thinks camping in bad weather is a bit pointless. Normally only done by youtubers that do it for clicks.

[@connahhardacre2030]

Where is that paul. ??

[@janepaterson-todd693]

Every time I see a video from someone who has consciously gone out to camp when there is a storm. Never understand that level of craziness. All for the sake of a KZbin video perhaps? Mad! And of course as someone points out it may rely on rescue teams coming out and putting their lives at risks. Why would you. We can’t always predict the weather but consciously going out - selfish madness

[@expat0149]

Sensible words :)

[@matthewbrookes6749]

Camping in storms get clicks

[@JGR100]

Would still like to see you camping in the teeth of a storm like Bert. Exiting viewing 😳

[@davidurchyk1421]

We all know the lesser KZbinrs do it to build their channel.

[@531c]

At last, some commonsense advice. Thanks Paul.

[@thewoodlandwanderer3416]

I agree your not just putting yourself at risk but moutain rescue and emergency services. " I survived storm a-z",no your just a sausage. I prefer a nice calm night in the woods.

[@Dore60]

👍

[@wayout6092]

Storms on hikes can be scary, but taking advantage of a storm is an absolute blast. Take tour cheapest tent and just bivvy in it, absolutely exilarating. Storm Bert was a letdown for me, but most storms find me on Bosely Cloud which is very exposed and £25 is the most I'd pay for a tent to overnight a storm.

[@WilliamPobjoy]

👍😄

[@eddyarundale1566]

👋🏼

[@happycamper90596]

I was out camping in it Saturday, it was wild probably the worst I've camped in. It was grim

[@62pnpn]

Many people did actually camp through this storm!

[@Roblovesbushcraft]

Tbh camping in a, storm is a wholly reckless venture. Not only are you putting your life in danger your putting the lives of those that come to rescue you in peril. Not least the loss of expensive gear just for the sake of a thrill or to boost a KZbin rating.

[@PaulMessner]

I've never intentionally set up to camp when a storm for the very reasons you have mentioned. it's not worth the risk. I've been caught out a few times and have also turned back before I've even left the car when you can see that it's not pleasant. It's just no fun holding on to your tent poles all night

[@Roblovesbushcraft]

@PaulMessner Spot on Paul.

[@CharleyPattonBoweavil]

When you walk through a storm Hold your head up high And don't be afraid of the dark At the end of a storm There's a golden sky And the sweet silver song of a lark Walk on through the wind Walk on through the rain For your dreams be tossed and blown Walk on, walk on With hope in your heart And you'll never walk alone You'll never walk alone 🔴🔴🔴🔴🔴🔴🔴