The Skarner Rework: Three Weeks Later

[@MrHunterBaby]

Old Skarner Main here. The Biggest thing i miss about old skarner is the build with Trinity Force. I hated the spires.

[@kingpimpskinnypimp5329]

and the speed fuck all the extra shit, skarner always felt clunky but they made him feel clunkier then before

[@carnage0685]

I don’t know why they don’t just give him higher base AD. Sion is considered a tank and he has huge base AD.

[@Moakmeister]

Maturing is realizing that the Crystal Venom version of Skarner was FINE! He was a really good champion at that time and the spire rework was so trashhhhhhhh.

[@brainstormsurge154]

Moving the stun to landing E felt okay in my opinion. It wasn't as reliable but also gave the tradeoff of making the stun quicker. I agree that the spire was trash. I do miss that he used to have cooldown reduction on ALL his non-ultimate abilities before the spire introduction. Maybe now that they've completely removed that mechanic they'll reintroduce it into a new champion or rework of another and perhaps that would also apply to Crystal Venom.

[@OnlyGetty]

Cho'gath is fifteen years old. In those fifteen years, he received a small gameplay update to make his E a real skill instead of a toggle and a visual update. In that same amount of time, Riot has given Skarner a visual update, multiple gameplay updates and a full remake as well as several lore retcons and updates.

[@Shaco.]

No? His Ult was also changed here and there. Not losing stacks, dealing more damage to monsters/minions, HP scaling.

[@OnlyGetty]

@@Shaco. Look, I know your main is even more neglected than Cho'gath.

[@Dracon350]

@@OnlyGetty WELL, to be fair, Shaco actually has gotten a lot more attention than Cho, what with the passive rework, the change to hit ult and W, etc.

[@carnage0685]

chogath is god

[@Jesus_rrs]

They take too long to fix both. Rockstar'd be able to release a new game first than Riot reworking their champs.

[@phinnix1577]

I missed his old story about his kind. I want a depress scorpion not a paranoid one. riot got no balls on the piltover's dilemma.

[@ridori7376]

4:00 "Even metal will bleed" with Divine Intervention in the background. Someone has been playing ULTRAKILL.

[@sacha9957]

Definitely. Just look at the top corner at 1:35

[@St_bane1]

Honestly they should just make the slow percent and damage of the W scale with how close the champ is to him so the W comet spam build would require you to actually be within range to be traded on instead of half a screen away for you to get value

[@LogiEspacio]

Riot. You better give a Cristal Indomitus skin for the new Skarner. *IT'S LITERALLY MADE FOR HIM*

[@completoenjoyer]

I love that cryos dad is a member

[@Yvädastra]

I like this rework so much. I haven't had this much fun on a jungler tank/bruiser. There are still changes I'd like to see, some of which may address some of your criticisms: 1. E's damage and speed should scale with Move Speed. I understand they made it a flat spectrum because he can go through walls, but it still feels bad. I would be okay if the changes came with a nerf to the early game speed. 2. R should apply 3 stacks of passive to each enemy impaled. He's a scorpion stabbing people with his stingers. It just makes sense and would make it feel like you're doing something more than standing around if you're fighting the enemy alone away from your tower. 3. I agree that the W radius feels a bit oppressive, but I do like it thematically. Maybe a compromise could be reached where the damage and slow fall off the further the enemy is from Skarner when he casts. Having a flat 20% slow all game feels sad. :(

[@wadenbeisser2491]

I would like a second instance of r where you can slam the impaled into the ground for some dmg, becoming lower the longer you impaled the target. That way you decide if you need the cc or burst. Would play beautifully with the long cast on r

[@willscott5374]

The Speed thing is 100% what he needs. Make him able to be fast as fuck like old skarner. With his W i wish they lowered the slow and damage but made it spammable so kinda like his old q.

[@valentijnkoot2277]

I think the initial speed at which you start when you cast E could easily scale with your movement speed. I also don’t really like his current passive. It’s quite unsatisfying, it feels invisible. I’d then rather have something more periodic like Galio’s passive.

[@willscott5374]

@@valentijnkoot2277 For his passive, I wish that it was whenever you applied any cc(soft and hard, so even his slow would work with it) to any enemy it would lower your cooldowns. Nice and simple but if you get really good at applying cc can be quite strong.

[@meebybell]

Yeah between a huge nerf in base damage, mana cost increase and the fact that the slow and shield do not scale with levels, there’s zero reason to max w first or even second anymore, even in jungle. Like you would max W last with top lane grasp build, but I think it applies to jungle now too- Q and bami’s is all the clear you’ll ever need and lowered e cool down means you traverse between camps quicker.

[@lolzalot44]

The death of the "Traditional" skins is criminal and should be punished. Still love using them!

[@notyouraccount6038]

I realy like playing Sion in the jungle with lots of hability haste. So I think I will like Skaner once he comes to wild rift.

[@zazyoy2769]

Old thing good. New thing bad. I’m NOT joking

[@_Necromancer_]

4:00 ultrakill will turn him into minos prime

[@Blu_Moon_Owl]

8:47 Lmao Draven being Draven as usual Anyway I’ve also spend the last few days playing Skarner before the rework to get a feel of how different he is. I had fun with old Skarner and even carried a game with him, but my god is new Skarner so good to play. It all feels right. Especially when you make a perfect gank to catch someone and push them back to your teammates to hopefully get the kill/assist is perfect

[@OrdanKarris]

4:07 yeah very ominous and all, but where is the ultrakill videos cryo?... *WHERE?*

[@CryoBeat]

Having beaten Violent P-2 last stream, we've got a lot of editing to do, but it'll be fun.

[@OrdanKarris]

@@CryoBeat i was in your stream today, hope you don't suffer editing, i love your videos, and you even more!

[@RadicalJawzFunnyMoments]

I’d like to think cryo’s dad is their real dad supporting their KZbin adventures. Makes it wholesome :3

[@jacob-4595]

His old rock pulling animation was half a second?? Now wonder he felt so damn clunky

[@kingol4801]

He is supposed to be a slow behemoth. Not meant to be used as ADHD maxing combo character

[@kogamustard7717]

Average league players cant realize this unfortunately ​@@kingol4801

[@noakinn]

​@@kingol4801Slow and skarner is dumb as shit to see in a sentence

[@NovenaEntidad]

I prefer so much the old one bro idk i feel like the appeal of the old one it was much charismatic this one seems like was made with an IA

[@kurooaisu]

Spirit Visage seems to be better on Skarner than Abyssal Mask. With that Shojin build, you can have a huge ass shield anytime anywhere. By the way, I dislike using Titanic on Skarner. I just don't like how it feels.

[@zuccy1017]

Day 9 of- oh my god im in the video. Also i wanted to say im so so very happy for your conclusion with Skarner. I feel as if every new mechanic, every thing renovated, every concept modernized, im not sure if only traditional 5+ years players, but they always get so much disgust and subjective criticism. And hearing about your "grief" experience with the rework, it actually makes me super happy you found a satisfactory relationship with him. I also thought he was very fun, but he had a lot of red flags playstyle wise, the map changes, the unnecesarily weak scalings, the point and click cc, the unrestrained movespeed. Like he was meant to be something but in return the balancing left him with uncomfortable interactions in his kit. But im so happy for you, aside from you building LETHAL TEMPO YOU MONSTER lmao go HOB, PTA or whatever for the love of christ. though i love you cryobeat

[@umbralbushido8636]

The "HA-" from ksante cracked me up In all seriousness though I would be fine with ksante needing to build ad if it meant them restoring all the mechanics they took out of him like the flash combos and... ability to ever stick to targets without ghost (Yeah there's a reason I only play arena now)

[@chaotixthefox]

Same. He's very clunky now and feels kinda ass to play.

[@markopusic8258]

​@@chaotixthefoxAnd he's still a proplay staple in this state. Yeah K'Sante will probably receive yet another rework in the upcoming months so be ready to welcome an even worse iteration... again.

[@cloudwalker9572]

New passive, og q, og w, new e, new r, old look, og lore and I think we might be cooking.

[@Qysmuth]

I liked the spire from old skarner, but even I know that it needed be changed for balance consistency

[@netnobody6907]

The influence of ultrakill is growing on your channel... good...

[@achka1109]

i wish the w could be held down to gain speed but delay your shield and aoe

[@shadetail]

I liked the spire mechanic from the beginning. But it might just have been due to the joy of getting rid of v3 skarner

[@Polten]

Crystalis Indomitus Skarner, that needs to be a thing

[@dimondsi]

In theory, I really miss the spires. Dominion was and potentially still is my favorite alternate game mode. But in actuality, theyre just kinda shit, since they don't really cover all of where you need em to and put a wet towel on skarners ability to push an advantage cuz he would hafta self root himself on several spots to gain map control, when murder kill would be a better option. I'd just want an up to date dominion instead

[@omgodification]

Dunno if its better or not, but it certainly is a menace

[@teo2175]

Cryo becomes Gabriel for a second

[@xinshi3090]

I only do aram. But he feels really op in that game mode. Snowball, e and you got basically a guarantee stun.

[@th3summoner]

Needing to "Build damage to deal it" isn't always a good idea, but works here. Tanks and Tankier champions need some reason to not be ignored in teamfights, otherwise they are completely useless while the enemy carry kills the rest of your team. That can either come from cc threat or damage threat. Think Maokai Nautilus vs Mundo Trundle. The damage part sends them more towards Juggernaut and CC towards vanguard. Skarner has a ton of CC so he leans more towards the vanguard edge, his threat comes from grabbing your carry, not his damage.

[@mikezigma]

i have this idea to have some play skarner boy with my blitz pull them even if just into the bush near your tower, you could just drive them into turret for like 2 seconds or the duration of the skarner e. idk i see the meme lol its so easily shut down though at times

[@eiiminate3322]

Can u make a skarner guide

[@poom323]

To be honest, I still love old Skarner a lot more... except that f***ing spire.

[@Paragon-rq7vl]

Honestly, I really dont care about the gameplay update, I believe going full tank and being a 6000 HP behemoth that melts down opponents is really fun even if you don't build trinity anymore. What Im torn is the visuals, Skarner was the crystal vanguard, what stops Riot from turning him into the Ixtaly crystal vanguard?

[@carnage0685]

Really good takes all around. I'm glad this champion has people who care about him, unlike what happened with Yorick and Galio. Wish they made AP Skarner better though : /

[@ponyfish157]

I quite enjoy the comet playstile. mostly in the support position. Would probably still be better for everyone if they nerfed w range

[@poom323]

Yeah, getting everything from building one thing is really suck, I absolutely hate it, but somehow Riot like that quite a lot.

[@Cybexx15]

New Skarner is so much fun to play. Im still pissed Riot discontinued legacy skins.

[@klawiszklawiszproduction4070]

Maybe I'm just coping but for me he still feels like Skarner and that is the most important.

[@AnotherblackmanOG]

his passive got nerfed and it feels really underwhelming in the mid game, and late game. It should scale faster and more reliable maxing at 6-11 and 16. Skarner used to crap damage but they have been nerfing his damage and cc on his W which is also his shield. He was akin to a tank but now he feels like a burst champion that team fights more than duels. If the champions he goes in to kill survive his burst, he has very low chase potential now.

[@ponyfish157]

Youre dad is one of the backers? thats adorable

[@yeezusIIfan]

He looks so boring now compared to the old one

[@ShockedLogic]

Mechanically, he's a lot more fun and interesting. Aesthetically, im baffled

[@P1EMASTER]

As someone who has only mained skarner for the past 3ish years i really dont like the rework. Can basically be summed up with all the negatives you provided with two added; the spires and build variety. I actually REALLY enjoyed the spires, they made it so you had to have a good idea of map control and positioning to make the most of the champ as well as giving a decent amount of info on what is happening in the jungle. His build variety has basically fallen off a cliff because all of his abilities (minus ult) scaling so hard with health, hes turned into a rush heartsteel champ which i absolutely hate. Yeah theres ap and lethality but they seem to more so be niche picks compared to old skarner being able to make almost anything work. If they either make his W give MS or make his E scale with it i might come back to the champ but for now im sadly just kinda done with him, the spark is no longer there for me.

[@kadalix]

8:56 BY THE POWER OF FRIENDSHIP, BEGONE DEMON

[@Dragonmist19X]

I'm tired of acting like spire Skarner wasn't a mistake.

[@fernandogonzalez6759]

resuming 11:16 video in one word... "is rework better than old?"... YES

[@fernandogonzalez6759]

jokes aside, he is WAY funnier to play, have better skill expression, it have "secret tactics" to learn now (unlike old that his only "secret tactic" was "E duration is longer than R duration", you can cast E leaving the mark, use R, proc the mark after R and you have E almost again)... like, if you are on top of a enemy you can E them to whatever direction you want, and skarner can't hold a rock and cast ult at the same time, so he launch the rock instant in middle of the ult cast, so the enemy is slowed meanwhile you are casting R, also, the R push enemies to to whatever direction you casted R, so if you manage to ult "backwards" and the enemy is caught you have a "insec"... make that a combo and now you can force a enemy to dive you very VERY easly

[@carnage0685]

@@fernandogonzalez6759 wow someone who disses old skarner but actually knows what they're talking about. that's exceedingly rare in the league community

[@fernandogonzalez6759]

@@carnage0685 I just know how to read abilities and actually play to learn the champ... I suppose that's even rarer?

[@carnage0685]

@@fernandogonzalez6759 when it's an unpopular champion it is. look at how few people know it wasn't actually optimal to build full mr on Galio and he could actually do well vs AD champs pre VGU, lol, or that Yorick didn't actually have a bad late game and was a fantastic duelist. or that Urgot's ult used to give him 50% damage reduction and he was probably tankier than current Urgot is right now. people just don't know jack shit usually.

[@wubble4045]

Old Skarner player, I played the spire one- he could build anything and everything and was a real knowledge checker- anyone who respected their life did not fight him in his grounds. Now the new Skarner is all but what I loved, no tempo- tank only, no swiss knife and adaptation, clunky and slow, did I mention tank only? OH AND MAKING HIM JUST ANOTHER EGOISTIC CHARACTER WITH PRIDE TO SCALE THE MOUNTAINS! WOAH SO ORIGINAL!

[@zigh352]

I mainly just miss the turn around with his ulti, I still forget sometimes its gone and end up pushing them away from my team at the end.

[@ironboy3245]

I just want him to stop doing so much damage by just chucking rocks. Move some of that damage elsewhere but it's so fucking annoying being pelted with rocks whenever you walk up I mean I still murder him regardless but the poke is ridiculous

[@SirJoffry]

Newer League player, only been around while Skarner had spires. I never liked old Skarner on SR but I MUCH prefer it on Aram. Because while it's nice to grab three people, the short distance between the spires meant you had a permanent speed boost on ARAM, making kidnapping a lot scarier. While I don't mind the two slows on the new kit, I would prefer a more reliable stun skill like his old ranged move or a SPEED BOOST. The scariest thing about skarner's kidnapping was the distance he could move you (especially in ARAM). Now you can barely move during his ult and you can't even turn with it to reposition the enemy, forget attacking while ulting too. Moving past that, his stats are also kinda garbage in my opinion. Mostly play ARAM and Mundo with just Heartsteel out scales you when you are both health scaling characters even if you have Heartsteel with equivalent stacks and more health items. He's just too squishy for ARAM now.

[@logangant7732]

Overall i like the old one

[@WolfmanluPurpleclaw]

Just gonna say Spire Skarner is the worst Skarner and the only version I didn't enjoy. The new is good and fun to me at least.

[@phgumerr646]

Am I insane for loving the spires before? I genuinley enjoyed EVERYTHING about old skarner, 1 in a billion I know but everything clicked amazingly with me, and now that he feels different I just cant enjoy him anymore. But with the tips and stuff said in this video, ill try new skarner out again.

[@Hussain-qe4tx]

The only scam is the aatrox rework. Legit changed the champ from AA to ad caster. This is a rework, What do u expects gonna happen?? No one played old skarner but as soon as they change him mfs are quick to so ohh i miss the old one! Like!? Stfu people didn't even play him before and now they suddenly care when his playrate was low as af like these people wanna be pressed about everything

[@Bomberman64x]

Lost Identity for broad viability Aatrox: first time?

[@carnage0685]

Sion? Poppy? Yorick? Galio? No?? Just Aatrox? Don't lie, you wanted Aatrox to get deleted.

[@josebaltoomarnilson4762]

didn't lose identity either

[@lightknightgames]

I don't even need to watch "Lol NO" - But I have to be 'unbiased' because the league community is obnoxious even though 98% of players didn't even play her.

[@thanhao5500]

The old skar both version was so trash even tho i like him, he was like my first champ i buy with IP, the new skar feel so good like throw rock so fuk the kite and e hard counter lee sin, after this rework he was my 2nd fastest mastery 7 after ekko back then, even when he got bad rap on release i still choose him

[@thisisquitter]

Skarner got the Udyr treatment, and people will enjoy it better as time passes, dont worry

[@Rev1n0s]

Doubt it. Appeartly the only liked the skarner the tragic faliure whos only purpose in life is to be a villian like sylas. So before you complain old skarner was better think about how rito handled sylas's story before mageseeker and really ask if it was different

[@munchy6211]

No he didn't. Udyr still has the same gameplay, playing around stances and auto attacks. Skarner is dead. Nothing remains of the old one. Rip my main, guess that's one less reason to come back to league.

[@kirby3910]

Nah...as someone that constantly played old skarner....he had more potential before then he does now

[@SoyMoqueta]

The old Skarner was just better, nubers talk, the new Skarner is only played when is stromg and none in the Skarner players comunity likes him at all.

[@kirby3910]

Players that dont play Skarner: "I love the Skarner changes" Skarner Enjoyers/Mains: "I miss old Skarner"

[@carnage0685]

I had several hundred games on old Skarner and I like the new one. He's not perfect, but he's a lot better than past reworks (Yorick, Galio, Aatrox).

[@josebaltoomarnilson4762]

20% of playerbase: "i love skarner changes" the 5 people who mained skarner: "i miss old skarner"

[@carnage0685]

@@josebaltoomarnilson4762 wow! great attempt at not only being correct, but dehumanizing people in the process! amazing : D in case you didn't even bother to watch the video before spewing hate speech, Cryo mained old Skarner and also likes the changes, and basically all of the 1m+ mastery players also are fine with the rework. do you just enjoy trying to dehumanize people on a daily basis, or what?

[@Hihitoto23]

man I don't really like this rework, I wish they kept his crystal aesthetic and just got rid of his passive while revamping his old abilities to match the game's more versatile champions. Keeping his old q mostly the same, and changing his e and w would of made him keep more of his identity. Maybe keep the single targeted ult but make it a faster skill shoot like a scorpion quickly jabbing his stinger at an opponent. this rework just suffers from aatrox syndrome where they just added a guy that looks like the old skarner but is nothing like him.

[@carnage0685]

people wanted Aatrox to be removed then complained when it finally happened. now every time Riot does an actual rework they cry "Aatrox!". go fucking figure

[@Hihitoto23]

​@@carnage0685??? aatrox when the rework launched was on his most healthy state he had been for years, getting played in high elo and being a very unique champion.

[@Hihitoto23]

​@@carnage0685no one wanted aatrox removed, they just expected the rework to keep most of his identity while modernizing his kit, like the warwick,nunu and udyr reworks accomplished

[@carnage0685]

​@@Hihitoto23If they expected that to happen, then they are all even dumber than I thought, because the only one of those reworks that had happened by that point was Warwick, and Warwick was both followed and preceded with some of the worst reworks Riot has ever done. Not to mention, Riot already said they were going to scrap his entire kit, an idea they probably got by the positive reception they received when they scrapped Yorick and Galio's kits. You reap what you fucking sow.

[@Hihitoto23]

@@carnage0685 I was just giving examples of more recent reworks that came to mind but most champion reworks to date had kept the champions mostly intact removing problematic parts of their kit or just shifting them from point and click to skillshots, Examples of this are taric, poppy and even galio and yorick kept most of their identity the same having galio still be the MR tank he was with his iconic taunt but modernizing him to be more functional, Same with yorick keeping his ghouls but scrapping his ult as it was too powerful. Aatrox on the other hand went from an autoattack carry with team utility and a revive to something entirely different. Riot never said they were scrapping aatrox's entire kit infact just a month before the rework they gave his old version a mini rework that made him great in high and mid elo. btw chill out dude lmfao what are you so angry at

[@joseepp1712]

Completely failed design imo

[@RockCarvingWind]

Gabriel, was that you?

[@drunkengibberish1143]

“I…. I spiked a support into a home nexus, the adc begged me not to! ‘Ooooh! Skarner! Thy gosh is…’ what the fuck ever.” *punting sounds* “and another! I went through them like fucking candy!” *intense griefing sounds* “and then we FF’d”