The SPR Scope Dilemma: 3-18x GLx vs 2-10x

[@toddinfl]

Yes, time for 10-40x56.

[@christophermitchell7925]

I’d love to replace my 6-24x56 with a 10-40x56, but that’s on my floated & glass bedded bolt rifle.

[@VincitOmniaVeritas7]

Who makes that 10-20x56? Athlon or Sightmark?

[@Schultz344]

Razor gen 3 6-37 is a thing

[@steffensamlal1854]

So we putting spotting scopes on rifles now, nice 😂

[@VincitOmniaVeritas7]

@@steffensamlal1854 hey, it’s 20-60x60 or nothing! If I’m going to snipe a rabbit at 100yd I want to hit between its eyes! You can never be too careful with those furry rascals.

[@CatTechSupport]

It seems like people are just looking for a reason to ditch LPVO’s. Seems nice to me so I can a 1-6 SLx for cheap.

[@thenathanr4243]

I love my 1-6 slx, but real talk, i just upgraded, and the GLX is worth the extra money.

[@dw5523]

That's funny, because after all my dicking around with various optic solutions, I've come back to hitting the easy button and choosing 1-6 LPVO's for my GP rifles.

[@MassJass]

an SFP 1-4 is all I need. I also conceal carry a p229 in 40 Smith and Wesson.

[@stevedo18able]

@@dw5523 ironically my conclusion was the 5x Microprism with offset. Ended saying f it to passive NV, although passive nv is somewhat doable with the canted setup. I appreciate the huge weight savings and moving the weight of the optic more to the rear.

[@CatTechSupport]

@@MassJass What SFP 1-4 are you using?

[@charlesm.2756]

Not gonna lie...im holding out for a fixed power 80x - it should be called the LCOG (stands for Long COG). I'd really like to push my 5.56 engagements out to 1500 - 2000 yards.

[@VincitOmniaVeritas7]

If (and that’s a big “if”) you hit someone with a 5.56 at that distance, they will be very annoyed at you. 😅

[@charlesm.2756]

@@VincitOmniaVeritas7 like taking birdshot at 1000 yards!

[@beowulf9878]

Just get a reticle etched onto a spotting scope.

[@andreivaldez2929]

Better yet: draw a dot with a sharpie and zero it by shimming popsicle sticks. It's how my uncle says he takes deer with a .22, he knows what he's doing.

[@PatrickKQ4HBD]

It's the HCOG - Hubble COG.

[@mikem4011]

I think once you start getting away from high-contrast and high-exposure targets that a typical range would have, you start to really appreciate the extra magnification even with the downsides you listed. That extra magnification not only provides extended observational capability, but standoff capability as well if employed properly which in the context of small-unit tactics = security/survivability. Even if you're not pushing out past 500 yds, in a real-world scenario you probably will be presented with little more than a head (8in x 6 in) or a bladed target. Not to mention being able to spot impacts at 500 yds plus becomes really difficult when you don't have the resounding confirmation of ping on steel or a puff of dirt in a desert environment. Just my 2 cents.

[@professionalamateur6169]

Exactly, people always train to shoot a "man-sized" target at certain distances, but realistically the threat would be behind cover and all you would get is a head-sized target. That's why I love magnified scopes with a built in red dot or illuminated reticle.

[@LRRPFco52]

Glass quality and training on 10-12" plates is where it's at. You don't need crazy top-end magnification for that. I prefer FOV and glass quality over magnification, with a good reticle. I'm not messing around with 5.56 either most of the time, other than bringing my loaner carbines for people who ignored the requirements of bringing a functional blaster (doesn't happen much anymore). With a full value wind at 10mph or more, you have a hard time of seeing or hearing impacts with 5.56 even at 450yds sometimes. It's also not much of an earth-mover, so misses are hard to register.

[@mikem4011]

Yeah I agree. Everything is a trade-off in one way or another. After using a Razor 1-10 and then moving to the GLX 3-18, the 10x magnification I felt was much better on the 3-18 than the 1-10 IMO. I hardly ever run the 3-18 at max power other than maybe for PID, but having it aids in a better image at lower power than I was getting with the Vortex which costs 3x the price as the GLX and only .5 lbs lighter. I don't know if that makes any sense just what I've experienced. I would like to try out a NF NX8 or ATACR to see how those copare and if the weight savings is worth it. As for caliber, there are many better rounds than 5.56 for that application, but for the cost, weight and recoil reduction savings you get with 5.56, it's hard to beat for practical application. @@LRRPFco52

[@LRRPFco52]

@@mikem4011 Big advantage to Vortex Razor, PST Gen II, and NF is that they will take semi auto beating. There's a big question mark for the lower price point optics. I've broken multiple LPVOs and even Schmidt & Bender PM II. After 3 decades of high volume shooting, I don't trust many optics manufacturers to make a durable scope.

[@LRRPFco52]

@@mikem4011 For the size of optics on a carbine, when you feel yourself crossing over the point where it's no longer a lightweight fighting blaster, then what is it, and is 5.56 cutting it for what we want it do? What if we could have something more the size of a Mk.18, but has more muzzle energy and more energy on-target than 5.56, that still has low recoil without sight picture disturbance? That's where I'm at with 12" Grendel.

[@RONIN_SATS]

The GLX 2.5 - 10 is a solid option, especially for 556. The scope just works. It is usable up close and sound out to 500+ yards. It is not too heavy and paired with an Aero lightweight mount most ppl will be very pleased. I am running mine on a DD 16" with SSA-E and with good 77gr ammo it will poke holes much closer than I am capable of reliably reproducing.

[@mghegotagun]

Aero ultralight has been on my personal blacklist after a reviewer broke one (i think it was the honest outlaw), and a few reports of it breaking on sniper's hide iirc.

[@volkoff6357]

What reticle do you use?

[@paulyp9853]

@@mghegotagun I saw someone break an Eotech, and 8T, and an LP1 during a review. I also read that they were broken by others. It means nothing. If you look hard enough on the net you will find something negative about anything. I think YT influencers may have too much influence.

[@KeterMalkuth]

@@paulyp9853 Be that as it may, the Aero mount has a greater than normal number of negative reviews regarding it's durability. That isn't something that ought be ignored.

[@wolfram2272]

That's just the price you pay for a lightweight mount. If you want it to be bomb proof you have to go heavier@@KeterMalkuth

[@abgrst]

I think a 4-16 is where it's at. Keeping your optic at no more than a 4x multiplier. I have an old Steiner P4xi 4-16x56 that I got for like $600 at the time and is a fantastic scope.

[@aaronsarquist3382]

As someone who has a 4-16 on my .308, and needing that validation to justify it, I massively approve this message

[@knifelover73]

Finally an actual review on this optic. You’re like the only one on KZbin

[@375Cheytac]

Just get a 5-50x 56mm from trijicon. That’s what I put on my 8” 300 blackout build. Really helps to see all of the things I can’t shoot without going 45 degrees

[@theunderside8968]

We really went back to throwing rocks at each other lol

[@dw5523]

After taking a long range shooting class, and being afraid of being over scoped, I realized very quickly that any scope I put on a precision rifle needs to have a relatively higher end to the magnification purely for the ability to see the damned target. A human torso, even painted white, isn't easy to see at 800+ meters, even at 16 power. Not try to spot your misses in tall grass.

[@shaolinwarriormark]

"Long range" u said. Ar15, with right barrell, and ammo, can go out to 800 yards(practice,i know) But , 2 x extra scope power, to me, isnt enough for 800 to 900+ "meters" If they can make a 2-24× by 50, 34mm tube, mil mpvo with filipino or japanese glass, night v compatible with parallax adjustment, and 2x starts at fov @ 100=75feet, or more, Alot of scopes going to go under. That covers you 45 meters out to about witgin 1300 meters(eye box would be super tiny!)

[@R3ap3r556]

@@shaolinwarriormarkget a loan and put this idea into reality I love it

[@dw5523]

@@shaolinwarriormark yep. We went out to 1300 meters, but I was shooting a 20” 308 with a 4-16 across cattle pasture. It was Jesus take the wheel at that point.

[@slappomatthew]

I cant tell you how long I have been trying to beat this into peoples brains and they just dont get it. to most gun guys 10X is a long range scope. SMH. I want more every time I use my 8-25.

[@PatrickKQ4HBD]

​@@slappomatthewIf you're just doing long range shooting and never let the Ivan's get close, sure. I think B.F. is looking for that magical scope that lets one setup be used to clear rooms and then the whole pasture, at night.

[@trentonkuhbander2534]

The GLX 4-16 Athena MIL reticle is another solid option. The zoom ratio (1:4) doesn’t mess up the max magnification experience. The weight is about 23 ounces. Just sacrificing the low end, however the obligatory piggyback red dot helps and utilizing an acog on my GPR has me comfortable with the 4x minimum.

[@alexgavieres8293]

Yeah, a budget 4-16x + red dot is a good all-around setup. But lately, I've been going between my 4-14x and 2.5-10x and have really started to appreciate 2.5x. I imagine 2x on a 2-12x would be even nicer and pretty versatile. Would be easy to actually use as your main magnification. A red dot could still be useful for the really tight quarters.

[@avaritiaetsuperbia]

That's the same optic and reticle I went with on an 18" 223 AR. Offset red dot. shooting competition as well as long distance on one platform made me have to compromise a bit, but I'm going to run this for a while and tweak if necessary

[@mdavem]

Came here to say this. You get a lot more capability than the 2.5-10 for only an extra ounce. 4-16 is the missing link lol.

[@jonasfotograf]

Have you test the Athlon Midas HMR HD 2,5-15x50 or the Atholm Ares BTR HD 2,5-15x50 Gen 2? On paper it seems like a quite good all-around range.

[@LyleH-13]

it's sad they discontinued the 4-16 because 3-18 is trendier but 4-16 is just better in every regard outside of the marketing department

[@Spessforce]

Scope creep is real

[@crakt7015]

Underrated

[@TEXwithNODS]

I wish there were more premium/lighter-weight 2-12x options. I love my 2-12x Swampfox but you can definitely tell the glass is sub-$500

[@bghiggy]

Athlon helos 2-12 is pretty good but definitely not "premium". It has pretty nice coatings though, it has outperformed my Vortex of the same price point every time

[@TEXwithNODS]

@@AndyAdventuring exactly what I want, except with a decent reticle in FFP

[@JC-af]

@@AndyAdventuring Isn't that a completly different price point though, like nearly 3x...?

[@poisonouslead85]

@@bghiggy I've been waiting for C_DOES's long term review on it. I think that's going to be the scope for my 20" upper

[@bghiggy]

@@AndyAdventuring looks like leupold is being leupold and only sells it with their firedot duplex which is about as completely opposite of a usable long range Reticle that you could use.

[@thedownwardmachine]

I have that exact scope and reticle and I love it. A few weeks ago I landed 5 consecutive hits on a standard torso target at 965yd with my 20" PSA CHF upper in .223 77gr. Hits confirmed with red flashing T1000 Magnetospeed, no way I can hear the impact at that distance with ear pro lol. The 3x is fine for close targets, the tiny chevron is nice for precision work, and Xmas tree is nice for self-spotting and holdovers on the fly. Good times.

[@life_of_riley88]

First off, that's very impressive for .556 but man @956 yards, the energy of even 77 grainers must be really low.

[@genocidelves]

I find the 2-12 works the best. At 2x using the scope at close distance works fine.

[@Billy4theWin11]

Which one do you run?

[@LRRPFco52]

IOR had a really cool compact 2-12x32 with MP8 reticle in the 2000s, but a competitor who filed the patents on 6 factor magnification went around and bought them all up, offering stupid money to anyone who bought one. Not sure if I would trust them to hold up on a gas gun though. I really do like compact 2-12x though. 2-12x32 with the GRSC reticle would be the shiznit.

[@FXIIBeaver]

This is why I switched to a 3-10x with a piggyback mounted RDS. 3-10 is perfect for 600 yards and the 3x is perfect for 100-300. Then the RDS is perfect for everything under 100.

[@keres993]

I picked up the 3-18x SLx (same FFP reticle as in video) and I'm loving it so far. My vision is horrible, so the extra magnification is nice. It is large and heavy. Everyone loves shooting it.

[@firebird5889]

For me, the big pull towards the 2.5-10 is how close the high end and low end magnifications are. With the highest magnification being 4x the lowest, just about every aspect of the reticle is usable at all magnifications. For a SASS setup however, I would probably go for the 3-18.

[@MyLonewolf25]

so grab a 4-16 or 3-15

[@Kross8761]

3-18 is a good magnification range for a true DMR (something chambered in 308 or 6.5 creedmoor or [much more rare, but my personal favorite] 7mm-08) For an SPR (which like you said is supposed to remain a relatively lightweight fighting rifle, but with added capability at range) a 2.5-10, 2-10, or 2-12 is a much less compromising... compromise Reticle REALLY matters on this style of scope, precision optics basically take low mag for granted and they're really only intended to be used for observation at low mag, theyre not designed for shooting at those lower magnification limits. An SPR scope needs to be "good" at *BOTH*. It's not better at precision than precision scopes, and it's not faster than a red dot but it needs to do both at least at about 80% capacity to make the compromise worth it.

[@LRRPFco52]

The SPR was a response to JSOC Sniper Troop modified carbines filling the DMR role within The Unit. They already had SR-25s at that point. SPR = DMR Large Frame = SASS With the accurized, free-floated, suppressed carbines, they could provide local support and still maneuver easily, while sharing ammunition/magazine commonality with Assaulters. As part of the AARs, there were instances where guys that brought 7.62 weapons couldn't share or needed more mags from wounded while driving through ambush after ambush. Same thing for a line squad. I don't want my DM shooting 7.62 NATO if we get left out to dry, miss evac, or get extended beyond what our round count can handle. But then you're left with the limits of 5.56 if you're in open terrain. 77gr bridged most of that gap, but regular Army didn't support it with dedicated training and a formalized, fully-supported duty position with standards and ARTEP.

[@highdesertdrew1844]

As far as the "prepared citizen" use case. higher magnification and longer ranges tends to come more into play with more open terrain here in the western US. A lot of the ROE starts to depend on how severe a situation gets, warning shots are still a thing, and can be accomplished at long range. But, the current status quo tends to frown on that kinda thing. I've long been a proponent of the PA 4-14x, yea it's an SLx, yea, it's an older optic at this point, I like the ARC2 reticle, but it's a consistent performer, unlike the higher powered scopes it gets a little darker, but doesn't fuzz out at top magnification, and with either a piggyback RDS or the illumination turned on, you can passive, it's just not as fast as a true low magnification optic. Then again, I'm running a 3x prism on my other rifle. In the SPR concept, having an optic that allows you to pick out targets at 500-800 yards, and then engage them is a valuable thing to have. What might be interesting from a prep/competition perspective would be to have both shoot and no-shoot targets placed at long range. It's easy to speed-run no-shoots at 10 yards, I don't think anyone does it at 400....

[@PatrickKQ4HBD]

That's brilliant!

[@es4583]

The problems with warning shots are two fold: a) you just told them that a hostile dude with a gun is out there; and they don't know that you didn't just try to kill them but missed. You basically just created an enemy, that might have simply moved passed you without ever knowing you were there.

[@highdesertdrew1844]

@@es4583 warning shots aren't really a prelude to shouting friendly in cherno.

[@spencercupit]

Great vid, I've got many scopes, from the expensive leo to the basic arken and primary arms. They all work, honest the $300 arken 4 to 16 has done super well. The weight on the more expensive options is less and some better glass, but you can still get it done with way less cash. I can't say the high cost I paid for the expensive options improved my capabilities much at all.

[@LRRPFco52]

What's your round count with Arken on gas guns?

[@Tarburz]

MPVO gang rise up (been preaching this for too long)

[@BrassFacts]

I disagree... but I still love you. LPVO gang.

[@KretinD]

I'm definitely mpvo gang but if I had a plxc in a reptilia aus mount I think I'd change my mind.

[@METALfanUSMC]

Hey, you don't say that without pants on...

[@SatanasExMachina]

​@@KretinD have a plxc in a badger ordnance mount...and it's fire.

[@bass779]

Bought a legacy helmet mount system for my old helmet from Venture thanks to your advertising. It was in good shape and ended a two year quest, all in one spot for a good price 👍

[@wawolfinbarger]

Something else I think is worth mentioning is the reticle and its capabilities. If you are wanting to put the GLx 2.5-10 or GLx 3-18 on an SPR type rifle, you may want the ability to dial. If you are going to be stationary when making longer range shots, dialing your elevation and holding for wind is very nice to do and that’s is not something the Griffin allows like the Athena does.

[@marleneball8498]

Nightforce 2.5-20x50. Low enough to engage bump into targets and high enough to burn your route to minimize your bump into chances, target ID is no problem with this scope. Would’ve been great down range for my uses

[@austinchowaniec2885]

I run a poortex 1-4 viper, and my biggest concern is target ID. I was shooting a chest size target, that was BRIGHT RED, but at 300yds, it was really hard to see despite good eyesight. Food for thought.

[@LRRPFco52]

Have you adjusted your diopter? Something sounds really off with those results. First thing I do with any scope is make sure the diopter adjustment is set up outside in the conditions you'll be shooting. The very few people that do touch their diopter do it indoors.

[@ImNoBSING]

I run 4.5 to 29 athlon in 556 with T2 for closer work. You really need wide range of mag to fit different needs. Looking for targets, identifying them, measuring them, shooting them and spotting your friend's hits.

[@PatrickKQ4HBD]

Ahh, so you run the Hubble model! 😅

[@KretinD]

The glx 4-16x50 is still my favorite. I like the reticles in that mag range (athena mil and mildot) and with the 30mm tube and the right mount its light as hell

[@Ken-yf1ev]

This is what I was looking for. Thanks! How do you feel the weight balances on the rifle?

[@KretinD]

@@Ken-yf1ev very well. The 4-16 has a 4" eye relief (as opposed to the 2.5x10 with a 2.8") so a cantilever mount is necessary on an AR-15. Im running mine on a dedicated 16" 22lr upper and it is money. If excellent balance on a tripod is important, an 18" barrel is the way to go

[@Bisley1]

Your reviews are fantastic Brassfacts!! Thank you for doing your excellent work and giving us all of the pros and cons to everything you do!! 🙌🏻

[@jimmybronco5336]

Perfect timing, bout to get a scope for my SPR

[@landonluebke7627]

I’m a fan of the 2.5-20x night force, it might go up a little high, but it has a good view in the 14-18 range.

[@holl0918]

On the low end of a higher powered optic... turn the illuminated reticle on. Makes your fine long range reticle much easier on the low end.

[@thepracticalrifleman]

You can really tell experience when you watch videos talking POU. Sometimes it’s even easier to spot lack of it. Lots of dudes couldn’t figure out why they would more longer range targets not knowing about cant or parallax errors. People will get hung up on flat range success and deem gear good for a task at hand. When shooting well-lit, open static targets glass looks much the same. Quality sights in poor lighting, occluded, and then consider camo targets. This is why training with those with experience helps. Many have seen situations you may not even consider. I’ve been rocking a 3-18x got a decade at this point. I tried a 2.5-10x for about five years and finally relegated it to a backup gun and eventually sold it. The 2.5x still sucked on 2.5x and the eye box was tight on 10x. Weight savings was only 4 oz and it still needed a dot.

[@bghiggy]

2-12 is the true meta but scope companies haven't caught up yet

[@andreivaldez2929]

You have the Swampfox 2-12 FFP as an option, I use one on my SPR sort of build. It's got its issues but it isn't bad for the price. Just wish someone else would make something similar but nicer.

[@daryenmirabal2656]

Nightforce has a nx8 2.5-20

[@bghiggy]

@@daryenmirabal2656 I really like the idea of the nightforce but they still haven't gotten a Reticle to work on 2.5 and 20x. They need to slightly modify their fc-dmx Reticle they use in the atacr 1-8 and put it in the 2.5-20 I'd buy it in a heartbeat

[@Cristopher1976]

Athlon has a good 2-12

[@bghiggy]

@@Cristopher1976 that's what I currently have. Just wish another company came out with a similar version with a bit better glass in the 800-1000 range

[@erickaracsonyi4415]

For 556 I think more than 12 is really pushing it. I understand using it for target identification, but I think its better to use binos or something else for that. For AR10, I like the Athlon 2-12. But at 25.5oz it makes the AR10 too heavy and the reticle is a strong b. Close but not great.

[@siegsouls]

I'm so happy you reviewed this specific scope.

[@stevenkennedy4130]

Maybe a 4-14x44mm with a 30mm tube. RDS piggy backed. That's what I'm rockin' these days. Thanks for the share!!

[@LyleH-13]

ive been wondering if this has downsides as far as eye box/relief vs the 4-16. 6x zoom vs 4x.

[@marvinbrock960]

I enjoyed that… You illustrated your point with good data.. The premise that retaining close in support is paramount, added magnification is just a bonus… is a solid call in my book. I tend to agree. 🇺🇸👍🏻

[@Ken-yf1ev]

Why not the 4x-16x option? That’s what I’m leaning towards for my SPR gas gun.

[@jessesando8582]

All the reasons i went with a 6-18x and a 45° dot for my SPR. Lpvo is fine for my 16" rifles, though i recently went to all ACOGs. Why not have more magnification? Made sense to me.

[@stevefaiello3321]

Every time you post a video on a scope in this magnification range, I'm more and more convinced that Vortex should have just taken the Viper PST Gen 1 2.5-10x32 and improved the reticle, capped the windage turret, and left everything else the same. They had near perfection and then they went and botched it with the Viper PST Gen 2 2-10x.

[@LRRPFco52]

I have that 2.5-10x32 PST on my 17.6" Grendel and agree on the windage. The elevation should be lower profile and locking as well. But yeah, I've literally rapid-fired into heads at 500 and 600, and rapid-fired sub-MOA 6rd groups at 1000yds with that set-up. The overall package is really light too. I used a Wasp profile Lilja barrel, which is .650" under the handguard, steps up to .750 gas block, .740 to the muzzle. Feels like an OG M4 when we had the 727 govt profile pre SOCOM heavy retardation. It's actually a lot lighter than my 12" with 1-6x24 LPVO. I shoot the 12" the most now though.

[@nurse-dude]

No matter what scope is on the rifle it’s still a 556. I think there is a point of diminishing returns with powered optics on any rifle but specifically 556, where as stepping up to a different/larger round you are able to see the effects far better.

[@BrassFacts]

for sure. But as you'll see when I start discussing BRs and SAPRs you pay major penalties to use these platforms. And it's not just weight.

[@bghiggy]

You get much faster follow up shots with the 556 which is pretty important in urban settings

[@Longshot762x51]

Being able to see better never hurt anyone. My Mk12 Mod 0 wears a 5-25. Yes its heavy but I want to see.

[@bghiggy]

@@Longshot762x51 if you are only shooting in a static prone position I'm sure 5-25 does work great but as soon as you start incorporating some movement you'll see how having a bottom end of 5x really sucks

[@bvhnightmare]

Having shot a Gen2 Razor 3-18 for several years in competitions. 12-15x is where it is 90% of the time.

[@tidypog3272]

For what you described as the goal (maintain fighting rifle reqs with ability to stretch further) the 3-9x is still king

[@ericb.4358]

For my 6.5 PRC Browning X-Bolt Pro I have a Bushnell Elite 4.5 - 18 x 44 LRTS with an illuminated G3 small Xmas tree reticle. For me that's just what I need for hunting in Nevada's wide-open spaces for long range hunting. The Bushnell Elite series, IMHO, is in the top end of the "very good" quality range. And also it is in the middle range money in this feature and zoom range.

[@duoofdefense8133]

I’ve been debating getting rid of my PA 2.5-10 for a PST 3-15 with the EBR-7C reticle. I’m glad you made this to say the least

[@thepracticalrifleman]

Look at other scopes.

[@duoofdefense8133]

@@thepracticalrifleman what would you recommend?

[@thepracticalrifleman]

@@duoofdefense8133 what’s your budget?

[@duoofdefense8133]

@@thepracticalrifleman under 2k most likely

[@thepracticalrifleman]

@@duoofdefense8133 I would definitely look higher than the PST then. The Leupold Mark 6 you can sometimes find for south of 2k. There are some on Midway USA right now for around that mark but they are Tremor 3. What’s nice is they are 23 oz. and good glass. He sure you get one with the 5C2 turret. The short turret works, the tall one was junk. You might also look at the Trijicon Ten Mile 3-18x44 FFP. I think mil/LE/first responder price is $1400. You’re just under Nightforce money at 2k though, and a little saving could really level you up. Personally, my favorite scope is the S&B PMII 3-12x but it’s heavy.

[@jumrobe]

As someone who owns ARs with both setups, I would agree with pretty much everything here. The 2-10 works well in almost all scenarios inside 700 yards, but it gets harder to spot trace, hits, and misses as you stretch out past 300 yards. The 3-18 is the opposite, where performance is really hampered by how much scope you have until you get to 300+ yards where the extra magnification and FOV of the larger scope start to make it much easier to PID, spot hits, misses, and trace than with the 2-10. Ultimately, they are two different use case guns that have a lot of capability overlap.IMO, if things go pear shaped, I'm grabbing the rifle with the 2-10 because it's a handy rifle that is capable. The 3-18 is a bit of a pig that is really good for stretching 5.56 beyond it's designed range limit for lethality.

[@kaynenbrown5102]

Mk4hd 4.5-18x is on my SPR build. It’s great. If you budget only allows for the Glx 3-18 then go with it. Seems like a very nice optic. Not just for the price.

[@teslamodhammer]

Interesting how no one mentions 2.5-20 there are very few options in this zoom the night force Nx8 being one

[@derrictaylor1181]

I have the older slx 3-18x on my 308 bolt gun. It seems to be the same scope you have. Same experience and same complaints. It's definitely usable though.

[@scott2228]

I put the PA GLX 3-18 on my 18” SPR and the PA GLX 2.5-10 on my 14.5” GPR. I also put a PA GLX 1-10 on a 16”. I think I’m a fan of the GLX line!!!

[@EmperorReinhard]

Seems to me that the point of using 18x is for positive identification of your target, then backing off the magnification to 12x or so to shoot. I've heard that if you are shooting at a certain range, you need to be able to double it to get PID. So, 18x would help you to reliably confirm PID at 900 yards. 900 yards is very much pushing the limits of 556, but you can at least confirm PID and move closer, or wait for the target to move closer.

[@BrassFacts]

900 is brutally far for PID even for 18x

[@KretinD]

Do a pid test on a lpvo (1-8) vs a mpvo at 6x for both. Then do a pid test between a mpvo and hpvo at 12x

[@DD-hz3ts]

Positive identification beyond 600m, on a rifle that BARELY reaches 700-800m with 77 gr OTMs, is a complete fucking meme 3-18x is a MEDIUM magnification range suited for up to 600. Beyond this is "sniper" scope territory where 24x and beyond is required, and you can't pretend it's a run n gun rifle anymore at that glass weight. Stop pretending your rifle is a do all tool and kit it out for what it actually can or can't do.

[@KeepCalmSoldierOn]

I have the Anthlon Arms 2-12x and I LOVE it, probably gonna sell it to a buddy of mine as an upgrade for his SPR so I can get a 3-18x (mine is a 6.5 creed so the extra mag is very nice

[@ThomsonBR42]

Bought the Helos BTR gen 2. A good 2-12 that checks all the boxes.

[@christopherwisby8926]

I just recently picked up a strike eagle 3-18x44 Sfp with the MOA reticle from PSA on sale. I love it. I have a viper 4-16x50 with the bdc reticle the I don’t take past 12-13x for the same reason you stated. It just falls apart. But this strike eagle 3-18 is “strikingly” better. Image stay clear and bright, and the eye box is acceptable. I’m not sure why FFP is so necessary on a scope in this range…If I’m shooting 100-200 yards I don’t need holdovers, and if Im going to use holdovers for shots past 300, I’m going to be on max mag. So why give up the forgiving eyebox of a sfp scope for FFP Now lpvo…. I absolutely love my PLX compact

[@Solidbuilthomes]

I agree 100%.... seems like too many good/ ideal scope options are only available in ffp

[@jonbartholomew84]

My SPR has a GLx 4-16x50. It's shorter, lighter, cheaper, and has the Athena reticle. It sits in a Badger mount w/ piggyback RMR. Much better setup IMHO. Great video.

[@Ken-yf1ev]

This is what I’m going for… you got any pictures?

[@JTTTTT850]

I would say 2X per 100 yards is a little closer to reality. Where i shoot PRS matches it goes out to just over 800 and I’m usually just staying at 14X on a leupold mark5hd 5-25

[@joshkirkby8103]

Lightweight hunting scopes in the 4-12 range with a top mounted red dot. I switched to a leupold mk3 hd 4-12 with an eps carry top mount and it all weights less than my old viper 1-6

[@Brayden-P]

Good take. I looked at this optic quite a bit for a while.

[@Moneypit_Adventures]

I’d like to see a 3-12 or 3.5-14x 30mm plx Athena. Keeps relatively wide field of view at lowest magnification range and plenty of high end for PID and ability to spot trace/hits/misses out to realistic distances for which these rifles would be used. Also helps keeps your erector ratio at 4x helping to keep clarity throughout the zoom range. Also would allow you to run a 30mm tube there for keeping weight down as well.

[@brutusgallicus3568]

I've got a Leupold 2-12x VX6-HD on my 7mm Rem Mag Browning. It's a hunting scope, so having a complicated reticle and adjustable parallax are more of a nuisance than anything. It's lightweight and provides a clean, bright view. On my CZ 308 with 26in heavy barrel I have a Nikon 4-16 FX Black. It's rad-rad and has is FFP. A rifle that's used for sniping or long distance target competition has different requirements than a mobile hunting scope. Even then for a long time military scopes were 10 power. People talk about long distance hunting, but even antelope won't stand off more than 4-5 hundred yards as a rule, and I've never shot a whitetail at more than 150 yards.

[@derek3154]

For .556 I like SFP scopes, 1-6, 1-8 and the 1-10 are great. Any higher caliber I’d go with a FFP. SFP gives you a usable 1x and longer range when needed.

[@PatrickKQ4HBD]

I'm the typical Army-trained, iron sights, once-a-year shooter. I did typically shoot 39/40 every time. That's relevant because I'm now an aging civilian (MUCH different ROE!) with weaker eyesight now. I need to shoot a handful of shots at an unknown range in rapid succession and guarantee every one is a hit, if possible. The penalty for misses can be draconian. I can't focus on a very fine long range crosshair reticle fast enough or well enough to be comfortable pulling the trigger IRL. I need a bolder reticle for faster aiming, but enough zoom for long range target and backstop ID. I live in the South Eastern US. Maybe I just need a good red dot and a spotting scope? Hoping for recommendations. 👍

[@robertscarduzio5720]

Just get a 1-6 lpvo illuminated how often do you have a unobstructed shot over 400-600 meters always trees and buildings in the way. Doubt in shtf scenario you need more range if so a sniper rifle set up for long range would be better for engaging distant targets

[@GldenRetriever]

Picked up a 1.5-15 DFP and I'm hesitantly confident this will be my end all, be all GPR/SPR/CQC, 0-1000y optic. If it isn't up to the task, then that means it simply can't be done as nothing is holding it back without throwing the whole thing away and starting over.

[@BuckF0eJiden]

I'm a huge fan of the PA SLX 4-16x44s. Especially with the HUD DMR and R Grid 2B reticles. If youre doing something between the SPR and SASS, i highly recommend the US Optics 2.5-20x Personally, I'd run a 3-9x in 30mm tube over any 2-10x on the market. You're really not losing anything on the low end, and you're gaining a lot in optical clarity from the 3x magnification factor. I'd rather have more magnification with better optical clarity, especially if I'm already running a dot with a scope. For me, though, reticle is actually very high up on my list of what I'm looking for in a scope, and the HUD DMR is untouched for the information you can gather at a glance. The 10x SWFA Super Sniper is also a great choice for anyone on a budget. On black fridays, you can catch great deals on those fixed power optics. I picked up my 10x i run on my .243 Win AR10 for $230, and thats with the mount and pic rail ring topper, and bubble level. Ive run a Shepherd Optics Rugged 3-9x with top dot on my GPR over a 1-8x for about six months now, and I absolutely will not go back.

[@mikeholley4488]

I'm old school and stand firm that the acog is still the most rounded optic for general infantry combat. However, lpvo/mpvo still reign supreme for dedicated mid to long range combat. If you are running a secondary rds, then it's really a no brainer to opt for higher magnification since you have close combat covered

[@hjorturerlend]

Think the 3-18x (or 4-16x maybe) would perhaps be a better fit for a .224 Valkyrie or 6.5 Grendel gun, more of a "light DMR".

[@rossauce12]

What would u recomend for a light weight 6.5 cm ?

[@rossauce12]

Bolt action i should add its a sig cross

[@hjorturerlend]

@@rossauce12 Depends on the use case, but pretty sure 25x is kinda the industry standard for LRS? Sig Cross is ofc also designed for hunting, so something smaller is ofc fine for that.

[@mavrikmavrik3032]

2-12 is a great MPVO and I love it on my 16”. I have a 4 to 14 on my 18” SPR and it’s great at distance but you absolutely need the offset dot.

[@3of11]

Go all in and get 4.5-30 athlon ares etr or Cronus btr depending on your Asian country preference.

[@anonymousperson2156]

Nova content always appreciated

[@briankopp1369]

I put one on 6.5 grendel, love it

[@Trad-Am]

You know what is like to see, and don't know why it hasn't been done, is see a scope mount, with red dot integrated into it, or fitment spot for a mini, that goes under the scope, instead of on top. I've seen it with irons, and with a little ingenuity could be done.

[@deanmercer1665]

With success of there plxc 1-8 scope I wish primary arms would come to market with a 3 -18x scope in their platinum series or even a 2-12x.

[@Gunfighter5]

I think this is the one time an illuminated reticle is necessary. It helps to make the 3x reticle usable!

[@TheGunNerd]

I'd argue the 3-18x fits the bill better for an spr, as you aren't worrying about low magnification as much and should run your system like an acog stack, and focus on higher magnification for longer shots (the whole reason you have the precision weapon). You're already adding a little weight to reach farther (longer barrel, bipod, heavier optic, etc) so what's a hair bit more weight to further focus on your strengths for a precision weapon. Tldr don't expect an spr to be like an sbr in cqb, you're bringing more weight to shoot farther, add more weight to shoot farther while still being able to run with the squad

[@Bisley1]

Looks like I will be getting the GLx 2-10x after all… i will also be selling my Razor 1-10x for a Gen2 1-6x or PLc 1-8x or just ditch my LPVO experimental phase alltogether an go back to my trusty old TA31 - I really love my ACOG, but wished it had 5 or 6x and a better BDC for wind😌

[@longboi8540]

5:05 "we dont live in a perfect wold, Halo 5 exists" 🤣😭

[@justsnuggle]

Thank you so much finally someone who can put the companies on blast bye designing a stupid reticles that don't work on each end of the individual scopes spectrum

[@thomasmason9070]

Weve got these small 6"x4" black and rust covered steel targets. At about 350 they disappear against a wooded backdrop with an 8x lvpo. Scopes don't help you shoot better, they help you see better.

[@Spencebot42]

Random totally irrelevant question; how do you go about brass clean up with the volume of shooting that you do along with the amount of moving between locations and terrain types? I'm on the east coast so unfortunately I don't have access to any large outdoor areas for shooting, but it just dawned on me that there's got to be some kind of cleanup procedure

[@wellingtonbruh3756]

For a long range BR style 308 rifle, I like 4-16x, and for a "REEECCE" rifle prism 2.3x or 3x work great, but the lpvo seems to fit into that in-between longer range 5.56 rifle. They all have their specific niche for their specific platforms. There's no magic scope that does it all without downsides.

[@lets-get-itgaming8075]

I'd again love to see some thoughts on the Athlon Ares 2.5-15x they offer. I feel like ob paper it's the ultimate MPVO

[@X-ForceBro]

This is a small Nick pic, but tube diameter does not affect clarity and naturally a larger tube can. Negatively affect clarity in the scope is adjusted to the extremes. Because a lineman is farther off in the glass

[@ChadCooper03]

I liked this scope a lot when I first got it. However, I really didn't like the illumination knob design. It's basically the same size as the parallax knob, so almost everytime I was trying to quickly adjust parallax during training, I'd hit the illumination. Their SLX knob is a much better design, I hope they update it.

[@jacksonmarshallkramer5087]

Can't do the mini dot in front of the turret. A mini dot should ride on every scoped semi auto, but it has to be properly placed. I referenced Lone Survivor for proper placement. 😁

[@snakebite210]

Brassfacts Friday 🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉

[@PreacherT5]

Have you thought of trying a 3-12x? Currently testing this mag range, light set up, uso 3-12c just barely over 9inches. Short light package, no illumination though.

[@fabiangonzalez-cortes8894]

When the intro Brass Facts heroin music kicks in, I know I’m in for a fantastic video.

[@Paulie771]

This sounds perfect for my 14.5” 6.5CM Aero M5 build!

[@notshared2543]

Ok hear me out El cheap o option Midway 24oz 30mm tube Buris IV 3-12 w illuminated dot simple range/wind tree reticle

[@mtnbound2764]

I trying to decide if i should step up from a 1-6 to a 2-10. while i would like the additional zoom, im not sure its worth it. its a 16" "DMR" type build, but in no way a long range set up

[@jik294]

I've honestly been looking at picking one of these up for a SDMR type setup. I'm not looking to use it for shooting 1000m. More wanting it for better PID and better 400-600m ranges. I have a 1-6 and 1-8 LPVO and I like those, but for what I'm wanting, they start to kinda struggle. They'll get the job done, I just have to put in a little more effort.

[@jaredmatthews9403]

8:07 Maybe I should go with the 4-16x which did very well in the C_Does review.

[@NickMaiers-hg3de]

Let that vortex rant out! Needs to be heard!

[@bewarethegreyghost]

"...but that's just a theory......a Gun Theory! Thanks for watching."

[@dr_feelgood8703]

Best 3-18x50 for the money imho is the meopta optika 6 3-18. In the desert you may not won’t appreciate the glass at 800-1000 yards as much besides maybe mirage. but out east we’re you don’t have the dirt splash everywhere you shoot and you have just looking for a tiny little bullet trace I find that the alpha scopes are worth the extra cash if you can afford to spend a little more. Mk5 is kinda trash for the money. Had a 3.6-18 very disappointed. If ur spending over 2 grand it might as well say “ made in Germany”. Hate to say it but it’s true. Your content is always fun to watch. Very jelious of your ability to 1000 yards everywhere you look haha. Spend sub 800 on a scope if you need more optic save up to around 2000-3000 sadly. Anything in the middle isn’t that much of a step up to warrant the cost

[@possumpatrol45]

Is that a lake at 3:56, or salt flats?

[@DesertCoyotes]

Salt flats

[@GWOTalchem]

I love a handy, light rifle as much as the next guy. But in the sand box I had a M16 20” barrel fixed stock with a 203 tube under. As a boot I “kept up with bois” rocking a 17 pound SAW and 600+ rounds. Yes clearing rooms, bounding, clearing trenches. This isn’t to say you should make your AR 10+ pounds for no reason. But if you have justifiable needs, equip yourself accordingly. PS you want ever want to be room clearing without the big army to support you, so don’t overly plan for long CQB days.

[@ultratacoRX7]

My first ar was a 16" with 1-6x lpvo. Then I got an sbr w/ red dot+magnifier so I'm turning the 16 into a mini spr by just adding a bipod, suppressor, and better ammo. I thought about replacing the 1-6 with a 1-10 or 2-something but decided against that due to cost, weight, and the fact that I'm not in a desert and the farthest I can train is only 200yds anyway. (Also saves me having to buy and mess with an extra red dot.)

[@thekeithlane]

Late to the show - I’ll be honest/ I love my ACOG on my 5.56 16”. I’m looking at the Athlon Helos BTR gen 2 mil IR 4-20 for my 16” .308 ar10. What are the tradeoffs if I compared it to same scope with the 6-25x50 magnification? I’ll be piggybacking a red dot. Thanks!