The State of VR in 2023

There are some some very fun games for VR nowadays, but is it enough to save the system? Let's talk about it.
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[@TheLaXandro]

I am still perplexed at how nobody ever mentions the sit-down, physical controller cockpit games in VR. Racing, flying, space, mech, VR makes even Forklift Simulator more engaging.

[@ThKolle]

Why are people buying triple monitor racing setups, when they can just wear a VR Headset?

[@mattcy6591]

I honestly want more games from a top down/isometric view played with a controller.

[@Landjrin]

@@mattcy6591 Only ones I can think of are Moss and it's Sequel

[@teneesh3376]

To be fair, those setups are expensive and mainly for arcades

[@teneesh3376]

To be fair, those setups are expensive and mainly for arcades

[@johndoe3307]

VR is stuck in a catch 22 where there are no big budget games to draw people in but in order to draw people in but in order for there to be big budget games there needs to be lots of people

[@Steven-bq5fu]

And for there to be people there needs to be more done with accessibility, like cost, visual standards, motion sickness, battery life... general ease of entry...

[@Hellmiauz]

It's still around because we now have massive companies like MS, Facebook and valve that get their revenue from elsewhere. If a gaming Company tried this earlier (even with current hardware) it would have gone out of business. It is unsustainable business both the hardware and software part.

[@rooty]

VR went off the fucking deep end. It's somehow become MORE expensive over time. Meta even increased the price of the same headset. A PS4 + psvr was less than £500. A PS5 + psvr2 is over £1000. Absolute fucking circus.

[@johndoe3307]

have you looked at inflation over that period? lol

[@rooty]

@@johndoe3307 £500 in 2017 is only £635 adjusted for inflation. As with everything else, they know people are aware the world is in the shit can right now and they know they can point to that as an excuse while ripping us off for no other reason than they can get away with it. Every product that is supposedly hit by inflation, the manufacturers are making record profits. It's a horseshit, corporate arse licking excuse.

[@misirtere9836]

@@johndoe3307 inflation didn't HALVE the value of the dollar within the time period the PSVR's been available. assuming 5% inflation, which is *substantially higher than average,* it takes 15 years for the value of the dollar to halve. so go ahead, tell me about the VR headsets you were using in 2008. i'll wait. not to mention it CERTAINLY doesn't explain the $3500 apple vision pro

[@Landjrin]

HL Alyx does allow continuous movement, its a toggle in the settings. Some people struggle with it cause motion sickness, but if you dont have that problem its way better.

[@razbuten]

the main issue with vr is that zelda 2 is not on it.

[@Phoeboi]

I feel like the problem with VR is the fact that almost nobody tried to make anything truly amazing with it. Games like BeatSaber, Superhot VR, and Half Life Alyx are all incredible games that use the VR’s uniqueness. If more game developers and companies had done the same it would’ve skyrocketed, but since barely anyone took the leap it stayed on the shelf.

[@Joe-bs9dj]

boneworks or vertigo 2.

[@lifetake3103]

As someone who has worked in vr. One issue is that it’s just incredibly hard. The more work you put in to make an incredible experience the more you want more people to experience it. The more people you want to experience it the more you have work around having a wider audience. The more you have to work around having a wider audience the more you have to deal with issues different people will have. And in vr these issues are 5 times more plentiful. So to make a vr game of the same caliber as a normal game you need to invest more time and resources to get over these issues that you just wouldn’t be having without it.

[@SolaireIntensifies]

The issue is, it's a high risk move for potential huge amounts of loss. The more dev time you spend making and polishing a vr game the bigger chance it has to flop and not only ruin the company's reputation potentially leading to lost sales in the future, but could financially ruin the company as a whole. Valve has a lot of financial security, so if Alyx flopped big time they have enough cash to recover and then some. Since they are a private company they can take these risks, but Ubisoft and EA for example? They have shareholders to impress, and VR is still considered fairly niche so they won't take that risk when they know Farcry 15 will sell hotcakes like it always does. It's in a real scary spot right now where it's on the verge of extinction but enough people are passionate about it that it's hanging on by threads until a big company decides to go all in on it (besides meta who would rather use it as a scamming platform which is only weakening the general population's view of VR)

[@TNEQL]

It's so niche and there's so little money to be made from it, it's difficult for many companies to justify putting that level of investment into it.

[@leandromadeireira8840]

the best and most immersive vr game know is skyrim vr with mods.

[@vrostygame]

I am working on a VR platformer - with a little snowman! Just saying ☃️ And thank you for all the great content.

[@SergeantMolt]

I feel like the biggest issue with VR, actually, is that the really good titles are kind of just...hard to find. Like as you were going into this video, I was thinking to myself "Well then he should try Into the Radius (really really captures that immersive feeling of being in a survival situation, having to take care of your guns with actual cleaning, dealing with temporal anomalies, the kind of thing that just embraces the VR-ness of it all in a way that is just so awesome), or Vertigo (which has been described to me as the "Half Life of VR", made by just one person), or Rumble (Earth bending pvp - need I say more?), or the now-defunct Echo VR (Ender's Game pvp that was good enough to be its own esport, may it rest in peace :( ). It's not that there aren't games out there. It's that the market is very much not mainstream, and as such you can't rely on normal social media channels to hear about things. You have to actually go out and find the gems yourself, unfortunately. EDIT: Adding a couple more games I just thought of: Mothergunship Forge for bullet hell roguelite where you're building giant guns on both hands in a frankenstein monster-esq death laser. Until You Fall for another great rogue-lite where you have to swing your weapons with actual weight and block/dodge swings as they come, though it's more arcade-y it still feels awesome. And Lone Echo is one of those experiences that's been praised up and down for its unique story and gameplay, though I haven't played it myself since it's a Quest exclusive. In general, most of the development & energy is being put into the Quest ecosystem right now as well, because that's the first real console to sell millions of copies. So if you've got a Vive, then yeah you're not going to see a good number of the newest and greatest VR experiences being played with, because most of those right now are going up on the Quest store.

[@DIRECTEDBYH]

rumble is one of the best games in vr, the feeling to discover combos with the physic based engine, the game doesn't tell you. It feels very real and even if you don't play the game a lot, the experience alone is worth it currently I am playing a extraction shooter caleld ghosts of tabor. No PC shooter ever was such fun

[@alexstacy9847]

Have you tried 'The Last Clockwinder'? It's the first VR game that kept me going beyond the 'ooo what a fun gimmick' phase and really felt like a taste of what is possible with the tech. Can't recommend it highly enough.

[@zephyrion]

VR has another use that you can't really talk about on YT that is prolific & excellent.

[@yoplait3256]

Tbh VrChat is where most the VR indie devs and creativity is. You can do a lot with VrChat worlds and I've seen whole games, minigames and full length story based adventures made within the confines of VrChat using it as an engine to build their ideas in.

[@CosmicReef]

It would be WAY better if 12 year olds wouldn't be the older people in VRchat. Some of the games are funny, anyway. But it is sad that the most time I spent on VR was VRchat.

[@Zer0_Ph34r]

I feel the exact same way about VR, and I don't really know if the issue is fixable. Half-Life Alex and Beat saber are stand out games, and there are a few other gems out there (Pistol Whip, Moss 1+2, Boneworks, etc.) but VR is a pretty steep investment for players and there's very few games that really justify the purchase. The issue is that VR is difficult to develop for in a meaningful way, and most players aren't interested in a game that physically exhausts them. I think that VR is in a similar position to the Playstation portable or Vita. These systems were fantastic little consoles that blew all other hand held systems out of the water, but both were commercial failures, mostly because there were so few games worth getting them for. The reason for this is that the market of hand held gaming usually warranted lower budget games, but the hardware for the systems was advanced enough that to really utilize it, it was a similar cost to full console releases. So, the PSP and PSVita failed partly due to how good they were. Companies didn't want to develop for an unproven system that was so expensive to develop for until there was a user base, but there was no user base because there weren't enough games to generate them. With VR, it's expensive and time consuming to develop games for, and it's a whole separate paradigm when it comes to game design. Things that work or make sense in 2D space do not work in 3D, and if you don't hit a certain performance quota (90fps minimum) you can actively make your players sick, which will prevent people from playing your game. So, VR games are difficult to develop, generally as expensive as traditional games, and there is a much smaller user base because of the cost of entry. All these things feed back onto each other making VR generally a losing gamble for game developers. Add onto this that many people play games to relax, they aren't really interested in playing a physically taxing game. I hope that VR holds out and gets a few must plays every now and then, but the bottom line is that VR will likely never take off and instead some other technology will replace it.

[@TayoEXE]

For me, I really just think people are playing it way too safe. Understandably so, but way too safe. I see so many FPS games in VR for example instead of ideas that are literally only possible in VR. For me, the most memorable video games aren't "generic something simulator" or "game about this topic." Most video games I loved growing up at interesting characters, stories, worlds, and gameplay mechanics that complimented those worlds. This Mario, Sonic, Mega Man, Metal Gear Solid, Ace Attorney, etc. Here we have the most powerful means to immerse someone, and I feel it's squandered on simple gameplay mechanics that are easy to get bored over in an already crowded market. This about a game like Pizza Tower, which doesn't have the most complex looking graphics or even the most complex story, but it's just oozing with personality AND fun gameplay that people can't stop talking about and enjoying for a long time. Games like Mega Man Battle Network and movies like Tron made me envision a digital world with endless possibilities. Making me "feel" like I am in another world, doing the cool things I could only ever seen on TV, connecting with people as if they're standing there with me (it's why I like VRChat) and seeing their body language in a shared space, exploring worlds I could never see in real life or that don't exist in real life, all as a virtual parallel to our world, without limits. Instead, while I see some fun games out there (not a bad thing), I don't see as many ideas that make people want use VR as a portal to another part of their life, if that makes sense. It doesn't always have to be social, but when I personally first stepped into VR, my world view changed, as if I had stepped into a new world of possibilities. Aside from that, what we need is more support from the biggest companies. If the gaming world was only indie titles, I'm pretty sure most people would not be into gaming that much, even with some really good ones. Imagine if Nintendo after stepped into this field and really tried to make content that would help revolutionize a player's immersion. Sony already has, but I'd expect Nintendo to finally be that one to take it in unexpected directions, for better or for worse.

[@toututu2993]

Beat Saber is okayish at best. There are like 50 vr games that is a lot better

[@simpsonsfanatic777]

Of course, VR Chat is the pinnacle of VR gaming. Nothing can ever top it.

[@violetmiraidon]

I find it hilarious that Mark Zuckerberg is just hyping up the metaverse as this amazing vr experience to be a second reality when in real life there’s about 30-40 people online at any given time, most of which are developers. It’s less people than vr chat. Shows that big corps will always make soulless vr stuff while indie devs can’t make vr because vr is very hard to program

[@kimjonguninstall6279]

Boneworks is the killer app for me. I've begun judging every game based on how well it handles physics and gunplay compared to boneworks. Alyx is a close second, but Boneworks has really pushed the medium the farthest. Its a shame Bonelap is apparently disappointing in comparison... Phasmaphobia (and more recently The Break In), although not a VR original, its a very strong contender as well. They both scratch that stealth itch I couldn't get from other titles. These are all standing VR games though, if you want a killer sitting VR title, play VTOL VR. Its the best VR Flight Sim by far. I would say MSFS, but the VR mode is too unstable to be considered top tier for me.

[@karlwest49]

I jumped onto vr with psvr2 and I've been having a blast with so many of the games that I've tried so far, such as horizon, resident evil village, pistol whip, and moss, with so many more on my wishlist that I've been hearing strong recommendations for, such as red matter 2, vertigo 2, and pavlov. Most of my gaming time recently has been in vr and I'm quite happy with what I've played so far. Looking forward to seeing what comes in the future!

[@Inimitablessj]

For me, VR hasn't become the DEFINITIVE way to play games like I expected it to years ago. The lack of real innovation or investment into the platform(s) is a big part of that, I think. But I do still think it's the definitive way to play certain games or types of games. Beat Saber, Walkabout Minigolf may not be epic VR adventures or real system sellers, but dang there's really nothing else like them out there and I love them. And slower-paced shooters with interesting worlds and interactions - like Half-Life 2 and HL Alyx- are just so much fun to play and be in. (I can't say the same for faster or more demanding shooters - I still prefer competitive stuff on a desktop with mouse and keyboard!)

[@jacksonjabba]

I mean idk I think there’s tons of great quality VR games, I just think VR has kinda become a more mod/community content driven game, with a lot of games focusing on being a sandbox, multiplayer, or heavily based on mods. All of my favourite VR games fall into one of the above categories. That being said, all of those experiences, and the scant that fall outside that, are kinda great. There is something amazing about just doing basic things in VR, and I hope that with the quest and hopefully a few more killer apps VR can become more popular.

[@TWONSSHOW]

Not enough people have played Astro bot rescue mission, that game is a masterpiece.

[@bostin1472]

2 VERY underrated vr games with an actual campaign that’s good are Vertigo 1 and 2, Vertigo was actually the first VR game to have an actual campaign and story, and it got remastered and it’s so good, vertigo 2 has a bigger and better story and a lot of variety in gameplay.

[@Joe-bs9dj]

Vertigo 2 is the best vr game. All made by one 22 yr old dude

[@godminnette2]

The other two stand-out titles for me are Ancient Dungeon and Jet Island. They both give a sense of visceral satisfaction I think can only be found in VR: Ancient Dungeon through combat, Jet Island through movement. It seems weird to me that you'd make a video called "The State of VR" and talk about two titles. What else have you played?

[@michaellong2439]

Thats is true. strange he did that. I 100% agree that vr is progressing slower than most probably would have thought. But there certainly are some top tier games to come out recently. Vertigo 2, Asgards wrath 2 coming out will probably be the biggest vr game so far. I haven't played walking dead saints and sinners but I hear amazing reviews. They may be few and far in-between, but they are there

[@igorthelight]

5:58 - "I can't feel my legs" moment xD

[@MaximumAxiom]

Still glad you're putting out videos again!

[@Dachusttin]

Always love me to see some fresh VR content :)

[@Yipper64]

to me VR Chat is what makes VR at the moment. So you know how all those other games are like gimmicky tech demos? Well VR Chat is slightly different, the game basically lets any player boot up unity, use their sandboxed API to do *whatever* they want. Both with worlds and avatars. This means that there are VR Chat worlds that are effectively new VR games, all for free. What makes that more than a tech demo is the fact that some people who play VR Chat, like myself do it regularly. And you know, if youre going to spend more than a few afternoons looking at gimmicks things inevitably need to become more "fun" Super VR Ball, is a monkey ball clone but I find it to be even more fun than non VR Chat experiences. Mostly because you can do it with friends but also just because it has so much depth. And yeah, its one that *could* feasibly not be a VR game, but it being a VR game definitely adds to it.

[@Temvest]

Lovely video , much needed

[@billienomates1606]

Good vid, I splashed out over £400 on a Pico 4 vr unit earlier this year and was very underwhelmed with the quality and overall experience so I sent it back. Over the past six months I have been dabbling with much older vr headsets and have finally arrived at one I actually like. I basically use the vr for watching movies and vr youtube vids. My choice currently is a Lenovo Mirage Solo which I picked up for the pricely sum of £20 plus £2.95 shipping. It suits me down to the ground and does everything I need for now. Maybe in 20 years or so I will get my dream ar/vr glasses that just look like a normal pair of glasses but I doubt it.

[@izzanirfan2534]

Never heard of that headset,is the screen good?

[@2leftthumbs]

VR felt like the thing I had always been waiting for!! And it's wild how quickly I lost interest... there are only so many reskinned FPS titles you can play before they grow stale. And while some of my most memorable VR experiences were immersive horror games, I can only stomach those so often. A few years back the next gen of VR was supposedly coming out, so I decided to sell my Oculus and wait it out. Aaaand... nothing has really convinced me to fork out the money a second time. Kind of a shame that it never became the most-have, hot new thing in gaming.

[@PerrydactylShow]

VR has always came off to me as something that would be really fun to experience like at an arcade or one of those weird kiosks in the mall and you pay $20 for. I'm kinda glad I never bought in, but I won't lie, guitar hero with lightsabers does sound mighty tempting!

[@michaellong2439]

If you've never played VR there are definitely top tier games waiting to try. The real difference is that those big games only come out every once in awhile compared to xbox 4 AAAA games a year. Alyx, beat saber, vertigo 2, Asgards wrath (and Asgards wrath 2 coming out soon. which will probably be the biggest VR game released to date) walking dead saints and sinners.

[@viddysgamingviddyos4710]

I've not played VR since going to a small gaming venue in early 2020, which was kind of fun, but at the same time made me uncertain about the medium's future. I've missed out on titles like Half Life Alyx, but then again, there are probably very few games worth getting VR for.

[@conflictt3224]

You can find a lot of good short games in VRChat as well but most aren't anything too crazy. Fate of the Irrbloss is like FTL in VR kind of. Devouring is a genuinely solid horror game that runs for a few hours. People who are into VR socializing, minigames with friends, and RP get the most mileage out of VR atm just because of VRChat lol. Thats been the case for some time though.

[@pirate_cove_man]

This may be controversial, but to me, VR is one of those things where it seems like the coolest thing ever when you watch it on KZbin, but then you actually get into it, it's just alright. I do still enjoy games like Job Simulator and FNaF Help Wanted, but I find it hard to go back to VR often

[@suerte1392]

Nah, the wow factor isn't on youtube, in both manual feats and inmersion. Alyx surprised me in the elevator when the guard responded to my tries to press the buttons, the striders, jeff and the final level too was something on flat screen would have done little but is cool as heck on VR. H3VR is all about guns and knowing how they operate in the game, so with time not only do you get good at aiming and reloading, you start being cool too, see jeditobione for some examples.

[@TheDarkEye]

thx a lot for this update video and good to see some regular uploads from you :) I haven't yet gotten a VR system and so far only played beatsaber on a friend's device :/ The high price and low amount of interesting exclusive titles are too much of a turndown

[@JustJulyo]

More snoman in 2023!

[@Tukaro]

BeatSaber is the #1 reason, by far (even well past HL:A), that I want a VR setup. Unfortunately, even after many years the cost of a "full" VR setup (not just the headset, but a powerful PC as well) remains well beyond my ability to afford :( I think that's the major hurdle for VR: If someone can create a _general_ VR device that can work on its own out-of-the-box and costs

[@godril90]

Dude buy a quest or the other standalone cheap one. Beat saber it's there and it's good

[@zacharyhailey2120]

Been playing on my OG Oculus Rift since 2013. Can’t wait to see what you have to say Snoman!

[@Landjrin]

Also Id like to recommend Boneworks, Wanderer, Amid Evil VR, and Red Matter 2 for some more killer VR Apps.

[@Landjrin]

OH and also Pistol Whip and Until you Fall, those or both essentially exercise games but they're loads of fun.

[@stevoisiak]

I wish Facebook wasn't the only way to get a proper wireless VR headset

[@Til_What]

Totally agree. The release of Alyx was a point where I had fain hopes of "Is this the point where the big budget games are finally through development and about to release?". And then absolutely nothing else like it released. Trying to find good VR titles feels like sorting through garbage games on the mobile app store, to find that one thing, you can get a few hours of enjoyment from. It's super frustrating and my Rift stays tucked away until I occasionally feel like slicing some blocks rhythmically. To this day, nothing even comes close to Beat Saber in terms of polish and replayability. Kind of sad, really.

[@tomsko863]

Besides things you would categorize as "Games" are there any other more utilitarian programs that VR is doing well? For phones, every critic was looking for the "killer app" that wasn't necessarily a game, just a program that revolutionized how people "thought of" and "interacted with" their phones. Since your phone is always on you, during every moment of your day, it allows it to be used during to solve immediate problems (Need directions? What was the name of that movie? What time is it? etc.).

[@girthfrombirth4408]

Yeah im just gonna wait for the tech to advance and eventually there will be affordable and powerful vr headsets made plus advanced vr games, i was always on the fence on buying a vr headset

[@Shiom270]

Still haven't got my hands on a VR set-mainly because of that price tag, to be honest with you. I'm sure there's plenty of fun to be had (this video reminded me of how much I want to play Beat Saber), but so far there hasn't been a VR game that made me go, "yeah, I absolutely have to play this one".

[@TayoEXE]

I mean, can you afford a Nintendo Switch? Quest 2 is now back down to $299 USD, same as a Switch, and it gives you access to a large standalone library as well as PCVR library and SteamVR if you have a good PC.

[@michaellong2439]

I think thats part of VR though, which makes it tough. Half life Alyx was absolutely not even close my favorite gaming experience of all time. But when you watch gameplay or trailers it's hard to imagine it, especially for people who have never tried vr in the first place. In a trailer it looks cool but it just looks like youre shooting and dodging like any other shooter. Hard to show what it's really like in game. especially the dark scary parts.

[@blackphysicalexperimentation]

i love this great technic

[@Yamartim]

I dont think it's an issue that the biggest vr games are just normal games with vr modes on them, thats probably the only comprimise possible to even be able to make a high budget game that supports vr and still sells well enough for the production to be justified What will happen to vr I feel is the same thing that happpened to motion controls, it'll eventually integrate itself to normal games to a point we barely see any games exclusive to it but also a lot more games will support it as an option for players that a lot of people will prefer due to the immersion it provides

[@gionnis]

I live for the day I get my hands on a "NerveGear" headset

[@KevinCow]

You need to play Astro Bot Rescue Mission. It's a top tier 3D platformer that uses VR in some extremely fun and creative ways. It's so good that Sony had the team make a sort of sequel, Astro's Playroom, and made it the PS5 pack-in game. Unfortunately, it's only on PSVR. Can't even play it on PSVR2. So it's tough to play these days.

[@slachnahoff]

I'm sure other people have mentioned it, I've had a great time played RE4 VR, had these moments, like you mentioned in HL Alyx, where having to manually reload made the game so much intense and scarrier. And after playing a lot of VR demos that had that little grab from afar mechanic, I've also tried to do that IRL.... lmao..... A game I'd recommend if you don't already know it is Moss (Book I and II), it's third person (sorta) controling a little mouse in a miniature/diorama world almost, through a zelda-like adventure. I wouldn't say ground-breaking, but it's a solid game, very cute, very pretty.

[@ty_sylicus]

I sampled VR at my nephew's house and was IMMEDIATELY addicted to Beat Saber. It was all I wanted to do! Sadly, VR sets have just went up in price lately. Are there any good introductory sets?

[@yoplait3256]

I don't really like meta but if you want to have VR that you could use to play beatsaber and other games right away I'd recommend the quest 2 but I'd get the cheapest model and use it on a gaming pc with a link cable for the best selection of games on steam like Half-life Alyx.

[@ty_sylicus]

Noted. =)

[@sabinsx]

One thing not to discount about Beat Saber is the high calorie burn from playing on higher difficulty settings. It's equivalent to a moderate game of tennis. It's genuinely a decent source of cardio.

[@TechNinjaSigma]

You should try Into the Radius (Librarian Gang) It's still a liitle shaky, but it's introduced a lot of clever mechanics for VR. There's also Broken Edge (Shout out to Broken Edge) A Sword Fighting PvP game that revolves around its ingenious "Sword Stance" Mechanic. Definitely give those a shot, I'd love to see what you think of them!

[@TheRealPots]

why are we talking about beat saber in 2023 like its something new.

[@CakeDayZ]

Other than Hotdogs Horsehoes and Handgrenades I rarely get on my valve index anymore.

[@MrMotown1981]

It would be nice to talk about more games from different systems for those who aren't familiar with VR. Games like Red Matter 2, Moss 2, Resident Evil Village, Boneworks, Pavlov, Skyrim VR(Best video game experience I've ever had), RE7, Polybius, Astrobot Rescue Mission, No Man's Sky VR(amazing), GrAN tURISMO 7, Wipeout Omega Collection, Firewall: Zero Hour, even Gorilla tag is a killer app for kids.

[@michaellong2439]

The problem with VR ports from flatscreen games is that, while they may sell to the VR audience, they probably wont do much in terms of getting new people to buy vr. Most people might think vr Skyrim sounds sick, but they already played Skyrim, they know the story and the gameplay and the environment. It's almost like if you have Skyrim on xbox 360 and then they remaster on xbox X. I doubt anyone would buy a new xbox just to play Skyrim again

[@rediornaut7018]

My favorite game in VR, 3 years after getting my headset, is still Pavlov. The gameplay is incredibly fluid, the mods are fantastic, and now that it has crossplay with PSVR2 users theres no shortage of players to compete against. Pistol Whip and Beat Saber are still my go to games for showing off VR to friends, though.

[@mastergame1311]

Into The Radius, man.

[@blindtreeman8052]

almost a decade into VR and all we have is beat saber and half life alyx. and the price hasnt exactly gone down for it either,

[@Lykrast]

I really want to get a VR headset, to play Half Life Alyx (+ the Levitation mod for it), and for some other smaller VR stuff I had stumbled on. But sadly between getting a new GPU to handle it (about ~350€) and the headset itself (around ~350€ for a quest but that comes with facebook crap, and more like 800€ for other models), like that's way too expensive for just like 3 games, and that makes me sad.

[@ChillinWithTheCapuchins]

I love VR and yet I hardly ever play it. And I think so much of it comes down to friction of use. The headsets are largely uncomfortable, there are so many PC issues that I often literally spend more time trying to troubleshoot and get stuff booted up and working than actually playing, and most of the time when playing games I really just want to sit and relax. That last one should be simple to accommodate but so much VR seems to go out of its way to force you to move. I understand that's generally more immersive, but I would be willing to sacrifice that immersion to instead control cameras with a mouse or controller rather than having to sit forward and and jam my chin into my chest just to look at the ground. Make it optional for those who deal with motion sickness. Its small options like these that are missing and they make it so that even someone like me who loves VR , rarely actually plays it.

[@michaellong2439]

I agree. The quest 3 seems to (hopefully) fix most issues people have with vr. One of the biggest underrated things is that the quest 3 is supposed to automatically determine play space. no more drawing the square every time you turn the thing on. Also Automatic updates for some reason only just now came to quest. Which, thank god it's here, huge QOL improvement. But also I have no idea why it wasn't there before

[@Digibenho]

Have you seen Davigo? It's an asymetric VR vs controller game and it's been my favorite VR title for a while. Still not a "Full" game with a story and everything, but it's a lot of fun and has a bit of depth to it as well

[@primedialga]

we need full dive

[@jdodds1612]

I think people need to be mentioning ghosts of tabor alongside alyx as the multiplayer killer app. True, it's still pretty buggy and early access, but it's also the only multiplayer game with true progression giving you a reason to keep coming back

[@ShadowWolfTJC]

Methinks VR seems to share the same kinds of problems that motion controls did back in the Nintendo Wii days, or heck, back when 3D was still new in the late 90s and early 2000s, and perhaps even back when video games as a whole were still a novelty in the 80s. Developers just need time to figure out what kinds of new genres of games could be created using these new technologies, and I believe that VR is no exception.

[@YouNeverComeCloser]

well, No Man's Sky VR could be a massive step up, now after the update .. i've never considered buying a VR set, but now i do ..

[@Sekacnap_]

Have you played Asgards Wrath from 2019? It was billed as one of the first full fledged AAA style games on VR and to it's credit, it is actually pretty cool. Combat has some depth to it, there's RPG mechanics, loot and dungeons with decent level design and puzzles, it really did feel like a fully featured game, not just a tech demo. That said, it had some problems, most notably super long load times. Having to wait 2-5 minutes every time I died made each death feel horribly punishing and tedious. But I do suggest checking it out if you want something substantial in VR, problem is I think it's stuck on the occulus store.

[@CosmicReef]

" Combat has some depth to it" Which is? I played AW2 as well and if I miss anything than depth of combat. So what depth are you talking about?

[@kakhome1]

This is off topic a bit but what's your favorite Sonic games? Maybe three for 2D and three for 2.5/3D. Just something I'm always interested in :)

[@SkyeWint]

Do you remember outer wilds? I'm sure you do. There is a mod for it that lets you play it in VR, and is designed so well that it feels as though the game itself was designed that way. The only clunkiness is dialogue with actual NPCs, and it heightens all the visual spectacle and tension from interacting with the world to absolutely incredible degrees. I want more "gimmicks" like that, games where you can use your tools accurately in ways that enhance immersion in a world to an incredible degree. I unironically wish I could have played it in VR originally. The mod is THAT GOOD. Also, as a custom map maker for beat saber, it goes far beyond what you showed there as well. Harder maps can be expressive representations of music in a way that dance simply can't be. They can be wonderful exercise tools while being extremely fun. And, modded maps can be absolute visual spectacles that still make my jaw drop - such as "Somewhere Out There" by acloudyskye. The notes visually drift towards you in water, float and glide through the air like they're carried on the wind, crack as though they're broken, and even smash towards you as the song peaks. It's unbelievable.

[@khaledassaf6356]

Modded games in general are some of the best VR experiences I've had. Valheim, Half Life 2, Deep Rock Galactic...

[@mimszanadunstedt441]

They should do that wii game ninja reflex but for vr.

[@alturos]

I’ve seen folks talking about some real bangers that have hit for VR, but I wanted to just briefly share a couple that changed the game for me entirely. First, Elite Dangerous. I never played it in 2D and there’s almost nothing like it (House of the Dying Sun comes close!) But if I had to name a standout that, to me, rivals Alyx in execution it’s Vertigo Remastered (and more recently Vertigo 2). It’s an absolute MASTERPIECE, and a VR killer app.

[@odinsplaygrounds]

Have you not played Boneworks? I think that game had a bigger impact on me in VR than HL: Alyx. While Alyx is a high budget and well polished VR game, Boneworks is far more ground-breaking and physics based. Vertigo 1 & 2 are also some excellent games. Skyrim and Fallout 4 are great VR titles WITH MODS - really saved by the community for those "in-depth" adventures.

[@yoplait3256]

Boneworks and Alyx are similar yet very different, I love both but man Boneworks isn't easy to get into if you aren't a vr vet with at least a few hundred hours of vr playtime under your belt due to how much more in depth the gameplay can get compared to Alyx.

[@odinsplaygrounds]

@@yoplait3256 Yes it's far more in-depth. Boneworks feels like "Half-Life" in VR, while Alyx is more of a streamlined game. I even refunded Boneworks when I first played VR as I was only borrowing the headset and I just couldn't handle the game within my limited time. But after I bought a VR headset and had played through Alyx and other games, it was the perfect next level step into VR.

[@CheeerriOH]

The only company who can afford to throw the money needed to make a AAA vr game is Valve because they are selling you the headset and take all of the profit from the sale. I think its telling its all small studios trying to make Vr games but they don't have the resources to make it feel like Half life. And Valve doesnt make games because why bother more than once a decade when the Steam money keeps rolling in.

[@AidanRatnage]

I don't ever want to try beat sabre, It looks so difficult.

[@brunocerra1850]

Have you actually played any new vr games? I mean , breachers , into the radius , the walking dead , budget cuts 2, rumble , blade and sorcery I think that vr is not for everyone , but for those of us that really enjoy it there is no replacement

[@RayTC]

pretty sure this guy only played the top 10 on steam from years ago and never anything else ive seen puddles in the kitchen that went deeper than this video

[@billybobjoe8549]

i swear vr has just been beatsaber and like 2 people playing into the radius and bonelab for the past year.

[@ibenizer]

What is your view on Apple Vision Pro?

[@CosmicReef]

Let me answer the question: If you love VR, you will most likely love the Apple VR. If you don't like VR or VR titles, you won't like it as well, and it might become the most expensive dust collector in your household

[@Joe-bs9dj]

No one mentioning boneworks or vertigo 2. These games pushed the boundaries of vr and are way better than HLA

[@Matshiro]

For me beat saber and blade and sorcery can be enough for hunderds of hours. Adding games like half life, boneworks and walking dead and you have fun roleplaying games. No man sky was also amazing. Tbh there are really a lot of small games that are fun for at least few days. But yeah, VR games were really amazing and nowdays it's kinda lacking new stuff

[@TFconfused]

I'm just gonna share some VR games that I think are awesome and worth playing for anyone who stumbles upon this. -Top of the list Into the Radius -Vertigo 1 and 2 - Saints and Sinners 1 and 2 - Red Matter, I've only played 2 but hear great things about 1 - Hubris - Moss 1 and 2 - The Light Brigade (banger roguelike) - Pistol Whip personal favorite rhythm game never liked Beat Saber - Synapse - Phantom covert ops Also Fallout 4 and Skyrim if your willing to learn to mod them, they aren't worth playing Vanilla but it's actual insane what mods have done to those games in VR. I don't want the comment to go on forever but there's a lot of great VR stuff out there. They just aren't huge big names that people recognize so they don't get talked about.

[@ch0ppy936]

Hey! I like your video but i kinda want to bring out a point that there are more games for vr than beat saber and half life alyx. pretty sure you know that yourself. For beginner especially there are things to do. You can play Pavlov VR Population one blade and sorcery, boneworks/lab Walking dead saints and sinners, after the fall and more. And VRChat as a social platform has also many games within. I mean i wouldnt say VR is mainstream that wouldnt really be true, but there is still quite a bit you can do in VR

[@RedBlueProductions1]

VR's at a point where it's mostly furries getting to be their fursonas in VRChat and no more there's a lot of development there but that's kinda it really

[@Ariuss3]

My biggest issues is that VR is cumbersome. Not just to wear on your head, but to get it set up, to clear or keep clear a space for it. Make sure your controllers have new batteries, and countless other things just to play a few good titles. There isn't exactly a real killer app in my mind either, while Half Life Alyx is really good, it doesn't have that scale to keep me invested in coming back to pick up my headset again.

[@toututu2993]

Random people: VR IS DEAD!! ME: *Being amazed of a 6 year old vr shooter game having constant 300 server full of players*

[@ThKolle]

I'm waiting for the Index 2 because I will not pay 1000€ for an outdated Index.

[@JayClarkus]

You should give Resident Evil 4 VR a try

[@brucerain2106]

I just want pancake lenses,oled, good resolution, and no latency. Is this too much to ask for?

[@Lefaid]

I have a feeling I found you through the 2017 video. I wish I knew what could save the platform. I love VR. But, it seems like there is a real disconnect between where the money goes with regards to VR and actual valuable innovation in the space.

[@derekw8039]

I see a lot of push for "look at the realistic interactions you can do with the world" but not a lot of "what kinds of full-fledged games/experiences can we create with these realistic interactions."

[@OSW]

For anyone with a hint of motion sickness, VR is an instant no :( Asians have a higher likelihood of motion sickness so it's probably a no-go in Japan, the epicentre of gaming, which cripples VR's progress. Looks v cool though!

[@N3rD_OVL]

You're right dude. Most games are tek demo ish. However we also have games like boneworks and community based fps games like Pavlov, contractors, Vertigo 1&2, and Onward (the latter I play competitively in the VR master league). VR is often compared to flat screen but the style is totally different. Emersion is the name of the game and since VR can truly raise your heart rate as bullets wiz passed ur head, Id say they nailed it. It's just a bit of a hurdle for the masses and most don't want to put in the time to develop their VR legs. It's a shame meta has dominated the market. They keep things in the stone age, but if you dig past the surface, you'll find some sick diamonds... Give it another try. You'd be surprised how many hrs you can lose in something like... Saint & sinners. I have over 3000 hrs in VR and I just can't get that fix like when I put on my HMD. Lmk what you think of those aforementioned titles.

[@kingcrimson234]

VR needs two things. 1. Better titles from big budget companies, employing developers and designers that truly understand the technology. 2. The hardware needs to become less cumbersome to use while also bringing down the price, but I'm not sure how they'll do that. The best VR game IMO is still Boneworks. It truly pushes the limits of the tech and gives us a taste of how immersive VR can really be. Unfortunately, as much as I love it, it feels like something in between a game and a tech demo. Noble effort, but Stress Level Zero's relatively low budget is obvious when playing. We need AAA companies to start pushing the boundaries in the same way but while bringing polish to it. But why would they? The users just aren't there to make it worth it.

[@togz813]

My personal favorite was " super hot VR" and yes it is a completely different game than the PC release

[@matKilla9801]

Quest 3 is less than half he price i paid for VR in 2016. The quality has gone up massively while bringing the price down to console levels. The Quest 3 will result in a renaissance of VR, the tech is finally good enough for mass consumer adoption. My VR headset also used to collect dust, but that has changed dramatically since upgrading to Quest 3. Also, Contractors Showdown is the big killer app that VR has been waiting for.

[@MoonSpiritChannel]

Woo! Another Sno vid! And VR still gets a "yeah, okay, but no thanks" verdict. I just don't have the space or money to afford VR still. That'll probably be for the foreseeable future in current living status. Shame b/c Beat Saber and HL: Alyx look like a ton of fun.

[@aniken6877]

We are has not been in its infancy since the 90s you know why there aren’t a lot of good games it’s really because there aren’t a lot of developers who are willing to make a game for VR and why would they it’s more lucrative to make games that everyone can play meaning flatscreen games on steam, PlayStation and Xbox. The thing about VR is that there have been a lot of drawbacks to it in the early days of modern VR, you had to pull yourself in and have a bunch of bait stations around With the quest one, and two you could have standalone VR but the graphics and fidelity weren’t great. I think the quest three might actually get more developers to make VR games

[@evilmandrake]

I stand by what I've always said; unless VR gets to Nervegear levels, it will always be just a gimmick. There is potential to do cool things, sure, but nobody wants to wave their arms all over to play a video game.

[@thehumblewolf]

If you have at least 2 friends who live long distance with quest2 and you Are Not playing WALKABOUT MINIGOLF…. you are missing the point and true gift that is Vr. Imo the game is incredibly satisfying and they keep coming out with new updates and new maps that are constantly improving and outshining expectations. It’s challenging fun hilarious and most importantly social in a way that flat gaming just can not match. It’s the future and it’s here. PSA: A New Quest will be announced end up September so if you’re thinking of buying the relatively cheap $250 quest2 (which is a banger) wait til then for a sale!

[@Greywander87]

I've been wanting to get into VR but needed to build a new gaming PC first, something I've been wanting to do for a couple years now and just haven't had the money for it. I had hoped that by the time I was able to, VR would have really taken off and there would be all kinds of cool games as well as good hardware at an affordable price, but it seems like VR hasn't really gone anywhere yet. It does seem like it's not dead, just relegated to a niche audience, and at any moment a killer app could suddenly go mainstream and make it widespread. I do think we need cheaper, more accessible VR sets to make that happen, though. And one killer app won't be enough, we need something that fundamentally changes how VR games are designed and inspires a paradigm shift. The "killer app" is just the gateway, but people will turn around and leave if there's nothing on the other side. The thing is, I'm not sure if the thing that will break VR into the mainstream is hardware or software. VR is still in its infancy, and there's still a lot of hardware that's being experimented with, from haptic suits to omni-directional treadmills. Until the hardware settles into a standard, it will be tricky to develop consistent software.

[@franciscofarias6385]

Dude, not to disagree with the main point of your video, but there are many great VR games you seem to be sleeping on, like Boneworks, Saints and Sinners, Eleven Table Tennis, Skyrim VR, Into the Radius, Lone Echo, Pavlov and Ghosts of Tabor. Come on, you can't talk about The State of VR and try like two games.

[@CosmicReef]

Tech Demos. Bought Into the radius a few hours ago and I'm angry that it is allowed to sell such a game on steam. Hated every second. Skyrim is a 10 year old title, a REAL game and people should be ashamed. This game needs a warning on steam too: 10 year old game. Nothing has changed, but we checked a button in the Unreal engine, now VR is enabled. I specifically hate this, because this is a way of delivery that shows me that nobody has REAL content. And it shows the quality of VR in general - you can deliver ten year old games and people still believe you are smart.

[@Pixelflames1]

I think game devs need to think about vr gameplay as optional. Like flight sims have the option to play on a yoke and pedals, you should have te option to render simcity on your carpet and turn off the skybox to reveal passthrough so you can see your family while you play in te living room. Same with 3rd person dungeon crawlers. imagine playing diablo on your desk and having the cutscenes play in full 360 degree immersion. You need to develop for multiple platforms and both 2d and 3d expieriences.

[@Pixelflames1]

Remember 3d tv's. For every 3d tv expierience existed a 2d expierience. It was the same with nvidia 3d vision and nintendo 3ds. VR is an optional full immersion.

[@Pixelflames1]

We also need to get better at rendering traditionally flatscreen games in stereoscopic.

[@michaellong2439]

you should try vertigo 2. A lot of people have said it's on par with Alyx, just a lower budget game and more comedic tone compared to Alyx seriousness . Was made by 1 guy over the course of many years

[@Dalenthas]

VR has been 5-10 years away from being good since I was a kid in the 90s.

[@r3dh34d32]

You could have dug a bit deeper and maybe shone some light on current projects like Grimlord, Rumble, Bonelab series, Blade and Sorcery... That could have been a beneficial use of your reach to boost VR development by introducing your audience to the projects. However, your estimate of roughly six years is not far fetched.