The Surprising Cartier Watch Movements and the Top Watchmaker Behind Them

[@stevefox8605]

Thanks Bill 👍🏻👍🏻

[@watchartsci]

My pleasure Steve! Take care, Bill

[@oneal14attnet]

Bill, you have the best channel on KZbin! Why? Because you are looking behind the hood and acting like this is truly a hobby and not an “asset class.” One that warrants a deeper understanding of the watches we all so desire. Who else is looking at the actual watch makers, component makers, case makers and dial makers as opposed to comparing the dials colors or bracelets? Or making a point as to “why” one watch is better than another from a mechanical perspective. You’ve touched on so many brands outside of the mainstream that are great buys. I truly enjoy your content. Keep up the good work sir.

[@watchartsci]

Hey Monkey! Thanks man! Take care Bill

[@TimG--]

Starting to like Cartier !! TH starting to move up too !! She is doing a great job there. I have been told TH are going to have there own in house movements within 3 years. Thx Bill.

[@watchartsci]

Ever since I've been collecting watches I've been waiting for TAG Heuer to come up with a movement of their own... maybe this time. Take care Bill

[@AbdulRWatches]

Great video Bill, I always liked Cartier, and their elegant dress watches, and now they have the high horology movements to go with their designs.

[@watchartsci]

Well said, Abdul! ... but save a few bucks for a watch in June! Take care, Bill

[@AbdulRWatches]

@WatchArtSci I have been trying my best to keep my watch purchases to the minimum cause of that 😁😁

[@watchartsci]

@@AbdulRWatches It's not been easy!

[@arentjanlinde6159]

Thanks Bill, Cartier makes you feel special. I really enjoy that.

[@watchartsci]

Good point, that they do Arent! Take care Bill

[@etebol]

As always a great informative video with great insight, thank you Mr. Bill!

[@watchartsci]

Very welcome, Ed! My pleasure. Take care Bill

[@andrefreing8290]

i love Cartier from the 1980 on ......

[@watchartsci]

Hi Andre ... are those post-Must-de-Cartier? Take care, Bill

[@chrishoyt7548]

Oui out, bonjour bonjour. Good vid Bill. I like these with a bio or history of the movement designers. Thank you. Love your Canadian hunting flannel and your Montreal beret. Stay warm I may send some polar bears your way. Chris the Prairie Canuck

[@watchartsci]

For Monday's video, I have a sweater that I got on Prince Edward Island in Canada, Chris. Take care Bill

[@weezkidtube]

Hi Bill Saw this older coverage of yours as I'm considering the retrograde gmt as a dress watch. Rather big at 42mm, just as the MC due to its shape, but I'm intrigued by the movement design. Right now, it's a toss up against the JLC Hometime Aston Martin due to the 975 movement (with ALS hairspring). Which one would you think has a better movement?

[@watchartsci]

Weezkid, it's one of those choices where neither is wrong-go totally with what your intuition on this one. Take care, Bill

[@antoiner4207]

Great content!!! Wonder if you have info on the movement of Ballon Bleu moon calendar model (080 MC) I’ve been trying to look for more info on these but can not find any.

[@watchartsci]

Antoine, Cartier has used everything from quartz to ETAs in their Ballon Bleus. Right now, the 40 and 42mm the Ballon Bleu de Cartier models have caliber 1847 MC movements-in house Cartier movements (MC="Manufacture Cartier."). However, the 36mm models use caliber 049, which is Cartier's version of the ETA 2892-A2. On the 37mm Ballon Bleu with a moon phase, the movement is automatic ETA Caliber 2671 . Take care, Bill

[@supremegalacticcommander2783]

I love Cartier, beautiful watches and incredible craftsmanship. Great video as always, thank you!

[@watchartsci]

My pleasure Cupcake. Take care Bill

[@jamessymington2466]

Interesting and eye-opening

[@watchartsci]

I think more people should be aware of the crucial role of the watchmakers! Designers get all the credit! Take care Bill

[@anibaluriarte3676]

Morning dear Bill! For a longer time period, I am taking into account buying a Cartier. The single disturbing factor is that they are overhyped now. Cheers

[@watchartsci]

Over-hyped Anibal? Not compared to Rolex, Omega, Patek Philippe and a dozen other brands. I think you'd look good with a Cartier! Take care, Bill

[@mdo5121]

@@watchartsci SPOT ON

[@h111551]

Awe inspiring. CFK was also a consultant to Ulysses Nardin in the creation of the movement for the Freak which is an often overlooked piece of high horology and (much to your consternation) the first movement to introduce silicone components. Richemont backtracked on Cartier’s focus on high end movement making and bright hued solar quartz Must de Cartier references are now hitting it out of park in terms of units sold making the bean counters very happy. I am interested to see what her impact will be at TAG Heuer which is an LVMH portfolio company.

[@watchartsci]

Right Howard, I'm glad you mentioned the UN Freak. While a tad strange, there was solid horology in the Freak. Take care Bill

[@williamwhitaker2928]

Question for all. I am interested in the Santos Dumont due to its historic importance but only the extra large comes with a mechanical caliber from Piaget. What would be the preferred mechanical movement for the Dumont or any Santos?

[@johnbisschop]

Very interesting as always!

[@watchartsci]

Hey John, thanks man! Take care Bill

[@weezkidtube]

Thanks, Bill!

[@watchartsci]

My pleasure Weezkid! Take care, Bill

[@TrumanBurbankFE]

Here's my problem, other brands base movements are in a different league. For instance, cal 8800 from Omega has double balance bridge, in-house silicon hairspring, anti shock and anti magnetic (15.000 gauss), 55-60 hrs power reserve, +5/0 sec accuracy. Cal 3230 from Rolex has also double balance bridge, their own Parachrome hairspring, Paraflex shock absorbers, 70 hrs power reserve, +/-2 sec accuracy. JLC's new cal 899 AC in Master Control Date has 70 hrs power reserve, 1000 hrs accuracy testing, silicon hairspring. Tudor's movement MT5400 from Kenissi also has double balance bridge, silicon hairspring, 70 hrs power reserve, COSC certified, datejust. Cartier's 1904 PS - MC is kind of already outdated in comparison I think, and do they make their own balance and shocks or is it outsourced, like a Nivarox from the Swatch Group? All these other brands are in the same price range as well. The TAG Heuer 02 movement from a blueprint from 1969 is an excellent chronograph for the money I believe, so Kasapi's task would be to design a new base movement for TAG to replace the ETA derived movements and take their brand to a more serious level.

[@watchartsci]

Truman, what exactly does a double balance bridge do? The balance in the 8800 is swung by an inflexible silicon (Swatch) hairspring...? If it has the co-axial escapement, that's something. I like the fact that Rolex hasn't succumbed to silicon, and JLC has been making great movement forever. Cartier's 1904 PS-MC is a base movement, and its structure is such that several other movements have been built on it...nothing mediocre about it.(...including both Vacheron Constantin and Piaget) Check these out: www.cartier.com/en-us/movements.html Take care, Bill

[@TrumanBurbankFE]

@@watchartsci Double balance bridge makes it more sturdy for hits and bangs, perfect for modern sports watches. I know you don't like inflexible silicon but it might be an easier and less expensive way for getting that accuracy figures. Right, it's a technical innovation with coaxial escapement, as with Rolex' new efficient Chronergy escapement. The 1904 can remind me of Parmigiani Fleurier's base movement which likes of Richard Mille uses in some of their base calibers, or they put a Dubois Depraz chrono on top on Kalpagraph. The difference is that PF makes everything from 5 of their subsidiary companies.

[@watchartsci]

@@TrumanBurbankFE Silicon is better in several ways: non-magnetic; less affected by changes in temperature and never needs adjusting. My iPhone has lots more silicon and is more accurate. Metal hairsprings are far more susceptible to those things, but if I wanted silicon-based perfection I would have to look no further than the device I use to accurately set my mechanical watches. Cheers, Bill

[@TrumanBurbankFE]

@@watchartsci Thanx Bill and cheers, take care over the pond.

[@thegolflife7565]

Is the caliber 1847 MC a solid movement?

[@watchartsci]

As far as I know G-Life. Take care, Bill

[@andresfg6788]

She's been at TAG now. Looking forward to that

[@watchartsci]

We ought to see in a couple of years, Andres. Great expectations. Take care Bill

[@jmbaug1229]

Excellent content 👌 thanks 🤩

[@watchartsci]

My pleasure, JMB. Take care, Bill

[@jmbaug1229]

@@watchartsci it is hard to find Information about Cartier movements. I really appreciate your content 🤍

[@watchartsci]

@@jmbaug1229 Glad I could help. If you haven't seen this, it's more information on Cartier movements: www.cartier.com/en-us/movements.html. Take care, Bill

[@aDocandhisWatch]

Very interesting!! I wonder if their “basic” manual in-house movement was also developed under her. I’ve heard it’s an excellent movement that’s in some of the Privé Collection watches. Thanks for the video Bill

[@watchartsci]

Kasapi was running the movement division at the time, Doc; so whether or not she did the actual design, she was a major influence. Take care Bill

[@aDocandhisWatch]

@@watchartsci thanks for the reply! Always looking forward to your videos my friend. Thanks 👍🏻

[@jameshoward9700]

Interesting - where will Cartier go next? I suspect ever greater design-led volume. I can't help but think Richemont brands overlap too much: Cartier vs JLC (elegant class - high end Tank vs low end Reverso); VC vs ALS (HH watchmaking); Panerai vs IWC (oversized machismo). I would guess the strategy is to move them apart: design led vs movement led. But this may mean high end watch making at Cartier and VC will suffer? Perhaps why CK-F left for LVMH? Which means they will be prioritising movements in their brands (a very good thing for TH!).

[@watchartsci]

James, that indeed is a good question! They're not a brand that huge among collectors or men in general. Their prices and clean designs are their biggest assets. Take care Bill

[@Javi_C]

I personally like Cartier, in the distant future I would like to go to Paris and purchase a Cartier tank.

[@watchartsci]

Hey Javi, now that would be a trip worth taking! Take care Bill

[@maynardgoff7321]

Hey Bill, who is responsible the Heuer 02?

[@watchartsci]

Maynard, I've not been following TAG Heuer for a while, and their movement names are somewhat deceptive. The Heuer 02 is based on the Calibre 1969/CH 80; so I don't know whether it's an update of an existing movement or a new set of features on the old movement. However, I don't think it's a new movement by Kasapi. Take care, Bill

[@maynardgoff7321]

@@watchartsci, thank you.

[@loborojo777]

I heard ten "cuckoos" from your clock. It could've been eleven, as well, not sure. Thanks for highlighting Cartier. Another great video, Bill. Keep up the interesting work.

[@watchartsci]

You've got ears Lobrojo ... my wife's cuckoos going off! Take care Bill

[@thomasaurus_rex]

Some of these movements are phenomenal, others look like they're based of ETA or Sellita moments. Nothing wrong with that, in fact my latest work with 3D printing/material design and the hobbiest watchmaking makes me think that having base parts such as the gear train/balance should be using the same gears as standard movements for easier service and creation whilst instead investing the effort into decoration, cases and dials. Nothing saddens me more then working on some family heirloom just to find a worn down pinion that can't be replaced without a risky donor. Instead something ubiquitous might not last forever but at least the parts will be in circulation NOS for 30+ years after they're discontinued. Maybe this is just where I have landed with experience now, owning things from Breguet to Casio. Inhouse is only as good as part supply and standards make me respect movements like the Powermatic 80 more then when I received for my first model 18th birthday.

[@thomasa.243]

Yes, this is also one reason why Seiko, love them or hate them, is a good buy for long term parts availability. They share the same base movement from the cheapest to the most expensive watch. The difference is of course in certain features, finishing, etc. but if a "base part" breaks, it can be easily replaced. Same of course true as well for Swatch Group. You have the same ETA base from Tissot over Longines to Omega.

[@watchartsci]

Well Thomas...the base movements don't appear to be ETA base unless you think all watches with barrels, going trains, escapements, pallet forks, balance wheels and hairsprings are based on ETAs. The calibers that Carole Forestier- Kasapi left behind are enough to give Cartier enough mechanicals movement designs until the end of the century...and I hope she does the same for TAG Heuer. Take care, Bill

[@leightodd7335]

What a talent and has transformed Cartier watch movements under her leadership. So Bill why do watch makers continue to put tourbillions in watches? Do they do something? Looks like at one time they did but now only to show the makers skill? Is there any other complication that has no point but watch maker skill? Why not put the effort into constant force? Also difficult and only done by a few? I've probably had to much coffee! Seems like the only complication that doesn't actually do something! Of course that might be said about some old retired guy that lives in my house. lol

[@watchartsci]

Leigh, they'll put tourbillons in as long as someone will pay a price for them. Take care Bill

[@andresfg6788]

This video makes me want a Cartier 🤔

[@watchartsci]

The more I found out about their movements Andres, the more attractive they became. Take care, Bill

[@VitalyMack]

I wonder if the 1847 MC is a good movement...wasn't mentioned in this video...lol

[@watchartsci]

As the French might say about the 1847 MC, Vitaly, 'pas mal'...Automatic (with bi-directional winding) 42hours, 28,800 so/hr, date. Looks like a decent standard mechanical movement. Take care, Bill