The TRUE ORIGIN of the Weeping Angels!

There's a popular Doctor Who fan theory that claims the iconic Weeping Angels are actually Time Lords, The Doctor's own people. But how convincing is the theory?
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#DoctorWho #Theory #WeepingAngels

[@HarboWholmes]

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[@killgriffinnow]

I never agreed with this theory. The way the Doctor talks about them in “Blink” makes them sound like these mysterious, ancient entities that are even older than the Time Lord. Plus he implies that they evolved the ability to turn to stone as a defence mechanism. Finally, Rassilon says that the Time Lords will be frozen “like the Weeping Angels of old”, implying that the angels are a different entity, and that the Angels existed in Ancient Times.

[@adolfodef]

Since the revealing from "The Timeless Child", it is implied that The Doctor lacks ANY real memories predating the creation of the "Web of Time" [an event that connected the enslavement of the purple_coded entity "Time" (aka "Death") that enforces linearity & the golden_coded "BigBang" (aka "Life") that generates new information]. . The Weeping Angels are constructs made of information ("naturally spawned" robots/demons, not living beings with a soul, a begining & end); their "origin" (if that concept is even applicable) would be somewhere [not "sometime"] inside the maze that was the "Dark Times"; all that predated the existence of numbers & equations [back when witches/magic/ilusions were as real as matter/energy, before Gravity & Black Holes (a later invention of the Time Lords)]. El Psy Kongroo /)

[@killgriffinnow]

@@adolfodef (\

[@sarbnitrof4663]

@@adolfodef I didn't realize the show had this silly origin for how reality works. Kinda glad I stopped watchin

[@eshbena]

@@sarbnitrof4663 Well, tbf, the actual theories of scientists is that there was no 'big bang', that the universe has always existed and always will. It changes shape, it expands and contracts, and we can never know why with the limited time and brain power that we have. So, ...is that a silly theory? Who's to say? XD

[@FullCircleStories]

Good point. "Like" as in a simile. A comparison to weeping angels.

[@DanTheMan2150AD]

Now we patiently wait for Harbo to deconstruct the theory of Rory being The Master.

[@tommatom3513]

people actually think that..?

[@MrFancyDragon]

Wait, what??

[@elliottnoad1270]

@@MrFancyDragon back in Let's Kill Hitler, after putting Hitler in the cupboard & watching Mels regenerate, Rory said he was getting a banging in his head. Amy said it was Hitler in the cupboard and the episode goes on If I remember correctly, this banging was theorised to be the drumbeat/signal from Gallifrey in the Master's head and the Master regenerated & escaped from the last day of the time war, now looking like Rory. The theory falls apart the more you think about it but it was a popular theory for a bit.

[@brobs0463]

Rory is the master, just waiting for the reveal in series 18

[@damianbrophy6481]

The Master is the War Rory.

[@JCM-ve5gg]

I always got the impression there was a shared history between the Angels and Time Lords ever since that line of dialogue from Rassilon in End of Time, or at the very least they were in conflict in the Dark Times maybe, or the Time Lords are actually responsible for them becoming quantum locked eons ago. In that same story we learn about some of the eldritch horrors the Time War birthed so I don't think any of that is far-fetched. But I think they should leave it at that and let people speculate like with the Midnight Entity. But my favourite theory you put forward was the one where the Weeping Angels are Time Lords erased from existence that have returned to the universe somehow. Because their appearances could then be interpreted in a sort of Lovecraftian way where their true forms as non-existent outer gods are so horrific they can't be perceived by most species, so they manifest themselves as statues. I always thought it was lame when Time of Angels showed them in motion and they're still statues, when they're unobserved I like to think they look nothing like stone angel statues.

[@joshuareynolds23]

Technically you are viewing the angels in time of the angels and, let's not forget that a TV show is just a fuck ton of still shots played together in frames. So seeing them move but, still be statues could literally mean you don't see them in there true form specifically because they are in their true form between frames.

[@johnhiggins1746]

That's y I'd put mines all around em turn out of stone walking on a mine boom

[@TheManBehindTheSlaughter6669]

you forget they can break tech and siphon energy from it.@@johnhiggins1746

[@peezieforestem5078]

@@joshuareynolds23 You win my rationalization prize of the year.

[@joshuareynolds23]

@@peezieforestem5078 I'd agree if it weren't for the implications of time of angels.

[@SerathDarklands]

The Weeping Angels are definitely cool, but there are a few newly-added monsters that I like more. The Time Reapers from _Father's Day,_ the Vashta Nerada from _Silence in the Library_ and _Forest of the Dead,_ and the Midnight Entity from _Midnight_ all are much more fascinating to me.

[@AlrightThere]

All monsters which are really mysterious and don’t have clear motives and are also really deadly are super interesting. I wish the weeping angles were never expanded on but cropped up now and again without explanation. It would make them more terrifying

[@fessy4]

the Vashta Nerada are my favourite monster and concept, not only in Dr Who but maybe all monster lore, not necessarily super original but defs a very innovative concept on fear of the dark, and like @AlrightThere stated its probably because how elusive and mysterious they are but i wish they did add abit more lore to them, besides some like audio books the library was the only appearance in all of dr who and i think thats sad. Also Midnight is probably my second favourite Dr Who episode, but certainly because the mystery surrounding the monster and how fascinated/scared the Dr was with it. i think that episode is so much better because we never got an answer.

[@gregf9160]

No, I think The Weeping Angels are a race far older than the Time Lords. Yes, they appear to feed on Artron Energy, but that's about it. Their exact origin possibly predates the current universe being "leftovers" from a prior epoch.

[@Leviathis_Krade]

considering that the doctor has faced "the devil" in recent canon and that captain jack killed abaddon another entity from before the current universe, most likely these two factions are related in their mysterious origins. with the "disciples of the light" being the possible proto-angel species that we know next to nothing about and "the beast" having similar powers to the weeping angels albeit having a host of his own too, but being able to use people and technology to communicate as vessels of thought are used by both parties. though this is all just speculation as its just loose theory crafting at best, there's also the guardian white & black which further bungles up these theories since well its a mess of lore and very convoluted to try and mash it all together.

[@DarkArtsMage]

@@Leviathis_Krade It's a pity Tenant never had any interactions with either the White or Black Guardians...would have been a nice tribute to the 5th Doctor's Arc of Infinity...

[@beesbrownies]

I really like the "natural predator" idea. Makes most connections between the species make sense, as Time Lords would naturally reference and maybe even tap into the primal fear of a, if not the only, predator. They could be a symbol of shame because for a Time Lord to fall victim to a time based trap would be sneered upon, and would damage the species' reputation.

[@ericstahmer720]

I like the headcanon that the Weeping Angels are the souls of Tardises killed in the Time War. It has about as little supporting it as the Time Lord theory but it would explain why they’re as old as the universe since Tardises can go anywhere in time and space.

[@kateglew580]

I like this theory just fine but I'd prefer for the origin of the Angels to remain a mystery.

[@jeckjeck3119]

It's not the origins. Some time lords can be turned to weeping angels. Like with the timeless child regenerations.

[@maxblake5564]

I personally think that the Weeping Angels are the ones who imprisoned the Beast, the massive Satanic monster from the story that introduced the Ood. If I’m remembering right, the Beast’s spirit has a line about the ones that imprisoned Him that made me immediately think of the Weeping Angels.

[@to4mac]

Good reference to bring up and maybe those entities benefit from chaining up such a creature for all eternity, although would the weeping angles be "Disciples of the Light"?. Still, the Beast said everything regarding that situation happened before time began, tho, so that puts the "angels" around perhaps back then. The doctor also references "angels who fear to tread" when descending the pit but I'm not sure he is referencing the weeping variety here since the themes of this discussion are more about light vs. dark and before/after the universe/time being created.

[@stevedavid5654]

In The End Of Time Part Two, David Tennants final episode, Rassilon states "only two are against, and will stand as monument of shame...like the weeping angels of old" this tells me they will freeze the Timelords in stone as punishment like a weeping angel but not actually as one.

[@MrFancyDragon]

Honestly, I wouldn’t mind if you kept exploring more Doctor Who theories. Especially with the hype train gearing up towards the 60th anniversary and everything surrounding the mystery behind the 14th Doctor and RTD

[@bmvthemoviefanatic7282]

I personally LOVE this theory. It's likely not what RTD or Moffatt intended, and though there are some minor contradictions, I just think enough makes sense for it to work, especially with the Five Doctors moment, and it would make for an interesting Time Lord/Weeping Angel storyline in the future. HOWEVER, I do agree the mystique of the Weeping Angels is what makes them great. That being said, though I believe their origins should stay a mystery, IF they were ever revealed, I think this is a cool way to go, as opposed to what was going to be done in Class Season 2.

[@ashleytuchin7693]

What did Class have planned for them? I've never read anything about what Season 2 was going to entail.

[@inc3000]

At this point It feels like the Angels are being overly filled with Lore to the point they're no longer that mysterious and are also able to be anything

[@akiraokami]

I would personally say that most theories about the Weeping Angels being the evolved form of any creature we currently know of is disputed by the simple line that they've existed since the beginning. While the time lords banished from time could potentially work and from a purely technical standpoint, so could any species that has time traveling capabilities, it seems highly unlikely as sooner or later you'd run into a point in history where people either know who became the Weeping Angels or they'd have a good idea. If anything I would say that they came through the same portal that brought the timeless child, and even then I wouldn't give that theory much to stand on, it's more likely that they are from before creation, a species that somehow survived from whatever came before the current existence.

[@nicka3697]

So if they exist since the actual beginning they must have been on Garm's ship in Terminus. Maybe they were lubrication nanobots In the fuel which inflated to their present size during the inflationary period immediately following the explosion of engine #1.

[@DarkArtsMage]

The only thing I get from the Timeless Child...is that "BBC approves of Experimentation on Children" particularly if you can recieve MEDICAL BENIFITS from all the EXPERIMENTATION! If the Portal where the Timeless child exists, at any point in history...then why not make or send exploration teams through it? the Time Lords are scientists afterall, they desire to know everything! not traveling through the portal, would result in them not Knowing or Controlling this "weak access-point into THEIR universe"! There is a point in Time Lord History that is Time-Locked by Rasilon himself! But that mainly pertains to the rise of the TimeLords/the introduction of both Regeneration & the creation of the Time-Travel tech! Also the mistake Rasilon makes by making a rift that lets the Vampire's of Old into the Universe!

[@robertdragoff6909]

Weeping angels are relatively new, having come about in the rebooted series…. But it’s interesting that fans have tried to connect the dots from the shows past to explain weeping angels and how they came to being. Interesting video

[@Supersonic802]

torchwood episode 4 "small worlds" is about fairies and these fairies are fairly similar to the weeping angels as captain Jack Harkness says that they are as old as the universe and they can travel in time, specifically back in time as they take children to the past. They are also very cruel like weeping angels and the final shot is a zoom in of a very angel-like fairy. Finally, the voice in the background says, "the world would be full of weeping" and emphasis is put on the word weeping. So yea I think weeping angels are the fairies just a different form.

[@rfactor1502]

I like the idea of a multi-orgin for the Angels, not unlike the Cybermen. The like the angels of old line is a great implication that the punishment can result in Weeping Angels, but there have always been some. The angels of ild that could be simply angels travelling back that far... or something more eldritch.

[@rfactor1502]

So wound up thinking on this some more after a long night of work, and thought of some other things that expand on this. First, the punished time lords were punished "like the weeping angels of old". Which is some great imagery... and as we know, imagery is something that the angels weaponize. I suspect that if those time lords that were punished became angels, it's because they became the image of angels, and of course, images of angels themselves become angels. But then we come to the episode where a 'captured' angel crashes a ship holding it into a planet to rescue it's brethren. And this angel in particular weaponizes the image of an angel power to it's utmost, not just through the camera, but through Amy's eyes. I suspect that this angel is one of this younger generation of angels, created by forcing a time lord into the image of one unintentionally by being punished like the angels of old. Yeah, thinking of it that way, that punishment seems like it was pretty shortsighted, if this were canon.

[@r.howardlawrence3527]

If the Angels require time displacement to extract the potential existence of a lifetime to survive, it is possible that they existed in some form prior to the beginning of time. There must have been a vast amount of potential time during that existence that was reduced to a unmeasurable tiny amount when time began. The Angels would have ceased to exist except for those who could extract the potential from beings who existed in time. I'm not saying this is accurate but it does not contradict the lore from Blink nor does it seem to run counter to other episodes where the appear. Second thought: The Statue of Liberty is Metal, not stone and cannot be an actual Angel. It could possibly be a construct of the Angels or an entirely different being mimicking the Angels. In fact many of the beings thought to be Angels but acting contrary to Blink's established canon could be from this same race of mimics.

[@LizardGuy50]

"any image of an angel is an angel" so being made of stone isnt required

[@jumbojaba1235]

I prefer angels being the natural predators of the timelords

[@DoctorDex]

I don't think they are timelords. To me they seem like a being operating on a different plane of reality. Like they are in constant flux until they are observed and manifest themselves as a stone statue. Perhaps timelords studied them to unravel the secrets of mechanical time travel. It's just a fun mystery.

[@spcwholesome5720]

I like the deleted time lords who came back and the natural predators for time lords theories best. The natural predator one would be perfect, considering the position they stand in is shameful for time lords to stand in like the king or whatever said.

[@Thrakus]

They mostly go after people who did mess with time, So I always did see them as fixing order by putting in a time you should be in or can not harm. Like a side effect of the time lords messing with time.

[@ThermalLance-hg4rd]

"In The Two Doctors,[58] the Second Doctor states that the "Rassilon Imprimatur" allows Time Lords to safely travel through time, becoming symbionts with their TARDISes," Perhaps the weeping angels were the result of a doctor turning into one following the destruction of his Tardis in a certain way that essentially "damaged" his existence within time itself?

[@BINACmini]

I love your channel because it proves you don't need to be perfect at editing to have good videos.

[@MrGreaves]

That was an odd insult 😂😂

[@AlrightThere]

I thought the editing was pretty decent

[@jimmyfrench4722]

1. Chibnall should not be considered cannon, desperately hoping for a return to comparatively lore standard Who soon. 2. Blink was amazing, but they then destroyed the story quickly…recall how they protected Sally & ?? when the Tardis left them between angels…then we see Angels en masse & trapping people between them, no way they don’t see each other…even being so large there’s no way they wouldn’t be seen…

[@nightshadoew436]

Ever since I heard Rassilon's line I just assumed Time Lords looked down upon the Weeping Angels. Timelord's are connected to time itself, overflowing with it's energy that they can even charge a TARDIS (like the 10th Doctor did) so they looked down upon the creatures who need to send people back in time to be able to feed off of something similar to what they poses by birth. Maybe the Angels are something Timelords created, propably by accident, through their numerous "experiments" with time.

[@joshuareynolds23]

They definitely don't look down on the weeping angels as they are acknowledged by time lords to be one of the deadliest predators in the universe.

[@MrGreensweightHist]

Just a thought. What if EVERY Time Lord, The doctor, The Master, Rassilon, The Corsair... Were ALL regenerations of The Doctor. We've seen as many as 13 all appear at the same place. What if Galifrey was just a spot where THOUSANDS of incarnations of the Doctor converged, with many of them not even knowing they are the Doctor at all because we already know the Doctor's memory can get more than a little spotty on how many past incarnations it has had. Maybe the Doctor was Rassilon once, before they matured. Maybe the Doctor was the Master once, before finding remorse for pas deeds and becoming the Doctor to heal the damage they had done as the master.

[@Montogoronto]

Cool theory please share it to others

[@mathieuleader8601]

i like the theory of them being a viral infection

[@celticluna1691]

They are nearly as old as the universe so for that theory to hold water the infected race would have to be nearly as old as the universe it's self

[@sanddagger36]

Why did 13 cover her eyes when she became an angel? I thot it was a choice because they did not want to risk looking at each other, not a pose they were forced to take when they turned to stone.

[@patloob]

The Angels could be timelords from a previous universe before the big bang and the method they used to avoid the end of creation dodn't work as intended.

[@johnydl]

my favourite fan theory is my own and it nicely explains all the gaffs and bad continuity -> We the audience don't get to see the story as it literally happens, we get to see it through the Tardis's Telepathic circuits and translation... all the quirky out of universe references or fumbled cannon is the tardis tailoring the story for the majority of its current audience, one which probably doesn't know about half of the content of the show. If the majority don't know about it making reference to it doesn't add to the story it distracts from the storytelling

[@NightmareproductionsOFFICIAL]

I don’t think that the doctor lies is a stupid line. Because he does lie. However I don’t think he’d lie about that and it doesn’t apply to everything.

[@matthewhenthorn3343]

I listened to that clip of Rassilon in increasing slow motion, but never heard him say like. I genuinly don't know where that comes from unless it was in the script and just dropped of the sound recording. Whilst i like the concept, it's worthwhile noting that the weeping angels of old could have been older and far more energy rich than the one they face in the current show, thus they could have been the origin of the Angels but not the original angels (important to note in that case only two were shamed due to being out voted by clearly a huge margin). Shamed Timelords, cursed Timelords, Timelord agents, or predators of time travellers (my favourate by the way), all this is clearly thrown around by fans and helps deepen the mistry of the Weeping angels, and the fact they've cropped up in nearly every major incident since their debue shows the writers are just as eager to stir the pot, without letting anything settle into an origin (hopfully).

[@Neutral_Tired]

The weeping angels just snapping people's necks made sense in their 2nd appearance because they were too weak and starved to use their chronal powers. It doesn't work in basically any scenario where they're at full power

[@erikrounds]

The first time I saw the weeping angels in Blink, I remembered the scene you mentioned from The Five Doctors. I feel like the theory makes quite a bit of sense, though there isn't nearly enough evidence to back it up.

[@judeconnor-macintyre9874]

The Division probably controls the Weeping Angels by promising them temporal energy if they do what they say.

[@bonweech3346]

The mere concept of Nature and Time evolving a PREDATOR for Time Lords, the most technologically advanced, oldest living, closest to omnipotent species in the universe is absolutely blood-chilling.

[@Therandomposter199]

Actually I believe that the Weeping Angels the ones who trapped the devil in the episode called "The Satan Pit". Because it seems that in the episode "Blink" the Doctor says that "they're as old as the universe, or very nearly", and in "The Satan Pit" the so-called satan says that he comes from "before time and space and everything" and assuming they both come from the same time, and that the Doctor questions the devil asking "So what, your the truth behind the myth." So the Weeping Angels could be the truth behind the myth about angels especially since actual angels look more like mutated monsters. Which is why I believe that they could've been where we got the idea from.

[@wyldride]

When the Master lands on Traken, his Tardis' chameleon circuit blends in by transforming it into a stone statue, which is an interesting if unrelated co-incidence.

[@charlestownsend9280]

What if the weeping angels are what remains of the vampires who the timelords defeated. Maybe rassilon could have have turned the surviving vampires into weeping angels or the vampires turned themselves into weeping angels to survive and exist in a form that would be able to challenge the timelords, only for the inability to be seen and interact at the same time devolving their minds to a more primitive state of an intelligent predator and later even working for their old enemy.

[@kaizaki9148]

Ooooh very creative! I love this idea

[@Unbreakable1986]

If you add up some of what's said into a coherent narrative it could go something like this: In the beginning, Weeping Angels were Timelords who the Lord President chose to punish by Quantum-Locking them with some device we've yet to see, rendering them unable to interact with society at all and dependent on time energy to subsist, yet still capable of multiplying, over time they evolved the look of angels due to the name and the appearance of statues because of being constantly referred to as such. We're used to Wibbly-wobbly Timey-wimey, but in the new era we're now seeing superstitions and coincidences actually shaping reality and maybe that echoed all throughout time

[@steelgreyed]

Irony. Rassilon's throw away line actually probably "created" the Weeping Angels, with Moffat going "wait a minute I can use that....."

[@BlakeGamer-qy6ve]

Is this satire? that was in 2010, weeping angels was created in 2007.

[@steelgreyed]

Knowing better makes this less safe how? In every sense they were also time travelers.... Your sense of timeline propriety says you do not know who is trying to exterminate your ancestors. If not become them....

[@BlakeGamer-qy6ve]

@@steelgreyed Ok this is satire.

[@steelgreyed]

@@BlakeGamer-qy6ve That's a cute way to say they ate everything you ever cared about....

[@BlakeGamer-qy6ve]

@@steelgreyed now I'm confused.

[@Mae_is_gae]

Harbo goin full matpat with his title game

[@HarboWholmes]

The only way to survive on Doctor Who KZbin in 2022

[@theoncomingstorm7903]

Matpat but he actually provides the counter evidence instead of taking an obviously false theory and running with it

[@tayetrotman]

I came up with this Weeping Angel headcanon as a kid, it’s stupid but I feel like sharing it. The truth is that the Weeping Angels are, due to careless experimentation with time travel when the universe was still in its infancy out of sync with time, and because time is relative, so long as you look at them they are quantum locked because time is beholden to your frame of reference and they don’t fit. When you look away, blink or it’s dark, time is relative to their frame of reference, enabling them to have it in sync with them so they can move. They appear as stone statues while being looked at largely because as far as most beings are concerned, stone statues are inanimate objects that can’t move to be a threat so you’ll be more inclined to blink or look away.

[@spartannaomi-a0957]

Finally someone else who sees the similarities, especially in the episode end of Time at the end of David Tennant’s run back in 08

[@josephmoss5396]

i used to believe the theory but you’ve made me realise how silly it is. thank you very much :)

[@theoncomingstorm7903]

If you're in the market for popular fan theories with little to no actual basis and a whole heap of baseless speculation to make videos about, the trifector of 'The Master was lying and is actually the Timeless Child', 'Ruth is actually from Season 6B' and 'Sacha Dhawan's Master is between Simm and Gomez' are all fair game. They all seem to stem more from 'retconning Chibnall' than actually trying to genuinely come up with an interesting theory.

[@NostalgiaBrit]

Ummm… Rassilon _doesn't_ say "like!" He says that they "stand as monument to their shame; the weeping angels of old!" 😳 Now, I'm _not_ saying that Weeping Angels _are_ Timelords (in fact, I'm one of those who thinks that they're _not_ Timelords at all), but I _do_ want you to get Rassilon's line right!

[@coachcodymoskalski7236]

I think one of the most compelling pieces of evidence is the fact that the angels often seek and can pilot a tardis.

[@Cybermanalf]

I've never really agreed with this theory, I think it's far more likely that the Angels were an evolved form of the Mouri

[@ethenallen1388]

My hypnosis is that one of the earliest Time Lord's, who wasn't very sane to begin with, wrote down some thoughts that would become the book about the Angles River showed the Doctor, then went back to the first milliseconds of the universe, got stuck, and his thoughts gave birth to the Weeping Angles.

[@scloftin8861]

I completely missed this ... now that is a fascinating idea. Or, perhaps back in the day, they were related ...

[@TheJECNova]

Just because the origin or ability of something scary is known, doesn't detract from it being able be terrifying as hell. Case-in-point: folks are STILL terrified of the giant squids and sharks, we know plenty about those (various, in sharks case) species, but, folks are still quite terrified about them. Justifiably so in many details and instances.

[@hlive714]

I just think of them as naturally formed paradoxes. And when they themselves get into paradoxes, it's poisonous to them, like their existence being cancelled out.

[@Kyle_The_Death_Knight]

Could never see them being one in the same like that, the angels are something made to hunt and fest on the time people missed, which is why there manly hunt time lords

[@austinwilburn1772]

I haven’t finished the video but would be interesting if the weeping angels is the results of one of the forbidden weapons from the ancient first ones.

[@CashelOConnolly]

They weren’t Time Lords,they were polystyrene

[@Lyko5]

funny that Hidetaka Miyazaki used a similar consept for his games of dark souls and elden ring, where dragons are immortal and everlasting with scales made of stone, never trully being alive and never being able to die and those who attempt to reach their level of existence become deformed dragon stones

[@thomasburn3247]

What if: They're the creatures that caught against Satan before the universe?

[@Kitsunetic_Pandorica]

just a random threory after I watched this video. instead of them being evolved into timelords would it be more plausible for the to be connected races like branches of the time tree?

[@ethanhiggins5559]

I think they’re a weapon made by someone/thing to harness the powers of time lords, maybe someone trying to regenerate without being a time lord

[@ImmortalAbsol]

I think they are like evolutionary cousins, just similar enough to be turned from one to the other. Like cross breeding animals or the idea to have an elephant be a surrogate for a mamoth.

[@Captain.AmericaV1]

Just seen this...... *"The Weeping Angels being disgraced Time Lords creates a classic Doctor Who time travel paradox - the Time Lord punishment was inspired by the Weeping Angels, but the Weeping Angels were created by the Time Lords' punishment"*

[@EmperorJ123]

It makes me think the Angels are also extinct by Rassilons time, which could mean the Dr is travelling through his relative past.

[@thomasjohnson8391]

Maybe the Rani used chameleon arch to return or she became a weeping angel

[@CyborgCharlotte]

Don’t know about the rest of you, but Village Of The Angels was a return to form for the angels after the very meh The Angels Take Manhattan

[@frde2190]

Pretty decent episode actually, best of the Jodie era

[@shnoozezzz9752]

i thought that too (even though i like angles take manhattan) The use of the angels in village was so creative and interesting, like having them crawl out the screen or even just have a light swing once jericho looks back at them was all nail biting stuff

[@crowcoregames1785]

the diviso lady mentions angels are just one agient of menay and that she has cells of all the speices of universe one, they way she words it is bascily like "we use agels as one of meany agents"

[@madeinsiy4363]

Didn't we all see what happened when biggest mystery of all explained? We've literally seen where time lords come from (sort of) and it created such chaos. I think it's the same with angels. I mean, they never made it to be as creepy as they were on Blink, more we got to see them more generic they've became and lost their "flair."

[@joshuareynolds23]

I mean it's also entirely possible that revealing their origins could lead to another plot like the other and, his connection with the doctor that was essentially one of the best plot points in all of doctor who history. Really depends on whether or, not the writer can pull it off.

[@tcrobot]

I love the mystique of the weeping angels. Think it's best to keep them that way.

[@TonyP9279]

If you stick to the definition of "quantum lock", the angels, when not being observed, would act like waves, meaning they would have no form and no definite position. There was an episode of The Sarah Jane Adventures where people were being turned into statues; I believe they were called *Gorgons*, probably not related, but would be much easier to write a story linking them to the Weeping Angels than doing so with Time Lords.

[@ThomasdWell]

It could have worked if they originally planed for it, could have been one of Gallifrey's dirt secret of how they became time lords, Weeping Angels could've been a product of failed time travelers being thrown so far back the whole of the universe just assumes they've always been there. But they didn't. I agree, they were so scary when we knew so little about them, except for the small detail that we couldn't loose track of them or else we'd 'die' a slow death. I haven't been keeping up with the new Doctor series mostly cause a friend is who is a big fan is just disappointed that the lead writer is making episodes to be produced to put an episode out instead of telling a story. Their words, I plan on checking it out sometime in the future

[@william2496]

If the weeping angels, I believe they'd be timelord experiments in the build up to the Final Sanction, experiments on seperating consciousness from the plain of reality

[@ryanratchford2530]

The dr literally says in Blink that Angles are evolved creatures

[@aspectpugzy9474]

To be fair it would explain how the doctor was the only one to ever be turned into a weeping angel

[@darthgamer2014]

Sometimes the best thing to do for a character/creature is to pull a Yoda. A character/creature so mysterious no really knows anything about them.

[@NyxCrow03]

I was about to say if you think of Medusa she could turn people to stone due to a curse so they could probably do the same because it might be a curse laid on them from the Oldest time lords if that could be a theory

[@suicune2001]

I just watched 4th Doctor, Season 15, Image of the Fendahl. Maybe they are the completed form of a Fendahl? Time Lords were scared of them, they were mythological creatures even to them, and they feed off of the very life force of creatures and I believe also time as well.

[@Elliot-ou6lb]

I think linking them to the Timelords would make the universe too small, but could maybe see them be the results of experiments around regeneration, perhaps the earliest attempts to instill it into Gallifreyan DNA. Like I say, unneeded, but if someone put a gun to my head and told me to link them, that's what I'd do.

[@dawall3732]

No, I don't think they are disgraced time lords. Or at least not the vast majority of them. I think the time lords could have figured out how to transform some of their own people into weeping angels as punishments. However, I don't think they created the species. I think they just consider it to be a supremely fitting punishment. After all, they are the ones who describe the existence of the weeping angels as the loneliest existences in existence itself. Because they can't look at each other, they can't let anyone else look at them. They have to forever be alone except for that brief moment when they feed on someone else's lifespan. The time lords aren't even really sure how old the weeping angels really are. All indication is that all the time lords know is that the weeping angels are older than themselves. My head cannon is that the weeping angels are not as old as the universe. My head cannon is that they are, in fact, older. I like the idea of one of the universes. Most horrific monsters are actually its ultimate saviors. There's been several episodes in which the doctor has gone to the end of the universe. Not in distance to the edge of the universe, but to the end of the universe, as in the very end of the universe's lifespan. My idea is that the weeping angels are there at the end of the universe. One of the last living things in existence. They use their power to move something through time in a reverse way. If they have access to a rift to feed off, they would have effectively infinite power. So they use their ability to move something through time to move the universe itself forward in time instead of back. So that instead of the universe living the last moments of its existence before it ever meets itself, it's moved forward to begin its existence all over again just at the moment when it would normally cease to exist. They literally hit the reset button on the universe itself. When it's about to end or at the very moment of its ending. In my head cannon, that is how the weeping angels. Save the doctor who universe and how they saved it in the past as well as the past of the universe that existed before. So they are, in fact, older than the universe itself and will outlive the universe and be inside the next universe. They ultimately are the ones that are in charge of the cycle of the universe's birth and ultimate fate. That would mean their origin and their end are both things. Perhaps the only thing that the time lords are incapable of knowing or fully understanding.

[@Lyndonberg_Gaming]

‘The stand as a testament to the wearing angels of old’ sounds like they are confined to the statue pose like the weeping angels are his old enemy presumed extent after the time war Hense he said of old like there disgusting or vermin to the timelords would explain the doctors confidence to them when they fear him but not his companions (Rory Amy and river)

[@OGdadpool]

I like the idea that they're disgraced timelords. How they become Weeping Angels, in my head canon, is unknown, just that there is a link. That's all I need or want

[@RobTheSquire]

Well to me the theories are sound, however I do not want to know as this increases the fear factor of the Weeping Angels and adds so much more to them.

[@briandaleske5139]

So far there has been moments, in the show series, that leads to the hints, that some of the Weeping-Angels, are punished TimeLords transformed. But I don’t think that, all of the WEEPING-ANGELS, are transformed TimeLords being punished. I myself theorize that the WEEPING-ANGELS, might be an ancient race of alien beings, who were once slaves, of the evil faction of TimeLords. I also theorize that, the WEEPING-ANGELS, might have been cursed, to turn to stone, if they see each other.

[@Shade01982]

Hmm. The only issue with that theory is that if it was a time lord punishment, one would think the Doctor would have known, or at least heard about it...

[@DeedeeDirt]

I kinda thought they were a monster more like vampires, like maybe there is a way you could catch weeping angelicism but mostly they just feed on others

[@Jay-ho7mc]

Always made me laugh that if they can’t move when you’re looking at them, you could just smash them to bits 🤣

[@Rabijeel]

Hmmmm.... "fossilzed Timelord" yould work pretty good considering the shenanigans the Doc was able to do with his cut off Hand. Also, the "Timelord" could feed of the Lifeforce, the Time of People around him by the Contacts and impacts he has on their "Lifetimes". This would explain why the Doc can regenerate so much and others could run out as they are too isolated - "together alone", a fine analogy for the loneley annonymity of one Person alone in a City full of People passing by. This would also fiut perfectly in the "Interactions make Time become real" aka Schroedingers Cat Thingy and the Microverse reacting somewhat "special" to interactions. [Edit to clarify] This would mean they hav no "Timetravel-capabiliy", they exist outside the Timeframe itself - they are Timelords fallen out of "Time", the Power they live upon and that makes them "regenerate" aka resist the Entropy itself - as Angels do. [Edit end]

[@SickVoid]

I'm actually really bummed we didn't get a second season of class. While it wasn't that good, it also really wasn't as bad as some people claim. With the weeping angel teacher it actually got really interesting in the end and I'm sad we will probably never see that plot thread explored.

[@darynvoss7883]

There's plenty of scope for an Angels origin story within the main show.

[@nsty_t0xic67]

Well if they were erased from time and the angels are timeless then they would be everywhere in time including the begging but that doesn’t negate the fact that they were created much later

[@CyborgCharlotte]

3:15 “PRAISE THE SUN!”

[@surferdudemi]

If you have a time machine, you can go back in time to find out where they came from, and any other puzzle. So there's no reason for the Doctor to not know the origin of Weeping Angels

[@Gfish17]

To answer your question at the end we don't technically Need to know any origin story. But we know everything and everyone has a beginning and I want to know what that is mystery be damned.

[@aronkovacs2655]

My theory is: The weeping angels were originally just angels, shy but powerful life forms with time manipulating abilities from another dimension, feeding on time energy. They were in war with the gorgons (they appear in the spinoff The Sarah Jane Adventures). The Gorgons won but they couldn't destroy the Angels. They made them unable to move or do anything, just stone statues standing for eternity. The gorgons banished them to our dimension, scattered through time and space. But if a statue is found and touched, it can send a person back in time, getting time energy to feed on, and gaining enough power to move when no one is observing it. Well, for the information that has been later added to their story, like an image of an angel is an angel, and if you look in the eyes of an angel it gets in your head, I don't know what to say. In my opinion it ruined the angels, just like Chris Chibnall's series 13 bullshit, yeah I'm mad at him. I'm looking forward to Russel T Davies returning as the showrunner, he might do something wonderful with the fan favorite villains.

[@bobnotbobff]

I reckon the division would use darleks if they could

[@Diddlydoodly420]

Weeping angels simply exist superposition and that’s why they are impossible to beat!

[@nickynegron3515]

I have an idea that could explain why the Doctor knows the Angels are older than the universe itself in Blink.. What if, and this is going by the admittedly limited knowledge I have from 13's run, but what if the Doctor, not originally being a Time Lord but from how Ive heard it explained the actual progenitor to the Regeneration ability Time Lords possess, and her transformation into a Weeping Angel could still be connected. Like, what if whatever species the Doctor originally hailed from became corrupted and turned into the Angels, or at least some of them. It would also connect the civil war plot originally planned, and the only reason 13 was able to be transformed into an Angel was because she was, somewhere in her DNA, still of that species. I vaguely remember the whispering told to the Doctor before she transformed that she was chosen or a herald or some crap. All I'm saying is that Time Lords may not have become Weeping Angels, but it is then possible that in the bigger picture, the Time Lords are actually a deviation from the original species that would eventually become the Weeping Angels.

[@kiyan5340]

I like the idea that they are the natural predator of Time Lords.

[@Ghostrebel017]

Giving these things an origin story, while intriguing, would ultimately ruin them. For the same reason why Voyager giving the Borg a Queen and a face ruined those guys.