The TRUE POWER of SPICE Explained | Dune Lore

"Power over spice is power over all." - - An exploration of the true power of spice and how Paul Atreides wields it to bend the Imperium to his will. This line opens Denis Villeneuve’s Dune Part 2 and highlights a core element of Frank Herbert’s saga. The Spice Melange, the most coveted substance at the heart of this story, represents unparalleled influence and control. It is through the remarkable journey of Paul Atreides that the full significance of this treasured resource is realized.
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Art Credits
(if I missed your credit or miscredited a photo please let me know via email at [e-mail])
Mihail Sarbescu moonlit.artstation.com/projec...
Edric The Guild Navigator by Andres Gomez www.artstation.com/scytales
Alex Jay Brady
Guild Navigator by Alexandre Gianfreda Ferrailleur - www.artstation.com/alexandreg...
Alex Jay Brady / alexjaybrady
Many Images used from Official Dune Comic Books - www.boom-studios.com/series/d...
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Intro Track Name: "Watching The Clouds" Music By: LAKEY INSPIRED @ / lakeyinspired
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[@NerdCookies]

Thank you for watching this video! If you enjoy my content, please consider supporting me on PATREON: www.patreon.com/nerdcookies

[@raisinbrand5000]

I feel like nerd cookies is one of the last bastions of "old youtube" no ads and no podcast performance

[@hypolyxa7207]

Podcast performance?

[@leebishop7591]

"Melange is a helluva drug."

[@garycarter6773]

All I could hear was Rick James's voice....😎

[@acenull0]

😂😂😂

[@ryneallen5163]

This is even better if you say it’s slurring

[@danelamoreaux4166]

The Spice must flow.

[@chrysm6842]

I dislike when it's spicy XD.

[@EnterTheFenix]

Its interesting, because it seems that Villeneuve completely forgot about the importance of Spice by the end of the movie. Pauls threat to destroy the Spice fields with atomics was THE biggest economic, societal, and political threat thats ever been made - in the history of history... and it was glossed over.

[@jinushaun]

Part 2 focused heavily on the Missionaria Protectiva, but completely dropped the Guild and the importance of Spice in the universe. Maybe Dune should've been 3 movies... Although, according to the forward in Dune Messiah, Herbert saw Dune as 2/3 of a trilogy with Dune Messiah as the 3rd book in the trilogy.

[@RodneyGraves]

Atomics would not have done the trick, the threat actually used would have required much more presence of the -Navigators- Spacing Guild...

[@carlosandleon]

That’s what you think. The third movie isn’t even out yet

[@RodneyGraves]

@@carlosandleon That's what you think, and you are at odds with the lore.

[@brotherjohnnyxXxX]

But he explained its importance in part one. "For the Fremen, spice is the sacred hallucinogen which preserves life and brings enormous health benefits. For the Imperium, the spice is used by the navigators of the Spacing Guild to find safe paths between the stars. Without spice interstellar travel is impossible, making it by far the most valuable substance in the universe".

[@timothymorgan1175]

This is one of only two things about Dennis's adaptation I don't like. Not including The Mentats and The Spacing Guild. The Sisterhood is only important to the manipulation they do to make a super human that they can control. For me The Guild is the most important organization in the DUNE universe. They control space travel. They control who gets to travel,and controls the ability for the houses to conduct warfare. Even the Emperor must bow to The Guild. That's what I found most interesting,not the Sisterhood, but The Guild. Dennis's adaption now makes the Sisterhood the most important organization which makes no sense,and leave a problem with how Paul will be able to conduct his Jihad without knowing where The Guild stands.I still want to see DUNE Part 2,Loved Part 1. I just find the omission of The Guild will hinder DUNE 3.

[@User_Un_Friendly]

Hopefully there will be deleted scenes...or at least a fan compilation. 😮

[@tgiacin435]

I feel like they’ll have the spacing guild get involved. Remember the guild is neutral unless spice is at stake. They could prevent the war before it starts.

[@dbsthumper]

agreed,l just arrived back from my first viewing of Part Two(B+)and l’m disappointed of the exclusion /reduction of both The Guild and Mentats(you do see some at work in the Harkonnens war room)this must be corrected in Messiah 🤔

[@Davepool-hs7vr]

He who controls the spice, controls the universe.

[@vatsetis]

Mentats are in both films. Guilds also, but just on the background.

[@mitchelllawrence2798]

That quote struck accord with me in a good way, first seeing it in the cinema. Great breakdown on the spice. You said it best, there are benefits and drawbacks.

[@GholaMuadDib]

Wonderful video. My favorite aspect of the Spice, is that despite its benefits, there’s a price you pay for taking it. Truly horrifying. One of the many things I love about these books.

[@companymen42]

Kinda like how in other fictions with magic, it always exacts a price.

[@stefbeg]

The total absence of the Guild as an effective power faction in the movies deprives the entire narrative of sense. It's all the more unnerving that you don't have to spend dozens of minutes to make this point clear. It's not even a page of narration in the book if you cumulate all the lines hinting at the link between spice and the Guild. On the other hand, there are subtle reminders of its power that could have been adapted too without spending too much time : the Guild's restriction on weather control satellite, Baron Vladimir lamenting on the cost of troop transport, the link between the Guild and Fremen and smugglers for illegal spice harvest... House Atreides was lured on Arrakis because spice promised them tremendous power, and that is also the reason why Harkonnen were willingful to reconquer it at all cost, even becoming accomplices of the Emperor's dirty work. But spice isn't such a vital commodity if you do not reveal its importance for the Guild and in the end of the Dune 2 movie, this loophole is made clear when the Great Houses don't care Paul can nuke spice production.

[@brotherjohnnyxXxX]

Members of the Spacing Guild appeared in part one and it only took a few seconds to explain the importance of spice. "For the Fremen, spice is the sacred hallucinogen which preserves life and brings enormous health benefits. For the Imperium, the spice is used by the navigators of the Spacing Guild to find safe paths between the stars. Without spice interstellar travel is impossible, making it by far the most valuable substance in the universe".

[@stefbeg]

@@brotherjohnnyxXxX So why this importance has no impact on the narrative ? One other example : spice brings enormous health benefice : but the emperor is shown as an elderly man. You could think that noone in the universe could afford more spice than Emperor Padisha Shaddam IV. In the book, he is described as a 70+ man looking 30 or so. Once more, show don't tell. It would be more striking and shocking to understand the power of spice by casting Princess Irulan and Shaddam IV with actors having a significantly lesser difference of age.

[@NameNotAChannel]

@@stefbegWhile I generally despise the writing advice of "show, don't tell", in movies, it is apt, and this is a major part of why it's good advice for a visual medium.

[@stefbeg]

@@NameNotAChannel You're right. I am not very fond of it either, but many changes in Villeneuve's two movies are made on that principle, people pretending that the adaptation to cinematic language justifies it. It would be too creepy to show things like Alia as a two to four year super-toddler, etc. etc. So I insist on pointing the contradictions in those claiming the movies where perfect adaptations by highlighting the adaptations were not perfect since they lead to new loopholes.

[@brotherjohnnyxXxX]

@@stefbeg They didn't mentioned this property of the spice in part one, so it doesn't really affect the narrative.

[@LordNicodemus1]

Thank you. This video should be required viewing for any of the "non book" movie going fans of DUNE. I enjoyed watching the new movies but was disappointed with A: the lack of emphasis on the importance of water on Arrakis and B: the almost overlooked importance of the Spice Melange. As a long time fan of the books these two things are what made the world building for me and feel that this video gives new movie based fans a little bit of that. Great job!

[@dimaster77]

I think Villeneuve fogot about Spacing Gulid in second movie xd they ware actualy the main power in the universe, no spcing gulid in second part, its a shame i would like to see Gulid Navigator on big screen.

[@OrphanOfDarkness]

Why would the guild be involved? They going to beat Paul themselves after the Emperor failed? Would make no sense for them to be in the second movie outside of fan service. People can't think past what they want to see what the film needs.

[@Enjoymentboy]

People seem to overlook the fact that Paul is actually the true villain in the Dune universe. Lots of bad guys but he intentionally chose to keep spice production going simply to maintain his power. Oh sure, there are many would would say he was only being kind because of the untold billions who MIGHT suffer withdrawal but they don't mention that these very same people WILL continue to suffer because the spice continues to flow. Instead of freeing the galaxy from the grip of spice he instead decided to hold it over everyone's head like a sword. "Do what I say or else". At least with the harrkonens, the emperor, or even the thinking machines you know what you're getting. They didn't disguise their intent with pretty pretense. They may have been very, VERY bad but Paul is true selfish evil. HE knows what is best for everyone and HE will wield the power to make it happen and if anyone dares to cross him HE will make them suffer for it.

[@troymash8109]

LOL. You're one of those people I hear about who have no inner monologue and are incapable of rational and critical thought. Who poured that garbage between your ears in the hopes you'd parrot it?

[@richardbradley2335]

If it was seen as Paul is the villain then the audience would have very little to get behind any character...it would be therefore difficult to watch.

[@brown3394]

Paul stop! it wasn't him! Hydra used the spice, had control over his mind! This won't change what happened! I don't care... he killed my Dad...

[@athrawes7257]

I do wish that Villeneuve would have kept Spice the power in the universe that it was instead of turning it into sci-fi "oil." Just a gold mine.

[@User_Un_Friendly]

I suspect he's using parallels from our own history, to make it more accessible and relatable to his audience. During Shaddam's invasion of Kuwait, one of the things people were most afraid of was that Saddam would order his forces to set fire to the wellheads. That would have significantly disrupted the US supply, and a lot of the planning in the Allied intervention was to prevent that.🧐

[@RodneyGraves]

@@User_Un_Friendly All of our history is already ancient history for the universe of Dune...

[@carlosandleon]

@@RodneyGravesthats not what he means jesus christ

[@manoz6194]

@@User_Un_Friendly Saddam wasn't the bad guy. He changed the oil currency to Euros, that's why the US invaded, after faking WMDs of course

[@alexiachimciuc3199]

I also wished for Villeneuve to have kept as close as possible to the book.

[@clanwaddell5628]

Yum. Fresh Nerd Cookies

[@chrysm6842]

How about spice nerd cookies, then, XD?

[@thedoughnutking9514]

Always great content…. Being that the Fremen lived on Dune their whole lives would they not be addicted to spice via osmosis? ….would that be a weakness as a conquering army as it could be exploited by an opponent?

[@gerhard7988]

This is one of my minor gripes about this version of Dune. Spice wasn't clearly shown just how necessary it is to the known universe. This was partly played out by downplaying the guild navigators in this version. With more emphasis how critical spice is would have put the struggle for Arrakis in better perspective.

[@brotherjohnnyxXxX]

It was clearly shown in part one. "For the Fremen, spice is the sacred hallucinogen which preserves life and brings enormous health benefits. For the Imperium, the spice is used by the navigators of the Spacing Guild to find safe paths between the stars. Without spice interstellar travel is impossible, making it by far the most valuable substance in the universe".

[@georgeandrews1276]

It was not clearly shown. It was stated then glossed over.

[@MrEnjoivolcom1]

It just now hit me in realization that the “billions dead in a holy war in my/my father’s name” are dead because of not receiving any more spice as opposed to simply dying in physical battle. Lol, why it took so long to realize that escapes me.

[@ArrakisCentral]

Your channel and Quinn inspired me to make a Dune channel

[@AodhanBeag]

8:19 real world inspiration based on Oil and Natural Gas resources from middle east and the geopolitics and wartimes inflicted as consequence

[@smokymountainangoras]

It’s like in the Matrix the sentient AI machines have humans in the pods bioharvesting their energy and consciousness. I’m sure the fluid in the tanks would have to have something psychoactive to keep the induced person’s imagination running/dreaming ex DMT. One of the guys in a machine pod is Neo, another is Paul Atreides. Are we all in machine pods? 🧠

[@mrcuddles2199]

Dune has always been dubbed unadaptable because the nature of its narration and esoteric subject material. If only they had GOT style budget could they even consider making it into a series that could respectfully convey the proper source material. Similar to how Nolan adapted The Dark Knight trilogy, I respect Villeneuve’s willingness to embark on this project knowing full well things would have to be changed to accommodate new fans and casual movie watchers in general. Part of 1984 Dunes failure was trying to be book accurate on things that couldn’t properly be conveyed in such a short movie.

[@NameNotAChannel]

And yet, in its much shorter run time, successfully got across a much more faithful adaptation than the 2 far longer movies by DV... DV failed in worldbuilding.

[@mrcuddles2199]

@@NameNotAChannel but at what cost? Would you consider Lynch’s version a success since it more properly aligns with the book? In order for the second Villeneuve movie to even get the green light it had to be a success commercially. There’s a balance that needs to be made. He needs to please the production company, the hardcore fans, and the casual fans. Hardcore fans can sometimes have an elitist mentality that’s too rigid to allow stories to be adapted to film. It is an adaptation not an exact copy, and I’m sure he has no intention to make 10 Dune movies to properly covey the story to appease the hardcore community.

[@NameNotAChannel]

@@mrcuddles2199Even the SyFy Miniseries, which had a similar runtime as the 2 dune movies, covers all of Dune, Dune Messiah, and Children of Dune, while holding MUCH closer to the source material (the best out of the 3 live actions we've had)... so... DV has failed on a very fundamental level of bringing the world to the screen. The things he DID bring to the screen were not true to the characters either, so it would have been better, to me, for him to have created an entirely new IP to make his own story, if he wasn't going to hold true to the source material. EDIT: On the topic of adaptations... while people praise movies like that one Steven King one that people go on about, but significantly diverged from the source material... they might be good movies, while being TERRIBLE adaptations. As a fan of the source material, I'd rather a faithful adaptation, or none at all. Often times, it comes across as ego stroking by those who think movies are superior to the books, or they think they need to leave their mark in their adaptation, changing the source to tell "their" story... rather than the original story. I just can't get behind that thinking. If they're going to take the IP and the fanbase associated with it, they should stick to it. If they want to tell their own story, they should make their own IP. I stand by this in all cases. VERY RARELY are changes made for the better, by less talented writers and directors, working from highly successful source material.

[@jtownjumpcity5937]

I’m going to repeat myself a lot. I wish they would treat the books as a screenplay. Just give us Frank Herbert’s world unfettered by personal dream of artistic signatures… I think anime is the key for the visual adaptation. Cookies has the true sight. Thanks again.

[@plato363]

It sounds like the dune 2 (which I haven’t seen) looks beautiful yet misses - and the lacks- the substance crafted by Herbert.

[@karlricardo4088]

That was my opinion on the new Dune films (and the Blade Runner sequel); very nice cinematography but it seems like Denis uses (or tries to use) visuals to tell the story but much of the story in Dune is told through exposition. Style over substance. As films they were objectively fine but as a fan of the book it felt soulless.

[@TheOtherNormie]

I feel like Villeneuve included enough of the source material (truly the bare minimum or at least the aspects that didnt require lengthy explanation) for his film to both share the same tone of the book and entertain the general audience outside of Dune fans. Including more elements of the book would require time to explain the who, what, and how behind them which ultimately would take time away from Paul's overall story. Example: Lets put more emphasis on the spacing guild - how much time do we put into explaining its intricacies with the landsraad and the empire? Are they also manipulated by the bene gesserit? Who are they lead by? Oh yes the navigators. Who are they and how do they use spice? Why do they mutate? Is there just one? Who do we put as the face as their leader as we do for the bene gesserit and the empire? These legitimate questions would require precious minutes to answer in the films meaning alot more time spent on world building - something i think the general audience berely tolerated as it was.

[@Pituqat]

I was actually thinking why would the Fremen run into a battlefield that was just cleared with the use of atomics? It must be that Spice among its many qualities must make one radiation /cancer proof. Why not? It extends life, cures disease, expands consciousness. This, although not mentioned, is what most likely gives Fremen their combat edge. Not anywhere near Paul's ability, but spice addiction could grant an alertness and awareness in combat that borders on near-precognition.

[@JM-nb2tt]

I would imagine this far into the future the atomics are envisioned as refined Fusion devices, which wouldn't produce harmful radiation to the same levels that current world Fission and hybrid (thermonuclear) devices do.

[@kimbertactpro9]

@@JM-nb2tt Then the question becomes why don't the great houses just blow each other up if their are no major consequences?

[@jtpoltorak]

Excellent video!

[@maneotis4g63t]

Nerd Cookies puts out a Dune vid, I watch it. No questions asked

[@TillionTirrion]

- Spice!

[@marlonjean9273]

A video on what happened to Stilgar?

[@Graftanker98]

Love your channel

[@RodneyGraves]

Well Done Elaine, very well done indeed. In this presentation you reveal the achilles heel of the Villeneuve adaptations changes to the Lore.

[@brotherjohnnyxXxX]

To be fair, Villeneuve did explain the importance of spice in part one. "For the Fremen, spice is the sacred hallucinogen which preserves life and brings enormous health benefits. For the Imperium, the spice is used by the navigators of the Spacing Guild to find safe paths between the stars. Without spice interstellar travel is impossible, making it by far the most valuable substance in the universe".

[@RodneyGraves]

@@brotherjohnnyxXxX Only the Navigators of the Guild could perceive Paul Muad'Dib's actual ability to destroy spice production...

[@brotherjohnnyxXxX]

@@RodneyGraves The Emperor perceived Muad'Did's ability to destroy spice production when he dropped the atomics next to his encampment.

[@agesflow6815]

Thank you, Nerd Cookies.

[@PersonalityMalfunction]

The book says it even more simply: "Power over a thing is the power to destroy that thing." That is applicable to anything. If you have the capacity to destroy something, you have ultimate power over it, no matter what it is.

[@peterbellini6102]

"The power to destroy a thing is the real power"

[@JesusGarcia-Digem]

What happens if they stop taking spice?

[@stefbeg]

In the book, people are afraid, as even the slightest addiction to spice leads to certain agonizing fatal withdrawal. It is even hinted that once you start living on Arrakis, you can't really leave it because spice is so omnipresent that you are accustomed to massive daily dose, unavailable elsewhere in the universe unless you are a Guild Navigator or a BG Reverend Mother.

[@JesusGarcia-Digem]

@@stefbeg Spice junkies, those navigators need an intervention. The mentats need to put the sopho juice down. Sobriety must flow! 😁

[@stefbeg]

@@JesusGarcia-Digem 🤣🤣🤣You can't imagine the number of used syringes floating around space heighliners ^^

[@smokymountainangoras]

If you stop taking spice you wake up in one of the AI machines in the Matrix on old terra that’s bioharvesting off of you…

[@smokymountainangoras]

They wake up in the Machine pods in the Matrix if they don’t keep taking the spice.

[@brotherkellymatthewbarnes8882]

Please do a video about the difference between Atomics and Stone Burners.

[@General_reader]

Do the books refer to the Freeman having long lives?

[@MrRadicalsheep]

Do you play the TTRPG dune? I see lots of pictures from the books. Love your videos!

[@NerdCookies]

Nope! But I love the art in it!

[@samfilmkid]

I get the feeling this world will be fleshed out a lot more with the new series, Dune Prophecy. A series will give them more time to delve into everything more deeply.

[@didamnesia3575]

The power of spice: combined over $2 billion in ticket sales

[@dbsthumper]

another excellent addition to your site’s Dune lore 😊 what l don’t understand is why the Empire didn’t attempt the produce Spice via artificial means or by introducing worms to other desert dominated planets 🤔

[@NerdCookies]

They did attempt this previously but until the time of the first Dune book, these attempts were unsuccessful.

[@stefbeg]

The matter is mentioned in the first book and it is precised there that it is impossible to synthetize it. And in the first book, besides Kynes father and son, nobody had connected the life cycle of sandworms to spice. Sandworms were just considered hazards endangering the harvest of spice.

[@dbsthumper]

ty 😘

[@paxofpayne]

After reasently seeing the movie . i did think it shld ave been 3 because it laked the expaned unverses world building . like showing HOW addicted the universe was to spice . eg members of greqat houses and the beni taking it . what was the glatic commuity like . so as to give context to the civil war on arakis

[@JackFrost008]

Where is the artwork from 02:20 from?

[@ragingtomato04]

"We’ve a three-point civilization: the Imperial Household balanced against the Federated Great Houses of the Landsraad, and between them, the Guild with its damnable monopoly on interstellar transport. In politics, the tripod is the most unstable of all structures. It’d be bad enough without the complication of a feudal trade culture which turns its back on most science.” They completely glossed over this fact

[@TheIslingtongirl]

What was it that Paul threatened to do to the worms to disrupt spice? I don't remember it but I'm assuming it had to do with using all the stored water? Or was it something to do with spice blows?

[@supermcspotty]

In the film he threatened to nuke the spice fields. Idk how tough worms are but that may effect the spice population

[@stefbeg]

He proposes to trigger an ecological planetary chain reaction by using the converted water of life (like he nad his mother did during the spice agony) to kill a stage of the worm life cycle, leading to the extinction of the species.

[@georgeandrews1276]

This is where creative license takes hold. Here's where Lynch proves he's understanding of the dynamics of the lore. Insert a Guild navigator in the plotting of the emperor. " We foresee a small problem in House Atreides. Paul Atreides!". Now you have mystery, motivation and plot manipulation all in the one scene. Is it Canon?! No! But for exposition it is necessary.

[@thosewhocando]

Nice video. But one thing I don’t think gets explained enough are the “minor” uses of the spice. On top of the aforementioned uses, spice is used for medical reason which prolongs life and vitality. Used by mentats among others. And there were unspecified industrial uses for it (plastics was one use).

[@stefbeg]

Mentats don't use spice, they can sometimes use spaho juice to enhance their abilities, but this drug originates from Ecaz, not Arrakis.

[@thosewhocando]

@@stefbeg I was under the impression that they used some spice to enhance their cognitive abilities. Like all the school.

[@stefbeg]

@@thosewhocando That may be said in one of the books. Perhaps I oversighted but I think it is not as necessary to mentats as it is for Guildians or Bene Gesserit sisters. The only "mentat drug" mentioned in the Dune glossary at the end of first novel is the sapho juice.

[@acenull0]

I love Dune because they made one resources so key you can understand why it's important then they went sci-fi with it 😂 bravo 👏🏾

[@rodneykelly8768]

Has it ever been stated as to how the Spacing Guild figured out the spice's use in space travel?

[@cedricthomas4867]

Yes in Dune prequel by Brian Herbert , find out about Norma Cenva , her story will give you the picture.

[@NameNotAChannel]

@@cedricthomas4867I don't trust a word written by Brian Herbert. Not even as fan fiction.

[@cedricthomas4867]

@@NameNotAChannel ok , but him & Frank pretty much the only ones to write on the subject so , I just follow the continuation on the story provided.

[@NameNotAChannel]

@@cedricthomas4867I understand. What killed all my interest in anything they wrote, for me, was how incredibly bad their reading comprehension was, in regards to the Butlerian era, or it was a complete intentional disregarding of what Frank wrote in his books, that lead them to write about some evil AI uprising... which directly contradicts the canon books. If they claim to have Frank's notes to base that on, I'd need to see those notes myself to e convinced it's worth reading anything they wrote. For me, that says they are writing whatever they want, and don't care about the world Frank created.

[@cedricthomas4867]

@@NameNotAChannel maybe it was their best try at fleshing out backstory for a known universe that was how old when he co wrote his books ? I would like to ask a question , about the Use of. AI in the stories ( first books ) with the Admonition “ Thou shall not make a machine in the likeness of a human mind” & no robotic appearances I figured machines and robots were taboo.

[@michaelnorman4476]

What I struggle with for the film adaptation is that it wasn’t necessary to make the changes for filming and screen purposes. There was no need to bring the atomics in. A very short quick explanation about the worms lifecycle and how Paul could control it. It would have sufficed to keep it true or to the books. There’s no need to take Chani’s character the direction that she went at the end of the movie either. While I still absolutely love the movie, those two things were very disappointing.😢

[@frankrobinson1322]

Wouldn't nuking the spice fields require nuking most of the planet, since the sandworms ranged throughout most of the desert?

[@chrisb3585]

Going a bit off topic here, but who would you cast as Bijaz, Peter Dinklage or Toby Jones? Sorry, I've had that question rattling in my head since watching the Dune Pt. 2 review video on Quinn's channel. Ok back the matter of Spice. Given the two versions of the threat to the universal Spice trade, either by its complete eradication or a temporary yet significant halt in production, either would be a sufficient leverage for Paul to press his will upon the Imperium. I say temporary as the film certainly doesn't say anything to contradict that Spice is a by-product of the worm's life cycle.The position of the Guild is an interesting one, though their absence at the end of the film is highly unusual given their presence when House Atreides was awarded stewardship of Arrakis. I suppose it could be explained that the reason Shaddam IV was on Dune was more to do with Paul's direct challenge rather than the threat to Spice production caused by Fremen attacks. Having the Guild step in to reluctantly back Paul's claim to the throne, while also effectively holding the other Great Houses hostage on their Highliners, would not align with how the film ended. As for making sense of the Guild's absence, perhaps they foresaw Paul's ascension to Emperor or at the very least the end of Shaddam's rule? Perhaps they ultimately saw themselves in a comfortable position regardless who sits on the throne, the Guild is integral to the functions of Human society and while their influence may be weakened under Paul, they can bide their time... Even the Jihad could not have happened without the willing or unwilling assistance of the Guild. Unless Paul truly intended to destroy the Imperium and probably the greater part of humanity along with it, the Spice must flow.

[@stefbeg]

That's reverse logic. Since Villeneuve decided how his movie would end, then he had to erase the Guild from the scope because otherwise the ending would make no sense. But by erasing the Guild, much of the true vital importance of spice and Arrakis is lost.

[@chrisb3585]

@@stefbeg yes it is, I was merely musing over an explanation for their absence at the end of the film in the context of their hopeful appearance in Messiah's adaptation. I agree with your point concerning the true value of both the Spice and Arrakis being lost at the end of the film, though it perhaps better explains the onset of the Jihad rather than the Fremen forcing their religion upon the Imperium. (However, it could certainly develop into that.) If we do get a reasonably faithful adaptation of Messiah, would you say the changes made to the ending of Dune are worth while? (Excluding Chani departing.)

[@stefbeg]

@@chrisb3585 Well, if people enjoyed the new storyline, it's the most important thing. Personnally, I did not, but that's just one person's taste. I fear "blockbuster logic" will make important parts of Dune 3 showing the holy war directly, which will make spectacular images, but you will have to make expositions for Alia, the Qizarate, the Guild, the Tleilax, the ghola, the twins... or will Villeneuve sacrifice much lore again ?

[@kwaki-serpi-niku]

Denise Villeneuve put Christopher Walken in the role of the emperor in Dune. There's no redeeming that kind of mistake. It's like giving all the Fremen cowbells as weapons.

[@Meloncolliepoet]

The thing I always wondered, though, is what will they do when the planet's sun inevitably runs out of hydrogen and expands into a red giant that absorbs the planet? Does anyone have a backup plan for when the spice stops flowing?

[@NameNotAChannel]

The later books go into this... many spoilers to even try to outline it.

[@RyanPerrella]

@nerdcookies Have a very Nerdy day. Thank you. Since you asked, i think “spice melange” is an analog or cypher for THC in cannabis or marijuana. It’s said that this plant, which has characteristics unlike all other plant life was brought to Earth by Shiva, of the Hindu Trinity. When you realize that the flowering/budding/psychotropic THC portion has an analog called Hemp, which grows faster than bamboo and is like a literal weed, this material used to make the best ropes, the best clothes which last multiple lifetimes and were handed down, hemp seeds are also said to be incredible for delivering fats and proteins CRITICAL to correct human anatomical/biological function of which no other commercial food product offers. Hemp has been suppressed as a building material, to CREATE, its fibers are superior to all other plant fibers used to construct homes and tie sails to ships which traverse the globe. Spice = Hemp It has practical uses as a fibrous plant, as a Necessary Protein for humans/mammals and most important, its flower OPENS MENTAL CONSCIOUS AWARENESS when simply stuffed into a pipe and lit by fire. What do you think the Wizard Merlin is smoking?

[@trumanshow162]

The Spice improves men’s logical thinking (like mentats & Guildsmen, including future prediction) for controlling outer environments. On the other, it seems to improve women’s sense & manipulation of mind activities (like the ordinally Bene Gesserits & reverend mothers, including the activation of genetic memories or the detoxification of drugs) for controlling body-internal environments.

[@shadowsift]

Nerdcookies has the cutest voice 😊 ❤

[@uknowbass]

The guild is powerful, but CHOAM is the head of commerce.

[@jayjackson676]

I like in the book where it says spice won’t kill you unless you stop taking it that was one of the best lines that came from the book I think let me know what you guys think in a reply what your favorite lines are from the book or the movie

[@kdog3908]

Some of the Bene Gesserit and God Emperor's commentary on the dual edged sword that is spice makes for some good reading. Unfortunately, such commentary occurs only in the later books so isn't really covered by the films.

[@chrysm6842]

However, this depiction of the spice as a drug is actually much more obvious in the TV series (the 2000s one) rather than in Denis Villeneuve's version, I guess.

[@archlittle6067]

I do not understand why Arrakis was not protected by orbital fortresses. If an unscheduled space guild fleet arrived, the forts would respond. Beam weapons would destroy the fleet whether they had shielding (causing a nuclear reaction) or not, by simply blasting them.

[@StevenStarksjbirdcapitalllc]

In the book, the reason why there weren’t any orbital fortresses or climate control was because the Fremen were bribing the Spacing Guild with spice that was outside the Imperial control. The reason why they probably did it was to hide what they used the spice for .

[@Nell_Tanya]

I think these cookies were spiced?!

[@tomafterhours6099]

Your videos are great, especially your voice; but can you please get a better mic for your narration? Whatever you are currently using for audio at the moment is a little muddled!

[@NguyenQuangLuan802]

THE SPICE MUST FLOW Failure is not an option

[@loganv0410]

I think that Villeneuve's substitution of 'atomics' for the ecological mayhem written by Herbert is wonderfully parallel to Jackson's rabbit-drawn sleigh

[@RodneyGraves]

@loganv0410 Adaptation done wrong...

[@darkgatheringwfb5759]

Imagine spice is the Desert Wurm's poop .... then you wonder what actually is a Desert Wurm

[@lorddio2572]

He who controls the spice controls the universe

[@stsolomon618]

The sleeper has awakened!!

[@sumtingwong8592]

Funny how, star wars makes you want a lightsaber. Dune just makes me want to get high on spice. Though would suck being addicted.

[@brotherkellymatthewbarnes8882]

Control, remember Her first name ain't Baby 🤱 it's Janet, Miss Jackson if you're nasty.

[@andrewgendreau2207]

Another lesson of Dune: There is a predetermined amount of cocaine to make anyone have a religious experience.

[@DrCarstairs]

❤

[@Shimra8888]

How can a million Fremen cause the death of billions?

[@shanenolan5625]

Cookie's name nam. Thanks Elaine

[@makarin1]

Hardship of rule

[@user-sn9qr8sw7l]

Need the needs indeed, find out

[@Queen-dl5ju]

how come there eyes werent as blue in part 2

[@borrago]

I never understood how, if the Bene Gesserit know that the water of life comes from sand worms; how do they not know that the worms create the spice?

[@williamantoniobeach5531]

Un abbraccio forte, vi voglio bene

[@marknovak6498]

I wish the nuclear weapons were never brought into the story as the shield wall issue. I think the director underestimates his understanding of the story and the audience's ability to understand Dune. I viewed the nuclear weapons stopping spice production as just problematic. He would have to kill the whole planet to do it with nukes.

[@Emanon...]

How would the Fremen even go full "Jihad" without the support of the Guild? Big big plot hole...

[@sgt.grinch3299]

I thought the movie was a spectacular film. However, this movie strayed too far from the book. I did not like Chani, the lack of the Guild, and where’s Thufir Hawat? I also think the timeframe was condensed into months not years. Alia never made a physical appearance as a toddler.

[@stefbeg]

The absence of Thufir Haawat is a dishonest maneuver from Villeneuve. Villeneuve pretends Paul must be portrayed as an anti-hero or even something tending to villainy. But if you add Thufir Hawat in the recipe, you have to show his death : and at the very end, Paul offers his life to Hawat. He says that if Hawat needs it, Paul will gladly accept to be killed by Hawat, and he means it. That scene shows that Paul is depicted in Dune as a real hero, as noble in the end as he was in the beginning when he saved the Shadout Mapes, but you can't show that if you insist to misinterpret Herbert's message. Many people naively understand that Herbert warned against messiahs, but he warned against blind following of messiahs, which is not exactly the same.

[@lukephilipp6777]

I think a big part of the admission of the guild and mentats was due to cater to non book readers and people who did not see the first movie. As well, I think a big part of DVs work was to inspire people to dive deeper into the source material. The movie may leave some wondering about certain aspects that weren’t highlighted and wanting more Dune in general. I think DV did a great job making a movie in that regard as well as catering to book readers, non book readers, and people who may have not seen the first movie.

[@lukephilipp6777]

Furthermore, I think DV excluded those aspects to streamline the story. Non book readers may have overlooked the mentats, the guild, and their abilities with how much detail was already in the film. I do hope that the guild and mentats make more of an appearance in messiah.

[@lawrencereid2767]

Your the best 🖤🫡

[@brandonhill2183]

Paul did a Harvey Dent

[@cyka7609]

I feel Denis adaptation is being faithful to Frank Herbert's original intention of interpretation, even tho the guild was sadly excluded from part 2. But we will certainly see the spacing guild in the next film side with Paul because of his control of the spice, probably in the beginning of the film.

[@fox_e_crow3276]

Is there a video about why the phrase “the known universe” keeps being used, when we are reasonably certain that the inhabited worlds of Dune didn’t stretch beyond the milky way?

[@isbestlizard]

Makes you wonder why in the thousands of years of existence the guild didn't just stockpile a few years worth of spice. Like... why this Just In Time delivery system for the most essential resource in the galaxy?

[@supermcspotty]

I assume since it's use is vastly needed more then it's simple value sitting around. To feed navigators, mentats ans bene gesserits. They may be using spice so much it's demand is so high making it so valuable too valuable to stock the spice in large quantities without making one economically vulnerable or cause too many to die.

[@stefbeg]

It's because the Guild (and the Bene Gesserit) did not always depend on spice to enhance their prescient abilities. In the end of the book, Paul reflects on the Guild who "had realised the error of specialising on the melange awareness-spectrum narcotic for their navigators". This sentence shows that some times in the past, the Guild used other drugs. But now that navigators are addicted to spice, a drug that promises horrible agonizing withdrawal, they became utterly dependent on spice.

[@ShangaelThunda222]

Not to mention, control. The reason we have the just in time delivery system on this planet today, is to control the supply. Either because you don't want to provide supply beyond the demand, or because you want to artificially limit the supply, so the demand remains high and you can maintain your prices and economic power, which grants control over the other factions.

[@NameNotAChannel]

It was illegal to have stockpiles of spice. Quote: “Thufir,” Leto said, “the Imperial and Harkonnen stockpiles of spice attract my attention.” “M’Lord?” The Duke pursed his lips. “Storehouses are susceptible to destruction.” He raised a hand as Hawat started to speak. “Ignore the Emperor’s hoard. He’d secretly enjoy it if the Harkonnens were embarrassed. And can the Baron object if something is destroyed which he cannot openly admit that he has?” Hawat shook his head. “We’ve few men to spare, Sire.” “Use some of Idaho’s men. And perhaps some of the Fremen would enjoy a trip off planet. A raid on Giedi Prime-there are tactical advantages to such a diversion, Thufir."

[@PapaSnurp]

Just in time delivery is how human supply chains operate

[@jerrysstories711]

Dune is a magnificent story, but the logic of it falls apart quickly if you look too closely at the science or geopolitics of it. The Guild is absolutely dependent on spice, and they control all interstellar travel and hence access to the spice. And yet they never took the time to investigate the connection between spice and worms, allow the emperor to reassign fiefdoms over the spice planet and disrupt supply, and they never noticed the spice planet has the more ferocious warriors in the galaxy. That's more absurd than people protected their bodies and cities that explode if you shoot a lasgun at them.

[@stefbeg]

@jerrysstories711 The matter is addressed in the book. The Guild Navigators have a limited prescience that enables them to search for the safest path. This has a heavy impact on their mindset. Not only do they seek the safest path in space, but also figuratively in the way they manage their policies. They would not take a decision that could lead them to endanger the flow of spice. The book reveals that navigators could see no way they could take control of Arrakis directly without pointing the finger on their main weakness : spice. I think never Lynch, never Villeneuve describes the Navigators' spice dependency as a secret. on one knows they rely on spice, Paul discovers that after taking the water of life. They are aware of the Fremen true power, but they have an arrangement with them : Fremen pay a monstrous ransom in spice to the Guild so that their terraformation of Dune is kept a secret.

[@jerrysstories711]

@@stefbeg Yes, and the books also contain equally clumsy explanations as to why exploding shields aren't a complete fiasco, which they obviously would be. In the end, these are just story elements that require suspension of disbelief, because Herbert was writing a human-focused story, not a tale of hard science or plausible geopolitics.

[@stefbeg]

@@jerrysstories711 It's not that clumsy. The Great Convention forbids use of weapons of mass destruction, not to endanger civilians. This sense of security leads non-noble populations to accept the faufreluche system for millenia, since the warfare between Noble Houses is basically innocuous for the humble people. And since you can't make the difference between an atomic explosion and a shield-laser explosion, no Great House takes the risk. But yes, I agree with you, you have to suspend disbelief, but that is the case in most sci-fi stories, even hard science ones.

[@jerrysstories711]

@@stefbeg And that whole arrangement falls apart the day someone figures out they can send lasguns close to your shield *discreetly* without anyone knowing who did it. The logic of it just doesn't work, but I'm fine with that because I can suspend disbelief and enjoy a marvelous story. Also, no, hard science stories don't require suspension of disbelief, that's what makes them hard science.

[@stefbeg]

@@jerrysstories711 Well, you are overanalyzing. In the real world, we could have a nuclear power transportinf all the required material in the diplomatic wallet to build a nuclear device in the capital of th enemy country and detonating it "discreetly" but what would be the consequences. "Oh no, we don't know who made it, what to do , what to do ?" or immediate blind retaliation and chaos ? And about hard science stories, they're good on the science side, but what about history, sociology, politics, resource avaibility, etc. Perhaps one doesn't have to suspend disbelief on technical or scientifical aspects, but the rest of the story can't be perfectly totally realistic. And even in the scientific aspect, I'm sure that any hard science story will find some scientists rolling their eyes.

[@sirloin869]

except for the tleilaxu...

[@sirloin869]

so,if water of life awakening gives mother genetic memory of all female ancestors, how Alia get took over by the baron haarkonan - because he's a boy,i think...

[@NameNotAChannel]

@@sirloin869Alia was like Paul, in this. Paul could see into both male and female ancestral memories. However, while Alia couldn't look where Paul could look, the persona of the Baron COULD seep out and possess Alia... the door was open by way of her pre-birth, and Jessica left Arrakis, without completing Alia's training, which could have potentially given Alia the tools to keep control over the many minds within her.

[@brianmccann666]

The director of Nue-DUNE hates Dialogue. That commit makes him a bad director IMHO. He should direct just Action scenes or action films like kurt Russell&s Soldier or the Mad Max style films...

[@610vegas]

The more I think about the movie the more I am starting to dislike it as a Dune adaption not as a movie I enjoyed the movie but just some of the choices I find extremely jarring.

[@camiloweinmann6440]

This AI voices are super creepy.

[@NerdCookies]

It's not an AI voice 🙂

[@brianlindee4397]

Yah essentially if you're addicted to it like high quality pot

[@peternouwen]

No!😢 Atomics?!?!? That is such a spoiler! And not in line with the current climate crisis, where our civilization will not be destroyed by nuclear bombs but by, eh, water. Both too much and too little of it.

[@Kwisatz-Chaderach]

Stop being lazy and go read the books. (If you've read then, carry on.)

[@stephensmith4025]

You know, I’ve tried to make myself like Denis’ adaptations. But I think it’s time to address the elephant in the room that they’re boring and visually bland. He left out so many extremely important plot elements, and book storylines that it’s just really disappointing and boring to me.

[@sharneparata2399]

I think your by yourself there Stephen, it's visually masterful. The book is boring in parts too. I'm gutted that the movies miss key parts of the book too, however these two films are amazing adaptations in this medium

[@georgeandrews1276]

I'm with you Stephen. I was sorely disappointed. The visual richness was missing and verbal intrigues were lacking. Casting was hit and miss for me. Eva Green would have been the perfect Lady Jessica! The story falls apart for me from there.

[@leonfizer1974]

Can't listen to this AI narration, do better.

[@drewforsyth1993]

You think Denis "overlooked" a detail of this film? Hilarious. I think you meant "adapted" for the sake of making a movie.