The Unhinged Wonder of Pokémon Ultra Sun & Ultra Moon

[@aokcraig]

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[@tjdragneel5002]

Yo great vid on the ultra games. Though I was curious on your thoughts when it came to the post game and a certain rainbow rocket

[@nirgunawish]

i hate these videos that are literally just a recap especially when you can't even be bothered to offer any actual commentary

[@vianabdullah2837]

Probably my favourite games in the series alongside Black and White 2. They essentially addressed all of the issues people had with Gen 6 in this one. It's one of the more challenging games in the series, the story is probably the best in a Pokemon game and there's quite a few things to do in the post-game. Long tutorials and lots of dialogue, don't really bother me since they're just a thing I expect in JRPGs, I enjoy each area having its own fleshed out scenario. Plus, it contributes building up some of the characters like Lillie and Kukui.

[@lestervalentin5418]

fellow b2w2 and usum enjoyer here. absolutely love these entries so much that gen 7 became the first gen where i bought both versions of both games. too bad about b2w2 tho as theyre hella expensive now so i only managed to get black and b2 since i only played them via r4 back then

[@nullpoint3346]

This is my rule for text in games, regardless of genre: If it is mandatory, then it is in the way and must be kept to a minimum. If it is optional, then it is not a problem and _can_ be expanded upon, but should be kept short and sweet. Nobody wants to play a four hour tutorial more than once (even once is too much), but lore heads are willing to spend _years_ combing over every line of text and analyzing every last polygon if you care enough to engage them.

[@Shinntoku]

As a dialogue enjoyer, I love the gen 7 games. I just replayed USUM recently and had an absolute blast with the story and characters. My biggest story complaint is that imo Lusamine and Lillie's arc is wayyyyy better in SM, Lillie's determination feels so earned

[@juandiegotorres9632]

Agree with you on Lillie.

[@victorvicg]

How is different the story?

[@Shinntoku]

@@victorvicg a lot of the broad strokes are the same(you visit the islands and do the trials in the same order) but a lot of the character details are stronger in SM. In USUM Lillie doesn't have nearly as strong motivations for getting out from under Lusamine's shadow because Lusamine hasn't been controlling and abusive the way she was in SM. Their whole family dynamic is wonky, and it also affects Guzma and Lusamine since her manipulating him lacks the kick of using him to replace her own children while being the first older adult to really take him seriously and validate his strength. The Ultra Recon stuff is all very cool, but I've always been of the opinion that it could have been DLC rather than another pair of full price games

[@FaisLittleWhiteRaven]

@@victorvicg In Sun and Moon Lusamine was out of her mind on Nihilego venom, abusive towards both Lillie and Gladion to the point the later says would've run away even if he hadn't found out what Faba was doing to the Type:Null in the post game, and pretty much every main 'plot talk with Lille and Hau' has Hau running off to do fun stuff while Lille holds back to talk a little about stuff like how she's unused to picking her own clothes because 'her choices weren't good enough', never thought about battling with pokemon because it's not lady like and comments on how Lusamine 'got so much worse' after Gladion left... Oh and then there's Lusamine's rant about how ugly and selfish her children are for leaving her and how she doesn't need them anymore all while hurting Nebby on screen. Basically any scene in USUM where the player is hanging out a lot with Hau or riding Mantine to the next island, assume there was a cut Lille scene. Also the original Executor Island scene with Lille is quite a bit longer and has her basically going over why, despite everything she still wants to save her mother from the Nihilego (that is, hope that the mother she remembers from before her father disappeared is deep down still in there)and the actual confrontation of the player and Lillie with 'Beast Mother' Lusamine is honestly fantastic

[@victorvicg]

@@FaisLittleWhiteRaven thanks man!!! I only played USM and didn't know how different it was! Wow now I want to go back and play SM for that plot. I wish they blended together better both parts. Would be awesome

[@shinymk6562]

These games are so interesting because if you read the dialogue of the characters, its so different to the SM story. SM is about lIllie and her family, while USUM is about Necrozma, its just less obvious from the gameplay and only from the text.

[@lasercraft32]

You know its crazy how little people talk about these games nowadays... It was such a major departure from the usual Pokemon formula (well, you know, not THAT major, but still), and there is some INSANE lore going on with the Ultra Beasts that just screams "give me my own Legends spin-off game."

[@astralizer99]

These games and Pokémon Sun were the first ever main line games I played so for me it got me into the franchise and because of them being my first games I enjoyed them for what they were without the internet's views and didn't mind the dialogue. Thankfully instead of putting me off the games they made me want to play them more.

[@thechisel_]

I always liked Z-Moves, but in the pandemic I saw a video from the first Aquaman movie's premiere carpet event (?), and something clicked for me. Jason Momoa and other people from Hawaii did a dance called "Haka", a Maori tradition to greet visitants and enemies with the purpose of intimidation. The way Game Freak combined tradicional dances of polynesian cultures with a tokusatsu styled finisher attack is so great to me. In my opinion, it is the only gimmick that fits with the region it is in.

[@WyattStone-lx5wc]

Slight detail in the story I love is when necrozma takes over the legendary. It instantly opens wormholes around the region. We actually get to see the world in danger besides a sky change like in D/P/P and R/S. And we get to see the side legendaries do something important in the story and how they add to the lore

[@owenmattes7619]

These are my favorite games in the series! I love them he dialogue, it makes me feel immersed in the story, kind of like I’m playing a movie. I play through these games once a year usually, and each time i have an amazing time. I never understood the hate, people asked for a more immersive story and that’s what they got. It’s also the most difficult pair of games in the series, yet people still find a way to complain about

[@Katelizaj]

“Help! The Ultra Beasts are killing everyone!!” Us: 0u0

[@handlethesenutz]

"Oh god, necrozma is absolutely killing nebby! We have to do something!!" ":^)"

[@Extinct-Lizard]

I personally really like the dialogue in usum just because I’m a lore fanatic

[@susy1796]

As an answer to the last question: Pokemon Ultrasun was in fact my first Pokemon Game and I think that impacted me in the way that I don’t really care that much about long cutscenes. Are they annoying? Sometimes yes, but I don’t feel like I am as annoyed by them because it was the first thing I got used to. Also when I started to play older Pokemon Games, I struggled with learning the type matchups in the beginning. Because Ultrasun always lets you know which moves are super effective against a Pokemon as soon as you encounter the second of its type, I didn’t really have to learn type matchups and it took a while before I started to get to know the types and the type matchups. They are to this day my favourite Pokemon games still, and I love replaying them over and over again. Great video!

[@noahthecrazy1632]

This is the only region where every ace trainer and above have fully EV’ed pokemon and WILL sweep your whole team and ruin nuzlockes

[@itsyaboigabe8334]

This being my first generation really made me appreciate how good I had it. I have put countless hours into these games and I hope we get another pokemon game like it

[@theitscolleen]

i giggled when you said that you used your z power against mimikyu's disguise because that is something i would 100% do!!! great video, Craig! I love hearing your POV about this game series... I need to try it out myself! If you ever need a video idea, you should should shiny hunt using the ultraworm holes

[@Alessio-z6x]

I assure you, they have tons of replay value. I have over 300 hrs for Ultra Sun and an additional 70 for Pokémon moon.

[@nullpoint3346]

If we cut the cutscenes, the time drops considerably.

[@RealSkello]

@@Alessio-z6x Over 400 for me on just my childhood save not including SR hunting and I never really did SOS lol

[@RPGPOKEFAN78]

These were my first ever Pokemon games I ever played and got me addicted to the series. To this date they are still my all time favorite game, but a lot of that is due to nostalgia and me being a impressionable kid when I played them

[@Go-get-a-Job]

I replayed them recently, THEY ARE JUST AS GOOD, top 3 pokemon games tbh

[@thomoclock]

13:33 I think this is the other way around. Ultra Sun and Moon makes her a non-villain. In Sun and Moon, she actually is one. I really enjoyed Ultra Sun and Moon and mostly prefer it to the originals, but Sun and Moon overall has the better story because of what they did (didn't do) with Lusamine in the Ultra games.

[@SEIJITV]

I loved the Ultra games. Never played the og Sun and Moon so I never got the hate on them. The music, characters, story, and challenges presented are just amazing in these games.

[@incomments2864]

@@SEIJITV the OG have Lilith’s goodbye end which was really sad back then, before ultra sun and moon came out a year later and didn’t have her leave lol

[@SEIJITV]

@incomments2864 imo, her Ultra ending was fine and it made more sense for Gladion to leave since he was all about getting stronger. From a narrative sense, if you went into the games without knowing like I did, it didn't make that big of a difference.

[@AdeptCharon]

Re: protagonist moves to new region Think the devs see some (if not most) Pokémon adventures as a vacation setting (specifically with Hoenn I know we had Masuda state that Kyushu was where his family went for summer vacations and that that was the vibe he was going for). It's also no coincidence that basically every real-world inspiration used for a region featured so far is a popular Japanese tourist destination.

[@OfficialAbjeer]

@@AdeptCharon France???

[@AdeptCharon]

​@@OfficialAbjeer is that a question or surprise or what?

[@AdeptCharon]

But yes, there are apparently a million Japanese tourists visiting France every year, and Japanese media is known for idealizing Paris in particular.

[@mysticdigital5936]

I always liked Gen 7 a lot. The dialogue/slow down is definitely the biggest issue. I can understand the ride Pokemon being random is weird, but it's way better to use Pokemon rsther than just a *surf* board. But there should have been a Bike too. Overall though, the games are just a great fresh take, Alola is such a fleshed out region and I love the Johto influences mirroring real life Japanese cultural influence on Hawaii too. The Ultra games are weird because I feel like they're *mostly* better than Sun and Moon but they also jsut changed enough things that I feel they stand on their own. SM is very much Lillie and Lusamine's story, but USUM always felt more like *Hau* and Necrozma's story to me. Beyond that the different Totems and trials do mix things up. But I think USUM has a better postgame. UltraMoon is the last mainline game I played. Dexit and the quality drop of Gen 8 and 9 just lets me save money honestly. I recently went back to playing UltraMoon to complete the dex so I can shiny hunt and it's nice to hear the music again, see the crusty but very pretty visuals. Hoping Legends ZA or Gen 10 show effort, content, and actual care.

[@hondaaccord1399]

My favorite generation 🥰 I think back to the late nights I stayed up, how hyped I was to watch the anime for it, playing and replaying and trying to complete the Pokedex to the max I could (when the Pokedex felt like a challenge and not just 10 trades and leveling some mons up) I love these games❤

[@treyc9590]

Alola is an interesting region for me because it took time to grow on me. I replayed Ultra Sun this year and found myself living it wah more than I had before.

[@juandiegotorres9632]

The thing is what you've said mostly applies to the original SM. I like what they did with Hau, but i dont like what they did with Lillie. She basically solved her issue about the years of neglect with an off screen conversation with Lusamine while in the original she gave her a stern talking to, losing the shy demeanor and giving it to her straight. I think what let me down the most was the fact that it wasn't a sequel, Gladion wasn't head of Aether Corporation and the Ultra Recon Squad wasn't a dedicated villain team.

[@jamiek8123]

a middle stage lover? nah you're good man, I also like some of the middle stages, Torracat included

[@nullpoint3346]

Braixen is the best middle stage, and it saddens me that nothing else can truly compare to this adorable fox mage. Well, nothing official anyway.

[@yukiizura]

1:01 Yeah it's just a casual thing. I mean, how many men call their friends "bro"? I only ever played the originals, so it was cool to find out that Molayne replaces Hala as one of the Elite 4! Still disappointed about Kahili, she really does feel like she just. comes out of nowhere. I fully agree that there is WAY too much text, and way too many interruptions in Gen 7. It's actually painful at points, I JUST want to play the game. And it's just really frustrating because Gens 1, 2, 4, and 5 all have equal amounts of heavy lore, but don't drag you through it. They drip feed it to you, and place it in areas where players who want it will find it, and players who don't (or who are returning) can ignore it. Gen 7's insistence that I have to care about every individual strand of lore in Alola, means that I actually care less and don't retain anywhere near as much info about it as I do from other regions. It's part of the larger issue in the post-XY world, where it's almost like Gamefreak doesn't trust new players to engage with the game, and so FORCE them to. It's the giant thing holding the generation back, if it was just more reasonable on the dialogue front, these games would be remembered as among the best in the franchise. I actually agree that Alola's Dex is weak. I've grown to appreciate it more over time, but my first playthrough of Moon? Without even realising, my entire team (minus Decidueye) ended up being pre-Gen 7 Pokémon; shouldn't complain too much since this DID allow for Gigalith to become my favourite Pokémon of all time. I will say, Alola has my favourite regional forms so far though. Team Skull... I will save my fanboying for their dedicated video, but wow are they my favourite "evil" team. Guzma, Plumeria, and the grunts will always have my heart. Great video as always!

[@Aoikitty]

I love Pokémon sun & moon, both the original and the ultra versions. The S&M hype season is what got me into Pokémon. Hell I, a 12 y/o at the time, saved up for and bought a 3DS for it with my own money. So these games hold a really special place in my heart. I love the story, I love the characters, I loved the totem battles, I love the Pokémon they added & I absolutely ADORE the Ultra Beast’s.

[@painpokebeys]

Probably my favorite games, purely because they were some of my first

[@martijnklaassen3536]

My childhood team: 1. Chandelure 🔥👻 2. Walrein 💧❄️ 3. Gardevoir 🦋👁 4. Gigalith 🏜 5. Galvantula 🪳⚡️ 6. Reshiram 🐉🔥 (Me and my friends had a 1 legendary rule)

[@imaeintellec209]

Ultra moon was my first Pokemon Game, my new 3ds was just shipped from Japan and I’m planning on getting Ultra Sun when it arrives Rowlet on top obv

[@UBHunterRonny]

Gameplay wise I think USUM are one of the best games. Replaying it now too

[@typhoonboom]

these were my first pokemon games i bought as close to the launch date as i could at the time, thanks for making me feel old by mentioning these games are almost a decade old. btw, i'd love to see a team skull video and a feature length video about these games. also i've been getting you on my recommended for a while now, but haven't subscribed yet. this video deserves to chance that fact

[@mimiquoi7380]

Personnally I really prefer the story of base Sun and Moon. The Ultra games make Lilie's developpement really less good. She had really good scenes in Sun and Moon who are just erased in this games and her ending with her travelling into Kanto (who I really loved) is also erased. And it's a shame because it was some of those scenes that make her character one of the best written character of Pokemon for me 😢 And Lusamine treatment in the Ultra game is weird. They wanted to redeem her but they keep some story element of her madness of base Sun and Moon into the game. Exemple : She still freeze pokemon and nobody care about it in the end ? 🤨 For me Lusamine was really a great villain and they took that away from us.. In the end, yes the Ultra games are maybe more complete in term of content.. But the story was really disapointing for me. (But yeah the Ultra Necrozma fight was still really good)

[@thepokemonqueen]

I totally agree, the ultra games really defanged lusamine by removing the nihilego fusion scene and wiped an important chunk of Lillie's character growth with it. I prefer the ultra games mechanically, but story-wise the base games are better imo (I did love the rainbow rocket section though)

[@mimiquoi7380]

​@@thepokemonqueen exactly !

[@thomoclock]

Exactly this. Whenever someone asks which Gen 7 game they should play, it's really such a hard choice because on the whole Ultra is so much better with all the little extra content they added. QoL additions, better UI, sidequests... But on the flip side, the story suffers because of the changes they made with Lusamine and Lillie. I wish they just didn't touch that aspect.

[@MoeChiller]

USUM belongs to my Top 3 Pokemon Editions. It's one of the liveliest Games. However Incineroar is my Favourite Pokemon of all time. So I'm gonna take you on anytime XD.

[@PelinalDidNothingWrong]

USUM are great,and Gen 7 is criminally underrated. I love the Alola region,it's characters,the island trials and the concept of regional forms it introduced. Gen 7 reminds me a lot of how Gen 5 was recieved back in the day....

[@Sush]

Man I need to watch this. Hopefully I don't forget.

[@Sush]

watching it five days later!

[@otakueve117]

I never did finish playing ultra sun, I should probably restart and play it again after I play more of pokemon violet

[@Go-get-a-Job]

Yeah its really good

[@KidBluu]

Hms should have been replaced by the pokemon ranger mechanic where as long as you catch a pokemon that can use or learn the move technically it will be able to do the hm ability. Like Beedrill cutting down trees without knowing cut

[@Blastosie_Offical]

"B-but there's no jellyfish monster! Bad game!"

[@thomasfan8889]

All I’m saying is that if the dialogue was voice acted cut I don’t think that these games would be considered as notorious an entry as they currently are.

[@historicflame972]

I just wish this had taken place a few years later like B2W2, would've made a lot more sense from a character standpoint, Lusamine's actions and role would make more sense without it feeling like she was awkwardly brushed aside to make way for Necrozma, still being addled by the affects of Nihilego's toxins, seeking a way to make up for her actions but still lacking restrains and inhibition. Also they could cut out the Pokemon freezing from the first game since it really has no place in this one, could've given them more freedom to actually do something with the Ultra Recon Squad too

[@finalGambitShedinja]

these games have a lot of problems, but the art direction and general presentation of gen 7 have always been my favorite

[@NexusAvery]

I didn't spend much time in these games, probably about 50 hrs across both moon and ultra sun. I believe that s/m should have been on the switch and the rainbow rocket/ultra space should have been dlc. A simple upscale of s/m can be done, many streamers did so.

[@minethecrafty9111]

0:56 the hottest professor 🥴

[@owenmattes7619]

No bc the 3DS professors were pretty much just thirst traps (and I’m not complaining)

[@jermainespeid4934]

Pokémon Ultra Sun and ultra Moon are like black and white 2 but different

[@akiraanzawa1615]

Ultra Sun is FAR superior to X&Y and Sun&Moon. The only game to beat it in terms of creaetivity and gameplay is Scarlet Violet.

[@vagueeeee139]

Tbf what made S&V that big and creative were the dlcs. Which for me isn’t creative because it took devs years or 3 years to be exact to complete the game and lore wise, the dlcs really didn’t even try to tie up to the base game and to other dlcs, the only tie ups were the champion which was your real rival. As for US & UM, the game was really fleshed out, great post-game and it feels like a new game rather than it becoming like a standalone dlc for Sun and Moon.

[@juandiegotorres9632]

There's only 2 instances of protags being from a foreign region (Brendan/May from gen 3 being from Johto and Elio/Sina from gen 7 bring from Kanto)

[@Alessio-z6x]

Still my favorite Pokémon game, although I'm going to play through black soon.

[@Azira_Amane]

I was not prepared for the Bewear hate 😂😂😂😂

[@miimiiandco]

Oh hey, it's my first Pokemon games. Yeah, I played the hardest ones first lol. This isn't my favourite Pokemon game - that honour goes to S/V - but it's one I hold quite dear. But then again, I haven't played it in a while! I've definitely gotta replay this game sometime soon.

[@stardustdragon7851]

I'm now on my 20th playthrough of this game since I finally found my 2ds I lost for 2 years

[@rosettaaraara6633]

Gen 7 is definitely my favourite games along with Gen 4 and Gen 5

[@lametrain9667]

This is by no means an insult directed at you but I’ve never noticed how “pedantic” the overall Pokémon community is about how USUM shook up the formula. My only expectation for a Pokémon game is that you’ll explore a region while catching and battling Pokémon. The difference between Gyms and Island Challenges never bothered me because of this. The game is still about catching and battling Pokémon at the end of the day.

[@rainstorm3343]

pokemon moon was my first game and i got it when i was 11. i didnt look at the adventure log, so i didnt know how to save the game or that i couldnt save during dialogue, so i ended up losing the first part of my very first pokemon game bc my ds died lol. i dont care for the ultra games as much as the originals but that might just be some bias showing. playing older gens has been really fun for me, even though im so used to plowing through every battle that when i dont, i get stuck. this happened with whitney in gold, norman in emerald, fantina in platinum, and iris in black 2. i think, since i didnt have to grind at all in moon (or ultra moon, or shield, or arceus, or violet), it seems weird to have to in the older games, and i have a slight distaste for it. thats probably why i get stuck so much lmao

[@michaelm9211]

Honestly very good Pokemon games. I had a lot of friends skip it because they did not like regular sun and moon.

[@WyattStone-lx5wc]

Ultra sun my first game and is by far my favorite. It makes me so mad to see how hated it is.

[@bvawesome5165]

USUM is peak pokemon!!

[@RealSkello]

My first game was sun and I think USUM maintain being my favorites. Unfortunately I hate sos shiny hunting so I don’t play it much

[@DeltaZinnia]

the first Sun/Moon games had a much better story

[@AmityvilleFan]

I suggest after the first playthrough skip all the dialogue as much as you can. Focus on soloing through the whole thing with 1 pokemon. It's a great battling game. Teaches a lot for a beginner at least. Plenty of replay-value in it. Only 2 things narrow it down: special attackers are very samey experience, and anythng that is voulnerable to dark damage will be a chore. This still leaves 50-70 pokemon to play through. And I mean fully evolved forms.

[@Tristan_Shuler]

Yea I hate how Lillie is the main character and the PC is kinda just there.

[@tyrellgary4462]

A lot of dialogue is okay but it has to be engaging which it wasn’t. Also Pokémon has always excelled in a show don’t tell aspect, I think this is why it falls flat for a lot of people.

[@myrmidonrising7054]

Haych Em

[@kyurei4478]

I completed both versions (Moon and Ultra-Moon) and I still find Team Skull as uninteresting and pathetic as the first time. The way they constantly belittle themselves just wasn't funny at all and felt like a waste of time. These guys were the only team without ambitions or goals at the time. They're a failed attempt of Team Rocket pretty much and they started the trend of unimportant bad guys. I just ignored them to focus on the Aether research team, a more interesting twisted evil team.

[@Tristan_Shuler]

Too much dialogue 7.8/10

[@killgronia5815]

A lt hre

[@Go-get-a-Job]

15:15 i dont get it, it gives more content and more depth. B2W2 does the same thing but its very much glazed