THE WHAT IF MEN AND THE NEARLY MEN! A Look at Drivers that Never Reached the Pinnacle

Matt Bishop tweets a lot of good stuff on twitter. He's probably the best thing on twitter and a recent post got me thinking about F1's nearly men. The ones who didn't get to the top because of bad luck, circumstance, or because they were killed or severely injured before they could make it to the top.
So I've picked out four or five drivers on a list of those who fit that bill, and see what it was that meant they never reached the levels they 'should' have done, if that makes sense.
Enjoy! And remember to like and subscribe for more!
Matt's Twitter: / thebishf1
Rally Crash: • Rajd Świdnicki 2022 | ...
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[@AidanMillward]

Check out mr less tomato face over here. Lookin' aaaaaaaveraaaaaaggge

[@y_fam_goeglyd]

You're looking good. Lots healthier. Love videos like this. More please!

[@eoincassin4265]

The "watch MOJO" intro was hilarious 👍

[@FSX239]

I love story time.

[@superpv]

What happened with your blond hair Rebbecca? hahahah great

[@mikehipperson]

Amazing what a bit of matt foundation can do!

[@AntoniusTyas]

Fun fact: Didier Pironi later died on a boating accident, leaving behind his pregnant wife who later gave birth to twins. One named Didier, and the other named Gilles. Gilles would later accompany a certain 7-times world champion on top of the podium during 2020 British GP to receive the constructor's trophy. Magic.

[@VonBlade]

I love the idea of comments complaining you forgot about people who are, by definition, forgotten men. During the Ickx segment you mentioned Ronnie Peterson. Another big what if. Not forgotten, just a stupidly quick driver who sadly never got a chance to strut his stuff.

[@KayoMichiels]

Those onboards of him on a soaking wet Montreal/ Circuit Gilles-Villeneuve/ Circuit Île Notre Dame are legendary!

[@GregBrownsWorldORacing]

I think he strutted pretty well based on his constraints. People marvel at how Max likes a loose car. Ronnie was positively mental at how sideways he got that car and still "saved" it and powered on!

[@Tacko14]

Bellof is the big one for me, I genuinely regretted his passing. But if he hadn’t crashed at Spa, he probably would have anywhere else. Bit of a live cartridge, that one. He was always gonna go bang at some point

[@rhodriedwardwilliams]

Same applies to Senna but life is all about the cards your delt

[@pauleaster5832]

He was in talks with Ferrari so that is a big what if.

[@grain_newports]

For me Juan Pablo Montoya is the prime "what if" of the early-2000s. Had Williams not fumbled their car development or hell even if he was on a different team we could have seen a couple of gaps in what became Schumacher's championship win streak.

[@AidanMillward]

Montoya was partially screwed by “Ferrari internal affairs” at Indy in 2003. Got hit by Rubens but it was his fault. No clue.

[@1greenMitsi]

montoya was too fat

[@mike04574]

he made a lot of mistakes and errors that cost him the title too, was also poor in his final 2 seasons

[@jonmancill6824]

BUT, if Montoya ever had the good fortune of signing with a team who understood how to work with him that was able to give him proper reliability, enough time to build something around him, and still be quick to race with the front group we'd have seen amazing magic happen. I'm a big what if type of person who loves to think about what we missed out on because things never lined up just right during his prime time

[@brianhale8537]

He lacked commitment in F1,and he didn’t like the politics

[@1_5RCBiker]

Belhof was a weapon at Monaco '84. He was SO much faster than anyone else that day.

[@adammercer6004]

And he would have the results stripped from him due to the FIA kicking out Tyrrell F1 in 1984

[@keystonedriving8180]

Jacky Ickx was absolutely brilliant in the wet, some will say that is when true talent shines through. As a sports car person I'd have added Pedro Rodrigues to the list, but you had to draw the line somewhere and I'm not complaining. I enjoy your thoughtful approach to your presentations, I don't miss many. Thanks.

[@y_fam_goeglyd]

Jackie Stewart would have added Cevert to the list. Cevert's death in practice in Watkins Glen is why Stewart "only" did 99 races; he understandably decided against racing in that GP, despite it going to be his final race anyway. He was convinced that FC would have soon been the champion, and quite probably a multiple one. That's the trouble with fatalities and career-wrecking injuries, we're always left wondering "what if"?

[@GregBrownsWorldORacing]

I agree, but another 'almost of a different kind is if you know Mr Cevert, had he been named after his father he would have been named Goldenberg and may not have fared too well under the NSDAP in Paris at the time!

[@AidanMillward]

Jackie would have probably put Bruce on there too.

[@brad6630]

When I watch old highlights of the older seasons Cevert is always talked about highly. As you mentioned Jackie thought highly of him.

[@Slider5320]

Jonny Herbert no doubt is a ‘What if’ he hadn’t had that crippling crash for Jordan in F3000.

[@mrkipling2201]

Agreed. Apparently Frank Williams was at Brands Hatch that day, and was going to sign him for Williams after the race. The bloke who caused the accident, I can't remember his name, wasn't exactly the safest driver either. Of course it was Foitek.

[@bobdevreeze4741]

I had the pleasure of watching Gilles Villeneuve race. He was ferocious. To this day I have never seen a driver as flat out aggressive as Gilles. I absolutely loved to watch him drive. A legend in my books. Jacques had his fathers talent, but he was blessed with far more patience. A combination that made him one of the greats.

[@1greenMitsi]

Gilles>jacques, villeneve jnr proved he was average afterall in the 2000s

[@NonFlyiingDutchman]

I was at Siverstone 1977 for the whole event, including the pre qualifying day. I was only a kid at the time and a massive James Hunt fan so on the first day I was following the guy in Hunt's old car - still remember it.

[@bobdevreeze4741]

@@1greenMitsi He has achieved things only a few have done. He like many others hung on too long. Jacques could be brash and arrogant. But you had to admit, He could drive an open wheel racecar. He never did well with fenders. Something I chalk up to overconfidence.

[@daleleslie1049]

I was lucky enough to have been born near Montreal and I have seen Gilles racing Snowmobiles, then in Formula Ford and Atlantic. Then I went to my first Grand Prix in Montreal in 1979, and I have attended every year since then. We stopped going in 2015, it was no longer the same with the V6 Turbo Hybrid. Jacques Jnr. was special in the 1990s. in the 2000s his career did take many bad turns I must agree, it is too bad though

[@1greenMitsi]

@@bobdevreeze4741 oh I agree he could drive an open wheel racecar - not into his 30s though

[@TheSt1092]

Fun Fact: With 3 career GP world chanpionship wins Mike Hawthorn has the joint-fewest career wins (along with Phil Hill) of any of the 34 F1 WDCs. He and Keke Rosberg also share the joint distinction of only winning 1 race in their F1championship winning seasons.

[@windturbine6796]

3 wins is also shared by Phil Hill

[@TheSt1092]

@@windturbine6796 You are quite right.

[@mateusznoga41]

@@TheSt1092 and didn't Denny Hulme also win only 1 race on his way to a championship?

[@windturbine6796]

@@mateusznoga41 no he won Monaco and Germany. The stat you're thinking of is the one where he didn't get a pole position in that season, and his one pole position came later on in 1973.

[@mateusznoga41]

@@windturbine6796 ah alright thanks for correcting

[@dan5213]

robert is probably one of the biggest what-ifs in formula one history he had a ferrari contract for 2012

[@tomastoth4018]

Chris Amon, Francois Cevert, Jean Alesi - a few super-talented drivers who could have achieved a lot, but two of them missed out a competitive car and another one paid the ultimate price for not investing and developing heavily enough to make race cars safer. I would've found more folks like these, but whenever I think of lost potential, these guys always appear first in my mind (alongside those mentioned in this video).

[@julianbailey2749]

Carlos Reutemann was my first sporting hero and him losing in 1981 hurt. I was 8. The next driver I followed above all others was Elio de Angelis.

[@PEPSIMaxMusic]

It's sad what happened to De Angelis

[@Mlaargaar]

I will not get twitter, I can’t stand people spewing their bile on social media(coming from someone spewing their respective bile on the internet, I know). So I’m really glad you’re providing this insightful coverage.

[@TheSt1092]

Not all of Twitter is bad.

[@matthewlawrenson3628]

@@TheSt1092 Twitter can be ok, but it's not as good as it was around 2011 or so. A lot of the time it appears to be people who create accounts just to start ill-conceived arguments. I blame the low barrier of entry a smartphone provides for most social media ills.

[@samiraperi467]

I'd say JJ Lehto was also a what-if. He just had the misfortune of 1) spinning into barriers in icy Silverstone test session and cracking a vertebra if memory serves, and 2) being in the same team as The Michael. Hell, Benetton even admitted after a few bad races on JJ's side that yes, the chassis he was using was indeed cracked. He was legit at least as fast as Michael when given equal machinery.

[@PEPSIMaxMusic]

Lehto also has his phenomenal performance in the 1989 Australian GP where he made it to 5th in his Onyx, fighting with the fastest man that race (Nakajima) before his car broke.

[@marklittle8805]

Gilles could make a shopping cart competitive. He was just a talent and his lapping ELEVEN seconds a lap faster than anyone else in the rain at Watkins Glen in the 312T5 in qualifying proved the man wasn't quite mortal when it came to driving in the rain

[@TwentyNinerR]

True rainmaster of his day

[@alecerdmann8505]

This video makes me think of IndyCar's "nearly" and "what-if" drivers. The two that immediately come to mind are Greg Moore, who is a bit like Gilles Villeneuve-massive talent, race winner, seemingly unlimited potential. Killed in a race at the age of 24. The other is Helio Castroneves - 4 time Indy 500 winner, 31 race wins, IMSA race winner and champion, but 4 2nd place and 3 3rd place finishes in the IndyCar championship.

[@mateusznoga41]

Well, Helio is very established though and unlike Ickx for example who also won a lot outside the main series of motorsport, Helio could be named among the greatest in history having this great number of the most important race won... Its like Ickx won Monaco 5 or 6 times so I'd say he did pretty well even though he never won the overall championship

[@alecerdmann8505]

@@mateusznoga41 Indeed, IndyCar is a bit different in that a very strong argument could be made that winning the Indy 500 is as prestigious or even more prestigious than winning the season championship. You have to go all the way down to the driver in 37th place for most IndyCar wins, Adrian Fernandez with 11, to find the driver with the most wins without winning the series championship or Indy 500. Fernandez had an unfortunate career for being an 11-time race winner. As noted, that is the most wins without either a Championship or Indy 500 win, it was a wheel off of his car that flew into the stands in Michigan and killed 3 spectators and he was the winner at Fontana in 1999 in the race where Greg Moore died.

[@mateusznoga41]

@@alecerdmann8505 Its surprising how some things connect and come around in Motorsport. But yeah maybe Fernandez suits more for what ifs category but tbf you could also put Danica Patrick in there from Indycar, what if she never went to Nascar and got into a good team maybe she would have won more than only one race

[@ChasingLamely]

I wouldn't say Helio is a "what if"; he's arguably among the most successful drivers in IndyCar history, and being on the top step of 500 winners alone puts him in the conversation for Brazil's second-greatest ever driver. Behind Senna, of course, but I'd argue four 500s is as impressive as anything Fittipaldi or Piquet ever did.

[@LowFatCurrantBun]

Saw the video title and began scrolling in search of this comment 👍. Moore was instantly quick when he joined IndyCar! 😲. I didn't see his Indy Lights career, but I know it was crazy 😵. He had great battles against Zanardi who was also a huge talent 🏆. ( Paul Tracy, -Gilles- Gil De Ferran and Michael Andretti were also up there too. ( I know F1 doesn't think much of Michael Andretti after '93, but he was a talent. But anyone using Andretti '93 to benchmark the quality of the drivers in the series as a whole should not do so in isolation of the efforts of Jacques Villeneuve '96-'97 📊. But I digress ) ). The fates that befell both Moore and Zanardi are very saddening 😢.

[@klepetar]

a little bit nobody talks about .. when gilles villeneuve started in formula one..his first race.. the 1977 british grand prix. ..it was for the Mclaren team.. and one of his teammates at that race.. Jochen Mass.. the driver of the car he hit at his fatal accident at Zolder.. !

[@The_BenboBaggins]

Lovely to see Slim Borgudd's Abba liveried ATS at the beginning there - drove me mad at times, working with him in the late 00s, early 10s - while success in F1 alluded him, he did have success in truck racing, which I always thought was pretty cool 😎

[@PeterJohnston42]

One who deserves his own "nearlyman" video is Bruce McLaren who dutifully shadowed Brabham in 1959 and 1960, then set up his own company before being sidetracked by CanAm, which his cars dominated. Quite a story.

[@newjerseywales]

I look forward to you making the follow up in say 20 years time. Who from this crop will be on the list. Lando and Charles are my predictions.

[@jimmyrecendiz4940]

Sir, you have been dropping banger after banger lately 🙏thank you for all your content

[@imbok]

I'll never forget the shock of seeing Gilles V's accident, broadcast on local Texas news as a 16 year old kid in 1982. I knew the sport was dangerous, but that short video put it right in front of your face.

[@stephenpointon]

Great Vid Aidan, If you want Mr. Bad luck, but talented you only have to look as far as Derek Warwick, Even Senna didn't want to have to race against him in comparative equipment. I remember him flipping his lotus on the first lap of I think it was the Italian GP and getting out and running down the pit lane to get to the spare car ...now that's commitment

[@AidanMillward]

Derek Warwick. The man who could have punched Schumacher and maybe changed history.

[@GregBrownsWorldORacing]

@@AidanMillward Should have!

[@MrSniperfox29]

Also remember Warwick turned down a move to Williams for 1985 because he felt staying with Renault was a better option. Renault then fell apart and Williams began dominating.

[@mrkipling2201]

The amount of times that Warwick was running in the top 3, in the 1984 season especially, only to have to retire with a car problem was ridiculous.

[@lestercombs1871]

It’s always a pleasure to hear your takes on F1.

[@FSX239]

I love story time.

[@GregBrownsWorldORacing]

Yeah, this was a particularly 👌 XLNT video I thought. He should be proud of this one...

[@themanwithsauce]

BMW as a brand in F1 belongs on here. They made killer engines, but constantly seemed to be fighting either reliability woes or the car that was built around these engines. The greatest irony being that they won "a championship" in F1 powering Piquet's Brabham but they didn't win constructor's. Oh well, what could;ve been....

[@martyndaly1539]

Great video as always. I've got a coupe that might seem outrageous given what they did manage to achieve in F1 but I'll mention them anyway... Johnny Herbert, if memory serves he was rumoured to be meeting with Ferrari before he smashed his legs up at Brands, still drove for Benetton but had Schumi as team mate and Flavio didn't like him. Martin Brundle, no race wins but he drove for Benetton and McLaren in the 90s... what if HE didn't smash his legs up and was still able to left foot brake. What if Schumi didn't go off at Spa and notice Brundles tyres were badly blistered and took the tyres that had been waiting for Brundle....

[@JamboP26]

What if's in motorsport are a fascinating subject. Like what if McLaren went for the Lamborghini engine for 1993, and it caused Senna to stay for 1994. Or what if Toyota's supposed 2010 F1 rocket ship got to race. It's weird to think how different the history of the sport could be with one different decision being taken

[@ChasingLamely]

Maybe an interesting idea for an offshoot for this, or relevant to this conversation... I always think David Coulthard is an interesting "what if" - as you said, he had a wonderful knack for the right place, wrong time, but very few people realise how wonderful a knack he had for this. DC shared the grid with 16 different world champions. He almost always finished in the top four in the championship and was almost always - except for Red Bull - the team-mate of one of those champions. In terms of "nearly men", I don't think anyone has ever come as consistently close to being in a position to win the championship and had the luck of the draw go against him. Especially when you think of the years he spent as #2 to Hill, Mansell and Hakkinen.

Just one thing that's not correct: the rally was called "Ronde di Andora", which is a third-fourth tier rally event in italy, a regional rally, where some crazy local can get to top 5 in a N group Clio. So it was basically a fun event he wanted to do to keep sharp before the new season. His ultimate goal was to be world champion in F1 and rally. Equally as "what if" is his career in WRC. He did amazingly, running the worst car of the lot, in privateer team he ran himself, and yet was leading rallies at the end of 2015 ahead of Ogiers and Neuville, winning stages. To get to this level in just 3 years was matched only by said Ogier. But then opportunities ran out, there were no second manufacturers' teams, no place for him to go really to develop. And from what I heard a couple of years ago in the rally insider scene, the moment a F1 comeback became a distant possibility, he shifted his focus 100% to that, dropping his rally activities altogether, which is a great shame. I really hope he'll do some more WRC rallies, as he's always absolutely brilliant to watch.

[@christianbelanger621]

In Rush, James Hunt mentions to the McLaren brass reluctant to hire him over Ickx that they'd never win a championship with him, True? As for Gilles, one can only imagine him racing against Senna, Prost and Mansell to salivate on what might have been titanic battles on the tracks.

[@garygup]

Yet another excellent and thought provoking video. The two drivers I always would have liked to have seen displaying their full potential in F1 are Belloff and Tommy Byrne...

[@Alnilam1973]

So happy to see Giles getting the recognition he deserves. He handed shekter the championship in 79 understanding he would be the no .1 after that and would have the support of his team mate, when pironi past him at imola, he felt betrayed, then Enzo did nothing for his "friend" happy with a 1-2 even though Didier had disobeyed orders. Legend says Giles was still in full on red mist when he got in the car on his last day. If anyone reads this and has t seen dijon 79 look it up, it's still the most impressive battle I have seen in any motorsport, the fact that that race is remembered for second place and not the manufacturers first win or indeed the first win for a turbo is a fitting tribute.

[@daleleslie1049]

Gilles had given his friendship to Pironi and this was betrayed several times. This should be a video on its own...a very long and intriguing story. Pironi destroyed his legs in German Grand Prix and never race F1 again, a few years later he died in an Off Shore Powerboat Race. To this day Pironi is a villain to most of Gilles Fans.

[@Alnilam1973]

@@daleleslie1049 I ain't one of those giles fans, these days, but there was a time when I was but I was only a child when it happened and Giles was a god to me. These days I see both of there stories as tragic, both could have been champions

[@ElliottNest39]

“Didn’t know what ‘slow down’ meant…” Good description.

[@TheEmm4lpha]

Personally, my biggest pet what if is Alessandro Nannini, he kind of feels like the 80s Kubica.

[@jimmyvande0233]

I reckon Nannini would've won at least a couple more races

[@chunterer]

@@jimmyvande0233 Agree he would have won races, but he was never a top liner. He was marking himself out as a strong number 2 when he has the accident,

[@wabba67]

Three of my personal "favourites" in this category are Gerhard Berger, Heinz-Harald Frentzen, and Olivier Panis. Berger was megaquick, but was against people like Senna and Mansell, and was just slightly a lower-tier driver - shining at times, but never managing to piece together a good championship season. Frentzen blew his chance with Williams only to then almost win the championship with Jordan. And Panis would've been in the title fight in 1997 (thanks to the Bridgestone tyres) without his accident in Canada.

[@jaybower1320]

Villenueve is, to this day, my favorite 'underrated' driver that I never got to watch. I was born a little too late to see him race but you can watch the video of his fatal accident on youtube. The camera work is shoddy, as you would expect for that time but it's got some gruesome detail in it.. Senna is still my favorite driver from any era not my own but man, Villenueve was a rocket

[@Hillbilly6548]

To build on what you said about Kubica, had he been able to make himself into what Verstappen is today (popularity wise), do you think it would of had much of an effect on the F1 landscape? Polish GP maybe?

[@mateusznoga41]

Polish GP pfff... It would have to be him like Idk winning 2 world champions for someone to invest in that. Thing is, our only proper racing track - Tor Poznań - is thrashed by the people who build their houses near and live there, they constantly complain and therefore there isn't many racing out there (I think its similar to what Brands Hatch had for a couple of years now). Realistically IF Polish GP was to happen it would probably have to be a built from ground up built either a normal track or street track. Although even with Kubica winning a championship or two I dont think there will be that much interests in Poland like in the Netherlands with Verstappen and therefore I doubt Orlen would be keen to fund such big project... Although who knows, unfortunetly (or not) it is only a what if story...

[@AidanMillward]

@@mateusznoga41 they’d have built a new one most likely. But they cram themselves into Zandvoort now, who knows?

[@mrkipling2201]

Villeneuve and Arnoux at the French GP in 1979 is insane. Wheel to wheel racing and no quarter given for 2 or 3 laps. It's brilliant. I've watched it many times.

[@alexcameron8724]

Jose Froilan Gonzalez - Nearly Man A gifted driver who was often overshadowed by his Argentine compatriot Juan Manuel Fangio; and had he competed in and won the 1951 Belgian Grand Prix, he would have been F1 world champion at the end of that season, even with the countback rule. Lorenzo Bandini - Nearly Man After John Surtees had a falling out with Ferrari at the Le Mans 24 Heures race in 1966 (a fallout which led him to quit the team with immediate effect), his teammate Lorenzo Bandini became Ferrari team leader just as he was starting to drive in the prime of his abilities. That same year, Bandini had lost victory in France and USA, both times whilst holding a big lead over the opposition. Factoring that with Ferrari's no-show in both Britain and in Mexico, and Bandini could have probably been a title contender that year. Roger Williamson - What If A 2-time British Formula 3 champion in 1971 and 1972, beating the likes of F1 world champions James Hunt and Jody Scheckter those years, Roger Williamson was a talent to be taken seriously throughout his racing career. But his life was taken far too soon in just his second ever F1 race in one of the sports most infamous crashes. His death effectively bought an end to Wheatcroft Racing after team owner Tom Wheatcroft started to lose interest, and slowly wound down the team's activities. Had the incident not happened, it's difficult to say how far Williamson could've gone, although there's no reason not to believe he would have one to watch throughout the 70s and 80s. Francois Cevert - What If Jackie Stewart had secretly planned to retire after the 1973 United States Grand Prix, leaving his prize student Francois Cevert to be team leader at Tyrrell from 1974 onwards. As we unfortunately all know however, the Frenchman attempted to take the 'Esses' combination in 3rd gear (as opposed to Stewart's suggested 4th) causing the car to crash violently and taking his life. Had Francois listened to his mentor's advice, I reckon he would have been a serious title contender in 1974; though this being the start of Tyrrell's slow but sure venture towards the back of the grid, it's difficult to say whether he would have been France's first F1 world champion that year, and even then whether he could find his way out before they became just another team on the grid. Michele Alboreto - Nearly Man Michele Alboreto was level on points with championship leader Alain Prost coming out the 1985 Austrian Grand Prix, but 4 mechanical DNFs right at the end of the season (5 if you count Italy) cost him the still ongoing shot of being Italy's first F1 world champion since Alberto Ascari in 1953. Jules Bianchi - What If Everyone is unfortunately aware of the horrifying incident that took Jules Bianchi's life in 2015, just as he was finding his stride in the pinnacle of motorsports. The Frenchman was lined up for a Sauber drive in 2015, before a potential move to Ferrari beckoned the following year. Were he alive today, I reckon the Bianchi-Ferrari combination could be Max Verstappen's closest championship threat in this era of F1 cars. Speaking of these 'What If?' drivers by the way, I really do hope the 'What IF1' series makes a return soon. I would love to hear a scenario where Gilles Villeneuve, Stefan Bellof and Jules Bianchi survived. Or even what if Robert Kubica didn't go rallying on 6 February 2011. On a non-driver front, I'd also love to see a scenario where Ferrari agrees to Ford's deal in 1963, and what if MasterCard Lola had been allowed to enter F1 in 1998.

[@66morningview]

I think if I had to pick one, you are spot on with Jacky Ickx. He isn't a 'what if?', like Villeneuve or Bellof whose careers were cut short. He undoubtably had the talent to win an F1 world championship, but for various reasons it didn't come together. He was up against unstoppable driver-car pairings in 1969 Stewart-Matra, 1970 Rindt-Lotus and 1971 Stewart-Tyrell. Then in 1972-73 Ferrari seemed to loose interest in F1 and the 312B was an ageing car. Finally the move to Lotus for 1974-75 was a case of right team wrong time, coinciding with a slump. After that good rides dried up and he didn't get to grip with the ground effect cars.

[@hexgraphica]

There could be a mathematical way to sort out the "title material" matter. We can pick a point threshold, like 60% of the champion's points, or 85% of the second's points, to get a rough idea of who was up there with the best, not just by the standing's position. Like in a race, the gap from the leader at the finish line tells more about the performance than the finish position alone

[@landiahillfarm6590]

Fun topic, so many many to choose from. You handled it well. I might have considered Montoya in the list. He went on to have a successful career in CART, NASCAR and IIRC a podium at LeMans and several wins in IMSA. He was crazy fast in F1 but never had the right car.

[@panvar8469]

My biggest and latest "what ifs" are Jean Alessi and Daniel Ricciardo... What would Alessi achieve in the early 90s with a properly organised Scuderia and a more reliable and competitive car? Even if there was Ayrton and McLaren and Mansell with Williams in that grid! And what would Daniel achieve if he wasnt simply getting dumped from RB for a young Dutch who was a little bit more interesting as a character bringing of course money and reality show elements for the first time in this sport...but EQUALLY fast! Daniel was and still is capable to win a title...he s not getting his chance simply because he s unlucky...

[@sspacegghost]

James Courtney - two time world karting champion....tested the F1 jaguar and crashed hard, it had issues, Schumaker pulled him out of the wreck. Courtney beat all that Alonso era drivers, and never got to F1. Being australian didnt have the money. Had the talent. Went on to race tin tops won a title but after a chopper incident in pit lane where an exhibition chopper whipped up wind and a pitboard hit him in the ribs - he was never as fast again. Plenty of non european drivers didnt get a shot at F1 and would have won races.

[@Spike-sk7ql]

My grandpa used to tell me that Gilles would definitely have been champion in 82, had he not died. All the way until 93, when he died, he said it. Watching all of his races, I agree with him.

[@chunterer]

One of the Ferrari's would have done. It was the best car in '82. GV may have had an even better chance in '83, had he stayed with them. But he might also have been in a McLaren instead!

[@lestercombs1871]

Francois Cevert would have been Champ in 74 had he lived.

[@weslittlereptilefamily3418]

Thanks for all your content! Love u buddy!

[@pawes4976]

17:05 its was not a rumour, Robert confirmed that he signed with Ferrari

[@jimiverson3085]

The result in 1958 was mostly a residual of the scoring system of the time. The baseline scoring was 8-6-4-3-2-1 for 1st-6th places, but there was an additional point for fastest lap. Hawthorne had a knack for combining a second place finish with a fasted lap. Moss won 4 races with one second place, and set fastest lap in 2 of his wins and in his DNF at the Nurburgring. Hawthorn won 1 race, finished second 5 times and set fastest lap in 4 of those finishes. That left Hawthorne with 42 points to 41 for Moss. For 1959, the FIA dropped the fastest lap point, arguably with the 1958 result in mind. Without that point, Moss and Hawthorne would have been tied at 38 points, with Moss being champion because first tie-breaker was number of race wins. It is also probably true that Ferrari's Dino V6 was more reliable than the Vanwall engine. Ferrari really deserves a fair amount of blame for Villeneuve's death. There is no way Villeneuve should have been thrown from the car if his belts were appropriately anchored.

[@terminateshere]

You're a true master at the art of procatalepsis. A word I wish many more people knew the meaning of, because it's so useful in online discourse.

[@AidanMillward]

Because I know how the average KZbin commenter thinks. It’s a big brain moment on my end. 😎

[@PrinceOfCats5]

What if Nick Heidfeld got the McLaren drive over Raikkonen or Alesi chose Williams instead of Ferrari?

[@TheRacingBoy1]

Great views on great drivers. Gilles Villeneuve, Jacky Ickx, Stefan Bellof, ... Always glad to hear your opinions. I've seen this rally crash on a compilation of Mr.M and got close to a heart attack. Motorsport is dangerous. Traffic too, keep in mind when you're driving on the road that even the best drivers can make mistakes, so don't push your luck

[@AidanMillward]

Six more inches and that pole is going through his head. Crazy.

[@Rhubba]

My 5 "what if" drivers: 1. Tony Brooks. Fantastic talent but put safety ahead of recklessness (a clever guy) to cost him a world championship. 2. Masten Gregory. Even Jim Clark looked up to him. Super quick but crashed a lot and had a penchant for jumping out of cars about to crash. 3. Ronnie Peterson. My first F1 hero...as a kid I had a Lotus 72 with a blue and yellow driver's helmet for my first Scalextric set. 4. Gerhard Berger. Great talent but didn't take racing seriously enough to win the title. 5. Juan Pablo Montoya. I so wanted him to dent Schumacher's supremacy in F1. It never quite happened but he was definitely in the hard charging, throw the car about school of Peterson, Villeneuve, Rosberg, Mansell and Alonso school.

[@ianwynne764]

Hello Aidan: It pains me to say this, however, I think Daniel Ricciardo should be on this list. Keep up the good work.

[@TwentyNinerR]

Ricciardo would've shine with RB-Honda. Red Bull's turbo hybrid Renault years were marred with reliability issues that pissed off the Milton Keynes outfit. Honda's stint with Red Bull is stellar, and I'd say that there would be a three-way rivalry between him, Lewis Hamilton, and Sebastian Vettel had he stayed just a little longer at Red Bull.

[@elonmusk9697]

Funny story about Bellofs Pflanzgarten high speed crash. He crashed at around 250 I believe and the car got airborne like the Mercs in Le Mans but he landed on his tyres again without making a looping. He hit the wall, the car was a complete wreck and stopped after 400 meters. Porsche had their people all around the track for taking the sector times and stuff. Bellof got out of that car and started giving autographs to the fans with a smile on his face. He sat there with the people and wouldn't stop giving autographs until the pit crew told the guys at the track to pull him out of there and bring him back to the garage. Bellof never really cared, he only wanted to have fun. Most naturally talented driver there has ever been...

[@pete5534]

Very well done. Thank you!

[@pettymike45]

You should do a video on Bertrand Fabi. Every article I've read on him has him compared to Senna as far as car control. Some even place him above Senna in that department, which is quite remarkable

[@chunterer]

That titanic FF2000 battle with Donnelly in 1985!! That was a hyper competitive season. Martin, and Johnny Herbert would both have achieved so much more in F1 had they not been so gravely injured in their crashes.

[@marcchan711]

IF is just F1 spelled backwards.... Lovely video Aidan! Keep 'em coming!

[@pauleaster5832]

No. It is OF

[@cas5447]

Another point in the Bellof-Ickx feud could be that Jacky was the Head Marshall at that 1984 Monaco GP and the one who took the decision to stop the race when it did. If Senna wasn't happy about that, I'm sure Bellof was neither.

[@alexgannon4139]

I love the random facts and info I learn from these videos

[@Bantercaptainxbox]

Aiden thanks for the long video. I've missed the long stuff

[@mgrzx3367]

You're absolutely right. I can't stand "reaction" videos either. Do I need someone telling their opinion of a song I already know I like. Great list and agree with you on these drivers.

[@Zero_Theory]

It's with mentioning that Rolt and his family disputed the story that Tony and Duncan were pissed whilst racing, something which Andrew Frankel discussed on the Intercooler podcast.

[@DankBoyy00]

I personally believe that had he not been in the crossfire of an accident in 1977, Tom Pryce would likely have been fighting for a title, the man from a little village in Wales was absolutely rapid and is a personal hero of mine

[@Coldwallbar]

Gilles reminds me of guitarist Randy Rhoads, believe they both lost their lives in SS of 82... both gems in their field

[@mrterp04]

Excellent video idea!

[@pete5534]

Fisichella is among my all time favourite drivers, he was very well regarded by his peers too. Robert Kubica was mad rapid.

[@Tacko14]

Two minutes in and I already learned a thing. Or rather: oh, yeah. Forgot that… ABBA sponsoring on the ATS. That happened

[@philipbain]

re. Stefan Bellof at Monaco in 1984, in the wet he had an inherant advantage over the likes of the Toleman & McLaren with the instant and more controllable torque of the naturally aspirated Cosworth DFY V8, a lighter car thanks to Tyrell being able to build their car to a minimum weight limit and the less thirsty nature of the Cosworth vs the turbocharged opposition meaning that he could carry less fuel and the biggest advantage that no one ever seems to mention - the Goodyear tyres which by 1984 were the thing to have in the wet, even if in the dry the Michelins were faster for longer. So weighing all this up it shouldn't be too shocking that in the awful conditions on that day that Beloff was able to out pace those ahead of him. If the race continued both Senna and Prost probably would have retired and probably would have been passed by Beloff before doing so!

[@jsquared1013]

Also, the extra weight advantage of the illegal Tyrrell lead-shot system.

[@Edelweiss1102]

Man there are so many drivers who were fast/had potential but had their careers cut short or were never quite at the right place at the right time. Cevert, Nannini, Peterso, de Angelis, Berger, Alesi, Herbert, Montoya, the list goes on. Belof and Gilles are probably the two who would have had the most potential. Another angle is to look at drivers who were successful put probably could have achieved more. Clark comes to mind for this, regarded by many as the most complete and fastest driver of his time, could have dominated a generation. What could the Ascaris, Rindts or Sennas have archieved if we didn't lose them early. Heck even someone like Prost with his 4 titles. His Renault days were cut short by unreliability. He lost 1984 due to half a point of that infamous Monaco GP. He had more Points than Senna in 1988. He had a contract with Williams for 1994. He easily could have been a 6-7 times WC.

[@TwentyNinerR]

About Bob Kubica, I think if he didn't crash at that rally in Andorra, he'd be on the same caliber as Daniel Ricciardo in his Red Bull days for being a race winner every now and again.

[@mateusznoga41]

I immediatly thought about a lesser known driver - Elio De Angelis, had massive potential, was basically the best driver I think in 1984 if you exclude the dominant Mclarens... Killed in 1986... And I think same could be said for Francois Cevert mentioned in the vid, also only started to come out as a shining star of the sport, killed at the glen in just his (correct me if Im wrong) 2nd proper season...

[@mafiousbj]

Fun fact: There seems to be a new documentary about F1 doing the rounds online in which Ecclestone admits the 81 Championship was "handed" to Piquet because he was in his team. How or why it happened I don't know since I haven't watched, but apparently it's Bernie himself telling the story and apologizing to the late Reutemann. I doubt this will amount to anything other than tarnishing Piquet's (and Bernie's) reputation a bit more.

[@Rhubba]

Reutemann self-destructed his season in the latter half of 1981. His feuding with Jones, his grumpiness with the Williams team and his lacklustre performance in the last race of the season cost him the title. He never seemed settled in any team, always feuding with teammates and managers.

[@williamford9564]

This did NOT" take up too much of my time". This was a GREAT video.

[@MWPompert]

Ickx was indeed a superb driver, especially at the Notdschleife, which is maybe one reason he didn’t like Bellof, as by the time he came around he was faster and more daring than he was. In 1967 Jacky was driving an F2 car round the Nordschleife GP, and F2 cars were in the same race as F1 in those days to boost the field size for such a long track. Amazingly only Jim Clark in his Lotus 49 was faster than him, all the other F1 car drivers couldnt beat Jacky in qualifying! The F2 grid had to start behind the f1 field however but in the race Jacky soon caught up with the 4-6th place battle, until bent suspension from flying so much put him out of the race. Sure showed just how quick he was!

[@AidanMillward]

Think Bellof reminded Jacky of how he used to be. ickx was very against Stewart’s safety measures but then went and did the Le Mans walk of protest. Maybe he thought bellof was going to get himself and/or someone else killed.

[@adambrush5445]

For me Stefan Belof is the biggest what if by a wide margin.

[@SamuelSantos_]

With his pace Bellof would have theoretically won in Monaco... But then it would've been taken away after Tyrell were DQ'd. With Senna's suspension issues and Prost's brake issues, the winner in the end would've been Rene Arnoux.

[@NCCoder]

There's a great little documentary about the rivalry between Senna and Martin Brundle in F3. I wonder if Brundle had ever been able to secure a better ride in F1 how that might have turned out.

[@AidanMillward]

Brundle got held back in F1 injury. Smashed his ankles in and wasn't able to brake as hard as anyone else.

[@thomasnieswandt8805]

A few years back, there was a very good, german documentary about Bellof and his crash at Spa. His girlfriend talked about the theories that came up over the years and people still blaiming Ickx. She said (meaning not word for word) "Stefan was an energetic racer, always happy, always funny before a race, but not that day. He was strange, alost apathatic, something was wong..... People always blaim Ickx, i never did. It was something between these two, what happend? We will never know, only they do.... it was a racig accident" Jochen Maas, Bellofs Teammate also said. "All sorts of people claim to know what happened. I was there, i drove that car. That manouver, that car, that corner.... it couldnt work, but who is to blaim? Both or neither...it was just tragic"

[@PEPSIMaxMusic]

I'd put De Ceseris as my big what if. In his later years, he was less crashy and usually out performed his woeful machinery (4th in a Rial!) but never got a top drive. His 91 campaign was good as he was 9th overall in a Jordan.

[@wharris123184]

A Rebecca from WatchMojo reference. Nice. As always, I will click like. I’m not new around here, so I’m subbed. 👍🏾👍🏾

[@No-ty4um]

Here's my 2 favorite F1 what if's: 1. What if Jean Alesi did sign that contract with Williams in 1991. 2. If Ayrton Senna never died, how would Bruno Senna's F1 Career turn out?

[@TwentyNinerR]

A response to #2: people might've compared him to his legendary uncle, much like Mick Schumacher to his dad today.

[@ChasingLamely]

@@TwentyNinerR to be fair, people did compare him to his uncle, and that probably cost him a longer F1 career than he got. Bruno wasn't on Ayrton's level, but he was certainly better than a lot of the drivers who kept their seats when he lost his.

[@steelin666]

While being Polish may make me partial on the topic, it also makes me more informed and able to offer some additional insight. In my opinion, Robert Kubica is still the same brilliant driver he used to be, though admittedly more matured and less reckless, which may make him avoid risks he would've took before the accident, which may not be the most desirable and effective approach in Formula 1. His season in Williams is hardly a good gauge of his performance. The team was struggling to put the cars together, to the point they missed the first two days of pre-season testing. Then, after the season started, amidst the reported issues with production process in the factory, Williams' chief technician Paddy Lowe effectively resigned. The team was on the brink of bankrupcy. It was probably the worst team on the grid of Formula 1 in the recent years. Considering all those circumstances, is it that unlikely that they may have produced two slightly different cars? That out of two terrible parts from the factory, one was slightly less terrible, and one was slightly more? And that a backmarker team like Williams would maximize their points potential by putting all the better parts in one car, and that it may not have been the car #88, but the car #63, driven by a promising British driver, a protege of Williams' engine provider and their former co-owner? So there's that, and I'll let everybody make their own judgement. But regardless, when it came to put up or shut up, it was still Robert Kubica who came out on top and took that single point for Williams. Driving a car with less downforce than his competitiors, in extremely tricky conditions, with a supposed predicament of his right hand, he prevailed and drove it home, while his less rusty rivals ended up in walls, and his team mate lost position to him due to a spin. His other stand out performances were Monaco, where he was unfortunately spun out by Giovinazzi, and had a very solid race before that, and Singapore, where he was on pace with the rest of the field and even overtook Magnussen fair and square, something Williams FW42 normally didn't allow for. In short, the more depended on the driver and less on the car, the better Kubica performed. And specifically on tracks, where there were the most doubts about his ability to do so. Then he went to Alfa Romeo in 2020 and took part in preseason tests, recording the fastest lap among Alfa Romeo drivers, and 12th overall among 21 drivers participating, despite running three-four times less laps than the rest of the drivers. Obviously not a definitive proof of his superiority over Raikkonen and Giovinazzi, but definitely a proof of potential that never got showcased in Williams. And even comparing the onboard from that lap, which is available on KZbin, with onboards from 2019, you can see how smooth and confident he was in Alfa's car, and how many corrections he needed to make to keep that Williams driving where it was supposed to. Surely a case of a good driver not being handed the right tools, if you ask me, not formerly good driver not being his former self anymore. Unfortunately, every month after that meant more rust back on Robert, and less opportunity to showcase his good form in an F1 car. Robert is now taking next steps in endurance racing, and won a class podium in 2022 24h Le Mans with Prema, despite their car not being on pace with the top of the field for the whole season, proving his killer instinct, one that allows him to take advantage of rare opportunties when they present themselves and get most of the package, is still there. As I said, I may be partial on the topic, but I think it's a huge shame that Formula 1 snubbed Bobby after one unfortunate season. If you got to this point, I have to thank you for reading this long-ass comment. I hope I put some new light on Robert and his performance after coming back to F1.

[@chunterer]

If I may Aidan, i'd like to suggest a few more standout examples (imho). some have already been mentioned and rightly so: GV Greg Moore Tom Pryce Tony Brise Mike Thackwell Johnny Herbert Martin Donnelly Thomas Danielsson Jason Watt Gonzalo Rodriguez JJ Lehto (if he hadn't broken his neck pre season '94) Alex Zanardi (if he had the backing to carry on after '94) Stefano Modena Allan McNish (the '91/92 illness took the stuffing out of him) Marco Apiceella Paul Warwick Rickard Rydell Eduar Merhy Neto Etienne van der Linde Sam Hornish Jnr Big list but worth delving into!

[@brad6630]

Nigel tells a great story about a comment Stirling Moss made to him about being a bridesmaid. After Hungary 92 Nigel mentioned he'd passed the bridesmaid tag back to him and Moss said something back that was unrepeatable!

[@EddieVanAidan]

Ah yes, WRC2 World Champion Robert Kubica. Pretty sure he had an Lmp2 class victory at Le Mans sewn up until he broke down on the last lap. Gutting his F1 career ended the way it did

[@benlowes8570]

I think the ultimate nearly man in motorsports is Mark Martin. A nascar driver who only needed a couple results going in the other direction to be a 5 time champion. He’s thought of as good but not great because of the no titles issue but man it’s close

[@harrymcsherry5272]

Great video Aidan all of these drivers deserved more in F1 in particular Bellof we were robbed of a Senna Bellof era which could have been even more chaos than Prost and Senna that man had just as much potential as Senna he didn't see the point of using the brakes different breed of racer

[@Durbanite2010]

There have been so many "what if" drivers. You could add these guys to the list: Ronnie Petersen, Rubens Barrichello (pre-1994 Imola he was different), Juan Pablo Montoya, Giancarlo Fisichella, Michele Alboreto (he was SO close in 1985, easily the fastest car but no reliability in the last 4 races of that season), Chris Amon, Didier Pironi, Francois Cevert, Peter Collins,, Tony Brooks (guy finished 10 out of his 39 starts on the podium), Bruce McLaren, Dan Gurney, Lorenzo Bandini, the Rodriguez Brothers, Jo Siffert, Clay Regazzoni, Jean-Pierre Beltoise, Peter Revson, Tom Pryce, John Watson...

[@richardyorke9055]

Johnny Herbert without the f3000 smash

[@chunterer]

No doubt at all...

[@iixxNJxiii]

Another great video but I would add Jules Bianchi to the list aswell.

[@ChasingLamely]

I don't think we saw enough of Jules to put him on this list, personally. He had the soothsayers predicting big things for him, but without seeing him in competitive machinery, we'll never truly know. He could've been great... He could've been Jarno Trulli.

[@minibus9]

great video, to what if drivers in my view are Jules Bianchi and Francios Cervert

[@mostlymotiongraphics2134]

I think Jeremy Clarkson being a big fan of Gilles is the only bad thing I've ever heard about him. Apart from possibly not being as sympathetic to the machinery as he should've been (which is debatable as a "bad" thing)

[@PuncakeLena]

RIP Slim Borgudd Sidenote: HHF is someone I have on my list as a nearly man due to his performance at Jordan in 99

[@hugoagogo9435]

I’ve always thought Jean Alesi was an underachiever for his talent. Ok he was temperamental which probably contributed to under achieving but still that first race in 1990 when he took on Senna. I was sure we were looking at thee next bright young thing. But that brightens dulled down despite being still there

[@chunterer]

The driver generation Alesi came through with was mega strong in both F3 and then F3000. Great days.

[@jl4859]

Looking good my guy

[@FSBMateus]

To me felipe massa is also one of the what ifs in f1, since he had a real chance at winning in both 2007 and 2008

[@jamesharrison3537]

Coulthard also had a spell at Williams, if I recall correctly for two years where Williams did't win the drivers title but with the two years either side being won by Mansell, Prost, Hill and Villeneuve. They should really have won one of those years, but sadly Coulthard didn't get a full season and was probably a bit surprised to get the seat in the first. And I don't know what was added to German Weetabix in 1995, but it must have been good.