The Risk of Rescue: Conrad Anker, Tim Auger, Valeri Babanov and Barry Blanchard

[@user-cc5od3zk4p]

RIP Tim Auger. The gentleman climber.

[@pegahghavami8062]

He is a legend. Both him and Ed.

[@theredrover3217]

Quite unexpected, fascinating discussion. Been on both sides of the rescue and high risk equations. Excellent presentation of the complexity of the issue. 👍 And the humor, soooooo apt.

[@Smokey66s]

“Willing to accept the consequences” well said Conrad!

[@loganharwell420]

Conrad is such a bad dude. I love watching his climbs, so much skill.

[@ghosttowntomato]

So true-- still makes me sad to know David Lama somehow managed to save Conrad's life, but ended up losing his own at such a young age in Banff (which, ironically enough, is where this talk takes place!!!)

[@susanappleby2414]

@@ghosttowntomato I will never forget David Lama. What a tragedy.

[@quivalla]

Would be great if they had a Sherpa involved in these type of Discussions.

[@PetraKann]

Perceived Slaves are often written out of the history books. When people are asked who climbed Mount Everest first, they either say Edmond Hillary or “I dont know”. Only a tiny fraction of people know that Hillary was not alone when he reached the summit of Everest in 1953. Tenzing Norgay also reached the summit of Everest with Hillary on that day in 1953 - a Sherpa from Nepal.

[@annohalloran6020]

Wouldn’t even occur to them.

[@washedupwarvet2027]

Same comment every video

[@nigeljones7]

Great point

[@warshipsatin8764]

​@@washedupwarvet2027 virtue signaling

[@skullsaintdead]

Wow Conrad likes Nine Inch Nails. Even more respect dude. And Barry with Joy Division, nice. Barry makes a good point though: if you have the choice between keeping your pride or keeping your life, you will keep your life. If you don't and choose your pride, then no matter what your doing, you're a dead man walking.

[@RomeoEdward]

Although I am not a climber but more of an adventure seeker. I remember a quote I heard years ago by a famous world class climber. ‘The definition of ‘True Adventure’ is when the outcome is not known’ I have always believed this statement. When rescue is an option, you are not experiencing ‘True Adventure’.

[@LinusWilson]

Humar died in 2009 a few years after this talk. RIP. He was an adventurer. “October 2006: Baruntse (7129 m), W face of SE ridge, solo 28. October 2007: Annapurna (8091 m), S face, new route, solo climb (ca.) 8. November 2009: Langtang Lirung (7227 m), S face solo attempt, died during descent”

[@bongofury333]

Was Humar invited to this talk?

[@ghosttowntomato]

Wow, wow, wow. Listening to Barry's accident on Howse Peak is so heartbreaking-- that exact situation probably occurred to Roskelley, Hansjorg Auer and David Lama, but they didn't have an intact cable to hook them to the mountain

[@christafox13]

Mountaineering is such an individual and mental sport. Everyone has their own reasons. If someone needs and wants to be rescued, let them as long as we weigh the risk to the rescuers as well. If you don’t want to be rescued and want to do the sport knowing the consequences, by all means do so. You set your own rules (whether you bring oxygen or not, diet, choice of gear, etc.) so you can choose to eliminate rescue as an option. But to take that away from others, who may have different beliefs and reasons for mountaineering is just wrong. Not too long ago, we didn’t even have oxygen masks, or stimulant drugs, or the modern equipment we have now. Each time technology advanced, mountaineering became safer and more accessible. If helicopters can safely rescue people higher than before, thats just another advancement. Mountaineers and rock climbers set their own limitations and difficulty level. If you want to do Everest solo without oxygen and set that you don’t want help or aid no matter what, go for it. If you’re tempted by the option of safety, then maybe you need to strengthen your willpower

[@Felipe_Ribeir0]

For me, the discussion is really about "how mainstream mountaineering is getting?". The old mountaineers like to be like "we are few people in the world which can do that". The real thing is more about their egos than about other people lifes.

[@_eliteblazin8765]

bravo!

[@SolaceEasy]

A life without risk is not a life well lived. A life with too much risk is short or tortuous.

[@Longtack55]

Helicopter rescue anywhere is weather-dependant. It's not 24/7/365. In NZ a few years ago it was suspected that a personal locator beacon (PLB) activation, and chopper extraction of an "injured" hiker, was due entirely to the possibility of the party missing their international flight. I conclude that some adventurers factor Rescue into the formula, and that is wrong. I have been adventuresome for 50+ years and no longer climb beyond my ability. In the 60s I recall rescuers dying in NZs alps while aiding weather forecast deniers.

[@davecarsley8773]

There's a lot of pretty silly comments here being made by selfish men (or at least men saying selfish things in this conversation). The whole idea of "It's a shame that technology is enabling more mountain rescues because I felt a greater sense of adventure and accomplishment when I got _myself_ out of my bed situation instead of calling for rescue" are the extremely foolish words of someone who has never actually _needed_ rescue. The bottom line is that if you got yourself out, then you never needed a rescue in the first place. Rescue is only for those who *cannot* get themselves out-- not with any amount of determination, blood, sweat, testosterone, ingenuity or "can do attitude". So the reason you've never called for a rescue isn't because you have some special alpine spirit of adventure. It's because you never _needed_ it. To say that rescue shouldn't be available for those who actually _do_ need it just because knowing that rescue is possible will "harm your sense of adventure" is to spit in the faces of wives who won't be able to pay their bills when their husband is dead instead of being rescued, and the children who won't have a father to coach their little league teams like their friends have. Nope, their dad will never see a single one of their accomplishments because we stopped the progression of rescue technology so the men on this stage could preserve the "sense of adventure" on their camping trips with their buddies. By the way, don't use the whole _"Well we have a responsibility to not put rescue personnel in danger"_ nonsense as an excuse for your selfish choices. I _am_ that rescue personnel, and me and my coworkers have already made the choice to put our lives on the line to save others whether _you_ call us or not. We certainly don't do it for the money -- most of us could make more on any local construction site. We do it because we _want_ to, and because we've discussed it with our families, and _they_ want us to. So don't use our safety as an excuse. Most of us who get hurt or killed will do so in training anyway, not in actual rescues.

[@nb6175]

Right. I was surprised that Conrad took that position. If he were serious he would inform search and rescue in advance and do the equivalent of 'do not resuscitate'. But I doubt he would go that far because the truth is, I don't think he even likes to think about it. Case in point, his last unsuccessful attempt at Meru, he never even thought that being out of Sat-phone contact would be a problem if they were late. That his wife had to beg him to have a radio relay at base camp says a lot about the amount of thought he actually puts into this issue, beyond feelings and machismo.

[@shahbazbangash9896]

Spot on my man!! Couldn’t have said it any better.

[@meaningfulsongspoetry6269]

2021 will be completion of 100 yrs since man stepped on 8000mtr mountain ; to start climbing journey!!!☺️

[@thelonegunman59]

Humans were climbing mountains long before 100 years ago....

[@JayB2]

Let's say someone takes some big risks & ignores others advice about climbing. If that person ends up calling for a rescue they should at LEAST be required to pay for the gas. That could actually be a big punishment. Most helicopters burn about 60-110 gallons per hour & an extra powerful one can burn 200 gph or more. But yeah the person should face some sort of punishment for risking the rescuers lives when they come to save them.

[@listrahtes]

Its like they made up a plan if you can tell something in 10 words why dont tell it in 1000 words. Its nice and funny but also strange how out of focus a lot seems. Doesnt help that Babanov has atrocious english even for a short time foreigner in the country. Its still very interesting but rarely are the answers focused on the question and a lot of rambling. Anker seems the only one willing to answer on point

[@RodrigoOliveira-gx8fp]

When you call a recue you put a lot of people in danger. Rescue must be the ultimate option. And most importnt, people who go to the wilderness MUST be prepare to do so. You wanna be a tourist? Go to Disney and resorts, not to the mountains!

[@frenchfree]

I know all the guys on the panel, just for clarity. On Logan in 1978 on a big face first ascent we chose not to take radios. No chance of rescue, that was our choice.

[@tombstone4986]

Valeri is old school badass! (all these guys are)

[@edmccaffrey1]

I became an alpinist because I understood that rescue was never an option. That kept weekend climbers and tourists from going. I prefer living out of bounds where rescue is not an option, as it keeps people out of that area where they should not be anyway.

[@DrPommels]

unfortunately it doesn't keep them out at all....

[@dianamincher6479]

Immaturity!

[@kevinbrooks1104]

If someone one is dying, I'm all for rescue, no one can say you don't have the right to follow your dreams, put away the pride accept the help if needed and prepare as if nobody is coming

[@CalopsitaVanderbilt1911]

9 months later, Mount Everest: David Sharp was left for death. R.I.P.

[@alanluscombe8a553]

David was not purposely abandoned. He chose to go alone wothout a radio or anything to a summit attempt late in the day. Conrad says himself you must accept the concequences, that applies to david. Im not saying some of the first people who saw him should not have tried but its not on anyone but david in the end

[@pizzafrenzyman]

#1 rule to hiking: Let someone know where you are going and when you will be back.

[@danmaltby3271]

Wonder how Anker feels about rescue when he needed one for his heart attack, I’m all for rescue as technology progresses.

[@ghosttowntomato]

but his rescue was primarily conducted by personal climbing partner-- wasn't asking for rescuers to scale mountain or fly up in horrid conditions.

[@ljslater1]

climbing in the Himalaya 6500 m Helicopter's Don't work very we 2015 I was climbing I was at Camp Two on Mount Everest Luckily for me I return to base camp .Before The earthquake/Avalanche And even more likely for me I survived. That earthquake/Avalanche I spent. The next couple days Watching Helicopters Rescuing people From Camp One. If you've ever cut the grass In Your garden When it's really too long And Your lawnmower struggles This is the sound of a Engine Helicopter Trying to reach That altitude The last place I'd want to be Is on that helicopter. One other point Insurance does not cover That type of rescue You have to pay In US dollars. And you have to pay whatever they ask.

[@l.tallmadge6536]

Sherpas...a gift from God. Also, we are not the only species that rescue, whales do. They are the stewards of the ocean.

[@oughtssought1198]

11:00. "you had mentioned Barry that we're the only species that does" rescues maybe I'm too gullible for the age of photo editing; but one of my favorite youtube features is video collections of animals rescuing animals of other species from predators or desperate situations no particular significance to the point with respect to the value of this conversation I look forward to but many other species rescue family members anf friends from danger 22:40. "success and failure, what stupid terms, all life happens in here" we have so many pairs of these binary either/or judgment adjectives we argue & choose sides over those good vs bad and success vs failure judgment adjectives are empty end points life lives in the analog line segment between, always a mix of both, never the abstract empty end point

[@frowningangel3730]

A sad event actually. The thought of no rescue has kept a significant number of the unqualified out of the mountains. The thought of death can be a fairly strong persuader. Now the buffoons know that they may have a way out and many of the previously deterred will flock to places where they don't belong.

[@badnews9312]

so true.....I totally agree with Conrad.....part of the allure of the mountains and alpine climbing for me, even though I was only really active in the Canada Rockies, was the idea of getting to the top and back being totally up to me and my partner and the collection of knowledge the two of us shared. However, I was rescued once, by Tim Auger actually. He basically saved my life after I foolishly tried to solo a Banff area ice climb during a high-pressure system, minus fifty degrees celcius that day, boilerplate ice which exploded every time I tried to find purchase fo my axe . When resting, just prior to the crux pitch, I dropped my only rope foolishly untieing it from my harness for just one moment...I clipped into a bolt anchor and hung there for the next 12 hours until Tim made it to me.....I was so ashamed and so embarrassed by my stupidity that I almost wish I was dead....they transferred me to hospital in Banff where when my plastic Scarpa boats were removed, two completely black stumps starred me in the face - I thought for sure, as did the doctors, that infection and subsequent amputation was a strong likelihood - fortunately after a month on crutches and minimal blistering, I survived with both feet intact - It took a long time to live that foolish experience down among my friends in the tight knit climbing community of the Bow Valley

[@3vimages471]

Who are you to say who belongs where? Just because someone is inexperienced doesn't necessarily make them a buffoon. Edmund Hillary was the same; acting like he owned the Kumbu and no one who wasn't a renowned climber should ever be there. Well I trekked to Everest Base Camp and I am sure I was every bit as appreciative of the high mountains as you are. Clients who pay to climb with guides have to prove some level of experience ….. so indeed who are the buffoons? Perhaps the pompous twats who think they are special?

[@Felipe_Ribeir0]

Frowning Angel well, if this type of person are going there to die, let them die. For me, this discussion is really about "how mainstream mountaineering is getting?". The old mountaineers like to be like "we are few people in the world which can do that".

[@kenadams5504]

If people didnt go where they shouldnt have , Neantherthal man would still be gazing at the hill across from his cave wondering whats on the other side of it. Yes , commercialising climbing to the point where idiots are attempting things they are qualified for should be discouraged , but not at the expense of the spirit of adventure.

[@taidelek9994]

Unless you don't have a basic foundation of moral and ethics. The sky is the limit.

[@annohalloran6020]

I was over forty doing labor in a hot tub with no drugs. Just breathing and a Doula and positive thought. Then a nurse snuck in when the Doula slipped out and offered me a big dripping shot of Demerol. It took me more than an hour to get my head right again and enter my zone. Luckily my Doula talked me through. The temptation of ending the pain was more debilitating than any of the contractions. I made it through drug-free but that helping hand of rescue almost did us in.

[@badmanprimorski]

Is it "macho" to die?

[@terranrepublic7023]

A boat a boat a boat a boat a boat a boat a boat a boat a boat

[@ptanyuh]

They should waive their right to be rescued. Putting SAR lives at risk for your own narcissistic pursuits is disgusting.

[@kenginger8051]

Sorry, these guys have lost touch with reality. Rescue, good. Dying, bad

[@brianshaw2914]

climbers are the only group that leaves their friends to die....

[@stevereed8786]

Notice these guys always tell the same great stories about the dangers, the struggle , the drama of the "Death Zoooooooone". They say the air is so thin it effects the memory but they manage to remember the most minute detail and ever word said. They also love talking about the dead carcasses left and they speak extensively on this topic until we are all sick of it. It painfully obvious listening to these Rambo self motivators that they love the fact there are bodies that remain on this mountain.

[@holyfox94]

Steve Reed Hard to admit, but aren’t we too? We that we watch all those high altitude, adventure documentaries?

[@31415926535equalspi]

While a very interesting discussion, these men should think about Nims Purja when saying blanket stereotypical things like “indigenous people think it’s a waste of time and money.” (Everyone should see 14 Peaks movie!) Such hubris, ignorance, and arrogance is also reflected in the comment that one can just “use a porter”. These issues are much more nuanced and deserve acknowledgment. Tenzing Norgay, the Sherpa and other indigenous people are the reason Edmund Hillary and many other Western mountaineers ever made it to Chomolungma (Tibetan name for Everest).