Another battery master class by the Master Of Battery Education. Thanks Jordon!
@SparkySho3 ай бұрын
MASTER. !!! MASTER. !!!
@gridcoregilry6663 ай бұрын
you are a gem of the Tesla community (and my investment thesis haha)
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
🤠✊🏼 You're most welcome man! I'm glad the information is useful
@WarrenRedlich3 ай бұрын
Thanks Jordan. Another great one.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Thanks for watching Warren! 🤠✊🏼
@vaclavmatousek30073 ай бұрын
Jordan, as usual, tons of quality info! Your Patreon is well deserved!
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Thanks buddy! 🤠
@josephvanorden37823 ай бұрын
Professional and well done!
@GOVAUS13 ай бұрын
Just excellent. I wish more people would strive to watch this kind of content. I keep dreaming.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Me too! 😁
@iandavies48533 ай бұрын
Totally. It keeps our expectations grounded to incremental tiny improvements vs next miracle unobtanium others might promote. There’s so much we can’t see like the manufacturing machinery.
@kevinrey94273 ай бұрын
Thanks so much for the continued high quality research you provide!
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Sure thing man!
@chilzone9663 ай бұрын
Great job Jordan. Sustainable development is important. You might want to consider annually the recyclable are the packs and companies, country and newest efforts in furthering sustainable development.
@xjdisuehd3 ай бұрын
One implicit result of this analysis, is that as soon as cells reach production capacity for enough cybertrucks and have excess production, we can start to see Model Y's and then later Model 3's with these cells. Maybe the Model Y refresh will be with these cells.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
I hope so!
@ftivolle3 ай бұрын
Impressive work! Glad to know that the 4680 is now a NMC955. Off topic, would you know if an LFP 4680 would make sense? Lower energy density and lower cost but the 4680 format would allow for better thermal management.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
I think an lfp 4680 vehicles makes sense for a number of reasons Primarily because it would lower Tesla's cogs With that said, I don't think Tesla's going to be making an lfp 4680 anytime soon. They still have to get the nickel lines up and running Note: An LFP 4680 doesn't make sense for grid storage where larger cells make more sense
@ftivolle3 ай бұрын
@@thelimitingfactor totally with you on the grid LFP where prismatic is good enough.
@l33tLX3 ай бұрын
Wouldn’t it be nmc 9.5.5?
@iandavies48533 ай бұрын
@@l33tLXexactly. But it’s shorthand for industry insiders. Could also go 90/5/5 as a way more descriptive form.
@georgepelton56453 ай бұрын
@@thelimitingfactor Do you really think the 4680 form factor is the right cell size for LFP used in EV packs? Elon and Drew have made comments about 4680 not being right for LFP due to "physics" in past quarterly conference calls. They may be referring to the voltage vs. SOC curve for LFP. The flat curve may be a problem for cells connected in parallel, vs. one larger cell. The voltage of the parallel cells will be the same, but the SOC may not. Most LFP packs for EVs use large cells connected in series (only), instead of cell groups connected in parallel-series. This might be the reason.
@JosueC7303 ай бұрын
It's exciting to see how this tech keeps evolving and giving more possibilities. It's truly amazing to think that this was just theory a few years ago and now it's happening for real. It certainly took a long time to develop, but we are seeing results and that's wonderful.
@budgetaudiophilelife-long54613 ай бұрын
🙋♂️THANKS JORDAN AND YOUR SUPPORTERS,EVERYONE ELSE 🤗💚💚💚
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
✊🤠
@mattheweaton14203 ай бұрын
This is great insight into the 4680 project.
@longmuskox41943 ай бұрын
You're awesome, Jordan!
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Thanks man!😊
@keithnance42093 ай бұрын
Great teamwork Jordan et al! 🙏🏽🤙🏽
@tommckinney14893 ай бұрын
Thanks man. I was confused at first about the thinner anode/cathode and higher energy density, then I realized the thinner can allows more volume for the battery. Sometimes I'm a step or two behind, but I eventually catch up.....
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Yeah, I probably could have called that out specifically, it's not immediately obvious 🤠
@NicholasShanks3 ай бұрын
@@thelimitingfactor"For those of you who are a bit slow, that means more space in the middle." :-)
@TheDanishSpaceman3 ай бұрын
Great work Jordan! Thank you 🙌
@johso873 ай бұрын
Utmost respect for your dedication, to all of you
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
✊
@dustinabele3 ай бұрын
Great analysis as always! I'm really excited to see Tesla making strides with their high nickel cathodes. This shift will not only help with performance but also with sustainability and supply chain challenges. Can't wait to see how this tech evolves!
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Yes! It's a big relief to see them making such great strides
@maxbuc124 күн бұрын
Grazie.
@chrisfrandsen3 ай бұрын
Thanks!
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Sure thing buddy!
@alex1357893 ай бұрын
Great info. Thanks for sharing.
@helmutshotthesheriff19423 ай бұрын
What a team work ❤👍 👍 👍
@RWBHere2 ай бұрын
Around 09:30 - Another consideration is that, if you limit Cathode capacity, and allow a small excess in Anode capacity, that will reduce the risk of Anode plating significantly, and should improve cycle life.
@noisypl3 ай бұрын
FYI: I came here to watch your video, because you got an awesome endorsement for this video from Electrified channel ;)
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Awesome! Dillon is a great guy. Thanks for stopping by!
@Marcin_Kwidzinski3 ай бұрын
Asymmetric lamination is already in use. Take a look at SEM images of electrodes in Figure 10. (b) and (d) of "Lithium-Ion Cells in Automotive Application: Tesla 4680 Cylindrical Cell Teardown and Characterization" (better quality in supplementary material)
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
It's not. I looked into it. It looks like it, but it's not.
@avivofir74323 ай бұрын
When the can wall thickness is reduced by 3mm, not only does the can weigh less, but one can also add a more jelly roll in the same can outer diameter (inner diameter is now 6mm larger). This should be taken into account, especially since the total length of the jelly roll scales roughly as r^2, i.e. small increase in inner diameter will result in a large impact on the total length of the jelly roll.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
That was taken into account
@charlescole-p9v3 ай бұрын
Nobody does it better than You ! By a HUGE margin .
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Thanks man!
@MrFoxRobert3 ай бұрын
Thank you!
@sallerc3 ай бұрын
Thanks
@yourlydontknowjack3 ай бұрын
Two things you might have missed: The new Cathode is (in my opinion) clearly a blend of SC and pC Cathode material (see the larger loose grains between the defined balls made um of tiny crystals?). This could very well deliver 5-10% higher density. 2nd Li-doping can be done with sacrificial Li-substances like Li5FeO4 or (also patented by testla) Li3Cu/CoO3 (I'm unsure if LFO is compatible with non-phosphate materials), doing Li-metal is potentially needlessly complex and also expensive - not to speak of, fairly dangerous
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
1) Great point and a good insight! If that's true, then it would put the estimate/hypothetical energy density from the improvements closer to the actual energy density. 2) True, but it's worth checking out Tesla's process. Because they use a dry process they might be able to get away with it, and not have to worry about the dead weight that comes with other lithium doping materials.
@w0ttheh3ll3 ай бұрын
For charging speed, it might be useful to look at cathode active material roll total surface area relative to cell capacity. For that we would need the thickness of the current collectors.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
There's a number of variables involved for total resistance and charging speed. On the ionic side, which dominates resistance, it involves particle size, porosity, tortuosity, thickness of the electrodes, and seperator thickness. That's not to mention the amount of carbon nanotubes or carbon black and electrolyte composition. Current collectors are likely the same thickness as before, otherwise that would have also improved the energy density.
@Aku6Soku1Zan3 ай бұрын
Based Jordan
@avgjoe59693 ай бұрын
Very nice detail. Hoping, in addition to the dry process on both sides (significant cost reduction), they add silicon and bring the energy density to (finally) 300wh/kg or more. This will finally allow "not model 2", Cybertruck full production, Semi, Roadster products to be shipped at proper scale (Cybertruck is in no way there and won't be at this price point with current batteries). We will see where it falls. Really need to see this battery take up in massive scale (at least 10k mixed cars per week).
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Definitely!
@Lukas-s4v3 ай бұрын
Extremely good video. Could you make a video, that deals with 46xx derivates. For example the 4695, BMW wants to use and how it compares to the 4680. That would be awesome.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Quick summary: If you make the can too long you run into cycle life issues. Better to just use a can that doesn't require a taller pack and make it more energy dense
@bowesterlund37193 ай бұрын
Why cycle life issues with a taller can? More heat?
@CupidinColorado3 ай бұрын
Quiz on Friday……….
@ThWiedermann3 ай бұрын
Great video as usual! Is the type of graphite in the Anode not mentioned because it’s not known? Was hoping to get an inside after there been several different opinions out there on what Tesla is using in their 4680 ✌️
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
I continued to dig on that and swap emails back and forth to arrive at a conclusive answer As far as I can tell, our original assessment of the generation one cell was correct The test that we did 'looked through' the sample, which would have revealed any natural graphite, IMO I decided not to test the graphite for the generation 2 cell That's because it provides no additional value from the perspective of a Tesla shareholder. It's an interesting thought exercise, but Tesla has a lot of options to ensure graphite supply. And, I don't think it really provides value for graphite investors. It's a red herring to focus on what type of graphite one company is using in one battery cell. In my view, it's more important to focus on whether a graphite manufacturer can get qualified and hit the price points that manufacturers need That's because synthetic and natural are so interchangeable and have such similar qualities.
@robertide51823 ай бұрын
Updated charge curve for the Cybertruck already came out a couple months ago. Also would V4 really help existing trucks? The truck doesn’t stay at 250 for too long so it doesn’t seem to be largely bottlenecked by the supercharger.
@patriksteffan20603 ай бұрын
I thought so too. OUt of Spec already was trying to check how the update perform but they had some problems (don't remember what problems) Can you check @thelimitingfactor ?
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Cool! Glad to hear that. I it would help a bit. We're talking neck and neck charging speed foor these vehicles, so anything to give people that satisfaction. 😁
@robertide51823 ай бұрын
@@thelimitingfactoryup just wanted to throw in some more info from an owner. And yeah people using an 800V CCS adapter or the few V4 stalls Tesla is apparently testing higher amperage on have shown there are some increase. Every little bit counts.
@MrAjgreenfeld24 күн бұрын
Fantastic video as always! After Battery Day, I was under the impression the DBE process would improve energy density, and if I recall correctly, would have an impact on charging speed (though I may be mistaken). Do you have a sense of how/if the DBE cathode will impact energy density and charging speed? If so, when do you think we would see these gains?
@thelimitingfactor23 күн бұрын
Correct! It's already improved the energy density via the thicker cathode. That's part of the reason it's able to match cells that contain silicon even though it contains none. Charging speed is more of a product decision. They could boost charging speed tomorrow if they chose to, but they're prioritizing cost and energy density.
@MrAjgreenfeld23 күн бұрын
@@thelimitingfactor I see. Do you think there are any more gains to be had with energy density via DBE or is this it? (Not that a cell with a carbon anode matching the density of a cell with a bit of silicon isn't impressive.)
@alexhare32403 ай бұрын
Thanks again Jordan. Were you able to determine if the anode was synthetic or natural graphite? If not what do you suspect it is?
@chokobokomokokoko3 ай бұрын
Isn't the dry cathode going to further improve energy density (besides the manufacturing/cost advancements)? Thanks for the great video!
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
The dry electrode is just a coating process. But, it will help facilitate further improvements due to better cohesion and adhesion and less reactivity 🤠 And sure thing!
@chokobokomokokoko3 ай бұрын
@@thelimitingfactor Isn't the wet process using some non-active material which is adding a few % to the total weight, which can be spared with the dry one? Or after the drying part of the wet process, there is 0 added material?
@davidwilkie95512 ай бұрын
Why is this holographic positioning nucleation like battery chemistry? Be-cause-effect self-defining instantaneous differentiates of potential positioning thermodynamical virtual work in Newtonian laws of motion, if they are looked at as relative-timing ratio-rates of log-antilog prime-cofactor frequency density-intensity interference positioning-location condensation modulation, are just a different aspect-version of the Singularity-point Centre of Time. Shirley and students need a crossover consultation with the Institute of Art and Ideas.., at MIT and Caltech etc. They probably have.
@robkeshav8003 ай бұрын
Great video as always. If Tesla is able to master the dry cathode process will Panasonic and other battery manufacturers follow suit, soon? My guess is that Panasonic might make 4680 cells in their DeSoto, KS plant if there is demand from Tesla and other EV manufacturers.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Thanks man! They are going to follow suit but it's probably going to be about 5 years
@robkeshav8003 ай бұрын
@@thelimitingfactor WOW! That is surprising. I thought that once Tesla solved the dry cathode process the other companies would follow suit, quickly like the Bannister's "4 minute mile" barrier.
@antoinepageau83363 ай бұрын
I’d like to hear your thoughts on the recent wave of vehicles in China that are charging at a rate of 500kW and maintaining high rates deep into the charge. They’re going from 5% to 90% in 10 minutes. Close to 6c.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Video coming within the next couple of months
@Nathan-ty6fd3 ай бұрын
In terms of silicon, Do you believe Tesla will stick with their own TeslaSilicon or go for an external vendor. Paraclete Silicon (which CleanerWatt recently covered) seems pretty similar and it seems like they have done quite a bit of testing at this point and maybe a easier/safer bet given how late, and problem prone the 4680 project has been.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Probably a bulk vendor that can be multi-sourced If not, then internal. They don't want a wedding.
@whitlockbr3 ай бұрын
2 dbe test next!
@robertlynn76243 ай бұрын
would be interesting to know the bill of materials cost implications of the design changes. $/kWh decrease etc
@kazedcat3 ай бұрын
More nickel = more expensive There is a reduction in the can thickness but that just means you have more space for more cathode and therefore more nickel.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Reducing the cobalt makes it slightly cheaper But we're probably only talking a few bucks Likewise with the thinner cell can Most of the cost reductions are going to be from scaling, because they're still pretty small scale
@lwwells3 ай бұрын
Perhaps the hardness of silicon prevents it from being compatible with the current dry electrode extrusion process.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
I would say it's more that they just have to take their time in introducing new variables The silicon is only a few white percent of a silicon anode, so most of the rest of it is softer carbon
@lwwells3 ай бұрын
@@thelimitingfactor even those few wt% of Si can make calendaring composite electrodes to a target porosity a nightmare. I have to imagine it will be the same for dry extrusion.
@LittleSpot3 ай бұрын
And how would 5% increase of silicon be handled with the extreme expansion of the silicon? We will see in the future.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
It's already done in many cells. And, DBE has greater cohesion and adhesion than a wet coating process. It's loadings above 5-10% that are causing issues. Mainly, as I understand it, due to calendar life issues rather than expansion issues.
@phila.65213 ай бұрын
I does contain Manganese. Why would Monroe Live say that it didn't?
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Probably just preliminary results
@SparkySho3 ай бұрын
Semi charges @ 900,000 kw Hope hyperloop charges at 3 mw ( in a vacumn ) worldwide transportation anywhere in 369 minutes - BET
@AustinFerguson3 ай бұрын
Panasonic is my wildcard on top of inhouse production as to what and where the 4680 land in product line up and will Panasonic's upcoming production cell be based on "Tesla" formulation and production standard? Not sure anyone has the answer on this to be totally fair. It could also enable new vehicle trims by end of 2025/Early 2026. Good video Jordan and thank you !
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
You're most welcome! And that is correct, Panasonic's 4680 is still a black box I'll be interested to see what they come up with
@georgepelton56453 ай бұрын
@@thelimitingfactor Panasonic did reveal that they plan to use a 5 tab design, instead of Tesla's "tab less" cell design. IIRC that was when they announced they would produce 4680 format cells.
@DavidMG993 ай бұрын
👍👍
@klauszinser3 ай бұрын
So there have been no voltage/capacity measurements on the cell?
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
No measurements from UC San Diego However, as I covered in the last video, Munro provided their energy density results, and I was able to confirm their testing was the same as UC San Diego's
@futuresmkt3 ай бұрын
I'm really confused. I thought a fundamental value proposition of Tesla was, FAR(~T4680), superior battery cost/effectiveness. Why are there close competitors?
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Because context
@andrewtancock-x3d3 ай бұрын
"Pack of structural batteries" more accurate than "Structural battery pack"
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Depends on the pack
@4literv63 ай бұрын
So the gen2 cybercell is summery is exactly where elon said it should be back in August of 2022. When he drew&Zach all said the 4680 program was on a 6 year timeline. He said to end 2022 it's goal was to be cost competitive with any other cells(since then he confirmed through 2023 it was. Due to a drop off in Chinese cell demand&cell materials coming back to earth. It was more per kwh in early 2024. But it should correct to below competitors cell cost per kwh to end 2024. 👍🏻 Then he said the goal was to be as good as any competitors cell. Multiple tear downs done by you&munro proved throughout 2022. That the world's first 4680 equipped model Y awd ev with the structural pack&dual castings. Did in fact at the pack level nearly match Panasonic in energy density. Then to end 2023 when the ct launched he said it's goal was to beat the competitors cells in pack level energy density. And the ct pack does in fact beat rivian and gms pack's. Not to mention even on at 35s the ct is more efficient than it's competitors! But this is a known tesla advantage getting better range per kwh of pack capacity. Also multiple ct on 800+v chargers have hit as high as 327kw. Matching or beating the best of the ultium gm truck's. Getting 80+miles back in 1 such test earlier this year in just 8mins of charging! So tesla and the 4680 cell program for being less than 50 months old is insanely successful by any metric measurable vs the competition. As elon said our cell suppliers all they do is build cells for decade's and decades! Imagine where tesla will be in a decade of cell manufacturing. Now elon get going on semi solid state cells and solid state cells buddy! Before that gov energy efficiency commission position opens up.😀👍🏻
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
I'd only add that solid state is a bad direction to go. It's fundamentally more expensive (as in a first principles physics level). Great for aerospace though and for manufacturers looking for a gimmicky hook 😁
@rogerstarkey53903 ай бұрын
@4literv6 You're assuming that "efficiency commission" will happen? It could, and should be a Bi-Partisan goal and would be great if the next President makes best use of her (😉) "Resources", putting aside previous "Tensions" because .... "Better Together". Pragmatism on all sides would be beneficial? Correct?
@4literv63 ай бұрын
@@thelimitingfactor hard disagree there man. That nio welion semi solid state pack of 150kwhs that fits in all the current nio model's and weighs just 44# more than the catl nmc 100kwh pack in the same case is proof. That it is imo the direction we should be heading full speed! And ALL the major Chinese cell oems are now going ALL in on solid state cells. Claiming mass production will happen by 2027-2028. Lfmp,lfp, m3p chemistry and maybe even sodium for all the cheap lower and some mid spec trim evs+bess sure. But then semi solid state&full solid state cells for everything above the mid spec evs. Imagine a ct solid state pack with 200+kwhs that weighs the same svelte 1480# as the current 123kwh pack? Charges 200+miles in 10-15mins on 350+kw 800v chargers. Or a plaid+with 120kwhs for 500 miles of range and shaves 350# off. Or a model 3 with 80+kwhs in solid state cells that also loses 300#😁👍🏻
@mastergool2 ай бұрын
One Cybertruck in Europe has been caught charging at more than 400kwh
@johnlabernik45993 ай бұрын
“Gain a significant lead on the rest of the battery industry in the next 2 years” if true this is huge. Tesla energy will be bigger than the car business.
@sender58043 ай бұрын
charging speed looks at the wrong metric. you should look at kWh per minute if analysing batteries.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
yeah, everyone has a favorite metric 😁 None are perfect, so we have many
@sender58043 ай бұрын
@@thelimitingfactor why would you take into account vehicles weight, efficiency etc when strictly analysing battery tech? makes no sense unless
@kevin423 ай бұрын
Not electronic, but ohmic resistance :)
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
I simplified to tease out the difference between ionic resistance and resistance to electrons for the average Joe
@WentzCraft3 ай бұрын
Time to delete the can! "the best part is no part"! The high density foam fill should suffice for structure and protection as well as giving a little spring to expansion. Then delete the excessive cooling lines with center cooling of each cell. To do this increase the void in the middle with a tube that is a thermally conductive, electrical insulator. I don't know what the best material would be examples could be aluminum nitrite, beryllium oxide, man-made diamond, but I'm sure something could be made cost effective eventually. Deleting these two parts should drastically improve thermal characteristics, and could have a non-zero weight penalty benefit. Jordan you are the best part of KZbin! I'm sorry I'm poor and don't support your patreon...
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
I appreciate the well-considered comment, and all good!... We're in lean times
@TroyFrank-h1k2 ай бұрын
Remember that 4680 is part of structural battery pack. I doubt they can take the cell walls out and still maintain the structural strength needed for the pack/car.
@WentzCraft2 ай бұрын
@@TroyFrank-h1k I would have tended to agree with you but I did a small experiment with spray foam and a circular honeycomb pattern with voids representing cells and a panel top and bottom. I was shocked at the results. The deviation under torsion was almost identical to an entirely foam-filled section. There are countless flaws with what I did given the scale and accuracy an actual engineer would require but the results were worth looking into further. I think manufacturing, transportation, and packaging would be much more difficult without the cell can.
@johannesdolch3 ай бұрын
Did you just hand over a Cybercell to the Chinese? (jk)
@peterchung20243 ай бұрын
Probably need to use X instead of Twitter
@science9393 ай бұрын
Cool less cobalt equals battery degradation but the battery cheaper to produce
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
No, it doesn't mean more degradation if it's been structured correctly. That was debunked about 5 years ago by Jeff Dahn.
@crimsondecade74203 ай бұрын
The 4680 path was initially the correct move for Tesla but it is taking much longer to get where they want to be. Maybe in a couple years we will have something similar to what was promised on Battery Day but as you mentioned , by the time that happens where will the rest of the industry be? I am not likely to buy a Tesla Vechicle with a 4680 until it is proven better then a 2170.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Taking longer, but also lower priority because there's currently a battery glut. There will be no real difference for customers between the 2170 and 4680 That's because you take the raw cells as a commodity and design the pack and vehicle to the requirements of the use case, not the other way around
@rsamd3 ай бұрын
What about power of 4680. Cybertruck has only 845hp dispite 123kwh battery pack. thats lame.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
The power isn't battery pack limited It's motor limited
@wpap58633 ай бұрын
It's battery limited. Check out TM3 performance specs, US vs. Europe.
@bobkat16633 ай бұрын
What is so odd, is battery tech. has been around for 170 years?? Advancements were suppressed, or just not worked on, they wanted you to buy a battery often, no matter what it was for....I am not an electric car fan at all, I love my diesel truck, and tractors., however Elon/Tesla are up to full production , and deserve time to let the battery tech. to catch up to where it is supposed to be; electric machines have useful places in our modern era. Take L.A. for example, The Spanish explorers were told by the indians not to go down there, as the air is stale, so what does the U.S. do? We build the second largest city, and the largest county in the U.S. in that stale air, dead valley. So to me, if you live in L.A. I think an Electric car is a great idea, but you going to have to start building power plants, some good coal burning , natural gas, gen. sets, it is long over due. So if anyone can do it, it will be Elon and Tesla. Well done and Great show.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Thanks man!
@gareth50003 ай бұрын
This is akin to industrial espianage, just like those drone pilots. Elon is very good natured about it:) Imagine if someone tried it with Apple or any of Bezos's companies...
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
🐱👤😁
@CodyDavis913 ай бұрын
𝕏
@BillSmith-fx7xx3 ай бұрын
Any chance we will see any significant change in battery density in my lifetime ! Unless we can get 50% improvement from here, in the next 5 years, this train is barely able to get out of the station. Frustrating.
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Oh, there's batteries with 50% or double the energy density of current batteries out there, they're just expensive These batteries have limited energy density because that's not their primary focus Automotive batteries are unique because they have to be good at everything And currently, automotive batteries are good enough to mostly transition the world to EVs That is, the technology is ahead of the scale already That's why Tesla is so focused on scale
@BillSmith-fx7xx3 ай бұрын
Thank you for a good answer & explaination. I really appreciate it ! But I can still hope, can't I ? It just seems that from a layman's viewpoint, advancements have slowed down quite a bit. Having said that, I guess my focus is very narrow, range & charging speed, compared to a battery engineer that has so many other criteria that I take for granted. Thanks again !
@JjJj-xk2yo3 ай бұрын
Only 330 wh/kg? Other EV uses solid battery, which has 500 wh/kg. Oh my god!
@waynerussell64013 ай бұрын
NOPE!
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
Yeah, you can put a 1000 Wh/kg battery in a vehicle. But it would cost a lot and have terrible cycle life.
@robanderson95653 ай бұрын
Too bad with all the misinformation/lies you spread it now makes your work questionable
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
🤣 Ah yes, the old blank assertion Debate me on X if you have a strong case about a particular topic Well, unless I've blocked you, which I often do for when people use circular or ad hominem arguments
@antonio_fosnjar3 ай бұрын
Tesla has nothing on Toyotas solid state battery. You will all see when they launch it next year with 10000Wh/kg and dominate and sell 10mil EVs
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
😂 You had me for a second
@Storm34513 ай бұрын
disapointing how slow battery tech moves ... EVs will remain a niche until a really breakthrough in energy density happens
@thelimitingfactor3 ай бұрын
The issue with this logic is that it's... not true Norway is already 90%+ EVs. Scaling just takes time.
@vaclavmatousek30073 ай бұрын
You do not need much more than 5 to 7% improvement annually and enough patience
@Storm34513 ай бұрын
@@vaclavmatousek3007 I dont see any progress in years. Tesla fans still rave about the high cobalt batteries from the past since they performed better then the current one. Batterytech appears to be moving backwards.
@Tschacki_Quacki3 ай бұрын
@@Storm3451 What do you mean? The first gen Model 3 with 75kWh almost had the same range as today's Model 3 with 60kWh. no progress my behind
@TheEvilmooseofdoom3 ай бұрын
@@Storm3451 You don't see progress? That's a you problem. It seems you might not be as informed as you think you are. In fact I'd say you have such a poor grasp it might be a topic that is actually a bit over your head.