0W-8 Motor Oil: Too THIN to Trust? Let's Find Out!

[@themotoroilgeek]

Here's the link to the research report from Oak Ridge National Lab on the special 0W-12 oil. www.osti.gov/biblio/1798600

[@AmazonasBiotop]

Who has written that and nobody read it...?😂 In abstract: "up to 9.9% better fuel economy for the IL-containing SAE 0W-12 experimental oil compared with selected commercial SAE 5W-30 and 0W-20 engine oils." The 0w-20 had no info in the paper and the table just say "n/a". So there is NO measured benifits in this paper anyway that there is ANY fule economy savings to be had going from 0w-20 to 0W-12 with or without whatever additives (IL) in it. A misleading abstract and a assumption that is unverified by the report. (it probably has likely one but they can not claim something they have not tested!)🤔 💖

[@Eduardo_Espinoza]

Did this pass for turbo charged? :)

[@bobbygetsbanned6049]

Speaking of transmission fluid, the myth of ATF having miraculous cleaning abilities would be a great topic for a video. I personally think ATF doesn't have special cleaning abilities, and people just think it does because they don't understand transmissions don't collect carbon like engine oil does. But getting the facts from you could finally end or confirm this myth.

[@jalofanclub]

@@AmazonasBiotopagreed. My car calls for 0-W16 and I never saw more than 38.5 mpg around town. Funny thing is the oil change place didn’t have 0-W16 so I just told them use Mobile1 5-W20. Since the oil change I’m getting 40.5 mpg around town. 🤔

[@AmazonasBiotop]

​@jalofanclub Yes, yesterday I did a oil change on my 2010 Prius gen 3. Been using 0w-20 and decided to put 0w-16 in it for the first time.. The gen 3 have never been recommended in the owner manual to have a 0w-16.. There is a couple of reasons I did the switch to 0w-16 anyway: 1. It is not that far of a jump in viscosity to begin with. 2. The 0w-16 did not exist 2010. So Toyota could not specify it, when it don't exit.. 3. The same Prius gen 3 engine is used in gen 4 there they specifying 0w-16. 4. And and I am a oil geek since 30 years. 😅 It went well and it seams to work super and the gasoline usage seams to begin going down also. My take on it is that viscosity is not as important that it used to be..😅 In the old days the additives were not that many and as good as they are today.. So we needed then to more than today relay on viscosity so that higher viscosity at 100°C were that engine protection.. With higher viscosity. Today viscosity is less of an importance when the additives are far better that creates that protection that higher viscosity did on the old days. And the base stock oil today is probably that thin so that we can deliver the additives in a more timely matter. And probably that is more important than anything else nowadays.😅

[@Nickrioblanco1]

As far as I know the CVT Transmission fluid cannot be completely drained from the drain plug. Additionally from the evidence I've seen the transmission fluids only last about 60,000 miles at most. They go from red to black so I don't believe the story about them never needing to be changed. I also believe there should be a law against making the fluid level so difficult to check it's almost impossible for the owner.

[@TexasVexes]

Planned obsolescence Baby…. they got a big lobby

[@bradhuffjr777]

VERY few people even know that a CVT needs frequent oil AND filter changes. Some manufacturers recommend servicing between 30,000 and 60,000 miles, depending on driving conditions. I don't know of anyone who rebuilds them, and they all have very short warrantys!!

[@DavidSmith-tu1nd]

​@@bradhuffjr777 Nissan infinity cvt transmissions had issues.

[@thisisyourcaptainspeaking2259]

Maybe the fluid is more expensive than the transmission?

[@adm7812]

@@thisisyourcaptainspeaking2259 it isn’t. i have diy serviced my toyota cvt along with the filter change. The fill port is behind the wheel and getting the right level is bit of a process but still easy enough.

[@TheRichardF10]

No speculation on this channel, all science. So many myths that have been engraved in our minds for decades regarding engine oil and you are dispelling them. Excellent work Lake.

[@themotoroilgeek]

Thank you!

[@ethermal1]

Still a little, to be truly scientific you needed a control, where you did the changes exactly per the mfg and compare the results

[@rayRay-pw6gz]

I can not comment on his knowledge of oil but, I can on the vehicle mechanics. Toyota specifically states 0-w8 or 0-w16 for a reason. The engine , computer and sensors are calibrated for that specific grade of oil. If you do not follow manufacturer instructions and use a different grade , you may damage the engine long term. Since he does not let the vehicle go over 5K with the wrong oil, I think he is OK. I would have ran the new engine 5K with the original oil and then change the oil but not the filter. The filter will work fine and you can change it every other oil Change. JMO🇺🇸✌️

[@ryanb5189]

I have the same 0W-8 spec’d car that I took to the dealer for the free ‘Toyota Care’ service and I asked the service advisor what oil they put in it. She didn’t know and had to ask her colleague who said 0W-20. I said “Are you sure, because the sticker on the engine says 0W-8.” She said “We don’t have that but can use 0W-16 if you want” So I walked over to the dealer parts counter, who had 0W-8 sitting on the shelf. Thankfully he told the service advisor they could use it for my car. I’m guessing the average customer gets whatever oil is most convenient for the dealer. When someone comes in and hands them an oil sample bottle to use I bet they call the boss, who tells them to make sure and use the good stuff on this one!

[@themotoroilgeek]

LOL, good point.

[@GT-mn3bx]

Dealers aren't as bad, but Most places are hacks and give everyone 5w30 dino oil. Most don't even change the filter.

[@ΔημήτριοςΚαραβασίλης-ω5λ]

Using an oil with higher viscosity, will increase fuel consumption, right?

[@LAP1050]

Good thing you were smart enough to check with parts dept and not accept what the, clueless, Service Writer had to offer.

[@taz4100]

I would imagine they have a pump and dont even normally use oil from jugs.

[@tomtom255]

It's truly a breathe of fresh air to see someone with a channel that has actual scientific data to explain what is happening instead of speculation and conjecture. Would you ever do an episode or maybe even a series on engine oil additives? Specifically Liqui-moly Ceratec. Thank you : )

[@sledgenwedge]

Hells yeah

[@johnroberts4823]

I’d never wait for 10,000 miles! Agree!

[@luckyguy600]

3,000km or 3 months. Etched in stone for all my vehicles. But what others do, I could care less.

[@TorbenRichter-z9d]

​@@luckyguy600In Germany we call it Materialverschwendung , so ein Quatsch alle 3000km ....

[@HourRomanticist]

3000km? That's quite frankly excessive unless your using natural oil instead of synthetic. If it's an older car with synthetic, you may benefit every 4500km, but for most cars, they can do 8000km and be just fine. Agreed, 16000km is far too long though.​@@luckyguy600

[@MrShadow1617]

@@TorbenRichter-z9d Speziell alle 3 Monate, viel zu oft. Jährlich oder alle 10.000km reicht völlig für benziner.

[@zenshy2139]

​@@MrShadow1617what about diesel?

[@greggc8088]

Toyota tech seeing Lake come in with his daughter's car-"Oh man, we better use that 0W-8 on his because he is going to analyze it for sure". LOL

[@Papparratzi]

Well I don’t think they could have stocked it because they knew he was coming. It had to already be there.

[@mevio4665]

😂😂 That's exactly what came trough my mind too. The garage knew that there was no time to play with the oil type

[@NorthlanderMN]

I’m not into conspiracy stuff like that. They may not even know who Lake is because they’ve got so many people working. The vehicle is in his daughter’s name. But who knows they may have something written in the notes in this vehicles file if they should find out. It’s a possibility. Yet I highly doubt it!

[@mrvwbug4423]

It comes down to the individual dealership. A lot of them will not use OEM oil and just use the cheapest synthetic oil they can buy in bulk or a different OEM oil from one of their other brands that is cheaper. Prime example, the Toyota dealer I bought my 2019 Tacoma from used Ford OEM oil because they were also a Ford dealer and that was the cheapest they could get. The Toyota dealer I use now since I moved uses Toyota OEM oil as they are exclusively a Toyota dealer

[@GT-mn3bx]

​@@mrvwbug4423 I think Motorcraft is still Citgo.

[@arthursmith643]

It’s always 10,000 miles when the dealership pays. It’s 5,000 miles when it’s on your dime.

[@themotoroilgeek]

Well said

[@GT-mn3bx]

You still paid for the 10K change. Why do you think these rigs have tripled in price?

[@acguy661]

Long service intervals look good when selling a car as low maintenance, though they may not be that great for the vehicle in practice. How many engines have timing chain wear problems these days? Changing oil at 5,000 miles may not guarantee you never have problems, but it is better for the engine than waiting for the oil light.

[@uninavas]

This is because when you pay, they usually sell you 'conventional' oil, which is a 5K mile oil. It's not the same they use when you are under the free oil changes. Unless you ask for Synthetic oil, then it will be 10k mile. But, it is more expensive.

[@dennisyoung4631]

Uh, use the good stuff, e.g. Mobil-1 or similar, and change it every four to six months? (NOTE: This is when you’re only driving a hundred miles or so per month, with at least one session per month where the engine gets warmed and stays warm for an hour or two, e.g. “bill-paying and groceries, about forty miles at 25-40 miles an hour on longish surface streets with little stop and go traffic.” Not quite the “ninety-two mile oil change” of mid-seventies Mad magazine, but under a thousand miles per instance.)

[@LamNguyen-dy5ep]

I have the 2024 Corolla Hatch. The American manual states to use 0w-8 and 0w-16. However the Australian manual says that you can use 0w-16, 0w-20, 5w-20, 5w-30 and 10w-30. From what I read, the lighter oil slightly increases fuel efficiency which is required by US law

[@themotoroilgeek]

You are on it!

[@TassieLorenzo]

Interesting! Is it a myth then about the different API starburst symbol on 0W-8 & 0W-12 products to show it is not backwards compatible with 0W-20 through 20W-50? I heard that engines designed for 0W-8 and 0W-12 have different bearing finishes. So that's not true?

[@wolfeadventures]

This. It’s strictly a tactic to meet CAFE standards. Has nothing to do with longevity or “tight oil passages” engineered for 0w-8. It’s not. Thicker oil is fine.

[@summerforever6736]

You better of using 5-20 or 5-30

[@summerforever6736]

I agree They are not manufacturing different engine with different tolerances in 2.0l f example for Europe and for USA! That would cost alot..

[@rodmorgan7041]

What a great dad you are, looking after your daughters car like this. 😊

[@themotoroilgeek]

😊 thank you

[@TheRealMrRoyal]

Is this not normal?? I'd never let my kids drive something not properly maintained.

[@craigammons5779]

The corolla does have a first gear then changes to CVT.

[@91CavGT5]

My 2022 Ram with the HEMI is specced to run 0w20. After 30,000 miles of 5,000 mile OCI, it developed a tick at cold start. No. I swapped it out to 5w30 and started doing all of my own oil changes. The cold start tick disappeared and I have not seen any measurable drop in fuel economy(average 21-23 mpg on the highway, hand calculated). I’m convinced that, for this vehicle, 0w20 is just for that slightly improved fuel economy for EPA ratings.

[@BF1-P]

5w30, greatest human invention ever

[@Winnetou834]

@@BF1-P0W-40 ist better!

[@davidperry4013]

My favorite oil is 0w30

[@jason200912]

Well the oil geek said 0w-16 can possibly be better than 5w-30 because it's all based on additive combo quality

[@PFinkoloTL87]

I had a Miata, neighbor who was a mechanic put 0W-20 in it, praising it to be the best motor oil available - he uses it in everything he owns. Okay. My Miata developed a ticking or knocking at all temps. Got fed up, bought factory spec 5W-30 oil, brought it and the car to a shop, changed the oil - ticking/knocking gone. Engine was running like new at all temps.

[@ElPants21]

Some Toyota hybrids take regular Toyota ATF. They use 2 electric motors and a planetary gear set to change the gear ratios rather than a belt or chain. Super reliable and durable

[@AB-yc1np]

Ok you’re talking about the Hybrid not the gasoline motor only

[@ElPants21]

@@AB-yc1np as far as I know, yes. The eCVT trans is for sure belt/chainless, but I'm unaware of Toyota's gas only trans construction.

[@deboralacreta]

eCVT

[@91CavGT5]

@@ElPants21 the two are different. The eCVT in the hybrids is incredibly reliable with countless examples having well over 200,000 miles. The CVT in the standard gas powered vehicles on the other hand, I have not seen any that are known for their reliability regardless of the manufacturer. Subaru, Nissan, Mitsubishi, Honda, Toyota, it doesn’t matter. Some are slightly better than others, but none carry the same reliability as the eCVT.

[@VuickB6]

This. My 07 Prius uses the same Valvoline MaxLife ATF that my 07 GX470 uses with no issues. ✌️

[@PeterHernandez-lg2eh]

Just watched you on Dave's engine shop in utah. Great advice

[@raymondreiff8170]

Me too, Two High achieving individuals 🇺🇸👍

[@charleshenderson9058]

Saw Lake there too!

[@themotoroilgeek]

Thanks!

[@mr.mr.3301]

Everyone should watch that.

[@rsc9520]

Me too !!!

[@TrollinCrazyRussian]

*clutched my heart and winced after reading "-so it's time for the first free oil change at the-" and not reading "i did first oil change super early due to engine break in shavings" edited: thank god right after i continue playing the video i found out you changed it twice already.

[@themotoroilgeek]

LOL

[@TrollinCrazyRussian]

Wait a minute! You son of bitch!😂 just when I let me guard down after work day. It's still April's fool. Legit thought to myself "what's next, 0w-0? -1w-(-1)? -1w+1?😂"

[@richhauxwell7848]

I have 5w30 vehicles, Never ever had anything less than 10w30 in them. I have gotten well over 300,000 miles out of them without issue. No knocks, no smoke, just go

[@noobulon4334]

You want the first number to be as low as possible to help on cold starts, there's no downside of using 0w30 over 10w30

[@craighoffman6876]

The problem with super thin oil isn't lubrication, its a combo of the low tension and thin oil control rings, and the thin oil getting past them. As the miles go by and usually out of the warranty period, the thin rings carbon over and oil use goes way up, especially if oil change intervals are not well adhered to. An inattentive owner can easily run low on oil and lose an engine. This happens a lot to KIA and Hyundai owners especially. I enjoy the "I Do Cars" YT channel, Eric over there tears down blown up engines and all of them that spec OW20 oil have carboned up and usually stuck rings. What I see from the engine tear downs is distressed oil control rings cause excessive oil use, which leads to running low on oil, resulting in spun crank bearings. The rod and main bearings generally look fine with the thin oil as long as the level is maintained and something else caused the engine to die, like driving it through deep water. Clearly thin oil lubricates well, the issue is the darn thin oil control rings. Manufacturers are reaching too far to eek every last fractional MPG out of modern engines. I wager if manufacturers used wider stronger oil control rings there would be no problem at all with thin fully synthetic oil, which does enjoy the advantage of quick flow on startup. As things are, a 10K oil change interval is way too long for watery thin oil in combo with thin oil control rings. I would do it every 5K at most. My wife's car specifies 0W20, I run 5W30 and oil consumption dropped to almost zero during it's 5K interval. I also believe that the slightly heavier but by no means "heavy" oil helps with preventing the carboned up thin oil control ring issue. I have a diesel pickup running T6 5W40 diesel oil, after 7.5K miles it's iron reading is around 13-15 PPM, which is less around half what the 4 PPM per 1K miles results were here as well. It has nice old school full sized oil control rings, and uses half a quart every 7.5K miles. If anyone reading this drives a newer KIA or Hyundai, I suggest using 10W30 oil, and keeping an eye on the oil level. It is good for all of us to just make a habit of checking the oil level at every fill up. There is no reason to lose an engine.

[@tenmillionvolts]

My friend's Kia has just seized during driving. No oil light flicker, no clatter on hard turns. Was quiet and smooth then seized. No oil left. It went from almost no consumption to enough to drain it between oil changes. She always takes it to our trusted mechanic so I believe it was changed correctly. I bet it has control ring problems. We have a Vitz (Yarris) that loves oil too. I just keep an eye on the level and we use a higher viscosity now that it has higher kms on it. Not worth stripping it down to do the rings

[@Duken4evr29]

@@tenmillionvolts Sorry to hear about your friend's engine. Sounds like you are on the right track with yours though.

[@shanejpark]

For new toyotas you really should just use what they tell you to. They’ve been using 0W8 in Japan with no issues for a decade at this point, and now that it’s approved in the US their ECUs are programmed like their japanese ones. Unless you’re tracking a car there’s no reason not the use the recommended oil

[@yzrip]

Eric’s channel is the best I love his videos!

[@chrisbarnes2823]

I still remember using W20-50 Duckhams Q in early Minis in the 60’s, the oil was green in colour.

[@cameronwood1994]

You can still buy Duckhams Q 20W-50 (it's now API SJ in the UK) and it's still green in colour! They do a Q 10W-40 too, which replaces the old Q 5500 (10W-30) oil.

[@eoghanhennessy443]

My box goes on about this all the time he said it was recycled oil

[@thisisyourcaptainspeaking2259]

You mean gear box lube?

[@chrisbarnes2823]

@@thisisyourcaptainspeaking2259 the Mini gearbox lived in the engine oil pan, so it was engine and gear oil.

[@thisisyourcaptainspeaking2259]

@@chrisbarnes2823 Makes sense. I only had the opportunity to spend quality time with an mg that had no roof, chrome bumpers and no rust. I really wanted that car.

[@markaruski]

CVT note: if you have a planetary gear-type CVT, it may call for ATF, instead of CVT fluid, just be sure to check the owners manual.

[@michaeldurrett8388]

I stick to oem fluids for CVTs. Not going to risk a 5k trans to save 40 bucks.

[@VuickB6]

Not sure what type of CVT my 07 Prius has, but it can use plain old Valvoline MaxLife ATF. Same stuff I use in my 07 GX470 which has an A750.

[@EatMyYeeties]

​@@VuickB6The Toyota hybrid CVTs use a planetary gear set. It's pretty cool! The engine drives either the ring gear or the planets, the electric motor powers the other, and the output comes from the ring gear. So, depending on the speed of the electric motor, you can set the engine RPM and essentially have any output speed you want. The belt CVTs are the ones that need the special fluid, but since yours is fully geared, it takes ATF.

[@HR-wd6cw]

Best to stick to whatever the manufacturer says to use, and in fact, would just buy it from the dealer. It's the one thing I would say you're best off just paying the extra money for the OEM stuff. Besides a few quarts of CVT or trans fluid in general is far cheaper than a new transmission down the road. I mean how often do you change your trans fluid? Maybe once every other year if you have a CVT (say every 30k-50k miles) and perhaps every 5 years (or 60-90k) if you have a manual or traditional (geared) automatic. And if you have a CVT you should be changing your fluid about every 30-50k miles anyway for best longevity.

[@robertjackson7590]

@@michaeldurrett8388 OE's don't make a lot of things under the hood, spark plugs, belts, bearings or oil. Many of the aftermarket are far superior and I'll pay more for them. The most cost effective way a customer can extend the life of their transmission is the OCI and the product they use. Do what works for you but this is what I do. Retired Ind Allison Trans specialist. Find the top tier oil manufacturer you can afford and use their product. It's what they do, it's all they do and the OE might be piurchasing from them already. They have guys like Lake that geek out on this stuff all day, every day. Just a suggestion.

[@EnthusiastsGarage]

Lake is doing a great job bring many oil myths to light. I threw him a shout-out on my channel and I’m in the process of doing the same mileage test on Costco oil.

[@themotoroilgeek]

Thank you so much!

[@ChrisPatrick-q6k]

He's like a wise Wolf 😊

[@jason200912]

What oil myth? He proved the oil myth was true in this video in that thick is better than thin.

[@Arman-tm1kz]

Thanks for the video, appreciate the topic a lot because I personally feel very bad using thin oils. As a Toyota dealer technician in Europe, I can tell you we use 5W-30 in this exact engine, and on basically all the other common Toyota models and engines. We only have 0W-20 for the 1.2 4 cylinder turbo (8NR-FTS engine), thats as thin as we go. Oh and by the way, we don't even use OEM Toyota engine oil, just some generic brand (with Toyota specification approval) which is still mindboggling to me since the oil changes are not so cheap

[@eclipes00]

I love this channel so great to see real results!!!

[@themotoroilgeek]

Thank you!

[@ThePolarBearProductions]

At this point I’m convinced we’re gonna go back to straight weight oils since I’m sure they’ll eventually make 0W-0 Oil

[@yournightmare9999]

Just use water

[@themotoroilgeek]

LOL

[@PinkFZeppelin]

As far as I know 0w16 can already be a straight weight oil since it’s representing two different scales. The Valvoline offering seems to be close.

[@bobbygetsbanned6049]

Yeah that's the weird part, one of the benefits of synthetic is having a larger viscosity range. But 0W-8 is 1/3rd of conventional 5W-30.

[@johnfranklin5277]

You made me laugh. Thx.

[@mkroach59]

I'm still sceptical of any filled for life claims.

[@themotoroilgeek]

Me too!

[@cup_and_cone]

Life of vehicle is usually only 100,000 miles for most manufacturers, so... 100k is what you can expect.

[@bobbygetsbanned6049]

It just means the life isn't as long. The oil life didn't get longer, the transmission life just got shorter.

[@tradingnichols2255]

@@cup_and_cone Or change the transmission fluid every 30k miles and the car may last 50% or 100% longer...

[@alexandergunaka666]

Why. There’s no legal length on life. They’ll just say sorry that was its life, but you can change the fluid now based on our specs lol. I think in the manual by the lifetime fills they should have to put estimates of their interpretations of lifetime at the very least.

[@dontderockmerizz3211]

I will never go 10k between oil changes. I wouldn’t be able to sleep at night. Oil is cheap, engines aren’t.

[@pleasedontwatchthese9593]

I feel like my issue is if there is a oil/coolant/gas leak into the oil you will not find out until its way too late. So even if the oil can last that long there are still other issues. A good user will check and find those things but I feel like a lot of people will be lazy and never know until their next oil change.

[@volvo09]

He didn't

[@GT-mn3bx]

​@@pleasedontwatchthese9593Just smell it on the dipstick each time(fuel) any significant water would make it milky.

[@TassieLorenzo]

Sure thing. You can see why van operators push it out to the 20k miles / 30k km though that Fiat (Dodge), Mercedes, Ford, Renault etc say (with e.g., 2.0L turbo diesels), as they want to keep the costs down. Plenty of people see that this is what it says for their passenger car Mercedes C300 diesel or Renault Talisman diesel as well and just follow it too. In theory this should be OK as long as the oil stays in spec and doesn't get diluted with fuels, though these Euro engines following these schedules do tend to be varnished up when they are opened up.

[@wirebrush]

It really depends on how you drive it. Long haul trucks will go tens of thousands between changes and hundreds of thousands or more between engine overhauls, but they don't put them through many heat cycles between oil changes. The typical soccer mom mobile that gets started, run a few miles and shut off multiple times a day should probably have oil changed every 2-3 months even though it's only getting maybe a thousand miles on it in that time.

[@meeder78]

In the Netherlands the Toyota dealerships do not use 0W20 in the RAV4 Hybrid (2015-2018). They all fill them up with 5W30. 5W30 is also approved by Toyota but for the lowest fuel consumption the factory advises 0W20...

[@robertmaybeth3434]

Meeder78 - The Dutch are 100% CORRECT. After researching this for months, incl an email or two to OP, I've concluded I won't be using zero weight oils anymore.

[@dipro001]

Dont tolerate that. Take your own oil

[@meeder78]

​@@dipro001Why shouldn't I tolerate it? It is the recommendation of Toyota across Europe to not use the 0W20 oil for these engines. The engine loads are generally higher here especially when towing with the vehicle. The 5W30 oil is the better choice for it.

[@robertmaybeth3434]

@@dipro001 You're absolutely right, and that's what I do, for my preciouss Lexus LS 460. I worked in fleet automotive for a large west coast city for around 30 years, and it left me half a cripple (now I've had severe back problems from lifting bus batteries of 160 lb.). So now i mostly get the oil changed at a Valvoline quick lube. BUT I bring my own oil for them to use (Penzoil Ultra platinum). If they didn't allow me to do that, I'd go someplace else.

[@9ZERO6]

You are 1000% wrong. Lol. Stop.

[@bigalbranim614]

I feel like you are the right person to ask this and I would love to see a video on this as it seems no one is in agreement. Techs believe 3-5k is max even with advances in technology while OE’s are pushing that 10-15k while aftermarket’s like Mobile 1 and Amsoil are pushing 20-25k. Obviously the question is quite load and dependent on many variables but with everyone is disagreement it’s hard to come to an educated opinion

[@RICHat22]

At 49 yrs old, and owning a shop, working dealerships, just 25 yr recert ASE Master +, having loyal customers nearly 20 yrs in my shop, I can give proven, experienced advise. Stick to around 5k miles. I tell certain ones with newer cars they can stretch a little if they have good driving habits. I get to see their oil when it comes out. Personally my vehicles all go 3-400k miles on original engines. I stay between 3-5k max. Because I know my driving habits. lol. 80's to mid 90's get 3k on the sticker. ALL others get 5k unless they demand otherwise. I generally rotate every time now. I switched to full syn oils back about 2010 (syn-blend about 2006) for all vehicles and never used cheap filters. Mostly OEM. Don't like it? Go somewhere else. I'm not an oil change shop. I only do oil changes for my regulars so I can monitor for other upcoming issues. A 5 quart oil change is running about $84 total May 2024. But how many have a $100/hr tech changing your oil and checking everything over at that time? Not many.

[@STSmithable]

Cars rust. 10k oil changes are fine. It will rust first

[@Bacnow]

Any reputable mechanic would recommend 5k max! If you can’t spare an hour of your time and $25 bucks to perform an additional oil change then you obviously aren’t planning on keeping it long term!

[@billthomas8994]

Been doing extended drain intervals (10 to 15k miles) using Amsoil or Mobil 1 and best quality filters with no problems for going on 20 years. Just sold a 2008 Honda Fit with 280k miles that used a half quart in 10,000 miles. Always start with a well maintained engine if used and start with an effective engine flush such as Amsoil Engine Flush per directions. For extended drain intervals to work it’s very inportant to regularly change the air filter and to be sure there are no intake or vacuum leaks.

[@463570joe]

It would be very interesting to get your take on the new Valvoline restore and protect. It claims to be the only oil that actually removes deposits. If it does what it claims, it would be great to clean coking from oil control rings on DI engines.

[@stephenh8092]

I would bet that adding something like Marvel Mystery Oil to your engine oil achieves the same deposite removal results at a cheaper price point.

[@Tradrnq]

I've asked in another video for him to do this as well! I hope he does

[@kenj.8897]

​@stephenh809l2 lol

[@mrvwbug4423]

It's not going to clean deposits from the intake ports on DI engines. And coking on oil rings is not just a DI thing that is most modern engines as they all have low tension oil rings now. I've only seen two design solutions that reduce or eliminate the intake deposits on DI engines, either dual DI/port injection like Toyota D4S and the newer Ford EcoBoosts or water jacketed intake ports like Mazda has on the SkyActiv engines.

[@themotoroilgeek]

Stay tuned! We are going to do an in-depth video on the Valvoline Restore & Protect.

[@tomwagner4516]

One of your early subs. I love your videos. We bought a 2024 Corolla Cross and followed your advice. First oil change at 1,000, second at 3500. Going for our first dealer service and we will do an oil analysis and CVT analysis. Thank you so much!

[@rayRay-pw6gz]

What anybody tells you on any media channel is suspect. The vehicle manufacturer guides you on proper maintenance. They know more than anybody . That said , changing your oil more often will not hurt the vehicle. Just keep in mind that a new vehicle may have special oil to help break in the engine. I would not change the oil after 1,000 miles on a new vehicle. Any metal flakes will be filtered out by the OIL FILTER . JMO

[@GT-mn3bx]

Those first 2 are the most important. Same for trans and differentials. I do those around 12K. 10 if any significant towing.

[@bubbleman2002]

@@rayRay-pw6gz "The vehicle manufacturer guides you on proper maintenance." Wrong. They guide you on maintenance, not proper maintenance. Case in point, BMW recommending 5,000 mile oil change intervals in their engines that have disposable rod bearings. The results are not shocking, the bottom end comes apart at 60,000 miles.

[@rayRay-pw6gz]

@@bubbleman2002 Toyota has never let me down . 2018 Camry. The best build and engineering of any vehicle I have owned. 2.5 L. 203HP 8 speed auto/manual . Solid platform and perfect suspension. Fun and comfortable to drive. This is a drivers car. With great safety features. 6,700 redline . I change the oil at 5K or less.

[@spunkush]

Manufacturers have a vested interest in lowering the "cost of ownership" ​number . So they benefit from suggesting longer intervals. If you look at their suggetstions for intense-use, its much more conservative. @@rayRay-pw6gz

[@ZWortek]

The videos you make on this channel are so important for consumers like myself that are a bit obsessed with trying to make sure we keep our vehicles running the best we can for as long as we can. I really appreciate you taking the time to make them.

[@themotoroilgeek]

Thank you!

[@riceburner4747]

Your daughter is a lucky woman. Nice to see miticulous actions on normal Toyotas. Ppl NEED to take pride in their vehicles & their vehicles will take care of them. Cars aren't cheap, we've gotta take care of them. 👍🇺🇸

[@thedefenestrator2994]

Toyota tech here; The transmission has a special process to checking the fluid level at a specific temperature range after fill up. It’s VERY specific, so they don’t include where to find the plug because they don’t want the owner to mess it up, which would be very easy.

[@mobileterminaluzer1858]

My 2010 Kia Forte has the same, VERY specific "closed for life" transmission so they never include the transmission drain bolt. More like stealership sales & services tactics. Have been doing my own on my "closed for life" transmission fluid & fluids changes. Never had any problems.

[@garybaldwin1061]

Just curious. Why does the dealer say the transmission in mt 21 Tacoma auto is sealed? Thanks.

[@PFinkoloTL87]

@@mobileterminaluzer1858 What is their understanding of life in "closed for life"? 200k? 160k?

[@genehart261]

Way back when, I used 20w50 oil in everything and it seemed to work great. Over the years it has been hard to adapt to the ever-thinning viscosities. I am struggling with the 0w20 requirement in my newly-purchased 20011 FJ Cruiser and now they come along with ow8! Your extensive testing is helping this aging gear head adapt to a new reality.

[@cengeb]

cus engine tolrances are much tighter now. old 60s 70s 80s where horrible specs, lots of slop in engines. things do improve. If you use too thick on modern engines you will cause damage, ever think the makers know what they make?

[@bobbygetsbanned6049]

@@cengeb That's very true, but I still would be extremely skeptical to run anything less than 20 weight in anything that's going to haul or tow. Too much stress on the drivetrain to depend on sub 20 weight oil keeping parts from touching.

[@bikeman123]

Also, manufacturers aim is economy not longevity so v thin oil may not be in your best interest.

[@tradingnichols2255]

@@bobbygetsbanned6049 Thanks for this! I say that because I have the lowest power, production car in America. The Mitsubish G4, and it revs a lot more, it's built for that, but I wonder if just pulling itself, is why they went with 5w-30....but it also makes me consider that they've made them similarly for so long, that maybe the cheapest car in America, which is going away by the way, that maybe, just maybe, they haven't built them any tighter or newer, so they were wise enough to still insist on 5w-30. Sure, cafe keeps pushing the limits, but since it sips gas, they didn't have to compromise on the oil choices.

[@AG-sx9ws]

@@cengeb THEY ARE NOT TIGHTER SINCE 2000

[@snapon1974]

That CVT has a first gear. The engine uses Toyotas D4S system, it has both port and direct injection.

[@volvo09]

Seems like the most reliable way to do it, by using a standard gear set for getting the car moving to eliminate stress.

[@BubblesTheCat1]

Toyota is the KING of making cars that work well and last long. I ❤️ Toyotas 😀💕🚗

[@Resistculturaldecline]

I do like the toyota method of having an actual first gear. With that said, my wife bought a 2013 Accord in 2016, with 25k miles. Ive changed the CVT fluid every 35k ish miles since. Its a bit of overkill, the fluid is still clean at that point. Only slightly different color than bottle-new but its dead simple and easy to change. Always with Honda oem fluid. At 140k miles, it still drives exactly like it did 125k miles ago. Im sure the toyota with 50k mile cvt fluid changes will go a long, long time.

[@ewetuber186000]

I’ve watched several of your videos and I respect your knowledge and expertise. Let’s say for purposes of this discussion, you are right about all of it. For me, and for most guys who buy and use cars in an average way, none of it matters. I’m in my 60s and like lots of other guys my age, I’ve owned lots of different vehicles. I’ll sell a car when I don’t need it, or don’t like it anymore, or sometimes too many little things go wrong with it. But it’s been a long time since I owned a vehicle with engine trouble. Todays cars and trucks run a long time with just a little bit of ordinary maintenance. To the guy who buys new and wants to keep it past 300,000 miles … To that guy, if he exists, what you say matters. To the rest of us, buying and selling on the front end or the back end, we’ll never get a reward from persnickety oil maintenance. That said….i enjoy the videos!!

[@themotoroilgeek]

Thanks for the comment. Maybe in my world of engine building we see all the failures, so our vision is different than the ordinary customers.

[@richcombs4805]

When I'm in my 60's I'll be grateful for my picky oil and filter selection, 5k OCI's, and rabbit holes on rust-proofing, when I'm still driving my '18 Camry and hopefully '12 Civic LX MT. I hear ya though! LOL

[@anidiotinaracingcar]

Love that series. I wish you did one on selecting an oil for a used car.

[@themotoroilgeek]

Great suggestion!

[@TheSlowDude]

​@@themotoroilgeekyes please, specially for 90s to 2000s TDI engines with north of 250.000km. I've been running 5w40 since the beginning :-)

[@ZacharyHankins]

I had a 2021 Corolla, and put 115k on it with zero issues. Changed oil every 5k, changed CVT fluid every 30k. Very reliable and nice car.

[@RFJersey]

What oil did you use?

[@ZacharyHankins]

@@RFJersey I started with just full synthetic Mobil 1, then at 75k miles, I started using the Mobil 1 Extended Performance High Milage oil.

[@RFJersey]

@@ZacharyHankins What weight?

[@ZacharyHankins]

@@RFJersey I used OW-20 for my Corolla.

[@55whiplash]

Good info, thanks.

[@robertpatton7442]

I had heard that the newest Corolla CVT's have a conventional 1st gear and then CVT for the other "gears", but I haven't confirmed which engine comes with which CVT, etc. Thanks for the great info!

[@hanmingyong2904]

Yup that’s right. New Toyota/AISIN CVTs (not ECVTs) have a launch gear.

[@mr.mr.3301]

The 5.7 Toyota tundra engine in other countries list 530 as the supposed to be running. Living in the heat of the south I’m considering changing mine from 0:20 to 5:30. A lot on the tundra groups have done that. I think the best thing to do is to try 530 and do oil analysis for both at 5000 miles

[@TexasVexes]

I run 5w-30 in my new to me 4runner. Driving in a heat index of 110degrees plus is no joke

[@dalephillips8250]

I've still been using 0W20 in my 2020 Tundra but keep wondering if I should use 5w30 due to so many people stating that is better and what they use.

[@kingssuck06]

Thats been going on for a while after the cafe standards. My car is specd for 5-20, but its 5-30 in all other parts of the world where its sold and its a 2007

[@colinnicols5387]

If you use the same brand/class of oil, you can mix viscosities to make up your own. I’ve been doing it for years.

[@mrvwbug4423]

I doubt it makes much difference, Toyota designed the engine to run on 0W-20 and the 0W part of the equation is actually an advantage in winter as it will reduce cold start wear.

[@MendicantBias1]

Loved your interview with Dave Auto Center 😊

[@themotoroilgeek]

Thanks!

[@kimberlyx4060]

Thanks for the facts here. I just got a 24 Toyota Corolla. I was hoping it was a smart move. I replaced a 20 year old Camry.

[@TheShornak]

Okay, I was just heading to the comment section to tell you my opinion of waiting 10k for the first oil change. Glad to hear you didn't wait that long in reality.

[@jesseozmen9835]

no one shood be changing oil at 10K

[@foxy126pl6]

@@jesseozmen9835 everyone in europe is, most of the people say its not worth the money to change it earlier. Some people even change it every 20k

[@foxy126pl6]

@Billybigrigger-ic7jp idk, we usually type "15k km for next oil change" which is like 9000 miles, most of the people do it either every 15k or every year, whichever comes 1st. I have seen some people do 30k km or 18k miles between oil changes since "thats what the manual says"

[@foxy126pl6]

@Billybigrigger-ic7jp european manuals dont. They do it becouse the brands know noone can stop them from saying that

[@jesseozmen9835]

@@foxy126pl6 i have seen first had many times what an engine looks like at 70K miles with 10K oil change its not good. the way i see it is they are to meet EPA requirements so if 0W-8 works for 100K miles and the engine wares out that's the problem of the sec or 3rd owner. and 10k mile oil changes are ridicules 5k max.

[@vipercrazy-9]

The issue with the corolla cvt service, at least the prior one is you only get something like 1.5 quarts to drain due to the location of the drain plug on the pan, it holds about 8 quarts. There are 3 or so magnets in the pan no need to worry about service for a while. Best/most cost effective way to service is drop the pan, clean the magnets and replace the gasket. Or use a flush machine but 12 quarts of toyota cvt fluid is expensive, and the fluid level still needs to be set/verified after flushing.

[@kerrylewis2581]

I had the dealer change the oil in my 2023 RAV4 at 1,000 miles, and then six months later, I brought it back for another change at 3,000 miles. My Toyota dealer surprised me when they said this one was free based on the date and not miles. They also rotated the tires. (Love the fluid sample pump)

[@themotoroilgeek]

Thanks for sharing that tidbit!

[@TheBasscow]

I just bought a Mazda CX-90 and asked about the free maintenance for a year. They couldn't give me a straight answer on how many times I could change my oil in a year or if it was based upon mileage

[@kerrylewis2581]

@@TheBasscow@TheBasscow Please listen to Lake Jr. and change it between 500 and 1000 miles the first time and every 5,000 or six months, whichever comes first after that. Pay if you have to because it's worth it.

[@cantwealljustgetalong2]

i hope you check to make sure they actually changed it. dealerships check the oil and mileage and if the oil looks clean they dont change it but they pretend they did

[@kerrylewis2581]

@@cantwealljustgetalong2 I saw my RAV on the lift and draining the oil. I hope my Toyota delaer would never consider something so dishonest.

[@on-site4094]

Amazing Dad. And great technical analysis 👍

[@themotoroilgeek]

Thanks!

[@blackhawk7r221]

I can assure you, dealerships buy bulk oil from whoever gives them the best deal with the best perks. The Yota dealer I used to work for built a new building and Quaker State bought them two Rotary lifts and gave them two NASCAR body go-carts to get the contract. The GM dealer was using Kendall, Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep was on a Valvoline contract. They are not required to use a manufacturer’s oil. Hell, tons of places use BG for their trans flushes.

[@tradingnichols2255]

I haven't worked with CVT's much, but normal gear shifting transmissions definitely do better with BG. My manager at Chevy was working hard to get BG products going and the data and studies were very convincing. The BG work for CVT's, I'm told was better too, but it's been some years since I upgraded my life from being a mechanic, got into IT, but if AI takes a bunch of jobs, maybe I'll have to work on cars again. LOL Nah, I'm top at my IT experience level so that should add some safety for a while, especially since I can do a lot of hands on work that much of the IT industry can't do. Tell me who, other than a mechanic is going to figure out that the wall socket is dirty (clean on the outside). We have so many more variables we're usually fighting than with computer building. I hope they never get into computers like they did cars, intentionally making them hard to work on, but if they do, my automotive background will be huge. LOL I guess the car equivalent is bad gasoline, which happens most from customer errors.

[@LovesHina]

Can depend. Dealership I work at, Dodge size uses bulk oil, chevy side uses bottled genuine ac-delco oil.

[@blackhawk7r221]

@@LovesHina It’s up to the franchise owner. It’s interesting that the owner is going through the heavy profit loss of using individual quarts, and on top of that rebadged bulk oil sold as AC Delco. I assure you, AC Delco does not own a refinery. Who knows what these owners think.

[@LovesHina]

@@blackhawk7r221 I also find it a bit strange, as it does add a non insignificant amount of trash, and time to each oil change as well. I assumed it's a GM/Chevy thing, since they do have a few varieties of oil for different applications. Dexos 1, dexos 2, Dexos D.

[@blackhawk7r221]

@@LovesHina With the way the LS cams were being eaten up a while back, this may have been a measure to ensure that a legit factory approved oil was used. I doubt it, but like I said, we never know what’s going through the minds of owners. I’ve seen them do some oddball stuff.

[@mikeschupp6796]

On The Car Care Nut channel on KZbin, he’s a master Toyota mechanic, he says change your oil at 5000 miles or 6 months which ever comes first, no matter what the owners manual says. If you want your Motor to last.

[@tightwadtv3421]

My wife's Subaru calls for 0-w20. It started burning oil at 120,000 miles requiring a quart every 2500 miles. I switched to 5w-20 and it hasn't burned a measurable amount of oil for 80,000 miles since.

[@JoshDillon-lm3hw]

That's cause subarus seem to only call for 0w 20 in the US I have a new wrx an it say 0w 20 but in Japan Australia an Canada manuel says 5w 30 it's emissions crap they don't care about the life of your engine

[@PSA78]

The W number is strictly a cold measurement, it's likely something different between the two.

[@JoshDillon-lm3hw]

@PSA78 they recommend 5w 30 so they want higher weight in cold an hot also higher weight oil you get less blow by on these di engines so less intake buildup

[@PSA78]

@@JoshDillon-lm3hw It's not "weight", the W(inter) is just a measurement of cranking force at a specific temperature (really low) and the last number is regular viscosity (span) at 100c (converted to a number for each specific type of lubrication; like engine or transmission). The W number can theoretically always be reduced (diesels sometimes excluded practically as they don't like the high amount of viscosity modifiers that might be needed). How much oil they burn is more down to how volatile the oil is, a small change in viscosity isn't going to matter when all things are considered. There's possible wear reductions with lower viscosity as well as the additives works more efficiently in mixed and boundary lubrication regime, it all has to come together in the end. It's like Lake says, let the UOA tell what's happening

[@JoshDillon-lm3hw]

@PSA78 the numbers are the weight of the oil lol weight is what viscosity was to called the last hundred years why people who don't know oil think that's what w stands for

[@sm7091bs]

I have to agree Lake that when you monitor it by samples you get the real data. My gut feeling is telling me to stay away from this water thin oils but the data show otherwise. So i have to adapt my auto mechanic brain.

[@deelowe3]

Thinner oil is needed for tighter tolerance bearings. Tighter tolerance bearings wear less and last longer.

[@supersportimpalass]

@@deelowe3false. The only real reason is tighter emissions and mileage requirements.

[@stephenh8092]

@@deelowe3 These Toyotas do not have tighter tolerances. That's an urban myth. These thinner oils are driven by C.A.F.E. standards pushing for ever more MPGs. Nothing more. In Australia the exact same engine is allowed to use oil even up to 10W40. Do the Aussie Corollas have lesser bearing tolerances?

[@pete1342]

Tolerances and design clearances are two entirely different things. Manufacturing tolerances have improved over the years, but engine bearing clearances are determined by factors outside of oil viscosity.

[@deelowe3]

@@pete1342 You're right. I meant clearance, not tolerance.

[@paul50002]

Меняю масло в двигателе каждые 5000км(летом), а зимой каждые 4000км(из-за прогревов). И никаких проблем с двигателем! В автоматической коробке меняю жидкость каждые 30000км, заправляю полный объем методом вытеснения! Живу в Сибири, в ста километрах от Байкала!

[@summerforever6736]

Da kurva

[@ebutuoyebutouy]

Brrrrr! Stay warm.

[@RSole9999]

That sounds good. Maybe change the oil more often in the winter, cold oil flows less easily, and how hot are summers in Siberia? Surely not as hot as southern USA.

[@paul50002]

@@RSole9999 я живу в Иркутске, летом до +35, зимой -45 по Цельсию! Климат, как в Канаде!

[@RSole9999]

@@paul50002 Вы живете рядом с Гаражом 54, сибирским парнем с сумасшедшими автомобильными видео? Наверное, нет, ведь Россия такая огромная!

[@jamesbosworth4191]

Incredible. I have been dead set against the use of super thin oil, but I can't argue with the oil geek.

[@garyclark979]

The only reason why Toyota dealers are installing the correct viscosity oil is because of people like YOU that check them! 5,000 miles is the maximum oil change interval no matter what the manufacturer’s manual says. Toyota CVTs generally use the WS transmission fluid. If you really want to cut down wear on the CVT, then install a magnetic drain plug at the bottom of the CVT to trap the fine metal particles. Toyota dealers do NOT want your Toyota vehicle to last more than 200k miles, but you can make some tweaks in service to get at least 300k miles. Happy motoring!

[@jimsix9929]

CVT transmissions can work well as long as you know what you have, fluid needs changed every 20,000 miles, the Jatco transmissions have 2 filters, one in the pan, the other where the cooler lines come out, make sure both are changed, also they will not stand hard driving, that is why you will only find them behind low power 4 cylinder cars, so drive easy and get the fuel economy benefit, never let your 18 year old son borrow it lol

[@OrganicFoxes]

Don't really need to replace the pan filter as often. It's more of a screen filter that collects bigger debris while the paper filter collects fine particles. The pan filter is quite expensive as well, I say replace the cartridge paper filter and just inspect the pan screen filter.

[@MyerShift7]

Toyota Aisin CVT's certainly can. I know firsthand from New and over 235K miles so far

[@stephenthompson9722]

Just got a 2021 Corolla with 41000Kms on the clock. I have accelerated with full throttle once and boy it was really impressive...but my thoughts exactly I will be looking after it!!!!

[@averyalexander2303]

Cool video! It would be interesting to see how these new ultra thin oils perform against traditional oils when both are using the same type of base oil and additive package. While it's cool to see that a 0W-12 can perform as well as a 5W-30 in a lab test, it would also be great to see a true apples to apples comparison with the only difference being the viscosity.

[@themotoroilgeek]

Great suggestion!

[@dc5723]

Not our 2022 Toyota Rav4's 1st oil change here in Honolulu at Servco Toyota. It was 5,000 miles but the dealer said no oil change, only at 10,000 and 20,000 miles but I used the 10,000 mile free oil change. Instead of the MFR's recommendation of 0W-16, they used bulk 0W-20 oil. I did my own changes after than using Mobil 1 Advanced Fuel Economy 0W-16 and Toyota's OEM filter.

[@fastinradfordable]

The first oil change you skipped sets the tone of wear on your engine for the rest of its life. So Next time do it when it matters Not after the fact.

[@Rhaspun]

On another channel the mechanic said that the 10k miles is for driving with ideal conditions. It's likely we aren't driving out cars under ideal conditions.

[@mick00000000002]

Every oil you pulled out was black. No km No words. Lost. Mick Australia. Information you upload is great I appreciated. God bless mick Australia 🇦🇺

[@themotoroilgeek]

Thanks!

[@camberwellcarrot420]

My son had the Corolla hatchback with the 6-speed, but he was never that pleased with it, so he sold it on and he's been driving around my 23-year old Corolla, and he loves it. 😅

[@RFJersey]

What did he not like about it?

[@TofuInc]

I'm a huge fan of these videos! Extremely educational and on a completely different level than most others on KZbin. 👍

[@themotoroilgeek]

Glad you like them!

[@cinq1368]

Toyota Hybrid CVT is a e-CVT and dos not have a chain. It has a planatery gear set and 2 Electric motors.

[@bjkjoseph]

I heard the hybrid CVT is indestructible

[@jesseozmen9835]

the way i see it is they are to meet EPA requirements so if 0W-8 works for 100K miles and the engine wares out that's the problem of the sec or 3rd owner. and 10k mile oil changes are ridicules 5k max.

[@lonniebeal6032]

Especially with low tension rings and oil that is close to water in viscosity.

[@fredygump5578]

I appreciate the confirmation that the manufacturers know what they're doing. I hear so many people accuse manufacturers of giving bad advice to make you ruin your engine so you have to buy a new car. I bet what is actually happening is that people use cheap oil and then run it for 10k+ miles...

[@chevyblock550]

Recently bought a 2024 Malibu new. Changed the oil at 5K miles for the first 3 times. About to hit 15K then should be able to open up that interval a bit to 7500. The 0w-20, thanks to your info, doesn't scare me at all. 36mpg highway! First Chevy for me and love everything about it so far. Also running premium gas after your excellent video on premium gasoline over regular.

[@MassiveTrackHunter]

If those lower viscosities can still protect under load, the big benefit will be much faster pressurization and protection at startup, especially in colder weather.

[@jason200912]

That's the theory but then all gains would be lost as soon as you're in warm weather season. Plus all the thin oil just falls off where it needs to be. So yeah it pump up nicely but it fails to stay where it needs to be. 20 or higher is probably the best compromise. Europe only uses 30 and 40 despite being much colder than the u.s. weird places like Dubai use the thinnest even though they're burning hot climates and I'm guessing it's because rhey have a similar CAFE legislation to the us or something that fines them for not saving a drop of gasoline per mpg

[@BeardedFordTech]

Awesome video. Very interesting the lower viscosities are going.

[@themotoroilgeek]

Thanks! More to come!

[@sergiopaulino859]

Thank you for the great video and explenation , I have an issue over here in Portugal , I have a Rav4 hybrid 2023 when i made my first oil change the toyota dealer here they put 0W20 when I found out that was not the correct oil instead of 0w16 a wrote to the toyota portugal to give me an expelnation and the answer was 0w20 was standart due to hight summer temperture not satisfied with the answer , the owners manual does not refer weather conditions to change oil it says should always use 0w16w but if in case the dealer does not have it can use the 0W20 but the nest oil change has to be 0w16w.

[@bruehlt]

Wow that's surprising that the dealer actually used the specified oil!! I've had cars where the dealer didn't use the recommended oil unless you explicitly told them to!

[@slyfox4564]

changing the cvt fluid at 10k miles is crazy

[@skylinefever]

And not only do you make sure to use CVT fluid in a CVT, read what the vehicle manufacturer calls for. There are a variety of CVT fluid types.

[@themotoroilgeek]

Great point!

[@softwaresignals]

@@themotoroilgeek Surprisingly, "Valvoline MaxLife Multi-Vehicle ATF" is a replacement for Toyota WS ATF (conventional shifting auto trannies) AND Toyota CVT FE, yes, both. I think they just added a big list of CVT's to their compatibility List, as seen on their latest Product Information spec sheet. Since that stuff is very well respected (runs in about any automatic around, with good shift quality!!), I would not doubt the Valvoline "experts" in claiming this universality (kv100 5.9 cSt), and I guess the frictional characteristics work in conventional style AT clutches and CVT chain systems too! I don't know how they do it. Heck, it would prob work in my '24 Honda CRV Hybrid e-CVT, but that one did NOT make the list for some odd reason.

[@thinkfirst6431]

Sometimes thin oil kills engines that were not designed for thinner oil. Back in 2012 I was the camp manager for a man camp in the arctic. I had 2 generators one which ran 24 hours a day for 500 hours then I would switch to the secondary generator which would again run 24 hours a day until it reached 500 hours of run time. Back and forth. During the down time the generator on standby would get maintenance and the oil changed. Also the standby generator was always plugged into the running generator with several different block and battery heaters so that if needed it could be started instantly in very below F weather. The engines were never cold or cold started. One of the generators I had was a brand new Cat 500KW paired up with a 3000 hour Cat 500KW generator. One day the Cat dealer got the bright idea that because it was "cold" outside the generators should have "winter" Shell Rotella 5W-40 oil instead of the normal 15W-40. That was back when Shell Rotella only came in 2 flavors. The Cat engines both had HEWI injectors which are sensitive to oil or lack thereof. After the new Cat gen had its oil changed to the "winter" oil at about 400 hours it quit in the middle of the night. The generators would always quit in the middle of the night for what ever reason. The breakfast cook who worked at night would come and get me when the power went out. I would have to run out, start the secondary generator, Let it get up to speed and minimum temp then switch over the load to the running generator. Not quite as easy as it sounds when it is 30 below zero, or more, outside. The new Cat generator was toast cooling fast. They lost another Cat generator with the thin oil in a different camp for the same reason. The generators live in basically a plywood box outside that has to have the snow shoveled out to keep them clear. Part of the box had to be torn down to get a replacement gen installed. The replacement gen lasted almost 500 hours before the water pump went out again in the middle of the night when it was -45 degrees F. I started the secondary generator which I remembered also had the thin oil in it and called for repair of the primary gen. While I was waiting for the Cat mechanic for the first gen I called for an emergency oil change on the running secondary gen which had started making noise. The Cat mechanic got down to the bad water pump then said he didn't have another so would have to go steal the one off of the dead new generator. Mean while the secondary is starting to sound real bad even after the emergency oil change. It got down to the point where the mechanic working with the secondary told me that if I didn't shut it down it to was going to shell out. Long story short everyone in camp had arctic gear, the mechanic working on the primary gen told me that he could have it running in 1.5 hours so I shut down the secondary generator. 1.5 hours later after the camp inside temp had dropped to around 50 degrees and people were complaining I was thinking of an emergency evac to a warmer place, the primary came back on and I was able to restore heat. The secondary was never replaced or fixed, the primary ran for 6 weeks straight with arctic oil changes, pour new oil in as the old oil runs out until it is clear until the camp was moved. The moral of that story is that the wrong oil can kill engines and potentially people.

[@robertmaybeth3434]

Thinkfirst IDK WHY your comment doesn't have more upvotes. I spent several years in a large fleet, part of my job was to be in charge of maintaining over 30 large diesel back-up generators (for a major west coast airport). I can well relate to your story. But I had a much easier time of it, since not only were "my" charges operating above freezing 99% of the time, they were also idle, except for test runs and bona fide power-loss emergencies. The lesson is if you are in charge of important equipment, make no major changes, without some kind of long-term test of the change, before actually rolling it out - I hope your employer made Caterpillar pay for the damaged generators caused by their stupid recommendation!

[@thinkfirst6431]

@@robertmaybeth3434 Most people can't relate to my situation so it might have been a great story but not note worthy. I personally believe that people nowadays just can't read that much anymore. They have been conditioned to limit their thoughts to 140-280 characters and anything more than that blows their mind. how r u is nothing but lazy shorthand. I believe that it is part of the dumbing down of the USA to bring us closer to the third world countries who can't compete. If you are free thank a service man, if you are stupid thank a socialist democrat. Not that most people will read down this far.

[@johndeere1951a]

I bet that Toyota Service Writer Advisor loved meeting you🤣 Great presentation Lake✌️👍💦🛢️🏆

[@jimsanders4412]

Good to know! It's interesting (at least to me) that Toyota doesn't program "fake" shift points in their CVTs like Nissan does. Never really understood why they do that. Maybe because us "old school" guys like to feel an automatic transmission "do" something!😄 Just subscribed, by the way.👍

[@summerforever6736]

The truth is until you show me a car with at least 100K miles on it been running with this thin oil I remain skeptical Great video other wise!!

[@wallacegrommet9343]

Thin oil flows better at startup, when most wear occurs. Tighter engine bearing clearances and smaller oil passages require lower viscosity oils. The additive package and oil chemistry makes all the difference

[@tradingnichols2255]

@@wallacegrommet9343 For the south, I live in a surprisingly overnight cold area for temperature drops. You got me thinking I want better startup flow. My 2018 Mitsubishi G4 3 cylinder engine still recommends 5w-30, but this video talking about how 0w-16 protection has a better package, combined with it being winter has really got me thinking. Nostalgia and thinking thicker is better, has me so proud of them still making 5w-30 cars, but I have to say, how many brands of cars I've seen where the engines were not changed, but moved from that to 0w-20. I suspect these new 16 oils have something special going on. 0w-20 definitely wore out engines faster. I'm wondering if better additive packages can turn that around in the newer oils. 5w-30 keeps being updated too though so... well... it's complicated!

[@shalemloritsch9382]

I have a 2006 Honda and 2008 Toyota intentionally running 0W-16 full synthetic oil, changed every 10,000 miles. Both call for thicker oil changed more than twice as frequently. 611,000 miles on one and 406,000 miles on the other, nether engine has ever been opened/refurbished, neither car burns oil. The reduction in engine drag is quite noticable; both cars gained an average of 2mpg, and on the Honda, I have to throw the shifter into first gear to get the amount of engine braking I used to get in second gear. On the Toyota, it has worn out synchros that would regularly grind during certain shifts, especially when cold. I recently upgraded it from the specified 75W-90 oil to the thinnest same kind of oil I could find, a recently released 70W-75. The change was immediate and almost as good as a new set of synchros, and to my surprise, the car gained another MPG on average (I didn't think there was that much drag in a manual transmission!). Both cars start much easier in the winter. If there's any downsides to running thinner oils on an extended change schedule, it's been years now and I haven't discovered it yet--I would totally do it again and only wish I had started sooner.

[@tradingnichols2255]

@@shalemloritsch9382 Nice, I'm definitely going to go with it! 0w-16 here I come!

[@EfficientRVer]

@@shalemloritsch9382 How many of the 611K miles were with 0W16? What were the original bulk of miles run with? 0W16 hasn't existed for most of the life of those cars, so what got them to be high-miles cars was clearly not the 0W16.

[@bobirving6052]

Thanks Lake Speed Jr! Really enjoy your “daughter’s Toyota saga”! Nice car btw! Yes, I was scared of the low viscosity 😅 Maybe I can put that 0-w 8 in a ‘95 powerstroke if it reduces wear even better that regular oil, due to it’s top secret super sauce! 😆

[@jason200912]

The data showed that 0w-8 performed worse than 16

[@Jonnydeerhunter]

Thanks for sharing, Lake! I enjoy your content.

[@dyllanmarshall3506]

that’s awesome we spoke on the phone just before New Years I have a 2021 Toyota Corolla Se, amazing information and great video

[@CJ5EVOLUTION]

It is always interesting listening your explanations backed with data.

[@brianklamer3328]

Was in local Walmart today, they now carry Mobil One 0W-8 for $27.97 on 5 quart jug, labeled as Guaranteed for 10,000 miles. If I was going to buy the oil and change it myself, I'd put 0W-20 regardless of what Toyota says.

[@cengeb]

Huh? so you know better than Toyota, brilliance is astounding. How many engines have you tested with oils etc? How many has TOYota done over the years, but ignore their specs?

[@cengeb]

I've been to places that make the additives, lots of syn oils can easily go past 10K with no issues...it's 2024, not 1964, join it

[@Mr.Bearded.Mechanic]

Man, you almost got me with that 10,000-mile first oil change 😅 I was like Motor Oil Geek let his daughter drive her car 10k miles without any intermitted oil change?! What? Hehe. Thanks for the informative video. I think car /engine manufacturers 'thin' the oil cuz the start-stop function to make the engine start easier, higher efficiency like less oil resistance/drag, and the even more strict emission

[@themotoroilgeek]

LOL, the fuel economy benefits of the thin oil is what makes them spec it.

[@GT-mn3bx]

​@@themotoroilgeek0w30 (Mobil is the only one with this) literally disappears on bigger engines with looser tolerances. 5w and 10w30 is much less respectively. Even in winter, any mileage gain (couldn't see any) is way offset with the need to buy so much more top off oil.

[@inductionbyforce8656]

They’ve had start stop for years now and no it has nothing to do with the engine oil being easier to start not sure what made that go through your mind the actual reason in MPG that’s the only reason. There’s a lost efficiency in pumping and by splashing the thicker oil but it breaks down much quicker if you look in any book from any manufacturer they all recommend a specific weight but will always have a chart in it for using other weight oils mostly thicker too

[@Mr.Bearded.Mechanic]

​@@inductionbyforce8656 so what I wrote is the same as you repeated but with different words. What do you think less oil resistance means? Less drag, quicker oil pressure build, smaller tolerances on rings, pistons, bearings, etc. Splashing is nonsense, many cars for many years have oil baffles/windage trays to prevent oil splashing onto the crank... What do you think efficiency means? Higher mpg or in Europe less liters/100km, higher thermal efficiency. What do you think more strict emission means? Maximized amount of CO2, Hydrocarbons, NOx, and particle emission of an exhaust. Emission limits have essentially halved from EURO 5 to EURO 6. This is the drive for the innovations and engine efficiency to increase (downsize, forced induction, hybrid, using flame speed manipulation). You should also know that a vehicle manufacturer has a total annual emission limit also per manufactured car models/engines, look it up. I am using simple words because of other comment readers, to understand it easily, not to read words that they do not know how to pronounce, let alone understand.

[@taz4100]

The trick to see what oil you should actually run in your car is to check the manual in different countries to see what oil is listed. Most of these engines arent actually made for the thinner oil that is called for in the usa. Its just for mpg improvements and there so small its funny. I would never put anything less then a 20 weight in. Manufacturers can always put those "great" additives in there 8 weight oils in the heavier weights 🤷‍♂️

[@Nathan-xk7hm]

I work at a Toyota dealer in Ontario Canada, and we still fill cars that takes 0w-8 with 0w-16.

[@themotoroilgeek]

Thanks for sharing

[@justinandout]

so you're scamming your customers! people pay you to use proper oil but are not getting the right product for their money!

[@BillDike]

I have a 24 Tundra sr with the base turbo v6, I believe a lot of the Tundra engine issues are due to the first oil change at 10,000 miles. I did mine at 1500, 5,000 then I'll do them at 4-5,000 for the rest of its life. I use only Toyota oil and filters. I have 20,000 miles on it, purchased new on 1/21/2024. The Toyota filters are about the size of my lawnmower oil filters, even if I was doing longer intervals I'd probably change the filter at 5,000 miles. But oil is so cheap compared to engine failure

[@YeOldeTowneCryer]

I just bought a 2012 Jeep Liberty and I almost choked when the owners manual recommend 5W20. I was thinking the 5 is a good idea, thin oil gets to the upper parts fast meaning less wear at start up. But the 20 weight number bothered me. I was glad to learn what your findings were. I will probably not switch to a 0W8 for my vehicle unless Chrysler issues a recommendation for it. My mind just does not yet accept that much reduction in hot engine protection.

[@srthiago]

Hey! Love your channel man! I was wondering if you could make a video between fluid recommendations from the 70s compared to the more modern fluids available nowadays; For example SAE 50 and 30 that used to be recommended for Differentials/Transmissions/Transfer cases and the newer 75w90 and 80w90 more modern gear oils. Can modern fluids be used on older applications (70s fords, gmcs and such)?

[@themotoroilgeek]

Great suggestion!

[@jamesmueller9819]

So, the manual says you can use 0W-16 but you must replace it with 0W-8 at the next oil change. I was surprised you didn't highlight that fact during the New Car oil change video you did with your daughter's car.

[@googleusergp]

Correct, my 2024 Corolla owner's manual says that, but has the same decal as his under the hood. 0W-8 is now available through Walmart. Mobil came out with GLV-1 approved oil in March 2024.

[@themotoroilgeek]

That's just legalese for the EPA.

[@LA_Commander]

I think Geek did mention that in his video IIRC. He opened up the manual and clearly stated that 0w8 was the proper oil to use, but that 0w16 could be used if no 0w8 was available. I don't see how he could have been any more clear than that.

[@rachegreenrg]

Anything lower than 0w40 is junk.

[@D2O2]

​@@themotoroilgeekYep, all the cert. testing was done with the 0w8 oil.

[@LoydChampion]

It's great that the Henricks Toyota Dealer in Concord used the proper quality oils. I don't know the policy of Toyota over their dealers on what lubricants they're permitted to use. But typically dealerships will order in bulk from whatever oil distributor they get the best deal from. To be clear, whatever oils they use are not some cheap no-name oil. They will get a known quality name brand that we have all heard of. But it isn't always the "OEM" branded product.

[@themotoroilgeek]

I was pleasantly surprised as well!

[@S1Lent_Wanderer]

As a hendrick Toyota Tech, I've only ever seen the toyota genuine oil ordered in bulk, I see pallets of the shit piled in parts every time I go to grab a box, we have pumps for 0w-20, 5w-20, and 5w-30. They use a synthetic blend so I've heard from the older techs, when it comes to off brand vehicles we usually source what they recommend (Mobil1, DEXOS, etc...) if the manufacturer doesn't specify what the vehicle needs then they get whatever is coming out of the pump. My favorite oil I've seen was this green shit we had to special order for a BMW weird euro spec stuff

[@themotoroilgeek]

@@S1Lent_Wanderer Thanks for sharing!

[@LoydChampion]

@@S1Lent_Wanderer Good to hear that your dealership makes this effort. Many don't. I know of a Chevrolet Dealer and a Dodge dealer for example that buy the lowest priced stuff in a drum they can get at the time they order more oil for their service departments. Even then, it is good oil and isn't really likely to hurt anything. I know that the Dodge Dealer gets a 0W/20 and a 10W/30 no name synthetic and the same weights in a conventional no name oil.

[@ryanbullock2971]

I found 5 quart jugs of Mobile 1 0W-8 at my local Walmart for about $27. It was like a unicorn. I could barely believe I was looking at it.

[@camarokurt]

Man, for a second, I thought you really went over 10,000 miles without changing the oil! I've been doing mine every 5k with Mobil 1, but recently started doing it every 4k.

[@Ahto42]

Many months ago Project Farm compared 0w16, 0w20, 5w20 and 5w30 Penzoil oils. The lower viscosity oils had bigger wear scars.

[@themotoroilgeek]

We will see if the same holds true for these oils in this engine.

[@Ahto42]

@@themotoroilgeek shame that I can't post links here. Just search Project Farm thin oil

[@hotrodray6802]

Project Farm is better than Lake Speed??

[@johnfranklin5277]

Thats NOT what he said...or implied...

[@lonniebeal6032]

@@themotoroilgeek Is this engine going to be driven in a lot of over 70f temperatures?

[@carlosmberrios]

Thanks for all the videos. I really enjoyed them. Have you analyze Super Tech oil? Is it any good?

[@themotoroilgeek]

Stay tuned! We are going to feature that in a future video

[@dannyo6699]

Back on the farm, the combines we ran had variable drive on them as well, but it wasn't directly in the transmissions. Our International combines had a regular 3 speed transmission, then had a mechanically actuated belt drive on the side of the machine that gave almost infinite ground speed. Granted at top speed in 3rd gear, it maybe went 12 mph specifically for highway use, but the field speeds were pretty much miniscule adjustments. 1st and 2nd were the field gears and you operated the variable speed either by a hand lever on the floor or a foot lever depending on how old it was. It made for very easy forward motion control without changing the engine speed. The machine thrashing speed had to be maintained at a constant speed so changing ground speed has to be done separate from the engine speed and it's cumbersome to change gears. It worked fairly well. Our newest combine had hydrostatic transmission where the ground speed was contained within the transmission and actuated by a hand lever on the steering column. It used the same process to increase or decrease speed but it didn't have the big belt drive on the outside of the machine. It also didn't have a reverse gear, the hydrostat had the ability to move in reverse in whichever gear it was in by just pulling the lever back to the neutral position which stopped the forward motion, then continuing to pull backwards on the lever and the combine went in reverse. The variable speed combines did have reverse and the variable speed mechanism did operate in reverse too. It's kind of interesting that they modernized the process and put it into transmissions in modern cars. Subaru also has a CVT transmission too.

[@zedmadeamps]

According to their testing, Toyota installed 0W12 at the dealership. The numbers don’t lie. The chart only says 0W8 because that’s most likely what was written on the mailed in sample.

[@etravix]

Good stuff. I was very surprised when my sister’s Scion IQ required 0W-20. However, her engine required replacing even though she had routine oil changes done by the dealer. Now your talk about CVT fluid was interesting because a friend’s 2018 Corolla’s CVT broke at 83k miles. I wonder if it was a fluid problem. Dealer said $10k to replace. That didn’t happen. LOL

[@TimberWulfIsHere]

Nope, it's a CVT problem.

[@Freighttrain-yd4fz]

So I work at a Toyota dealership and I've done a good amount of oil changes with 0w 8 mostly on crowns with the 2.5. The first ever oil change I did with 0w 8 I was blown away by how thin is was, it almost feels like coolant. But my dealership doesn't cheap out with Toyota cares and dealership free oil changes, if it says to use 0w 8 that's what we use. But just being honest I am skeptical of 0w 8, mainly running it hot weather and running to low on oil I feel like it will thin even more than what it all ready is. I heard the main reason why Toyota uses 0w 8 is for better fuel economy but I feel that it's a bit of stretch to say it will do so. But how ever though I do see 0w 8 being great in very cold temperature weather where it will help the engine get lubed up faster. Really only time will tell how good 0w 8 will be, maybe it will be a good oil. 0w 20 is a good oil and I know people were skeptical of that when it first came out.

[@themotoroilgeek]

Thanks for sharing. I’m very interested to see the results compared to the 0W-16

[@AudriusN]

There's one paramater most people don't know or forget about - the Viscosity index. The higher it is the better will oil retain the viscosity with rising temps.

[@brianv.1300]

0W40 is as good as 0W8 in cold weather. 0winter40 is same as 0winter8 at cold temp startup.

[@GoldenPants911]

Just saw Mobil 1 0w-8 at Walmart! First time seeing it.

[@themotoroilgeek]

Wow! A spotting in the wild, LOL

[@raycollington4310]

Dealership oil will be brown, slippery and above all, cheap. Love the channel content thank you from London, UK

[@BigHRepair]

In the US they typically use oem fluids. Only time I seen they haven't was a Ford dealer when I was picking up parts, they used mobil one.

[@Hernsama]

@@BigHRepairthey don’t use OEM fluids they buy in bulk. Most of the time it’s not the OEM oil.

[@BigHRepair]

@Hernsama really? The dealers around me do with the exception of the one. Didn't know that. I thought that was common for them to use oe fluids for their warranties and stuff

[@googleusergp]

@@Hernsama "OEM" oil is supplied by the major oil companies anyway because the car makers don't make their own oils. Toyota oil is from what I remember supplied by Mobil. Motorcraft oil typically is Conoco-Phillips, and GM used Mobil as factory fill for a time.

[@themotoroilgeek]

Thanks!

[@tonyb7748]

I traded an old Volvo s40 in and bought an s90 in 2018. I run similar tests every 6 months on the car as I did with the old one. Fantastic results with the newer 0w products especially being turbocharged.

[@sixsixST2]

My '22 Camry Hybrid calls for 0w-16. The dealer I brought it from put 0w-20 in it on the first free change. I asked them about it and they said they put bulk 0w-20 in everything that calls for 0w-8/16/20. So I've been running the Mobil 0w-20 hybrid oil in it.

[@BVN-TEXAS]

All this thin oil is about CAFE standard and not what’s best for the engine. Just look at the same engines sold in other counties without an epa. They don’t mandate those ultra thin oils. They have the classic oil weight recommendations by outside temp charts. So don’t trust that it’s what’s best for your car. It’s what’s best to boost the epa numbers.

[@lonniebeal6032]

I saw a comment from someone in Austrailia, they use 20w50 in their Kias and aren't having near the problems the US is having.

[@GoonyMclinux]

You can use 10/40 and it would be better. 😂​@@lonniebeal6032

[@ejgrant5191]

I've been proactive on my 2020 Chevy ZR2 but, think that GM quality is rather suspect these days. When I went to change the transmission fluid & filter @ 32K miles (I do a lot of off roading in it) the "trick GM recommended" fluid has given me an occasional "shudder" that never existed before. Doing the differential fluids the front looked great but, the metallic sheen of the rear fluid @ 32K miles gives me a great concern that once again GM or Dana has assembly line issues in setting up differentials. My friend with a shop has seen quite a few issues with GM differentials these last few years. Maybe I need a Ford Raptor? GM under Mary B has been on a TERRIBLE PATH towards "self destruction" with her lack of vision & leadership. Toyota saw through the EV mandates BS and never wasted their engineering talent on this too soon to market technology....Maybe I need a Toyota?

[@ryancrispin1805]

“Dad can I please have my car back?!” “Hold on honey one more oil analysis sample and you’ll be good to go.”

[@Kirmo13]

oh god! It's the infamous 3 cylinder CVT transmission hybrids. This engine + transmission combo is starting to become more and more popular and I'm curious to know how long they last.

[@nickjanes5843]

Good job on using scientific methods for your questions. While true that additives, modifiers, detergents and surfactants matter a lot, viscosity also matters. Both are necessary for proper application. I dont think people understand how long a modern engine will last on full synthetic 10w40. Most likely it would outlast the rest of the car by 2 times as long. More than likely people wouldnt keep the car long enough for engine problems to develop from wear. Also 0w8 oil engines are low stress low rev engines that wont be used in racing. So the 0w8 engines will last for most consumers ownership of the car after that Toyota doesnt care. It would just be unnecessary and more expensive to use thicker oil